Infestations

In the dead of night as people sleep, that is when the spirits creep. As the bell tolls three, dark things take power. We like to call it the supernatural hour. So excited.

I'm so excited for this podcast. Hey, this is your host Raven. Welcome to the Supernatural Hour. This is Chad.

Hey, it's your girl, Mone. This is Drake. It's Alma. And Whiskey is also here, allegedly.

We'll have to keep an eye on that. So be a deep minute, guys. If you are listening to this, I am so excited because it is October. And we are starting our Halloween series.

And every Halloween, every October, we try to come up with a topic that's spooky. So I'm not going to tell you what spooky is yet. If you're an insider, you know what it is. So there's that.

So hop on over to Patreon if you want to inside scoop and become an insider. But we have a whole series, which we'll talk about in a minute. First of all, we have like a ton of stuff. It is spooky season.

It is spooky season. We're kicking off on October 2nd, Wednesday, October 2nd at 7 PM. We will be at the Spring Build Public Library for a free mini-dead talk presentation. These are always really fun.

We do a number of these library presentations. Then rolling on to Saturday, October 5th at 8.30 PM, we are doing a dead talk presentation and investigation at the Jewish Performing Arts and Cultural Events Center, known as Pace in Utah. So you can go out to Eventbrite, get tickets for that. Then on Friday, October 11th at the Chapman Branch Library in Salt Lake City, we're doing another free mini-dead talk presentation at the Chapman Branch Library.

And then on October 19th, this is our big one for the month. The Levitz Altarist Memorial Park Cemetery investigation. That's going to be Saturday, October 19th at 8.30 PM. That's up in Aug.

It's a great venue. We were there a couple of years ago. It's really a fun venue. You'll need to go out and get tickets at events.

dernorall.com or event right for that. We follow up with another free mini-dead talk investigation at the American Fork Library, Wednesday, October 23rd. So that'll be at the American Fork Library. And with these library presentations, you can go to eventsperinormal.com slash events or the upcoming events tab and get the details and telephone numbers for those venues.

You need to work with them on the attendance. So they're the ones that manage the attendance on that. And honestly, just come. They're free.

And for those of you that have seen our dead talks before, don't think, oh, I'm not going to go because I've seen your dead talk before. It's a little different. We've got new stuff in there. So come and see your new stuff.

And then we do some mini-investigations. And the Chapman Library is a great mini-investigation there. Oh, it really is. I'm not going to work libraries.

One of my favorites too because we actually get access to the DUP cabins that are on the site. So what are DUP cabins? Daughters of the Utah Pioneer. So they're Pioneer cabins.

Yeah. We investigate them. I mean, you got told to shut up. I believe so, yes.

And there was knocking in the basement and all but one time it was actual people. And one time it wasn't. They weren't scared because it was already people coming down to the basement. That's hilarious.

They're fun. They're little investigations, but they're still fun. And Springville's got really good cookies. At least they say it last time.

Yes they do. And here's the thing about the Springville Library is the Springville Library is built where they're used to be a hospital, a jail and a morgue. So that's actually got some pretty spooky stuff there too. And then the follow up the end of October, there's the free Indian Hills Horror Haunted House.

That's at 28 17th West, 950 North and Provo. Their scare nights are going to be Friday, October 25th, Saturday, October 26th from 8 PM until 11 PM. And then on Halloween, Thursday, October 31st, they're going to be going from 8 o'clock until 10 PM. And then there's a no scare walkthrough for those people that don't want to have the jump scares.

And that's going to be Wednesday, October 30th from 7 PM until 9 PM. And this is a really, really great haunted house. Yeah, and the no scare night is a really good one if you have little kids that want to experience a haunted house, but not be scared. And if you go to the eventspairnormal.com slash events page, you can go down and click on the links and check out the YouTube videos that are associated.

They've been doing this for years and there's literally probably 10 or 12 videos of past years that they've done it on. And some of the videos are 8, 10 minutes. So Springville in there, a handful of residential and by the end of October, all of you are WISPS apps personalities will be just about to go to the end, almost. Never.

Oh, I know. I know, but we'll definitely sit down and have to take a big deep breath. So it's a busy month? Absolutely, but it's fun.

It's spooky season and I like candy corn. So I'll be eating candy corn even though it's so scenic. It makes everybody sick. Stop it.

Stop buying it. It's so big. They have to get rocks. Pastity rocks.

You have to have candy corn. It's delicious. Okay. So now you can spare some of your on them for sure.

