Paranormal Expo Part Two

You're listening to the Wisps. It's wasatch investigative studies of paranormal stuff. Wait, no What wasatch investigates the science of Peron? Wasatch wasatch It's the Wisps their Wisps.

Listen, it's okay. It's the Wisps Happy awesome fun time paranormal adventure show seriously dude. You need to get a better name. I'm not kidding Hey, welcome to another exciting Exciting because I've had later caffeine and you might have heard that on the intro from last week But it's five minutes apart for us.

Well Caffeine or do you take it down or man? It's like two minutes for us. Well, yeah regardless But this is kind of the next few episodes are interesting because again We recorded them over the course of two days the better part of our both of our weekends And all for you the listener because we love you But we're actually here. We're promoting two events the first event Which is the metaphysical Expo which will be held Saturday September 16th at the Sandy Southtown Expo Center and Then the second event will be the paranormal Expo which we done Saturday October 7th at the Southtown Expo Center And we kind of in our first intro to last show went through all the guests and we decided not to do that because it was a really long intro Yeah, but in this episode like last one we've got some phenomenal guests.

We've talked with Elizabeth Saint We talked to Brian Cano we haven't we're recording this immediately after we've done these interviews We're not entirely sure how we're gonna edit these together We're not sure at all but hey, we love you in fact We're gonna record a third-end for a minute just because this might even be three shows and if it's not then we'll just Should we use it we use it then we use it and you'll know because it will be there anyway on with the show and we will see you At the events because if you're not Tim will find you and he will kill you with kindness and hugs. I'm a big guy Hey, welcome to the wish show. I'm your host Castle. I'm here again with Tim What's happening?

We are we actually have three guests on with us right now. We've got DJ Justin Hoffman That's kind of hard to DJ Justin. It's the two days together. Yeah tongue-tied And we've got Helen and we have got jewels now.

Tell us what you guys are here to talk about today I understand there's something through a throg venom and recovery and some other stuff So take a lead on it first Justin. Tell us what we're doing sure I run a house in Las Vegas that is America's first Ibogaine aftercare clinic and what Ibogaine is is it is a hallucinogenic Plant from Africa that we are using to detox opiate addicts with no pain no withdrawals and leave them with no cravings Not only that but allows them to get to the root of their issue of why they're using in the first place So basically we're talking about a miracle plant and it's been used for 10,000 years now and And we're seeing amazing results. You know rehab system sees about six to eight percent succeeding for a year What i'm doing is seeing about 70 to 80 percent right now clean and I couldn't ask for anything greater, you know, I've been DJing for the last 25 years of my life And I've had amazing career at it. I did this medicine four years ago after a 20 year opiate addiction And I probably saw about 30 different rehabs that I went to nothing ever worked me.

I never worked me Medications never worked for me and four years ago. I decided to go down to Mexico and give this a try and Took about eight nine hours It was pretty intense and then I came out of it and I realized that my depression was gone My anxiety was gone. My bed polar was gone. 80d was gone and I was no longer an addict Um four years later and still never had a craving for drugs So we're talking to basically almost like this is a miracle cure when it's done correctly Um, there's a lot of different avi-game clinics out there Um, there's really really good ones and then there's ones that aren't so good What I started though was a very very important piece of the puzzle and that was africa Because it's one thing to go down there and have this amazing experience with avi-game and feel reborn and all new and fresh But a lot of the people that I was working with in the beginning would just go straight back home to their old environments or their old relationships or Being around old places and that wasn't working.

That wasn't working whatsoever So what I did was I set up a house in Las Vegas Beautiful beautiful mansion where everybody gets their own bedroom and basically we wake up every day 7 30 in the morning We start the day off with all different kinds of yoga. We're going to a beautiful gym We're with long hikes in the mountains. We teach them Buddhism. We teach them all different kinds of things We teach them chigong.

We teach in Tai Chi Um, we do amazing amazing things there. Um, we also we use combo frog medicine, which jewels Is a practitioner of we use Hape, which is an Amazonian stuff. The one thing we don't use is we don't use big farm immense We get you off these meds and we keep you off these meds for good There's no reason for anybody that I've worked with to be on antidepressants anti anxiety medications or especially sleep medications We can take care of everything. Um, it's I've I've watched miracles Over the last two years and I truly believe that what we are doing is going to become the gold standard in american when it comes to treating addiction and especially tackling this Epidemic, I was watching cbs this morning and they had a roundtable discussion with a couple of doctors on there and an addiction expert They had nothing to offer basically.

The only thing they said was we need Um, more access to methadone and suboxone. That's absolutely insane to me. Okay, both of those drugs are way way worse than heroin itself They're absolutely Almost impossible to get off and could lead you with post-acute withdrawals for over a year So how is somebody ever gonna get off those? They're not it's a great band-aid to put on elastination of the throat, but it really doesn't work Well, I say it's interesting that our best and the best can offer us right now that and tell you to go to AA meetings Obviously, it's not work out.

I say it's interesting that you mentioned the box in and the I say it's interesting that you mentioned the suboxone and the methadone I actually my day job when I'm not doing this and I'm actually I'm in law enforcement I've been in law enforcement for 19 years and I've seen firsthand what uh opiate dictions can do and I'm And it's interesting because you see the person getting on par one they get on suboxone It's just they've basically replaced one addiction for another addiction Um, and so it's fascinating here you say that because I mean I've witnessed that first hand and seen it over the last two decades Of exactly what you're talking about. So let me ask you this With the idle gain, um, how could the medical community hasn't embraced it yet and started using it? Um for many reasons one it's illegal in america So we can't it's considered a schedule one narcotic which absolutely blows my mind that the cure for heroin Um is classified as the same thing as heroin under the u.s. Government same thing with mushrooms same thing with lsd same thing with Iowask and all these other medicines that could be used, um to great benefit But um the main reason is because here's the thing.

