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The NBA draft is over. And most of the drama took place before the draft with a mammoth trade from the Boston Celtics and the fire sale Washington Wizards and the Memphis Grizzlies pouncing in. Chris Paul now plays for the Warriors. That's a thing that happened.
Two and three in the draft. Much drama turned out to be much ado about nothing as I predicted and John think of only predicted and Bobby March predicted all along on this podcast. Zion stayed. Portland picked at three.
Charlotte took Brandon Miller. There wasn't even that much movement in the first round as much as I expected. Atlanta stayed put. Utah made all three of its picks.
The Lakers stayed put. We got a lot to talk about. We got Kirk Goldsberry with a nice denim. Are you Canadian tuxedoing it today?
No, I have some khakis on it that prevent me from going full Canadian here today, Zach. Well, yeah, denim shirt at least. Grady Dick, speaking of Canadian tuxedos, different Canadians. He looked like he was going to the Tim Hortons Christmas party up there in Toronto.
Jeremy Wu, draft Nick, expert. How are you, sir? You're great. The day after the draft is always like, I don't know.
It's like the first day of summer vacation. Coffee number three in my New York City. I love New York. I miss New York.
Now I'm a boring suburban loser mug. Well, Jeremy, I'll start with you because this is your debut appearance on the Low Post podcast. This is your time of year. You're already moving on to researching the 2028 draft and things like that.
But I want your take the very first pivot point, the subject of much controversy. Joceling in the reporting landscape was, who is Charlotte going to take at number two? They ended up taking Brandon Miller. A video is circulating from the Hornets Watch Party in the arena this morning of Hugo the Hornet appearing to be disappointed at the selection of Brandon Miller over Scoot Henderson.
There's a whole segment of draft people who are like huge, crat catastrophic mistake. What are they doing? They're worrying too much about fit. Then there's a lot of people who are like, no, we think they're kind of equal prospects and maybe he does fit them better.
And talent is the same. Where do you fall on this choice? I think, I mean, look, I think there's a reason why this is a move that we could see coming, right? Like if it had been something that was so out of left field that we had never seen it coming and never considered it, right?
Like, I don't think it would have been, we wouldn't have felt the scare and that this is going to happen. I'm more of in the camp of them being relatively equal in a lot of ways. And I just think it depends on what you need. What Miller is, which is at his size, maybe you can really make shots and people think he could be really dynamic and he had a great season in college.
And there's nothing like a dominant college season to win Scotts over, right? Because you know what you're getting. You've seen it at that level before. They know how to evaluate it.
And not that that worked against Scoot, but it was like, I think back in October, when we saw Scoot have that transcendent game against from the Amay and Vegas and we were there. And we thought, oh, wow, this guy is on this crazy trajectory, too, and then that wasn't what happened. And nobody talked about it during the season, but he didn't have like a banner year and it was his second year in the GV. Again, he's still young.
And this isn't not like hating on Scoot, but I just, the notion that there's like some unequivocal Scoot choice was also equally as flawed as saying Brandon is audibly separate choice, right? I mean, it's never take, but ultimately, I think, landed what we thought it would. Obviously, the more interesting storyline for the broader NBA is what this means for Damian Lillard. I said all along, I expected nothing would surprise me.
I wouldn't have bet money on it. I don't bet money on anything, really poker now and then. I would have bet money on Portland, just keeping the pick because I think the players they may have coveted in a trade involving number three, we're not gonna be available to them and the players that might have been available to them. And I don't even really think like any of these discussions got super serious or maybe even happened in a real way to begin with, but just if they're spitballing internally about like who might be realistically available, I don't think they were gonna trade to pick for those players.
I don't think the Zion thing was ever super duper real. I just think it's too, it's just too dicey of a decision for everybody involved. The Pelicans and any team who might be trading for them. It's just too hard to do, particularly on a clock like this.
And so they end up just keeping the pick and as stewards of the Portland Trail Blazers, you can understand why Joe Cronin in the front office and the ownership and all that are like, yeah, damn, we owe it to you, but we also owe it to the team in 2035 or whatever to make the correct decision today. And we think this is the correct decision. And this is the third path. This is the third path that we talked about two weeks ago on this podcast.
Make the pick and say to Dame in the aftermath, just like I don't believe there's a school of thought around the NBA that the Blazers secretly hope that Damian Lillard requests a trade, that they don't wanna be the team, they don't wanna be the quote unquote bad guy. They would be happy if Dame did that. I actually don't believe that's true. I know the people in the Blazers front office, I think they're honest people.
And I think when Joe Cronin says, we want to win a championship with Damian Lillard, he means it. We want Damian Lillard to retire a Blazer. He said that last night. He means it.
I think he really just thinks Scoot Henderson's the best guy for them to take long-term and that there is enough maneuverability around the edges, somehow in free agency, somehow with future trades to construct a legitimate, not just, ooh, if everything goes right, they could be the fifth seed or the sixth seed, but like a legitimate good team around Damian Lillard. And right now that team is, let's just have fun and assume that Scoot Henderson walks in the door and starts. That's more fun to me. So their starting five is Lillard, Scoot, Shade and Sharp, I guess.
Let's assume they re-signed Jeremy Grant. Nurgiches the starting center. Simon's moves to a six-man rule. You got some guys off the bench, like Jabari Walker, you re-signed the eyeball, maybe re-century you banks.
Who knows what else is out there for them? Like that's a decent to good team. The team with player X in Scoot's place is probably better for the short term, but the Blazers decided player X, whoever was available to us, that team is not better enough to justify the pick. And then after the draft, right on cue came the ominous Chris Hain's tweet.
