Meet the Press NOW – April 3

If it's Wednesday, April showers bring a muddy 2024 forecast as both Biden and Trump pad their leads in the presidential primaries while running neck and neck in the latest battleground state polls. Plus, President Biden says he's outraged and heartbroken after his rail airstrike killed 7 World Central Kitchen workers in Gaza as Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu faces mounting pressure from all sides to do more to protect civilians and lower rising regional tensions. And we're following the devastating fallout in Taiwan where at least nine people are dead and nearly 1,000 more are injured from a major 7.4 magnitude earthquake, the strongest hit the island in a quarter century. Welcome to be the PRESS now.

I'm Garrett Hake in Washington. Both parties presented nominees added to their delegate totals after primary victories in four states last night. There's no drama anymore in these primaries. But when it comes to the November general election, well, that sure looks like it's going to be a nailpipe.

Pretty much every national and battleground poll these days has the race between President Biden and former President Trump within the margin of error. We got another one of those today. A new Wall Street Journal poll shows President Biden slightly trailing his Republican opponent in six out of seven key battleground states. Every state is within the margin of error, mind you.

Now it's only April. As our own Chuck Todd points out, many key swing voters this election are not in any rush to make up their minds, especially when it comes to these two historically unpopular candidates. What motivates these swing voters could be totally outside of the current or former president's control. Which brings us to the issues because that seems to be where both campaigns actually see some certainty.

They know what fires up their base voters. So the Biden campaign, it's abortion. As it looks to capitalize on that ruling this week, it will put the issue on the ballot in Florida, releasing this ad blaming the former president for the state of reproductive rights in the country because for 54 years they were trying to get Roe v. Wade terminated.

And I did it and I'm proud to have done it. Donald Trump ran to overturn Roe v. Wade. Now in 2024, he's running to pass a national ban on women's right to choose.

I'm running to make Roe v. Wade the law of the land again. The Meanwhile, Mr. Trump engaged in some downright raw red meat rhetoric on the issue of the border yesterday, attacking Mr.

Biden while speaking to his supporters in battleground Wisconsin. I'm here tonight to declare that Joe Biden's border Bloodbath. Remember they used the name Bloodbath. I was talking about something entirely different.

But this is a border bloodbath. Ends the day I take the oath of office. With your vote, I will seal the border. I will stop the invasion.

I will end the carnage, bloodshed and kill. The former president also used his rally to again falsely claim that he won Wisconsin back in 2020, which leads us to an enormous wild card hanging in November right now. And those are the very rules of this democracy. Today, the former president joined a push by Nebraska's Republican governor to have the state legislature change the way Nebraska builds out its electoral votes in a way that could almost certainly benefit the former president.

To be clear, the effort faces major hurdles due opposition from state House Democrats and independents and just due to the time left in the legislative session in Nebraska. But it's yet another example of Donald Trump exerting his considerable influence over his party at the national and the local level, which has grown more receptive, not less, to his conspiracy theories about the last election and the administration of the next one. And join me now to break this all down as NC News Chief Political analyst, Chuck Todd. Chuck, I want to put up something you wrote in your column, this idea that all this is a warning not to overreact to any poll trend you see developing between now and October.

You talk about voters who the most fickle about the current political situation. The more fickle they are, the higher the variance about the likelihood of vote and where the vote goes. You cannot tell us to ignore the polls until October. Well, you don't have to and we won't.

We're going to get these releases. But the point is the movement to me doesn't matter until these last voters come. Right. Where are they going to go?

They're the deciders and that my point is the voters we're trying to figure out, the unenthusiastic partisans. Right. Your base turnout. And these double haters, they're not going to decide now.

Now they may ask my pollster say I'm for candidate. Now I'm going to say I think you will see my point is it's going to be volatility that really Anderson decided to come October, which is why ultimately it's that movement there. And I will point out one thing about the polls that I think is something to keep in mind. I think this is, it's possible we look back, this is Pete Trump because he's, he just won and he hasn't been put through the billion dollar ringer that he's about to go correct.

Meanwhile, Biden, he has more room to grow now. Maybe he never grows. Okay. I mean, I still have room to grow and I've yet to, I never got to succeed.

So, I mean, but in theory, there are more potential voters for him to get. So for Trump, it feels like he's kind of top down. The thing that's so counter true to about Alison is you've got an election in which average voters, even low ID voters, know more about these two candidates than like any other two candidates in history, and yet there's still so much uncertainty. I think that's a hard circle to square.

Well, if you don't, I think it all depends on your expectation of politics is. And I think that this is something. No, I, I, you know, I wrote about this a couple weeks ago because I do think that there are some people that go in the battle box. What's it for me?

And then there's some people going to the ballot boxes. What's best for the, what's best. What I think is best for the country. And you.

And I don't know which voters are doing that. Their vote counts the same. And I think this group of voters, the reason why they're undecided is because I think they're mostly, I think they're thinking, well, I don't know which way is the right way because I look at them like, you know, it could be they're exhausted from the divide. I will say this.

