Ghosts, Bacon, bombs, and religion

In the dead of night, as people sleep, that's when the spirits creep. As the bell tolls three, dark things take power. We like to call it the supernatural hour. And now, our hosts, cards against humanity with myself.

It's not all he does with himself. I have a gula for that. There you go. Hey everybody.

You have a gula? You want a gula? I have one. Didn't you listen to the last episode?

In his basement. I have a gula in my basement because it's a healthy dwelling. It sounds like I'm making a doctor's juice. I don't think so.

A doctor's... What kind of creepy as doctors? It sounds like a perfect time for a doctor's juice book. Reminds me of a wasket in my basket and a nair under the stairs.

What is wrong with you? I know. How old are you? It's my fault I used to walk in one of the hood when he was a little sorry.

Lead paint chips, friends. Lead paint chips. Hey, welcome to the supernatural hour. I am your host, Castle.

And we've got with us our fellow hosts. We will start with Tim or as we like to call him beaker. What's happening? We've got Peaches or we also call her Brandi.

Hello. We've got Deann. With that. Fantastic.

Really lively intro. What's up? Well, the last I've got a fantastic... I thought I'd tone it down.

Hey. And we've got Silent Dawn. Hello. So we are back with our second episode of the supernatural hour.

Dude, I'm going to tattoo that on your forehead. I'm showing you that after like 70 some episodes of the Whist show, it's really... Give me 30 episodes. You're the one that wanted to change the name.

Remember it. Honestly, we didn't really even change the name because the show in the Whist show was Supernatural Hour of Wisps. All we did is eliminated the of wests an hour just a supernatural hour. Right.

Did we go into the last episode? Because I know that we had some people... No, that's why we're talking about it now. Yeah, let's talk about it.

They're all sad because we're not the Whist show. There were some people who were kind of like, hey, what's up with the name? We don't really like the new name. And there's a few reasons why we changed the name.

Primarily Wisps is our residential investigation team. We do all our nonprofit residential investigations through Wisps. And if you've listened to the show for any length of time, you know that we sometimes drop F-Bombs. We sometimes drop other swears.

We are a little irreverent and we laugh and have fun. What are you saying? We are mainly talking about me and Brandi, right? Because you guys are like, upstanding mornings.

I was mostly just talking about you. If it makes you feel better, I'll say Anne Brandi, but no, mostly just you. Well, she's the one that tells me to say half of this stuff. Oh, by the way, I forgot to mention Lurch is not here.

We record this. We normally would have recorded this on Mother's Day, but it was Mother's Day. And so we were recording on a Saturday, which is really unusual for us. And Lurch was really busy.

He had a bunch of stuff going on. I was a test. So once Lurch gets to school, we'll have Lurch back on a regular basis. But right now his schedule is kind of hit and miss, but we miss Lurch.

But since I've side-track myself, why we renamed the show is we, we being beaker, can be a little irreverent and naughty. Actually, I may be contributed to that as well. And again, Dan's been a pre-confer. How long have you been?

Just muddly. But we felt that kind of the irreverent nature of the show maybe could potentially give clients a bad impression of what the WIS team is about. So when we go in on an investigation, we are nothing but professional. That's kind of what our thing is, is we want to convey a professional image.

And we didn't feel that the show itself was really professional. It's the most professional in the world. The show is not a good reflection of how the team operates. It's probably the best way to put it.

Well, you know, in an ordinary team, the professional outlook that you have for the WIS team, that's why I left WISPs. And I just do the podcast now. Right. And so Tim is actually, we've got apps, which is part of, well, apps and WISPs are kind of twins.

Apps is the fourth-profit branch. WISP is the non-profit branch. WISP is all residential stuff and the stuff that we do to help people. Apps is where we sell Ghost Gear, which that is coming by the way, the gear.

And where we do all our Ghost Tense things, that nature, speaking of Ghost Tense. We have got Benson Grissmill coming up May 26th. In fact, there's actually a little announcement I've got with this. We will be giving away a piece of Ghost Gear at that particular event.

Paranormal Brassidy, our friend Paul Welch, is donating a pair of dowsing rods, which we'll give away at that investigation. We'll give it to a random participant. They're nice dowsing rods and we are going to be special dowsing rods. They're going to have Gloomed Arc tips, so you can use them in the dark without having to, anyone who's using dowsing rods when you use them in the dark, they suck, because you can't see what's going on.

But these ones are going to be one of a kind special until we start selling lots with Gloomed Arc tips, but this will be the very first pair and we'll be giving them away. But again, May 26th, go to Event Right and buy your tickets. Let's talk business. What do you think business wise talk about besides Benson Gris Mill?

We do have the date and location of our June public event. Oh, that's right. Fear Factory. We'll be going to Fear Factory June 23rd.

And those tickets will be on sale on Event Right and through events. Or events.prinormal.com, which is our apps website. You'll be able to buy fear factory tickets there. It will be hot as balls.