Damian Lillard has not had any recent conversations with communication with the Portland Trail Blazers involving the draft, free agency or his future. League sources tell MBNT and TM Bleacher Report. Joe Cronin said that they had a long talk on Tuesday, which is 48 hours before the draft. I don't know what's soon or recent really means.
I think it's not a secret. Dame would have preferred. I think he's probably excited to play with Scoot Henderson, but also would be more excited to play with Bam Adabile, which was never happening in a million years. The Heat are still laughing about that report right now.
Both of those things can be true. But here we are. Mr. Goldsberry, what are you looking for for the Blazers this offseason?
Like they're betting on themselves. And I think they're also betting on the league's increased parity and betting against the Western Conference outside of Denver, who everybody knows is going to be a juggernaut. Yeah, in a weird way, Zach, their team building challenge in 2023 kind of got harder when they elevated in the lottery. And I say that because if they had gotten five or six or seven in the lottery and Jeremy could chime in on the value of those slots.
But when you're looking at a player like Scoot, that's a different equation. Now your math is different than if you're looking at one of these top-sense. And I think that was really a pivotal moment here. Getting off of the five or six pick in this draft is much easier to do for a front office than getting off of Scoot Henderson, who ceiling is immense.
His likely outcomes may not be all NBA, but his ceiling certainly is Zach. And I think when you're looking at a player like that, in a smaller market in the Western Conference, you have to take that player. And I think that's what sort of forced their hand here in a weird way. And cost an additional set of conflicts with Damian Lillard's camp is now we have number three, Damian.
We have to either get an immense superstar back at all NBA level player back in return, which wasn't going to happen as you pointed out, or we're taking this pick. But now in a weird way, their rise to number three changed the equation. So I think now, if I had to say, we're looking at realistic chances that Damian gets traded in the next few months. I don't think there's any question that there's a realistic chance of that.
And certainly the Heat, maybe the Nets, other teams are sitting there waiting, and waiting, biding their time. But I do think the Blazers are going to take an honest shot at, I believe them when they say what they say. So I think they're going to take an honest shot at it. You know, I just don't know, I don't know what the real, I mean, they can still trade Simons in future picks and they'll have to clear up that bull's, that bull's picked that they owe with a lot of protections.
To me, the wild card is Nurkich. I just, I don't think Nurkich, I think Nurkich has taken like a quarter step back in the last couple of years on both ends of the floor. I just don't know if he's the guy. I wanted them to go after Porzinga's.
That ship is obviously sailed. Jeremy, how, what are your thoughts on this? And or how ready is Chris Murray, the guy they took at 23 Keegan's brother? Is he ready to play?
Yeah, I like that pick for them. And I almost think like that pick kind of red as a pick that kind of splits the difference where you're kind of keeping down happy. Like, hey, we got you this older guy who looks a lot like that guy who's really good in Sacramento who is gonna be, you know, hopefully helpful. He can make shots like he's got size like, you know Keegan can basically play in NBA.
I think Chris is a little smaller. Just saw my eye test. That was how I always told him apart at Iowa, but I think that was a good pick. I think it's a decent value there.
And I think if they hadn't taken him, I think Sacramento was probably taken him at 24, the three United, the brothers. So yeah, I just think, you know, to your point, Kirk, like it's so hard to trade out of a top three pick, no matter what the draft is, but also in a draft like this where so much of the dialogue is just that there is this top group of three. And from an optics standpoint, like coming back off that for anything less than like star level guy who's really gonna move the needle is tough. And I just, I think with knowing what we know about Portland and like you said, like it's, it's kind of hard to like, yeah, with iconic player, it's hard to like, nudge them out the door.
You can't like do it. You know what I mean? I'm like that's what they're doing. But it's also hard to just point on this chance to maybe have the next centerpiece of the next era and walk away from it.
You talked a lot of executives around the league about the PlayZer situation. And you hear a lot, I'm sure Kirk you hear this too. You hear a lot of like, like can't believe they haven't traded him already. Like it's so obvious they should have traded him for the bounty they could have traded him for.
Look at what the Wizards did with Bradley Beale as a cautionary tale. And I'm like, I just, I get it. Like I get it. I get the cold calculated way of thinking.
Like you do, you sell early, you get the bounty. You don't end up selling late and getting 70% of what you would have got before. But Damian Lillard is not Bradley Beale. Damian Lillard is the greatest Portland show lazer of all time.
They have had real playoff success with him somewhat recently. Not the last few, not the last couple years, but real playoff success in the tougher conference. The Wizards haven't had real playoff success since like 2017. When they took the Celtics to seven games and the Kelly Olinik game happened.
The Isaiah Thomas series and playoff run happened. And I've always said the Beale wall playoff runs in 14, 15, 16, they didn't make it 17 are underrated. Like there was a lot of respect around the league for how dynamic that back court was and how Bradley Beale at like age 20 walked into the playoffs, walked into the Tom Thibodeau defense what was left of it anyway in 2014. Was like, I'm not afraid of any of this.
I'm ready. Like that dude's a big game player, but he hasn't done what Damian Lillard has done. And he had a no trade clause. Like there's, it's just a totally distinct situation.
And I understand the Blazers trying and trying to find a moment with this guy. And I just don't know, I don't know what the pathway is, but if you're gonna sit here and say what a disaster they should have traded the third pick, you gotta tell me for who. You gotta tell me for who because I don't think, I don't think, and I think the Blazers knew this. I don't think they were getting to McElbert just who Dame is named check.
I don't even, I'm not sure there was even a real discussion or any offers were made. I just think they knew then that wouldn't do that. So why are we talking about it? The Toronto guys, you know, OGN and Obie has injury issues off and on.
We're always waiting on the leap. The leap, it's kind of like little mini steps and half steps and side steps and Pascal Siakam. I think Chris Hain said to tweet yesterday about how there was sort of an ominous like, he may not resign wherever he gets traded. Adabao, no.
