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Sep 17, 2025 57 min

Real Life Consequences

from Main Justice Hosted by Andrew Weissmann, Ryan Goodman, Mary McCord

Last week’s fatal shooting of Charlie Kirk was deeply disturbing, and as Andrew establishes at the start, “murder is murder” and those responsible must be held to account. So Mary and Andrew begin with where the investigation stands and how the FBI has handled the case, as well as the lawsuit filed against FBI Director Kash Patel over alleged politically motivated firings at the Bureau. Then, co-editor-in-chief of Just Security, Ryan Goodman stops in to share his research around the end of “the presumption of regularity” in the Trump era, amid growing frustration from many lower courts. And lastly, Andrew and Mary dig into the latest twists and turns in the President’s attempt to fire Fed Governor Lisa Cook. A note to listeners: After today’s recording, Tyler Robinson was charged with felony aggravated murder, among other charges. Further reading: Here is Ryan Goodman’s research in Just Security: The “Presumption of Regularity” in Trump Administration Litigation And a reminder: There are still tickets available for MSNBC Live – our second live community event featuring more than a dozen MSNBC hosts. The day-long event will be held on October 11th at Hammerstein Ballroom in Manhattan. To buy tickets visit msnbc.com/live25. Want to listen to this show without ads? Sign up for MSNBC Premium on Apple Podcasts. Sign up for MS NOW Premium on Apple Podcasts to listen to this show and other MS podcasts without ads. You'll also get exclusive bonus content from this and other shows.

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The investigation into Charlie Kirk’s murder continues. And the ‘presumption of regularity’ is not a foregone conclusion in Trump 2.0.

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Real Life Consequences

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This episode was published on September 17, 2025.

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