Yeah, it's going to be warm. That's my birthday, so bring me presents. Yes, bring again. Take presents.

How did I manage that? We did Benson Gris Mill on Lurch's birthday. We're doing fear factory on the end of the birthday. The end likes all things Alocado.

So bring her presents. Give me Alocado. No, no, that is false. No, bring some guacamole and some chips.

She loves it. We're fair. My thing is, sorry. But you call them Ghost Hunt.

So you're hunting ghosts. We're investigations. But you always say hunts and then you go into it and you start saying investigation and go back to hunts. And then he's over here saying public events.

And I'm like, you guys need to get together and figure out what you're going to call it. It's a public investigation. Public investigation, public ghost. I don't know.

I'm not shooting anything. We're very quiet. I'm hunting ghosts. It's not like you can bring one home and put it on the wall like all of your many dead fish here.

Actually, I've got several on the wall. You just can't see them. And yes, I do have replicant that fish all over my walls. And a set of antlers.

It's not like, you know, we don't walk around. As much as the people at work like to joke around with me, no, I don't have a proton pack. No, I don't like shoot ghosts with my laser beam and put them in a trap and go stick them on a wall somewhere. That's not what it's all about.

Hunting ghosts. I literally don't like the word ghost hunt. You know what? I will personally try to use ghost investigation because that's what it is.

Ultimately, anyone who's never been on an investigation, you're basically going into a building or location in the dark with a flashlight and you're talking yourself with some different EMF meters and some other tools and you're just trying to basically figure out if there's something there. Try and gather what information you can and try and hopefully gather evidence along the way. I don't care what you use. Just pick a word and go with it.

Bacon. We are going out of ghost bacon. Don't ask for some ghost bacon. You know, more people might come up and start calling it ghost bacon.

And actually having bacon. Actually having bacon at our investigations. Like four pounds of bacon. You know what we may bring four pounds of bacon to Benson Grissmill, but you won't know unless you show up.

So go buy your tickets. Definitely maybe. It sounds like I'm going to be in a lot of bacon that night. So anyway, hope to see you guys there.

So again, May 26th, Benson Grissmill, June 23rd, Gear Factory. And let's get on with the show. I'm making beaker yawn. He's yawning as if he's tired.

So you guys have an investigation last night. Let's talk about that just a little bit if we can. Who all was there? Me.

I was going to go, but I got sick because I did not go. And I believe Caden was there. Is that correct? No.

Caden is not here. He was here on the phone with me. I had David and Mike and Dell, which is kind of interesting because Dell's never investigated with the other two before. So we got to the house and they kind of mentioned a little bit of what was going on.

And I just did what I normally do because I don't want to know what's going on. I just kind of tuned them out and started trying to figure out where the spirits were on my own. I guess they told some of the investigators that there was like a woman that followed their mom around and they normally experienced her down at the end of the halls. So some of the investigators I think Dell and Mike went to go talk to her.

But I was really just drawn to the basement. I felt like that's where I needed to go. So I went down to the basement and was kind of checking things out. It wasn't very long into the investigation.

I realized that they had at least one type three. And what kind of confirmed my suspicions was I borrowed a Gushmina Pro and it was answering and I already knew the answers. They were already coming to my head like the answers were going to be. But it was answering the opposite or it wouldn't really answer.

You can kind of tell like when you get certain spirits and you've used that Gushmina Pro enough, you can tell what kind of spirits you're interacting with just by the way that they responded on it. And I just started at this point, everybody else joined me in the basement. One of the girls that was there said she used to live there. It was their parent's house.

And her husband used to sleep in the basement. They said that was the most difficult time of their marriage. They would always argue with each other over random small things. They never really understood why they were arguing with each other.

And as they were explaining this, one of the other investigators David started saying he felt kind of like nauseous and claustrophobic and he was feeling like really strong anxiety while he was in the basement. But it was only while he was down there. When he went upstairs he was fine. I was kind of feeling a little aggravated as well.

And I mean there's nothing there that other than you know like a not nice spirit of what kind of do. But as this was all going on we were about 10 minutes into the investigation. I got a call from Caden. He had issues going on.

And that's what kind of confirmed it for me that we were dealing with at least one type three. And I had to explain to Caden what was going on and he's like okay and hung up the phone. I continued the investigation. And it got to the point where I was actually able to determine that they had two type threes.

One being a water elemental. And... Oh, it was a wind. Wind and thank you.

Yes, wind, elemental. I said it wrong. They're both W's. I get confused easy.

But I ended up calling Newman. And he was able to clear them out of the house afterwards which I went through and saved the house. I still feel like it kind of fixed the issue while we were there. And I always do the best I can to make sure that we don't have to go back.

But I have a feeling mainly because Brandy told me that this is one we're going to have to go back and look into some more. And that happens from time to time for those who've never been involved in investigations. Is it's not a comment. I have to go back if there may be something in the home or something going on with the way that's not resolved that we have to go in and do a little bit of a clean up.