People floated Paul George's name, not in the league. I'm not reporting anything. I don't think the Clippers, Paul George stuff. I don't really know what happened.
I don't think there was any traction anywhere. You can't trade Scoot Henderson for Paul George at age 33 eligible in September for a four year max extension. You just can't do it. That's just like, and he's hurt frequently too.
You just like, that's not responsible management. You wanna tell me Zion, I don't think that was ever real. So who's the guy? If you're gonna trash him, who's the guy?
Now, the challenge is how you take that team and make it good enough. And it just might be like they're banking on Simons and sharp to make leaps. I don't know, it's gonna be tough. Any other thoughts, Kirk?
Yeah, well, it's like what we learned from Golden State. It's like it's hard to run a good team or a great team on two different timelines. And that's where they are now. They're two most important players in the organization are at very different parts of their ARCs, Zach.
And like I said, Golden State couldn't pull that off. And additionally, like I said, they get Scoot Henderson essentially with some lottery luck. If there's one organization that knows what a incredibly athletic high ceiling guard can do for the Portland Trailblazer, just the Portland Trailblazer. And to turn a blind eye to that, to get off of that, and I think you nailed it, Zach.
You have to tell me who, right, cool. In a vacuum, we're gonna get an off. No, that wasn't the thing. There was no option here.
And the best team building play for this organization. When are they gonna get another top three pick, by the way? The best team building play for this franchise in the 2020s was to take Scoot Henderson at number three last night. That's the best move for the future of the Portland Trailblazers.
So I think that's why they did it. I just, brief aside on the Clippers, could I just probably might as well hit it now. I think something is going on there. I don't know what the something is, but what I said three days ago, or whenever I lasted a podcast, I think from what I've heard, when Mark Stein put that tweet out that they were giving off the impression of gauging Paul, Georgia, straight value, what I said that day was, the buzz I had heard was, something went on within the Clippers organization that at least a portion of their brain trust has come to the conclusion that if Kawai in July and Paul, Georgia, September, walk in the door and say, hey, where's our four year max extension?
We want a four year max extension. The Clippers in at least one or both cases are prepared to actually do what real professional organizations do, which is negotiate. And not just be like, oh, you guys never play? Sure, here's all the money for all the years, which is typically what happens with superstar players.
They get all the money and all the years and there's not a negotiation, you just get it. And I think the Clippers, again, the buzz I heard, this is just what I heard. I don't know exactly what the truth is, but the buzz that I heard was that the Clippers are like, prepared to say, hey, how about to either one or both? I don't know, a two plus one, a crisp hostile deal with a partial in year three, something to acknowledge the reality that you don't play enough and that we have not had enough success with the two of you considering the outlay of everything we gave up to get you.
Now, if that's true, then I would guess the agents who represent those players already know that. And if that's true today, everyone has some understanding of how those discussions might go. And if you're willing to do that, you have to be willing to acknowledge that there is a universe in which those discussions go badly and you have to turn to the next alternative and we know what that alternative would be. I think that's all that's going on with the Clippers.
I don't think there was any like Nick's talk with Paul George that got really serious or maybe any at all, anything like that. That's my Clippers, any Clippers. I do think though, this now becomes one of the biggest looming stories of the offseason that maybe people just haven't put on their map yet. I think Steve Ballmer wants to win championships, Zach.
And I think you and I in the summer of 2019, if we can bring ourselves back to when we were awoken in the middle of the night with some blockbuster news, we thought this team was destined for more than they've got in the last four years. I think the road has just gotten tougher and the track record has not really been that impressive. I think if you're Steve Ballmer and the leadership of this organization, you are now looking at a reality where you're, even if everything goes right, or you a contender in the Western Conference, I think you and I both think they are, but the reality is things don't go right. Nobody's ever playing.
And I think that is set yet four years later, that now we're gonna double down on this thing, that is as unreliable as anything else in the NBA. I just don't think that Steve Ballmer wants to do that. So I think you're exactly right. I don't know when it happens, but I think sort of a Vibe shift is coming in Clipperlands where we're not married to these two wings to build our 2020's championship chase around.
Well, there's also the new arena thing that is coming and they definitely don't wanna be bad for that. There's also the fact that like, if they ever got to the point of trading these guys, I don't know how you trade for Kawhi Leonard and resign him for any number of years. Like I just don't know how you do that. And yeah, when he came back, he was reliable the last 40 games of the season.
He was absolutely incredible in the playoffs until he got hurt again, right? When they amped up to minutes in the intensity and I think Lawrence Frank talked about last night, he might be ready for training camp. Like that's great. I don't know how you put a value on that.
All right, let's switch gears. Jeremy, you have any Clipper slots? No, not really, but I do think, yeah, it's your point. Like about that arena, it's like it's hard for them to go.
Bull reset, their picks are all over the place. Like I do think there's something that has to change, whether you move one of those guys, but I'm with you. You just can't put yourself in that jail for four more years each at 50 million, whatever. You just can't do it.
Like I said this for the season ended. I was like, you have to say no. You have to stand up and say, we can't do it. Baseball fans, the ESPN app has all of ESPN all in one place.
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Sign up or activate now. Two, I would classify them as strange trades, preceded the draft. The first which we will start with was a three team trade and with the Boston Celtics traded, Marcus Smart, the heart and soul, green hair, taking charges, flipping and flopping all over the place, making big shots, taking big shots just after the buzzer and big playoff games, making big passes to Jason Tatum at the buzzer of the Nets game. Just a gutsy player, we all love Marcus Smart.
For Kristoff's Forzingus, the number 25 pick in last night's draft, which they turned into 92 second round picks in what John Hollinger aptly described as a tribute to the cascading David Con draft of many eons ago. And the Warriors top four protected 24 pick, which is an interesting little piece of business for them. That's what the Celtics got. The Wizards got Ties Jones on an expiring contract.
