Well for the quick for you see me living like a king still one one six breath. Oh Lord working for the same team I think I need a ad lib from pity Cuz I'ma take that to each and every city. I'm gonna take that I'm Think I need Taking a mile you get dream you take an hour the power of a cat of this cat and she do the wild I hear I'm working with the I'm not And we're back This is your boy to bond and Jason we're back once again another podcast episode This one's another good one this one is a little bit more geared towards what we were built around that's Christian hip-hop And something strange happened this week or should I say in this past? Something strange happened this past week that was a little controversial for Christian hip-hop and that was the release of soul Rebel by John Gibbs You said I was a little controversy.
It's a little it's a little it's a lot more than a little well Cuz it's not really hitting a lot of people right now a lot of people are talking about it per se I'm not sure that a lot of people know that it's actually out which is why it's anticipating But yeah, it was never like a hey guys. It's out right and it didn't really Matter to a lot of people with that being said in case you guys don't know what we're talking about There was a I guess we have to give a brief amount of history because The introduction to this to this artist John Gibbs would have legatively that this was a Christian hip-hop artist, right? What's the first time? Yeah, well, yeah, I can agree with that because well He talked about it even in the in the letter that he pinned but the mediums that were actually playing his music or putting his music out would be like your rapsilla or your Was it Was like jam the hype I think is what it's called.
Yeah. Yeah, so I mean he talks about it How those are the mediums that really put him out there and I mean I never heard of him before Jesse yeah, he was featured on a Christian hip-hop on same team. I've already song He's on same team. You know what?
No, I wouldn't say same team was my introduction to him No, I'm just saying that he was like he was on same team. He was on same team and as a matter of fact I will say this I've never heard him on anyone's music that has not been associated with Christian hip-hop if to kind of get clear on it And for those of you don't know let me read the letter to you So that we have a bit of context because what he did was basically on Revzilla calm this particular artist John gives wrote an open letter I mean, but it was covered by my rapsilla. He did an open letter to Christian hip-hop and it starts like this It says dear CHH I want to start by thinking the folks that found my music and supported me through the mediums of Revzilla girl across jamma hype Except I do realize that by me allowing myself to be associated with those particular mediums. It is allowed the following to grow I Thank God for the understanding and support of hearts out there buying and sharing the music up until this point I haven't made any huge public statements about what I think about Christian hip-hop subgenre or Christian culture as a whole because I haven't been Mature enough until this point to consider all the hearts emotionally invested into this community Oh, can we stop for just a second right there?
I want to Because that sentence right there is a sign of huge maturity. It is what's not a sign of huge maturity are the multiple typos inside of this letter And I mean and I'm saying like I've noticed about five of them just to this point. What would you expect from a hip-hop artist though? Nobody who considers themselves a writer well, you got to remember though hip-hop has never been a clean writing There's no excuse for not capitalizing the first letter of a word at the start of a sentence I don't care if you are I don't care if you never even graduated from high school You know to capitalize like right now.
I'm putting three underlines underneath that tea with red marker This is not about to be a breakup letter or an attempt to throw shade on the community This is a letter about reexamination. He has not capitalized a tea or a opening word yet Even right now this next phrase has not it's been brought to my attention that some think my motives are offered that I should check Why I'm doing this to Kirk Franklin to those of you who think it's actually for those of you We've got to know you by the way, it's not it's not you that's okay that we've gotten to radical He spoke with our message left out loud. Let me assure you that while I'm let me assure you I'm aware of myself I know when my heart is bent on evil doing I hate my sin which brings me to what I think is not capitalized yet Which brings me to what I really want to say why is CHH and see the computer will automatically do this for you So I mean you intentionally even went back and did it I don't know why is Christian hip-hop artists and consumers afraid to embrace people like me because this is a letter that question that question Because this is a letter that question is rhetorical. I pose that question as a sentiment for all the people in this world that Christian culture has turned away I'm not gonna go too far into it because he goes on and on and on and these types are starting to get to me But at the end of the day, he basically says why don't you accept people Christian hip-hop as a culture?
Why don't you accept people like me and what I do now with that being said just based upon this letter? It would make it seem like this dude and some like dude out there doing drugs or something like that I'm super crazy. Oh, I think we're leaving out a major part Oh, I know you cut out a lot But let's go towards the end because he actually like kind of explains what he his his challenge to Christian hip-hop So to speak so let me just pick it up from from where I see that I Linked up with belief in wrestling At around 19 after belief married my sister they introduced me to the scene that is CHH Christian hip-hop I wasn't welcomed easily because of what some would call my edge I've never felt emotionally a part of CHH, but always respected the rules of Christian hip-hop always respected the rules Christian hip-hop keeps In the last five years, I've been around it at this point. I've thoroughly seen how well some of you mean I've also seen how scared some of you are to embrace me my culture because it is because it is in some of your eyes of The world I want to say to those of you that think I am of the world and there are quotes of the world Because of the things that I say I think you're scared I challenge you to embrace people like me It wasn't until God showed me he understood me that I could love him and furthermore love people like yourselves See that I can't even go beyond that because that's so non-scriptural It wasn't until and it wasn't until God showed me that he understood me that I could love him you could So basically your love to God was predicated on him understanding you which is completely beyond scripture Because because because here's the thing you're saying God understands you God created you bro, right right more than anything I think it's not that God understands him someone showed him that God understood him Okay, but let's talk to the context because people don't know what we're talking about Okay, because they don't understand is what he keeps you from phrases like people like me or that of the world The reason why he's catching this flag is because he continually and especially in the soul rebel album.