The other warning I was putting out there is don't assume that just because the last two elections basically were identical results that we're half free, straight. It's like fighting a black and red tackle. Free. Let's keep going.

Sure. But there's people out. There's not. And in fact, there's actually greater odds that it won't.

And if you look at our own district, there's greater odds that we're more likely to see a more decisive move either direction. I think if Trump wins, he wins it all. Yeah. And I think the likelihood that Biden gets everything is higher than we, than we fully realize.

What I like about your framing is it helps me understand why we've seen Donald Trump run the racism. There's been no outreach whatsoever than Mickey Kaylee voters. There's no pivot, there's no move to the center is to squash those unenthusiastic partisans on the Democratic side. Like, you're right, you do want to stay home because Joe Biden does suck.

Right. That is like the whole basis of the Trump campaign right now? I think it is, I think making people feel unnerved about their guy 100%. I do think that's Trump's strategy, if there is one.

You know, I mean that's his strategy over the years. How does he become popular and make other people unpopular? It's a frame that makes sense here. Well, I have you as a resident Florida man.

I want to ask you about the Florida Supreme Court part of this. There was so much, you know, sunshine, if you will, for Democrats yesterday. You can just call Florida winnable. How realistic does that seem to be on a presidential level or perhaps on the down level, having abortion Democrats favorite issue at the center of this campaign?

Look, let's the big favor that abortion rights advocates were given was green lighting the six week ban because now you have a stark choice, one or the other. That's right. You either are a state that restricts abortions completely, your state that's going to allow it pure and simple. But I think we underestimate the intelligence of the voter, meaning the voter.

There are plenty of voters who understand they vote on this and then they can vote any other way they want elsewhere. Now, do you get more youth turnout? That's a big deal. Okay.

If you get more youth turnout and that is the key that's always on Kansas. Right. If Suddenly voters under 40 are coming out in numbers that came out for Obama, numbers that came out, then that that's how you lose for floor by three points, remember, but only lost Florida by three points. This is, you know, we're so we saw what happened in 2020 and we're all like, oh my God.

Right. It's probably Florida is probably more like a five point state generically could turn out make it two or three. The problem is what it would take to win the state. Democrats haven't done.

They've yet to register voters for the last 300 years in the state of Florida, but at least the last three. Florida is a four year project. Right. All the time.

You cannot just text it there. Chuck Todd, thank you for sharing your analysis with us on this. And joining us now from where else the big board is NBC News national political correspondent Steve Pornaki. And so Steve, from Florida to Wisconsin now one of our premier battleground states.

They had their primary there last night. What we know this morning about Wisconsin as we headed to November that perhaps we didn't know yesterday. Yeah, well, I think we know yesterday largely which is going to be a battleground that could be decisive in this election. And obviously the margins, the last Two elections.

And it's not just the last two elections outside of the Obama or the margins in Wisconsin have been closed for a long time here. So you can see Biden winning it by six tenths of a percent year margin of 20,000 in 2020. And I think the places to look on this map, we'll be talking a lot about them between now and election day. And certainly on election night.

You look in the suburbs here of Milwaukee, particularly Waukesha County, Ozaukee county, these are still big Republic suburbs, but they become a lot less Republican since Donald Trump came along. And even between 16 and 20, this is a big reason Trump won the state in 16, lost in 20. He didn't get as much out of Ozaki and Waukesha counties in 2020 as he did in 16. Trump also in 2016 had big surges in counties that have mid sized small cities in them.

Places like Brown county, where Green Bay is. You know, places like Lacrosse county, where La Crosse is. And the problem Trump had again in 2020 was he still won Brown county here, but he didn't win by as much as he did in 16. So he's got to improve.

He's got to stop the losses in places like the suburbs, stop the losses in places like Green Bay. And he's actually got a claw back there. Somebody gave up in 2020. Because the other problem Trump has is this one right here, Madison State Capitol, University of Wisconsin.

It's growing in population, it's getting more and more Democratic. And I think Democrats can squeeze even more out of here. So we talking certainly a lot about those dynamics. It's gonna be fascinating to watch.

And Steve, we mentioned at the top of pushed by Trump and some Republic to change the electoral vote distribution in Nebraska, the critical battleground state of Nebraska. Can you walk us through why that would be such a big deal this November? Yeah, I mean, I'll take you through a scenario here. I think you can see how this one electoral vote could actually be huge in this election.

So this is where things ended in 2020. 306, 232, Biden. First thing to remember, we had a census. Since then, some states, some states got more electoral votes, some got less.

So if you ran the election all over again and you got the exact same result in terms of the states, it would now be 303, 235. Just on population shift, Trump gains three electoral votes. Now, we did say mathematically, what is Trump's most efficient way to get from there to 270. We'll just start working the order here.

Of the states in terms of how close they were in 20, this was the closest. 20 lost Arizona, about 10,000 votes. State of argument. What happens if Trump wins Arizona?