It might be the best word. Go in and find out what we missed and go from there. In fact, if there's a wind elemental, there's a couple of extra things that we probably need to do just to verify that it stays away. Well, and when I'm there without you or Brandy, there's only so much that I can do.

I'm still kind of learning and I can wave my crystals at them as much as I want. I don't know if that's really going to keep them out of the house. Wave against crystals. You've missed them for waving something else around.

Wave my stone down my whole way. And that folks is why we don't hear it called the Whist Show. We're going to do a little bit of a picture of the shaking her head. So anything else going on since we recorded the last?

I'm seeing a bunch of blank looks. Next looks all around the table. My life is boring. By the way, that wasn't a Vegas.

You hear that was silent, Don. Speaking in his loud voice saying, Vegas. We do have a thing, but we're going to do it later for our segment. Oh, okay.

Fantastic. So let's get it into it. Let's get it into it. Last time we recorded, we told you guys we're going to do a segment on Ghost Interlegion.

And there's two, maybe three that we like to cover in this episode. One's a pretty big one, which is here in Utah is going to be Mormonism. And kind of their take on spirits and ghosts. We'd like to cover Catholicism tonight.

And I'm glad Peach is here because she's an archithalism expert because she's actually Catholic. And again, I'm getting kind of a head shake yes and a head shake no. Not an expert, but I am Catholic. Well, you're the most expert in this entire room.

So I have done some research and looked at some stuff and you can tell me if the stuff is bunk or if it's any good. But we'll talk about those three religions generally on this particular podcast. And next episode, if we've got the time, we will cover several other religions. Judaism, Islam, Protestantism, and some other isms.

So if you remember from our last episode, though, Deann had her segment on Laylines. I found a little bit more information on Laylines. I know you guys were kind of on the fence on whether or not they existed. I have sort of metaphysical evidence that they actually do exist.

And Brandi might be able to explain a little bit more about what I'm talking about and how it coincides with her ability to find things. You know, let's dive into that before we get into religion since it ties into our last episode. Yeah, that's why I'm turning the time over here interrupting my key. Gee.

Sit over there and look at the pretty ladies. That doesn't mean I'm going to meet all of you. It's the new show. No, Laylines actually exist.

They are energy basically. And when I find phones on properties that you guys have seen me do, Laylines have a lot to do with that part of it. Because they can also, if there is a source of energy near one, it kind of scares off a little bit so that you can find those things that are harboring energy outside of itself. But yeah, there are sources of energy that take you to certain places and the world that have a lot of energy coming from them.

So the pyramids of Giza, really a lot of landmarks have very energized landlines around them that lead to them. But yeah, so they do exist. Which would make sense why if you listen to my, let me talk about the energy coming from Stone Hands and my Hypnosis session. I mean that would make complete sense that because of these Laylines, our crystals will not are able to get that energy from those areas.

And then a little side note, the side note, since we're already on a side note. I've had an intermittent visitor and Brandi's been keeping me updated on her. And I asked her a question. I asked Peach as a question.

And apparently there is a lay line that goes through my basement. So now let me ask this, Peach's. Now, are Laylines something that you can physically see? If I were to meditate on it, I probably could, but I just don't.

I don't see them. I feel them. Okay, and that's just kind of what I wasn't sure if that's something that you can physically. I'd probably show you, you could, if you meditated enough and learned all how to do all those things.

So are there any Laylines around here? Oh, there are a lot that are in the western United States alone. There's a lot. You tell there's a lot.

Your particular residence? No. That's probably maybe a good thing. I don't know if that's a bad thing or a good thing.

Congratulations, Ian. What have you won? We've got a bottle of water for you. Yeah, that's some delicious.

I should say it this way. You don't have any that run through your home, per se. But there is one that can now that runs behind your home is a lay line. It's a natural lay line.

And that's like really close. I can throw rocks in that canal on a daily basis if I so chose to do so. So can I drive over here and read the day and throw rocks in the canal? Well, first castle.

He's skipping rocks. Alright. So I got a question about Laylines. Did the Layline, were these monuments and things built because the Laylines were there or did the Laylines...

Which came first? Did you go to the egg? Yeah. Oh, for me, for me, it's probably the Laylines came first.

And then things were drawn to that area to be built. Okay. I guess that makes sense. It's kind of how we are in an investigation.

None of us can see the spirits except for beaches. But a lot of us, I've seen it with pretty much everyone at this table. We all at times are kind of drawn to a certain area of the house because of whatever the energy there is. I'd do better if one of our mediums is there.

I just kind of turn off and let them run with it. But if I go on an investigation where there's not, I tend to hone in on it. I can fix that. I can too.

I just need to meditate more. Yeah, I can say. No, when you're around me, that's one of the things I do is I enhance your abilities. I say, and it's interesting because I think a lot of people can sense that kind of energy.