He continually uses the N word Yes, he curses a couple of times He's the D word Minor or not it is you cannot use it no and to be honest Not at the age 15 years ago or 20 years ago that would have put a Portial advisory sticker on your album as crazy as that sounds about 20 years ago That would have been the case okay when I was 12 you couldn't even say that on television It was a huge deal when when Fresh Prince did that in the 90s and when Martin did that in the 90s huge deal It was a huge deal right there were other words included in that too. Oh, yeah plenty of them But see but see that now now you just suppose that right so you hear that you go come on man Like everybody used to the N word but the issue that I have with everything that he's saying is that if me and you Were talking to you at the inward slip out or you are we sitting in with right? That to me does not mean you're not saved correct right nor to me doesn't make me question your relationship with God Right when you sit down to pen an album there it is it takes hours days weeks months of listening to the same tracks over And over again to you get what you want which means it's it's so deliberate to use it that you're that there's no possible Way that it's just a slip up or something like that. This is something that you wanted people definitely to hear you say So my question comes down to now after I listen to the album I listen to it today And I and this is what I did find he talked about his dad more than anything And he said the inward in places that were completely unnecessary to me the skits were completely unnecessary to me the part about having sex For the first time with his girl and was like look you're gonna let me you know You know here's a funny part about that because he said you're gonna let me beat right now that being said you're gonna let me be um He must be like in my age group because that was something we would say At that time it was a part of the 2004 track so we're talking like yeah, so I mean it's definitely relevant to that time period But I also feel like that skip it doesn't start a purpose and as I listen to the album I'm like okay, you made your point.
You're not Christian hip-hop. I get it But where's the resolution I guess basically so like my question is he keeps he keeps And when you when you're looking at the article here's letter and please and we'll drop the link in the description So you can read it for yourself because Jason to point out a good part of that he keeps talking about of the world Right what's the church phrase in itself, but the Bible gives a clear delineation between the world And us it says it we cannot ignore it beat it says I do not conform to the image of this World the right for me so he cleared a lineation Right so so where does the barrier stop right so so there's a huge issue with La Crea and all these people Bringing quote unquote hip hop into the church right right yes, but we've seen the fruit of that right right we've seen how And people still question that and people still question it makes up, but they're literally using scripture right yes They're not changing any of that right there all their literally all they're doing is for taking that and they're speaking it right yes And people please understand we're not the type of people that need a Jesus count No, but I'm not gonna sit here and count how many times you say Jesus on your songs in your album as a whole although I did Past track number six or seven was going is he gonna say Jesus well more than Jesus I was looking for scripture Right I was looking for some some kind of development of scripture And here's the thing at the very last thing that he says in this letter that he writes He says I'm gonna tell my story to the world Lee yeah, and he says peace now. Here's where my This is what tells me that he does not want to be a part of the CHA's community He says I'm going to tell my story where CHA says I'm going to tell Christ sorry And how my life is intertangled in that's exactly what Christ has done for me in my life And here's my and to me that should be the focus of anybody trying to minister the gospel in any medium if that's what your If that's what your focus and aim is to minister the gospel by all means and it's not his name no And that's okay, and here's the thing. Hey, I'm okay with that.
Yes. I'm okay Like it's like a like a craicot a lot of flak when he did the church clothes mixtape and he had a wall Right, but if you listen to it in context, I'm going I'm not asking Paul wall to rep Christ That was in the purpose of me listening to this album exactly it was just cool to hear two people get together and do a song Yeah, and if you buy the way let it whip was a bang It was a band and if you notice Paul wall changed his lyrics to fit Christian hip-hop to extend no I'm saying Paul if you listen to Paul wall stuff. It's not clean. Oh, it's not clean.
Oh, he definitely cleaned it Yeah, clean it on them to fit for the mix. I think a lot of that was respect exactly they have they had a certain respect level for For for the correct and Christian hip-hop in that sense because he was leading a movement think about it Why would you want to do that true? But but to me that that's a that is a hey Paul. I'm cool with you being you look crazy I'm cool with me being me.
Let's mix those together. You do you hear the parameters for my album, right? Yeah, now that's what I really would like to know. What are their parameters that said hey look let's do this but no No, it had to be there's no possible way.
No anywhere. There's no possible. They had to there's no possible way They had a mixtape like that and there was not a conversation about it Because if you think about it, there's no conversation that has to happen the other way It's not like when he went to go to the BET site where they were like hey look great Can you throw a couple of inwards in there some curse words absolutely not he just got in there and did the thing yeah But when you come on our turf that's the way it should be that's the way it should be is that when we come into your turf because we live a Holy we will be us well Yes, and here's the thing you don't have to have a conversation with us because our lifestyle should be non-offensive It true very true. Very true.
No, I'm sure they would have a conversation if everybody could ship up I was like we hate homosexuals. Oh, I'm going like that. They would have to go. Hey listen You can get on here and rap but don't rap about that right?
But that's not an issue that we have exactly right in fact if we want to kind of take it into that realm and He minios uncomfortable single off of his outcome down to right talks to he mentions that he says essentially says he's a homosexual Slam term that we don't want to use but he used in the context of saying we apologize for Christians that use that word. Oh, yes The the Westboro Baptist right hates yes, right? So in that context I'm going that's amista glorifies Christ right? Way yes, just saying look extremism is extremism.
That's not who we are and that's not Christ right So like that that helped me now if you would have gone in there and just been like yo I was on the swag I was messing with this and where I would have been like I don't care how dope of a rapper you are And that even just me being African American any racial slur right that you're using to be hip right does not glorify Christ It glorifies your past right right yeah, so like so if anybody's going out to get the John Gibbs album I would tell you don't listen to it through Christian hip-hop ears big time big time You just brought up something really really interesting to me because I believe we had a conversation There was a timing for this but it was in regards to show the rock is out. Yes, right? You remember he had that song The inward basically yeah, you know and the word was used in that song Often yes, but it served a purpose it was not too It was like the way that he used it was to degrade the word yeah as opposed to how John is using it It's like this is just how we talk yeah for the world. Yeah, right?
