Ratcatcher

Blank check with Brendan and David, Blank check with Graspace. Ma, I asked you to put Blank check on. You wanted listening? I told you to put up Blank check on.

Put Blank check on, Blank check, Blank check. You lot wouldn't know a good tune if it came up and bit you. Put Blank check on. Stop screaming in me ears.

Blank check? Blank check is shite, am I? Your shite, you're a big shite. That scene.

What is it that, what is it that, Tom Jones, Tom Jones, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's very, very, Tom Jones, it's a wonderful scene. But sure.

That scene really resonated with me as the father of a child that now loudly requests music. And calls you shite. Luckily, it's got to learn the words. I'm not calling you a boss, baby.

Just paces around. I'm not calling you a coffee. Or anything like that. I'm calling you a shite.

But yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That scene, I've been on the receiving end of the six shouted requests where I'm like, I heard the first. What are the big requests now? Can we go through the pop demon hunter songs?

Golden, soda pop, takedown. Has boss baby watched the movie of Just The Sound Track? Just The Just The Songs. It is incredible how dare I say it, potent.

Those songs have become, I'm not saying they're potent mix, but I'm saying if you were to put those songs onto a mix tape, that would be potent. No, but it's like the saturation of those songs. Absolutely. It's like frozen and Taylor Swift combined.

Very powerful. And I will admit, I watched that film. And I was sort of like, oh, I get this. But I think I'm sort of bouncing off me a little bit.

But I get that it's, I get why this is, I can see why this is so popular at home or something. And then, you know, listen, at least sometimes I'm like, they do rock there. They work their magic on me. And that's why it's so smart that the Academy shortlisted only one of them.

Did they just golden? Amanda Dobbins had a great break then. I think it's kind of the incontosocial. Did they just go all in on one?

Why do you, how do you mess this up? At least you two. Yeah, I just only golden. But I mean, like, that's the incontos strategy.

Sometimes I feel like the movie will be like, well, let's just get our one over the line. But then incontofamously picked the wrong song. They pick the emotional and lovely Dosto Ergitas. And they should, of course, pick Bruno.

They didn't see the Bruno wave coming. We don't talk about silence. Did you see Bruno? Oh boy, oh boy, it's the start of the new mini series.

David's like, you're like, you're dealing cards. You were making a hand gesture. Like you were dealing them out at the poker table. We're holding the hand here.

Yeah, sure. In my opinion. A wet hand. Five great movies from one of my favorite living filmmakers.

In my opinion, one of the best filmmakers on the planet, Lynne Ramsey, someone I've been wanting to discuss on this podcast for many a year. I was telling Sims earlier before you got here, Griff, that having now watched, I guess we've done three. Yeah. And I only really had familiarity with you and never really hear.

I am vibing with Lynne Ramsey so hard. In a way where I don't, like, cross our whole 10, I guess, our 11th year of doing the show. I think that I have dreams. This is the director I'm vibing with the hardest.

I mean, she's just so bencoded. It's just like being from another country, you know. I never had a doubt your reaction was gonna be that strong. Never a doubt.

They're challenging films. And I would say the most challenging we've yet to tackle and at least Ben in a way. We don't talk about Kevin. We don't talk about Bruno.

We need to talk about Kevin. That's what we've got, right? Yeah, that's the difference. Heaven must be discussed.

And we are promising. We are going to discuss him. We must. Kevin.

Yes. Look, this being the first episode of a miniseries and one that I very much pushed over the line, I feel like there has not been as much of a griff move. No resistance here. But you've always, you've always marked Lynne as, when she makes another movie, we're doing Lynne.

And it's very much like the Buster Keaton series for me. Lynne Manuel, we didn't talk about Bruno. That's him. And Ramsay, Rat Catcher, today's film.

That's her. Right. Now, Lynne Manuel Ramsay would be like, and I'm not tied rat to a balloon. Interesting.

We've been served with a legal document here. He just unfriended me on Facebook? I have my Facebook account that I use to send all our assets. Just to send all our assets up to Disney Moji Blitz and Message Lynne.

