Hello everyone and welcome to a new episode of the Nerdy of North Podcasts, the Nerdy Podcasts hosted by Two Northern Nerds and one before Sam. And I'm the other host Paul. And today there's no top five, there's no list, there's no anxiety, there's no pressure. Yeah, I think after the last episode, yeah, so the bit too stressful trying to be something I was guilty of when I wasn't really guilty, I was aim-taught with friends after 10, yeah, I was crazy, I was talking to my folks.
I ain't scared. This week we're doing a review of Black Widow. Because it came out, eventually, and now I'm going to do our thoughts on Black Widow. So just before we get into the review, I just want to say it, that it's just about to want to say it, but I want to tell you, Black Widow scored 80% on run-tomarros, which is fair, and it was directed by Kate Shulland and Swingplay was done by Eric Pearson.
So directed by your woman. This is going to probably show how my feelings towards this film go is I'm surprised by that call. Very surprised, yes. Okay, so we'll get this out the way within, because this will help where the conversation goes to, out of five, what are you scoring it?
Two. Wow, oh my god, I'm going to go four. Yeah, I put on the same level as I am on three even though Dark Worlds has started. I had so much expectation for the film, like say I love the characters, like Scarlett Johansson's never been poor as Natasha, and like she's just been on instagram a lot of the things, and like she's even in Finney War and Endgame, she was one of the standout performers in that, but it didn't, I probably would have found nothing sound really weird, but I would have probably liked the film more if it came out after Civil War, because...
Yeah, because I followed directly on from, so either the timeline is literally straight after Civil War when Natasha, which was the choreography of her course, and Ross is on the hunt for her. I actually wrote in my notes that I felt, and I actually enjoyed the film, but not for the reasons that I probably should have. I thought Natasha was almost a secondary character. She wasn't, I don't think it was her film.
Yeah. I really, I think she was secondary because there was more people that stood out over her as she was in the case, and I thought David Harbert was from No No, thanks to the Red Guardian. I thought, I mean, I think that was the tip that you said, and that was mentioned June, that's going to lead to quite a few interesting things, and always well, I'd say it was good to discuss Black Widow, but after this as well, when it just was Loki. So I think again, without just a few watching this as well, there's going to be a folk turn of spoilers, so I do apologise.
Yeah, that's pretty good. When you say you're doing a Black Widow review, your brain should go as an listener as well, because we are going to go into it. But I would say four out of five because the, I thought there was some absolute standout moments, but not from her, which was pretty disappointing. I couldn't get invested in it because I know her fate.
Yeah. I couldn't, it's the same with, I'd say with other, I know you, mean you have different views on, say, Captain America First Avenger. I couldn't get to it invested because you know what the outcome is going to be, you know, like there's no danger because she's in future films after this, with a bit of break, well, that's what took us out of the film a little bit more than, obviously, because I was wanting a little bit more from it. Yeah, no.
I get that. I think with Captain America, as the first event of the reason why I like it so much, and I know you know that Cap gets from us and you know that he comes back, but you have to, you don't have to know who he is in order to understand the struggle when he comes out. And I like the fact that we got to see that side of it, but the one worry with Natasha's film was that we're going to find a way to bring her back. And I've been watching a lot of videos this morning just to try and like, get into the thought to like start thinking things.
Because I do like, I watched it on Tuesday, but I've watched so many things since then, like my brain, and like, so I have to go over some things. And I was, I was worried that we're going to find a way to bring her back, which was totally ruined for all of us and taken away from us what we felt at the end of end game. And the right, the director said there was going to be the end credit scene, it wasn't going to be what it was. So the end credit scene, you see Yelena want to, the Tasha's grave, and they have this kind of colon, like a whistle that the dude of each of those trying to make, I think that they're there.
And she does the whistle and kind of waits to see if she, you know, if it comes back. And apparently the director said she was going to put it in. And that was, I feel like finished. And you know what I mean?
That would have been out of, yeah. I would have been right now, I mean, that is in the Disney with that, but I can understand why they don't want it to go out because next year's money, like, and Disney and Marvel are in the money making business. But as I said, stand up performers, like David, David, I can say David Harvard from the Stranger Things as well. I don't think I've ever seen him other than Hellboy, where he wasn't part of Hellboy, but the film was part where he's been, he was actually one of the stand out things, like even Racco Weiss as well, absolutely outstanding.
Probably your answer was a bit more emotional than we've seen in other Marvel films, which was a good thing. Oh, definitely. It fixed because it was, you know, it's all about a family with Natasha. There's two things that's going on in her head, her family, and her ledger, her red ledger and this.