Did you, did you just say you? I said, mmm. So this is what I'm doing. I'm getting close to you, but it wasn't you.

I'm getting my nails done tomorrow. I'm going to bring a bag of candy corn. I'm going to eat it the whole time you're doing my nails. The school is going to bring me something better than that's fine.

Just don't breathe on me. No, you're doing my nails. I won't do that because I want my nails to look cute. All right.

So let's jump right into our main topic because it's actually not fun, but it's interesting. We're going to be talking about possessions for next for this all month. We have three podcasts in October. We're going to talk about the three different stages of possession.

So this episode is going to be the first stage. And there might be some people that this scares. So please don't be scared. We're not going to get creepy.

We're just going to tell you kind of what it is, how it happens, the steps that get there. Nothing to be scared about. Most of you that listen to this won't be scared anyway. In our Dead Talks, we have one page that just briefly, briefly covers this.

And honestly, when we do questions and answers and when people talk to me about ghost hunting, possessions are what everybody is fascinated in. And I think just the idea of possessions itself lends to be very interesting. What do you guys think? Just about just the topic of possessions is general.

It's interesting. What's really interesting to me is that possessions at its core is all of them are founded in A religious belief. So possession means different things to many different people. And people interpret a possession as really depends on their personal beliefs.

Absolutely. And I think because it's rooted in religion, there's one reason why not rooted in religion, but has religious aspects to it is why people have what I would probably call a morbid fascination with. I think my fascination is normal. I don't know why I got to make fun of it, but whatever.

Hey, I've got morbid fascinations and prostitutions and brothels. So there's that. Not prostitution. Bro.

Hey, remember, nobody's making you say that. Nobody's making you say that right. You are doing this for free. I'm just saying this on the record.

More but fascinations can just stem from all sorts of places. Okay, moving on. Moving on. Moving on.

I meant brothels, not prostitution. Okay. Although, yeah, I just we're moving on. Okay.

On that podium, explain the difference. Once the act, once the place, it's pretty clear cut. Well, sure. Pretty clear cut, whiskey.

Government. Alright. So people ask about possessions all the time, all the time, all the time, usually, and this might be to put anybody down or to make fun of anybody. But a lot of times when people will call for a residential, I hear the word, hear the thought process of possessions all the time.

And first of all, first and foremost, especially for those of you that, you know, this might be a scary topic. Possessions, true possessions are very, very, very rare. There's actually something called, you'd have to cut out this big space because I have to look out. Transient possessions.

Make a word out. You've only ever come upon one like maybe once. Whist as a whole has dealt with three, maybe four. We have maybe a fifth that we're kind of working on right now.

They're very rare. First residential was like leaning towards that. It was in that like little trailer. We were in that one room.

There was like a chair facing a wall and we were trying to figure out is it a mental health thing? You know, what is it leaning towards? So that to me, first of all, my first residential. So it was a little freaky.

Yeah. So there's that fine line and we've done some podcasts before on how you draw the line between mental health and in possession. And that's definitely something that we need to talk about. We're talking about the residential is not necessarily the podcast for say.

There's a thing called diabolic temptation. Temptations are external things that happen to people by demonic entities that they're not affecting you personally. They're affecting your surroundings. We do run into those a lot.

And that's where a demonic entity or a type three is we call them. Oh, manipulate the victims life and environment. We have to make them depressed, despondent, despair. So anybody who's familiar with the Bible will know the story of Joe.

You could say my understanding is he was being tested by God to see how faithful he was. But that would be an example. If it were a demon doing it, that would be an example of diabolic temptation because everything that happened to Joe was external. Whereas a possession, the spirit might start on you externally, but the goal is to get inside you and take over your body where diabolic temptation is just to create havoc.

And it could be a step towards possession, but there are two different things because one's external one's internal. But today we're talking about possessions. And just briefly, if you look at possession and stages of possession, you're going to find three to seven, eight, nine. Everybody is going to excite when it out differently, depending on how you want to classify different things.

We are going to break it down into three very basic categories, which could be subdivided. And you can do it how you will. We're just going to do it our way to keep it simple. And it works nicely because there's three stages.

There's three podcasts in October, so it works out pretty slick. So the first one we call infestation. And infestation is where the entity needs that invitation. You can't just get possessed.

It's not like you're just doing anything and boom, possession. There's got to be some steps. There's got to be stages. And so infestation is that first stage.

What are your guys' thoughts on infestation? What I was researching was it can take place anywhere. It can take place in your home, on a piece of land, cars, buildings, dolls. It can take place anywhere.