Yeah, you're still, you're still messing into those messenger DMs. I'm not saying there was any opposition to it, but she's very much one of my people. And much like Buster Keaton, it felt like, look, this is slightly more challenging than he's seen than we've done before. The Aspen Buster Keaton, although this one's very very fun and watchable.

And I was happy to see our listeners discover that in real time. We're asking people to engage with central silent films, which is outside some people's language. These movies are very emotionally intense. Another filmmaker I adore, who I think has similar kind of thematic obsessions and weight, is the great French director Robert Burson, who I once wanted to put on a March Madness bracket.

And David very wisely pointed out, imagine 20 weeks of that. I love programming so much. We love it. We're very important filmmakers ever.

We would not be covering Lynne Ramsay if she had doubled to do the numbers of film. Because I think it's just a lot to ask of our listeners. But I also think, and this is what you're experiencing, Ben, these movies are not, in my opinion, punishing. They are difficult.

And they are challenging. They're a little challenging, but no, I don't know. Certainly not. Honestly, my love of Lynne Ramsay is not a fetishizing of a kind of feel bad mood.

It is that I feel like she very, very easily. The material is tough to think about sometimes. The most simple way I would put it is she makes films about the things that we don't know how to talk about or even think about, much like Kevin. We need to.

But they're all based in unspeakable realities of human life. And they are, she tells those stories in an understated way. I don't think they are punishing. Yeah, she's got style, dude.

That's a huge part of it. It is a very stylish film, and we're going to be unpacking. Because these movies are about the emotional experiences of going through unspeakable experiences. She's never gone over two hours.

Congrats to us. I love that. Her long-smoovies die, my love at 119 minutes. She kept it under.

She kept it under. It's five films over the course of 26 years, with a lot of failed what-of-projects that we'll talk about that are really, really fascinating. But this is her first film, Rat Catcher, released in the UK in 1999, in the States in 2000. It got an early, I say, a pretty immediate criterion release, a thing that is not as much part of their model anymore other than when they are the distributor for a film and were theatrically.

But George Washington is another one that comes out 2000 US, where it's like, Criterion has taken a debut film that barely got a theatrical release. In the United States, sir. And are immediately kind of canonizing it. Yeah, you're right.

You're right. If you're a film nerd like us, and you're looking to the Criterion announcements every month as a guidebook of where should I start? What should I look at? And not to age ourselves, but at that point.

This is how you discover it. Criterion only has 200 titles. No, I hear you. This is the most interesting.

You find another one. You go interesting. They put a movie in the collection that's only two years old. That immediately jumped out to me.

And so this was the first one I watched and for that exact. OK, that's interesting. But what does this podcast called? This podcast is called Blank Check with Griffin and David.

I am Griffin. I'm David. Pretty sure Ben here with us by Ben out to Lynn Ramsey. Poke in the Bruce.

This is a main series on the films of Lynn Ramsey. It's called We Need to Pod About Cast Fin, which we're going to do. We will in two weeks. In right, just to dust him on us.

That's right. Today we're talking about her debut film, Rat Catcher. And we're actually starting from the back hatcher, which came out in 2000, but it was at the Cannes Film Festival. It was this announcement of a new talent.

She won the BAFTA's Newcomer Award, which is a big deal back down. It's a little similar to Jean Campion's launch. This energy of attention must be paid by the festivals. And by, yeah, I discovered this film.

Because my mom must have interviewed her. My mom, we moved to London. I lived in London. Yeah, we know.

Why are you putting such an emphasis on this? It was when you said that. You had like there was a tremor in your body. It was interesting for someone to have another country.

I don't think it's interesting. I understand why we need to make such a meal out of this. We're going to make a meal out of it. And I talked about this.

She had this period where she was writing arts journalism for the first time in her life for the Daily News, where she had been a political reporter, a super reporter, for many years. And Graham Fuller was her editor in this period. Great, Graham Fuller, a friend of mine, or someone respected for this day. OK, well, that is all.

That is all correct. And I feel like Graham had this artier taste. So he would assign her kind of artier stories. And I just remember she came home with a VHS of this movie.

And I assumed it was a screen or something, essentially. And she was like, I got to watch this. I got to talk to this filmmaker. And we threw it on.

