If it's Thursday. High drama in federal court as Hunter Biden prepares to plead guilty in his federal tax case in a surprise move with the trial about to start. Plus, it's official, the rules are set. The mics are off.
The debate is on. And the expectation games begin as Vice President Harris and former President Trump prepare for their first matchup on the big stage just five days away. And new disturbing revelations in the investigation into that deadly high school shooting in Georgia. Yesterday.
They killed two students and two teachers as the teenage suspect is charged with four counts of felony murder. Welcome to PRESS now. I'm Chris Welker in Washington. We begin with breaking news from the courtroom in Los Angeles where Hunter Biden has been sworn in and is preparing to enter a guilty plea of his federal tax trial.
It comes after a wild day of drama at the court as federal prosecutors began the day expecting to begin jury selection in this case. But just moments after the judge explained how jury selection would work, Hunter Biden's lawyers unexpectedly announced that he wanted to change his plea. The plea he initially wanted to enter didn't include an admission of guilt, but the special counsel was adamant that it would not accept that kind of a plea deal. After some back and forth in a late afternoon recess, Hunter Biden returned to the courtroom moments ago to plead guilty.
But without a deal with prosecutors, he is facing three felony and six misdemeanor counts for failing to pay his taxes over several years. All of this comes after a plea deal he struck last year with the government fell apart, which eventually led to his conviction on felony gun charges at trial back in June. Journey now is NBC News correspondent David David Noriega outside the courthouse in Los Angeles. Also with me is Carol Lamb, former U.S.
attorney and an NBC News legal A list. David, take us inside the courtroom. A lot of different moving parts today. What's the very Walk us through what happened.
Yeah, Kristen, a lot of twists and turns. So currently as we speak in this federal courthouse behind me, Hunter Biden is on the stand under oath preparing to offer a guilty plea in this case. Leo Wise, the special prosecutor, is reading indictment into the record, which is necessary part of that process, after which we expect the judge to ask a dividend number of questions about whether he has at the counsel and understands the consequences of the guilty plea and crucially, whether he factually admits guilt in this case. So to back up, as you pointed out this morning, shortly after proceeding started, Hunter Biden's legal team announced his intention to change his speech not to guilty rather, but they were Trying to pull a maneuver that involved this sort of unusual, special kind of guilty, pleasant, alpha clean, which you accept a conviction of eventually a sentence, but you maintain your factual innocence.
You do not admit any wrongdoing. We're now at the court for a hundred what's known as an open clean, meaning a plea with no agreement with the prosecution. Essentially putting his hands in the face, putting his fate in the hands of the judge saying I am guilty. Sentence me as you wish.
To do that, he does need to admit guilt, but we won't know the eyes what he's done until he has explicitly done so on the stand. It has been a dramatic in court, like I said, a lot of twists and turns. We're imminently possibly going to see the end of this case and the potential jurors released from this building. And at that point we will basically be waiting for judge to schedule a sentencing hearing at some point in the future.
It is just incredibly dramatic. David and just you think about how the day started where we are now anticipating this potential guilty plea. Can you just walk us through how prosecutors have reacted to all of this as it's unfolded? David yeah.
So Hunter Ride's legal teams kind of gambit this morning. I'm trying to enter a plea by plea that non abomination of guilt was met with very strenuous opposition from the special prosecutor's office. Leo Wise said several times in the record that Hunter Biden is not innocent. Hunter Biden is guilty.
The Department of Justice wants Hunter Biden to be on the record in court of law as guilty of committing the facts put forth in the indictment. They were also very resistant to Biden's legal team's efforts to sort of rush this plea through the court today. Abby Lowell, Biden's attorney, was trying to convince the judge that the facts were such that the judge could accept and Alfred plea. On the face of it today the government was again strenuously opposed that they were saying that if there was going to be an offered plea they needed at least a day to come up with a substantive response to explain why they were opposed to such a conclusion.
And the judge was receptive to the DOJ's claims here it seemed very unlikely that the judge would accept an alphably plea please today. And that's the point at which we stopped by an agree to take this in and offer what again we expect is likely to be a straightforward guilty plea with an admission of guilt. But like I said, I want to keep caveating this. We won't know that that's what happened until it has actually happened in prison.
And that is the update that we're waiting for right now. Well, keep us posted. David, we're going to come back to you if we get any update from inside that courtroom. Carol, let me go to you.
I mean, David, just mapped out how dramatic the twists and turns, the fact that this day started with discussion of an Alford plea deal to a potential guilty plea deal. What's the strategy at play here? Well, Kristen, now that we know that Hunter Biden, at least we think he's willing to actually enter a real guilty plea to the indictment. I have to conclude that going into the courthouse this morning, his defense team had already obtained authorization from him to have him enter a guilty plea without conditions.
So what this was, what the Alford plea offer was this morning, was basically a Hail Mary. They went in and told the judge he's prepared to enter this Alford plea. And let me emphasize how rare an Alford plea is because it is essentially a guilty plea without admitting you're guilty. It's done only in the rarest of circumstances.