I'll put it this way. I was on over a dozen medications. Okay for ad backpolar Um addiction depression anxiety sleep disorder. I mean it just goes on and on and on this that's the story my whole life Once I've gained There was absolutely no need for any prescription pills So think about what this one plant with one dose would do to our pharmaceutical industry a multi-billion dollar industry Would be crushed by this one plant So why is our government gonna go out of its way to legalize a cure for addiction like this when they can keep you on suboxid methadone, prozac and all these other drugs that are daily drugs and keeping the money machine going They're not gonna it's not gonna happen.

Right. That makes sense. I mean there's a lot of uh things out there that they kind of More or less milk the public on a Keeping them on these drugs. Oh, yeah, because there's no money in the cure.

It's on the temporary in the tree. Yes. Yeah, so now On the maintenance medications now. Let me ask jules.

Um, so how does the frog gonna play into this part of the the equation? Um, well, I don't work directly with just a group over at holistic house I do have a practitioner that is a colleague in my nut works hand in hand with him and she's excellent Um, and what what I do here in Salt Lake City in terms of with eyeball gain, um, or excuse me with combo is I treat people who are using an array of other substances plant modalities um to come off of other prescription medications like one big one that I'm working with right now heavily in Utah is the antidepressants and people do come with you know A fortitude and a conviction to come off of opiates to work with combo venom. Uh, it takes a great deal of commitment and um, it's not always successful for them Um, they do relapse into old behaviors and it's the same thing. Justin had just said Um, there's something unique about what I go gain does for the reset and then coming to aftercare Um or seeing someone like myself or someone, you know, the associates he works with in his in his um, setup combos used Um to cleanse lymphatic system and to help repair neuro receptors and the opiate receptors So in terms of combo, you would come and have a treatment, um, you fast for 12 hours before and I work with it I'm in a traditional Amazonian way from the yonow tribe from um, other different methods that I've been taught through an organization that I work with Um, and inside of that treatment I work in a series of three and it's really unique to work in sets of three with treatments So they would come with intermittent fasting in play like dry fasted Um, and then we would create a sit with two liters of water We burn a superficial layer of the skin, which is about a 1-8 inch diameter.

Um, I reconstitute venom that's been dried I work with first secretion venoms male and female young and old Um, and then as I reconstitute that venom, I place it on the gate is what it's called And it's a little small point of venom and there's multiple ways that I can put that on the body or administer Comminister it on the ankle, the shoulder, the spine, um, different meridian points, different marimapoints and the regular of the euso- like an acupressure point or like a needle in your ear as well And different reasons for different energy points or energy systems But just to work with someone coming off of something or someone who would like to come off of pharmaceuticals, um, or even have a cleanse, right? Uh, I put it just anywhere like on the ankle or the shoulder Because at that point it's just getting peptides in the system and a couple of the peptides to mention, um, is the frog It's named after the bicolor phylla medusa and the medusa peptide, um, is the vasodilator And it carries the phylo-carin and the phylo-lo-trin, um, phylla- del morphin and del tworphin And several other peptides that they've been able to isolate between the tydicin and bradykin families of the venom Um, they also know with six decades of research that combo is the most powerful vaccine on our planet And it is legal. Um, when you go to the UK or in other countries, it's kind of like Starbucks there And here it's not very well known Um, and it's well received but it is still there's still a lot of dogma and a lot of fear and a lot of Stigma around it that it being venom, but it's actually peptides So, you know, once that's administered in the body, it'll go through the lymphatic system Certain peptides work in conjunction together to help cleanse the body so it'll go pass through the blood-brain barrier It goes to the neuroreceptors, it goes into the cells into the opiate receptors And then it also when the cell receives it because it's natural like del morphin and del tworphin are kind of like They're the natural effect of morphine, 4,000 times more powerful, but you're not getting all of those synthetics And it's not like a chemical that is, you know, doing damage and we can have it confined Receptors and helps create your pain management system and helps increase your antibodies in your immune system Plus it's getting all the toxins out at the same time. Okay.

Yeah, besides let's say the addiction stuff. What are things in that treat? Um, well, you know, there's no we can't really say combo treats anything because it's illegal to say that Um, but you know what would people come to use one before? So people would come for like withdrawals like what Justin does, you know, they're coming off of like heavy heavy heavy drugs Um, they've done the eyeball gain and then you know in a period of days after they're still dealing with a little bit of Um, withdraws sometimes not not and Justin can speak more to that actually But they would come for that to support the withdraws and to actually, you know repair opioid receptors neuro receptors And then to also cleanse and detox um, but most of the people that come and see me are coming off of antidepressants They're coming off of um, benzodiazepines They're um seeking to have like increased stamina.

I work with a lot of professional athletes Um, who are looking to take it to build their immune system. I work with people like you, you know in law enforcement who need strength and who have different stressors Um, for anxiety depression, um, you name it I mean it just the list goes on. I work with people who have autoimmune disease HIV, rheumatoid arthritis. This is an alternative people accept this as an alternative treatment for cancer.

Um, The list goes on and on. Okay. Now we also have Helena as a guest now Helen. Did you work with both jewels and Justin?

Um, I actually lived at Holistic House for two months post-ivigames Uh, I had my iB treatment in Mexico in October and moved directly into the Holistic House after that And I have not worked with jewels. However, the colleague that she spoke of did treat me while I lived at Holistic House. Okay, so tell us a little bit about your experience Um, well, I couldn't hear a thing that Justin said so I'm going to kind of go by what what I know He basically just kind of talked about How it all works together and what the purpose is and how it treats addiction what goes on at the Holistic House So kind of tell us how where you started at and kind of where you ended at as far as before your treatment to where you're at today Well, um, gosh my story with addiction started when I was born. Um, I was born with fetal alcohol syndrome And so for 43 years, I just traveled in and out of varying stages of addiction with various things Um, I did have a a small stint with opioids, but it wasn't really my thing.