And you sometimes just have to point it out to them what it is. I've been exposed to it enough that I can feel spirits in certain places. I can't remember where I was. But I basically, oh, I was in a funeral actually.

And as I was going through the line at the funeral, I could actually sense the person who was there at the viewing standing right next to the casket. I mean, I could physically feel them standing at the foot of the casket as I walked through the line. I'm like, oh my gosh, he's like right here and you could feel it. But I don't think anybody else could.

But had I pointed it out to people what the feeling was like, I think anybody could have picked up on it. Who wasn't completely dead to feeling that sort of thing? So what kind of funeral was this? Was this like a LDS funeral or...?

It was no, yes, funeral. It was actually an LDS chapel. This wasn't terribly long ago, actually. This was like within the last couple weeks.

I was at an LDS funeral and it's been six months ago. And it was the person who had passed away was a troubled passing and a troubled life. And that's the first time I'd felt the spirit of the funeral. And they were standing at the foot of the casket and he was just as angry and bitter and disgruntled as you could.

I actually gave him a birth. I was like, I walked around him. But that's it. I felt it once.

So speaking of LDS funerals, let's jump back into the religious aspect of this whole... You're welcome. Alright, so let's jump into it real quick. I do want to talk some statistics.

So 2005 Gallup Poll found that 32% of all adult Americans believe in ghosts. You read the same article from the Deseret News, huh? I think we tried to read the same article from the Deseret News. That's fascinating.

32% of adults believe in ghosts, huh? Nineteen percent were not sure. Well, 48% dismissed the idea. So basically half of the people out there think that we're nuts and the other half are either in the not sure.

But what are those numbers compared to? Is this the first time the studies have been done? That's all the information. There was actually an earlier poll.

Then it's called the Harris Poll then in 2003. And that poll found that 51% of 2,201 adults... I don't know why there's one random guy. Ask Eric over by the water cooler, see what he thinks.

Surveyed included 58% of women believe in ghosts. So there tends to be more women who believe in spirits than men. Which I found kind of interesting in and of itself because I think as general real women tend to be more... ...open, more sensitive to energies and stuff around them in my experience than most men.

And I think the other thing with that, and I think everybody here at the table and everybody listening would probably agree, is that most guys tend to have a macho attitude that I don't believe in that. That's not cool. And so they just kind of shut themselves off to the idea in general because it's not cool and not tough and not macho to believe in ghosts. So along with that, let's kind of delve into the religious aspect of it.

And let's talk about Christianity in general first. And just because we've got such a wide audience, let's focus on the Bible. So if we turn to John... Wait, we're in the centering class now.

Everybody... Did you just say Joan? John. Turn to Joan of Art Chapter 4.

There's no Joan in the Bible. What Bible are you reading? He said Joan. It sounded like he's a turn to Joan.

He said Joan. Listen, go back to him. He said Joan. He said Joan.

I wrote myself. Thank you. Joan Chapter 6, right next to Roxie. Followed by the Book of Bill.

So... Name is Roxie. If we turn to... I just called it Chicago.

The Bible, and we turn to John Chapter 19, verse 30. It talks about Jesus Christ upon the being crucified and it says that Christ gave up the ghost when he died on the cross. Now that Scripture alone implies that physical bodies have got spirits inside of them. And I refer to it as a ghost, a ghost being a disembodied spirit.

I mean he gave up on ghosts and so should you. Alright, I'm done. I'm shutting it off. And that was our last episode of Supernatural Hour, folks.

Thank you. Thank you for tuning in. So basically the Bible, right then, there, there, there, and of itself, well English is really hard. We're really good at this talking thing.

Like last episode I couldn't talk with shit and this time was your turn. So basically the Bible says there's ghosts. If we go to Matthew Chapter 8, 28 through 34, it says, and when he, Jesus, has come up to the other side, into the country of... Guru, this is nice.

I need to come up with that and help you. They're met him with two possessed with devils coming out of the tombs, exceedingly fierce. So they were talking about possession, which is interesting because I ran across people who are religious who basically, so I thought that people with unclean spirits were basically insane and it was mental illness. No, it's actual spiritual possession.

I mean, we've actually seen it firsthand and quite frankly, even though there's a lot of stuff in the scriptures that is figurative, there's a lot of stuff that's quite literal. And spirits and possession of stuff is quite literal. Okay, I'm going to read the next one because we're tired of hearing you talking. We apparently have the exact same notes.

Go for it. I'm going to read Matthew 10, Chapter 1, Matthew Chapter 10, verse 1, let's clarify that. And when he had called unto him his twelve disciples, he gave them power against unclean spirits to cast them out. And what I liked about this is it kind of goes to show, if you believe in the Bible, New Testament, particular, according to these, you believe in clean spirits, which are those spirits that have come from the dead and unclean spirits, which people will call demons or we call them Type 3s, or some people call them evil spirits.