Yes, it doesn't have to just be your home. Anytime, too. It's not any place. It sounded similar to maybe how you would say, oh, my house is haunted.

There's some weird stuff going on or whatever. Speaking of any place, I'm on a Facebook group and people post like, hey, this is happening to me. What is this? And there's times where I'm like, oh, I really want to investigate that.

But somebody was saying how they got a car and how the car is opening the doors on its own, locking it. The windows are going up and down. And I'm like, well, what's up with that? So is it coming in sort of almost like a spooky ghost thing and appearing that way?

It's pretty hard to tell I think from the beginning. Right. I was going to say, or are they leaning on their key, Bob? Or is it Optimus Prime?

Maybe it's not a demon. Maybe it's just a transformer. And some saying. It's an alien.

Basically, infestation in order to get possessed. First of all, possession takes a long, long time. You watch videos, you watch movies, and it looks like they get possessed, and then it'll run or come in, and they do their thing, and then it's gone, and it looks like it takes place over a week. This can take place over weeks and weeks and weeks, months, years.

It's not something that's going to happen overnight. They're very, very, very rare, and it can take a very long time. Also, you can't just get possessed. You can't just walk outside of demon jumps and you can't boom your possessed.

They have to follow a process. And the first step in that process is they have to be invited. You have to invite them in. You have to give them permission to come in.

And if a demonic entity comes up to you and says, hey, can I possess you? Most people are going to say, no, I'm good. I'm good. I'm going to say, what's the deal?

What are you offering? Don't do that. That's the question for me. Here's the sad thing though.

I mean, we laugh, but honestly, we're going to get into exactly what infestation is in here in a second, but whiskey you bring up a good point. The problem is these entities will and can give you what you want, but they will want something in return, and most people aren't willing to give what these entities want. So we're just going to put that out there now. Basically, in order to get that infestation, they are going to trick you because these aren't going to be honest.

They're not an upstanding member of society. I guess we'll put it. They're going to trick you. So think about Annabelle.

Everyone's seen the movie Annabelle. If you haven't seen it, it's been up for a long time. So the spoilers on you because you took too long to see it. Annabelle is a real story.

They use a creepy doll in the movie. It's actually was a raggedy and all. And there were some nurses. They had this raggedy and all.

I think it was given to them as a gift. I don't remember where they got it. And they noticed that we'd come home from work and the doll would be in different positions. And they realized that it wasn't them that was doing it.

It was doing it itself. And they thought it was really cute. And they would invite people to come over and see it. And they'd put it in special positions so they could come home and see how it had changed.

And they would talk to it. And right there, boom, invitation. Well, I think that's one thing that like, when we talk about it not happening overnight, in some ways it does, right? Because as things change, they do happen suddenly.

And as with most things, that's when we become aware. So while like timeline wise, looking back on things, when you're trying to root cause what happened, it might expand. It might expand, but in most people's experience, when the sudden changes happen is when people become more aware. Like when someone's mood shifts or things like that.

And so in this case, right? We talked about they brought it home and that was the moment of the invitation essentially, right? Up until then it was just tiptoeing around it. Exactly.

And everybody can be different. And every stage might be different for different people. A lot of people might take longer for the infestation stage. And other people, you know, it could be short.

Some people step two and step three, which we'll talk about later. Those could be longer or shorter, depending on how well you hold up to what's going on. So we don't want to put a timeline on anything because everyone's going to be different. Every situation is going to be different.

It's going to depend on the fortitude of the person. It's going to depend on how strong that tiptoeing that particular demonic entity is. A lot of factors that are going to change the timeline. But the point being the spirit can't just possess you.

So it's got to go through these steps and these steps don't happen quickly. Can you talk about just a little bit the difference? And this is like a common question that we get at libraries and just in general when we're investigating. But we talk about this step, right?

The invitation and acknowledging that it exists essentially whether it's tricked us into believing what it is or anything like that. What's the difference between that act and what we do in paranormal investigating? Because we are essentially showing up and acknowledging the presence of something. Good question.

So many people won't go to investigate. They won't go on a ghost hunt because they're afraid of getting possessed. They're afraid of something following them home. So let's not talk about things following you home.

Basically, you just tell it not to. I'm short story. If you come out on an investigation with us, we can go into more detail. Let's focus just on what we do.

One of the things we tell people on investigations is don't invite anything home with you because you don't know what it is. These entities do not tell you the truth. These are the entities that are going to tell you that it's this cute little boy or cute little girl or some soft story. Or it's just going to be so cute and you're like, oh come with me.