I was more of a stimulant type of girl So I came to Justin and came to iB gain actually after a four-year methamphetamine addiction Uh, you know this time last year. I was smoking meth every day and uh What iB gained did was you know in the in the process that I was in the medicine Um, it was able to pull the trauma from my youth out of my Out of my soul out of the you know back my brain so I could process it Uh, look at it deal with it, grieve it and kind of put it in its place So it didn't control my life anymore and that's a very heavy experience. Uh, iB gain really is a very It's like doing 10 years of psychos, intense psychotherapy in five days So coming out of that you're incredibly rattled and you do need to readjust to new healthy habits Uh to you know life is not drug addict. So moving into a holistic house was a beautiful transition for me Um, you know, Justin gets you up every day to go to the gym Uh, we do a lot of yoga which since i've left holistic house i've continued and yoga has been just beautiful um to continue this process I've also continued doing I did three treatments of combo in the two months that I lived at holistic house and like jul's was saying um, you know for me being somebody that came from a meth addiction one of the one of the struggles with meth addicts is You know part of our detox is that pink cloud period where you know after after you get over the initial detox of it Where you're just slow and sluggish and sleeping all the time and eating lot then you go through this like 30-day period of like Almost like false energy because your endorphins are just overstimulated Uh trying to re-rebalance themselves and then usually around day like 45 to day 60 after quitting meth You crash again and that's when most people actually go back to using meth Well, what I found that combo did was in addition with the ibogaine It's all kind of reset the dopamine and serotonin receptors in your brain So you can really just power through those normal phases of meth recovery Um, so by the time I left holistic house after two months, I was ready.

Um, I was able to I never had I never had any of the crash I never had any of the low energy the bottom of the out. I didn't have any of the depression Um, I was able to just kind of bounce out of those those phases just right into like, you know where I would be maybe six months into recovering from meth So so yeah, okay, so let me ask um How long have you been using meth before you started a distro program four years four years? I think I'm ever using that four years Um, and so you've been completely clean and since you've done this no urges. Nothing.

That's fantastic. So Justin are you still with us? Yeah, I'm right here. So if someone was wanting to get a hold of you and to try to beat their addiction and get off of this stuff Uh, how would they get started on this path?

Okay? Ah very easy google my name Justin google ballistic house. There's um, a website Uh, holistic house Las Vegas dot com That they can get all the information on um, I can give my phone number up right now That's okay. Sure.

Absolutely. Go ahead. Okay. My phone number is 702 275 3301 and feel free to call And uh, and jules It's just a phone rings 24 7.

I know How would somebody get a hold of you here? Uh, if they wanted to try some of the frog venom treatments that you've discussed Um, I'm on facebook at peacelev combo and um, my phone number is 385 250472 Fantastic. Well, we appreciate you guys coming on. I appreciate you guys taking time at your busy schedules to come on to show with us Um, and we will see you guys at the expo Awesome.

Thank you so much for your help. Hey, thank you everybody. Appreciate you guys being on All right, thank you. Have a good day All right.

We are back on with Helen Greco um, and we talked with her briefly when we talked with jules who is still with us and uh DJ jist and hofman, and we actually kind of want to talk to Helen and get a little bit more of your story Um, so Helen we're just gonna kind of open it up to you And just I know you gave us kind of a brief rundown, uh, but tell us exactly kind of how you got where you got and how you worked your way out of that Okay, um, like I mentioned in the previous part, you know, I I kind of had a rough run out of the gate Um, my mom was an alcoholic so was my dad and the day I was born My mother was so intoxicated that the doctor refused to give her an epidural and they had to literally hold her from falling off the table during delivery So my first two weeks of of life started with detoxing from alcohol with fetal alcohol syndrome So, uh, you know throughout the course of my childhood Um, I was uh, you know sexually abused by family members by the time I was six Um, I was exposed to a lot of drugs and alcohol in my home by my parents older siblings their friends Um, so it was it was a very common thing around my environment where I grew up I had no other coping mechanisms really offered to me as a child other than drugs and alcohol. So, um, gosh By the time I was 14, I was drinking regularly. Uh, by the time I was 16 I was smoking my dad's weed every day with him a lot. Um, by the time I was 19 Um, I had tried my first stimulant which was meth and I remember thinking to myself the first time I ever did it was Oh my god, how do I do this every day forever?

Um, and uh, I just Really kind of went down from there I was on meth in the 90s for a couple years and when I was 21 I kind of detox myself and then I went on to not use any hard drugs for about 13 years But I was drinking alcohol daily. Um, I did this and had a career and had actually, you know, what people would call the successes in life You know, I had a normal household. I had, uh, you know, I made a lot of money I did all kinds of great things and then um, I had my son when I was 34 and When he was four years old he was abducted by his father and that threw me back into um, having a regular daily meth habit Um, I was already kind of playing with the wrong people and hanging with the wrong crowd again But that threw me into daily usage and you know, even though I was able to bring my son back in my life Like a couple years ago. I was still not able to Get out of the deep meth addiction and the trauma that I was experiencing.

Um, so I had toyed with the idea of going to conventional rehab My boyfriend was going to pay for it. Um, my boyfriend who's totally straight. He's never done a drug in his life Um, that you know, we met and I was honest I told him what I was doing and he kind of fell in love with me and took me on as a project Like I really want to get her clean. So we looked at a conventional rehab about a year and a half ago And I just didn't I didn't think I would be successful And so what I actually ended up doing was um, I found a raky healer And throughout that process of doing the raky, um, is when I began the I began option came to us And so I kind of tostled around with it But I really was at the point where I knew I had to change that I was dying and I was Uh of no use to my child.

