Meet the Press NOW – January 30

Welcome to MEET THE press. Now I'm Kristen Welker here in Washington on a very somber day here where recovery operations are underway as we're learning more about that deadly and tragic mid air collision last night when a passenger jet and military helicopter collided, killing everyone on board both aircrafts, according to authorities. Here's what we know so far. Shortly before 9pm last night, an Army Blackhawk helicopter on a training mission and an American Eagle flight inbound from Wichita, Kansas, landed at Reagan National Airport, collided over the Potomac river.

There were 60 passengers and four crew on the flight and three people aboard the helicopter. Now in this video, which is disturbing, you can see the moment of impact from a camera on the Kennedy center facing a river. And, and here is the audio from the air traffic control tower just shortly after the collision. Crash, crash, crash.

This is a Win three. Crash, crash, crash. This is a Win three. We're looking for a aircraft versus a helicopter.

Now late this afternoon, a source telling NBC News that according to a preliminary FAA report, staffing in the control tower at Reagan National Airport at the time of the crash was slimmer than usual and that one air traffic controller was controlling both airplanes and helicopters, which is acceptable under FAA guidelines. Right now, rescue crews are at work locating the two aircraft in the water and still pulling bodies from the wreckage. While we don't know the identities of all the passengers at this time, members of the U.S. figure Skating Community have confirmed that a group of American skaters, coaches and family members who have had been a training camp in Wichita were among those on board.

Investigators are underway from the NTSB, FAA and U.S. army. Moments ago, the chair of the NTSB said that they are still working on recovering the flight data recorders and that this is a whole of government effort, stressing that the investigation will take time. All of that comes after President Trump delivered remarks from the White House briefing room earlier today.

He started pointing fingers at air traffic control and the army helicopter pilots. Listen, we had a, a situation where you had a helicopter that had the ability to stop. I have helicopters. You can stop a helicopter very quickly.

So you had a confluence of, of bad decisions that were made. And you have people that lost their lives, violently lost their lives. There were some warnings, but the warnings were given very, very late. Those warnings were given very late.

It was almost as they were given. A few seconds later there was a crash. It should have been brought up earlier, but the people in the helicopter should have seen where they were going. I can't imagine people with 2020 vision not seeing, you know, what's happening up there.

And with that, I'm not blaming the controller. I'm saying there are things that you could question, like the height of the helicopter and the height of the plane being at the same level going in opposite directions. In his remarks, the president also baselessly blamed diversity hiring practices from prior administrations. Reading off a Fox News article about diversity, equity and inclusion initiatives at the faa, seeming to suggest they contributed to the incident.

Look, they put a big push to put diversity into the FAA's program. Then another article. The Federal Aviation Administration. This was before I got to office recently, second term.

The FAA is actively recruiting workers who suffer severe intellectual disabilities, psychiatric problems, and other mental and physical conditions under a diversity and inclusion hiring initiative spelled out on the agency's website. Can you imagine? Now, it should be noted the policy mentioned by the president has been up on the FAA's website since 2013 and was present during the first Trump administration. Now, there's also currently no direct evidence linking diversity standards in the federal government to this collision, something President Trump acknowledged at the podium when pressed about it.

Are you saying this crash was somehow caused and the result of diversity hiring? And what evidence have you seen to support these claims? It just could have been. We have a high standard.

We've had a much higher standard than anybody else. And there are things where you have to go by brain power. You have to go by psychological quality, and psychological quality is a very important element of it. These are various very powerful tests that we put to use.

And they were terminated by Biden, and Biden went by a standard that's the exact opposite. You have today blamed the diversity elements, but then told us that you weren't sure that the controllers made any mistake. You then said perhaps the helicopter pilots were the ones who made the mistake. It's all under investigation.

I understand that. That's why I'm trying to figure out. You can come to the conclusion right now that diversity has something to do with this crash. Because I have common sense, okay?

And unfortunately, a lot of people don't. Now, just moments ago, President Trump spoke to reporters again, this time in the Oval Office, as he doubled down on those unsubstantiated claims, signing a memorandum directing the Secretary of Transportation to ensure that his administration is undoing some of those DEI policies from the Biden administration. The president also took questions during his remarks. We're just getting the tape.

Let's watch it together. It's going to be quite an important signing. So we thought we'd let you watch if we could. I'd Ask Will to explain the first, but really more importantly, explain the second and we'll start signing.

Go ahead. Mr. Just two items for your signature today. The first is the formal commission of appointing Chris Rochelot to be the Deputy Administrator of the Federal Aviation Administration.

And since the commissioner position is. Excuse me. Since the administrator position is currently vacant, he will act as the administrator, since he's now appointed deputy and he's a very capable guy, extremely experienced in aviation, highly regarded in the industry and in government. Okay.

Thank you, sir. Thank you. Second, for your signature, we have the presidential memorandum titled Immediate Assessment of Aviation Safety. In light of the damage done to aviation safety by the Biden administration's DEI and WOKE policies, what this presidential memorandum orders is for your secretary of Transportation and FAA administrator, in this case acting FAA Administrator, to basically ensure that we are actively undoing all of that damage, that we are assessing how much damage was done, and that we're ensuring that people hired within the FAA, in keeping with the memorandum of January 21, are only the most outstanding, capable people for the jobs that they're being hired into.