And that's like, so with the C, her family, that kind of like will always bring in a more, well, her family will always bring with the emotional about what we're going on to David Harvard, Alexei, I can't see his son, you know, so I'm using a red card. Wow. Like, oh, wow. That's a prison scene where he's writing about fighting Captain America.
That was just brilliant. Pushing on that, though, because that's an element I think they're going to do a call back to, because you mentioned that Ron does Cap, like, do Natasha, does he talk about us? So we don't know what Captain America's been up to or happens when he went back in time. So and he's been around.
So clearly it has. So it's not going to be a call back to what good old Steve's been, because I know there's been talk of Chris Evans come back into the model world, secretly, I'm not so secretly. So are we going to say like an 80s cap versus red guardian, which would be quite interesting? And what is that?
Or is it because of, like, say, what we're going to discuss later with Loki and timeline splits and multiverses and stuff like that? Has that got an element to play in it as well? Because I know this was meant to come out a lot longer before then. So things, like I've changed, we don't know what rewrites or what ratios was put into to nest with us.
But that was quite interesting to you. Because as you said, the place of prison saying I thought he was just talking shit. And then he got called over talking shit. But when he thought, Natasha, at the Ron and said, has he mentioned this?
I was like, right. Yeah, there's something there. Because if he was lying, he would have just said like, you know what I mean? He wouldn't have took that lie to someone who actually knows him.
So I thought exactly the same thing. I just thought he's delivery the way that he was. I was just, I was just, I was just a man. But you know what he said before Captain America, could it not have just been another soldier?
We now know from Papua Little from Constantine. But she was motherly as well. And mesmerizing. She was so interested.
Like, I wanted to hear more from her. I want to say, because she is, I'm not saying the original, but she is also a Black Widow. And I just want to say, come on, there's so many stories. And you could get from her.
And she's not even like, when I looked at the cast list, she's right the way down the bottom. Yeah. Because she isn't really in it that much. No, but I was a bit disappointed.
But her and Natasha's relationship was so talent, like, even that time in the barn. I know, like, we're saving huge chunks of the film. But that time in the barn was quite, like, quite, and this is from someone that didn't like the film as well. So I do appreciate that there is elements in it.
Like, even them too, the stand out to me was Florence Pugh as Yelena. Her accent as well, because I know we're going to go under this, there was some dodgy fucking accents in this film. But her accent, the only thing was good. But the only thing I did confuse is because when she was a young kid in America, she didn't have a written accent.
She was quite like, say, American swan. So I don't know how the Russian accent, Kenan, is strong. So did Alexi, so did Melina as well. They all had an American accent.
I've been like this. They just framed them that way. But she didn't know she was an American? That's true.
That's true. And we don't know what the Red Room does to them. True. That's the thing.
And getting to see the Red Room was fascinating. Who, but Yelena, I just asked her, I'm the miniature, she came on screen. And we could see what she could do. I was like, we need to see more of this girl.
She knew. And we know who Loh was going to see more of that. I was in the final credit scene. But she was just absolutely astounded.
She taught everything she was in with Scarlett. She took it away from her. Yeah. She was an absolute outstanding Black Widow.
Because they all are Black Widowers. Yeah. One character, who wasn't a standout, was Kenan's very much secondary, but I didn't know this until I looked into it. I'm not going to know if anyone else knows it.
But Rick Mason. And Black Widow is a little go-to guy for all of our bits and pieces. Oh, right. Yeah.
I've tried to say the end of all the British things, but I've not really noticed it. It's not the actor. It's the character. So Rick Mason is the son of Tinker.
Am I getting that wrong? From Spider-Man? Right. You know, if you watch Spider-Man Homecoming with the Vulture, his little tech crew, the guy who's from Orange is the New Black, they're Kylan.
Or he, that's him. They are related in the comics. Yeah. But I don't know how that's going to work.
I didn't know that. I thought that was quite interesting because it's a connection between the two people. They are technically related. Great Winston.
Oh, God. No, I was just going to be before I started leaning into the very big way of us. I'm just going to mention because Marvel don't do anything by chance. Like I said, even- The George, he kind of escaped.
It's all, like I said, pre-ended. Like, say, even Danny Glover's, Danny Glover, Donald Glover's appearance as potentially the prior law in things. So that's the way enough to miles and miles apparently. But again, exciting times ahead.
But yes, we'll come to the bit that totally, like, soon as it happened, I tapped out the film. Real Winston's accent. What the fuck was that? Oh, please.
Was it so far from again? Was it, was he dutch? Or was he a comic? Or was he a comic?
Or was he a comic? Or was he a comic? Or was he a comic? Physically angry watching this film every time he talked.
And I couldn't have just corrected as the company accent. That is more sinister, like, regardless of the fucking sperm rush I just gave him. He's letting Joey's company accent. It is perfect for him.