There you go. He moved to 246. Second closest Georgia, just under 12,000 votes in 2020. If Trump want to get Georgia now, he's up to 262.

And this is where Nebraska comes in. Because right now with Arizona and Georg would need one of the big, big 10 states that he lost, Wisconsin, Michigan or Pennsylvania. But what happens if Nebraska changes this rule? Then another state comes into play.

It's one that Republicans are very bullish on. It's Nevada. Nevada was blue in 16 and 20, but the margins only about 2 points. And demographically, Republicans think this is a state where they got a future.

So look what happens If Trump gets Nevada. 268 right now. But if Nebraska changes the rules, battle congressional, district. Don't do it.

269. 269. And that's a reminder. If it is a tie, the House breaks the tie.

And it's not every member who votes. It's every state delegation. And the Republicans are expected to control more delegations than Democrats. So the expectations have ever made it this way.

It's advantage Trump. Steve Kornacki haunting our nightmares for months to come with the 269. 269ties. Dude, thank you for breaking it all down for us.

You got it. And coming up, in the aftermath of that fatal idea airstrike on humanitari aid convoy, the message from the White House and from World Central Kitchen founder Jose Andres is that Israel must do better. How Israel's top officials are responding next. Plus, new domestic fallout from the war against Hamas will take you inside President Biden's tense meeting with Muslim community leaders and what it could mean for Biden's campaign hopes in November.

You're watching Meet the Press now. Welcome back. We just learned that President Biden is expected to speak with Israel Prime Minister Netanyahu. Tomorrow will be the first conversation since seven aid workers with World Central Kitchen were killed by an Israeli airstrike in Gaza.

And it comes to Netanyahu is facing increasing domestic pressure. Last night, demonstrators clashed with police outside the prime minister's residence. What has become the most significant anti government protest since the war began in October. And today, Benny Gantz, a member of the war cabinet and political rival to Netanyahu, called for early elections to be held in September to, quote, prevent a rift in the nation.

If not that today, Jeff Hosann Trace, founder of World Central Kitchen, describes the seven aid workers who were killed in Israeli strike as the best of humanity who risked everything to give food to the people who need it. He also wrote, quote, israel is better than the way this war is being waged. It's better than blocking food and medicine to civilians. It is better than killing aid workers who had coordinated their movements with the Israel Defense Forces.

All this comes after President Biden also condemned the strike, saying that Israel was not doing enough to protect aid workers or civilians. NBC News international correspondent Raf Sanchez has more from Tel Aviv. The bodies of those slain seven World Central Kitchen aid workers have now crossed out of Gaza into Egypt as part of their long journey home for burial. They go with tributes from around the world, including from President Biden, who calls them fearless and brave.

And it leveled some of the most serious criticism at Israel that we have seen from the president. Yet he said simply, israel is not doing enough to protect either civilians or aid workers and that this is part of the reason that it has been so difficult to get aid distributed inside of the Gaza Strip is that it is simply not safe for humanitarians. The UN says the killing of these seven aid workers not an isolated incident. Around 200 humanitarians have been killed in Gaza since the start of the war, the vast majority of them Palestinians.

Among the seven World Central Kitchen staff who were identified overnight, 33 year old Jacob Flickinger. He is a was a dual US Canadian citizen who was part of the relief operation at World Central Kitchen. Now the Israeli military making public the initial findings of its probe into this deadly series of airstrikes. They say this was a misidentification of those three World Central Kitchen vehicles.

They say it happened at night in a complex wartime environment and that this is a tragic mistake which they deeply regret. But the Israeli military is facing a number of questions. World Central Kitchen says that its vehicles were clearly identified with its symbol and that it coordinated with the Israeli military about their movements ahead of time. The charity also telling NBC News that two days before the deadly airstrike, they believe an Israeli sniper shot at one of those vehicles.

They say the bullet damaged a wing mirror. Nobody was hurt, but that they filed a complaint with the Israeli military. We asked the IDF about the shooting incident. They did not come back to us.

This is having a major impact on the humanitarian mission inside of Gaza. World Central Kitchen has paused its own aid operations. We saw those three ships heading from Cyprus to Gaza, turning around and heading back. A number of other aid organizations also putting their operations inside of Gaza on Pause.

So this is a major blow to the humanitarian effort at a time when it is needed the most. Back to you. That was Ross Sanchez reporting. I want to bring in now Kelly o' Donal outside the White House.

As we mentioned, President Biden has leveled some of his harshest criticisms now at Israel. This statement following the strike on the World Central Kitchen workers. But is there any sign that it won't just be his rhetoric shifting, that perhaps the administration's policy towards Israel might follow? Well, so far when we've been pressing top officials about this, the answer we're getting back is that there is not a change in policy, that the US still believes that it will have a partner in Israel and will defend Israel and will provide military weapons for sale to Israel and that that is ongoing.