And she's like, you don't really throw on Ratcatcher. I mean, you place it very gently in a player. I assumed we knew that it was like a sort of gritty indie feature. It's not like we were like, oh, what this about?

A sports agent who has a certain act in life? No, but you could look at this movie and go like, Oh, that president is playing a tie-jacked by Russian terrorists. You could go make movies of that here. Is this a slightly rougher cast?

Yeah, that's kind of a question. That's a movie really, maybe. It certainly reminds me of cast. And we could talk to that.

Yes, yes. And we watched it. I was what, 13. We were just both so struck by it.

It was just when we were just like, God, this is unbelievable. And we loved British slice of life stuff, me and my mom. Because we lived in this country that wasn't our own. We were the most outsider.

My dad had grown up in England, obviously. And my brother moved to England when he was five. So he was a little bit more of a British boy than me. Like I moved to England as like a little American kid.

I had my little American identity. You had the bags under your eyes. You knew who you were. So this is my name and my mom.

I probably did. He probably did. He probably did. He got him early.

It is so fine. My mom has him too. It's genetic. Exactly.

It's so fine. I spent too many nights staying up on Oscar one for that. He's on the night. I didn't do myself any favors by not sleeping as a TV.

Of course. Yes. But then all three of your children were immediately born to the exact same. I got the exact exact same.

Clear them. I don't know what they got out today. So we loved like Mike Lee movies. We loved watching like the old British New Wave movies from the 60s.

Caster people don't know as a kind of Loach film. That's a better boy. We can talk about Casso in a second. I'm going to actually put a painting in Casso.

It was actually recently re-watched. But in the UK, it is kind of a generational classic. It is. And I just so I just and we always owned this movie.

I think I even re-watched it. Like it was honored like video shelf because she got in the screener. And so I was also all in on Lin right away. And then more from Callur came out and like which we'll talk about next weekend.

Samantha Morton was this hot new star and it was like, oh, it's exciting. And then of course her career develops in this depressing way. Like where like it becomes with Lin Ramsay, as we'll talk about like the story is the movie she doesn't get to make. And the story is like how long it takes her to make a movie and how chaotic it can be.

And then when something does come out, it's always really interesting. Yeah, crazy. I think a lot. I crazy.

Wait, wait, wait, wait. I'll have to turn the upside down world. Can I say it? It's especially been a rough week in the world.

It has. You know, this has been an intense week to watch this movie. But speaking transparently, there is a good chance that any week you are listening to this episode, that will also apply to the week that you have just lived through. You're living through a very intense time right now.

And it doesn't seem to be getting less confusing. And there was always this dread of like, am I gonna be in the headspace to wanna watch these movies at this time? And speaking candidly, I've been going through kind of rough psychological patch. That is another bit I have stolen from the Devoys and Tiger Wiger, my depression era.

But it's partially, you know, there's some circumstantial stuff allowed just my bad brain wiring. I've been wanting to do this series for a very long time. And it's like, am I gonna be in a good place to watch and talk about these movies? Oh, sure.

Like if you're feeling a little upset, you know, Lynne Ramsey might not be the first thing you wanna watch, but you're about to say actually, I think I'm up. The way I feel about her work is her movies always make me feel more alive. They always make me feel more connected to the human condition. And if I'm in a good mood and I watch them, it's not like they bring me down.

I feel something kind of cathartic of thinking through thoroughly. Such intense emotions. I literally just, I go, hey man, I get it. You know.

Totally. I literally just wrote down the exact same thing. You go out in the world after watching this film and it's, you're reminded you're alive. You're a human.

It puts you in touch with that. It's so easy to be distracted by just your phone and the everyday bullshit. It's not like hurt so good edgelord shit, which I don't say dismissively. There are versions of that and filmmakers who do that well that I enjoy to varying degrees, but that's more, am I in the right mood to watch this?

I do think Lynne Ramsey movies are all deeply trying to engage with what it feels like to be a person. It's the number one thing they are all really digging into and she explores that in very non-literal emotional terms that are always kind of very engrossing and captivating to watch. Yeah, this is a movie where it's like, is this a gritty slice of life movie about a working class kid in Glasgow? Glasgow?