And the number 35 pick last night, I think. And the Grizzlies got Marcus Smart and traded those two first round picks we talked about to the Boston Celtics. The Celtics angle is obviously the biggest one here. Just give me the initial thoughts, Kirk.
And you're a New Englander, what do you think? I was shocked at the return, number one. Oh, wow, Marcus Smart is worth this relative to some of the other players we saw moving around last few weeks. Okay, you're getting Forzingus and two firsts, great job by the front office.
I think there's also sort of a cultural risk is how I would characterize it. Smart has, as you said, been called the Hard and so big week for the term heart and soul. I've heard it, I've heard it a lot referencing Marcus Smart, but that's exactly what he's been for nine years. And his arrival in Boston's act, as you know, just happened to coincide with a resurrection for that franchise.
He might not be the best player of this recent run, but he's certainly one of the sort of spiritual leaders. I think the risk here is we're bringing in Forzingus for a world where Althorford's role in the rotation diminishes. Joe Missoula loves stretching out the court. Forzingus does that, he shoots three as well as almost any seven footer.
And he's gonna be able to extend that. One thing I haven't heard talked about enough, Zach, is that the arrival of Sam Cassell and Charles Lee, I think gives Brad Stevens a little more confidence in the sort of culture or the leadership in the locker room or in the huddle. Remember Joe Missoula was in a tough spot last year. They had to sort of build this coaching staff from scratch at the wrong time of the calendar.
They're able to correct for that. I think the building of this coaching staff has been under reported story. I think it makes Boston a lot better. And I think it makes them able to sort of offset the spiritual loss, you wanna call it that, and work as smart, where you have Sam Cassell, I mean, really the caricature of Swagger in the NBA in my lifetime, one of them at least.
And I think that's a big part of why they thought they could get rid of smart. The other really fascinating thing I wanna hear, your take Zach is like, that other deal that almost hacked. Do you think they would have rather gotten off of Brogdon? Can we read that?
Yes, correct. And Brogdon's injury is something of a mystery. Windhors described it as potentially serious enough that it would be very hard to trade him. And obviously it was very hard to trade him.
Adam Himmelsbach of the Globe reported that there's a possibility he actually doesn't miss any games. I've been told that there's just a wide array of possible outcomes here. And one of them could be as Adam reported that he's healthy sooner than expected. But yeah, of course they would rather trade Malcolm Brogdon, than Marcus Smart.
Jeremy, did you have any additional reactions to this before I go on my spiel? I guess I just think it feels to me like they know that they have to change something. You just make enough of these deep runs. I mean, in some ways, it's kind of interesting the parallel with that in the Clippers.
When you have two really, really high paid wings, which is a formula that doesn't always work when there's some overlapping skills set and how they mesh. And obviously Boston has more time in their younger, but you have this massive jail and brown contract coming. And it's coming, by the way. It's coming.
That drama I expect to resolve, I don't know how quickly, but I expect it to resolve with jail and brown getting the massive super max contract for the Boston Celtics. Yeah. Yeah. So I think that's part of the point.
I was like them not only doing what they did, but also just accumulating all these million picks. It's like, they know they're going to need cheap young players and they're going to have to draft well. Because if you're going to be on this timeline with Tatum and Brown both and knowing the way the CBA changes things, they're going to have to really hit on some of these picks. So Kirk, you started by saying great value for MarketSmart.
And I agree. Getting a big man coming up, a young big man still coming up a career year. Had a legit all-star case. I thought it didn't pick him for my team, but I thought he was considered honorable mention.
And two first round picks, including a Warriors pick that has some real upside. The Warriors are older. They got older. And the trade we're going to talk about got older and a little less punchier in the trade we're going to talk about shortly.
That's great value for MarketSmart. And obviously I get the fit. Porsingas is in Elite Stretch 5. There were moments now you've got to go back four years for him now for the most part where Luca and Porsingas, like in the bubble, looked like, oh, this is the vision for this combination.
This is trouble. This is trouble. Like the Clippers don't really have a great answer for this. And then Porsingas got hurt, of course, in that series.
And you can envision Tatum and Porsingas and even Brown and Porsingas having that kind of chemistry. You can tell me that he's in. There is some irony in your insurance policy for older and injury prone big men being another injury prone big man. I'm like, I just keep getting guys injured all the time.
Probably some of them will be healthy at some point. Now, Al Horford's never injured, but you know what I mean. I get the insurance policy thing. I get to be can play with Horford.
Maybe that's end up being their starting five, is Derek White, the J's, Horford, and Porsingas. The Celtics think he can play with Robert Williams. I'm sure they'll try it. I'm just skeptical that that's going to be a thing.
So I get the whole, and his rim protection is Elite. If you play him and Robert Williams together, one of them guards the center, one of them guards the worst shooter on the other team, you drop back, you roll back, I get all that. Something in my tummy doesn't like this one so much for Boston. And it's not just the heart and soul thing.
It's, it starts with this. Marcus Smart was the best passer on a team that is a bad passing team. Hor'singas is just a block passer. I do think he's gotten a little bit more decisive and confident with his reads in the post.
And when he gets the ball like on the pick and pop, he would even sometimes like work a little give and go with Luca in those plays. And in Washington, I think his decisive is really amped up. And they have confidence in the Horford time lord passing, you know, from those positions. I just, of all the teams to take a step back and playmaking, this was the one that made me the most nervous.
And he's their screener for Tatum. He's their pick and roll ball handler with Tatum in that two man game. I mean, yeah, Derek White can do a lot of that. Derek White can do a lot of the same stuff.