In other words, competence. Yes, sir. Elevating competence over everything else instead of the DEI policies that were pursued by the Biden administration. I think everyone understands that.

And Obama. Okay, but Biden, much worse. Not even a contest. What they've done is just crazy in so many other ways.

Okay, Mr. President, to be clear, are you saying race or gender played a role in this strategy? It may have. I don't know.

Incompetence might have played a role. We'll let you know that. But we want the most competent people. We don't care what race they are.

We want the most competent people, especially in those positions. And you're talking about extremely complex things. And if they don't have a great brain, a great power of the brain, they're not going to be very good at what they do. And bad things will happen.

There's all the concerns about the amount of congestion out of D.C. airport. Do you think that there's too many flights coming out of the airport? No, I think we need very smart people running the flights and doing it.

You know, the ones that aren't good, they'll either do one or two things, they'll have too many coming in and they can't handle it, or they'll have the people waiting up in the air, which everyone's been caught in that situation and circling the airports for an hour, and that's no good either. Military helicopter training flights that are flying around National Airport all the Time. What's your view? Should they be flying?

It's fine if they're in the right locations. And if they're not at the same time, I mean, if a plane coming in is at 300ft or 400ft and helicopters training at 300 or 400ft, why would they be up 500ft higher? And that, to a certain extent, is the air traffic controller. Please wait just a second.

I feel like what happened last night was preventable. I do. Yeah. Oh, absolutely.

Obviously that was something that should not have happened and we're not going to let it happen again. Yes, please. Mr. President, on a slightly different subject, on your Canada and Mexico tariffs, will oil be included or excluded from those tariffs?

So we'll be announcing the tariffs on Canada and Mexico for a number of reasons. Number one is the people that have poured into our country so horribly and so much. Number two are the drugs Fentanyl and everything else that have come into the country. Number three of the massive subsidies that we're giving to Canada and to Mexico in the form of deficits.

And I'll be putting the tariff of 25% on Canada and separately 25% on Mexico. And we will really have to do that because we have very big deficits with those countries. Those tariffs may or may not rise with time. Oil is going to have nothing to do with it, as far as I'm concerned.

Oil has nothing to do with it. Depends. But countries that won't take back their criminals that they sent into us. You know, they sent them to us, they put them into the caravans and they came into your standing that they were sent by those countries and then they're going to be met very harshly with sanctions, etc.

It'll be up pretty quickly. How much do they get to? It's not very much. A lot of the structure is already there, as you know.

Are you aware of any performance issues or disciplinary actions that were taken against anyone who was working the tower last night or flying a plane? No, no. And I hope that's not the case in this case, but certainly over the years it's been the case. And it's the case with respect to close calls.

And it's the case with respect to circling for hours on end. You know, planes circle a lot and they circle because the people bringing them down, these people that have to be very, very smart and it's not based on anything other than the brain. We need the smartest people. We need both psychologically smart and just brilliant, period.

And we are going to have them in our, in our control towers. We are going to have the most competent people in the country in our control towers, not people that are there for any other reason. You said that you envision sending the 80 something thousand IRS agents higher under Biden to the border. What role do you see them playing?

Well, we'll see. I mean, I may do that or may use different people that would have sent more. Would I give the Border Patrol some help? Although now if you look, they've taken in the lowest number since my administration.

The numbers are very low. And that level, we don't need so much help. People know not to come because if they come, they're not going to make it in and they're going to be shipped out. Both said that they won't take in disposition people from Gaza like you suggested.

Is there anything you can do to make them do that? Against those countries, for example? They will do it. They will do it.

They're going to do it. Okay. We do a lot for them and they're going to do it. Mr.

President, you've offered over 2 million federal workers the option to resign immediately. There are 50,000 FAA employees. Does this tragedy give you reason to reconsider that option of resignations because of concerns about staffing issues? If people aren't coming to work, they're not going to come into the office and report as per the date that, you know what it is, Everybody knows what the date is.

It's been very well documented. Then they're going to be terminated. You're not, you're not concerned though, that if many people take that offer, there could be shortages that could be. They'll be replaced with very competent people, A lot of competent people in this country.

Have you spoken to any of the families of the victims of things? I don't want to comment on that. Do you have a plan to go visit the site? I have a plan to visit.

Not the site, because what you tell me what's the site? The order to meet with the first responders down there. I don't have a plan to do that, but I will be meeting with some people that were very badly hurt. With a family member, obviously, but I'll be meeting with some of the families.

Do you believe that there are five votes on the Supreme Court that would hold your position? One what? Five votes on the Supreme Court. Birthright citizenship?

I think so, yeah. Look, birthright citizenship was, if you look back when this was passed in May, that was meant for the children of slaves. This was not meant for the whole world to come and pilot to the United States of America. Everybody coming in and totally unqualified people with perhaps unqualified children.

This wasn't meant for that. This was meant, when it was originally done, for the children of slaves. And that was a very good and noble thing to do. And I'm in favor of that 100%.

But it wasn't meant for the entire world to occupy the United States. I just think that we'll end up winning that court in the Supreme Court. I think we're winning that case and I look forward to winning it. This has been going on.

We're at that level. We're the only country in the world that does this. There's no other country at this level. There's no other country in the world that does it.

It's crazy. Mr. President, if 64 people lost their lives last night, if you aren't confident that DEI had any role, why bring it up? All I'm talking about is competence.