However, what is certainly notable is that the president's tone has changed dramatically and that he has certainly put pressure on Israel to do something different here and to recognize the scope and scale of the reaction and the horror of famine in Gaza, civilians dying at a very high rate and suffering. And now these prominent aid workers among many who have been killed. We're talking about the Jose Andres route, the World Central Kitchen. There have been many more aid workers from various organizations that have also died in this conflict.

So the message from the White House is that Israel is not doing enough and that we expect will be delivered in the direct conversation between the president and Prime Minister Netanyahu. Their relationship has long been tense, but it is also a deep and long lasting relationship. They've known each other some 40 years and so this will be an opportunity for the president, if he's going to change policy, to do it. Voice OF VOICE OVER the PHONE yeah, they made clear both of them, they have a pretty candid speaking relationship.

And clearly the president also had these scaled back Ramadan events overnight. Some Muslim leaders rejected the invitation to even come take us inside the room. What do we know about what happened? Very different from a couple of years ago when this holiday was celebrated at the White House in the East Room with a big public event.

Officials say that what was requested from Muslim leaders in the community was a working group meeting. And then they did have time to break the fast, but small scale. Very quiet and very different than what we might have otherwise expected. At the same time, some of those who were directly involved in this wanted that face to face meeting.

We were told in order to confront the administration to talk candidly, not a time for celebration when their fellow Muslims are suffering in Gaza. And so this is a very different tone now, the White House says that they wanted to respect that request to have a working meeting. They understood that there would be candid words and difficult circumstances. They also say that they are having these meetings on an ongoing basis below the president's level.

And with this, they want the president to be involved in these conversations directly. So different than what we've seen in the past, but also this moment is quite different as well. Yes, it is. Kelly o', Donnell, thank you.

And joining me now is retired Admiral James de Breez, former NATO Supreme Allied Commander, now NBC News Chief International Analyst. So, Admiral, as a former commander, what's your reaction to this strike on these World Central Kitchen workers? The conflict was clearly marked. They coordinated with the idf.

How did this go so wrong? Clearly, the Israelis felt they had a senior Hamas operative. We've watched them use this kind of technique, drones, missiles, taking out convoys. In this case, just deeply flawed intelligence.

Heartbreaking. Tragic that Israelis will pull this apart. I'm quite confident they will fully admit to their mistakes. Certainly the United States has had instances of this kind of event, always tragic.

And my heart goes out to those workers who are real heroes in every dimension. How important is it for Israel to take really serious responsibility for this? I think a lot talk of this could be a turning point in the war, or at least how the rest of the world looks at Israel's handling of the war. Israel has already lost the international narrative.

Clearly, the vast majority of countries believe Israel has gone way, way too far, is violating the laws of war. And this incident will add fuel to that fire. Israel needs to tactically stand up, take full responsibility, show what happened, discipline those involved. That's very.

And then strategically, at the same time, Israel needs to pull back the lens, get the aid flowing into Gaza, loosen the constraints on these aid convoys. I think it is going to be a turning point in the way Israel approaches the war, and it must be. Do you think it's a turning point in the debate about conditioning US Aid to Israel? The Biden administration has continued to provide military assistance.

At some point, the US really becomes, or at least looks palpable to the rest of the world for this kind of thing, though. Absolutely right. And the way the administration has been looking at it, I think correctly, is that it's not an on and off switch of 100% A or 0%. It's a rheostat.

They're dialing up the pressure on the Israelis. You see that in a number of different dimensions. The next click on that rheostat is going to be Stopping providing offensive weapons to the Israelis. I got to think that's being communicated stage Soto voce to the Israelis.

We do that as friends of the Israelis in the sense that it will push them toward the behavior that will help them in the long term. And I'll ask you about the strike that went on any other day. The top news in the war, the strike on the Iranian consulate in Syria. Israel has had no comment on the strike, but somebody did it.

So is a strike on a consulate is a legitimate target? Does that violate international law? What are we doing with here? In the sense that Israel and Iran have no diplomatic relations and are already engaged in a shadow war, I would argue it is, in fact, a legitimate target for the Israeli Defense Forces.

You'll get some international lawyers who would disagree with me on that and say, nope, it's a diplomatic compound. But I think from an Israeli perspective, when they listen to the leadership of Iran talk about wiping Israel off the face of the earth, about the Houthi attacks on Israel, Israeli shipping, about Hezbollah launching missiles day after day, and Hamas, above all, a creature of Iran, raping, torturing, mutilating Israeli citizens, I think it's a legitimate target. Now, Iran has vowed to retaliate for this. I feel like we've heard that from them before.

What will their response, or lack thereof tell us about their appetite to escalate this into a broader war in the region? Iran has no appetite to turn this into a broad war with Israel because they know if they did that the United States ultimately would end up with Israel, and that would lead to extremely destructive effect on the Iranian armed forces. So what I suspect Iran will do is launch some additional weapons from Hezbollah. They might undertake a kind of assassination attempt against senior Israeli officials.