This is how we talk and I think he's using it to attract the world Lee so to speak I mean like he said I'm gonna tell my story to the world Lee and I guess that's cool man. I mean I get it I now I've watched interviews where belief and rustlin and and they're having conversations with dream junkies like the three of them and They're they're basically saying that this dude is out in the streets administering to gang members and all that and that's cool But you don't have to conform to being a gang member yeah to bring them to the church You got to show them the change. That's what you use in language as a part of it. I don't know I Think we as Christians have a huge problem with utilizing ministry right effective ministry yeah as a form of Affirmation from God and that that cannot be confused because Jesus clearly says many will come and say hey We lay hands on the six we cast out the enemy out he goes I never knew you so God can utilize your gifting I can utilize the principles that still work in the spirit and still cash you down to help now That's not he's going to hell right, but we want to have a healthy fear of going at the end of my day It's me going out ministering to these people does that justify me hearing from God because there's plenty of preachers right?
Let's think about it. Yeah, how many pastors are affected by the ministry and live in completely the opposite of what they're Time based on and we'll use words like that from the pulpit. Yeah. Oh man.
Oh, right I mean this can really go to that whole other level. I mean ultimately I mean we look at situations where what it seems to me is that there is a attempt at relevance Because we for some reason feel like the gospel isn't efficient enough by to get through by itself So what we have to do is package it with swag so we'll do things like we'll have a sermon that talks about well F you and F you means forgive you but We're not gonna talk about the forgive part until we celebrate that it was first F you right and let everyone in there think F you means what it really means in the streets, right? And you know that sermon is still beyond me. I'll never understand that that I would I'm walking out.
I'm walking out and I want to sound like a basher But I always want to look at it like I've been watching a lot of ad details Let me let me start this here we go watching a lot of the details especially Jonah has been over right and I'm thinking to myself Man, how dope must it have been to be back in the day as a prophet, right? It may be that's a profit But just to have this that when every time a prophet came into the city right the prophet will come in and go This is what the Lord said the Lord says stop slapping people with fishes Which is actually in the vegetals thing right? They're slapping people with fishes. He goes the Lord says stop doing that right?
There was no question about it was God said it done deal right and deal It had nothing to do with culturalism and nothing to do with where you were from or how you grew up Stop stop doing it And to me it was so much simpler to live that way because you had somebody come in and whether you were right or wrong as hard as it may Have been it was easier to correct because you knew it It was just now there's so much discussion right I yearn for the day where a prophet can come in and go stop using the Inward but there's no way we can like somebody can walk into a church and do that but it won't be a it won't be a culture shift It'll just be somebody saying it. Here's the thing that gets me when we look at and we talk about culture, right? Let's look at the original profit. Yes, right would be Moses Moses, right?
Well technically Noah Well, yes, but he was right widely overlooked right right No, no one but his family But yeah, good catch. Yeah, so but when you look at when you look at Moses When you question God about his inefficiencies with speech what he was talking about is how am I going to be relevant to these people? Yeah, first of all, I've been run off. Mm-hmm.
Yeah, I'm out here by my lonesome Right because I've been run off because of what I did right and I'm out here by myself You're calling me to go talk to people And you want me to leave these people out right and I even after the leading them out Because you remember most didn't really actually meet with the people until it was time to go yeah, right? So then he goes up to Mount Sinai and he's in and God is like telling him like so this is what you're going to do He's like but I can't speak right. I don't have no relevance right to them. I'm not relevant How are they going to listen to me?
How about the relevance? I don't have any relevance to Pharaoh period What am I gonna tell him he you're telling me to go tell Pharaoh to let his people go to let your people go right? And he's gonna ask who told you that um what am I supposed to say I am I am? I am that I am period no relevance needed no relevance needed.
That's it which is hard I this whole podcast is built on relevancy right true because we're not sitting here going over James Cleveland's arm We're obviously trying to find a way to reach the youth. I think there is you know even when Jesus came He didn't really speak Old Testament right he would quote certain things he used Old Testament He was like he was like he was like what you mean I can't heal on the status He used it against right if anything against religion like he yeah Yeah, so so and I can understand how people like a John Gibbs would go I'm trying to fight religion Right, but there is a clear distinct line. I was reading some today in first John man that was talking about being like Christ Right such that's what we should be we should be like Christ and and so when I sat down I thought about it I was like yo that's bananas because it kind of takes away any excuse to be like anybody else Right and it kind of goes into that what would Jesus do type thing which I'm kind of played out But the idea is still the same. It's like it's like okay, so Jesus were to put out an album Does the n-word come out?
There's no need there's no no Whatever claims to live in him must live as Jesus did according to first John chapter 2 verse 6 Whoever claims to live in him must live as Jesus did so just based on that okay Jesus you want me to put on an album? How do you want to look? How do you want to sound like? I guarantee you that even though Jesus is is relevant to the culture and even though he's trying to reach certain people He's not doing it in a way that compromises who he is right?
He's not Peter. He's on the cross Peter's cerson on the other side Right so this is this is Peter disciple walk with Jesus, but was still messing up in that area right? You don't see where Peter curses after Christ's resurrection You understand right during the crucifixion process? There were some bits of old Peter even though he'd been walking with Jesus that were being dying off right?
So the idea is that if I'm taking that in context and that means that if this is where John gives is that he's still in the crucifixion process And resurrection has not yet happened for him. He's still trying to kill off whatever happened to him I talked about in this letter like is dad flipping out and going mentally crazy and all that stuff right? I can I can I can accept all of that and go God is not through with you You're still going through your crucifixion process right? But when you write a letter and you're coming at me as though I'm wrong Right come at me as I'm wrong.
That's why I'm not accepting it for not accepting it You want me to accept you on the cross and ignore the fact that you still need to get up out of the grave Right you're asking me just well you see me. I'm up here. I'm just showing up on my scars I'm up here and I'm done, but that's only one part of the story like Jesus didn't just don't like didn't just die for people He rose for people right changed You know I'm saying like change the way he went down is that the way he got up? Yeah, okay I'm with you in that cuz in a sense that's that's like a Free boozy Greatest movement of all time right.