Yes, it is. Does it also have little touches of magical realism and sort of beauty, fantasy, humor? Right, right. Like sort of malickian landscapes?

Yes, it does. This is not a fucking pushing your face into the mud. It's not a mil-by-mouth. It's not a mil-by-mouth.

Which is a movie I really love. And Gary Oldman, who directed that film has called this his favorite British film of all time. Yeah, catchar. Which makes it kind of sense.

Yes, yeah. I like the right, the British movies, that just like, life's fucking hard. You live in the fucking council state. So it's a more specific mood.

Yes, right. And there's some of that. No, I won't offer this as a disclaimer. I will not judge or bemoan any listener who just needs to opt out for these five weeks.

I get it. These movies all deal with complicated subject matter. I'll do it. I'll do it.

I don't care. But I would encourage people to at least give them a chance and I've seen since we announced this series, many blankies going like, oh, what? So it's like five weeks of bleak week. Is that like what's going on here?

And then watching one or two and going like, these are not what I thought at all. Which I think is what you're describing as well. App is so experienced. App is so different.

Yeah. Although I do have a hack. OK, OK, for this series. Give it to us.

Have on hand pints of ice cream. Because I will tell you a little fish food at the ready. And after watching Rat Catcher, grab yourself some ice cream. What kind of cream are you scooping?

Yeah, I mean, when it comes to Ben and Jerry's, I love a chunky monkey. Oh, yeah. Is that the one with banana? Yeah, yeah, right.

I feel like I don't like chunky monkey because it has walnuts. Is that right? You know what? They don't pay us, but let's try to fuck out.

Also, do you know that Ben and Jerry is in the middle of insane drama? Yeah. That like Jerry is trying to buy the company back? Yeah.

It's like I think there was some sort of split in retirement and the companies that moved in a less political direction and whoever retired is upset about that. And it's me trying to move. I can't resist the more activists. Has now merged with another larger company that's sort of like destroying the ethos and the way that was contracted.

I have a friend who used to work for me and I've heard a little bit about it. I'm a chunky monkey. Ben? Was your friend Ben?

Is it a seller? Well, Ben who? Who did a friend work for Ben and Jerry? Oh, OK, OK.

And I realized she was using, I should have said the guy that also shares a name with someone in this room right now. I said that Ben turned around. No, I don't know Ben who would ever is last night's cream. No, honestly, I have a friend who worked for Ben and Jerry.

Jerry? No. No. You were going to say, stiller.

That would be funny too. I could point out why I do have walnuts in the chunky monkey. And I did go to the factory, which is up in Vermont, Northern Vermont, when I had a girlfriend who went to Goddard College, which is a remote car. It doesn't get to work.

That is one of the biggest home works I've ever heard. I had a girlfriend who went to Goddard. You had a girlfriend who went to Goddard. The Ben and Jerry Factory.

Well, it was like when you go off there, the things to do include go to Ben and Jerry's, go to Cabot also. OK, the Cabot Factory. It's really fun. You can watch the Kurds and way get skinned.

And you can go buy a fuck off block of cheese. Long as Mafather? Yeah, she's there. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

She's there. And she's doing great. I don't fucking know. Another flavor I love?

Chocolate chip cookie dough. That's the classic. I was going to say my favorite is the chubby hubby, often confused with the chunky monkey, which has chocolate coated peanut butter pretzels in it. I just like late night hosts to be on my Ben and Jerry's.

I need the comfort of Jimmy Fallon looking out. I need to say this respectfully. Objectively, I think the tonight dough is a good flavor. It's a good way.

I think I've had it. But here's the problem. I've had the American dream for sure. It's a choking hazard because I can't get down one spoonful of this thing without laughing so hard.

OK, let's read that. Look, we're going to talk about. I said we are going to be really concise on this episode because we got two episodes for court today. And I want to be really, really, really concise and tangent free.

But I do want to say, did you see when Timmy Chalamet promoting small martyce. Everybody's having a big butt dum. TC went on Fallon. He was promoting the movie.

And he does some kind of joke about, I guess, the Bob Dylan tour he did last night. He was promoting his room when he was known. And Fallon does a pitch-perfect Dylan impression to do the bit. He does some sort of bit.