Look, Israel will take care of itself. I don't see Iran taking on a big mass because I know at the end of the day they'd be on the losing end of that conflict. All right, Admiral James, thank you for your time and for your expertise today. You bet.

Thank you. And turning out a devastating earthquake today in Taiwan. At least nine people dead and close to a thousand injured after a powerful 7.4 magnitude quake struck the east coast of the island this morning. As you can see here, buildings shook, some collapsed just as people were headed to work in the school.

It was the strongest quake to hit the country in 25 years. Right now, rescuers working to free over 140 people who are still trapped. More than 100 buildings have been damaged. Strong aftershocks follow the initial earthquakes, including a 6.5 magnitude tremor.

The Biden administration says is monitoring the events and is prepared to offer any assistance Taiwan may need. Up next, as former President Trump ramps up his rhetoric on the border. A controversial Texas border law allowing local police to arrest and detain illegal migrants is back in court today. You're watching the PRESS now.

Welcome back. The Biden administration is once again facing off against the state of Texas over a controversial immigration law. In this case, the one dubbed SB4, it would allow state law enforcement officials to arrest, detain and deport individuals suspected of crossing the border illegally. Today, a three judge panel heard oral arguments on whether that law is constitutional or if it conflicts with existing federal immigration policy.

Right now the law has been temporarily blocked for going into effect as it makes its way through the appeals process. But regardless of how the appeals court rules, it's yet another contentious case that appears headed to the Supreme Court. Joining me now as NBC News Homeland Security correspondent Julia Ainsley. So, Joel, you follow these arguments today.

What stood out to you and what do we think happens next? Well, I say what stood out to me, Garrett, is the fact that Texas kind of didn't about face on what this law means in the first place. Oh, good. Yeah.

So that's where we started this morning. And the lawyer arguing for the state of Texas said, look, maybe Texas went too far. Those are the words we heard. And he said that in fact, what could happen if Mexico refuses to take back migrants supported by Texas, as Mexico said it will refuse to do so, that these migrants would instead just be handed over to CBP Customs and Border Protection at a fourth entry.

That's where migrants end up when they cross the border today. So it really circumvents the whole purpose of why Texas would do this in the first place. They would have them arrested and sentenced for trespassing. That's something they're already doing.

Now perhaps Texas judges get involved and local law enforcement would feel empowered to start arresting people in the interior of the state. That could be a change. But it's really not the SB4 that was signed into law. It's not the SB4 that they described and what they've put into breeze to this order of the Supreme Court.

And it was a real surprise here. In fact, the three judge panel started asking the folks from the federal government arguing for the Justice Department, is this something you could agree to? It just got into this really weird hypothetical territory. Yeah, that is very strange.

So I want to ask you also about the former president. He's been ramping up his rhetoric still farther on the border. Talking about the idea of a border bloodbath. Give us a reality check here about the violent crime, real life statistics both at the border and from migrants.

Well, I actually was just speaking to some folks yesterday who have been looking at the most recent numbers from the state of Texas because that's the only state that actually records immigration status of people that they arrest. And for people arrested for charged with homicide, they are more likely to be U.S. citizens. In other words, illegal immigrants commit crimes overall on a lower rate per capita than US Citizens do.

And as far as the numbers at the border right now, we're not talking about record highs. We saw that last year. This year they've been around 5 to 6,000 illegal crossings per day. Certainly not exactly where they want to be.

But it's not the dire 5 alarm fire that we saw last year. The other part of this interesting is the former president's been saying that Mexico will negotiate with him better. He will negotiate with Mexico somehow more effectively than President Biden has on this issue. What do we know about the state of that relationship?

And what are Mexican officials saying about all of the border drama that we're experiencing on the northern side of it right now? Well, Mexican officials tell me that it is a policy of this administration and likely the next one to be as cooperative as possible with the United States. They don't mess around with their largest trading partner. Mexico's also our largest trading partner.

That's a relationship that needs to stay. But the Trump camp really wants to ramp up pressure on Mexico to take back more migrants, to interdict more migrants on the way to the United States. And they could do that in some pretty harsh ways, including tariffs. It's a question of is Trump willing to play with the economy and global trade on that scale.

So that's certainly something I'm watching for it. Something you might be watching for, too, as you listen to Trump. Definitely. And there's a presidential election in Mexico this year.

So all of these balls very soon. Yeah. All right. Julian Ainsley, thank you for that reporting.

And after the break, poll problems and battleground bids. I'll talk to a Democratic lawmaker from Michigan. As President Biden battles political headwinds in a state that is a must race win for his campaign in November. Congressman Haley Stevens joins me next.

You're watching me, the president. This is a very important state. You win Michigan, you win the election. Welcome back.

That was Donald Trump yesterday in Michigan making a statement that many people in both campaigns probably agree with the state where he leads President Biden according to the new Wall Street Journal poll of battleground states. Although that lead is within the margin of error, Biden's allies worry that President Biden's support for Israel and four with Hamas could be hurting his chances in the state considering it's a sizable Arab American population. I'm joined now that Congresswoman Haley Stevens, a Democrat from Michigan and surrogate for the Biden Harris campaign. Congressman, thank you for being here.