It's like free boozy like but what did boozy do to get in there? There it is there it has boozy been rehabilitated nobody cares so the question is has John been rehabilitated from the streets And if he has why do you have to divert back to the streets just to go there? Look a recovering you're always recovering if you weren't at it. Yeah, right a Recovering addict who is not over The fix has no business going back to the house.
No To try to get other people to come out. Yeah, absolutely not because who's gonna get pulled in man? Right there that makes completeness to me. Oh, so if you're done with the streets be done with you done with the streets And you listen here's the thing like this is where I kind of like about Reach and even collision.
They found some kind of way to still be authentically them right right but not be Where they were right? I'm saying like I'm not a shoe head. I don't know any minute was a shoe head All of them are actually not a shoe head right, but they were shoe heads before Christ, right? Yes, but Christ wasn't asking the shoe head to die Right, you should say yeah, so even when I was looking at his album cover for John gives up the solo stuff No, that stuff was offensive to me you being chest naked with tattoos all over you.
Oh no crucial complimented No, that got to me. I was like that's fine. Good. Yeah.
Yeah, I was all fine with it It was when I started listening to the album I'm so glad you had me listen to it because I only heard some things on it right but listening to it like you said from the beginning From the beginning to the end in order. I was like I was in the car going Everything any one of me to change it had to not been for this podcast right? I would turn that off like track for it. You know I'm saying like and then I put on Taylor's album like when I was Just a minute ago.
I put on Taylor's album and I'm going I can identify with anything he's saying right now But none of this stuff is offending me in fact. I'm thinking of people that I could pass his record to who Taylor Yeah, I'm like who can I pass his Taylor Gray record to because this is gonna minister to somebody Yeah, you know I'm saying right I can't think of one person give John gives up with you Like there's nobody that I would go hey, you know Jesus this will pull you closer. Oh You see I can't that's and that's what's missing from the album. There's no redemption story There's no I've been redeemed I mean there was a little bit of a battle here and there but there was never like I graduated in Christ Right there was none of that.
Yeah, there was none of that Christ changed me right there was more like yeah I was in the church when I was young and you know then I was kind of messing around with the homies out in the streets Since my church or to me I don't know why I do shot my window right because my mom's gonna get mad like oh and I'm listening to the album I'm like this sounds like it could have been so jibwe Couldn't anybody if anybody the only thing that's missing is like Like grave vulgarities. Yeah, like it wasn't it wasn't like it be too uncut right You know what I mean? But it was at the same time. It was still not it wasn't CHH But it was like you remember the cool kids.
Yeah, it reminded me of the cool kids with less inwards That's a perfect because the cool kids didn't cuz no there was no curse words on the cool kids out right beats were banging everything Well, that's the problem with it with the John gives out one to yeah, it's it's in a garage But it the production to me But this way it doesn't move me it no it doesn't now I will say this he has gotten a whole lot better from the singing perspective He's saying pretty much every hook on the album. Yeah, which to me. He's maturing there, right? That sounds great, but from a production standpoint He's like someone's not sending himself Well, and maybe that's why I can see some weird label right well, he's with the dream junkies right That's what I'm saying, but they're on some kind of weird label like the dream is kind of have Inside on that but I think personally I think a lot of Christian hip-hop producers that would have done it didn't want their hands on it You might be right about the features outside of belief and rest like I mean obviously he mentions them in the letters So they're obviously close right who else do you recognize on well Jeremiah's on there?
Yeah, but I mean what but that's his cousin right I'm gonna have to but by the way Jeremiah had a smoking verse though Which is I mean, I mean you had to get through three and a half minutes of some cloud melody And then in the beginning of the intro he's like they're like I don't know somehow it's like I'm a girl talking about John or whatever and like they're talking about it like he sounds like hundred thousand and what's funny is This was funny as the tone for if I can use the word secular was set in the beginning I would have never thought about on 3,000 or other than the references that he makes Yeah, and he actually talks about big boy in the famous words of big boys. Yeah, or Kendrick you mentioned where he cuts a cuss word out by the way Yeah, and see that's what I don't like even there have been some other artists in Christian hip-hop that have done that yeah where They are it's blatantly a cuss word, but they don't say it'll sh and you know what cuss word it was It's like come on guys like you know what you know what that leads to so what's the point in doing that? That's like you know I'm stubby my toe and I'm like shoot right you know what I mean, you know what I mean? I just barely exactly Yeah, exactly that doesn't take the intent of what I said away No, and it doesn't help the mind stay focused on Christ.
It definitely does not John Piper said something that was very crucial to me when he was trying to set a Standard for a media consumption he basically was like when it comes to movies music going to a theater place or whatever he goes This is basically the way you should think about it if by finishing the experience of a concert or an album or song or whatever If it doesn't if you can't freely worship God After that if it doesn't if it doesn't if it doesn't if it doesn't bring that to you Right if you feel some sort of shame and coming if like you don't if your passion feels dows because of it He goes you should not do it He goes because the idea of reading glory to God is you're constantly finding wood to throw on the fire that is already burning Right, right he goes if you're listening to something that obviously makes you feel the opposite of worshiping or if you're watching something on The movie that makes you feel the opposite of worshipping you shouldn't watch that. Yeah, right? Yeah, and that whole entire podcast was about Game of Thrones. He was talking about It's a scary part about that You can watch things on TV and that won't lead you there exactly so you can't even say it's secular Christian at some point It has to be something that that pushes you for instance, right from me and this is me personally I Can't watch like I haven't seen um straight out of Compton right?