Um, I was killing myself slowly and I was just kind of ready for it to be over But I didn't understand what exactly I was going into and it was it was frightening. Um, I did a lot of um, I did a lot of almost Uh, I went through a grief period of my broken self before I went to mexico where I really processed through Um, who I was and how I wanted to change and I really I really went into it kind of closing up a lot of a lot of things that I I just didn't want to be anymore. So when I got to mexico Um, my I began was was given to me on Tuesday night and I was in the medicine until Early early in hours of thursday morning And what I began showed me were all of the things that I had stuffed down my entire life images of the sexual abuse Images of my mother's neglect and her alcoholism and her rage. Um, I had to look at all of that and process it and accept it and grieve it and um and embrace the child that got broken at such a young age and And pull her out of the closet and let her be free and in doing that, um, I was able to Accept my adult life and and I was able to understand that for 43 years I've lived um, I'd lived as an adult but making all the choices out of the trauma of a four-year-old child's brain Um, and I suffered adult consequences and felt them as a four-year-old child That really kept pushing me back into addiction over and over and over again.

Um So since I've been clean, you know, and then I left I left my secon I went and I lived with Justin and You know, I really prescribed to you know, I know this isn't gonna be easy, but this is where I'm at and I want to make the best of it I wanted to change. I didn't want to be broken anymore And I've again showing you all of that. You have to really reintegrate it into who you are Um, and that's what Justin helped me do Um using healthy coping mechanisms like yoga like meditation Um, like, uh, raw bay, which is, you know, an Amazonian, um, ground like tobacco that we used to meditate Um, we did a lot of nature walks We did a lot of you know, we did gong meditations and you know, drum circles and and just kind of using all of those tools to to kind of be able to cope with what I see now and what I know now Um, and a lot of it still comes up. Um, that's one thing about ibogaine is ibogaine opens up this door Into your amygdala in the back of your brain when you store all of these images and stuff and um, They kick up into the most random times now, you know, I've been clean for nine months And I've been progressing beautifully for nine months But then all of a sudden, you know, like I'll be sitting watching television with my son and boom Outcomes this memory from when I was a kid that my parents gave me alcohol and I got drunk in front of them And they were laughing at me and I'm throwing up and I don't think I could have been older than my eight-year-old child, you know So you still have to process all of that and I have the tools now to do that successfully Um I can do that now as a grownup and and not run into this shell of addiction I have I have the tools now because of ibogaine and because of holistic house and The connections that I have through all of this experience So that's that's my story.

So let me ask you Helen What would since you kind of lived at first hand? What would a typical day a holistic house be like? Let's say you woke up at whatever time in the morning to the time into bed kind of just walk us through a day of what someone could expect there Okay, um, well Justin pretty much gets the group going by 830 to the gym and everybody goes You know, it's uh, we all load in the van or the Tahoe or whatever and everybody goes to the gym in the morning for a good hour two hours um Whichever, you know, whether we're doing yoga that day or not. Um, and then you know, we come home There's a cook that gives you breakfast and you kind of everybody sits around for a little while and then we have our afternoon Like whatever we're doing.

Sometimes we went floating like those pod loaders Um where you float in the saltwater and they have it's completely enclosed. Um, sometimes we went to red rock for nature hikes Uh, sometimes we would go to kundalini yoga and meditation in the afternoon Um, just various things now He was also one thing that he does that I I don't believe they do in any other rehabilitation facility is he really listens to What your natural? Abilities are like me personally. I'm a painter and so when he heard me it kept saying, you know, I really want to be painting right now I really want to be painting he you know, he had one of his assistants take me down to michaels And we bought me all of my paints and my canvases and so I was allowed to sit and paint during my free time Um, there was another person that lived at the house who was really like fighting through some things Um, just internal things some trauma that he had just gone through right before his iBating treatment And Justin actually took him and got him signed up with boxing and this guy was able to work it out, you know with his boxing Um, so he was really he's really careful about listening to his patients And and giving us the ability to kind of take on our own tools for success Um and kind of point us in the right direction Um, then like, you know after our afternoon program, we would have dinner And then we'd usually close out by either going to like a candlelight yin yoga or having a you know a meditation at the house or something like that So yeah, and they were pretty the days were packed.

Um, you know, there wasn't a lot of downtime You know, that's probably healthy not to have that downtime, you know, when you're working on the bathroom addiction to have something to be occupied Especially when it's healthy things like like that like meditation and things of that nature Well, no, we greatly appreciate you having yon Congratulations on being clean and on your journey. Thank you. I appreciate telling my story. Thank you for letting me Yeah, we wish you the best and we hope to see you at the expo Yeah, you go.

All right. Hey, thank you. How are you? Hi, honey.

Hi, honey Hey, Kathleen. How you doing? I am castle and you're here with me and tim we are from Wisps and you are on the Wis Show Now we are today are going through we're interviewing different guests From the Utah paranormal expo, which is coming up and the Utah metaphysical expo, which is also coming up And now you've written a book. Can you tell us what the name of the book is?

Yes, it's called Catch Me If You Can Um, a story of alien abduction and culprit plunder Okay, so tell us a little bit about what the book uh, give us kind of an overview about what what the book is about. I mean, I know you just kind of snip it It's a story of a close encounter, um that I had back in 1976 Um in riverdale, Utah, so the story just goes Into the encounter and the different extraterrestials that I met while I was on that ship So now I I listened to a lot of coast to coast and saw the whole extraterrestrial thing is not really a special theory for me Uh, but I am a little familiar with it. So how many different types of extraterrestrials are there that we know of? Well, I you know, I I really wouldn't know Um, how about how many do you know of that?