So let's go. Big picture. How does President Biden put that winning coalition back together and win in Michigan again? Well, that's what the Biden campaign is working on every single day with a commitment to open 30 offices by the end of this month.

Last month we opened an office in Oakland county to great fanfare. They're working on that coalition building. They're running a fun, inclusive, compassionate oriented campaign that is firing people up. And most importantly, they're not taking anything for granted.

Joe Biden is a consistent, steady, successful leader who has delivered on his promises time and time again. And he has a continued vision for this country. He wants to continue to tackle gun violence. He wants to continue to deliver for our clean energy economy and most importantly for voters in Michigan.

He wants to stand up for women's rights. He wants to codify Roe. We can trust Joe Biden to do that. We certainly cannot go back to Donald Trump and his plan to implement a six week abortion ban and take this country backwards.

It's not going to work. It didn't work in 2020 and it's certainly not going to work in 2024. What message do you think the president received from the more than 100,000 Michiganders who voted uncommitted in the primary last month and what he intended to do when those folks back? Well, certainly the president understands that people have a right to exercise their opinion and their voice.

And you can't have a better leader than Joe Biden in this moment because he's a listener and he's a leader at the same time. And so he's meeting people with the compassion and the dedication that they deserve on a very complicated and tough issue. There's no doubt a tremendous amount of pain in both our Arab and Jewish community since October 7th. Everybody wants to see war end and war not go on.

It's harrowing to watch the images and see this go on day to day. And I believe that Joe Biden has a plan and he spoke about that very clearly in the State of the Union, about his dedication to providing humanitarian and also continuing to stand by our long standing ally, which is, which is Israel. Joe Biden's records are very clear on that front. Donald Trump.

I don't dispute that last point, but I will ask, I mean, is listening enough? I mean these Arab American voters are really angry in a lot of cases. I mean, the idea that the President has listened compassionately does not seem to be enough to win over somebody who's gonna go out in the cold and write down uncommitted as a message to him specifically that this isn't working. That's a great follow up question.

And look, it's responsible listening and it's also action oriented listening. It's not just paying lip service. It is hearing directly from voters and from constituencies. And look, the foreign policy approach that the Biden administration has been taking and certainly we've heard this sort of Jake Sullivan it has been transparent, it has been consistent and also it has been very commun.

So what we're not going to see is Joe Biden take a 180 degree turn in another direction. But what he is doing is doubling down on the commitment to humanitarian support and aid. He's trying to work with Congress on the right package. I don't think that you're going to see this President sign something that doesn't include that humanitarian aid, which in a lot of my conversations with stakeholders and folks on the ground, that is absolutely essential here.

Right. We have a failed state in Hamas and their leadership that has truly endangered and hurt people in Gaza. We all know that needs to go. We need to rebuild.

You see the Biden administration putting forward a plan to rebuild and again not taking anything for granted. And this is, this is one issue that has large ramifications in the state of Michigan. But look at how Joe Biden has delivered for our manufacturing economy. We had six automotive plants shutter under Donald Trump, one here in Michigan.

And yet we had 350,000 manufacturers jobs in just my state alone get created under Joe Biden. I got manufacturing crawling out, you know, all over our state here in Oakland county to mid Michigan, from solar to battery to obviously automotive, a record automotive contract and something that Joe Biden endorsed and supported along the way, standing by our UAW workers. Don't take that stuff for granted because you see how Joe Biden is communicating and leading at the same time. I'm hearing you say that this state even will be decided by many more issues than just this war.

You mentioned the UAW workers. I'm curious about the endorsement that the President got from uaw. Has he done enough to communicate about the value of that endorsement, any idea that he is specifically pro worker, not just sort of pro union conceptually, to the degree you see a difference between the those things. Well, it was certainly a ringing moment to see UAW President Shawn Fain at the State of the Union.

I was certainly very proud to see that. And what is going to take place over these next six to seven months with a Biden campaign is work in the union halls. It's not just big rallies. You saw the president coming to Michigan, come to Region one here, UAW Region one over Macomb county, not holding a big rally, but engaging with workers, learning their stories, winning over their votes.

It's those nooks and crannies that are so deeply important. Yes, people love to go to a political rally. You see participation on that front. But they also want to know who they're voting for.

They want to connect with their president and they want to hear his vision. And so I believe that this campaign is doing this and frankly, I'm a part of it. And we're getting into the weeds here and that's going to pay dividends. The neighborhoods, the precinct work, the voter operation work that's gonna be so critical to November, just wait and see because I gotta bet that my district's turning out the most number of Democratic votes of any congressional district in the state.

I got a little competition going on with my colleague Debbie Dingle. So we'll mark this tape for that moment and check it in six or seven months. Now, Congressman Haley Stevenson, thank you for coming on. And Silicon Trump on the spot.