And we want, in the, in that particular position, we have to have the most competent people in our country because we're talking about lives. Now. It may or may not have had to do, but I don't like the fact that the helicopter was at the exact same level as the airplane. The helicopter should have been a thousand feet or 500ft above it or something below it.

The plane was at 3 to 400ft. Or the plane should have been stopped because the helicopter could have stopped. The plane can't be stopped. But the plane was on a schedule that was, you know, it was along a track.

They call it a track. And it's the same track that every other plane's used for many years. It was going down and landing and the helicopter got in its way. And if the helicopter was higher or lower or stopped or turning left or turning right at a quicker time, I mean, it turned, but it turned when it was too late.

A tragic, a tragic story. So I don't know, do you blame it on the air traffic controller too, in addition to the pilots? Maybe the pilots fault. They should have seen it.

I would have thought they should have seen it because it was a plane that was loaded up with lights and everybody. You can see it from Kennedy center. You can see it very easily. So all I want is the most competent people in our country to be air traffic controllers.

It's a very important position. And other positions too, by the way. We're not only talking about that, we're talking about air traffic controllers. Maybe in particular, they have to be brilliant with computers, brilliant with graphics.

They have to be psychologically really, really smart. And, you know, there are a lot of people that would be able to do. That's coming on Saturday. That's coming on the first Saturday.

No oil tariffs? No oil tariffs? No, I don't. Well, I didn't say that.

You said that. No, no. We may or may not. We're going to make that determination probably tonight on oil, because they send us oil.

We'll see. Depends on what the price is, if the oil is properly priced. If they treat us properly, we'd say no. Look, Mexico and Canada have never been good to us on trade.

They're treated as very unfairly on trade. And we will be able to make that up very quickly because we don't need the products that they have. We have all the oil you need. We have all the trees you need, meaning the lumber, we have more than almost anybody in those two categories.

And oil we have more than anybody. And we don't need anybody's trees. We have to free up some of the. Some of the tree areas that we have.

We have great lumber in this country. We have to free them up environmentally, which I can do very quickly, but we don't need what they have. And for us to be subsidizing Canada to the tune of $175 billion a year and subsidizing Mexico to the tune of 250 billion, $300 billion a year, and Mexico is a method of China sending in its product. And with China, I'm also thinking about something because they're sending fentanyl into our country, and because of that, they're causing us hundreds of thousands of deaths.

So China's going to end up paying a tariff also for that. And we're in the process of doing that. We'll make a determination of what it's going to be. But China has to stop sending fentanyl into a country and killing our people.

Is that conversations between Netanyahu's government and the White House and signal that the US May be about to pull its troops out of Syria? Have you made a decision? I don't know who said that. I mean, I don't know who said that, but we'll make a determination on that.

We're not gonna. We're not involved in Syria. Syria's its own mess. They got enough messes over there.

They don't need us involved in everyone. Well, it's part of confidence right there. They shouldn't have that happen. Right there is what I'm talking about.

Confidence would be you're not gonna have a shortage. But if you had the right people, you wouldn't need as many people either. Do you know if there was a shortage last night or not? I don't know.

No, I don't know. You're telling me something. You said earlier today that you had not spoken to Putin about this. When was the last time you spoke with him?

And has President Xi responded to your ask to help put pressure to end the warfare? I won't comment on either of them, but we're doing very well with regard to both. Mr. Russell reports that she might ask of you in order to give that help.

Pressure to disavow potential Taiwan independence. Is that something that you ever did? We never discussed it. You had said earlier that we would get more details about the victims on the plane.

Can you give more on that now? I have a lot of details, but it's something that will be released to you also at the appropriate time? No, I have the full details. There were a lot of young people.

Young people, Great people, great athletes, great skaters. Very sad situation from numerous countries. Thank you very much, everybody. Thank you.

President Trump answering questions from reporters for a second time today. Just a quick recap. He was pressed on whether he was in fact saying that race and gender played a role in this crash. He said it may have.

He was asked if he thought there were too many flights out of dca. He said no. He was asked if what happened last night was preventable. He said, I absolutely do think it's preventable.

He was pressed there at the end about whether there's a shortage of air traffic controllers and if there should have been more on duty on that last night. And he said, I don't know. You're telling me something. He was asked about a couple of other issues, really pressed over and over again on his accusations that Di may have played some roles.

Someone saying, if you can't draw directly, if you're not confident, why bring it up? He said, well, I'm really talking about incompetence. He also talked about tariffs, signaling he still plans to impose them on Canada and Mexico, as well as birthright citizenship, of course, as executive order that which gives people citizenship who are born here in the United States. And he thinks he's going to win at the Supreme Court.

To delve in more deeply, let's bring in our full team, NBC News White House correspondent Michelle Sindor. Courtney Cubby is at the Pentagon. Emily is near Reagan National Airport. Yamiche, let's start with you.

This crash, of course, happened less than 24 hours ago. Still a lot of questions. But there again, we all just listen to President Trump in the Oval Office really doubling down, acknowledging he doesn't have confirmation that Di played any type of role, but that it's what he thinks may have been at play to some extent. What are some of the key takeaways and reactions to some of what we've heard today from the president?

