Please welcome the Democratic nominee for president, Vice President of the United States of America, Kamala Harris. Und genau darüber sprechen wir jetzt. War es gestern tatsächlich ein Good Evening für Kamala Harris, derzeit Vizepräsidentin der USA, und seit gestern offiziell die Kandidatin der Demokraten für das Amt der US-Präsidentin. Hier ist 8 Milliarden, der Auslandspodcast der Spiegel. Ich heiße Juan Moreno. Und natürlich müssen wir heute über den gerade zu Ende gegangenen Parteitag der Demokraten in Chicago sprechen. Vier Tage lang haben die Demokraten auf einen einzigen Moment hingefiebert.
On behalf of Americans like the people I grew up with, people who work hard, chase their dreams and look out for one another, on behalf of everyone whose story could only be written in the greatest nation on earth, I accept your nomination. Jetzt ist es also offiziell. Kamala Harris ist die Kandidatin der Demokraten. Und ich spreche heute mit Spiegel-Korrespondent Roland Nelles, der in der Halle ist, in der die Demokraten ihren Parteitag gerade beendet haben, was sich in der Tonqualität widerspiegelt, wie wir gleich alle hören werden.
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Okay, Roland, the important question is of course, is the important part of the party today. Kamala Harris has the important part of her life in her life. How was the question? I think it was a good one, I must say. It was very important, what is here very important. That will be in all the TV-Chiefs. Many Millionen Amerikaner and Amerikaner schauen sich das an. We want to see, that this is someone who...
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He has many themes spoken, which many voters are at the heart of the heart. And so, I think that's a good thing. I think that's a good thing, Roland. I think that almost every text and every TV show about you, has Kamala Harris with no words said that she is a woman or that she is white. That's a strategical decision from Kamala Harris and her colleagues, that they don't put these themes into the Vordergrund. That whole thing goes a little bit back, I think, on Hillary Clinton.
in 2016, Hillary Clinton verloren hat gegen Donald Trump. Hillary Clinton hat damals das Thema Frau sein sehr in den Vordergrund gestellt. Sie sprachen immer davon, dass es darum ging, mit ihrer Präsidentschaftsbewerbung die Glasdecke zu durchbrechen, also dass eine Frau endlich auch einmal Präsidentin werden kann. Dieses Thema wurde sehr in den Vordergrund gerückt und viele Berater der Demokraten glauben, dass das mit einer der Gründe war, warum Hillary Clinton die Wahl verloren hat. that some of them didn't like it, that this played such a central role. Of course, especially men. And that's why it's now less important for Kamala Harris. And the same thing is basically for the black woman. That's not too much in the background. That's why she looked at Barack Obama, who didn't put it in the background, that he was a black woman. And that's why Kamala Harris, I think, leaves it away. And that's why it's more in the background.
Oder noch etwas ist mir aufgefallen, während Harris 2019 als Präsidentschaftskandidatin noch eine eher woke und eher progressive Agendavertrag, klang die Rede gerade keineswegs, sondern nicht links, sondern man hat den Eindruck, die Frau ist massiv zur Mitte hin gerutscht. Ja, also die Rede war sicherlich eine Rede, die an die Mitte der Gesellschaft gerichtet war. Kamala Harris will very eindeutig eine möglichst breite Koalition schmieden. Sie will eben auch versuchen, Republikanerinnen und Republikaner anzusprechen, die vielleicht nicht für Donald Trump stimmen. Aber sie will natürlich auch ihre eigene Parteibasis mitnehmen. Also das soll ein ganz breites Bündnis werden.
Also, eher linke Demokratinnen und Demokraten sollen auch für sie stimmen können. Und da versucht sie eben, sich so zu positionieren, dass irgendwie für alle was dabei ist. Man muss sagen, ich glaube, sie ist eigentlich eine unglaubliche Pragmatikerin. Sie war als Staatsanwältin damals in Kalifornien, war sie eigentlich eher eine moderate Politikerin. Und auch im Senat galt sie jetzt nicht. Also das behaupten zwar die Trump-Leute, aber sie galt eigentlich nicht als besonders links oder progressive, wie man so sagt. In Kalifornien sind die Politikerinnen und Politiker der Demokraten generell immer ein bisschen linker.
She was actually more at a moderate level at home. Also total links ist sie, glaube ich, nicht gewesen. Und dann hat sie 2019 im Wahlkampf, als sie ja versucht hat, schon einmal die Präsidentschaftskandidatur zu kriegen, hat sie so einen kleinen Linksruck für sich selbst vollzogen. Und der war, weil sie dachte, dass das eben in der Parteibasis besonders gut ankommen würde. Und das war eben nicht besonders glaubwürdig damals. Und deshalb ist, glaube ich, auch ihre Kandidatur 2019 so gescheitert, weil sie im Grunde gar nicht sich selbst treu geblieben ist, indem sie da so einen Linksschwenk vollzogen hat. Und jetzt ist sie eigentlich, glaube ich, wieder viel mehr sie selbst. Sie ist eine moderate, pragmatische Politikerin.
