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Thank you. Welcome to the Mariners Church Life Group leader podcast. This weekly conversation is designed to equip and resource you to build a healthy life group community that studies God's word, practices spiritual rhythms, and changes the world together. Welcome my people here.
This is week two of Colossians Habits for a fruitful life. We are looking at the second week in Colossians. We're going to be looking at chapter 1 verses 15 through 23, which many have called the Christ, Him. And that's because it was often sung aloud in the churches that would have heard this letter.
And so I've got to guess here. We're going to go ahead and start by singing this passage together. Ready? One, two, three.
Hey, hey, hey, hey, hey. What's your name? All right. Well, it's John here.
And you've got, you can't guess the silky sounds inside the microphone. Introduce yourself with people. No, you are. Hi, everyone.
This is John. I'm the discipleship pastor at North Irvine. Yeah, thank you, John, for joining us in blessing us with your technical abilities of this spiritual gift of singing. Thank you.
That's also John. Thanks so much. So glad that you're with us. I think this is your second time or so.
Yes. So the time cast with us. So the Salvation pastor, North Irvine on the ground, God doing great things, man. Just give us a little bit of a insight of what's happening.
Shout out all your leaders listening for North Irvine. Yep. All the North Irvine people. Shout out to all of you guys.
North Irvine, it's been a blessing. We are currently the only, currently the only Set Up and Tear Down Church. We are out of worshipping out of Stone Gate Elementary. And we are looking forward to moving in the summer to Creen, Lutheran High School, and the team and the volunteers and everyone in the church in our congregation.
It's been such a joy to see how many people just jump into serve. And the whole vibe and attitude of everyone because it's a set up and tear down. There's this bit of urgency, bit of constant gratitude, bit of the tension that I think everyone can benefit from. It's a healthy way for people to engage with the community and to worship together.
It does really find a way of unifying and wanting people together to be serviced. This actually is not going to happen without being engaged. I've had roles where I understand, understand that. There's a lot of joy that can come in through that and the fruits of that.
You're seeing that. I actually feel the stories and the groups that are being birthed, the recession I've rooted and the people that are being mobilized. There's a lot of really unique things. When people ask about our congregation, one of the highlights for me is the fact that it's right in the middle of residential areas.
So we have people who are just walking the dogs or biking and they hear music. They go, what is this? And they can just come, let me get dressed real quick. I live two minutes away with this walking distance.
And we're right in the heart of just people living there. It's been a great lesson. And as you said, launching into Creen, Creen Lutheran Christian School here shortly, where you guys are at now, so I'm getting in. I've met many different schools and stuff in different worlds.
That is the nicest. I don't know what you call that. It's really a cafeteria, whatever. That is the nicest.
One of the nicest things I've seen at the school is so great. I'm going to be even that much. We have seven of you on this. That's great.
Also, man, shall we jump in? We are Colossians 1, 15, and 23. We're talking around a little bit about this being called the Christ Him. But it really is.
It's just such depth, theological truth here about who Christ is. Many people have that question, don't they? Okay, believe in God. But what about this whole Jesus thing?
And is he just a teacher? I got questions about that. Paul just goes for this letter. Last week, we talked about reminding ourselves of the gospel.
We see the gospel really outworked and displayed through the finished work of Jesus. So Jesus is a principal piece of the gospel, so Paul is going to remind us of that. Before we jump in and read the passage, why don't we work through the sermon questions. Paul and I have both got our series magazines, and John and I have both got our series magazines and encourage life group leaders this week.
Cross all of our congregations. Show up with your magazines. We're ready to go. All right, shall we jump in?
We got to lean in here. Lean in. Design everybody talking up front here. It's a shared experience that just didn't live up to the hype.
What do you got there? I got one. There's a famous dessert place. I won't name which one.
It was in San Diego. It was height. There were lines. There were posts on social media.
I was excited. We got a group of people together. Went in and long story short, for a small slice of a cake, I think it was about 18, 20 dollars. The hype is there, so it must taste amazing.
Let's just say it wasn't. It was just a normal chocolate cake, at least to me. It definitely didn't help that the hype was there. Maybe I thought if I didn't know the hype, I wouldn't enjoy it more.
That's a good one, man. I remember years and years ago going to the Louvre in Paris with my wife. Do the thing and go to see them before. Go to see the Mona Lisa.
It's a room full of hundreds of people. Everybody is trying to get their pictures. We went in line for this. That was part of the thing.