Well, this is a striking moment for the Trump presidency because this is really the first big tragedy that he's having to navigate in the second term. And he leaned into the sadness that so many in our nation feel during that press briefing, which of course is the first time. Walking into that briefing room for the 47th president, he took a moment of silence and said that he was going to get to the bottom of what happened, saying that he wanted to do it as soon as possible and criticize other investigations for taking too long. But then, as you have said, he did a hard pivot to politics and to attacking dei, going after former President Obama, Biden, as well as the former Transportation Secretary Pete Buttigieg, saying that he was a disaster when he was in that role.

The president, though, as you said, he talked about the fact that, quote, common sense is the reason why he wanted to bring up talking about DEI is something that, of course, he's attacked over and over again, first on the campaign trail and then in these first few weeks of his presidency. He signed a number of executive orders going after dei. We can't underscore enough that there is no evidence that diversity, equity and inclusion programs played any sort of role in this playing collision. And the NTSB had their own press conference where they said it's too early to tell what the actual cause of this accident or this collision is.

And we have to know that NTSB is the only agency that actually based on the laws and the policies, they're the only agency that's actually supposed to talk about this investigation into the cause of this collision. But you see President Trump there leaning into the cultural issues. It's an issue that work for him during the campaign trial. He's doubling down on that, even though he's saying, I'm not sure exactly if this is part of this.

The fact that he's bringing it up is causing up. And we've seen some real pushback to him bringing up DEI issues. We have people who, Jed, you call it despicable in a social media post. I also have been talking to the president of the naacp, who also was very pointedly criticizing the president, saying that this was not the time or the place given the fact that there are families whose loved ones are literally laying in the Potomac still as there's still this recovery effort going on.

So definitely a striking woman for his presidency in one where he is continuing to lean on the issues that he's talking about throughout his presidency and throughout his campaign. And despite this being attracting that, it is really asking some people to be a consoler in chief in this moment rather than being someone who's talking about politics. But that's what he wants to go and that's what he wants to do. Kristen, you know, it's a great breakdown.

Imitation was also notable because he had two of his newly installed cabinet secretaries with him as well. Secretary Hexa, Secretary Duffy, of course, leading Transportation. What is the internal discussion that you're hearing given that they are so new to these roles you mentioned? Here they are handling one of the biggest commercial air disasters that we've seen in years.

Yeah, I'm also striking. The Vice President, J.D. vance was also there. All of those people, Sean D, the new Transportation secretary, as well as Pete, he, the Defense secretary, they all really were in line, lockstep in line with the president bringing up DEI issues and hinting that that might be a cause of this collision.

Again, there's no evidence of that, but it shows you the dynamics here. He has a cabinet that has individuals who are willing to get behind him despite the fact that there isn't any evidence exactly of what he's saying or evidently at all of what he's saying. But it shows you that he has really found loyal people who will go up to the podium and say, well, I'm going to be with the president on this. That being said, there are a number of career officials in our federal government, including at the ntsb.

These are people who have a lot of expertise in this work with unfortunately how to do this work in the past looking at tragedies, looking at plane crashes and collisions. So there is a federal government response that's going to be robust. For my understanding, that's going to continue to be an all hands on deck investigation here. That is what investigators are stressing that this is all hands on deck right now.

And with that, let's go to Emily. You are near the scene of this horrific crash. What is the very latest on the recovery efforts there? What are investigators telling you, Emily?

Workers now last check that recovery mission is still underway and they're in a bit of a race against time as we're losing daylight here. All day we've been watching Boats and flashing lights so circles in the fuselage behind me as they tried to recover the 67 people who died in this terrible tragedy. They've been using a recovery center not far from here on a helipad, a temporary morgue, if you will. They describe it as with a tent.

They're using ambulances and boats to transport the victims as they recover them to eventually be reunited with their grieving families. At this point, so far, more than two dozen bodies have been recovered in the wake of this terrible tragedy. Person it's just so devastating, Emily. It's hard to imagine what these families are going through.

And I know that we are learning some details about these beautiful lives that were lost. 14 members of the figure skating community were among those killed in this crash. I know that Nancy Kerrigan actually spoke from the skating club Boston, where six of those victims are from. Let's take a listen.

I'll get your reaction on the other side anytime. I've been able to be here and watch them grow. The kids here really work hard. Their parents work hard to be here.

But I just, I feel for the athletes, the skaters and their families. But anyone that was on that plane, Emily, what's, how is the community. We see how the community's reacting. But tell us more about what you're learning.

Yeah, I mean, you can see the pink Papa Bull there in the interview there. Remember, this was a flight coming from Witchita, Kansas to D.C. and what was just happening, there was a national development camp on the heels of the US Figure Skating National Championship. So there were a number of figure skaters, rising stars if you will, that were appearing in that development camp along with their parents and coaches.

Skating clubs throughout the northeast, including the D.C. area here, also Philadelphia area and in Boston, Boston, the Skating club of Boston, losing six people belonging to that club, including two athletes, a 13 year old and a 16 year old, their two moms and a pair of coaches from that club. It's a sore point for the city of Boston because just a matter of decades ago, especially for older members of that club, in the 1960s, there was a plane crash that happened to carrying the entire US Figure skating team to Worlds and everyone aboard that flight died. And Emily, what are those families hearing from the airline authorities right now?

I imagine they are trying to keep them informed as much as possible while this recovery effort continues. Yeah, absolutely. Because one of the things that American Airlines has done was they introduced a toll free line. I'll read that number for you.

800-679-8215. That is for anyone who believes they may have lost a loved one who had been on that flight. They also have been deploying care and go teams here at D.C. but also throughout the region.