I can't even remember what I'm talking about. I have not seen this. Timmy Chalamet, what Fallon said, actually ad-libs something quite funny with his Dylan impression because Fallon is a gift impression. And Timmy looks at him with this momentary kind of like, fuck, that was funny.

Chalamet probably has never known Fallon to somebody so he was like, oh, right. And it's just this like flash from Timmy of like, oh, right. You used to be a funny person. Yeah.

Like, instead of the fucking anus that you are now. Sorry, Timmy Fallon. If you listen. Just the gibbering fool that sits behind the desk of the tonight you're desecrating the name of Johnny Carson and fucking, well, now, let her start.

You can get desecrated. We should mention that Jimmy will be our guest on the more of a calorapisone. Hey, match. Guys, movie.

Crazy. Boyfriend dies. She chops him up. Spoiler.

She doesn't do that. It's opening in the movie. No, she does chop him up. Yeah.

Just in case I'm a great actor, comedian, comedic actor, you see the person did a sketchy watch on YouTube for characters of welcome that is Jimmy Fallon being called into testify as a witness in a murder trial. That's OK. And it is the best Jimmy Fallon impression I've ever seen. It's an excellent sketch.

It's crazy. This is crazy. He's dead. It's great.

He does somber Jimmy and have a party, Jimmy, perfectly. Rat catcher. I think about a line I paraphrase often on this podcast that I heard Greta Gerwig say about being on film festival juries. Right?

Yeah, Greta Gerwig said something about it. OK. When you suddenly have to watch like 30 movies. Sure, sure.

And you have a say in the matter of an award that could change someone's entire career. Right? Like a new filmmaker like this who scraped together a tiny amount of like state money to make a little movie. Right.

And how do you process these things? And how do you give all the movies equal ways? Especially if you're like, this is a film that I said, well, look it up. It was funded by the UK Film Council, whatever.

And if you go and win a prize at Cannes or whatever, you can come back to your country and be like, see? Yeah. Like, you know, because you're not going to come back and be like, hey, Rat catcher made $40 million. But you feel like this was a clown.

That's how it works. 100% countries with art funds. Yes. Do you want to see the film?

But it's really fun. It's 20 seconds. It is so funny that you surrounded by people who are in ping pong heads. Yeah.

You're not a theater. So they're talking about the Grammys. Right. Because he's got an army for the Dylan album.

So it's right. He says, I'm imagining Dylan in a Mortal Kombat because he's talking about talking about something. And Fallon goes, finish him. And Chubby, you could just say, he double takes.

He's like, wait, that was funny. Like, he's looking at his husk. He's looking at his husk. And he's fucking feared him in Lord of the Rings.

He's like on the front covered in spider webs. And then his eyes lit up for a second. You know what I mean? Once again, you're speaking of next week's guest.

If you are listening to our next week's guest, it's competing in sort of web mode. Mummified King's reading is doing what we need to talk about, Kevin. Jimmy is doing work. Right.

And we'll be doing more than we'll be doing. No, we'll be doing. I'm not. We're not.

Yes. Because I'm a great speaker. Absolutely. Absolutely.

Absolutely. It's right. Yeah. And Matt Koalik is doing, you were never really here.

I meant to do a joke about Matt Koalik doing this episode because the dope boys always make a joke about him having a razz or record. Anyway, one of you must know how to make a GIF of Timmy's reaction because I think this is an evergreen expression of like, holy shit. Wow. I thought you sucked.

The way he conveys that, actually, there's a lot of utility for this as a GIF. 100% of this as a public like this needs to exist in the public trust. Yeah. So I was going to say the perfect thing is.

OK, great. We're talking about being on it. Right. She said you put the movie on it, whether it's a screener, you go into a screening.

And within five seconds, you know when you're seeing a filmmaker. Agree with her completely. As someone who's done juries and stuff, you know immediately. Right.

And she said, yeah, it'll be as going to be like, sort of next level kind of thing. Right. Sometimes they don't live up to their potential or their start. Right.