Like, it would have been perfect for that character because he was a dodgy-dealing kind of thing. But yeah, I totally, your rage is the same rage I get when I listen to Kathy Berg in American Horror Story. Because her accents and that are absolutely horrendous. But I'm a terrorist ex and Sean Durene-Gone.
What is he doing? And he was just laughing. He said, not good. Because then he watched it the day after he went, I told you, I understand why you hear this.
And the biggest anti-climatic part of it as well was Taskmaster. Such an interesting character in so many possibilities. And as soon as you saw Natasha's backstory, like how she got into shape by blowing up these dodas. And he went, that's Neil's on going to be Taskmaster.
And Marvel don't do that. They don't play the obvious game. And this is why I couldn't get on board and film as much. Everything that happened was so predictable.
If it was a return on who? You knew what there was North living or even the M credit scenes, the spot there a little bit. Because the toilet stopped. I've got a near now.
Lady Hyde was going to be in it. Because the toilet stopped after. The set that wasn't going to be our first appearance. So you knew she was going to be in the demons in there.
The only thing I was surprised at again. Because if you're looking at the black window on the cast, that's one of your notes. There's a certain person I've actually raised in the cast list in. But he's not in the film.
Robert Downey Jr. Yes, right. I watched that. There was another thing that was this morning.
So he was there was rumors that he was meant that this was way before it got put back and forth. So there was rumors while it was in production that Robert Downey Jr. would be returning as Iron Man for this villain. But they never said what it was for.
It wasn't going to be a flash. There was a video on YouTube actually telling you everything that was cut out. Because the trailer and the film do not marry up with each other. If you watch the trailer and then watch the film, they don't marry up.
So that's a lot that they gave in out. That happens a lot. I'd say the Marvel do the small and mirror side thing. Look over here.
We'll do this. Like Avengers was such a big one. Like having characters that weren't even in the trailer this way or there. And they say in the big one where they had the Hulk showing up and the final battle win.
Running. Yeah. And he wasn't there. One minute.
But again, I don't mind that. That's fine. But actually what I heard was apparently this was what the whole beginning of Black Widow was changed. Because apparently it was already set exactly after the big battle.
And Tony Stark, that's where Robert Downey Jr. was supposed to be single by. And I say in the Flash was sculpting off and stuff. But I know the change at this time had General Ross coming in.
Made it to their own self as he does. Again. But it's nailed on. I don't think the next Avengers film isn't going to be Avengers.
I've got two ones in the price of one this time. It's going to be the Thunderbolts, which has to happen now. That's obvious. It's obvious now.
Definitely. Especially with the domination going to be in Shang-Shae as well. But the Unaventures, I think that's going to be the next. Because I don't think we're going to get an actual Avengers film until maybe Marvel never say it.
It's got to be an end. It can't just keep going. So the last one, I think that'll be a fit. But yeah.
I know there's a lot of positives in the film. But I think it's one end where I wanted to like it. Because I've got to, but again, it was a film that came out that if I didn't release it, I wouldn't have been bothered. I get what you mean.
I do. Now I've seen it. But obviously the lead, I think it's just because it was, it's been kind of in tears, not only 18 months. You know, we were meant to get this 18 months ago.
So yeah, I have to watch it. But I totally understand where you're coming from. I give it, like I say, I give it the four out of five. But it wasn't for her.
Yeah. It wasn't for the other ones. I don't feel it was her film at all. It was one thing that I did pick up this morning.
So I found very interesting was talk of X-Men. It's very minor. It's what Melina says. And this is, I think word for word, girls who passed through the programme, but if they had, only they had genetic potential.
Right, okay. And that could be because they also use the same reason in when the soldier, when they refer to the twins because at the time they couldn't see mutants. Yeah. No, no, I remember that.
Yeah. Because they were called the miracles, I think, didn't they? No, I'm not. I'm way wrong with that one.
But I can't remember that. No, I can't remember that. The word of it was a mutant, but it was genetically different. And she did exactly the same.
But it was only a minor thing. And it's like, could she? Could we have had potential X-Men in there? I mean, the thing is, Loki has changed everything.
So this doesn't even feel worth it anymore. Because it means nothing. But that's the thing. For example, if this came out instead of Captain Marvel, I'll probably have enjoyed it more.
Really? Because in the timescale, what Marvel were trying to do? The first female superhero, Shoki is in womanhood and thinks this would have been the perfect foil and it would have fit nicely in within the films. And all the made of Captain Marvel for the Avengers, but delayed by a year.
Delayed by a year. They fit this in if you want this in so bad, rather than saying, because it felt like an afterthought. It felt like you've done really well. You've helped us out.