These specialists that have been trained to respond to these kinds of incidents, to work with the victims, family members, crew members, family members on board. That American Airlines flight includes two pilots and two flight attendants, we learned. One of the flight attendants is named Ian Epstein. His family tells us he was full of life.

He loved travel. But most of all, he loved his family. He was a father, a stepfather, a brother, a husband. Also on board, First Officer Sam Lilly, whose father posted, was supposed to get married later this year.

It's just so devastating to learn all of those details. Our hearts are with all of the grieving families right now. Emily, thanks so much for that. Court, let me go to you now.

I know you have been digging into all of the details about this helicopter flight. It was a training mission. What is the latest that you're hearing about this training mission? What may have happened?

Yeah, and I have to say, Chris, and oftentimes we'll hear after there's some sort of a mishap that it was a routine training flight or training mission. In this case, what this means is one of the pilots on board, in this case the co pilot on that helicopter, was doing an annual evaluation flight. So essentially the pilots have to make sure that they can fly various routes and various missions, daytime and nighttime. And this was this individual's time to be evaluated.

Because of that reason, the main pilot on the aircraft was actually an instructor pilot with more than 1000 hours of flight time. Very experienced, both of them, frankly, the third person on the aircraft was a crew chief, according to army officials. Also very experienced, all three of them. Very aware of the route that they were flying.

It's a very common route. The military calls it Route 4, frankly, commonly flown. Also, these individuals were very well, well aware of the restrictions that go along with flying in this area and flying this specific route. Among those, the idea that they are not allowed to fly higher than 200ft.

So that is the max altitude this aircraft is allowed to fly in this, along this route. Now, Kristen, that brings up a huge question, and that is what was President Trump and Secretary of Defense Pete Hike said, what were they talking about this morning when they both repeated that there was an elevation issue regarding this flight? We don't know the answer that we've been asking it. One of the main questions here is usually when you talk about elevation, you're not talking about aircraft.

You're not talking about flights. Generally the term is altitude when you're talking about flight. That's one of the things that's really been compounding people here today. And we do not expect to get any real answer or fidelity about how high the helicopter was flying at the time until the investigation is unaware completed.

Kristen it's just there's still so many questions, according to your point, that raises yet another big one. One of the things we continue to talk about is this idea that Reagan National Airport, which we all fly in and out of all of the time, is incredibly congested. What are investigators saying about that piece of their investigation? Could that have been part of the issue here?

And I gotta say that has been an issue for a long time. And people on Capitol Hill, local officials here in D.C. residents have talked about this as being a concern for quite some time. And not just it's not just that we have a major airport here, right?

Literally you can see it from the Pentagon. That's how close it is. But you have a number of military installations in the area with Bowling, Joint Base Bowling and Akasi, which is right on the other side of Tonic river for National Airport, where we are right now here in the Pentagon with multiple helicopter pads. Right up the street from us is Joint Base Meyer Anderson hall, which also has helicopter landing areas.

And then also right within miles of here we have Fort Belvoir where the helicopter flew out of. And then we have Andrews Air Force Base, a major Air Force base. All of this is literally within miles of where we are standing right now, Kristen, because of that. In addition that frankly, we have coast guard, we have MPD, the D.C.

police, they also have aircraft because of that. This is a very the restrictions that congestion in this area lead to extremely specific and tight restrictions about flying here. And what we've been told by army officials today is the pilots and the crew chief on this aircraft were very aware of those restrictions. They know the route, they know the corridor.

It only leads to more questions about how a collision and a tragedy like this could have even occurred. Kristen it absolutely does. And I know people are mourning there inside the Pentagon as well. Courtney qb, thank you so much.

Your great reporting as always. We really appreciate it. Joining me now is Greg F. He's a former senior air safety investigator for the ntsb.

Thank you so much for joining us on this tragic day. We really appreciate it. So Mr. F, you've investigated crashes before.

What is your impression of this collision? And we are trying to work on Mr. Fight's audio. So give us just a moment.

Mr. Having trouble hearing you. So we are going to give you just a moment to try to get that going and then we'll try again to get it fake. All right, let me go back to my question.

What is your first impression from this collision? The first impression I had, Kristen, was the fact that the video does show that both aircraft are at the same altitude. The helicopter itself. I could tell immediately when I looked at that video that the aircraft, the helicopter, was not passing in front of the regional jet, but rather behind it.

You could tell that by looking at the lights and blossoming of the landing lights. The question is, how is it that that aircraft was in that piece of airspace at that altitude? Again, based on what Courtney had just said about the restriction at 200ft, this system has been safe for a very long time. I grew up in the area.

I've flown in that area quite a bit throughout my life. And you know, it is just normal part of Washington, D.C. flying, especially when you have special use airport criteria for commercial pilots going into Washington, national and of course the military running those low level routes, as well as the National Park Service and the police. The question is, what got them off their altitude?

Was it something that they did because of the weather? Was it something that again they were doing because they thought they were somewhere else and started to climb? All of these questions are going to be incumbent upon the NTSB to try and figure it out what got the military aircraft above its restricted altitude. And just to follow up with you on that point, I think a lot of people look at that video which is so difficult to look at, it is so tragic.

And you see the helicopter moving forward and really doesn't change course at all. And a lot of people are wondering how is it possible that the pilot didn't see the plane in front of it? Is that something that happens at night? Is that one of the things that makes flying at night so challenging?