I like to call them in the human spirits because I think that just encompasses everything. Well, you mean unclean spirits? Yeah. Yes and no though, because I think our Type 2s would be considered unclean spirits in our own right.

Sort of. I don't think that's how the Bible is referring to them. Do you think the Bible is referring to a human spirit? No.

It depends on what scripture. Okay. And the main example. You didn't expect this to do.

No, actually I'm prepared for this. We need sinned? Yes. So, and I'm going to use a different scripture as an example or different.

I'm not going to be able to give you numbers, I didn't research that part of it. But I'm going to dive into the book where we're in here for a second. And if you go into the book of Alma, it talks about when people die, if they're evil, they get tossed into outer darkness. And if you research all of the LDS belief in outer darkness, it becomes very clear that Alma's not referring to outer darkness as referred to in the doctrine.

It's basically spirit prison. So, outer darkness has got two references in the book of Alma. There's outer darkness, which is purgatory, where Satan will go at the second time. That's kind of like Mormon hell.

Right. And then you've got. I thought that was a bar. No, back to.

And then you've got basically spirit prison, which is referred to the book of Alma as outer darkness. So, I think there's terms where unclean spirits can be Type 2s and Type 3s and just depends on the different scripture in different contexts. Okay. So, what do you have to do with the book?

Well, I think there's a lot of people who have the message on Facebook or something else because you know the question will come up. Oh, yeah. And so, like I said, I'm prepared for that because basically in all scriptures, sometimes the definition between one book or one chapter can vary slightly from another one. It just depends on the context that the actual prophet or speaker is referring to it.

And that's a relatively normal thing with scriptures. Context is huge. And anyway, so, one thing that I did find in the research, and I think you'll find this stuff on the same article that I've said. And basically though the Bible overall basically says as far as seeking after the dead.

And this is Isaiah chapter 8 verse 19. And when they shall say unto you, seek unto them that have familiar spirits and unto wizards that peep and mutter should not people seek unto God for the living and the dead. And basically what this is. That's just so that people shouldn't talk to people like me.

I'll reframe that. Don't talk to Tim. He looks like a wizard. He mutters and he mostly peeps.

He's been arrested three or four times for people. There's a difference between speaking with spirits and seeking out spirits. Right. And basically what that particular scripture refers to.

Because there's those who think that basically what we do is under complete garbage as far as we're begging for trouble. What this is saying is that basically if you're dealing with spiritual things in your own life, I think I'm sponging up there. No, man. Actually, go ahead and then I'll touch on this.

I was going to say basically what that's saying is if you're looking for counsel on your life, your best bet is to go to God and not to fortune tellers things of that nature. And to be honest with you, I know that we have medium-so-give readings and those are useful and they can be fun and they can be interesting and they can be accurate. But ultimately for your source of knowledge, you should take anything you get even from a medium who's given you reading and basically go back to God and verify whether or not it's legit. Right.

One of the things as far as the LDS doctrine is concerned, I went on to a couple of different articles and once there's no firm doctrine on whether or not LDS people believe in ghosts, but it did quote some, I think this kind of ties in with what you're saying. And this is from Bruce Armaconke in Mormon doctrine. It's on page 759 if you're interested. And he says, it is true that some mediums do make contact with spirits during seances.

In most instances, however, such spirits as manifest themselves are probably the demons or devils who are cast out of heaven for a million. Right, just spirits have nothing but contempt and pity for the attempts of mediums to make contact with them. And as I read this, how do I want to put this? He didn't say all or every.

He said a lot of times and most times, so basically it goes back to what Castle said is you just need to be careful. You need to use your intuition and determine the source and what's going on to determine if it's legit or if it's something that you're trying to be deceived by. And that's actually one of the reasons why we in our investigations don't use we deborged or seances of things of that nature to do our investigations. Yes, we'll talk to spirits in a home, but we do it with an understanding of what we may or may not be talking to and kind of make judgment based off of the totality of information.

And when we do that, we're not seeking to know one thing that always in my opinion seems really tacky for lack of a better word is when somebody like a celebrity dies and I talk to a medium who's like, oh, yeah, I just talked to a celebrity who recently died. Art Bell. Art Bell, there you go, perfect example. Hey, he was in the paranormal world.

So I went and I was talking art bell investigation other night. I really think of the millions and millions of people and probably billions who lived on the surface and passed away. The fact that you managed to personally reach out and talk to Art Bell, I find that to be highly suspect and you probably weren't talking to Art Bell. You know, how paranormal we talked about how paranormal quite a bit and he's got a lot of videos on the YouTube that you can go watch.

He claims to talk to dead celebrities all the time and I find a highly suspect. What's your opinion on that, Tim? Talking to dead celebrities? Yes.

Unless you're somewhere that they visited frequently or where they lived, you're probably not going to talk to a dead celebrity. In my experience during investigation, spirits, they usually end up somewhere where they enjoyed or where they worked or somewhere that they were familiar with or they usually followed an object around that they liked when they were alive. So if someone died in Wisconsin, the chances of me talking to them here in Utah, highly unlikely. It can happen, but the chances that you're going to talk to that celebrity at the one house you go to in Utah, you get about the same random chance of dialing a random phone number and getting Tom Cruise.