I will never tell anybody don't go see straight out of Compton right right for all I know somebody could watch the other Compton and have some sort of weird experience with God so whatever right I Personally cannot right there's no way already know what's in it people came back and told me a lot of nudity in it, you know There's obviously a lot of adult language book here in it and nothing all that's gonna make me want to do is go home and produce a doctor To attract right or go back and listen to the chronic album or something right right which is gonna make you remember when you That's all the commercial the first song I went back and put on was straight out of Compton Right, I was like never got about that joint and I'm listening to it I was like man, I've never heard this many F words in today's music let alone back in the 90s now Okay, that'd be a say how did it make you feel about because I went out and bought the Compton album I didn't I mean I have I listened to an album music I bought it and I bought it because of the acclaim Now when I listened to it, I was highly disappointed Personally, I was just highly disappointed because I felt like there should have been something fresh something new something strong It was classic Dre But in my opinion, it wasn't even really classic Dre it was like Dre mixed with some classic artist like It was like Dre and Bootsy Collins collabed on and that's classic Dre to be honest with you Is that weird which you know most of his hits to me? I didn't feel it This is what it sounded like sounded like to me. Do you remember when when Dr. Dre was on hiatus?
Yes, after him and she got into it He was on hiatus right he was in like Minnesota or something and he came out with the aftermath Yes, it had Nas on it. It had Foxy on it. It had a couple people on it, right? It reminded me of that album how nothing really goes together It's just a bunch of singles that I put out it is and I want to put them together on an album now that being said I have a friend of mine who makes secular music I can listen to his album and put it in like yo This knocks it's not glorifying the God at all.
No, but it knocks It's like yo, that's the point. This is but my appreciation for music comes in and I'm like man This is good music dr. Dre. Nah, it's really just his name Because if you put vanilla ice's name on that album nobody buys it in a sense now.
Let me say this I'm completely dry bias So yeah, so he does no wrong to me, right? Him and Tambalyn do no wrong Tambalyn had the worst rapper on earth as his duo partner No, no doubt and that's still to me was the greatest of the boogie I was like I don't understand what we were talking about but I cannot get enough of this on listen Here's the funny part. Magoo is really not that bad. He was horrible.
He was absolutely the worst He was soothed the shocker Yes, he was soothed the shocker. I was Virginia only thing he had different was he had rhythm But see my point is my point is like for instance So can't get rid of him. He had no rhythm. I can listen to any of those things and go Right, right.
It doesn't move me one way or another right the things that I can't listen to are the things that move me DJ quick is another one sugar-free is another one right? I can know that there's certain something to talk about that in Vegas I could there's certain songs you can put on right now and no matter what I want to do is gonna make it's gonna cause Response so I say so I say away from it, right? That's the same way I feel about if I try to indulge myself like for instance I've never listened to a pimple butterfly by Kendrick me either I can't and there's an editor on Apple I can't I can't do it because and like I said I don't the issue. I have what most people is they're going Oh, you don't understand getting musical.
Yeah, this is like revolution. Yeah, yeah God is not judging my life based upon me accepting was revolutionary for a musical genre Right, that's not what he's not going man You were just so short-sighted you didn't like the Kendrick album, right? Yeah, but he will judge me if I get so far into this Kendrick album that I can't I glorify that more than I glorify God Oh, there's no way you can do that. There's no way you can go.
Yes, there is yes There is your passion drives you to talk about Kendrick Lamar's album more than Christ then Christ and how the gospel changed your life If you become an advocate for someone to get a Grammy, right more than you do for someone to get saved Mm-hmm. That is a clear-to-stitch issue. Yes, and I can't do that so like when I listen to like people like John Gives or whatever I'm listening to go which side of the fence you gonna put me on right here's a funny part you bring up a very like funny topic for me because I Get a little agitated with a lot of men a lot of men and generally it's because of this you can go to any barber shop Mm-hmm. And every man will have a defense.
Yeah, for instance, Michael Jordan Kobe wrong everyone has their defense. Yeah, but what's your defense? I don't know you know what I mean, like it's like wait wait wait you mean to tell me you can bring up every stat Yeah for Michael Jordan from the time he got drafted to even his watch in wizard years, right? And when it comes to what you believe in you don't know yeah, what you believe in but you got every stat And here's the thing it what will happen is extremists will hear that and go she's telling me that it's a sin and no It's that's that's the message.
Yes, you're missing the point. We love stats, right? I love talking about my defense have my defense as well. Yeah, it will never trump my passion now if you start bringing up Christ That's all right.
I want to go for blood right? You should I say like exactly I can go to ESPN calm and pull up some stats and memorize it right when it comes down to like Theological matters like that stuff is directly connected to and it's not because it doesn't make me better than anybody else But I'm saying like it was it was it's easy to get caught up in things that don't matter big time You know I'm saying that's what it's really about yeah, and that's what I got out I felt like the entire thing was caught up on things that don't you he mentioned his dad every other song and I get it I get it and you're not the only one that I've heard talk about your father right most of the Christian hip-hop artist that we listen to have Some sort of dad issue right most of them. I can't name one. It was like very open with this There's more on one of his records right exactly I have no problem with that But what it does to me though is is I keep hearing that keep hearing that keep hearing that and then I go what is the Resolution to this that makes me feel like it's okay to have daddy issues, but there's something better and that's and that's the difference Between how someone like Andy will use it and say you know I had daddy issues So it took me a while to figure out this whole daddy thing Yeah, even it's at any morning cartoons his mom talked about how yeah, he asked her she said what should we pray for he said a new daddy?
Crazy right and that's like I'm sitting there watching that. I'm kind of mind-boggled. Yeah, but at the same time It made sense her next statement was God He saw daddy in God and that's what changed him. That's the resolution exactly doesn't point to that it was a point It was a point to you ultimately right where you aiming the people and that's where I have my issue with the whole It's our first time we're gonna have sex in the back of my car thing And I'm like you could have really left that out because you seem to be more glorifying.