Here's your pair for what you've done. No, I don't know. I get that. And I actually wrote a full article on this.
I am a very proud member of the Carol Cops. I love Captain Marvel as a character. And I was buzzing my tits off when she was getting her own film. But in my eyes at the time, she was getting it over Black Widow.
And I thought that character has paid its dues since I'm Antu. And has made such a place for ourselves amongst all these men. And she is an afterthought in Marvel's eyes because they're going to give the first female Marvel film to Captain Marvel. And even me as a Captain Marvel fan, I thought that was an absolute kick in the face for all the character for Scarlett, because it was a, well, we need to bring her in.
We didn't need that Captain Marvel film when it was. At the end of Infinity War, the picture of her star appears on his pager. If you knew who it was from that, why did we need a film to show who she was? Because when she walks into the Avengers headquarters, she is wearing her outfit with the star on it.
You didn't need the film to explain where she's being or who she was, because by the time she gets the Avengers headquarters, that star from that pager is on her outfit. And that would have made it more intriguing as to who this person was. But because you already seen the film in the first place, it takes the entry and the interest away from it. Okay, some point.
How Marvel has brought Spider-Man into the face? Everyone likes to say the backstory, but we don't need to see it. We don't need to see it. We've seen that.
And how they brought him in already as a full-fledged, well, as a teenager, but with these powers. It worked so much better. It was more of a surprise. It meant more, I think.
I know Carol's not a, but just movie fans. She's not a big, she's not a known character. But movie fans, but you're not, well, not stupid. People are going to remember that there's a reason you're looking at that pager for as long as you are.
And then that star repeaters. And then you see her in her outfit with the star on the front. People are not stupid. They would put together that that is the same thing.
And all she needed to do was the same speech she did to them when they're already getting an interview. And she says, there's more people out there, there's more of the universe out there. And they go, have a nice time. We didn't need the full story.
I generally don't mind the Captain Marvel film. I don't. But what I didn't like was her actual origin story because it's not Carol's story. That's not Carol's story.
She was never part of a creep or me. No, I didn't like that aspect of it. And I'm getting a lot of stuff. Listen, we're watching as well.
We are in Vietnam, North East. We're not used to this. No, no. For any Americans listening to give you some perspective, if you've seen Game of Thrones, we went to Bell.
It's always cool. It's always weird. It's always miserable. The minute it's like dawn and it's so hot.
So for same thing as well, that might be the thing. But yes, go back to the Black Widow aspect. I know it's strange because I think my disappointment as well is because we're being promised this film for over a bloody year. And they could have released it in so many different ways because I know they wanted to make this cinema and things.
But apparently when they made the money back off Disney plus alone, right? Again, I don't like the Korean sized companies or people that do well. But 20 pounds just for one day as well. And you don't even get to watch it after that.
I know I understand it's part where if it's a family going, they can save money on tickets or off-corns. Yeah, totally got that. Overall price you pay in for a service and a monthly thing anywhere. Jesus Christ, I was surprised at that.
No, I totally got that. And I always asked if the assets appear for it, I bought it because I was getting to the point where I just needed to see it. And then I found out the price now went, well, why would I pay it? 20 pounds to watch it on Disney plus I already gave the money for when I bought it to the cinema and watch it for a fiver.
It doesn't make no sense to me. But if it was a case of they did this straight away, when it was meant to be released, I probably would have been paid to try and quit. I thought it would be well. And I've gone back as well.
The whole Taskmaster element because again, I've heard rumors that the Taskmaster is going to be reappearing in the next Deadpool film as well. Which again would be interesting, but the main interest and character saw a blend with the reveal. But even after the reveal, there was no personality or I know there was nothing there. There was no change.
No, no. And I want to get into this and this one is going to go a little bit serious. So the Taskmaster isn't Drake was not at all in the comics. I'm trying to find his actual name because I forgot to write it down.
Oh my God. What's his name? No, but in the film, I kind of like we like to predict and see what's going to happen. That was what I thought was going to be Raka Weiss's character before I saw the film.
That was my call because I thought it was going to be some on close to Scarlet's. I thought it would have been interesting. That would have been more interesting than being Drake was daughter. But the real, the probably character from the comics is called Tony Masters.
The characteristics of the character from comic two, what you see is spot on. Forget the reveal. But how he is a spot on. The credence of the internet have taken it upon themselves to display their disgust with the reveal by sending Kate with her name Kate Shortland death threats.
Wow. They changed the character from Tony Masters to Drake was daughter. I'm sorry. But who the fuck do these people think they are?
Death threats. It's a fanboy's way though isn't it? That's the problem. It's not that it's not this is not serious at all.