That's an invitation. Inviting things home with you. That's going to just open the door for that. What we do is scientifically we want together evidence.

We want to try to capture a picture. We want to try to get a recording. We want to have some sort of proof of, and maybe at this point we can't prove, but we want to show a picture that says, we don't know what this is. We've rolled everything out.

So it's paranormal. It doesn't necessarily mean it's a ghost, but it's paranormal. We don't want to invite things there. We don't want to invite things there.

We don't want things to come home with us. We are just basically doing experiments to see what we can find. When we go into someone's home, we try to figure out what's there. We try to figure out why things are doing and what they are.

Sometimes we've been able to say we don't think you have a ghost in your house. We just think that you've got this air purifier too close to your bed that's giving you the heebie-jeebies. Or the main Wi-Fi cords are going up in your closet and that's why your closet gives you the creeps. Your snorkel arm is hanging from the ceiling with the wire and it's causing a bunch of...

Absolutely. A bunch of EMF and that's giving you the creeps. I guess the basic difference is we want to scientifically try to get some evidence and see what's already in place. We're not even thinking of this.

We're not trying to get into a relationship with these things. Speak for yourself first. No, no, no. This is not the case.

No, no. No, no. Ghost friends. I don't think we should have investigations for no reason.

So how do you guys do that? For me, it's really interesting because I struggle to explain the difference other than the key point of intention. I think that's true. And it's still a really fine line because even though I'm showing up with tools that are developed for some other sort of science and trying to apply it in the scenario, I'm still trying to establish contact when at its core, that's what a lot of people are doing with a Ouija board with other types of summoning pendulums, things like that.

They're trying to talk to something. So I always sit back and I wonder, even if I'm not asking for anything new to come in, is just going and trying to talk to something that I've been told is there with the intent to gather something, is that an enablement for it to be in that environment. Obviously, the thing that kind of separates us from what standard people do is we take steps afterwards to cleanse and rid it from the area. And cleanse ourselves, making sure we're okay in the best of our ability.

Absolutely. And I don't disagree with you. We are going knowing that we're going to be making contact with these entities. But I think you really hit it on the head is what is the intention.

And our intention is very much, you got to stay here. We are not looking to interact with you other than just if we can get your bit Jersey, if you can touch this ball, you know, act like our chank monkey and you know. I do think our health get rid of it. So a family can be comfortable.

Exactly. Yeah, I think like my grandma's house is a great example. The more we go, the crazier and crazier guests. We never take any steps to cleanse it purely out of selfishness because it's fun when you're a parent.

But he's getting more and more worse. And I just wonder, are we in this environment, right? Because it can invest in environment. It doesn't have to just be a person just waiting.

Are we giving it more and more opportunity? And eventually it's going to be a throw down with some sage before we sell the house. That's not right now because the house is empty. We have any set of like, I don't know, like if we're going into environments like that consistently, right?

Where we don't really worry too much about cleansing because no one's there. But are we adding to the infestation by going there with the intent to communicate and not get rid of something? I think that's really what people who become into the next stage that we'll talk about later is like they no longer intend to rid themselves of it. Well, my thinking is like those historical places that we could go to like Benson, Chris Mill, The Wash U Club and all that.

There's so many people that go through there. Is it getting worse? Is it getting more scary and negative? Or is it kind of being around the same?

If you're going to environment that is more negative, could that still feed into because of a negative feeling? Or is you being there allowing the negative to get in there? But are those historical places or places that just have a lot of people going through there? Is that getting worse?

Yeah, exactly. One thing that you can think about though is as paranormal investigators, when we go in somewhere, we realize that there is that we understand what a possession is and what you need to do for that to become a factor in your life. And we take steps not to do that. One of the things in our presentation is we say, do not give them an invitation.

Do not say, hey, come at me because they will. Boom, that's an invitation. Don't invite them home. And so we know what not to do.

Also intention. And if you look at a lot of these possessions that have happened, they're like these nurses with an animal doll. They weren't going into a situation where they thought, we're going to go home and there's an entity in this doll that we got. And also we got to be really careful.

They came home and it was just moved. So I think a lot of times there's not only the expectations that you set, the intentions that you set, but the expectations of what you're going into. We're going into haunted places with the expectation of meeting these entities. And we don't want anything to do with them as far as getting into our personal lives.

Whereas if there's an entity on a thing you possess or it just happens to follow you home and you're not aware of it and things just start to happen. You don't even know what's happening really until maybe it's starting to get too late. I think like, yeah, exactly. That's when they call it.