It's kind of the best way to put it. Peaches, you seem very quite over there. What's your thought on the subject? Well, okay.

So we all say, and we say that quite a bit as a group, that ghosts are the same and death as they are in life. So, what were I supposed to say? But it's the same thing. We're not going to go and talk to just go show that famous over here for some reason.

We have local celebrities, but big time celebrities that everybody knows, they're probably going to just visit their inner circle. People that they spent day to day time with. Right. And that's actually one of my favorite things about investigating with Peaches is that she doesn't do readings.

And again, I think there can be some value and I think that can be fun. I'm not. We all know the main reason why you're enjoying investigating with her is so you don't have to do anything. Maybe.

But you know, like we talk about Caiden and the Utah Medium and those who do readings and I don't want to disparage them or take away from them at all because I think they serve a very useful purpose. I think they're very good at what they do. But when it comes to any kind of reading, just anybody seeking one needs to be very careful and ultimately turn to the creator to determine if the information they've been given is accurate or not. So let's delve further into the LDS belief as far as spirits go.

And keep in mind, I am not a spokesman for the LDS church. I don't. We're just members. Yeah.

I don't pretend that anything I'm about now. Tell this episode errors. It doesn't give us a week. And so just kind of a disclaimer, I'm not speaking on behalf of the church and what I'm telling you is not necessarily official doctrine.

So that's kind of my disclaimer. This is just based on my own personal opinion, based on the doctrine I'm aware of. And so some of this may be incorrect, but we'll kind of go from there. So the LDS faith basically teaches that spirits are eternal.

We actually existed with God before we came to earth and will continue to exist after our time here on earth. And so a lot of other faiths teach that spirits that basically are created, that's the beginning and they don't teach a pre-existence. The LDS faith basically teaches that we existed with God and a third part. And I want to emphasize that a third part, the host of heaven, rebelled and came down and basically became inhuman type three spirits for lack of a better term.

Not a third, the host of heaven, a third part, the host of heaven. It's actually smaller than a third. And you can go look that up anywhere. It always says third part.

So there's kind of a great big misconception that it was a full third of the host of heaven. So what is the difference between a third and a third part? A third part, a part of a third. And actually I thought it was a third and I actually had a long in-depth discussion with a gospel scholar who broke it down for me and basically said we don't know what that number is, but it's part of a third.

So it's less than a third that actually rebelled. So we don't know how much of that, if it was ten, we don't know if it was ten billion. We don't know. But it wasn't one third that we do know.

So basically the LDS faith teaches that when we come down here, our goal is to test ourselves to learn lessons we can learn before coming down here and then we die. And this is where the LDS faith gets a little bit interesting compared to some other faiths. So the LDS faith teaches that essentially when we die we've got two choices. We can return to Paradise or we can go to Spirit Prison.

And essentially it's a choice, but if you've lived a decent life more than likely you're going to end up in Paradise if you choose not to cross over. You stay here in Spirit Prison. Now one of the articles that Jan referred to, let me see if I can find it, there's a quote from a couple LDS prophets. And if you know Sermon, the Prophet Joseph Smith declared that the spirits of righteous people who have died aren't far from us and know us and understand our thoughts, feelings and emotions and often pained therewith.

So it basically says that those spirits who have died who are relatives are close enough that they know what's going on with this and kind of sympathize with us empathize with what we're going through. Right, and on that same subject it was in the April conference in 1971. Ezra Taftabentson said, sometimes available between this life and the life beyond becomes very thin or loved ones who are fast on or not far from us. And there's another quote from President Brigham Young who's the second Prophet of the earliest church, second President.

Says, where is the spirit world? It is right here. And to be honest with you, that's something that I believe, that's something I think we've all seen for investigations, is that the spirit world is right here among us. Peaches, let me ask you on a daily basis.

Hey, I'm here. There's a look of shopping. She'll shoot you back in. On a daily basis, how many spirits do you think you see?

See a day. I'm just roaming around. Okay, so if I just got up out of bed and was just walking around. Gosh, so many.

It's probably just like a normal day, probably a few hundred, probably, no, open the hundreds. So let me ask you this, spirits to real people. What's the ratio? Do you think it's one for one or half the number of spirits for people, twice the number of spirits per person?

And otherwise this is an uneducated, this is just a wild-ass guess. Well, in my normal day, for me, my ratio, I guess my personal ghost ratio would probably be for every one dead human or spirit. So one spirit is probably the equal to like three or four, I would say for more or longer for every human. Which that's a pretty good number if you think about it.

Because I mean, if we're looking at say the Salt Lake Valley, there's one or two million that we have here in Salt Lake Valley now. I think it's only like one one point five or something. Yeah, one point three. I mean, it's not.

