If it’s illiberal, is it democracy?

Europe is increasingly divided: between the frugal North and the Club Med South; between the illiberal East and the progressive West. In many ways, the latter is more profound at a time when democracy is under pressure almost everywhere. Our guests are engaged in this conflict. Zuzanna Rudzińska-Bluszcz, Poland's Office of the Commissioner for Human Rights and András Léderer, Hungarian Helsinki Committee. Listen as they discuss the profound conflicts that will shape their countries for decades to com