How the former president and now Florida resident is responding after his home state paved the way for a six week ban on abortion. With the issue now is set to appear on the November ballot. The panel's next. You're watching the PRESS now.

Welcome back. Turning back now to campaign trail where the state of Florida has put former President Trump into something, a box on the issue of abortion after its Supreme Court paved the way for a strict six week ban on the procedure to take effect while putting the issue on the ballot this November. That means Florida voters will get to vote on potentially overturning that ban and codifying abortion protections up until viability. While they also cast their vote for president.

It's a bit of a dream scenario for some Democrats in their rival's backyard. Reporter yesterday asked Florida resident Donald Trump how he would vote on that abortion ballot initiative. Here's what he had to say. What I'm going to do is make a statement about it next week I'm going to have a formal statement.

I'm going to make it next week. And that's an issue that we should win. The Roe v. Wade issue is a issue that we should win.

It was sent back to the states. The states are going to really dominate, and I think that's what you're seeing. But I'm going to make a statement on that next week and it'll be a very concise statement. What should we prepare for?

But that be a change in position? No, not a change in position. It's going to be something that is very important. You have to go with your heart, you have to go with your spirit.

And it's going to be something that I don't think people will be overly surprised. But we also have to remember we have to win elections. It's very important. You have to win elections.

Otherwise you go back the way you were. There were a lot of words spoken there, but none of them was an immediate answer on where Mr. Trump stands on the Florida abortion initiative beyond him basically saying, as he so often does to stay tuned. Journey now on set is Molly Ball, senior political correspondent for the Wall Street Journal Mo Leafy, Democratic strategist and executive director of the Georgetown University Institute of Politics and Public Service, and Brendan Fox, former advisor to Republican House Speakers Paul Ryan and John Boehner.

He's also NBC News political analyst and the only person taller than me allowed to participate in this panel. Molly, we'll start on the abortion issue here. Donald Trump has been on every side of this issue over his political career. Does it behoove him to take one specific position, if not now, ever?

Probably not. I mean, what you heard him say there was very suggestive, and I'll be eager to hear if he does, in fact, take a concise and firm position, as he says he's going to do next week. But he seems to be hinting that he's going to have to win, which signals to me that he's not going to give pro lifers all they want. And he's saying that the states are going to dominate, which suggests to me that he's not going to come out in favor of some sort of a national ban, which is what a lot of the pro life movement wants, you know, advocating for Congress to pass some sort of limit, whether it's 15 or 16 weeks, as he's hinted in the past, or something more or less restrictive.

So that those are the tea leaves that I read in his statement. But as you say, he tends to do this thing where he Takes all sides of an issue and lets everybody hear what they want to. And so I wouldn't put it past him to just keep doing that. We talked about this kind of box of the state of Florida put in.

I think that reporter asked the right question. Donald Trump the voter, you can say where he gets to the states, but at some point Donald Trump the voter has to say 6 weeks or 24 weeks when he casts his ballot. Presumably he has to answer that question at some point if he keeps getting asked. I recognize that's a big projection here, but, you know, talk me through the sort of implications of where he lands if it's a binary choice between those two.

What he also saw there was a tactic that was clear. Without Trump saying, I'm going to release a plan later, I'll be surprised if he actually lets himself get pinned down. I think he realizes there's no good answer here for all the reasons that Molly laid out the Florida issue, put it back in front of him. But one thing we do know is he's worried about this.

He's thinking about this. We've seen a report of his talking about it 16 weeks. He knows that he needs to find some safe ground. Problem is, I don't think any Republicans found really safe ground for a general election on this end.

As Molly pointed out, there's so many constituencies that have been asking for something for so long, we've actually seen them in a lot of polling and actually in voting in places, there are a lot of Republican voters who don't agree with the sort of long standing Republican position on this. So I don't know where he's gonna land, but I'm sure it'll disappoint a lot of people. Mo isn't the risk of just saying you kick it to the state, but then you own every state's policy, whether it's a six week ban or no ban at all. You are basically responsible for all of that.

And the Biden campaign's not waiting here. Right. They have tried to nail Donald Trump on his boasting about ending Roe. Talk to me about the ways that Democrats can best take advantage of the hemming and hauling here from the former president.

Yeah, I mean, I, like many people, laughed when he said, I'll give you an answer next week. Right. But you know, I suspect that if I'm the Biden campaign, I don't need that because Donald Trump said everything he needs to say already. Right.

When he went out there and took credit for the overturning of Roe v. Wade. When he says, I did that, I overturned Roe v. Wade by pointing all these justices.

That's what matters to the Biden campaign. They have that ad, they are running that they are going to continue to run against him as the guy that, that was responsible for putting states like Florida in this position. Because you're exactly right. Now it doesn't matter what Donald Trump Trump says.

What each state does is now going to be the next battle in this war over abortion rights and reproductive freedom. And it's a war politically. The Democrats are here to keep fighting. He's also a master at mudding the waters, though.