You've got to figure you've probably got about two hundred and fifty thousand to three hundred thousand spirits here in Salt Lake Valley based on the numbers you've given us. And I realize these are rough estimates. And that's what Brandy perceives. Right.

There could be more than what you see. Yeah, I'll tell you where I go because I live in Murray. So I usually stay around my home area unless I have something like this where I'd come out for that. But just where I live on my daily route or routine.

Right. No, we took peaches to Payson. It's been a couple years ago. And she was like, holy crap, it's super haunted here.

So what would you say the ratio is down in Utah County based on what you've seen? Based on what I've seen. There are like thousands of spirits down in Utah County. And that's from Lehigh all the way down to you hit like Cedar City.

There's quite a few spirits. And so yeah, so there's a lot of them. And so the spirit world basically is here. Very astute of you.

Right. Yep. So there's a lot of them moving on. I'm like a super genius.

All right. So according to LDS doctrine, there are basically two forms of disembodied spirits. Evil spirits, which would be what we consider type three. And spirits of those who have died not yet been resurrected, which would be our type one and our type twos.

I did find some documentation and I've got a big sheet of papers here and I'm not going to take through and find it just for the sake of not having five minutes of dead air. Where basically one of the LDS church leaders, one of the LDS prophets said that spirits maintain their disposition in death as they had in life. So basically what we've told you guys all along is spirits were nice when they were alive. They're nice when they were dead.

And if they're dicks when they were alive, they're dicks when they're dead. It doesn't really change. You don't so many dying to be like, oh, hey, I'm an angel. I'm righteous and awesome now.

We're basically the same thing we are when we die. Unless you have somebody that sits a fanatic. They could be both. That's cute.

You should do that again. What's that? You sounded a little dumbfounded there with your little squeaks. Alright, so there was an interesting part in here that was researching the Mormon stuff.

It said evil spirits, Satan followers are ever desirous, a torment man, obtain control or physical bodies of men and a swayed man from falling christians. Oh, shit, if you got epilepsy, you're going to die like an other website. So talking with evil spirits, they can communicate through mediums, and they can both behave like poltergeist possess the bodies of men and even appear as angels of light. Alright, and the one thing that I found is if you get the Aaronic Christian manual, it says in their Ouija board, seances and spiritualism are tools of Satan that members have been counseled to avoid them completely.

It's the only real doctrinal thing that's been written, as far as actual paranormal stuff. Right, and so basically, and it's interesting because we've all seen the stuff. We've all seen the Type 3's basically one torment man. We've seen them on a possessed bodies.

And we've seen them kind of drag people away from doing what they should be doing for the most part. One thing is then here is discernment necessary to identify these spirits as to what type of spirits they are not to be deceived. Now, if you go into Doctrine and Covenants section 129, it actually talks about a way to discern spirits and to determine what is what is our spirits go. Would you like to tell those who are not LDS what the DNC is?

I probably should. The DNC is called an abbreviation for the Doctrine and Covenants. It's considered to be a book of scripture like the Bible and the Mormon. It's basically modern scripture revelation received by the Prophet Joseph Smith in organizing God's church.

And the Doctrine and Covenants for those who have never read it, it's very interesting. Some of it's very heavily doctrine based and has some really fascinating in depth stuff. There's other stuff that's very personal for one or two people who you're kind of reading and you're like, what the Christ is? I don't care.

Oh, hey. It was a lie, but section 129 basically says if you see an angel of light to determine whether or not it is a righteous spirit or an evil spirit. There's kind of a little test in there, a litmus test, if you will, that you can use to determine the spirit's intent if it's good or evil. So if a spirit appears to use an angel of light and says, hey, I've got a message from God, section 129 says offer to shake hands with it.

And it says if it's a righteous spirit from God and it doesn't have a body, it won't shake your hand because it knows it doesn't have a body. And so it will just stand there looking like an idiot. Can I bother? I can even if those can happen.

Right. If it's a spirit that's trying to deceive you as an angel of light, it'll try and shake your hand, but you won't feel anything there because it doesn't have a physical hand for you to feel. If it's a resurrected spirit that's got a physical body, it'll shake your hand and you'll feel a physical body. And so that's kind of how you discern whether or not something appearing to you as an angel of light is actually an angel of light or an evil spirit.

So if you go shake hands and try to shake your hand and you feel nothing, it's trying to trick you. And so that's kind of what I had on LDS Docker. Did you have anything else you want to throw in there? No, because you only pretty much covered red the exact same source.

Anything you'd like to throw in there Tim? Nope. Peaches? I'm not LDS.

I just look at looking for your opinion, anything else you want to throw in there. Let's talk Catholicism. And this is one I'm going to be looking at Peaches a lot as I talk to make sure that I'm not totally watching it. Unless you want to run it.

Do you want to run it? That's your religion. You can cut something and I'll put my own. I have one little thing.