And that's because obviously once you start letting people enter Alford Alford pleas, then everybody wants an Alford plead. Who wants to admit that they're guilty. It was never going to happen with the consent of the prosecutors, which is what is required for an Alford plea. So I believe it was a Hail Mary.
They were hoping that maybe the judge would go for it and put some pressure on the prosecution to allow the defendant to enter an Alfred plea. The court was not biting. Neither was the prosecution. And therefore, after some, after some time for reading again, apparently, and I think David is right to express some caution that we don't know what's going to happen until it actually happens.
Apparently Hunter Biden is willing now to plead to the indictment with no deals with the prosecutor. So he's essentially avoiding a trial but placing himself at the mercy of the court for sentencing. Yeah, Carol, you say that the Alford plea is rare. I think it's safe to say a lot of people were googling what exactly it meant and calling legal experts like yourselves, asking for help to understand exactly what the details of that would entail.
Look, I guess the question just zooming out, taking a step back, as you say, it was really a Hail Mary, essentially. Is this something that prosecutors should have worked out before today, Carolyn? And what does it say? Abby Lowell is a highly experienced prosecutor, highly experienced defense attorney, I should say.
What does it say that this wasn't worked out? Well, we don't know what plea negotiations took place before today, but apparently no successful negotiations actually took place. And when I say plea negotiations, I mean that we anticipate a plea agreement where the government gives up something, maybe agrees to cap the sentence or give up certain elements of the sentence so that he will get a lower sentence. And the defendant agrees to give up something because he's not going to put the prosecution to its pieces.
He's going to actually plead guilty. But an Alfred plea is basically saying, I don't think I'm guilty, but I agree, looking at the fact objectively that I think the prosecution could prove to a jury beyond a reasonable doubt that I was guilty. So even though I don't think I'm guilty, I'm going to accept that and. And go ahead and do an Alford plea.
It's almost never done. I think maybe I've done it once in my career, but. But the reason you do it is because there's some sort of other extenuating circumstance. You know, let's say.
Let's say the defendant has a really good job and would lose their job if they admitted to. To this crime in their own word. But even. Even then, it's extremely rare.
There's usually some sort of outside extenuating circumstance which just doesn't exist here. So that. That was really never going to happen. Abbey Lowell knew that they went and did the Hail Mary, but they were prepared to have him plead guilty by Singh if the Alfred plea did not go through.
Carol, thank you for breaking all of that down for us. David, let me go back to you, if I could quickly just put this in perspective for viewers. How much time could he be facing behind bars if he in fact does strike this plea agreement? Well, the maximum, especially when you consider that he has already been convicted in federal court.
In the case in Delaware where he was convicted of lying in a federal form application to purchase a firearm, he faces several years in prison. It's unlikely that he will get the maximum sentence. But one of the questions now is whether he will serve for purchase sentence at all. One of the reasons behind entering an open plea, as he's doing in court today, is again to essentially ask the judge for mercy.
To put it in sort of layman's terms, he's saying, look, I am agreeing to put my faith in your hands. And hopefully, I imagine his legal team wants that result in more leaning incentive. Also, by the way, Wicksters have a little bit more detail about what happened in the courtroom prior to his taking the stage. There is still some kind of push and pull between Abby Loebines and turning and Leo Wise as best as prosecutor over whether Hunter Biden is going to explicitly admit actual guilt in the alleged crimes laid out in the indictment.
Special prosecutor Leo Wise says, and I'm going to quote from you here, he said, quote, Will Mr. Biden agree that this is the truth? This in reference to what's in the indictment? Because the truth matters, he should have to say that the facts are true.
And in response, Abdul's response is, I know Mr. Wise would like Mr. Biden to say, and in addition, I was really bad person when I did this, but that's not what the law requires. Unclear honestly what the judge, how the judge is going to push this, whether he's going to push it to land in either Lowell's side or Wise aside, there is still some ambiguity there.
Regardless person, I think we can say that this will straightforwardly be a guilty plea, that once this proceedings are done, Leo Wise is still reading this lengthy indictment into the record. Once that's over and once Triben admits on that stand that he is guilty, he will effectively be guilty of federal court of law and we will be willing to sentence, well, at another unprecedented moment given that he is the son of the sitting president. David Noriega. Carolyn, thank you both so much.
I'm asking you both to stand by because David, as you just showed us, this is still a developing story. Really appreciate your reporting and analysis. And we're going to continue to follow this breaking news throughout this hour and bring you any developments as they happen. We do want to turn now, though, to the presidential election as the candidates take their debate preparations for the campaign trail with just five days until they meet for the first time on stage.
And after weeks of back and forth, the rules are officially set and it isn't what the Harris campaign was hoping for. So here's what it's going to look like, folks. The same rules as the first and only debate between Trump and President Biden will be in effect. No audience, no notes and muted microphones on.
Candidates aren't speaking. The Trump campaign pushed for muted mics and the Harris campaign repeatedly lobbied against it as Harris's team looks for ways to use the debate together. Mr. Trump skin ahead of the debate, we saw a familiar strategy from the former president as he trashed the host network during a town hall on Fox News last night while also attacking Vice President Harris.