I think that clearly what he's trying to do here and he could potentially use these state. And I've talked about this for a long time, the Republican Party has no position. So every state were at the whims of state lawmakers. That's never a good place to be.

But he could use it to his advantage and say, I think Florida was too extreme, I think Oklahoma is too extreme and try to make himself moderate. Of course Democrats are gonna say something different. But it does give him an opportunity to muddle, muddle things a little. But if he ever gets the debate he's so plaintively asking for, that could be thrown back in his face effectively too.

If I consult my tactical political handbook here, it would tell me that the party that is more united on issues like this almost always wins the debate. When the party is completely splintered, as Brendan in the case Republicans are, it blows up in their faces. Do you think Democrats can stay united on a defend row platform, kind of let that mean whatever it means to voters and run that through November as effectively as they have over the last year or so. Well, I would say on the one hand, yes, I do think the Democrats stay united on this because as much as, you know, there have been attempts to get them to answer more questions about things like late term abortions, we haven't seen that resonate with voters.

People just don't seem to care about that end of things. But, you know, I also think it's important to remember that we don't know how this interacts with the presidential election. This is the first presidential election since the fall of Roe. And what we have seen in elections that were candidate elections that were not ballot initiatives specifically on abortion, is that this issue is actually very unpredictable.

You know, I was in Florida in advance of the 2022 midterms and went to an event where Ron Desantis Opponen, Charlie Crist was surrounded by abortion rights activists holding signs and saying, you can't reelect Ron DeSantis. He's going to. He's already limited abortion. He's going to do it.

More voters were not persuaded by that. Even if they were on that side of the issue when it came to a candidate, they were looking at it more holistically. So you can't just look at this as simplistically as saying Democrats are on the right side of this important issue, therefore they win the line. A ballot measure, especially alone, is not a silver bullet 100 years old.

But talk about a change in thinking that appears to be existing among Democrats when it comes to Donald Trump. 90 of you may have our viewers don't pick listen to quite as many as rally as I do. I want to play you some of the super cut that we had to say last night on the campaign trail in Wisconsin. Let's listen.

I'm not the threat to democracy. Joe Biden and the fascists that control him, and they do control him, are the real threat to democracy. The radical left Democrats rigged the presidential election in 2020, and we're not going to allow them to rig the presidential election in 2024. 2024 is our final, final battle.

With you at my side, we will demolish the deep state. We will expel the warmongers. We will drive out the globalists. We will cast out the communist, Marxist and fascists.

We will throw off the sick political class that hates our country. They absolutely hate our country. We will route the fake news media. We will drain the swamp, and we will liberate our country from these tyrants and villains.

I mean, there's some pretty wild, fantastical, outlandish stuff there. And what I've noticed recently from Democrats is a desire to make sure that people see that. As a Democratic strategist, where do you land on the idea of more Trump, not less is better for elected Democrats and specifically Joe Biden? Look, I think Donald Trump is one of the best salespeople for Joe Biden.

Having said that. Having said that, that is only part of the equation. Right. I want Donald Trump out there as much as possible because I think when people hear that, it reminds them of sort of all the cringe that was the lead up to the 2020 election.

Right. It just reminds them of that icky feeling that we all had heading into that election. But Democrats have to offer more. They can't just make this a referendum on Trump, though they could.

What they need to do is continue, and Joe Biden needs to continue to tell people, here is what the alternative looks like he needs to say, here's what I am going to do. While he's talking about all this crazy stuff, looking backwards while he's talking, still Talking about the 2020 election and overturning all these conspiracy theories, here's what I'm gonna do to make your life a little bit easier. That cannot in this election, especially given where both candidates are in terms of approval ratings. They cannot just rest on Donald Trump's unpopularity, reminders people of it, but offer the altar.

You can hear the relative risk of that, especially if Trump's going to get further off the deep end by November. I think there is risk in letting him set the tone of the campaign. That's what he's a master at is we're going to talk about what I want to talk about. If we let Donald Trump just talk about only immigration or any of that stuff that is too good.

No matter what the context is, if one person gets to define the issues that we're talking about, they win. Certainly the Biden campaign needs to engage in there as well. I don't know if we're turning attention back to Donald to Joe Biden's policy platforms are necessary the answer, but I think Joe Biden needs to engage in pointing out exactly the danger behind some of those things and tackle them more on this. That's an excellent point and one we're going to have to end on.

Mo Brend and Molly, thank you all for coming in and thank you all for watching. We're back tomorrow with more Meet the Press. Now the news continues with Hallie Jackson right now. Hey, it's Kate Snow, NBC News anchor and host of the Drink.

This month, Demi Lovato is my guest. The global superstar tells me that she is the happiest she's ever been right now. But getting there, it wasn't simple. Demi opens up about starting in Hollywood young and why she now thinks she may have started too soon.

She talks about recovery, her new marriage, and the deeply personal reason behind her new cookbook. The Drink is always about the journey to the top, and this was an honest conversation about what that takes. Hope you listen and follow the Drink wherever you get your podcasts.