There is no reason to send a fucking woman death threats because you didn't get what you wanted out of that character. To be honest, if it's the reveal that to be Tony Masters and not Drake goes daughter, what will I just give in a sheet? I was wondering why. It wouldn't have made any difference to the storyline.
No, because it's probably just one of them. Who? Because it's somebody we don't know. I understand the reveal is a bit, it's very predictable.
So that was my problem. That was always my problem. Again, I couldn't, I would have laughed at it if it was someone like a clone version of weird Wilson. That would be funny.
But, like I said, as you go back, no one should be getting death threats or any type of performance. And all back to Captain American when they saw that, the guy who played the new Captain America, don't perform in so well that he was here so much he got death threats. Well, again, get all of yourselves. It's a comic book.
It's not real life. It's not serious. Nobody deserves to have that amount of dirt. They've gone them.
But even if they reveal it to be Tony Masters, majority of the people in public are not going to know who that is. It's not going to make an impact and get where they were trying to go over there. To be honest, if we didn't see who was behind the mask, that character is so interesting, so deadly, so dangerous. The fact that the amount of time was me and I forgot, oh my god, it's Black Panther.
It was amazing to watch it. But just because you didn't get what you wondered, you feel it's okay to send someone death threats. It's absolutely ridiculous. I just cannot get me head around it at all.
Absolute credence, man. But, yeah, it's a modern world. It's internet trolls, as you say, but try and move through the shadows. Move through the shadows and see what goes on.
Yes, the whole film overall, when I watch it again, I always wonder if I was watching the full films. In crime, yeah. But I wouldn't watch it in the release order, because it doesn't work for me. It doesn't work in the slightest.
No, I don't. I like to watch it as they came out. I like to go over to Iron Man 1, right? The amount of times I've watched End Games, man, it's just, it's starting to get stupid now.
How much punishment do I need to put myself through? But I do. I have this plan, always have the plan. I'm going to watch it, not in chronological order, where it's like in the timeline, which is from start to finish.
Because Disney Plus is great. They've got the timeline order, then they've just got the release order. And I get from Iron Man 1, Iron Man 2, and then I'm like, yeah, I'm on straight to End Game. I'm missing it all.
I'm going straight to End Game. The only thing as well, because with every Marvel film, is it after credit's same, which would talk to her as well. This one didn't make as much sense as the others, because I know what they've done. I know why they're doing it, but to go that way and see it, because you give, like, Natasha says a big change, she's out with that, and I've been controlling the minute later, then going straight back into the main minute later again, to be sent after Barnes, saying, do you want to go after your sister's colour?
Wasn't all? He didn't fucking kill you, tried everything you could to save her. So that's bullshit one and one. It is, but look who we're dealing with.
It's, and look at what she's probably already in that we don't know about. I actually thought, so when we saw her, I wanted to agree, as it's done. Swear to go to Samuel Jackson, comes around the corner. So initially, at this girl, into the young Avengers, I will lose my absolute shit.
But what we got was Valentina coming to her, and it wasn't, and I thought, oh my god, it is, it's always right, you know, this is it. And it wasn't a, you know, a Tony Stark moment. That's what it felt like to me, it felt like the beginning of the end of Iron Man. When Samuel Jackson, now Nick Fury comes out and gets Tony to join the Avengers program, I was like, oh my god, it's going to be, you couldn't have come join with the Nables program, but no she wouldn't.
It sounds like she's already in it. Oh, yeah, no, that happened. That's the target though, fun. I know that's on the TV show, so I think this has been added in after, like, what I personally think is that Barton's pissed off a lot of people when he was in his Ron Han Ronan character, that the Thunderbolts just wanted to take him out and going to use that as an excuse to take Barton out, and that's what we're going to see in the whole TV program.
I don't think, obviously we know, we know what it is that he did everything he could to see of her, but to somebody who wasn't there, you could use that as a massive manipulation tool. And this woman is not a good woman. She's not a good person, they're not good people, so she's obviously going to use an manipulation factor to get your lander to do what she wants her to do. And I think Barton's pissed a lot of people off, and his little less appears after he lost his family.
We only saw a fraction of it. I am not a massive Clint fan. I don't think he's going to be named Elfisason, do you understand? I know that Kate Bishop now, so.
Yeah, I mean, this is why I think you're right with the Young Avengers because now we've got another version of Black Widow. We know that Malzreal is coming into it. Miss Marvel, who is another Young Avenger, she's in it. And we know that Kate Bishop's going to be in Haw Valley.
I would say that Kate cannot be well. Oh yes! Yes! So we can see where it's going.