Look, this is, this is a woman who is dangerous. I don't think too smart, but let's see. But she loses her train of thought a lot. She goes that's why she doesn't want to do interviews now.
Today for President Trump is in New York where he delivered remarks on the economy, while Vice President Harris is in Pittsburgh where she is preparing for the debate. Harris laid out her own economic vision in New Hampshire yesterday, continuing to try to tackle one of her campaign's most vulnerable issues, proposing plans to aid small businesses while also trying to distance herself from President Biden, breaking with him on the issue of taxing investment profits. While we ensure that the wealthy and big corporations pay their fair share, we will tax capital gains at a rate that rewards investment in America's innovators, founders and small businesses. So here's detail.
If you earn a million dollars a year or more, the tax rate on your long term capital gains will be 28 under my plan because we know when the government encourages investment, it leads to broad based economic growth and it creates jobs, which makes our economy stronger. Now that 28 is lower than the 39.6 rate of President Biden's proposed budget, but it is higher than the 20 current maximum rate on long term capital gains. Today, New York, Trump's slamming Harrison's proposal, seizing on her comments about a billionaire minimum tax, a Biden proposal that would tax gains on certain investments before they're ever sold as he laid out his economic efficiency. My plan calls for expanded RR D tax credits, 100 bonus depreciation expensing for new manufacturing investments and a reduction in the corporate tax rate from 21 to 15 solely for companies that make their product in America.
By contrast, Comrade Kamala Harris wants to sacrifice our wealth, kill the economy and drive jobs overseas to punish businesses more. These policies, especially the tax on unrealized capital gains, would decimate the U.S. economy. Join me now from Pittsburgh is NBC News senior White House horse on Kelly O' Donnell and NBC's on Hill here is in New York tracking all things Trump campaign.
Kelly O, let me start with you. It's official. The debate rules are set. They're gonna be the same rules as we saw back in the debate in June.
Talk to me about what your sources are telling you inside the Harris campaign. How are they reacting to all of this? Well, they are accepting that they are where they are. They had hoped to have some changes in the rules to allow for microphones to be hot or open.
Working for both candidates throughout the debate and not just when a candidate has received a designated question. That was the plan under Joe Biden. That was his preference, his team's preference now with a new candidate in Kamala Harris with a different style, with a prosecutorial background that she would identify. She and her team had wanted to have the mice open the whole time.
They have agreed to go forward because the Trump people would move off of that already agreed to list of items which includes things like standing at lecterness, no notes or props, things that people in the audience will recognize for having watched past events. This is a chance for them to have a face off on Tuesday. We are here in Pittsburgh because she's actually doing her prep work with her senior team, going over how she wants to approach different issues, different planned exchanges in terms of anticipating what they think Donald Trump might say with her and to help her to be ready for that and choosing to do so in Pittsburgh because this is a big market in a very key battle round state of pen. So she'll get plenty of local attention here in local papers, local radio, local television and the community being aware that she's choosing to spend multiple days here preparing matters to debate itself in Philadelphia.
But they are agreeing to go forward even though they hope for some changes. Now, they do tell me that they expect that if there is a back and forth between the candidates, and we've certainly seen that style with Donald Trump in past debates, that they believe that there's an expectation that the host network would open up the microphone so the public could see it. That is something that the Harris campaign maintains is an expectation they have. It was not explicitly written in the rules put out by the host network.
So they're getting going here. They're doing sort of the rounding third heading home toward her first major contest on the presidential debate stage. Of course, four years ago she debated Mike Pence and she certainly debated in Democratic primary debates in the 2020 season. Kristen Kel, you know, it's so interesting because one of the big questions looming over her campaign is what are the differences between her and President Biden?
I'm talking to Ian Sam's with her campaign about this very question momentarily. But let me put this to you in terms of this new economic policy that's been rolled out. Where are the differences with President Biden, Kelly? Well, in most ways and in big sweeping of views, she and the president are very much together.
Where she is trying to make a point is to take the issue that is really top of mind across the electorate, the economy, how people feel about their ability to spend money comfortably or not, and also what what is at the root of that job and so trying to incentivize business development is something that also appeals to more center right voters. Those could be independent voters, those could be Republicans who do not want to vote for Donald Trump. The campaign is clearly making a very direct play for them and wanting to appeal a bit more centrist. When you consider some of her other positions.
Formerly she had supported ending fracking, those kinds of things, for support for some of the environmental things. An economic plan that's a little bit to the right of President Biden is still centrist. And that's something they think can be an advantage for her if she can articulate it and convince people it would be good for jobs and for the economy. All right.
We know that there's still a lot of attention on that focus. Kelly o', Donnell, thank you so much. I appreciate that. Let me turn to you now.
Let me ask you a similar question about Trump's economic policy. He pitched his plans today. Of course, he criticized Vice President Harris. We still don't have a whole lot of detail, though, on his policies.
