How you form your ego—and can ultimately overcome it.  Jun 28, 1987 episode artwork

EPISODE · Nov 2, 2025 · 57 MIN

How you form your ego—and can ultimately overcome it. Jun 28, 1987

from Talks by Zen Roshi, Lola McDowell Lee

Zen Roshi, Lola McDowell Lee, tells a parable about a powerful Chinese prime minister, who was a devoted Zen student. When the minister asked his master, "how does Zen explain egotism?" the master insulted him, calling him a "numbskull". As the minister's face filled with anger and hurt feelings, the master smiled and said, "Your Excellency, this is ego".Lola explains that this ego is our very basic problem. Paradoxically, we need It presents we need the ego to function in the world, yet it is also our biggest stumbling block to discovering our true identity.Most people, she says, are so caught up in this pseudo self that they don't even know how to begin looking for the True Self. She explains that the rules of Zen practice, such as the sesshin, are designed to force practitioners to observe oneself and one’s reactions.Lola explains how the formation of the ego begins in infancy. A child, Lola says, is born like a tabula rasa or "clean slate." Everything—food, love, comfort—comes from out there. The sense of me is formed later, in contrast to “other". This "me" is a "reflected awareness". It is a reflective center built entirely from the opinions of others, starting with the mother. If the mother smiles and appreciates the child, the child feels valuable, and this positive reflection builds the ego . Conversely, if the mother ignores the child, the child feels worthless and rejected, which builds an "ill ego."This ego is necessary. The True Self can only be known by passing through this ego. The path is to first know "other," then "me" (the reflection), and finally to see that reflection as the illusion it is.As the child becomes an adult, the search for the true self begins, but it's often misguided. People look to religion, but with nearly 400 sects, they usually just pick one that reinforces what one already thinks—which reinforces the ego.The great religious traditions all aim to show one, universal truth shared by great figures like Buddha and Jesus. The smaller sects tend to get lost in trappings.This societal atmosphere we develop in helps form the ego. Lola explains there are two centers in each of us. The first is the acquired center, given to us by society and shaped by others. This is not direct experience. The second is the true center, which we are born with and is given by existence; this is direct experience . To glimpse the true center, the ego must be overcome.Lola discusses a concept of "masks of the universe” from physicist Edward Harrison. Including, historically, the magic era, the mythic era, etc. (While this is after Lola’s time, it reminds me of a more primitive structure that scholar Ken Wilber later provides us more comprehensively).Most of us are trapped in our own minds, which are full of intellectual nonsense and sentiments that make us miserable.One way out, Lola concludes, is the Zen path, which requires persistent observation: one must really observe" oneself in action to see the source of one’s misery. Second is re-evaluating our values.The goal is to reach a state of "just so." With values that are free from ego.The parable about the Zen master Joshu and a stone bridge.Jun 28, 1987

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How you form your ego—and can ultimately overcome it. Jun 28, 1987

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This episode was published on November 2, 2025.

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Zen Roshi, Lola McDowell Lee, tells a parable about a powerful Chinese prime minister, who was a devoted Zen student. When the minister asked his master, "how does Zen explain egotism?" the master insulted him, calling him a "numbskull". As the...

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