I think for me, I don't go to house calls. I mean, if we've been there before, I do have a level of expectation. Like, this is what happened last time. So I expect at least that this time.

Like the family trees get example down in the teller. My blue lights like it happened both times. But going to a house call, I don't expect anything. I hear what they say.

And I just go there to see like most of the time. Honestly, I expect to find some kind of wildy M F in your walls. But I think that to your point, the key difference here is we know what we're going to do. Like we have our guard up.

Exactly. If you're not expecting it, it's a lot easier to manipulate somebody. Right. If I'm expecting a phone call from a close relative and a scam or calls to be the close relative, I'm going to maybe believe them.

There's just opportunity. But if I know like, hey, no one ever is going to call me, which is true. Ladies. Is number five five.

That's right. All five. Just keep dialing. But it definitely like, if you're not expecting it and somebody calls, I might answer.

I might be like, Oh, I don't call him out of the blue. What the heck? Like, I guess that that sound like my book. I haven't heard from him in a while.

I guess he might be in jail. He does mean my book. And just I wanted to piggyback off of something you just said, when I go to a residential, I don't necessarily have expectations. That being said, when someone calls you and says, Hey, can you come check out what's going on in my house?

My mind said is there's either going to be something there or it's going to be nothing or it's going to be a myth or it's going to be one of these things that we've talked about. But you're still going in with the idea that there's possibly an entity in there. So yeah, I agree with you on that aspect. You want to have your guard up.

Tell us where to look and we'll look just like on the HVAC people when you feel like whole drafting your house like this is where I feel it. They might come and be like, I don't know, that's weird. I can't figure it out. Or they might be like, Hey, this vent across the room has a bent little fan and then it's going to blow that way.

Sorry. We'll fix it. So going back to actual infestations, we've talked about the Annabel doll and we've actually brought that up several times. Some of the things that we have actually dealt with us personally, not personally, but cases that we have dealt with.

One person that was in the process of being possessed and going to infestation, it had gone on to the next days. But what had kind of caught the entity's attention was that this boy was an early teen and he had autism. And these entities will appear to them if the person is able to see them and will become their friend. And it might not come through attached to something and it will be friend them.

And that's actually a case that we're working off and on right now with the family is the same situation. An older boy in his early 20s who has some of these entities that were his friend. And we'll talk more about that in the second phase. But you know, they're your friends, they help you, they hang out with you.

They'll find people that are lonely. They'll find people that are sick. They'll find people that are for whatever reason. Maybe just off the top of their game and they're going to sympathize with you and they're going to make you feel understood.

And like you have someone, it could be playful, it could be a child. You just need to be very, very careful. And I'm going to kind of, I don't know that I can quote it because it's not going to be a direct quote. But if those of you that are familiar with Harry Potter, I believe it's the second book.

You'll saw. You'll saw. The second book where they, where Mr. Weasley says, you know, if you have something that can think for itself, it's probably not good.

So, you know, if you get this cute doll and it starts moving by itself, that's not cute. It's potentially very, very dangerous. There's an entity that you can see and no one else can and it's validating every feel bad you've ever had. Be careful.

So in that mindset with the invitation, I was trying to think like, you know, adults, they have like their emotions and their needs and wants. And so you can see where they're like, hey, this isn't my life, but kids, like, they're not going around saying, hey, come over here and, oh, are there you and like spooky, whatever, is it made because they try to be more like that invisible friend or imaginary friend and then they get in that way? That's like my thinking there. That would be my thinking.

Personally, any of the possessions that I have heard about dealt with, read about are usually teenagers and up. I'm not saying that small children can't be affected. We've had a few residential where some smaller children were being, and I'm not saying it was a demonic possession. It was probably just a grumpy spirit trying to harass them.

Could it be a possible early possession? We don't know. But one of the things that we would tell the parents was, as a matter of what religion, but are your children blessed? And if not, please go get them blessed because that can give them an extra layer of protection if you are of a religious mindset.

You know, that's not your thing, that's not your thing, but it can't hurt. So, but yes, that's going to be imaginary friends, that sort of thing. I'm just pausing, so someone else can talk if you would like to. Anyway, I think that as far as possessions go, the infestation part is the scariest because it can be hard to recognize.

So you might be saying to yourself, yeah, now I'm scared, I don't dare do anything. Again, remember that possessions are really, really, really rare, very rare. And really, we know on Ghost Sense, we always say that your best ghost sense tool is just you, it's just your body. You're going to feel hot, where it shouldn't be.