He can screen, he can screen on and off the ball. He can do all the pet actions that the cells looks like to do with the J's. But you know, I do think Marcus Smart's passing and playmaking will be missed. He was an option in the post for them.
And away Derek White can't be, I think his size on defense is obviously critical to their ability to switch everything. Derek White can't really function the same way. He certainly can't guard up several positions like Marcus Smart can. And I don't trust him, he gets to stay healthy.
I don't, I understand he had the most efficient post up season of his career with Washington last year. I don't trust those numbers to sustain. And like so many of his post ups are still given ball at the nail. He gets to like do his stuff and rise up and shoot over smaller kind of switch like that's cool.
Some seasons that'll work really well. Some seasons they'll be slums. I don't think Jalen Brown and Jason Tatum want to like watch him do that very often, at least on both of them around the court. Maybe it's different with one of them on the court.
I'm not sure that double center look with time lord in Porsingas is going to be a thing. Obviously Brodden is injured and that would, if he's out longer than expected, that's two guards out the door. You maybe you keep Peyton Pritchard. Grant Williams seems likely to not be on the team next year.
They'll explore everything. But I have the Celtics at like 170 million for just 10 or 11 guys right now, which means even using the tax mid level is going to get them close to the second apron. I don't know. I get it.
The Celtics are going to be awesome either way. Like the two best players are this good. Derrick White is amazing. They have good depth still.
I just, Porsingas has always left me a little cold as a player. Yeah. And something about this trade leaves me a little cold about just it's not the heart and soul stuff. It's just the playmaking deficit, the defensive identity shift.
I just, I don't love it. I don't love it. How about instead of heart and soul, it's heart and defense? How about that?
Because I think they got worse on defense. It was a hot take dude. They lost the defensive player the year from two years ago. But you said, tactically, Marcus allows them to do a lot.
Like Time Lord. I think when Ema Adoka really unlocked this team a couple of years ago after they sort of struggled out of the gate, it was a defensive story. It was finally getting used to switching everything. Rob Williams is a big part of that.
I've never liked Porsingas as a contemporary NBA defender. I think Dallas got better on defense when they got rid of Porsingas. I think this team needs to be good on both ends of the court to get to where they want to go. And if I want to be critical of this trade, and again, I started by saying they got a nice haul.
Great haul. It's great. They're going to be awesome either way. That's the luxury of having Jason Tate on the day on the day.
Are they still at top five defense? That's a big question here. That was a defining aspect of them. And I thought they were ascending towards title contender status in the Adoka year.
And I'm not sure they still are that great on defense. That's what I'm looking at with this new looks. Celtics Ross. You know what you know the word that I would use.
Porsingas is just, there's something sluggish about him that I don't like. He's just sluggish. Marcus Smart is anti sluggish in every possible way. Well, last night we said he's got that dog in.
That was another term phrase that's had a big couple of weeks, Jeremy. Am I right? And I think there's no question. If there's one NBA player that quote, has that dog in them, it might be the guy that just went to Memphis from Boston.
And Jeremy, you said they just needed to shake things up. And I agree. Something had grown stale with the team and the way their offense runs late in games and all that. Any time we need to shake things up becomes like a guiding principle.
I get a little nervous because sometimes you do things that are just, you do them for the sake of doing something. And I'm not saying this is the case here because I think Porsingas is a good fit in lots of ways. I just, something leaves me cold. Something leaves me cold about this move.
For Washington, good value. People are killing the wizards for like, I can't believe they only got one first round pick or whatever. For all these guys, Biel out the door. Porsingas out the door.
Chris Paul in the door, then out the door, through the revolving door. OK, Brad Biel had a no trade clause. And they got a bunch of second round picks and a bunch of swaps. I got everything Phoenix could have.
He had a no trade clause. People are underestimating what that is. That's the whole thing. That's it.
Exactly. That's exactly what I kept circling. This is the week I learned how expensive a no trade clause was. That's the end.
Throw it out the door. Porsingas, they got the 35th pick. And they got Ties Jones who they can flip any time they want. For another good maybe first round pick, I don't probably.
Or they can just keep him and be like, Ties Jones is really good. For a guy who we just talked about, Porsingas is fine. He also had had suitors in free agency waiting for him and could have just opted out and left them with zero. And then they got real stuff for Chris Paul, semi real stuff.
At least I just don't. The idea that the wizards missed out on a Binance of Trade assets three years ago. The wizards didn't miss out on a Binance of Trade assets this week. The wizards this week got what they could get and moved on with life.
And Jeremy, what do you think of the Marcus Smart Fit for Memphis and what they gave up? I mean, I heard that Memphis was chasing a veteran guard. I think clearly they feel like they probably considering sort of the instability of the last year with all the stuff with Jha, like they need to, I think, try to get more experience in the room. I think that's a win for them.
Whatever price I had to pay to do it. I think just, I think he'll fit well in a complimentary sense too. Giving them more of a defensive look in the back court that they maybe didn't have with, you know, Bayon is not, Bayon's a good player. He's not like a great defender.
So you plug in Smart, you have those three guys. You can play them all together if you want to go smaller. I think it gives them a lot of options. I like to from Memphis.
I mean, you got to do something and this something is not, you know, start over. It's just, you know, what can we do in a reasonable way that sort of helps our team grow? Because this is a huge year for them, I think, personally. Like, you know, they're going to have to prove a lot and Jha's going to have to come back and prove a lot.
And I think that's part will stabilize, at least especially with him missing the first court of the season. This was the first deal maybe in the Zack Climb and Regime in Memphis where from a just an asset perspective, they actually kind of took a risk and put a lot out there, put real stuff out there and maybe from just like a pure asset valuation perspective, quote unquote, loss to trade. I'm not sure that that's really true. But Ty's Jones is good and they gave up two real picks for Marcus Smart, who's on a great contract.