That's a very good question. And yes, if you were to take that same event with the same flight paths and you have it during daylight hours, this accident 98.999% of the time will not happen just because you can see the aircraft. You know, looking out there, you have visual cues at night, it is totally different because especially with the collision angles that the NTSB is going to have to derive, how was the helicopter approaching this fixed wing regional jet? If they're getting a profile view, all you're going to see really are the position lights and in this case probably the green light on the right wingtip Maybe the strobe on the belly of the aircraft, maybe a position light, but those lights being at that elevation over an urban area, can actually blend into the background.

And. And then, of course, there's been a question about were one or both pilots using night vision goggles. That creates a lot of problems, especially in an urban environment where you have a lot of blossoming white light that can provide temporary blindness. Again, was there a misidentification of the airplane that was called by the air traffic controller?

There are a lot of questions to be answered. We saw with the Los Angeles accident when a commuter airline was struck by a landing 737 U.S. air because the pilots thought that the lights from the aircraft were part of the Runway environment. Things do happen.

And that's why it's going to be very incumbent upon the NTSB to be thorough and methodical in developing all of the back story, all of the backs and conditions so that we can understand what may have happened. Just very quickly, Greg, we've been reporting that there was one controller when usually there would have been two staffed. Do you think that could have factored into this horrific tragedy? I think there is going to be an issue with that.

Of course that during peak periods you want the maximum amount of controllers. But in this case, based on the procedures that the FAA has in place, you can combine positions. This isn't the first time that the NTSB has identified that combining positions may have been a cause or contributing factor in an accident. And I think that that's going to be a very good focal point for the board to look at because again, we're in this controller shortage, just like a pilot shortage and even an aviation mechanic shortage.

And with this being a recurrent theme, this is not something that just happened overnight. This has been going on for some little while because of funding and of course, trying to develop and recruit people to take over the retiring controller workforce. Greg fights. We always appreciate your expertise.

Thank you so much for joining us. We really appreciate it. And joining me now. Thank you.

And joining me now is Tennessee Republican Congressman Mark Green. He is the chairman of the House Homeland Security Committee and served as a flight surgeon with the US army in the Middle East. Congressman, thank you so much for joining us on what is just a devastating day, I think, for this entire country. Thanks for having me on.

Prayers for the family. Absolutely. You served as a flight surgeon. You have been on helicopters.

You investigated flight crashes before at this point. And I know this is very preliminary. I know we're just starting to get information. But what is Your sense of what may have gone wrong here.

It's very difficult for me to imagine that at the same elevation, the flight didn't see that aircraft. The only thing that comes to mind for me is possibly target fixation. It's a term used in the military on the aircraft that was taking off. There's a aircraft taking off, and it's very possible the pilots focused on that, saw that they were well behind that aircraft and sort of kept their eyes on that aircraft and didn't see the second one that was coming in on approach.

And that's, that's the, that's how I'm reasoning. This is possible. Even night vision goggles in a city. It's very.

I mean, it would be almost impossible not to see the tail lights. They would, they would light up with nvg. So I think they got target fixation. I also a little concerned about the ABC and of course, the way that the pace of how things, the warnings got to the pilots.

There's still a lot of research to do on that. The UHF frequency the military aircraft lies on, it's a different frequency than what commercial pilots fly on. And we're the ATC talking on the right networks. Those kinds of things are going to have to be carried out.

Yeah. The other thing that has gotten so much attention, and I was, of course, just talking about this with Greg Fife, is the fact that Reagan National Airport is very congested. You have talked about the need for deconfliction. Do you think changes need to be made in terms of how many helicopters are allowed to.

How many of these training flights, quite frankly, are allowed to take place at night at the times that commercial aircraft are flying? I think the training flights are very important because remember or think through this, the Blackhawks down there at Fort Belmore may very well have to respond to some crisis in the capital. So having them capable of flying those routes, very important. Having them trained on that.

We haven't had a problem with this before, and we've been doing this for years. This is. There are probably more radars in this area. And, you know, it's really inconceivable to see if this could happen.

So I will tell you that when you have an investigation like this and all the ones I've ever done, it was always multiple problems that lined up all at the same time to cause the accident. So that's why TSB is so good at what they do. They'll come out with what all lined up and caused this to happen, and we'll make sure it doesn't come again, I do have to ask you about what we heard from President, President Trump today. He seemed to suggest that this could be the result of diversity and equity programs, that basically he wants to strip that.

Do you think first of all that that may have played a role? What do you make of what President Trump said today in that regard? You know, I look to it not only what President Trump said, but, you know, the Washington Post, the New York Times, there have been lots of articles, other news organizations about thousands of qualified people who have applied who are not chosen more qualified people. And there are studies, analysis of the faa, showing that they intentionally picked through this biographical mechanism of hiring people who are less qualified.

And I just asked the American people, who do you want the ATC controls? You want the best person? I ask this often about the military. Who do you want her to go to war with?

The battalion commander? Who is the most lethal, best leader or fit a DEI category? I mean, merit has to matter, especially in some jobs. Brain surgery, pilots, ATCs, things like that.

You can't just pick. You should be the very best person. And it's clear that the FAA did not do that. And yet, Congressman, that is one argument even President Trump acknowledged today.

No, he can't actually draw like direct link. He's not certain of anything. Are you? Yeah.