I just think it's going to be a slow progression to boot all the older people out, to bring the younger crew in, to then at some point having to need the older crew. I don't think Clint's going anywhere, but I think she will be the perfect reason for him to give in, because he doesn't need to do what he does anymore. He's not an older crew. Yeah, because I'm just thinking about it as well because of Rakesh and Man's daughter as well, because she's going to be playing a bigger role going forward.
And Cassie Lang in it as well. So there you go. It's perfectly coming together. Because of Castablón, the last out of that new freaky fun that the Senior Collar Freaky Friday, which was in Supernatural for a few episodes as Cassie El's daughter.
Can't remember any of which she's recently named Rakesh as Cassie Man's. Cool, and that's cool. Just go on back with all, and Martin. I loved the fact that they went back to Budapest and we got to know that they actually did that aspect.
I did think it was good that it tiled up, but I wouldn't have been sad if I didn't know, because it would have been that little in-joke that was always quite a bit too. Yeah, because that would have been good. I would have been happy with that, but no, I honestly said it was nice to get a bit of closure. And again, going back to the most predictable and what you thought was going to happen when you knew the line and word that Natasha was going to use as soon as...
Thank you for your cooperation. Exactly. So again, you knew soon as she was going to be in the office, there was going to be a kind of manipulation and you knew she was never going to be the vulnerable one as well, because she is the ultimate assassin as she looks by. But good, for example, keep jumping from point to point now because you keep saying something things pop me head.
With Samuel L Jackson, I knew he wasn't going to be in the payments, the reason being in Svees with the girls. So... To Shay, to Shay. Yes, I just thought that would have been a perfect moment.
It was a different character, a different organization that was coming for your lint, for your lint. But also, her watching Moonraker was an absolute massive four-shadowing of where the Red Room was. Massive because of even more Moonraker, he goes to a secret space thingy and dies. And that's where the Red Room was.
I think it was a film of four-shadowing. That's the only thing. I could say it was a Robols Drag Race, where it was four-shadowing who was going to be kicked out and you know over who out throughout the episodes. Oh, ouch.
Yeah, the shade of it all, sorry, the shade of it all, but yes. No, it wasn't the biggest fan. Again, I think it's more disappointing. It's probably better than a two-star film.
I've probably been a bit overly harsh. But I think the menthet time we have waited for us, I want to think better than what we got. It's been a waste. And I think it got to the point with me that I just wanted to see it.
But I did. I brought a massive article about Black Widow and how I felt she was absolutely shafted in not being the first person, the first woman to have her own. Because now there's so many. There's going to be a Miss Marvel, Jennifer Waters' She-Hulk.
Which I'm looking forward to that. Sounds like the room. Oh, she is one of my favourites. There was a room that came out in 2012 in, no, 2014.
And it got cancelled. It got one series and it got cancelled. And really up raw because of it. Because you know why?
It was all to do with our work. It wasn't a superhero aspect. It was more to do without it. It was fantastic.
But if you want a really good, really good Black Widow comic, I cannot recommend Nathan Edmondson's 2014's The Finally Woven Thread. That is giving you Natasha, why? Because I said Natasha is one of two things. It's family or a ledger.
And this is a ledger. She's trying to write her wrongs while also being an Avenger, while trying to actually live a life. And it's so brilliantly done. That again, you mentioned a certain word there.
Just jump something straight back in. One of the things that you'll actually enjoy. It's probably the first film of the Marvel thing. Where people are referring to a as an Avenger as the mid-it's a big deal.
And I enjoyed that. Just saying that sounds way insane. But that was a key thing. Where people saw Natasha as a superhero.
And now she's got more special powers. Just a bit better than anyone else. She really is. She really is a lot better than everybody else.
But the majority of the story does come from another comic book. Black Widow's Deadly Origins. It's almost similar to the story that the viewers, who are trying to pick within the MCU, have never read it. But finally, Robin Thread is absolutely unreal.
The artwork in it is beautiful. The reds that they use throughout. They say the reds and the whites are just stunning. Such a good read.
I probably will not be watching this for a very long time. I get where you're coming from. I even... I said to Carolyn.
When I saw Carolyn yesterday, I was like David Harbour, phenomenal. Absolute, phenomenal. I could have watched him for the two and a half. I could have been...
his film and I would have been happy with it. But no, it wasn't. Poor and superior with Elena. It was absolutely unreal.
Elena was... Rachel Weiss was absolutely brilliant. Saw interest and devastated. We didn't get it seen more and he and more from her.
And then you got Scarlett who just felt like she was just bit into it because it has her name on it. Yeah. I have heard rumors as well that David and Rachel Weiss is going to be returning a lot sooner than we expect. So we are already seeing apparently more.
Because of the reactions that she had been getting from this film. He was a standout. They were quite believable as a family non-family as well. I do think there's something there between them too.