How much can he tell us about what he rolled out today? Right about eight blocks from 30 Rock. He went and met with CEOs, investors, headphone managers, very prominent business folks in the New York community. This was the economic club of New York here.
And for the better part of an hour, he talked about economic tangential issues, talked about mig. And when it comes to actual specifics of what his economic policy is, a lot of it is based on rescinding what the Biden Harris administration effectively implemented over the last four years. Part of his new call today was to rescind funds that had been allocated so far under the Inflation Reduction Act. Of course, this was a piece of legislation passed by Congress.
It's not clear exactly how he would seek to stop funding from going to certain programs. He called today for the government incentives for clean electric vehicles to be pulled back. He called for the reversal of clean carbon emission standards that was implemented under the Biden Harris administration. He has called for tariffs of 10 to 20%.
Today he suggests that number may actually be higher than he has publicly suggested previously. That would be of all imported goods. And of course, there's one other headline from him today, and that was noting that he would intend to put Elon Musk, of course, his friend and the CEO of Tesla and X, at the helm of a commission to oversee what would be an effort to make the federal government more efficient and less financially bloated in his words. And of course, part of that is looking for details which we don't have at this point in time.
But I would want to note as part of this, two weeks before the 2020 election gets signed an executive order that would effectively allow the federal government to transition thousands of federal career civil workers their jobs to become politically appointed jobs. Of course, Joe Biden won the White House and he recited that on day one executive order. But there are a lot of questions still exactly to some of the details that Donald Trump was putting out there to be figured out. Von Hillier, thank you so much for breaking it all down.
Really appreciate it. Coming up next, breaking with Biden, I'll talk to a top official inside the Harris campaign about how the vice president plans to differentiate herself from the current president and how she's preparing for that all important debate. Don't go anywhere. You're watching the PRESS now.
Welcome back. Joining me now is Ian Sam, senior national spokesman for the Harris Walls campaign and a former White House staffer. Ian, thanks so much for being with me this afternoon. I really appreciate it.
Thanks. We are going to talk policy, of course, but I have to start with Tuesday's all important debate. We have learned now that the rules are set, the microphones will be turned off when the other person is speaking. We know that that's not what you guys were pushing for.
So tell me what your reaction is today. Yeah, it's a little disappointing. I think the vice president really felt strongly about having microphones unmuted so that the American people could see a real debate with real exchanges between the two candidates back and forth. I think you think about the sort of viral moments of her that people remember from her time in the Senate where Trump appointees were for the Judiciary Committee, the way she's incisive in her questioning, asking them to draw the truth and the facts about what they are talking about.
You know, having that taken away from her in this debate is a challenge. And I think we wish that the Trump campaign had understood that these are two different candidates than they were a few months ago and that it was very clear that the Trump campaign wanted to keep a muzzle on their candidates so they could try to instill some discipline. I think they were worried about what might happen in those exchanges with the vice president. And we're trying to sort of keep him under control.
And I think, you know, look to their point. It's probably good for them. It's probably helpful. It's going to help Donald Trump stay under control and calmer and more disciplined and restrained.
In June, for example, in debate, he lied over and over again, but maybe he seemed a little bit more normal because he couldn't be interrupting, interjecting all the time. And so, you know, look, this is a, this is a guy who's a showman. I think he knows how to perform in debates like this. I think he knows how to get ready for the big lights on tv.
And he's a very experienced debater at this point. This is his seventh general election presidential debate, which is probably the most of anybody in history. And, you know, I think that we're looking to see that they're probably ready to have him seem a little bit more restrained and normal for the country. Ian, I hear you trying to lower expectations.
Is there a reason you're doing that? You know, that's interesting. It's like lowering expectations question. I mean, Donald Trump is in Sean Hannity's town hall in Pennsylvania attacking abc, claiming conspiracy theories about we're gonna get the questions ahead of time.
And, you know, people aren't really talking about that as Donald Trump lowering expectations. Well, to be fair, we are talking about that too. But since I'm interviewing you, I just want to put the question, why are you lowering expectations? I'm just telling the truth.
I think it's a little bit dispiriting that the mute button is gonna be on for the debate and prevent the candidates from being able to go back and forth. But look, regardless of that, the Vice President is gonna come to the debate and you talk about the choice in the election, the choice between his economic vision and her economic vision, trickle down and big corporations and big billionaires getting tax bets, help for small business and working people. She's gonna paint the choice of the vision. She's gonna talk about how we can turn the page on Donald Trump and move into the future with a new way forward for the country.
Those are things she's gonna be ready to talk about. She's excited. I think it's just a matter of as we talk about the rules, talking about some of the unfortunate decisions, I think that were made to continue pushing for the microphones by the Trump campaign. Let me ask you now about some policy.
Obviously, the Vice President has been rolling out the details of her economic policy. She signaled that she supports part of President Biden's proposed budget that contains new tax policy. So question for you. This is a yes or no question.
Does that include his billionaires minimum tax that would effectively tax unrealized capital gains for Americans with wealth above $100 million? Yeah. Vice President actually talked about this yesterday. I think that she sees the proposal she put forward on capital gains and investment and Entrepreneurship and startups in this country as appropriate in balance with the suite of proposals that she's also for, which includes a billionaire minimum tax, which includes quadrupling taxes on stock buybacks, which includes a higher corporate tax rate.