Yeah Yeah, you mentioned that there was some tainting of our purity That was a coach of the song the rest of the song was talking about glorifying and the excitement of us doing the first time And and I'm trying to remind myself that he's younger But when I was growing up that wasn't the conversation that led to your first time Oh, not at all you should I say like so I can't even put that in the context of that being some sort of truth that that's universal Most people aren't having like most teams are not having that conversation like I love you So you should do that that is so saved by the bell family matters made up most of those conversations are they both want it Most of them say big and girls were no more no no it's it's it's almost reverse almost reverse with the teens I'm dealing with that's been my experience is that these teens the boys are are having to guard themselves right right You know that's because because women have become hunter-gatherers as well. They are the thirst is real I understand it's not like there's a huge proportion of men that are living in a way that would attract a godly woman So you got to write somewhat sell for scraps women I can't understand that but We're in that that that's the case and you're in that place does that album push you to purity now listen to that track exactly It almost desensitizes you to it and makes you feel like it's just something everybody does and I think that's it's clear It's clear that that that album is not intended to push you towards Christ No that album is just simply to tell you my experience. Huh period. That's really what it is.
This is my experience This is what I come from now. I pray that the maturity comes The maturity in Christ comes to where it no longer becomes about me and it's all about Christ. Yeah That's where I feel like artists like from reach or collision or you know most of the other Labels right, you know humble beast. I love that stuff.
That's that's where they are. Yeah This album to me is like a it's okay for instance Many of the gospel many of the Christian hip-hop artists used to be secular artists Yeah, this sounds like leftovers from when he was a secular artist. So to speak. Yeah It sounds like Christian hip-hop didn't taste good to him to with the Al Green route.
It was like I Want to inspire people right right got it not call us to inspire anybody right no We're supposed to say that in fact the main purpose of us is not even to get people saved It's to is to make them disciples teaching them discipline setting boundaries that God will be like nobody wants to talk about that part The boundaries would go man I want to tell my story but my story would interfere with making disciples that Christ will be proud right and that's our look about some of the videos and things that that You know reach us put out Derek minor. What's the name? He was labeled? I can't The name of his label, but they do a lot of discipleship as well and he had a video that that showed that It was like a story of how he hooked up with the cray and how you know They got linked up and they literally did Bible studies period.
Yeah before we're not getting on wax No, we are going to study because we need to make sure that we have the same interest in mind Yeah, so that we are that we are you know Kingdom grounded in here. Where where this is what our mission is Yeah, we're not here to to become you know The best artist we're not here to become you know the top of the game right we're not here to go shirtless on stage So all the ladies can get excited, but that's not what we're commissioned to do no We're commissioned to spread the gospel period period bottom line period and that's why I love Artists like like Taylor because if you listen to Taylor's writing Here's the funny part Taylor's a pastor now and he's actually Pastoring through his music if you listen to it right if you listen like everything comes right back to Christ period Even when he talks about current events things that happen. He mentioned Trayvon. He mentions the hundred and I think 47 I want to say there are big ones Nigerians or a kingon's oh, yeah, yeah, they got killed yeah by Isis You know I mean for proclaiming Christianity He's talking about those things in and still bringing it back to Christ because we can even get caught up in talking about current events Yeah, and forgetting that there's a Christ and there's a reason right why for all of this that's happening.
It's okay It's okay Specifically he says in the song he talks about the fact that his wife had missed care Yeah, that his wife miss Kerry a boy or girl I guess they weren't far enough along to know but he said he found solace in Knowing that the child is in God's face. Yeah, I mean these are all the things and here Let me also stop and say this no matter what music you listen to No, what music you listen to our prayer especially here is that you would really have a thirst to hear music that pushes you towards God Ultimately, yeah, I can tell you right now about 90% of our listeners don't read their Bible daily Yeah, I was 99% this podcast is for you, right? Because at the end of the day there's something inside you that doesn't thirst for that I pray that the music you listen to will at least feed you enough word or feed you some word yes That would begin to kind of spark those sticks together. Make you want to read yes and through through you know true confession that when I first started listening to CHH so to speak when it was you know it was after the music stops the great after the music stops That inspired me to pick up my Bible because they were using it and I'm like no way that's what it says Yeah, okay, wait a minute.
That's what it said. I need to study this Now, how are these dudes able to make the scriptures sound like this and I'm like wait a minute But then it dawns on me that that's just spiritual maturity. Oh what that means that they actually study this stuff It's real they actually know this stuff. It's relevant in their lives and because it's relevant in their lives They can actually wrap it yeah, and there when they came out if you remember we didn't have another example of Everything was in down Christianity everything was in there We weren't sure what pastor was really doing what they were with their preaching Oh, man, we knew personally church members that we were looking at and be like don't know about you look passionate And we were looking for something some lemonade we're looking for something to go please just validate So and when those guys came around like riding my top down listen to my Jesus music It was so much music like it was so much less about the music at that point.
It's going Man, you make this valid like you make a sight about Christ. We love this. There's no shame. There's no shame in it It's no shame in it and that's really what started that movement and so as that movement progresses You know every now and we might hear something that makes us go That doesn't feel like the way I initially felt but for the most part we are celebrating watching the gospel inspire and push others to go I want to be like Christ, right?
Right, which is why people like us or CHH fans get so perturbed when CHH gets attacked Right yes, yes, and then there's that that critical side. Yeah, yeah, man Where we as Christian hip-hop fans are like wait a minute that person is coming on to the scene. Okay, so here's a difference to me When we talk about Christian hip-hop, right the people that have made it meaning you will hear them featured across the community Yeah, all can rap with skills. Yeah, like we haven't heard any Soldier boys.
We haven't heard any koochie mains. We ain't heard any silk the shockers, right? There's nobody who is big in CHH right that cannot rap That's true everyone out there has skills and everyone out there has something about them Yeah, it's a little different from from the cray to a tragic hero. Yeah, right Are you the Molly Molly looks better culverts anything about like a tragic hero is his voice is so distinct You've never heard it before right you've never heard a voice even near his from a from a secular side You can't compare it to anything you can't compare it to anything.
Yeah, and he's lyrical He actually is like wait a minute you listen to what he's saying now for some people They might have to get past the voice yeah, because some people have voices that can be somewhat annoying right You know I mean cuz over time you're like man, it's killing me. Yeah, you know I mean, but I thought about this one I Respect his grind. Yeah, I'm not a fan. Yeah, I'm just not a fan Yeah, I can understand why a lot of people will put him up here There's a lot of people I'm putting my hand over my head There's a lot of people that put him you know near the top they're like oh look great bizzle and I'm like I Say the pray I don't see this one so much up there.