I did do a whole lot of research on this for a couple reasons. When I took my demonology course, I took it from a Catholic priest. So I got a lot, but it was Catholic doctrine. And I figured Peaches as Catholic, so let her do everything with this.

I'm mumbling at this point. But I did write down one thing which I thought was interesting. And correct me if I'm wrong, because again I'm not Catholic. But I saw this in three or four different places that in Catholicism, they break spirits down into three where LDS breaks down into two, they break it down into three.

And I kid you not, this is what it said. The first one is wispy sad ghosts, which are kind of the quintessential what you think of ghosts you know they don't have unfinished business. And they're here. Then they had malicious deceptive ghosts which we would call the type three's.

And then they had bright happy ghosts. I'm seriously, that's what's the internet description. Bright happy ghosts, which are the ones that are crossed over and could come back at God's will to, which I guess we do have in the LTS culture as well. I saw, I think probably I'm guessing we may have researched the same sources.

Because mine also says this sadly was be ones. So I think we may have researched the exact same stuff. We're siblings, we're like linked. But I actually, I wrote down some notes and it sounds like from what I got based on the three types of ghosts described by Peter Kraft.

And Peter Kraft is the author of a book, Everything You Ever Wants You Know About Heaven. Did you make a medium to find out who he was? No. I did.

Who was he? Tells. So he used to be a Calvinist and then he got converted to Catholicism. And I don't know if he was considered good or bad in the Catholic Church.

What, sorry, I was looking at him in the picture. Peter Kraft? Peter Kraft, what about him? Do you know him?

Slightly why? Is he good, bad? Do Catholics think he's a wack-o or is he like cool? I wish he could see the face she's making.

He's okay. Some of the stuff that he says is kind of, well he used to be a Calvinist, so he's a converted Catholic. But he, I mean he gets the dust of it, but it's, I don't know. But he is a philosophy teacher at Boston College and King's College in New York.

So like you said, he broke spirits down into three types. And I basically, I put notes here and he had the sad wispy ones, that one finished business. I put type ones because that's kind of what we consider to be our type ones. Then he had the malicious decept of spirits.

And I kind of, basically what he described, I think that's our type twos and our type twos and our type threes. And then he had like, you said the happy bright ones and I kind of classified those as the cross-bits. And we do have the, I said, LDS has to, what I forgot about cross-diversaries. Yeah, you can quote that as being accurate as well.

Yeah, and so in Peter, in Peter Kress' book, basically he said that the Catholic Turks strongly discourages people from seeking after spirits. And he said, the structure is probably protection against the danger, deception by evil spirits. We're out of our depth, our knowledge, and our control once we open the door to the supernatural. The only openings that are safe for us are the ones that God has approved, revelation, prayer, his unmarical sacraments, and primarily Christ himself.

The danger is not physical, it's spiritual, and spiritual danger always centers on deception. He also continues though, nevertheless without our action, and remediation, they often do appear to living. There's enormous evidence of ghosts in all cultures. Yeah, that's basically, if for Catholics it's, you know, we bring them down into three groups that we have, which are accurate.

We have ones that, you know, have crossed over type ones and haven't finished business or protecting loved ones, whatever. And then, yeah, we do have the demonic or non-human spirits, kind of, you know, area or type two, even in that group. But, yeah, the church strongly suggests not to seek out spirits intentionally for it to find out, you know, why they're still here or this, not in the others. So, basically what we do, like church doesn't approve, because they don't, it's God's choice to decide where they go and how long they're for, and this, not in the other.

And as we're just intervening, and you know, when I open light or whatever, I might be letting somebody through, that shouldn't be. You know, and ultimately, and I'm going to delve into opinion world here for, based on everything I saw, and I actually looked at some other religions and stuff, but I mostly wanted to cover Mormonism and Catholicism and Cotholesism tonight, because we've got both groups here. Most Christian religions kind of say stay away from that stuff, and I get it and understand why. I mean, if you don't know what you're doing, even if you do know what you're doing, if you're not careful, you can really step into a mess.

You know, and we've seen people step into messes, and there's a lot of people, in fact, we've had people contact us through Wisps. In fact, Tim, you probably remember the guy that contacted us that wanted to know how we could find evil spirits. Do you remember that guy? Yep.

Yeah, so we had something going, hey, how do I find type 3s? I want to talk to type 3s. Yeah, that for me is like, you know. Well, then claimed afterwards, when we told them no, like, well, I've got like 13 years of experience dealing with the paranormal, so I can handle it.

Like, well, then you should already know where to find these things. Yeah, and they're really easy to find. They're not hard to find at all. My favorite was, is his profile picture was him in the LDS Church with his family.

Right, standing in front of a picture of Jesus in the front of a member, right? Yeah. You know, they're not hard to find, and it's the kind of thing where if you were looking for trouble, you're going to find it. You know, if you start messing with Ouija boards, you start messing with Seiont says you start doing stuff like that.