But not a lot and the ones that I met were not your the typical graves Um, so yeah, gosh, I think there's probably an encyclopedia these days on the different kinds of aliens that there are Yeah, well that wouldn't surprise me the slightest so so let me ask and I know you probably want someone to well Obviously we want some people to buy your book, um, but kind of tell us how this all happened what tell us about the encounter and how that all unfolded Okay, we we had gone to um, I was with um a date. We'd gone to see the show one through over the confusiness Do you remember that with Jack Nicholson? I've heard of it, but I've never seen it. It's a good shelf.

It's an old classic Um, we had left the show and we were um going down riverdale road and we were going around the loop to get onto the freeway Um in our car quit working the street lights went out. Um, and you have to remember this was 1976 So the Betty Barney Hill story wasn't even out yet. Um, so nowadays it's something like that happens your first thought with the ufo um, and there was a spaceship that was it was parked in the Loop that the on-ramp created. Um, and then I And then I was taking board the ship and I met a group of extra-terrestials that I call the weavers Um, and they they were interrogating me.

Um Um Of them and they looked a lot like us. Um, skin and bones. They were very tall very Lip, I guess um kind of thin their skin was kind of bluish Um beautiful. They were extremely beautiful looking beans Um, and they were interrogating me and about halfway through the interrogation A different extra-terrestials showed up and abducted me from the first set of extra-terrestials Sounds like a metric of the double whammy.

Um, the second extra-terrestial was um Um, was they completely out of light. No skin and bones. Um, and he could pull himself light or gummy into different shapes Um, to me he looked like an upside down treble cleft. Okay.

With the cleft part looking like his head Um, and I called him Asop. Do you remember Asop from Asop's fables? Yeah, so I called him Asop and he kept calling me a thought continuum. He didn't call me by my name Kathleen He called me by the name thought continuum.

Um, and that's one of the reasons that I write under that name That's my pending. That's a pending I use when I write. Okay, that makes sense that And then he showed me um, when I was with him, he showed me pictures of eclipses So I saw like lunar eclipses, solar eclipses. I saw galaxies of eclipse.

I saw entire university eclipse Um, and then I was back in my car So do you remember like any type of the questions that are asking me or like what they were interrogating on? It was interesting because when we left the show Um, in the show the main character of McMurphy, which was played by Jack Nicholson Um, was in an insane asylum and they could not get him to conform Um, and so they lobodomized him. Um, and when I walked out of the theater, I was 18 years old Um, and my first thought was just that I wanted off the planet It's conformable to be lobodomized. Um, and I think I had like a little out of body experience Um, and I could see um, like a contextual field that surrounded the planet.

It was like a matrix Um, and then a step back I could see another field. It was like a conceptual field Um, it only lasted for like a minute. Um, but I, I was looking at something I wasn't supposed to be looking at Um, and that, I'm sure that that's what tipped the whole, all the events off that evening. Um, and so they were interrogating me Trying to figure out how I was able to see that field Okay, so now you mentioned you saw the spaceship.

Uh, can you describe to us what that ship looked like? You know that on ramp is about three times the size of the regular on ramp. So it was the size of at least two football fields Um, it seemed to blend into the background. It was hard difficult to see.

Um, it raised up, um, out of, um, park, out of what the big park or dock. I don't know what they do. Um, and we were about to go under, underpass, and right on the underpass, it said truck clearance 18 feet. So the ship rose up and was level with that.

So it was like 18 feet above our heads. Um, and as I was looking at it It was, it had boondolites going around the bottom of that. Um, and then I thought to myself that maybe it was a helicopter And when I thought that the the ship kind of changed and it had red lights going under it. Um, it was just Very fluid.

I don't know how else to explain that. Um, and then everything just turned white. I was sitting in the car and everything turned white. The guy that I was with, he was driving.

Um, and he was inanimate too. Like he was not moving the way that everything else wasn't working. I was the only thing that was animated. Um, and the whiteness was real different too.

It was it wasn't a white white. The reminded me of Um, you know those green screens that they use the meteorologist use and the weather people stand in front of them. Yeah, they've projected that. Yeah.

So, but instead of being green, you could imagine that that screen is white. And if somebody turned off the projector, all you would see would be white. Um, and that's what it seemed like to me. So it didn't seem like I was moved.

It seemed like everything around me shifted. Um, that's not the only way I could explain it. And I was sitting in the car and the next thing I know I'm sitting on the spaceship in a chair um, and the uh, extraterrestrials were sitting in front of me in a horseshoe shaped um, desk uh, trindle. Um, so it was this though even my position had not changed.

Um, so it was very, very different. So like I said, it was so like over the, you know, because it's been 40 years, over the years. Um, has I look at other extraterrestrial uh, books and uh, uh, documentaries and stuff that sound. I haven't seen anything that's comparable, um, to my experience.

So let me ask you, you mentioned you're on a date and a young man you're with, uh, was driving the car. What happened to him? Did he have an experience or what did he remember? Did you talk to him about it?

All he said was, so when I was back in the car, our car was had gone underneath the over, we were on the other side of that underpass. Um, and we both started looking around to see where the UFO had gone. Um, and there was a light over by the, you were right by a hill or a horse face. So there was a light over by the Wasatch Mountains and all he said was fire on the mountain.

Um, and then the, the thought in my head was that it didn't matter. So I didn't forget it. It just simply didn't matter. Um, and so we didn't talk about it.

Okay. That was a thought for a very, very, very long time. So it's out of curiosity. Did this happen over just like a matter of seconds, minutes or did like time pass for you differently than I did for him while you were on the ship or?