I don't yeah me personally I mean here's like Jackie Jackie Hill now. These are the people that I would lift up a Jackie Hill my wife We were in the car one day and she was like why does she sound so Angry or why does she sound so manly and I'd explain to her. I was like, okay, so check this out We get home. I have you watch a video.
It's gonna be their testimony. She was it she watched a video She was like I get it makes all the sense in the world it makes all the sense in the world Yeah, and I'm right where right she's like I'm right with her You know what I mean? Well my wife is a type of person where it's like if you got a backstory I'm riding with you. Yeah, I'm not the exact opposite.
She cannot stand Christian hip-hop on any level right She cannot I can't play with her in the car, but she's not it. She's not a hip-hop fan period though She's really not but she can she can get with a Drake. She can get with a couple of little Wayne songs Let me say how bad it is It's what I can't get like how can you get with a Drake and not be able to get with a because something so Blimminally broke in her brain. It's one of those things where experience overrides.
Yeah. Yeah. I got you I got you guys doesn't belong in the church. She was not introduced through the crate She was not introduced like T-bone or something like that, right?
Which no, I mean no just to that but like we're obviously not celebrating T-bone in 2015 right? So like I'll give you a perfect example. We're at urban workers youth camp conference I'm sitting here my wife is to my right LaCray is directly to my left with his wife We are sitting at arms length like we're at a movie theater right like literally shoulder-sharing armrest and I'm tapping my wife going Do you understand what's going on right here now with that being said nothing in her moved whatsoever? Nothing in her nothing in her move right?
It's not because she didn't know who LaCray was. She knows exactly who LaCray is He doesn't matter. None of that matter now. What's funny is that it have been Shirley Caesar.
Well, it's funny is we have after that experience I said there's no possible way that you're telling me that what you're listening to is bad Right like what I'm like what I'm like you can't tell me that the quality is bad right so at a birthday party I mean a mixtape full of songs that nobody's ever heard before then people were dancing Gig into it at the end they go who was that I go Christian hip-hop not one person believe me into this day They believe I was lying of course not you know why because the expectation is that it's going to sound that's gonna sound horrible It's gonna sound like somebody opening their Bible and saying in the beginning was the word That's the expectation we got to pray That is the expectation and that's very unfortunate. Yes, I recognize that we weren't we constantly gangsters wasn't the greatest I understand that But you have to respect that you respect it the same way you respect because they're the four runners They're the four runners man like the Humpty dance is not a great lyrical song. No, no. It's just a Humpty dance No, no, no, no, no, no, man.
I appreciate that right right as hip-hop, but it got you the same song sugar hill game as Iconic as their song was lyrically was not at all Curtis blow at all basketball Like like if you look you go back and you listen to these early early 80s. Yeah You respect it for what it was in the time But you can't listen to it with 2015 ears No, you just can't because hip-hop has evolved. Yeah, the evolution of hip-hop has evolved and that's the thing that was such the struggle with Christian hip-hop is the evolving of Christian hip-hop weighted. Yeah, it took till 2005 for it to actually get into like the late 90s Yeah, for real.
We were so far right because the first time I heard Jesus music. I'm like That's kind of Cash money no limit Swish a house, you know, I mean, but it was like yeah We're really kind of five years removed from that but you know that song goes and now check it right so now Andy Mini oh had one that walk-up song from major league baseball right people have realized like he has like you can't stop me is a UFC commercial Song yes, it's the walk-up song from multiple baseball players right look great has stuff that's directly tied to Steph Curry like You have see walk-in songs. Yeah, they're listening to it now 2016 yes in F. Yeah, Nate Fierzin your side He actually has been on the last two versions of man of mad and you'll never know who he is unless you look into it You should say I like what you'll sit there and you'll actually learn it and rap to it Yeah, you like cuz he's going going in going in and that's it's like that to me is like the culture set of the trend center And what people are talking about it gets in the middle by the way But I think the day people are gonna be talking about the talent the rap They're not gonna be talking about this is new Christian using the N word It takes the focus on when you do that kind of stuff it draws the focus away How great you are as an artist yes, it becomes everything becomes controversial You become the Donald Trump of Christian about or hip-hop because now it's about all the things you're saying and how you're saying it And I believe people will respect you more for being true Yeah, then to try to be relevant and that's one of the differences between like a look right like people respect him for who he is Yeah, you're gonna rep Christ period.
You're not you're not gonna change up Yeah, if we're hanging backstage and there's you know flusies and all that stuff you're gonna say you know what I'm good Yeah, you know and nobody's like that's that's what he does right. He does man. I don't know I don't know but that essentially is what the whole podcast is essentially was around was just that and I I don't know who even initiated this. I think it was you It was both kind of we kind of talked about how we wanted to to discuss this album Just from the standpoint of there had been so much talk right with his letter and then it was like a well Is it out?
Yeah, it's out. Okay. It's out all right cool. Let's listen to it.
Yeah, I heard it And then it was kind of critically acclaimed amongst Christian hip-hop artist That was my next I was just gonna say who who's I want to say it was because a couple people who tweeted about it And here's the funny thing and I guess it's not funny or weird But you know a lot of his support came from a lot of the Christian hip-hop artist And I don't not support it. I don't support it as Christian hip-hop I won't push it, but I mean this is the same artist who are pushing the killer album Like Jackie Jackie's like they were like they were in like this dude lyrically and looking at it from an artist perspective And I'm going that's fine for you, right because you see it completely different the way I see it Lirouses you guys literal songs out that require your writing so I get that right so even with John gives up I'm going I think they would grain assault right but if I get on there I see John Piper trying to endorse it. I'm gonna question it right because your contacts for that John You're not a writer you're not an artist you know that so that means your context for that is completely different right? But you're not gonna see that like you're only gonna see like artists who kind of understand that and they're They're mature enough I could say from the outside looking in to be able to talk about those things amongst their circle There was a pair of scope that they had while the post wrong that tour museum and they were talking about Drake lyrics the Drake versus the Me That's fine just don't go up on stage and try to repeat a mean male verse right?