I think that was very real. And that was the whole point throughout the film was Florence, like the Elena's character, saw that. That was real to her. And to Natasha it wasn't.
Because she was a bit older. She knew that the healthy it was. You even saw the skill that she had as a child. I got different.
Yeah, I think it was real for Natasha as well. She got so good at hiding that part of it. Because when you see her as that little girl, I'm trying to take a little sister away and she pulls it on them. That was really intense and real.
I think that's it. I just said Natasha is trying to hide most of her emotions. You never saw her show any emotions until what was it? Endgame?
Because then in 50 Wars she was like, yeah, I saw her. I'm tired and done. She was broken. She was absolutely broken.
It was the first time that you saw her cry properly. As a fake one, she was trying to manipulate anybody. It was a pro cry. She was just absolutely broken.
And you knew I was the two of them who was going to sacrifice their life because that's all that they would think. That's what she said herself. It's been leading up to this moment. I just felt that she was very good at hiding it.
She almost made herself believe she wasn't real. So therefore I believed it wasn't real. Which Elena is... Couldn't hide a type of thing.
She couldn't. She was too emotional over it. The little girl who played Elena in the beginning bit is the same little girl from... Doctor Sleep and...
How was I on Haunted Hill? I think that little girl has such a future in films. She is absolutely phenomenal. Not a little actress.
My last little thing I want to say about Black Widow, though, did the best callback that I never thought. Actually I was amazed when I saw it and when I saw the pictures afterwards. And it was something so simple but so clever and it shows how much Elena meant to Natasha. The vest.
She wore that vest in Infinity War when the battle failed. Oh my god, she did the best with the puppets. She did so many puppets. It's just a nice little interview between what sisters would be like.
As you know with your sister and stuff. And then when she gives her the vest and then I didn't notice it until I saw Gitch on 90. Natasha was wearing Elena's vest during Infinity War during the battle scene. So I was like shit.
It shows that they've called her back. She doesn't mean a lot to Natasha. Which I thought was already quite sweet. I thought yeah that's totally changed a little cute thing to me.
Overall I enjoyed it probably not for the reasons I should have. I can't be over critical of anything Marvel do. Because I know if I will come back is in the ass later on. Because Marvel don't do anything by accident.
There'll be a chance that something from what we didn't like it will be a callback later on that's something we loved. Do you know what I mean? It's just Marvel's never ending circle of we're gonna fuck with your mind. That's the thing that with Marvel.
They always do leave things open. Because I like how they always advance the story. Like I said, there's no wasted motion. This one to me felt like a lot of wasted motion.
I going back rather than going forward. But again, that's just maybe over critical and picky. Because I say we expect more shall we say. But that's definitely ruined us with the last part of the Infinity Saga.
We were absolutely ruined as we was because that is some cinematic brilliance of what they did there. And I get what you mean. It's not progressing the story forward. But I think that's what we're in the past.
We know her fate. But I am so glad she didn't come back because everything I felt from endgame when she went would have been taken away from us. And it would have been for nothing. So I'm kind of pleased with that.
I think we should leave it there. I have nothing more to add to this. To be honest, my notes were very, very little because I knew because the fact that she wasn't really what it just didn't be like her film for me. I thought I could talk about what really made the film more.
That's always the thing. But yeah, it's one of them things. I'll always be a comic book fan. And anything you point for us, I will watch.
But it didn't fit in nicely. I know film shouldn't be a big thing. I think it fits in nicely. Do you know if you might have felt a bit different if it came out what it did?
I would have said. Because then we would have had shan-chis afterwards and we would have had new Spider-Man, the story. All you're getting is the starting point of what we know is going to go into the next bit. I think it's going to be a good segue as well.
I think we have been spoiled a little bit as well with Marvel TV. Show us that's been coming out. Well, because they have been given us more if that makes sense. Moving on to the next thing we want to talk about.
Yeah. We might as well. I know we normally do our top five. But we are trying to keep up with what's been talked about.
So what we'll probably do with this podcast might even do it in two parts. So we'll have the next, say, the Black Widow one and now we'll discuss. Going into Loki. You've got to be able to go into this.
Now, I talked about expectations for a TV show. Because I think from the start, I think it was a picture or I think talking about when Loki was born out was basically 10 years ago, Marvel took a punt with two unknown actors for two big roles in the Marvel Universe. One was Tom Hiddleston and one Chris Hembeth. And the new movie Marvel do big gambles with a payoff.
Has it paid off? Loki has been one of the best characters in MCU. He's been the most interesting, most diverse. And he's one of these people that you shouldn't like, what you end up cheering for.