Why are we asking that question? What do you think it was behind the question? We looked through the flow and the rest of the questions. On one hand, people hear a lot about Jesus, who he is, what he has done.
Sometimes when they don't know what Jesus is about, they can see the hype, see what people are talking about, when it doesn't live up to a certain standard of hype. The passage makes it very clear. Jesus is the ultimate, supreme. He not only lives up to the hype, but even beyond that.
To set up, what do you know about Jesus, what do you know about any spiritual truth? What is it really about that I can really get to know him in a personal way in religion? It's balancing that. What do I know about him, what is really true about him?
That's really good. I love that you're making that connection too. It could also be said that we put our hope in other things too, even outside of Jesus, as Eric talks about in his message, that we make second things first things. When we make second things first things, they disappointment.
If you make first thing first thing, then you get second things tied in. Second things is first things, they disappoint you and you miss out on the first thing. I think there's also that sense of you look to other things to fulfill this even outside of Jesus, and it lets us down. If you'd like to understand why are we asking this question as life group leaders, it's good enough because it helps you set up for where you go in for the rest of the discussion.
Great. Would you be down to read the whole passage? You want to go for it? Read the whole passage and then get ready to read that in your look down section.
A couple of questions here. It says choose one word to summarize how Jesus is described in verses. How does viewing Jesus like this influence the way we see ourselves? What does it mean to be reconciled?
You could also summarize these on one question of what you learned about Jesus from this passage. What stands out to you? Why does that stand out to you? So why don't you go ahead and read it and then some observations?
Sure. This reading will be in the key of A minor. I thought some people played. Alright.
Here we go. Verse 15. Verse 15. He is the image of the invisible God, the first born over all creation.
For everything was created by him in heaven and on earth. The invisible and the invisible. Whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities. All things have been created through him and for him.
He is before all things and by him all things hold together. He is also the head of the body, the church. He is the beginning, the first born from the dead. So that he might come to have first place in everything.
For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwelling in him and through him to reconcile everything to himself. Whether things on earth or things in heaven by making peace through his blood shed on the cross. Once you are alienated and hostile in your minds as expressed in your evil actions. But now he has reconciled you by his physical body through his death.
To present you holy, thoughtless and blameless before him. If indeed you remain grounded and steadfast in the faith and are not shifted away from the hope of the gospel that you heard. This gospel has been proclaimed in all creation under heaven and I, Paul, have become a servant of it. The word of the Lord.
Amen. Thanks be to God. If you get nothing else out of this podcast besides John's and the Holy Son of Christ, you get God's word. Amen.
And that is incredible. What a profound passage. I mean every passage is profound. It's God's word.
What about for you, John? One word. Am I going to a possible question but one word? What would you summarize that out?
I think it begins for me the first verse, the image. And I think that really portrays me. Of course, people who have grown up in the church who have known Jesus is God. He is God himself.
We worship him as God. But when you include the word image, it makes it personal. It's an invisible God who we cannot see but Jesus becomes a picture, an image for us. And it makes it personal.
And so I think for me, that's the one word that I would highlight for me. That he is the image of the invisible God. He's not some thought, some out there concept but he's a very actual image of God. That's great.
I love that. The first word he came to mind for me was supreme. The supremacy of Christ. He is the image of the invisible God.
And in being that, he's supreme of all creation. He stands alone as himself. Holy, that's the word that came in mind for me. And so what else do we learn about Jesus from the passage really?
I mean, Eric really walks us through these statements within the message. You just picked up on the first one. Image. That he is the image of the invisible God.
Icon. Think about God. That is Jesus, the image. First born.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm. He's created. Yeah, how would you respond to that? Yeah.
I think Eric mentions this. He goes into this. And it's not that he is created. Mm-hmm.
But the type of first he goes into, where it's not created being kind of first but the kind of first is the prototype of what else comes after. Yeah. First of importance and the first of its kind to come over like the first frees of creation. Right?
Yeah. Jesus, the resurrected savior. Likewise, we will be. Yep.
Not defeated by death but resurrected. And Jesus is that pilot launched in the new humanity. Right? He's the prototype of that.
And so he's not created one. He exists outside of time before time. Mm-hmm. He's the creator.
Yeah. So he's present with creation. All things are created in and through him. He sustains creation.
He's the sainer. He's the head of the church. Yeah. The Supreme.