And so, as she's now presented, she's much more herself. That's certainly something to do with her as a vice president. She learned a lot about politics. She learned a lot about politics in Washington. Also, the whole pragmatic approach of her, that's certainly better to her. And that's why she feels much more in her role. And you know that from yourself, when you're with yourself in the Reinen, you feel better and better. And that's what you feel here, that's just so.
So my mother was 19 when she crossed the world alone, traveling from India to California with an unshakable dream to be the scientist who would cure breast cancer. When she finished school, she was supposed to return home to a traditional arranged marriage. But as fate would have it, she met my father, Donald Harris, a student from Jamaica. They fell in love and got married, and that act of self-determination made my sister Maya and me. She had practically the typical American story of a child of a child. The mother came from India, the father from Jamaica, both of them were Wissenschaftler in California. And that is a story that is for many Americans very well understood and relatable, as you say, because many of them have a similar biography. And that are exactly the women who are talking about. Also, people who are not so long in the country are, who are different than the white American, who is perhaps a little longer here. That are exactly the people who...
I think it's important to tell a personal story, where people can recognize themselves. What I really like to do is that the Democrats are a party that really looks like America. The party is diverse, there are many women, there are black people, they have a big role in the party, but also asiatisch-stämmer people. And the Republican Party, you see that it's a part of the white party, which has tried to protect the old America, as it's already overholted. And Trump, of course, the Republican Party doesn't look at all, but the Republican Party doesn't look at all like America today. That's the way the Democrats get better.
And that's why they couldn't be successful in the last few years, because they're much better than the Republicans, who really are on the absolute gold path. That's also for the Republicans in the Congress. You can't see black people in the Senate or in the Republican House. There are a lot of old men, white men. That's really the time for them. And that's the way the Democrats get better.
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When I came here in the USA, 7 years ago, I was also surprised that this was always so skandulated in the US and the USA. And actually, that was also always been published by the Democrats. Also, this patriotism and this Ruf USA, USA, USA, that was always been published by the Democrats. That was actually nothing new. However, you must say, the Republicans have done that much more, especially since Trump is there. And that's been sent to us once again. In a certain way, the Democrats have discovered the topic of patriotism now a little bit more.
They don't want to leave it alone to the Republicans. There were also letters on the U.S.A. that I have, I believe, the Democratic Party has never seen so offensive. There were many American flags, and the background is of course, that you want to call Wähler in the middle, we want to call Wähler, conservative Wähler, who can start with Donald Trump, who can start with the Democrats, but they have a little bit of a doubt, not patriotism enough to be. And I think that this is a little bit of a thing, that you have this Patriotism-Thema more in the middle of the way, as it is already already there. Also, as I said, the Democrats were always patriotism, but that is now a little more, just in the Wahlkampf, what else was the case.
And before her, a whole bunch of other Democrats, who talked about it, have always been on the meaning of freedom. Freedom.
I think this goes very strongly back to this debate here in the United States. The freedom of women to decide their own body. And this topic is a big topic here in the United States, at least once again since the Supreme Court decision for the abortion rights. And the Democrats have written it on the floor, that they have the freedom of women to decide their own body. That is, I think, the important thing here. Let's go to the end of the discussion on the Außenpolitik, which is expected to expect Harris. What comes to Europe and Germany to? Should Harris actually President of the United States be? That was also in the debate, but that was not a big surprise. If Kamala Harris should win the President, that's not the case, we don't know yet. But then they can, I think, the Europaeer can, I think, relax.
because there would be no big change in Europe and in the world politics of the US-Administration. I think there would be a special continuity in terms of the European relationship with regard to the Ukraine conflict. I think there would be no big change in these places. Kamala Harris has been in the past few years at the conference at the conference at the University of the United States. She spoke there for the US government and there also always very clear the line of Joe Biden and the government. And here today in this conversation has she also confirmed that.
She sets on the NATO, she sets on the defense of the West Bündnisses and the West Democrats against the autocratic regime like China and Russia. All these elements from the Joe-Biden-Zeit and actually also from the classic American Außen-Sicherheitspolitik, would she, I believe, as President would continue. With regard to the Nah-Ost-Konflicts, she sets a few different accents from Joe Biden, in which maybe a bit more than Biden... who is here also on the side of the Palästinenser. That was already already their role in the Regierung, that she was the one who had a little more about the side of the Palästinenser. But that is basically the line here more or less of the Regierung. Also, there are really no surprise from their side to survive. Roland, something else is mir noch aufgefallen. Joe Biden came practically not in the speech of Harris. Where is he actually? Joe Biden is in the residence in Santa Barbara in California. That's four hours from here. He is directly after his speech on Monday. He is with his wife Jill.