You know, I, I really don't know. It was late at night on a Sunday night. Um, and I didn't check the time. It was, it was like there it was and then we were on the other side.

So I really didn't see a passage of time. Um, my dad worked out at a hill airport space at the time. And the next day he came home from work and said that there had been over a dozen reports of the UFO, uh, the night before. And I was going to tell him that I had seen that, but it didn't matter.

So I didn't mention that. But he said, yeah, including all the ranking official from, from the base. Um, from my viewpoint, there wasn't any other traffic. So I'm, I'm not sure where those other reports or witnesses came from.

So now when you were inside the craft, um, now, like I said, I'm not terribly familiar with UFOs and alien stuff, but I have listened to a few episodes of like, say coast to coast and how did they communicate? Did they communicate verbally? Did they communicate telepathically? It was telepathically.

Okay. It was definitely telepathic. The interesting thing about that was that telepathy is a two way street. So as soon as that connection was opened, they were, they were just as open to me as I was to them.

But being a newbie, I couldn't even think of a question besides, you know, the old WTF. So yeah, it was, it was, it was telepathic. And then when the other extraterrestrial showed up, he was standing behind me and he looked at the first ones and he said, this one is not for you. And they just let go.

They, there was no argument. There was, it was unusual. It was very unusual. Um, so, yeah, I'm not.

So this is what I told you about the contextual field and the conceptual field that I saw. It's my impression that the first set of extraterrestrials that I saw are connected to that contextual field. Um, and ASOP is connected to the conceptual field. So what it's like is, um, can you hear people talk about collective mind, what the consciousness, uh, you know, call you with the collective consciousness and repar self, shell great with the hundred monkey and the metamorphic gills.

Um, and the conceptual field is actually, this is probably the most important thing that I figured out was the collective imagination, which is totally separate from our collective mind. It's kind of like a template that holds that matrix in place. Now you say a collective imagination, is that between the extraterrestrials or is that something that the human race? It's going to be the human race.

Okay. Yeah. That's, yes, it all belongs to us. Okay.

Now with these beings, I know you talked about ASOP kind of being a being of light. Uh, and the other ones are kind of blue. Um, can you describe the blue aliens? Uh, a little bit more detail.

I mean, did that hair? What, what do they look like? They were wearing, they have some kind of cloak. I don't even call it a cloaking mechanism.

Um, because they kind of blended into the background. Um, and that they were kind of difficult to see. It was, um, you ever looked at those 3D pictures where it looks like it's just all geometry, but if you soften your gaze, all of a sudden the image will jump forward. Oh, yeah.

So it was like that if I looked at their faces, their bodies would disappear. So whatever part of them I was looking at would stand forward. Um, they were malent female, uh, definitely malent female. Um, they were very, um, business-like.

I didn't feel any aggression. Um, they just, it's kind of like, they're in charge of this matrix, this contextual field. Um, and I had stepped over a line and they were trying to figure out how that had happened. Um, but they were moving through the inside of my head and I could literally see this.

The masses. Um, um, this is going off inside of my head. It looked like a big, um, combination lock where you go up to, left, forward, down, free. Um, and they were rummaging through my head.

So it wasn't just what I thought they were interested in, how I connected the dots between things. Okay. Well, hey, we are running out of time. I appreciate you coming on and talking to us.

Now, if someone wanted to go and buy your book, where would they find it? Uh, how would they find it? It is at, uh, you can get it on Amazon, Farms and Noble. Um, you can check out my webpage at www.fockcontinium.net.

Um, it's always available. It's pretty easy to find. Fantastic. Well, hey, thank you, Kathleen, for coming on.

We appreciate your time and we look forward to meeting you at the Expo. Uh, okay. And hopefully we can sit down face to face and have a little bit more in depth interview with you. All right.

All right. Thanks, Kevin. Thank you. Have a good afternoon.

All right, thank you. All right, we are on with our next guest. We're back at this game, man. Who's about this game, mate?

You want me to record on video, but you don't let me start recording. I told you that. When Brian says, Hey, that's what we're good to go now. Sorry.

Hey, Brian. Welcome to the professional podcast on the internet. This is actually kind of a guilty pleasure for me. I'm not going to lie because Hana collector is actually my number one favorite ghost hunting television show.

You're his favorite. Big fan of you. Big fan of John Zappas. He loves John Zappas.

He wants to have John, but Zappas is babies. Oh, maybe. I'll make it happen. They're science.

I've seen junior. Anyway, like I said, that's actually the only ghost hunting show I actually usually watch. My name's Castle. I'm from West.

This is Tamar. Also from Wisps. We belong to a paranormal group. And we actually most of the way we do our investigations is patterned very much after you guys do your investigations there on haunted collector.

So you're coming down to the paranormal Expo in September. Tell us a little bit about what we can do for metaphysical panels in October. So tell us a little bit about what we can expect when you get here. Well, one thing I like to do when I interact with people at conventions, especially those in paranormal groups, I like to impart upon them.

Certain bits of process and knowledge. I've been doing this for 15 years. So I still consider myself. I'm in the sophomore class.

I still have a long way to go before I get to the level. Say a John Zappas, but over these past 15 years, I've kind of made tons of mistakes, made lots of course, and if I can help, especially new investigators skip over those initial mistakes and give them some foundation to build upon that makes us all collectively better. That gets all of us closer to the finish line to those answers to working together as one team. And that's primarily been my focus.

And that's actually really good focus because we run across that too. I mean, we run across people all the time for a new paranormal field. And it's kind of rewarding to take somebody who's new and show them kind of past some of the mistakes that we ourselves have made. And it's nice to run across somebody like you who's done it longer than we have, or someone like John Zappas who's done it way longer than any of us have, who can kind of help us over some of those humps that we all inevitably run across and that make it difficult to get through on our own.