You're going to feel cold, you're going to feel just like something's not quite right. And as you know, the last residential we went on, which we'll talk about here in a few minutes, I believe, and I can't wait for Whiskey to be able to review his video footage, but I think one of the cat balls actually moved. And that's kind of cool. I love seeing things move.

And if you've ever investigated with me, I'm always trying to get spirits to knock over bottle or move this ping pong ball. But I think if something legit started moving in my house, it would creep me out a lot. You have all those dolls, man, it's gonna be one of those dolls. You got your little minibill mini.

I do have three just nice, happy, not demonic, not want to possess me spirits with my home. And they will occasionally move things. I'm not worried about those, but I know the spirits are in my house. I know, right?

They're gonna say, Hey, I'll show you this. But I'm talking other kinds of things because type ones aren't gonna be or demonic entities aren't gonna be subtle. They're gonna really want you to notice they're gonna be a little more out there. They're like your extrovertie outgoing friend that really wants some attention because they want that invitation.

They're not gonna be so. Well, I'm still gonna be trying to go ahead. It's okay. You go ahead.

It's not gonna be like a cut moving. It's gonna be something that resembles a body that they're trying to move. Yep, it's going to be it's going to be a lot more out there. I like it start like you're hearing voices, you're hearing footsteps, you're feeling another presence, you're seeing apparitions and even smelling like different funky odors.

And then as I was reading about this, it says that they need approval so they can have an invitation to stay basically. And then once they get that more solid invitation to stay, that's when they can really reveal their true identity and kind of work more harder on you. Yep, and that's where we're gonna get into the second stage, which will be our next podcast. But absolutely that's kind of where it goes.

I was thinking it's sort of like if you have that annoying noise that's always in your house, like the beeping thing for the smoke alarm when it beeps. At first it's like the most horrible sound ever and then it just becomes a sound in the background. So it's gonna wear you down possibly and make you get used to it. You're like, yeah, you know, no big deal.

You're there but you've just kind of ignored it or become a big deal anymore. And I guess that's where it could potentially grow and you're just welcoming it there. And they just do over a long, great time potentially. I will say like obviously seeking out communication, right, is a big thing.

And in my experience, there are times where there's something out there that's trying to communicate and I don't want to talk to it. I just get the vibe that I shouldn't. Sometimes it's in my own house. The cat toy literally got thrown the other day by an unseen force and I didn't acknowledge it.

I knew it happened. My cat who chases everything that's thrown on the hallway also did not chase it and just postured and stared at it. And I think we sent a pretty clear message of like, hey, it's not, it's not today. I do want to say though, like one really important thing this step that we don't want to skip over is like the gloss over in the beginning, but like mental health plays a big role in this particular stage and preventing it to the next stage.

If you, it's not saying that it's not paranormal, but if you're hearing voices, you're seeing things and things like that, it's some help. You reach out to a qualified professional, you can totally reach out to go Sunday, we'll come out, we'll help you, we might recommend that you follow up with somebody because even if you are experiencing something legitimate going on in your house, something's trying to get that invitation, making sure that even if what's happening is legitimate that you are in a positive mental space, you're dealing with any depression, increased stress, whatever it is in a healthy way, will help you keep your shield up from going into the next step. Right. And on the flip side, let's say that it's not a paranormal entity and that it's just mental health issues that you're unaware of, it would be very unethical for us to get all excited about the possession and be treating, you're not seeing my air quotes, but treating you and your household for this possession when there's really a mental illness that's going unchecked.

That's unfair to you, it's unfair to your family. So it can go both ways or either way. I just wanted to piggyback off of that in our research and my research on YouTube, just looking up different presaying stuff. I got two ads for spirit possession treatment and the odd thing is it's two different companies, but they look exactly the same ads.

So there's a conspiracy, don't click on that link, who knows what you're clicking. But yeah, I was two ads for spirit possession treatment through long distance treatment. I was like, I don't know about that. So going to people and researching what they're about to make sure it's potentially more helpful.

It's definitely not my number on those ads. All right. Before anybody asks. Five five five five five.

Right. Now, I don't know that I've ever seen or read anything. This is purely my opinion and honestly this opinion kind of popped into my head right now, but I've been thinking about it as we've been talking. And I think if someone is seeking out to be possessed or not even seeking out to be possessed, but if you're using a Ouija border conjuring candles because you want to invite a spirit in your life, first of all, I would suggest not one of the things we talk about on our investigations is we highly recommend highly, highly recommend not inviting spirits into your home.