The person hasn't quite figured out how to communicate what they want to do. She builds in other ways because performance or whatever. I like a movie to start flashy with sort of like Tommy Lee Jones has the neuralizer. He's pointing it right at.

The best kind of flash. Right. It raised my memory. This could be my first movie.

Or a movie starts with Jennifer Beals like working at a steel mill cut off shirt. That's another flashy way to start. That's a flat move. It's pretty flashy.

Yes. Or or. And this is once again a disclaimer because I don't want to make it sound like our listeners need to do this. If you're not comfortable with this, I understand.

But if you're ready for Ricky. And you could start a movie with Ricky in the flash playing a small concert. David? Yes.

I'm going to lean into pieces that feel easy to come from and put together. I'm sure you could get those from anywhere. Oh, quince. Look, I really.

Oh, he's showing him literally wearing quince. He's showing tag on me. It's been my go to because very clean fits. Very nice fabrics.

Yeah. They don't feel like cheap fabrics. I hate dirty fits. I hate cheap fabrics.

I am. We're in. You know, it's the weather's getting warmer. I really rely on my quince polo shirts for the kind of like exactly like a formal enough piece of clothing that I can go to the office.

But it's comfy. Yes. Because we do have a dress code here. I have like a dress code.

So they got those 100% pima cotton teas with a softness. They got a feel. Oh, enjoy. And for those who don't, David is touching the fabric.

Can't sit that same balance, relaxing, comfortable. I got to tell you, I recently had a birthday. And my in-laws sent me a quince gift card because they know I like quince so much. And I am itching to spend it.

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I like that sweater. It's very nice. Yeah. I wear it all the time.

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You know, you go to a garden center and you just find it so overwhelming and inconvenient. You took the personal statement out of my mouth, Ben. That is how I feel. And then here's the other thing.

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I think to your point, Lynn Ramsey, but especially this film for a first film, it is what go to go where it is describing. It is within five seconds. I'm watching a filmmaker. Who is this person?

What is their deal? Trying to figure it out, which is why it is bizarre, David, that both you and I were transfixed by this movie while being vaguely the age of the characters. Yeah. And look, I'm not a poor, glad we can kid.

Neither am I. And I never experienced the things that we, what's his name? It's his name in the film. A Rat Catcher.

No, Rat Catcher will, of course, be joining the Avengers in the video. I was googling for Rat Catcher quotes and unfortunately all that was coming up was the suicides while Rat Catcher. Who's a charming performer? I like her quite a bit.

Yeah, but yes, for some whatever. I responded to the kid immensely. Absolutely. Yeah, like to just that feeling of like, you know, being amongst a bunch of kids that you just are not vibing with.

I think. And like, you just, you don't want to make a mad, and you don't want to do the fucking weird shit they're doing. All three of us are different strains of Sensi Boy at our core. And I think the thing this movie captures incredibly well is that moment of, am I going to let the pressures of a kind of imposed cultural sense of masculinity change me permanently?

Right. Right. It's like this peer pressure boys will be boys kind of insidious energy that he is trying to navigate his way around. We're also trying to figure out how just fucking survive, you know?

Yeah. And not just survive them, but like everything in his life. Lynn Ramsey, I'm going to the dossier. Please do.

Born on December 5, 1969. Wow. 1960. No, pretty fucking rad.

Born in Glasgow, Scotland, too. A Catholic father and a Protestant mother. I don't know if you guys know this, but that kind of shit is a little more unusual, especially back then. I was cross-faced marriage.

Glasgow, of course, is home to what they call the old firm, the most famous sports rivalry in Britain between Celtic and Rangers, which are the two big Glasgow football teams and Celtic is supported by Catholics, Rangers, supported by Protestants, classically. Also, yes. Home to the Glasgow kiss when you headbutt someone in the nose. The jokey thing is that a Glasgow kiss is a headbutt, yes.

Yes. Jokey. Glasgow kiss. I don't find that funny.

Jimmy Fallon would not be laughing at that. Hey, buddy, please. You know, in Britain, Glasgow, blank, basically just sort of means like a rough thing. I feel like British people are like, that's the scariest place.

A Glasgow handshake is stabbing someone in the liver. I want to share. I did visit Glasgow for the first time. It was a beautiful city, but I can see the edge.