Absolutely. Now, I got a question for you. Tim and I have actually investigated a lot of locations that appear on a lot of shows. I don't know that we've done any that you guys have been to.

But we've done like a Silent 49 which has been on Ghost Adventures and Fear Factory, Ghost Adventures, the Rawls Penitentiary. Yeah, stay on the hotel. We also did the Family Team restaurant which has been on travel channel and the customers as well. Now, where I'm going with this really long question is as we've been into some of these venues, some of the staffers at the venues have mentioned that these other shows have, in some cases, fabricated some evidence or requested evidence in advance so that they can portray this their own evidence.

Now, with Honda Collector, and I understand that you guys are trying to make an entertaining TV show, but did you guys ever have anything like that that you guys did to kind of make the show a little more entertaining? Or am I getting into non-disquatch or stuff that we can't talk about? Well, I can only speak about my show. I can't speak about any other shows, but for us, the thing that made Hornet Coelectric different was that we had an end goal in mind.

And you could be fans of the other shows. They're all great. Take them for what they are. They're entertaining.

They're entertaining. They're entertaining. They're entertaining. So be it Ghost Hunters, Ghost Adventures, whatever.

More often than not, they go to places because of their own curiosity or maybe they respond to something that they heard. But there was really no stakes involved. I mean, you look at Ghost Adventures and they're getting into it and stuff is happening and the credits are rolling. With us, there's a family.

There's a business. There's something that, okay, if you guys can't get to the bottom of this, we're going to have to move or we're going to have to close. Or our livelihood is affected and that would pressure on us. Now, for our TV show, it's a covenants of producers and paranormal investigators.

And we made a very good symbiotic team, but our goals weren't always the same. And this is true for any show. The producers want to make entertaining TV that stays on the air that sells ad dollars. The paranormal investigators want to help the people get to the bottom of this, get to the weird evidence.

There was plenty that happened to us that didn't make it to the final cut of the episodes because it didn't lead to an end point. There was evidence there were EVPs, there were things that were amazing that you'd think, wow, they've got to show this. That kind of ran into dead ends that didn't lend itself to the final story. So the editors are the ones that are telling the story, but it is very much like you see based off of the reality.

Everything that happened to us did happen to us. Everything that transpired was as it was. So, again, I can't speak to other shows, but I think being an editor myself, I know what it takes to make an entertaining bit of fun. I think they did a good job in portraying that as well as keeping it faithful.

One of our really good friends has been handsome from Sci-Fi's Factor Fag. I've known Ben for years before he even got into TV. He brought up a very good point. Basically, you've got a half hour to an hour to tell a story, and an investigation can last hours and hours and hours and be quite frankly boring as hell sometimes.

And you've got to make that into some interesting TV. That's one thing I really always like about Hanayklectors. You guys seem to have a lot more integrity as far as you guys did things than I saw in a lot of other shows. It seemed like they're doing it for the Wii Factor.

That's why our producers sometimes got to get frustrated with us because something would happen. Chris and I would look at each other and just kind of like, hmm, I guess we got to get to the bottom of that where other shows would be like, Oh my god, dude, you hear that? Oh, dude! And the producers want that.

That's a great lead-in to the commercial. Coming up on a collector, what happened to Brian and Chris? No, we're just kind of like in a way to go. As good investigators, that's what we're going to do.

We're not going to run away from it. We're going to run towards it. Right. That's just how we roll.

So now, Brian, you mentioned that you've been into this for about 15 years. How did you get involved in the paranormal investigating and how did you get involved with John Zappus? And how did that all come about? Well, I always tell people that you can't be involved in the paranormal seriously for any extended amount of time and not run into John Zappus.

The man is a fixture in the field. He's the elder statesman of the paranormal as we have it. So if you do this and you go to the conventions and you go to enough events and you do the work, John will find you. It's almost like the IRS.

You're saying John's going to steal my wallet? Is that what you're saying? Well, he already stole it. He might give you something back.

But for me, I've always been interested in the paranormal. Even when I was young, I would watch it. It was like a linear voice in search of. And I still distinctly remember the end credits of the music.

And as the credits were rolling and you saw the stills of him on location, the Loch Ness Monster, castles, Bigfoot, UFOs, all these different things. As a child, I was always amazed by what was shown on TV on these mysteries. And as a young and professional child, I thought to myself, I'm going to find out all this. I'm going to get to the bottom of all these mysteries.

And then when I was 10, Ghostbusters came out. And yes, it's a comedy. Yes, it's a movie. But to a 10-year-old impressionable child, this was a movie that says, we're ready to believe you.

And you can handle this with tech. You can handle this with machinery. And all the movies I've been exposed to up until then was The Omen. The Omen too.

The older guys, these were scary things that you were pretty much powerless to do anything about. And that really was a subconscious sleeper for me. It didn't manifest until many, many years later, where some friends and I decided to do a gay-blaxed show here in New York City about urban legends and urban exploration. And even though I had always been interested in the topic, you grow up, you go to school, you get a job.

Those flights of fancy when your child really takes a back seat to getting the rent aid, getting your adult life rolling. My friends and I had always been into making little movies, short movies, skits, comedies, and stuff. And just one day we decided to switch up and say, alright, you know, there's a lot of urban legends here in our hometown. Let's see if we can't get to the bottom of some of them.

Let's go in to these abandoned buildings, ourselves, some cameras, our five senses, and see if we can't document any of the stuff that was going on. Now, this was in 2002. This was pre-Ghost Hunters. So our stuff was very Blair Witch, very shaky camera, very hard to watch.