We saw Trump today talk about this. Yeah, she said that she scored the minimum taxes and stressed that again yesterday. And I think again, the reason I put all these things together is I think she rejects the false choice that we can either be for using the tax code to foster investment and growth in our startup and entrepreneur community and taking on those at the very top and the very wealthy. She thinks that we can do both.
And she thinks that some of the proposals that we've seen, including President Biden's budget blueprint, at 39.6% for those long term capital, that's a little bit too high for how she sees how we can incentivize investing in startups and entrepreneurs. But when it comes to things like the billionaire minimum tax, you know, the raising the corporate tax rate, the stock buyback, tripling or quadrupling, excuse me, the rate on those, that's a suite of really strong proposals that targets us at the very top to ensure that we create more revenue to pay for really important priorities for the middle class. You know, you take me to my next question because you're talking about entrepreneurs and startups. And Congressman Khanna actually pushed back on the idea saying exactly that, that this is going to stifle startups that could hurt entrepreneurs.
How do you counter that? And quite frankly, that opposition coming from within your own party. One of her top surrogates saying that. Well, I was watching Congressman Khanna actually yesterday talk about her proposal that she announced in New Hampshire about the lower capital gains rate than what President Biden has proposed.
And he was saying that he thinks this makes sense, that this is a good suite of proposals and a smart plan to help small businesses and increase entrepreneurship and startups in this country. And so, you know, I think that every Democrat and every Republican are going to agree on everything. But I think at the end of the day, Congressman Kahn, many other Democrats have spoken out to say Vice President Harris has been put a real plan helps small businesses and working people, which is such a contrast to what we're seeing from President Trump. And you guys talked about this with Von Vi on his announcements at the New York Economic Club where he's pushing even more tax cuts for corporations, even more tax cuts for those at the top.
So it's just a really stark difference between the two. Let me ask you Broadly speaking, because she has put out a number of proposals, including a ban on price gouging, as you just laid out a smaller increase in the capital gains tax. But how should people think about a Harris administration as compared to a Biden administration? Where will the big differences be?
Will there be any big differences, Ian? Well, you're starting to see some of these areas where they disagree a little bit on how to get the policies around the edges. Around the edges. I think at the end of the day, they're very different candidates.
I think the country and voters view them as different people. I think that people can see that President Biden and Vice President Harris aren't the same person. And I think that when Vice President Harris talks about her values and priorities, when you think about something like the price gathering proposal, this is someone who spent 15 years, 20 years, years of their career as a prosecutor taking on special interests, big powerful interests on behalf of regular people who've been wronged by them. And so you can think about her policy proposals in terms of understanding that there are really big, powerful interests out there who are screwing over regular people.
And we'd actually use our policy programs to take them on in order to give relief to some people. That's something I think we haven't talked a ton about over the last four years. But again, I think there's places that she can continue to roll out ideas and talk about the American people. Maybe a little bit of a distinction from President Biden.
And I think the other thing is putting forward ideas that grow on and expand upon progress that we've made under President Biden. I think there's a little bit of a shorthanding that there's a massive break or something. No, I think there are places where they disagree. They're different candidates.
But at the end of the day, there have been amazing successes on this administration. And what she's putting forward, ideas how to build on that and talk to the American people about her own values and her own vision for doing that is unique to hers. Canada, I want to ask you about price gouging because a lot of questions about how practically that would play out. For example, would the government set a maximum price on food and groceries?
No, I think that the Republicans now suddenly. Let's talk about this for a second. Donald Trump and Republicans have been attacking her for somehow this is price controls, which it isn't. Economists and Canon said it absolutely isn't.
But what's interesting about this price gouging proposal is 40 states already have price gouging proposals on the books. There's just not a federal law. And in fact, there's been bipartisan legislation, Republicans and Democrats in Congress who have put forward suggestions that we take on corporate price gouging at the federal level. And so it's interesting that suddenly ideas that Republicans used to support are being attacked by Republicans once the Democratic nominee for president, Kamala Harris, proposes them.
And so I think that there's some, there's some game playing happening here by those on the right when what the vice president's talking about is easing the burden on people when corporations are charging too much than they should be on products in moments of vulnerability. I think we've seen this. You actually have seen a lot of conversation in the press and economic news over the last year or two about shrinkflation, for example, selling a smaller product for the same price as a larger product used to be. Well, those are the kind of corporate behavior that she's talking about wanting to take on in order to bring down prices for the American people.
Ian, before I let you go, I do have to ask you about the developing news right now. Hunter Biden in court on the tax related charges that he is facing. We anticipate he's going to enter a plea deal. That has not happened yet, though.
That is our reporting, that's our anticipation. As president, would Vice president, now Vice President Harris, pardon him or is that off the table? Well, you've heard President Biden make a comment that that wouldn't happen. I wouldn't imagine that changing with Vice President Harris.
