This is a Global Player original podcast. It's a word, and I find it really interesting. I think you might find it controversial. It's controversial within our own family, because, you know, my kid has got ADHD, and he disagrees with me on this.
And in the midst of everything that is going on right now, to do the med shortage and everything, obviously, that is making things complicated for people. But in an ideal world where we've all got the meds that we need, and our ADHD is really well managed, I feel that I fly. Genuinely, I feel that I am the very best version of myself that I can be. Okay, so where's this going?
It starts with a story, and we were going through the diagnosis of my son, figuring out what this meant, knowing that there had been family history, and worried about what future might hold. I am at a friend's 50th birthday, and I find myself standing at the bar next to a very old friend. It's her friend. She was somebody who I didn't know very well, actually, at university.
We were in different years. We were in different friendship groups. I liked her, but we didn't know each other very well. But we suddenly find each other standing next to each other at the bar.
And she asks me how I am, and being me, my entire story for that, I can't help it, because I can't help it. And she reveals that she has a very important job at a top accountancy firm, head of inclusion. And she says, oh, my goodness me, oh, gosh, ADHD. Oh, congratulations.
It's a superpower. And at the time, I remember getting a real thrill from that word, and obviously, I needed her to explain why. And she did. She told me that the reason why she sees it as a superpower is because, for her, her colleagues who have ADHD in her particular accountancy firm are particularly brilliant in areas of that business where they need them to be brilliant.
For her, it was insolvency. She said, you send people with ADHD into a company that is leaking and really struggling and has made all sorts of terrible decisions. And she said, it's only our ADHDers who can figure it out, who are quick, who see those problems almost instantly. And she said, obviously, you have to send them along with a really good PA.
They'll do their paperwork. But she said, they are the people we trust to do that job. And I have really come to believe her to be right. Over the months and nearly years that I have had my diagnosis, I do think it's a superpower.
I think it's an amazing thing to have. I'm proud of it. And I think it's also very healing to believe that it is. But I know that you disagree.
First of all, how proud are you of me to have sat there all that time, holding my tongue by enough people? I was waiting. Just desperately holding it in. Trembling.
I mean, all the best for her. But I just, I couldn't disagree more. I cannot, I can't stand the word superpower. It absolutely doesn't hit me.
The first time I heard it was when I've been recently diagnosed, and we've talked before about how I basically fell apart after my diagnosis. I was seeing an ADHD coach, my wife actually, for one session we were seeing her together, and this coach was the first person who called it a superpower. And both my wife and I just looked at her and went, what? And talked about it afterwards.
Because, I mean, I told you by experience, I do not understand how something that can cause you to be incapacitated so often can be a superpower. Something that causes you to get so overwhelmed with life that you crash and find yourself unable to communicate, unable to even get up in the morning sometimes, but finds you standing there scratching your skin and pulling your hair and just being so totally off the wall that you feel like you can't put one foot in front of the other. How is that superpower? Because that is when you are dealing with the fallout of your superpower.
It's like something, like a sparkler burns very brightly, and at the end it goes out. You get to go for your own. Well, yeah, so you have to be very careful with it. But it's beautiful whilst you're looking at it.
And you have to acknowledge them and find the ways in which you handle those loads. But the highs are really important and really extraordinary. So how do you see that this is a superpower in your life? I don't think that.
I think it's wonderful, obviously. But I'm talking about your ADHD specifically. How can you look at that and say, this has been a superpower in my life? So long before, long before anybody was talking about ADHD, apart from for that kid after the class he couldn't sit still.
I mean, we're talking 10, 15 years ago. 20 years ago, my husband always used to say to me, you are always the first person to spot a problem. He said, you're the first person to spot if someone's upset. You are the first person to see that in a week's time, we're going to need to do X, Y, Z.
You're always so much more hyper-aware of people's emotional intent, but also what challenges we might face in the future. And he said, you've always been somebody who can be the most extraordinary problems of. Now, obviously, I'm not necessarily the person who can implement these solutions to those problems, but what I do is I spot them. And at the beginning of our relationship, we used to have problems with that because he would disagree with me.
I'd say, oh, this is going to happen, or someone's upset about that, or you just said something and it upset her and I could see that. And he would disagree. And of course, days, weeks later, it would transpire I was right. And over the course of our relationship, he's gone, okay, actually, we have to, he calls it, he says, it's foresight, it's almost like I can read the future.