That's part of the reason why maybe they didn't quote unquote even lose the trade, maybe it was a tie or whatever you want to say. So I guess they're starting five when everyone's back is Marant, Bain, Smart, Jaren Jackson Jr. And I'm curious about that fifth spot because yeah, you can pencil in Stephen Adams. That's the incumbent starter when he's healthy.
Marant, Smart and Adams is just not a lot of shooting. It's a lot of toughness and boy, are they going to be unpleasant to play against if they ever have Smart and Adams out there together, that's going to be nasty. And Jaren Jackson Jr. blocking everything into the backboard.
It's not a ton of shooting. It's not a ton of shooting. I'm interested in that fifth spot and how they dole out the minutes there. Brandon Clark Jr.
and Jackson has always been a winning combination for them. Smart and Marant are below average shooters for their positions. You throw in a true center, like the old Memphis problem of we can't score in the half court. That's been their issue in the playoffs two years running.
I will say, I would just keep an eye on the Grizzlies. They don't have cap room, I don't think, but I would keep an eye on them as a sign and trade destination. If there's anybody in the free agency market that they end up liking, they have a lot of little contracts, not little midsize contracts that can aggregate attached to good players. I would just keep an eye on that.
Should we move on to Chris Wall? I want to ask Jeremy one question about the Wizards, who I thought took the biggest swing in the draft, maybe last night. Maybe had the biggest reach. Jeremy, we can't get out of Wizards talk, hashtag Wizards talk, let's celebrate.
What did you think of the, do you want to try Zachar, do you want me to try my debut pronunciation of Bullaw, Koolleballi? You can help him. You got it. You got it.
Reach or not? Do you love that pick? Let's go over the details. The Wizards had the eighth pick and the Pacers had the seventh pick.
And the Wizards wanted Billaw Koolleballi, Victor Wemanyamis teammate in France, and paid two second round picks to flip with Indiana from eight to seven with Indiana going from seven to eight and picking Jairus Walker. So that's the trade. And yes, that is a well above where even optimistic mock drafts had Koolleballi. So now with that said, give me the take.
So I think there was kind of this growing thought over the course of this week. It's like, would the Wizards actually take Koolleballi? Because with Will Dawkins going there from Oklahoma City, you kind of have a sense of who their type of player is going to be. Now you have those two teams kind of like jostling in the same range of the draft.
My understanding of sort of what happened with this trade is that Oklahoma City was very close to trading at seven, is what I heard. And so I think Washington was worried about getting sniped. And then you have Utah sitting right behind them, and Utah is another team that likes Koolballi. And I think Washington had to make sure they got the guy they wanted.
And I don't think it was too big a price to pay them about. It was a couple of second round picks. I think that's OK. If that's really your guy and you believe in him, they have.
Again, they have. They just got there. They got a long timeline to do this. They turned it down.
I like this thing. Koolballi is an awesome story. And I said this before, but when I was over in France in November, the guy was so far away from looking like a top 10 pick, just what I saw playing in the, I talked about this with, Prime Windhorse, the Esquire game, and basically the JV team of their team. By the end of the year, he was the second or third best player on the team with Victor in the playoffs.
So I think he really used this advantage. And it's a big swing for Washington. And it's going to take him a year or two to really like, I think become what he, like a shadow of what he's going to be, because he's going to have to get better playing on the ball. People think he can be a playmaker.
He had a late growth spurt, was a point guard growing up, and now has this like amazing physical tools, whatever you want to call it. So I like it for them. And again, if that's your guy and you're starting to, take your guy. I don't mind paying to make sure you get him if you're worried about the trade.
I really missed out on the late growth spurt in life. I've been 5'11 and 3 quarters since I was like 16 years old. It just didn't happen for me. Imagine if I were 16 years old and something I was 6'6.
Yeah, late growth spurt for Zach Lowe. We'll do it out there. You were a late riser, though, Zach. I will give you that.
It's like Kula Bali. You were a second rounder for a while there. But now, man, you're a clear top 10 pick in my world. I agree, by the way, Jeremy, 2 seconds is not a lot to get squeezed out of in that kind of situation.
I always think back to the infamous Alfred Payton Dario Sarge draft where Philly knew Orlando wanted Alfred Payton and took him at 10. And with Orlando was sitting at 12 and was like, oh, you really want Alfred Payton? How badly? How about first round pick badly?
And it turned out to be a high first round pick, too. So 2 seconds to move up 2 spots when you just got 6 of them from the Phoenix Suns, who have literally nothing. I guess they have cash. Did the Suns send all their cash in that trade?
Or do they have any cash? I would just think it would be funny if they had like 100 bucks left over. Let's just keep 100 bucks in the kitty. Just in case.
By the way, it would be really funny. And I asked around about this a little bit last night and got nothing. Just nothing. There's got to be a team.
There has to be one team who was like, and I'm not even going to name a team. Because I got nothing. Like I said, but there has to be one team who called the Spurs and were like, we'll give you everything. Just to see.
And we have a GM who was curious enough to just be like, let's offer them our best player. Say we have like an all NBA level player, who's young, ish. And we have all our picks. And we have like some extra picks.
Like what? If I were a GM, I would have just called me like, you can have this guy, this guy, this guy, 8 first round picks, 7 second round picks, and 4 first round picks swaps. So 15 draft picks, 4 swaps, 2 all-stars, like just to see. So I asked around and I heard, no such calls were made.
I'm like, that can't be true. Some team must have done it. I don't think so, man. Because everybody knew this was like the perfect spur from the jump.
I mean, this is like an international. So the Spurs Dynasty is always saying it's built on lottery luck. They'll be the first to admit it. It's built on international players and incredible big men.