Obviously, obviously, you know, the case is still ongoing and we want to be really careful and respectful of the court process. I don't think that this should be politicized from the Harris campaign. President Biden has taken it off the table. Does the vice president take it off the table?
Well, I just answer is I think that she's not planning to pardon anyone. Again, there's no, I think it's important to understand there's no sentence or anything like that happening right now. And so, you know, I leave this question to the White House and President Biden, obviously to Hunter Biden and his personal team. All right, Ian Sands, thank you so much for joining us.
We really appreciate it. Appreciate, appreciate your time, Ian. And speaking of the debate, you can watch Vice President Harrison, former President Trump face off in their first debate hosted by ABC News and streaming live right here on NBC News. Now full coverage starts at 8pm Eastern this Tuesday.
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Welcome back. Moments ago, President Biden spoke publicly for the first time about yesterday's deadly shooting at Georgia High School. Here's what he said at the start of his remarks in Wisconsin for an event focused on infrastructure. As a nation, we cannot continue to accept the carnage of gun violence.
We need more thought, more than thoughts and prayers. Some of my Republican friends in Congress who just finally have to say, enough is enough. We have to do something together. Let's ban assault weapons.
There are too many people who are able to access guns that should be able to. So let's require safe storage of firearms. I know I have mine locked up, but how could you have an assault rifle? Rifle a weapon in a house not locked up and knowing your kid knows where it is.
Gotta hold parents accountable to let their child have access these guns. Let's enact universal background checks and then immunity for gun manufacturers. Authorities just released this booking photo of the 14 year old suspect in yesterday's shooting, just hours after he was charged with four counts of felony murder. Authorities say the Suspect opened fire was an arc weapon inside Apalachee High School, killing two students and two teachers and injuring nine other people.
Senior law enforcement officials briefed on the investigation say the suspect had shown interest in prior mass shootings, including the 2018 shooting at a high school in Parkland, Florida. Local authorities also say they interviewed the suspect and his father in May of last year after the FBI received a tip about a potential threat to shoot up a school. The sheriff in Barrow County, Georgia, told NBC News about that investigation law. Again, I believe, I feel, I feel confident that the FBI, the system worked.
They notified local authorities. Local authorities went to the house, interviewed him, interviewed his father. They did a report. They did what they were supposed to do and found that there was no probable cause.
I mean, regardless of the situation, all of us have civil rights. He didn't commit a crime. He made a comment. It was unfounded at the time.
And so can anything be preventable? I mean, I don't know. It's hard to say. NBC News correspondent Jesse Kirsch joins me now from Winder, Georgia.
Jesse, thank you for joining me. I know the investigators are still trying to piece together what happened. Talk about the latest in the investigation and what we know about the suspect. Yeah.
So, Kristen, as you were just hearing from the sheriff, sheriff moments ago, we now know that this suspect was looked into over a year ago. According to an incident report that we've been able to review. The suspect apparently told the suspect from this incident apparently told authorities more than a year ago, he was 13 years old, that he had never threatened to cause violence at school, would never threaten to cause violence at a school. And also suggested that his Discord account, which is frequently used for gamers and communicating online, that he suggested that his account may have been hacked as well.
So he pushed back on those claims. As the sheriff said, there was nothing that led to an arrest at the time. And furthermore, as our college town winters pointed out, there's no red flag law here in Georgia. So authorities really had only so much they were able to do in terms of trying to get him away from firearms in his home.
According to the citizen report, the suspect's father said that there were guns in the home, but that the boy did not have unfettered access to it. Fast forward to yesterday. And Colt Gray, who according to authorities was new to the school district on his second day in this school, is accused of having shot and killed two classmates, killed two teachers in the school as well, and injuring nine more people. We are told that those nine individuals who were injured by gunfire are expected to survive from their wounds.
The memorials continue to grow. Here we see I have seen people bringing flowers to this school throughout the day. Classes have been called off for the rest of the week here. And this suspect, who excuse the carrying out this rampage, is now facing four counts of felony murder.
And more charges were told are expected after this rampage involved in AR style weapon. Of course, the question remains out there, Kristen, among so many others, how does that kind of weapon, weapon get into a school? And this says the school year is getting under white president. It's just so many devastating details.
Jesse Kirsch, thank you for being there for us. Thank you for your reporting. I know it is just tough. That community's still in shock and demanding.
We really appreciate it. Coming up after the break, former Republican congresswoman and outspoken Trump critic reveals she's voting for Harris this November. We'll delve into that and tell you who it is. You're watching the press now.
As a conservative, as someone who believes in and cares about the Constitution, I have thought deeply about this. And because of the danger that Donald Trump poses, not only am I not voting for Donald Trump, but I will be voting for Kamala Harris. While the backup was former Wyoming Republican Congressman Liz Cheney announced her support for Kamala Harris last night at Duke University. The former vice chair of the January 6 committee and former chair of the House Republican Conference, Cheney isn't the first big name Republican to come out against Trump, but she is one of the first to say she will vote for Harris.