It's kind of why it shows that he's the head of the body. He's it. There is no church all part apart from Christ. There's no human or institution that is the head of the church.
Jesus is the supreme head of the church. Yeah. And he's the reconciler. He's the one that provides a way for us back to the Father.
Right. So he has so much depth within these verses here. And so note those things. Eric goes into much more great detail of each of those sub points about Jesus being the image, the firstborn creator, the sainer, head of the church reconciler.
And you go back and listen. And which one stands out to you? What did you grab from that? And then you can kick around within the passage of your group around those things.
Anything else you want to call out just from the look down section of the passage itself? Yeah. Personally, I think this is more of an indirect view or indirect description of Jesus because the question is as you know, what's one word that you want to describe Jesus as. But another word, if I could point out just on a personal, spiritual, relational level is in verse 19, before God was pleased.
I just love that word, please. Where it's not just some technical, hey, Jesus fits all these job descriptions. These creators, the sainer, head of the church, but there's an element of, hey, God is pleased to have all his fullness to all of him. And there's an element of in between and weaving through all his, I guess, so to speak, dog descriptions.
There is a pleasure. Hey, this is my son. This is whom I will please. And for me, that just hits home because there's not just a technical understanding of, okay, creator, okay, so sainer, head of the church, but man, he's my creator.
He's my sainer. He's, and it makes it, for me, that pleasure element makes it personal and just hits home a little closer. Really good. Awesome.
All right. So, we have a couple of misconceptions here, a couple of questions. This is what are some of the ways Jesus is viewed in our broader culture? How are they similar or different from what we see here?
And what are some of the ways that we can represent Christ as creator and sustainer and first Supreme Supreme? So what are some ways that Christ is viewed in our broader culture? I think you had lots of different things you could say about that. I don't think you'll find too many people that would, you know, argue the historiosity of Jesus, that this was a person, that had lived, that existed, that's documented outside of God's side of scripture, but certainly you would find people that would say, well, just a moral teacher, you know, somebody that lived years and years ago upset their religious leaders, the Roman Empire.
Was it a bit of a revolutionary? Yeah. But God? I'm not sure.
What else do you hear? Yeah. I think there's that element of because Jesus isn't seen as the ultimate Supreme, you know, God himself, you get, you know, hats and bumper stickers. Like, Jesus is my homeboy.
Yeah. Or he's like that. Okay. Yeah.
Yeah. It's like that. Where I get it, you know, they're hitting the aspect of Jesus close to you and there's words that you can describe. But when you limit it to that, then broader culture just looks at Jesus as just another, like, coming alongside Band-Aid or a helper, just to kind of increase the capacity of your life, where the scripture clearly says, no, he is everything.
He's first and alpha and omega. He's everything. And so I think that's the contrast between what the culture sees Jesus and even as Christians, there is, you know, we don't go out of our way to say, no, I'm going to put Jesus second. But I think Eric puts it in a great way.
Christ in versus Christ in. Really good. And I think that's where we get, it leads to how do we even represent our lives before that? You know, is it going to be based on the culture, based on what we view, what everyone else views or is it going to be Jesus's first?
And if Jesus' first, then everything else in my life needs to be second. Yeah. And I think that instead of just incorporating him into the story of my own life, where he's a consultant, you know, he's somebody that makes my life better. He helps me with my own project.
Yeah. He's there when I need him, but I need him. I think that there's a real danger in doing that, right? Yeah.
We want to become our best selves. So I'll take a little bit of this, a little bit of that, take a little bit of the sprinkling of Jesus' teaching and incorporate it when that's not the call at all. Yeah. It's not, no, no, fit him in.
Yeah. It's, he's supreme and takes the first place and everything else comes, comes from there. Amen. He's stuck to me and I think Eric on that Christ in Christ and talks about this where it's not Jesus' first and then family second and then, you know, school, third, work fourth.
Yeah. It's more of Jesus' first in my family, Jesus' first in my work, Jesus' first in my friends. And there's a, there's a, you know, he is the list, right? He is my everything.
Yeah. And so when you see it that way, then now you have to think about in my area of, in every area of life, not just here's Jesus' first. Okay. I did my checkbox on a Sunday and then from the rest of the days, I can hit my other priorities going above, but it's, if Jesus first in my, my home, then how do I act?
How do I react? How do I live and represent him in every moment? Yeah. You're really getting onto that key of, yes, he's your savior.