And this guy checks all those boxes. You know, I'm biased, but when Banyama's born to be a San Antonio, I think other teams around the league wouldn't even pick up the phone and say, hey, pop, you're ready to part with this logical extension of what you built for the last 25 years? I would have taken pop out for a meal, bottle of wine number 2, and then like, so how about it? 15 draft picks.
I don't know. I'm not going to go into the gun at Justices. By the way, the Pacers have $30 something million in cap room. And I don't think this would happen.
But if there's a cap room team, just a cap room teams, forget the sign and trade landscape. If there's a cap room team where I'm like, that would be kind of a fun place for J-Mong Green to go. It's Indiana. With Miles Turner as a stretch five and Tyree's Halliburton as a point guard splitting playmaking to use with J-Mong Green, that would, and a team that has nothing at the four.
Now I don't, maybe they're going to get something. Can Walker play any four, Jeremy? Yeah, that's probably what they'll do. That's the biggest.
That's why he was their guy. They wanted a four all year. He can play make a little bit. He's not like, you know?
He's young. He's young. Let's have some fun in the meantime. The other big mega deal of the Golden State Warriors trading Jordan Pool in a top 20 protected 20-30 first round pick and a second round pick in some year.
I don't remember. I think 20-27. For Chris Paul, if Dray Mong Green doesn't come back now, I would be absolutely blown away because if there's a win now move, this is a win now move. If there's a let's not quite nuke the two timeline plan, but we're going to set it a little bit in flames.
We still have Kameka and Moody, but Poole gone. Half of the two timeline plan is gone. Now, a 38-year-old point guard who's injured all the time in the playoffs is there in its place. I mentioned Golden State as sort of an aside as a potential Chris Paul destination, but I did not think that that was going to be where he would go.
I focused on the LA teams. I know that Chris, I've heard that Chris was really intrigued and excited about the possibility of reuniting with the Clippers and sort of the poetry of maybe finishing his career, trying to take them where they haven't gotten and take him himself where he's never gotten. But I heard yesterday, like, this is like a double shock of wait on the Wizards now on the Warriors. I've heard he's excited about the opportunity here to strange fit in just about everywhere.
I mentioned both of these trades are like, what's strange? This is about as strange just as a stylistic ideological clash that I can recall. Kirk, what were your initial thoughts on this? I mean, WTF was my first thought.
I think I'm not alone there. I mean, Chris Paul and the Golden State Warriors have a checkered past. I don't think they really liked each other in the peak of that Houston rivalry. There are like nine memes and quotes that all can be used.
It's not just the Steve Kerr laughing one, which was an all-timer. There's like 20 of them. It just never ends. Now, Wendy had this point on our draft show last night about how when the Warriors dispatched the Rockets in that crazy series.
There was the F Chris Paul chant in the locker room from the Warriors players directed toward the Rockets locker room after they'd won the series. I mean, this is really interesting. But I think there is, you know, if it's a salary dump in pool, I think you're exactly right. When you're looking at it from the Warriors perspective, this is blowing up the two timeline thing.
Just like Damien Lillard saying, I don't want to go out there and play with kids. I think quietly behind the scenes, some of the leadership on that Golden State roster was saying it's like quietly and diplomatic. But I think that Jordan Poole and Wiseman were two of the biggest players in that second timeline, if not the two biggest. They're gone.
Chris Paul is in from an analytics perspective, Zach. One of the big signature elements of this Warriors team the last few years is this. They have lost the non-quarry minutes on the basketball court drastically. In the 2023 playoffs, they were positive team with Curry on the court and negative 17.7 in this last postseason when he sat.
That was a caricature of a larger trend we've seen, not only in the regular season this past season, but when they won it all, they were a negative team without Steph Curry. I think at very least, if indeed Chris Paul cracks this rotation, Zach, he can come in and run that second unit. And I'm not shoveling dirt on Chris Paul. This guy is still a fantastic offensive player.
And I think he can solve one of those big problems they've had with Steph Curry off the court. They can win those minutes with Chris Paul in there. I also think it's time for Chris Paul to play 24 minutes a game or something like that. This is a place where he can do it.
And just when you got to amp it up in the playoffs, if you can amp it up in the playoffs, it is a salary done of Jordan Poole. And it's not even like this, it's a top 20 protected pick. Like you could end up being a fake pick. Like they could end up dumping Jordan Poole, whose contract could age well.
I mean, I'm sure whoever it's like 27 a game next year in Washington. Right. But for a fake first and they give themselves a shot depending on Clay's number to come back as soon he comes back and Dremon's number to come back, assuming he comes back at like being around the second apron going forward, maybe under it, maybe a little over it. They give themselves a shot to maneuver a little bit.
I just think it's a crazy fun opportunity for Chris Paul because if you talk to Chris, I remember interviewing Chris in Houston about when he his first year there about sitting down with him at the facility and talking about what Chris, I mean, you love like you're the master manipulator. Like you want to walk the ball up the floor, dribble it a lot of times, yell at everyone where they're supposed to go and like get them in position and run a pick and roll and do your thing. Now you're playing with James Harden and like you got to do off the ball stuff and get the ball moving, whatever. And he did not like the line of questioning.
And in a very Chris Paul way, it was like, I'm way more adaptable than you think. I'm not. I don't want to be the control freak guy. Like if I played on a team that was fast, I'm happy to throw hit-ahead passes.
I'm one of the best in the league at that. I'm happy to run. I'm happy to run like if my team wants to run floppy a million times, he asked me like, what do you think the most common play was we ran with the Clippers? What do you think, Zach?
Floppy. Floppy. Not picking roll floppy for JJ Redick. Like if we want to run that play a million times, I'm fine with that.