I mean, it's a very cool city and it's only gotten cooler. Totally. Very cool city. And I have to say, it's rougher days have, you know, are behind.

I do have to correct you. The edge is Irish. I did the witness kids very much of the age of the kind of older bully kids. Right.

I mean, 13, 14 year old age. I did witness a street fight. Oh, sure. Well, you know what they call that Glasgow homework.

That's pretty good. So she says her family's, you know, her parents, his parents were so so much that her own mother's own mother refused to attend the wedding. Her dad worked in the shipyards in Glasgow. Glasgow was that was the biggest industry that the fucking river, whatever.

The fucking river. I heard the name the fucking river. I'm getting my I want to get my geography straight here. You know, the class has a big shipping area, especially back then, I think.

So dad worked in the shipyards apparently at one point with the great Billy Connolly, the great Scottish comedian to begin. Is that the call? I think I'm the big fan. Yeah.

And then the shipyards close. You know, the city falls on harder times. Dad worked apparently as a bar manager of a gay pub at one point. OK.

Per Ramsey, that was a revolution for me. Dad brought him to the 90s. You know, he kind of woke him up to a new culture. It's kind of cool.

So yeah, they lived in Mary Hill, which is like a typical sort of working class part of Glasgow, which is where Rack Hatcher is set. She's got two sisters and a brother. She's got a brother named James. OK.

And of course, the main character of this film is named James. Ramsey says both of us had dark hair. My sisters are blonde. So we were the black sheep and we were the ones essentially who kind of got in trouble.

You know, we were like the bad kids. She liked to paint and film. She says was not like a primary interest as a kid, but she did love the Wizard of Oz Douglas, Dirk and Betty Davis. So she was watching something.

She says that's the influence of her parents. She thought she might go to art school. She remembers she says she watched Wizard of Oz like 50 times. It's such an art and story for so many filmmakers, especially of a prior generation back when you just watch what was on TV or whatever.

James Cameron recently cited it as his favorite movie of all time. Cool. It came out that he had tried to develop Wicked, but I think he was implying that he tried to develop a movie out of the books before the musical, perhaps. Oh, that's interesting.

But that he was talking with Universal about doing Wicked for a while. Interesting. Because he loves Wizard of Oz so much. Interesting to consider Cameron doing a musical.

Well, that's my question. Was he doing the musical version or was it like an adaptation, a straightforward adaptation of the McGuire books? Not totally clear. Don't look now the Nick Rogue movie.

Uh huh. One of my favorite movies. One of the best. One of the best.

Yeah. But a scary movie. An inappropriate. She was about eight.

Uh huh. Uh and it was like a sort of thunderbolt moment for her. She's so mercenary sin it. She said I had a very happy childhood.

So like the films are more like showing her like dark other worlds and interesting things like they're more active. I like that films were like an escape from some grim childhood. No, and they don't feel like processing films. If that makes sense.

Yes. Uh she was sent to bed. Uh her parents found out she was watching film. Okay, now we didn't approve.

I made the dossier. JJ decided to be on the fire button already. He's gone. They sent her to bed.

That's what she said in an interview. She does say so they said her whole thing. She's like, I thought it was my big thing. But also her parents were clearly big film fans.

They showed her shit like Betty Davis again. Mildred Pierce Alfred Hitchcock movies. It's getting in there. But I do think a lot of my favorite filmmakers are people who find their way to filmmaking.

Yeah. It is not the first obvious nor star that they're heading toward. And the way she approaches film definitely tracks with someone who's working in other mediums of art first and applying other sort of ways of thinking to filmmaking rather than just a self-referential feedback loop of what other filmmakers have done. She refers to her parents as products of a certain intellectual working class movement towards self improvement and self empowerment that has all but disappeared with the clinic, communities and the unempowered and all that.

I think that's a very cogent way of thinking from Lynne Ramsey. She hits her teenage years, falls for an older boy and they start going to the Glasgow Film Theater where she starts seeing more European art films like Fast Binder movies. She sees Blue Velvet basically the sort of arty anarchist boyfriend. She saw Ali Fereets the sole incredible movie, Blue Her Away.