One, because of possession, two, you have no idea and no control what comes through that process. And it can be and has been for many people very, very, very ugly. So we highly, highly do not recommend that in any way, shape or form, so I'm going to put that out there. But as far as the stages of possession, if you were to invite something in, you could probably just forego the whole first stage and jump right into the second, which again, we'll talk about on our next podcast, which gets very ugly.

And if you are communicating with things, whether you think it's your greasy granddad year, whoever you're talking to, keep your guard upright. If it's influencing you to do something negative, it's probably not your relative. That's just another common opening that people, especially in stages of grief, you're a little more vulnerable, the people and to the paranormal. So you might be out there actively searching for something to say hello, your mother, whatever it might be, and something might pretend.

So I am, I totally 100% believe that close ones, loved ones can communicate with you after they're down. Honestly, this is my personal opinion, that they're not going to do that very often, they're not going to do that on a daily basis. Now I'm not saying that there aren't people that are very in tune to their relatives and their relatives, give them some affirmations, but honestly, I don't think they're just going to sit down and chit chat with you for long periods of time on a daily basis. And so if that's happening, I'm going to be a little sus on it actually being a relative.

A lot of the time it's also not going to be either talking to you, it's going to be like, you recognize a presence or something like that. Absolutely. Yeah, I think any interactions with relatives are going to be relatively brief and a lot of times just feelings, like Jake said, impressions, maybe if butterflies were something important to you, you might see a butterfly or other things, but it's definitely going to be different. My grandma is a ladybug.

Aw, sweet. And you know? Alright, well next podcast, we're going to talk about Step Two, which is oppression. And this is where it gets exciting.

So listen for us again in two weeks. In the meantime, let's see what you got for us. Hi. Talk about something though.

I went to the Audis and Curiosity Expo. This last, well, not last weekend, but you know, weekend to go. Since we've last recorded, I went there. I'm a shameless spokesperson for our crew.

So I made a lot of good connections there. I bought a wet specimen of a shark. I have a little shark in the jar. It's pretty cool.

That fossil and a lamp for my new craft desk, which I'll finally be back up and running in the lab down here, hopefully in a week. I'm just going to be organized now and I've got to backlog at things to fix and repair. I don't want to say anything because it's rude. It's there.

I see it. It's on the desk now where the soldering iron is. So it's made progress. But it was actually really interesting.

So last year, there was, it was just mostly like, that animals, which is really cool to me. But you know, it's kind of like some of the farmer's marks about where everybody has a 3D printed dragon. We're like, okay, I would love to see something different on a booth. Like years is a different color of very cool, three horns.

Wow. But this year, there was a lot, a lot, a lot of like paranormal type stuff, a lot of dolls, a lot of really old artifacts, a lot of old pictures. There was like Victorian death, like post-death pictures. They had for sale.

I saw a wreath made of somebody's hair. They used to take like people's hair back then and make like little art projects out of them. I was so so, Kristi was there with me and other person on the team looking around at stuff. And I met somebody there that is interested in having us come out to their shop and it notably haunted place in Utah, haunted kind of ghost town, any place and to investigate none other than their cabinet of human schools that opens itself.

Really just casual things to have around the office. But it was really fun. I was really stoked if you guys haven't yet. Definitely go check it out.

The other cool part is there was like local vendors too. So it's not just the same vendors that travel everywhere. There's a good amount that do the whole circuit. Some of them make some really good treats.

But yeah, they were local. I've got people from Colorado coming in. One of them I might hook you up with, or even bring on our podcast. They're on some vernal movies and stuff and send them out to look at some spooky stuff and saw like a layer in town.

So yeah, that's it. More to come on equipment soon. I have some ideas for things to create. So we shall see what happens.

Oh, just a quick before you move on. So I didn't go to the oddities and curiosities expo this year for two reasons. One, school's kick my butt. So I just did not have time.

But two, I've been a couple of years in Rowan. It's always been really good. But last year I was very underwhelmed. And now I'm sad that I missed this year because it sounds like it was fantastic.

Yeah, I mean, I had fun last year, but it was a lot of taxidermy. Like it was a lot of taxidermy and a lot of framed butterflies. I was like, I don't want to see any more bones. I don't want to see any more taxidermy.

I don't want to see any more framed butterflies. I'm feeling a lot of attack here with the frame butterflies and monster in my background. But you know, whatever. Well, no, there's nothing wrong with eight framed butterflies.

Like every other booth is like, oh, more framed butterflies. I want to see one booth with framed butterflies. And then the next booth with something else. And the next booth with even something different.