I can I can invite John gives to my church to perform right now that stuff, but he'll say I don't want to be in your church I can't invite you to a college campus to perform right well. I'm not going for the college campus I don't know where you want to take you to the drug house. I don't know what to take you You know I'm saying like I have friends. I want to get saved, but I can't use your music Well, here's the thing that albums not for touring no in my opinion.
No, there's no It's not for touring. I don't know what to wear you'll be on maybe I'm like a J Col thing or something I don't know and I guess I think and I wouldn't call it necessarily disappointment But I guess a little bit of disappointment is the dream junkie album was so good so amazing man Dude, it was a man. I'll give you a mile the three of them put together a masterpiece the production everything was great Right was great. I didn't understand about the dream Jackie album was one skit And everybody wasn't a skit, but it was more of a listening to Beliefs messages.
Yeah, and I'm like did you mean to put that on beliefs album or was that like why are beliefs messages on the dream Duckies album, right? I get it. He's one of the members, but are we gonna have to listen to everyone else's message? So right like the universal thing that's the only thing I didn't get about the dream junkies album and I felt like okay Maybe somebody messed up, but whatever But other than that I'm confused as to why someone would go from dream junkies being featured on all these Christian hip hop albums to now To be honest with you, this is not that far off from four seasons either though Well, we have a conversation about four seasons to and I mean honestly, it's like a hold up podcast I don't run any other time, but like it's not that he's surprising us with this I think we just expected something different we expected growth from yes Yes, I think we just saw this solidified stance and I'm not changing from this cool by all means But I will not consider your Christian hip hop artist even if you're even if you're on songs at a Christian I just continue to be featured you continue to do that And I'm not saying that you're not saved you know I'm saying that this is not about salvation at all.
This is about your product is not for the Christian masses It's not and I'm fine. It's not gonna lead the world to Christ not in this current setting I have some of my best friends right now man from back in the day I Will I listen to it I'll text them to be like this was phenomenal man. I appreciate it for what it is I won't read about it I won't Facebook about it I let them know because I have to be very careful about my sphere of influence right I can listen to you because I know Yourself, I know you we have relationship and when I'm listening this I have so much more context in the normal listener If I send that out to my college students, it'll take me on a path that don't ever understand right you know I'm saying so there are ways to support that without Throwing your entire sphere of influence into a tizzy exactly Any case Wow, it's really been an hour We've been a whole hours worth. Yes on just one album.
Oh, hey, hey Thank you guys so much now for supporting us Of course, we're gonna have links in the description to the letter that John gives wrote as well as and just you guys know There is no music on this one straight just talking We're not doing any music so if you're looking for me that music wait till the next podcast But this literally was just one of those venting sessions where we're trying to figure some things out Yes, and I hope if you guys have any comments, let us know what you guys think If you are on our side if you're not that's fine with us. We have no problem. I Like it. I like people who aren't afraid to disagree.
Yeah. Yeah, I agree Please but on me give you some context. Oh, no. Yeah, hey, I don't you know Yeah, I listen you got to do a whole lot more to just say Jesus ate with the thieves and you know You got it.
We are not talking about hanging with people that is who are unsafe, right? This is not gonna do with salvation. This is everything to do with a genre and does it fit and Jesus had intent when he did Jesus and intent so you know for instance if your pastor curses a lot I don't really consider him a pastor you never expect him to that But my personal belief is you get up there in the pulpit saying the f word does not represent Christ not at all No, that is not the Lord's anointed. Yeah, so that's just a clear delineation You may be saved and all that stuff But I'm gonna put you in that position because I hold that to a different standard So same thing with Christian hip-hop man.
We are huge believers in Christian hip-hop In fact, I think the next one will be kind of towards that mark a little bit We're gonna maybe we'll just dive into some of our new albums that are dropping man I know because Andy and he drops Tuesday, but also um Taylor just came out I was like Marty just dropped his dude. You know what happened with that? No, we got to talk about that in the next Well, tell me now what happened what Charles was filling me in on what happened with it But basically I hate to bring up another name when somebody was not actually here But he was in the last podcast so you guys know Lee is he was telling me that he was number one on iTunes and they took him down What that's what I'm thinking down and then he had to jump through major hoops to get it back up And now he's starting to climb the charts again, but they don't it's the machine man. They don't want it's the machine I love it.
I love hearing stuff like that. Do you know this is this is I believe this week this week? I believe it's this week that Christian hip-hop is taking over so J. Give and just released this track with his track listing Yes, so when any drops, which is the 18th, it's gonna be a rap dude.
I believe that's Tuesday matter Fact a little close out this podcast. He just dropped another one off of that. Yes I'm gonna probably play that one as we go out because I was in the car gig again, and I was losing in my car Man, so yeah, I just love what Christian hip-hop is right now man. Like I just I love it Man as a whole yes as a whole you know I'm saying like I love the fact that we're having Discussions about talented artists who are not Christian hip-hop, but they're like in that weird I love that like we're relevant or relevant bro and and the concert for coming matter of fact poets and autumn are coming I'm definitely gonna try to get a hold of Ezekiel and see we can get a quick podcast with him.
They're coming on our October So shout out to me CMD if you hear this podcast get at your boy quickly so we can get that going now But anyway, the next podcast will be great. Once again, this is twice more radio. This is your boy D And J And J Go to church Yeah Graduation For the first time I was way to show for the first time I was here you I never know how complicated life is when you feel so I select and I don't speak much cuz when talking got hard all I ever did was go to peace up I'm big sister Grace. I'm sorry.
I never learned to sign on and even though you were born deaf I pray you forgive me for the years I live blunt These words on enough to let me show you I