Are you concerned with getting ahead of the investigation? Do you think that's a problem? I think coming out with this issue is really important. This is a part of something he campaigned on.

President Trump said merit needs to matter and it does need to, to matter, especially in these situations. So having the dialogue is, is completely okay, and it's what he had before this accident happened. So. But saying that that's absolutely the cause here.

Well, the investigation will happen, just like I mentioned earlier. It's multiple things that probably contributed here and NTSB will get to the bottom. And again, I guess my question is, is that a discussion for a different day when there's absolutely nothing, by the president's own admission, linking this horrific tragedy to DEI programs? People are looking to the president for facts, for hard information.

Do you worry that this in any way complicates the job that investigators are trying to do, which is quite frankly to stay focused on the fact of the matter, exactly what happened. I don't think those NTSB examiners are going to, to change their methodology because President Trump is concerned about how DBI is, you know, weakening the military, weakening, you know, all these organizations throughout the government. I don't think they're. It's Just like, you know, positions, they're not going to suddenly choose to not do their job today because of this issue being brought to the fore.

And if this makes the point more clear, President Trump should say it again today. Five times. All right. But again, there is no link has been established by the President's own admission.

Congressman, thank you so much for joining us on a really difficult day. We really appreciate your time. Thank you so much. And join me now is Democratic Congressman from Kansas, Sharice Davids.

She represents the Kansas City metropolitan area. Congresswoman, thank you so much. My condolences to your entire state today. I know that you, along with the rest of the country, is in mourning.

Yeah, thank you so much. And this is such a heartbreaking tragedy. The folks who are, you know, I've been thinking a lot about the folks who are waiting for a text message from their loved one. As we now know, their teammates and everyone in our state, in the state of Kansas is mourning this tragedy and certainly appreciate the condolences.

Well, absolutely. What are you hearing about what may have contributed to this crash at this point? I know you've been very tuned into what investigators have been saying. Yeah, well, I think as, as was just made clear.

I'm sure you all have been hearing this from a number of folks today. The ntsb, the National Transportation Safety Board, has, has the responsibility and the skills, frankly, and experience to get down to the bottom of exactly what happened. You know, I think that the most important thing all of us can do, uh, there's a few things. One is, uh, as, as a member and representative of, of my state, I'm going to be here to help support the families in every way, uh, necessary families and loved ones of, of the, the folks who are on the plane, the folks who are in the helicopter, armed service, active duty military, our first responders, and, um, and everybody who is experiencing this.

I think it's natural for all of us to want to, to know exactly what happened as quickly as possible. The fact of the matter is it's going to take a little while. And there are some preliminary, preliminary reports that folks have, have seen. There's a lot of speculation happening right now.

And the most effective thing we can do as folks who are part of the federal government is one, assure people. Look, you can take a flight, you can travel. The United States has the safest airspace. And a lot of that is because we let the NTSB do, do the work that they do so effectively.

And when the time comes, if there are changes that we need to make the processes to Procedures, whether it's in FAA or Department of Defense, we're going to do that. Congressman, let me have you respond to what we heard from the president. You just heard me talking about this with the congressman as well. The fact that he's pointing fingers at the pilot, the air traffic controllers, the fact that DEA DEI rather he says may have played a role.

What was your reaction to hearing some of that from the president? I well, one I will say as a Kansan it's who is experiencing the heartbreak with so many people in my state, I was, I'm disappointed. Anytime we have whether it's the president, vice president, any federal officials getting out in front of this investigation that needs to happen, you know, the victims and their families all deserve to have to have us be as responsible as possible in the way that we communicate out to folks. The ntsb, the faa, the Department of Defense are conducting an investigation and speculation from from the president or anyone else is, is not helpful and and is is reckless.

Congressman Sharice David, thank you. Again and again our condolences to you and your entire community. We really appreciate you joining us. Thank you.

We do want to turn now to another big story right here in Washington today. Three of the president's most controversial nominees all testified today during a series of combative confirmation hearings included his pick to be Director of National Intelligence, Tulsi Gabbard, his pick to run the FBI, Cash Patel and his pick to run HHS, Robert F. Kennedy Jr. Of all three, the nominee facing the most skepticism among Senate Republicans was Tulsi Gabbard, former congressman who ran for president as a Democrat in 2020 and endorse Trump in 2024.

Her past statements on leaks and intelligence election have put her at odds with intelligence officials and some Senate Republicans including on her past support for NSA whistleblower Edward Snowden, which lawmakers on both sides of the aisle prestar on today. Take a look. Simple yes or no question. Do you still think Edward Snowden was brave?

Mr. Vice Chairman, Edward Snowden broke the law. I do not agree with our support with all of the information and intelligence that he released, nor the way in which he did it. Was Edward Snowden a traitor?

Senator, my heart is with my commitment to our Constitution and our nation's security. Was Edward Snowden a traitor to the United States of America? Senator, I will also repeat my answer. He broke the law.

Is Edward Snowden a traitor to the United States of America? That is not a hard question to answer when the stakes are this high. Senator, as someone who has your answer, yes or no. Is Edward Snowden a traitor to the United States of America?

As someone who has worn uniform in combat, I understand how critical our national security is. Apparently you don't. Gabbard was also questioned about her secret meeting with Syrian dictator Bashar Assad after the US Accused him of using chemical weapons against his own people. A number of topics were covered and discussed.