And I do recognise that, but there are times when, also, because your brain's moving so fast, I speak from experience, and I'm sure this happens for you, you make assumptions, you jump to conclusions, you miss out a bit in the middle. That is also true, and that is something that my diagnosis has really helped with, actually, because before it, I think I thought I was always right, and I think that is what led to so many problems with friends or with family. I would assume they were thinking one thing they weren't thinking. Anything they were thinking about, there's too much to help they have to do.
So how is that superpower? Because what you're saying is it's led to problems with your family. Something that you thought was a power, actually, has caused problems. No, but I think, because it's balance, isn't it?
It's about the balance, and it's about how, in the end, is there more good than harm? Yeah, there definitely is. Yes, there are problems like that. See, there isn't for me.
There definitely isn't for me. Look at the job that you do. The job that you do is because of your ability to think quickly, and you're sharp, and you make decisions, and you ask the right questions. Your brain is there before anyone else is, because of your ADHD.
Well, so on that point, it's a superpower that you can't control. So you might say that, actually, sometimes my brain works really fast, and I can work things out really quickly, and I can do things and see things that other people can't. And yes, there are times when I genuinely think that's true about myself, but I can't decide when that is. So it might be that I really need to get something done.
It might be that I go to work, and I really need that superpower, as you call it, but it doesn't come. But it might be that I'm sat at home with my children, playing on the carpet, and off the wall. So what use is a superpower, as you call it, if I can't control when I use it? Yeah, you see, I wonder whether what we are describing here is the difference between somebody for whom the meds work, and somebody for whom they don't.
Because I know how much more handleable my life is, how much easier it is for me to go about the things I used to struggle with now, because I'm able to medicate. And maybe for you, that's where the gap is, because I know I can control it now. And that is the extraordinary thing. I have what I believe to be all of these skills.
Sensitivities, really, is what I think. Because we see everything, and we're distracted by everything, and we're looking everywhere all at once, it's that ability to take in all of that information and channel it. And now that I take a tablet in the morning, my ability to channel that information is much better, and it's much easier, and I find that I get jobs done much more quickly because of it. Well, my therapy has all the problems I've described before, about crashing, emotional dysregulation, being off the wall, having really big mood swings.
I've managed to, essentially, deal with most of that through therapy. So my therapy has had a similar effect that your drugs have had, except I'm still in a position where I can manage life, I'm much more balanced, and my ADHD still causes me problems. What do you think is one single thing that your ADHD has given you? Well, I mean, I think that ability to think quickly, and I was always quite a good news editor because I could look at stories, I could see where stories were going to go, and I could think quickly.
That's definitely a skill from ADHD. But then I compare that to the days and days I spent as a child hitting myself in the head because I was so uncomfortable. The days and days I spent as an adult, you know, crashed at the weekends and not being able to talk to anyone under a duvet, you know, or feeling so incredibly down that I got to the point where I thought, do I want to be here anymore? I'm not sure, to your point earlier, that the ability to think quickly and clearly outweighs the emotional distress it's caused.
Well, let's, I hate the phrase speak to, but I'm going to use it. Let's speak to the point that you made about school, first of all. Let's talk about school because I think in the right school environment, a child with ADHD flourishes. You know, it's interesting, isn't it, that my mum, who was a primary school teacher her whole life, used to feed off the children, usually the boys, because I don't think she necessarily recognised it in the girls then, but used to feed off what she called the naughty boys in her classroom because they brought energy, humour, ideas, creativity.
You know, talking to my mum about years ago when my eldest was five or six, he got really upset about school. He was very bored at school, and I remember waking up for school one morning, right, yeah, I remember waking up for school one morning, and he burst into tears and he said, don't let me go to school, it's so boring, I can't sit there. Now, I know why he was saying those things to me now, but back in the day, I thought, oh, well, it's a, you know, particularly unchallenging school environment, what can we do about this? I ran my mum, she's a primary school teacher, and my mum's response was, well, where is what she called the stretching corner at the back of the classroom?
It was a place for the kids who'd either, either, not, you know, they didn't have to have finished their work, but if they'd finished their work, they'd go to the back, and they would find a puzzle to do, or a crossword. And my mother, as somebody with undiagnosed ADHD, recognised that there were certain children in that classroom who needed other forms of stimulation, and she gave it to them. She didn't blame those kids, send them out, do the worst thing you could possibly do to make them stand in the corner, or sit down with their hands on their head, or whatever. She let them simulate their brains in a different way.