Joining me now on Sennis Crystal is the founder of the so what newsletter, Democratic strategist Juanita Tolliver. She's also known as political analyst and Republican strategist Lance Trover. Thanks to all of you for being here. Chris, kick us off the significance of this announcement, not altogether a surprise, but as I said, to hear her say she's going to vote for Harris, I mean, okay, let me first answer your question, which is I don't think there's a huge amount of significance.
I don't think anybody does. I just don't think. I don't think there was a world out there where we were like, who's Cheney for charge? Which you're right, that she's for Harris is something.
But I will say it reminded me when I heard it last night, again, not super surprising, but when I heard it, I thought, holy cow. Like, number one, I thought I'm old. Number two, I thought 15 years ago, if you said Lynn Cheney, it doesn't matter who it is, but Lynn Cheney was going towards the Democratic nominee for president. I would have fallen over because Liz Cheney, I know she's sort of a hero among Democrats at this point, but Liz Cheney, I would remind people, go look at her voting record on anything not tied to Donald Trump.
She is. I mean, she's what we used to call conservative. So it just reminded me how much things have changed, even in the last decade. That was my big takeaway.
It's a great point, Lance. I mean, and that was so on display at the convention that this is Donald Trump's party now. The Bushes and the Cheneys, the Romneys, they were nowhere to be found. Yeah, you took all my lines.
I told Chris I had to go first. It is Donald Trump's party. I mean, there's no question about that. I obviously agree with.
This is not a surprise to anybody. We're joking about it off camera. But if you look at the polls, I mean, it's Donald Trump's party, but he's also had a real shot at winning this race. Right.
If you look at the polls, he's seen the polls that came out this week show him, I mean, 47. 47 in Pennsylvania. He's doing really well out there right now. And so these types of things I don't think are gonna matter, certainly not to Republicans.
I'm not sure what really matters when voters. At the end of the day. Do you agree, Juanita? What do you think?
I mean, I'm always gonna say, sure, come on in the water for the next president to be the next president of this country. So I'm not gonna slam it. But I do agree that Liz Cheney isn't at the top of my list. I don't think a lot of Democrats view her as someone who's doing anything different from what she has done for the past year.
Do you think that this space should be campaigning for Vice President Harris? What can we expect to see? What do you mean? Maybe Do I see official event with her and Adam King, singer?
Sure. To the right audience, to the right state. Definitely not on stage with the vice president, though. Here's how Jan is responding.
Let me play this and get everyone's reaction on the other side. This is a person whose entire career has been about sending other people's children off to fight and die for her military conflicts and her ridiculous idea that somehow we're gonna turn Afghanistan, a country that doesn't even have running water in a lot of places, into a thriving liberal democracy. And for that, Liz Cheney was willing to kill thousands of your children. Lance what do you make of that?
I mean, it's a new day and a new age here. And the party. I don't think there's really what else to say. I mean, in that response, actually, if you think about it, I mean, the Republican Party has become an anti war party, an anti interventionist party.
So I'm actually not surprised to hear some of what he's saying out there in terms of drawing the contrast. It is. Look, I mean, I just, I don't want to be the old guy on the panel, but I just, I, I do. My kids say I look younger than I am.
You do. But it's not just the blue glove. Thank you. Not just.
The thing that I just keep coming back to is like, it is stunning. That's the vice presidential nominee for the Republican Party. Who just said that. Basically, Dick Cheney's vision of the Republican Party, which was not a hundred years ago.
All the nine people. Dick Cheney was vice president since 2008. Like, it is stunning, the change in the reversal. I just think we should bookmark it.
I don't think it makes a huge difference because we kind of know the deal, but it is in the evolutions of the two parties. I did not see this one coming. Yeah, no, it absolutely is a changing of the guard. There is no doubt about that.
And this does come. We're talking about the polls, Lance. And you know, David plus said something one of the so interesting. He was quoted as saying this is a moment where he believes Vice President Harris, if you look at the polls, they're running neck and neck.
They've tried to cast themselves as the underdogs. But he says, look, it's not just that there's momentum against voting for Trump, that there's momentum for voting for Harris. He said that's where the magic comes in. Do you think Democrats are doing enough to tap into that magic right now?
Absolutely. They raised 300 million in August alone. We've seen millions of new voters registering, young people, women especially. And those same people are killing off from Donald Trump.
I think the biggest change in pulling I've seen since the convention was white women shifting away from Trump by about 11 points. And so when I, when I think about that in the context of Democrats leveraging this opportunity, yes, they are doing that work and translating it numbers into dollars, but activations on the ground, because that is what's going to turn out. Turnaround's going to just decide this race, especially with these statistical ties and polls. And they're trying, of course, they're rolling out A new ad campaign.
I want to play a little bit and get everyone's response action on the other side. Project 2025 strip away our voting rights protections and it eliminates Department of Education. It will also require states to monitor women's pregnancies. It bans abortion and liberal way health coverage for millions.
Kamala Harris will stand up to Trump and his Mandalore's dangerous planes control our lives because Trump is out for himself while Kamala Harris is for the people. Chris, you know, it's interesting if you look at the polls, a lot of voters actually know what Project 2025 is. I'm sure surprised to be honest. It's a very conservative, we should say blueprint.