Am Strand, I think. She has now the conversation of Kamala Harris. She posted in the social media a little picture of herself. And I think Joe Biden is just... Of course, he is probably a little bit of a candidate, but on the other hand, I think, he is also very excited, because of the last few months he was going to be criticized. He was extremely unbeliebt, he was also very bad at the time. Insofern, I think, that there is a little bit of an Erleichterung from him. And he is here very gefeiert worden from his own party. Also, Kamala Harris has been thanked for his performance as President. He is also here really unheimlich gewürdigt and gefeiert. Also, that passt schon. I think, she will try to...
She has to have a balance. That's a bit crazy because she was in this government all the time. And she has permanent decisions from Joe Biden. Things that have been criticized by many voters and voters. And at the same time, she has to try to sell a new face as someone who is completely new. And that's a bit of a balance act. And that's, I believe, it's very good in the moment.
Aber das sind natürlich Sachen, auf die Trump und die Republikaner immer wieder hinweisen, dass sie eben letzten Endes quasi nur so eine Fortsetzung von Joe Biden sei. Und damit machen die natürlich so ein bisschen Stimmung hier gegen sie. Roland, es ist ja nicht so lange her, Mitte Juli, da hatten die Republikaner ihren Parteitag. Da wurde Trump ja offiziell als Präsidentschaftskandidat gewählt und vorgestellt. Und ein politischer Beobachter, der damals bei dem Parteitag war, meinte damals Folgendes.
Also die waren natürlich, die Republikaner waren ja auf Wolke sieben. Die haben ja gedacht, sie haben die Wahl schon so gut wie gewonnen. Joe Biden war noch der Gegenkandidat, ein extrem unbeliebter Präsident, der aber vor allem auch so unbeliebt war, weil er eben so alt war oder ist und viele Leute ihm nicht zugetraut haben, dass er nochmal vier Jahre Präsident sein kann. Donald Trump konnte total profitieren. Die Republikaner haben von diesen schlechten Zustimmungswerten von Joe Biden wahnsinnig profitiert. Und dann kam das Attentat auf Trump. Da konnte er dann noch mal so ein bisschen diese Märtyrerrolle einnehmen, die er ja sowieso so gerne spielt. Und das alles hat dazu beigetragen, dass die Republikaner eben tatsächlich bei ihrem Parteitag das Gefühl hatten, sie hätten jetzt irgendwie die Wahl schon so gut wie gewonnen. Und das zeigt eigentlich im Grunde einmal mehr, dass man sich in Amerika auf sowas nicht verlassen sollte, weil hier meistens doch immer alles nochmal anders kommt als gedacht.
I also found the Republican, or what I also think about the Republican, in a certain way, is that this person's cult. Everything is just about Donald Trump. There are a couple of other people on, J.D. Vance, the fitz or so. But the Democrats have also very much more people, who are for different types of content and different regions and stories. And the Republican is really everything on this person Trump, on this person's cult. And who doesn't follow him, he will sort it.
And there is no more discussion in front of the way. It's all just streamlined on the Trumpism. And that's very armed. And that's why I believe that many voters are not. So, the last question, Roland. How did the Democrats go now in the last 10 weeks until the election? What is that for a feeling after the party? They are all very good. They know, that it's not difficult. They know, that it's not sure, that they win. But they are on the way motivated.
And I think Tim Walz, who is the best player of the event, who is the vice candidate, he made it very well. He made a comparison with American Football. He said that it's in the 4th quarter, that means that we are in the 4th quarter, that means that we are at the end of the game. But we have the ball and we have the ball. And if you want to attack with American Football, it's very important that you can attack the ball and then you can attack the points.
And I think that he had a good point and a good comparison. That's actually so, they are incredibly motivated. They have a lot of work. They all tend to come in the direction of Kamala Harris. And they have the momentum here. And what I also noticed here was the incredible power of the star power. I mean, for the Republicans, that was really trostless. Hulk Hogan, a kind of ringer-wrestling star from the 80s. That was the most important celebrity that they could do there.
And here, Steph Curry, the famous basketball player for Kamala Harris. Oprah Winfrey, who is a superstar here in the USA. She hit the side of Kamala Harris. Pink has played here today, and many other bands. There are so many endorsements from Hollywood, George Clooney and so on. This is actually an irres Star-Power, which is gathered here by the Democrats. And the Republicans don't come against it.
That motivates me, I think, more than that. There's also a party mood. There's also a rapper, that's you've seen by Trump, that you've seen a lot of other culture and other music types of music, as always his make America great music, make America great again music, which he always plays. So this whole party here, that was really an incredible spectacle. Of course, everything was a huge inszenable for television, but I think it was pretty good and made it. They just need to win.
Das war Roland Nelles, Korrespondent des Spiegel in den USA über den Nominierungsparteitag der Demokraten in Chicago. Und das war 8 Milliarden der Auslands-Podcast des Spiegel. Ich heiße Juan Moreno und ich sage Dank. Und zwar bei Philipp Fackler und Janis Schakarian für die Hilfe. 8 Milliarden erscheint immer am Freitag und zwar bei spiegel.de und überall da, wo es Podcasts gibt.
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