And it wasn't a proper investigation, which is why it was more of an urban exploration. But that really lit the fire for us and myself. And we just had such a good time doing it. We kept doing it.

Then when Ghost Hunters popped up and Ghost Adventures and all the shows, it really became a thing. And the rest of his history, I guess, as they say. Alright, now let me ask you this. Having done this for four or five years myself, and I know Tim has been with me through most of that.

We've seen some pretty amazing things. What is probably your most memorable experience that you have had since you started investigating Premarable? Oof, that's a broad question. It's a tough question, but it's an easy answer for me.

And I feel like I'll tease it here. It's a 45 minute story, which I'd be happy to tell when I come out to Utah. I'm going to hold it to that. He's going to follow you around and tell you tell him the story.

That's true. Prepare your stock in the direction now. Nice, nice. It was the one and only case, the one and only time that I've ever run across something that could be considered demonic.

And if we don't want to use that word, we could say malevolence in human. It's funny to say that because our team actually specializes in the darker cases, and we get a lot of flack for using that particular word. We know because the media over blows it in certain shows, everything's a demon. And you're like, yes, they're out there.

Yes, they exist. But it's one of those things where, alright, if you go into a forest, how often do you run into a bear? They exist. They're dangerous.

They will. They could really mess you up and make you have a bad day, but how often does it happen? I feel that's the same way with the paranormal. Yes, they're out there.

Yes, they're dangerous. You don't want to mess with them. But how often do you really run into them? And I think there's a great deal of misclassification when it comes to identifying the demonic.

Why do you think everyone just assumes like when you hear the word demon or demonic, they just assume everything is going to be on the level of like Amityville or like the praying case or EdnaVille? I think that's what everyone just kind of assumes when you say that you've dealt with something demonic, that it's on that level, which is not necessarily always the case. It's a reverse glamour effect. It's one of those things where, you know, people would love to be successful and do great things and do big things.

You movie stars and sports heroes, but on the flip side of that, so many people go, ooh, demons, I wish that would happen to me. I want to see what I want to experience that. I think you know you don't. It's yes, you'll get notoriety.

Yes, you'll get fame. But you could be haunted by a demon. You don't want that. It's like standing on a street corner and seeing someone get hit by a bus.

And you go, oh, I wish that happened to me. No, you don't. Welcome to my job. My job.

Yeah. I was going to say we've had some pretty interesting encounters with some pretty dark forces. And yeah, it's funny because we get people who contact us and say, how do I go find this? And he's like, no, you don't want to find this because we have found it.

And it's not it screws with your everyday life. It really does. It causes a lot of problems when you're not investigating when you get involved in that kind of thing. Oh, absolutely.

I mean, when you sit to the old ad is that when you study evil, evil studies you and I'm more than than happy to stay up there. We try to, but it doesn't seem to always work. They kind of find us. I'll play some stories when you get out here, but we've had some rather interesting experiences doing with that very thing.

So, let me ask you this. In all your time doing this, have you seen a full figure apparition? I have not. It's been 15 years.

And that's the last thing I need to kind of check off my list. I've seen partial apparitions. I've seen the bits and pieces. I've never yet encountered anything that I mistook to be a human.

I've never had a conversation with someone that I later found out to be a ghost. And hey, I'm hoping that happens sooner than later, but it'll happen when it's meant to happen. I'll tell you, it's exciting when it does happen because I have seen a full figure apparition in my own home. And it was it was like kind of scary and exciting at the same time because I know who the operation is.

It's a family member of mine that's been with my dad ever since she passed away like 55 years ago. But being able to actually see her, it was a really neat experience. Like, it was kind of really no way to describe it. I say there's a venue here in Utah.

And when you're out here, if I can arrange it, I will get you there. But it's the only place I've seen a full figure apparition and that place is completely off the hook. It's probably the most home location hands down that I've ever been in. So when you're out here, I'll see if I can arrange it if you're interested.

And get you out there and look around. That sounds great. I've never been to Utah before. So in addition to being excited to come into the event, I'm excited to check another state off the list.

I want to get to all 50 before I stand down. And it's going to be great. It's going to be a good time. Well, I'm looking forward to you coming out.

And we'll come look for you when you're there. And we'll sit down and have a face-to-face interview. And we'll hear that 45 minute story if you got the time. Because we love to hear it.

And I'm sure listeners will as well. So thank you for sitting down with us, Brian. And we will see you at the expo. I'll see you there.

Alright, hey, thanks. Take care. How the hell do I get it? Tim's voice out of the stem podcast.

I don't think I can figure it out. Oh, I thought by not talking, I was helping you. Wow, look at the audio file. Like, you're so quiet.

I'm just going to whisper in the window. I'm just going to head over to the voice out all the interviews. Wow, you're dick. You're just now figuring this out after four years.

No. Hey, everybody. I just make sure the listeners know. Oh, I'm going to told them that.

Hey, thanks for listening to the Castle and Tim show. Yeah. And we probably have another episode of the Castle and Tim show coming up. Yeah, Mark's and Brandon are going to kill us.

Yeah, I know. Hey, we'll probably have another show next week. If not the week after that, because that's how we roll. Anyway, hey, everybody.

Thanks for listening again. Penerable Expo Saturday, October 7th at the Soutan Expo Center. And the beneficial Expo will be held on Saturday September 16th. Also at the Soutan Expo Center.

Find the links on Facebook. We will get them up on the West page shortly. Either tickets are cheap. And it'll be fun.

They'll be cool guests. And there will be us, if nothing else. So, but that will be cool guests. And peace out butterflies.

Son of a bitch. You're listening to the Wisps. Wasp at your investigative studies for paranormal science. They're grown as adults that like to sit in the dark and talk to each other.

But they all love their moms. So that should account for something.