Donald Trump has said, look, I have nothing to do with that. But of course, a lot of folks who wrote it are former advisors to Trump. What how much does an ad like that resonate when you make that? Let me say about Project 2025 first, it is the single dumbest thing if you want Donald Trump to get elected.
Okay. If your goal is to get down to 11, the stupidest thing you could possibly do is like why don't we put down in minute detail what are we saying the Interior Department. No one is your department right now. Right.
But like when you do that, you allow ads like that. I mean that's why Kamala Harris, look, she's not a me unpopular but I totally get why. Because as soon as you say I'm for this means you're against this and you're only going to attack you. That document is an absolute gold mine.
If you are Kamala Harris campaign does it. It's great for the base, the Democratic base. We actually fired up by like that. We always talk about this like will it matter to somebody?
Man, I wish I knew, honestly, because I just. It's so hard to know. That's why I think what's coming Tuesday night is going to be so critical in this election because there's what, 15% run deciding in the polls at this week? I mean those folks are going to be watching.
That's why. Because everybody knows Donald Trump. That is not the question is who is Kamala Harris? What does she stand for?
And that's why I think a lot of people are going to be too many. And how does she stand up to Donald Trump face to face? Remember, they have never been in close proximity. This will likely be their very first time meeting each other in person.
Is a her posture on the stage at night going to toe with him even with muted mics. I'm sure there's gonna be something shouted across the stage at her that she will be able to respond to. It is going to be a fascinating night for so many reasons. We saw the importance of the debate back in June.
Guys, thank you very much. Fantastic conversation, really appreciate it. We wanna turn now to the ballot for the control of the Senate which could go through the state of Montana. A new AARP poll shows former President Trump with a 15 point lead over Vice President Harris and unlikely voters.
But the Senate race is much tighter. Republican Tim she holds a six point lead over incumbent Democrat John Tester was in the pulse margin of error. CNBC's Emily Wilkins is on the ground in Missoula and filed this support. Kristen Housing prices are an issue nationwide, but it is a particularly big problem here in Montana.
On the demand side, you see a lot of folks move into the state, of course, for some of these gorgeous views that you see here. But it's driven up housing prices. And then on the supply side, the state actually has a labor shortage and that has led to homes being more expensive as well. The national association of Realtors said that Montana is the least affordable state for homeowners because of these two reasons.
And here in Missoula, the average housing price of $568,000. It might not sound that much if you live in New York or Washington, D.C. but if you're born and raised in Montana or you've been here for a while, wages have not kept pace with the skyrocketing housing prices. I spoke with DJ Smith, he's the president of the Montana association of Realtors.
Listen to how he describes the issue. People in, you know, Colorado, California, they would sell their homes for over a million dollars and have a lot of equity to purchase here in Montana. And so we've seen that. And that's led to 30% of our homes, a record number, 30% of our homes last year being bought with cash.
Housing affordability has become a huge issue in Montana. Senate race that could ultimately determine which party controls the chamber next year. Democratic Senator John Tester. He's a third generation Montana and he faces one of the most difficult reelections of any incumbent we see on the campaign trail.
He's been talking a lot about out of staters moving into Montana, what it means to be a real Montanan. But he's also authored a number of policy proposals and this includes federal grants to help with middle and low income housing, also to repair homes here in Montana. Plus he has talked about tax credit that would go to developers if they sell property to groups of Montana residents who are trying to keep costs low. Now Tester's Republican opponent, Tim Sheehy, he's talked a lot about inflation, blaming that on Biden and Tester's policies that he has passed in Washington, D.C.
but in recent debate, he also began talking a lot about the needs for more tradespeople. So these are builders, your plumbers, your electricians, your H Vac specialists. Folks are in short supply down here in Montana and that if they had more of them, you could have more competitive and hopefully lower pricing. I spoke with builder Andrew Wiegand who told me that part of the reason that housing prices are so high is that it's difficult for him to find subcontractors here in the state.
With the labor shortage, if you have a pool of three or four subcontractors to use and not 30 or 40, you're going to have not as competitive of market as you do in other areas. Destination the race here in Montana is currently considered a toss up. A poll from the AARP out today does show Sheikhy with an eight point lead, but that is within the polls of margin of error. Will certainly be a very close race from now until November, Kristen and our thanks to Emily Wilkins for that great report.
We'll watch that race very closely. I'm back tomorrow with Morning Depressed Now. And as we mentioned earlier, tune in Tuesday night, 8pm Eastern for special coverage of the hairstyle debate hosted by ABC News. You can stream it live right here on NBC News.
Now the news continues with Hallie Jackson right now. He was a young Marine. She didn't care about convention. They made a life together.
Then one night the Marine died. And then the death investigation took a wild, unexpected, expected and utterly bizarre turn. I'm Josh Magowitz and this is Trace of Suspicion, an all new podcast from dateline. Listen to all episodes of Trace of Suspicion now wherever you get your podcasts.