And to directly answer your question, yes, I asked him tough questions about his own regime's actions, the use of chemical weapons, and the brutal tactics that were being used against his own people. Were you able to extract any concessions from President Assad? No, and I didn't expect to. In complete hindsight, would you.

Would you view this trip as good judgment? Yes, Senator. And I believe that leaders, whether you be in Congress or the President, United States can benefit greatly by going and engaging boots on the ground, learning and listening and meeting directly with people, whether they be. Meanwhile, President Trump's picture.

FBI Director Cash Patel, a staunch Trump loyalist, broke with the president on his parts of January 6th. Defendants convicted of assaulting police officers. Patel was also asked about his own past statement, vowing to carry out the president's agenda of retaliation and retribution. You say this.

When Trump wins in 2024 and is in power in 2025, we can prosecute them, referring to Justice Department officials for an actual RICO statute violation for criminally organizing the United States government to break the law, to break presidential elections. Did you say that? Yes or no? And, Senator, you're reading a partial statement, so I'm unable to fully respond.

Is both Bill Barr on your list of whatever you want to call them, you know, been referred to as an enemy's list. You call them deep state. After serving his country as the Attorney General of the United States. Is he on your list because of a personal vendetta?

Well, it's not whatever we want to call it, Senator. With all due respect, it's not an enemy's list. That is a total mischaracterization to be head of the FBI. And he said that their headquarters should be shut down.

Mr. Chair, parliamentary inquiry. You've got anything you want to say, Mr. Patel, before I go on to Senator Lee?

Simply this. If the best attacks on me are me, false accusations and grotesque miscarriages, the only thing this body is doing is defeating the credibility of the men and women at the FBI. We agree that prosecuting violent crimes should be the principal focus of the FBI. What I'm trying to get to Mr.

Patel is a whole series of very troubling to me and the other statements you've made about instead using it to pursue those who might be viewed as political. And as I told you in your office, I have no interest, no desire, and will not, if confirmed, go backwards. There will be no politicization at the FBI. There will be no retributed actions taken by any FBI should I be confirmed as the FBI director.

Senator Coons also asked Patel if he would be willing to resign if he was asked to do something illegal or unconstitutional. Here's his response there. I asked the same questions of Director Comey and Director Ray. Director Wray, quoting former Attorney General Bell, said, you should be willing to resign if necessary, over conduct if you're pressed to engage in it.

That's unethical, illegal, or unconstitutional. If pressed by the president, would you resign? Senator, my answer is simply, I would never do anything unconstitutional or lawful, and I never have in my 16 years of government service. Would you be willing to resign the post of FBI director if pressed and given no choice but to obey the order or resigned?

Senator, I will always obey the law. Does obeying the law require you to, as Attorney General? Bell said. As FBI Director Ray said, refuse the order or resign.

I'm not familiar with the extent of the law that you're referring to, but my answer is simple. In my 16 years of government service, we will simply follow the law. Joining me now to break it all down quickly is NBC News chief Capitol Hill correspondent Ryan Noble. So, Ryan boy, a lot of fireworks at Tulsi Gabbard's hearing and that moment where she was pressed over and over again on whether Edward Snowden would be considered a traitor.

She didn't answer. How is that playing on Capitol Hill? Could it cost her? I do think there's something that we need to look at.

When we read between the lines of both of these hearings with Tulsi Gardening Patel. The most obvious one is that Gabbard's toughest questions today came from Republicans. It was Todd Young of Indiana, it was Susan Collins of Maine. It was During Moran of Kansas who were asking her very poignant questions about where she stands on many of these big issues of the day, including the pardoning of Edward Snowden and whether or not she thought that he was a traitor.

And so none of these Republicans have come forward and said that they're a no vote. But there was certainly a much higher degree of skepticism in the Gabbard hearing than there was a Patel hearing. Which makes you believe that there are at least a few of these Republican senators who remain skeptical of Tulsi Gabbard I don't see a Democrat on the board that's gonna go yes for her. So if four Republicans break, then she could be in trouble.

Keep in mind, she may have been making out a committee given the fact that there were so many Republicans asking tough questions. So far, none of them have said there are no vote. But you have to wonder if maybe Tulsi Gabbard's nomination could face an uphill battle here. So just to put a fine point on it, Ryan, do you think she's facing a more uphill battle than Cash Patel?

Because he had some rocky moments too. He had rocky moments, but they all came from Democrats. There was not a single tough question asked of him by a Republican today. The Republicans I talked to as they left the hearing seemed very confident that he would win comparation.

They seem to have all their concerns quelled about his enemies list or political retribution. They don't think that's gonna be a problem. They think that he has what it takes to reform the FBI. They think that's a big challenge for him.

They think he's up for the job. Right now, it looks like Patel has smooth sailing to confirmation. Ryan Noble's fitting a lot in in a very short amount of time. Thank you so much.

We are back tomorrow with warning the press now. But the news does continue with Hallie Jackson it right now. I'm Craig Melt. Cheers.

Cheers. Cheers. I've always been a glass half full kind of guy and now I'm talking to some people who look at the world that way too. It's really fascinating.

Folks who share their defining moments, their triumphs, challenges, their stories are fun and quite candid. So I hope you're joining each week. Who knows, you might just come away with your own glass apple Search Glass Apple with Craig Melton From Today on YouTube.