And this was the perfect foil for him. And before I give you my ratings and stuff, how did you feel about it? Well, before I get into how I feel about it, would you like to know the rotten tomorrow score of the program? Okay, corporate.
92%. Should be higher. 92%. I am not going to use his name.
But as frequently is what I should talk about him because I absolutely despise the way my Northern accent sees the name Loki. It's just my teeth on edge. Whenever I, just me, nobody else, when I hear myself say Loki, I absolutely, it sets me on edge. I absolutely loved this TV series.
It was emotionally on par with one division. It had me absolutely gripped. It gave me some characters and some, but I never, I never thought I fall in love with. And we'll get into that in a bit because I'm, I'm just, I'll be jumping straight ahead of myself.
It also left me with a lot of questions and a lot of confusion because there was a lot to take in. Even though it was simply done, it wasn't hard. There still was a lot to, like, the Nexus events, variants. I've got a bit lost at some points, but that did not take me away from the program.
Certainly. And you think, because I know we've had other ones, this one was only six episodes. So no one division was a lot that long. I think we'd be sure there was six as well.
And I, I fell in love with one division. It was a journey. Like, say it was hard. This was every episode of your grips.
There was something different. It was something like, it was never boring. And it was not the premise I was expecting because when I watched it, I was expecting. And so when I caught them late, but I'm not.
Yeah. No, no, I totally get it. But because we didn't, because they never told us about variants of this character that we are thinking that, you know, our, our lobby is the one who's going to be doing all this time travel. And when it's not the case at all.
And I'm, I've absolutely loved the progression of the character from his transformation from this absolute weed of the villain because he was, he wasn't the greatest. Because if you think about it, he hasn't been through Ragnarok. He hasn't been through dark. I think it's basically at the end of New York Avengers assemble.
That's the lobby we've got at the start of this. So he's not. It's not involved here. It's glorious purpose.
Exactly. Yeah. And again, I know the kind of touched on that when he was sitting, because I was getting his name in the form of Wilson's, was it Morpheus or Morpheus? I kept calling him Morpheus.
And that's it's Morpheus. Yeah. I couldn't do the same. I asked him when I sat down with him and showed him everything that happens and when he's more with him to his mother, Freda, and that was well done.
And the whole issue wouldn't get kicked in the balls for about 10 hours straight. It was hilarious. But his journey from being the dick that we had at the end of Avengers to basically at the end of the movie. Because I know there was a few people I had a few arguments with who said, well, the title, the film was Loki and he didn't get a great thing ending.
I mean, none of the other shows are getting the second season. Loki's getting the second season. That was huge. This is leading what we've been waiting for.
We've been asking the question since we heard multi-year verse of madness, how we are getting the movie. We have found that out during the show and the way they've done it has been perfect. And the way that it's implemented at the end as well, implemented at the end was done sort of done so badly and so lightly. Did he even notice it?
That was the brilliant part. No, he didn't at all. And you don't, you know, the fact that at the end, we're going to go back and forth and I'm sorry, the end scene where the, what's he called, the, he who remains, who will get into it a bit. When he who remains gives him the option, take the throne or let the movie verse happen.
And in her head, she, the fact that because he knows, he knows what that means, letting the movie verse happen. Because if you picked up on it, Miss Minutes kept telling him over and over again, what would happen if that happened? But in her head, all she can think of is he just wants his throne. But that's not Loki anymore.
That's not who he is. She is, she helped him to realize a bigger picture where it's not about him. Because he always made it about him. But wasn't that the whole nexus of rent when the touch hands, that was like the big spark that he realized it wasn't about him anymore.
Again, I know what probably touched on the relationship, but that was, I took his a little bit to get me head round, but again, I got there and found it all for themselves makes perfect sense. But when they kissed, I went and asked, is that right? Should we be like in that? I'm kind of digging it, but I really don't know if I should be.
But again, if you think about Loki as a character, it made perfect sense that the only person he truly would love is himself, which I thought she was brilliant as well, but after so. And then I said, Sylvie, I said, well, it's not rather, we'll find a bit more of a fun. When Loki first introduced, he introduced the time variant, what was it called? TVA, the time variant associate.
I can't have that. I just got found the TVA. But the whole premise where he was getting through indoctrinated and checked out and the little in jokes as well, saying, oh, if you go through this and your robot, you'll be a bit weird. He's got a lot of armor on.
He's sitting there with Brett, he's going to be a robot, and he's happy that he's not. It's at the end, but it was all done very cleverly. I've still got ideas and theories about it, because one thing I did love about this, you don't get all the answers. Because I still think it's going on all the different variants and you find out all the variants are basically multiverse versions of the same character doing different things than trying to get rid of ones that be a team as messing up the same timeline.