He's a big, he's like a physical screener. Like I'm sure he's thinking right now, like if they want to put me out there with Curry and Clayton Thompson a lot and run, use me as a screener and have me hit people like, I can do that. I'm happy doing that. He prides himself on an adaptability that I don't think has necessarily played out at all if it stops and it will be fascinating to see how he adapts to chaos ball.
Because the Warriors play chaos ball. Let's just throw the ball all over the game, run around, set screens, improvise everything. That's not the way Chris has traditionally played. That's not a bad thing because to your point, Kirk, maybe they get a different identity when instead of turning Jordan Poole into diet curry, maybe they just, like, we're going to, our second unit offense is going to be a Chris Paul offense.
That said, he doesn't have the kind of pick and roll partner. He usually would prefer to have. But you know, Looney is a really smart player who's become really good at that. You pair with Dremans.
I think it's, look, they're trying to win the title. They should be trying to win the title. Steph Curry is Steph freaking Curry. As long as he's on your team, you have to be all in, as all in as you can be.
They have kept the most valuable piece, I think, of at least the one they drafted because they clearly missed the wise one and picked by a lot of the second timeline thing and that's coming and I think they're smart to hang on to coming and I like for Jordan Poole and maybe a fake first, I don't know what better with now player they were going to get than this. It's a big team building move for the future to getting off the pool contract alone as a triumph for the future of this team. But I had one Warrior Source tell me, you know, they don't just play chaos balls. They sort of play cadence ball.
Like it looks chaotic, but there's a cadence. There's a heartbeat to that jazzy sort of motion that they have. Chris Paul's smart enough to slide in there. And I had one of my Warriors friends told me like, at times Jordan Poole was just off rhythm with what they were trying to do.
He was taking one or too many dribbles. He wasn't in the right place. Players were frustrated. You have to be a high IQ sort of selfish basketball player to fit into what Steve Kerr has engineered there to what they're trying to get Steph Curry and Clay Thompson open looks with.
And yeah, if I've learned anything about Chris Paul, he's a versatile player. He's an offensive mastermind. And I think he'll be able to slide into almost any offensive scheme and match his cadence in a way that Jordan Poole simply was someone that's just to add that. Yeah, no, 100%.
Yeah, for me, it's definitely about the money that's relatively clean way to get off that contract. It's not working clearly ever just to do that. But then I just tend to think like the more high, elite, genius level basketball IQ players you throw in together, they usually figure it out. And like at this point, their career is again, it's like, you know, it's a good situation for it to manage Paul's minutes.
And again, you made a great point. Like you'll probably have something in the tank in the playoffs. He's not going to have to burn in all the regular season. And I'm actually excited to see what this looks like.
The different combinations they can have and sort of how it fits. I don't know. It didn't work with the Angela Russell as the Oakland bird, but that's because it's the Angela Russell, right? I don't think it precludes Steph from playing with another smaller guard.
Go ahead, Kurt. I'm just going to ask him what he thought about their draft pick. Because a lot of the nerds absolutely love their draft picture. I mean, I wanted to know what you thought of Brandon.
Yeah. Yeah, Brandon, Pajemski. I think it's a good thing. I mean, it is kind of a nerd pick, but it's funny because so Brandon is the type of guy like analytically great at it really, really well.
I'm sure for a lot of people and helped to stock a lot. But he's also like super, super competitive and driven. Sometimes almost like to a fault is sort of his reputation. It's not a bad thing, right?
And if you throw him in a locker room where, oh, look, there's Chris Paul, oh, there's stuff, he's going to like, I think embrace that. Like, it's a great situation for him. The question with him is just, you know, he's kind of physically maxed out. He's not going to like dunk on you.
He's going to be, you know, crafty, drawn foul skill. I'm going to have to make a lot of shots. I went and watched him work out in Milwaukee, I guess like a month or so ago and was really impressed with the shot making and just his work ethic and, again, one of the workouts were one of the workouts. I think teams saw a lot of these same qualities.
He took it really, really seriously the whole pre-job process. You know, six months ago, we didn't think he was going to be in the first round and he earned it. So that's the type of guy I think will vibe with what they're doing. He'll be falling right away.
And I think maybe able to give them bench minutes and a little bit of extra scoring juice. So not against your point about the timelines. I think they've realized that you know, they tried that. But now it's like, well, the timeline is however many good years we're going to get out of the class and two less for example, the other guys.
So now it's one timeline and you can have young guys, but you got to, you know, you have to think about fit. I think even more. Yeah, I am interested to see how much they play Chris and Steph together. I mean, they moved away from the pool party, super small lineup, but Chris is obviously a tougher, more rugged and stronger defender than Jordan pool.
I just don't know how much physical pounding you want to subject Chris Paul to in like game 38 of the regular season, but will they play Chris Clay and Steph together and how much I mean, they will, how much, to what degree and like where does Peyton fit in there? But this is going to be a really talented team. And if they stay healthy, they're going to be competitive in the West. Obviously, this probably increases the odds that Russ stays with the Clippers and Daniel Russell has a path back to the Lakers.
But we'll see. I forgot about the F Chris Paul chance coming out of the locker room. I don't that that has I got to look back at that. It would be fun to think it to remember how back in my early 20s, I'm not ashamed to admit I dabbled in I watched WWE every now and then remember, turn angle.
Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Remember how the fans used to chant you suck you suck to like the beat of his entrance music and then it became like a term of endearment for him. Like it became a way for them to maybe the F Chris Paul could turn into that for the Warriors. Now turn it into like whenever he does something like just nasty, but it helps the Warriors like a flop or although Chris would say he doesn't flop of course or like whatever. They ever one chance that I think that could they should co-op that.
I don't know if I have any other. Oh, Draymond. Draymond. Oh man, Wendy got his fingers wagging on Draymond last night.