Talk about Jesus being my personal savior. I get the sentiment behind that. Yeah. And there's truth in that.
He personally knows you, calls you, compels you by his Holy Spirit to respond to the invitation of the gospel. He is your savior. He is your savior. And we're so grateful for that.
Yeah. And he's also your king and your lord. Yeah. And so not only does he save you, but yes, there's a life of response of Jesus takes the first place, like on the throne of my heart.
He not only saves me and reconciles me unto my father, but he sets me under his, his gracious rule and reign where first place of first priority, it's not, okay, well, I decide this and I decide, I decide that it's no, actually he's, he's the king. He's the king. And you know, many have coined that phrase of, you know, we want the kingdom without the kingdom. We want the benefits of the kingdom without being subjected to the rule and reign of a good and gracious king.
And that's who he is. That's who he is. Not just savior, just lord, not just friend, brother, but all he's, he's our king. He's our king and that requires a response.
So really good, John. This is great. Yeah. So I'm going to talk about this section.
So how do these verses challenge the way that you currently view Jesus? We're talking quite a bit about that natural thing to look out, look out. And then what particular changes can you make in your life right now that would represent that understanding of Jesus becoming first? And then how are you presently being tempted to replace Jesus as first?
So what are the other things in your own life that creep in the first place? Yeah. So we're talking about that already, but naturally, who else would you encourage? Yeah, I think on a practical day to day level, the word that comes to mind is control.
For me personally, there's a level of, okay, I get it, I understand it, you know, in my head. And even up to verse 22, it says, he has done all this. He has reconciled you. It says to present you holy, faultless and blameless before him.
It's encouraging like, yeah, great. And then sometimes I just stop there and say, okay, then I'm good. I'm holy, faultless, blameless before him. And then everything else, I got to kind of take care of it.
And you know, Eric mentioned this last week where the gospel is not just the ABCs, but the A through Z is everything. And so the second part of that verse in verse 23 is if indeed you remain grounded and steadfast in the faith and are not shifted away from the hope of the gospel that you heard. So there's this commonly put it, there's the sovereignty of God and what he has done. He has created us and when reconciled us, created us to be, made us to be faultless and blameless, but there's also our responsibility to stay grounded, to say, to not go away from that hope.
And I think for me on a day to day level, it's the, no, I can do it. I'm not going to say that only I can do it. I'm not going to say deliberately God, I don't need you. But it's very clear in my actions in the way that I don't consult him.
I don't pray about a decision in the way that I get frustrated in the way that I want to, I feel like the only intuitive way is to just do it myself without asking him as my king, how would he go about and want me to live my life. Those are the moments where it's very easy to be tempted in my control of my life to not rely on him or even excuse myself to say, oh, he's the king, he's busy, he's the frame, is I'll do this myself, where he wants to be a part of in a personal, relational, practical day to day way to be my king, to be with me in every decision and how I react to my kids on a day to day basis and how I relate to my wife and in every aspect of my life that he wants to be king. And that's the part where it's not as intuitive, but the moment I trust him, that's when I think one of the greatest ways to tell it is to see if I have that joy and joy of salvation. And I know this might sound corny, but the way that you spell joy, J-O-Y, I've always learned it as, the only way to have that joy is Jesus first, J-O, other second, and why you last.
That's great. That's not corny at all. That's true. And so if you have Jesus as Supreme, Jesus as number one, Jesus first, then you can go, hey, this is the joy I get, not the happy, go look lucky, laughing all the time, joy.
But the joy that in the passage says that's connected to the peace that he reconciles to. And so one way to check if you have Jesus as first is do you have this joy? Even the most of tears, even the most of the valley lows, is there a deep sense of joy and peace because Jesus first. That's good, man.
I love it. So good. I think that's Jesus. I'm going to take it.
I'm going to copy right. I'm going to write a booklet about it. That's great. I know we offer you.
We know we originate from you. So John, I can't thank you enough. I really appreciate your insights and your leadership and I love you. You represent what God is doing here so well and I want to remind you for the leaders that are doing your care and good things are happening and God does good things not independent of his people.
And so I love that you are part of what God is doing here and you're like relentlessness to equip others to do that, to train others to do that and to join you in that. So my pleasure. Well done, John. Great to have you.
The man with the Golden Voice and the Bluey Stick Girls laptop. Awesome. All right, guys. Well, thanks so much for joining us.
We will see you on here next week.