I was at a vintage store recently and there was definitely like a possum head. Just this head all mummified, sitting in the glass around all of these like antiques of grandma's dresses. And I was like, what is this? So I was like, oh, oddity.

The possum head. Another thing coming up with equipment and maybe with moon's artwork. We might be selling some soon with our friends at the Mystic Frogs. We'll be able to get your hands on some random things from the lab and some artwork.

So and if you don't want to wait to buy stuff from us, which is totally fine, I am on board with that idea. If this podcast is the infestation stage of your urge to buy, you know, send us the invite, open up those doors and those wallets, go to advanced tournament.com, check out all of our stuff. You can find the store, you can buy a cleansing kit in there, you know, kind of like cancel it out. Follow us on YouTube, TikTok, everywhere.

We'll get posted on there soon. But yeah, that's it. Alrighty. So with our junk drawer today, before we start, we have been so excited about this topic, at least I have, that we have totally just to ignore all of our sponsors.

So we want to first of all do a little shout out to Castle Photart. If you need some portraiture taken, or if you just want some pictures of nature, he does amazing wildlife photography. He's got all sorts of stuff that you can print that you can purchase besides having your family pictures or graduation or whatever pictures. And also to the SF-Hiwish Performing Arts and Cultural Events Center, Pace the Hiwish and Otayos, which as you know is one of my favorite places to eat, even though I haven't been there for a minute, but I will get back.

So we're starting to talk about possessions. So our junk drawer is not about possessions. We're going to lighten the mood just a little bit. Probably need this more than next two episodes to get really dark, but there aren't a lot of people keep possessions in a junk drawer.

Yes. Yes, so maybe it is about possessions. So we are going to do some Halloween riddles. You guys ready?

No. You're ready to take your own doll? Not on the script here, Raven. You got to say, you were ready.

You were saying the answer is an hour ago. No, that's not how this works. I'm doing my dark drawer. I'm on script.

Save me chat, GPT. Happily. I'll give you some of the grade school ones that seems too obvious. Well, don't intro with that.

Now when we miss it, just going to make us look more dumb. Yeah, you did. Like, you did the hardest ones. Developed by MIT and Harvard.

Okay. Well, start off easy. Start off easy, ready? And I'm just doing a chosen few.

Okay. Here we go. I made a phone, but I'm not alive. I dance in a rattle and give you a surprise.

What am I? A rattle snake. A skeleton who said skeleton? Me, Velma.

Is it not? How is it not a rattlesnake? It's got bones. It's not a tail.

It's alive. Is it? It's not alive. If you kill it, it's still rattles.

No, you lost. Don't even. Okay. Move it up.

Let's rattle snake. Okay. In your defense, y'all, all y'all, this one is a little harder. Oh.

The person who made me doesn't want me. The person who bought me doesn't need me. The person who uses me will never know what am I. Rattle snake.

Raven? Raven? No, not Raven. One more time, one more time slower.

Slower for everybody else, but me. He was normal. I was good forever. The person who made me...

Slower for the listeners. As I read this, I realized that the answer of Raven is rude. The person who made me doesn't want me. The person who bought me doesn't need me.

The person who uses me will never know. Is it a Halloween stuff? Public urinal. That's pretty spooky.

No, because the person who buys a urinal would be the urinal. Not a public one. That's pretty else. Okay.

It's not Halloweeny. How's a urinal Halloweeny? They're spooky to me. You're hit with a black light in the bottom of the family tree.

Okay, there's that. And also a big nanny. If you're having a urinal, you probably have a Halloweeny. Oh no.

You give up? Yes. It's a coffin. Oh, yeah.

Okay, let's see. A friend, the reminder to order your coffin in advance. So you know what it is. Okay, this one's maybe a little easier.

I stand still to protect and cause fear, so things fly away before they get near. Bear crow. Bear crow. Yeah.

Yes, one for moon. Okay. We'll just do a couple more. I'm tall and I'm young.

What? The girls are winning. I'm tall and I'm young and short when I'm old. Once a year, I make a heavy pumpkin light and more bold.

What am I? I'm tall when I'm young, short when I'm old. Once a year, I make a heavy pumpkin light and more bold. What am I?

Candle. Yeah. The tall is in a melt. It was coming.

It was processing. I almost had it. Okay, here we go. This one, you'll know.

We'll see who's just the fastest. Ready? I have a broom, but it's not for sweeping. I wear a hat and cast spell.

Okay, there we go. I'm surprised. Somebody is there raving on that one? I was there to chat the whole time.