Now, you know, I've said to you before, I think, that the current schooling system that we have is terrible for kids with ADHD. That was not your ADHD at fault, it was your environment, and had you been in the right place, you'd have been, you'd have grown, you'd have been challenged, your brain would have been given more to do. I would admit that I am someone who has not yet learned to effectively manage my ADHD. I'll accept that.
However, what you're doing is describing a perfect set of circumstances, where the world around us and the school system is set up to meet the needs of neurodiversion. Yeah, because I wish we could have that. But it doesn't exist. And so, if we lived in a world like that, perhaps having ADHD would be easier.
But we don't. So how can you say that it's a superpower when we exist in a world that isn't set up to deal with people with ADHD? Because if you are lucky enough to survive... If you're lucky enough, what about the people you aren't?
What about the people who actually find that day-to-day this is crippling? Yeah, so that's what... So, two parts to my answer there. The first is, if you're lucky enough to survive the school system with the confidence to go on and explore a meaningful career that suits your brain, then that's when you fly.
And that's what so many NDs and your divertics talk about, isn't it? It's that sense of, if you can survive this terrible schooling system, out you go. Let's look at it from the other end of the telescope. And imagine we've got those kids all through in a system that has been designed for them.
What can those adults who've been given the right form of stimulation in their childhood do for society now? Well, it's really interesting, isn't it? Because what you'll find they're doing is probably filling most of our entertainment opportunities. They are summer comedians.
They are TV presenters. They are radio presenters. They're teachers. They are presenters.
They are... But that's not the fault of their ADHD. That's the fault of society. And I'm talking about the kind of world where we acknowledge that this is a superpower and we take those people we make the most of them.
And that's the point, is that you are talking about something that fundamentally doesn't fit in to our society. And honestly, I don't mean this as a gotcha. You're talking about something that needs quite a strong medication to manage. How can it be a superpower if actually you are in a world where the way your brain works doesn't fit with other people, unless you take medication?
That's a very fair question. I think, is that not... I mean, because there are lots of people who don't take medication. In fact, when I was first offered medication, the doctor who offered it to be said, you know, it's a perfectly understandable choice to decide that you are who you are and you want to remain that way and you don't want to take meds because this is who you are and maybe you might start presenting a different version of yourself.
And I was worried about that, actually. I was very worried about that when I first started taking medication. I think that is a very good point. But I would also say that it's not the fault of the ADHD, that society doesn't make the best of us.
We are on the beginning of this journey. We are only just beginning to understand what ADHD is and how we can better improve not just school, but work and also. And companies are really beginning to do that. You know, places like the cool tech companies, like Google, for instance, are going to extraordinary lengths to identify what kind of person they employ their person, because they recognise that different people have different skills and that ADHD comes with benefits.
They love ADHDers in Google because they're sparky and energetic. They're funny. They bring ideas into the room. They know that they have to get up during a meeting, walk around, that meeting can't be too long because otherwise they'll get bored stiff, but that's where their brain is working quickly.
Google values that. Google isn't a huge company by chance. It thinks differently about how you work with different kinds of brains. And I think we as a society need to start recognising that we are different.
We have different challenges, but we also bring different benefits. And that's a good thing. Well, look, we set up this podcast because we wanted to learn more about ADHD. We also, I think, want to be real about ADHD and real about our experiences.
And I think, you know, I would want to say to anyone listening that this is not me saying that you, you know, there's no hope if you've got ADHD. You know, I know we're sort of arguing about the word superpower. And I maintain, I don't think that's a helpful word, but there is hope for people with ADHD. There are lots of people out there who manage their ADHD with all that medication, who go on to do great things, or even just do mundane things.
But man, it is not the end of the world. You know, having had lots of therapy, actually, I find I can manage my ADHD. And so I think it's fair to paint a real picture, which is that I wouldn't choose to have ADHD. I don't think it's a superpower, but I also think that, you know, people can manage in society with ADHD.
But I would think as part of that honesty and that being honest about our experiences, I would ask you just to tell us a bit more about ADHD in your life. Because yes, okay, you are able to manage it with medication. Yes, you believe it's a superpower, but it's had a pretty negative effect on parts of your life as well, hasn't it? Yeah, it has.
You know, as you know, these are effects I'm really, I've really only begun to recognize them. Yeah, absolutely. And obviously there's the grief. The grief was part of that.
It was that sense of, oh, I see, life was difficult because of this. It was difficult because I'm this way, not that way. But it goes back to what I said before. It's about balance.
It's about whether or not, in the grand scheme of things, when I take a step back and do what ADHD is, I'm so good at, which is looking at the whole picture, I know that my life is better because of it. I know that. The friends I've made, I genuinely believe that I connect with ADHD quicker than I connect with other people. And I love hanging out with ADHD brains.
I know that. I also like autibrains, autistic brains as well, for exactly the same reason. I like the people who think differently on the fringes. And I suppose I can't imagine what life would be like without ADHD.
No, and I think maybe that's where I can, you know, I can meet you halfway. I think talking to Tony Lloyd from the ADHD Foundation really helped me, actually, to understand the idea that this is, it's a spectrum. And it's about, you know, if you look at ADHD as being a type of brain and a type of thought rather than a condition, you know, and I'm starting to come around to that way of thinking, having spoken to Tony, that, I think, does change my perspective. I think what I struggle with still is the word superpower.
And I wonder whether, actually, whether we start to look at ADHD as a type of brain, as a way of thinking, as perhaps something that can have positives, but we want to manage expectations around it. And I think, honestly, you would have a problem with me calling it a disability, because it creates an otherness. It creates a condition, a disorder, something that isn't normal, okay? Well, I actually think superpower has the same effect.
I actually think using the word superpower creates an unrealistic expectation. I think it suggests that this is other. And I think, actually, if we were to say that accepting ADHD is part of a spectrum of brains, it is a way of being. It's something that we do need to learn to manage.
It's something that we do need to take into consideration of whether we're eating properly, whether we're wrestling, and that it has its ups and it has its downs. I can get on board with that. superpower creates unrealistic expectations that certainly don't match my experience that's a really interesting point actually you'll kind of and also for people who like you are really really struggling it's a difficult thing to hear because that's not been your experience and it's very interesting because i actually have a sort of similar experience with my brother my eldest brother ricky has down syndrome but he also has autism and the number of times people have said to me oh the down syndrome community oh they're so warm and friendly and so lovely and so kind ricky is with the few members of his family that he recognizes he's not that way with everyone else because he is probably more autistic than he is recognizably downs and i have found that very hurtful over the years this sort of sense that everybody with down syndrome is so social and loving yeah he is he's individual his condition and that i think is the problem with doing this a superpower in the same way as maybe you don't like me calling it disability is that it creates ADHD is like this yeah you know we're all individuals and we and it is part of our personality of who we are so after all that has anything i've said made you take even the smallest of steps towards my position on ADHD being a superpower have i listened to anything you said yes of course i have i've got ADHD but i was still listening to what you said and i'm pleased that you think it's a superpower for your sake i'm glad that you're as positive as you are about it i still don't accept the word superpower i don't like it i find it i find it frustrating because that's certainly not my experience and i think it does create unrealistic expectations as i say i think it suggests that you are abnormal that there's a sense of being different to everyone else i don't think that's helpful however i think what you said about the skills that come from it i think hopefully as i go on and i learn to manage my ADHD there is perhaps i hope that i can i can see the positives more in the way that you do how about you do you do you take my point about about the word yeah i do i really liked your point about it being like the word disability i like i thought i think that's very interesting that essentially taking a position in either extreme feels wrong because everybody's ADHD is different so yeah yeah i do maybe for me it's about remembering that it's only parts of my ADHD that are superpowers actually maybe that's it it's certain characteristics which i think i think both of us are special and without sounding horribly arrogant and you know um but i think i think you're right i think i do need to at the same time acknowledge that for both of us it comes within all the downsides and i need to remember that when i'm using that word well that seems a good place to leave it i should say a big thank you to everyone who sent us messages so far we are still asking for your questions your stories about ADHD you can send them to adhdpodcast.global.com particularly if you've got stories around coping with christmas with ADHD because we're going to do a special episode of christmas answering some of your questions sharing some of your stories and that can be about christmas about coping with people coming around about remembering to put the dinner on in the morning remembering to buy presents or it can just be all day-to-day things about ADHD share them with us and we'll answer some of your questions share some of your stories at christmas that's adhdpodcast.global.com that's everything from us for today you can listen to your wrong about ADHD for free on global player download from the app store or go to globalplayer.com see you next time this is a global player original podcast