hey serial spirit listeners cc here the host of the sooner state true crime podcast we focus on cases based in my wonderful home state of oklahoma and since the term sooner actually refers to the state's very first true crime cheaters in the land run oklahoma is definitely a crime state sooner state true crime can be found in most podcast apps or visit our website anchor.fm slash crime state new episodes are released twice a month follow us on twitter at crime state for upcoming episodes and more so come away with me and discover my crime state on the sooner state true crime podcast all right guys welcome to the serial snippet this is the first serial snippet of 2020 yes we've had some cool episodes that we've done any and they've all been interviews and this snippet's gonna be an interview too and it's just how the dog rolls man you know it just it happens that way you find all these cool topics these cool people willing to talk about it and there you go we got we got some interviews for you some stuff to do but we've been in this whole strange realm right now of high strangeness and missing people and conspiracies that i just want to go a step further and talk about something that's been around for a while now and a lot of people talk about it on reddit there's facebook groups there's a whole bunch of things it's the missing 411 and i've you know a lot of my friends talk about one of them i have on with me right now we're going to bring him on and we're going to talk about this because i know he's done a lot of research into it has had interest in it for a long time but uh this missing 411 stuff really it's weird because it does try tie the true crime into it but it also teeters on conspiracy and possibly paranormal realm because of where these things happen and if you look at the patterns how all this stuff goes down i mean it just doesn't make sense it's mind-boggling but today like i said we're going to be talking about dave paladis who is the guy who basically is the mastermind i would say or the main researcher behind all this stuff who brought it out in the forefront who put these patterns together and this guy of course like a lot of people we know who are into the 40 and who are into the paranormal was a former police detective from san jose police department since his retirement paladis has written books on bigfoot as well as the many many people who disappeared in state and national parks throughout the u.s and canada and abroad most notable books are the missing 411 and uh also he's got a couple video documentaries on this subject now when i first heard this i was like why 411 and i guess it kind of makes sense because when you i don't know if mike remembers this when we bring him on but uh when i was a kid if you wanted information you dialed 411 to find a number of your friend your family or whatever you could if you didn't have their phone number you dialed information that's what it was and he put the two together missing 411 because we want more information on the 411 so makes sense right but i'm gonna go ahead and bring on my good friend mike shields he is one of my good friends and we go together every year to the mothman festival so we've investigated you know some crazy stuff together and i know he's done his research on this 411 mike shield are you there oh yes i'm here sorry to ramble on in the beginning that's what i'm known for is rambling i ramble on in a lot of these episodes but how are you doing man oh i'm doing pretty good man so this is your first time long time listener first time caller right yes real spirits yes first time so i know you've dug deep into this we've talked about it before we've sat around drinking beers at mothman festival after we've investigated the tnt bunkers kind of talking about some of this weird crazy 411 stuff i mean let's just get right into it right now i know you have a couple cases that you looked into you want to talk about but isn't this kind of crazy like give a little bit of background more background about this stuff from the research that you've done on it well um david politis another thing he is known for is uh he does a lot of bigfoot research and he does have some bigfoot books and sometimes people kind of conflict the two and put it together that this missing 411 is david politis also he's known for he never says what he thinks it is he doesn't give his opinion and it lends a lot to a lot of people thinking that he thinks it's bigfoot but he has straight out said that he doesn't believe that at least not in all the cases um but i did print out some stuff and i do have like a list of common common traits are things that politis points out is common a lot of the missing cases i didn't know if you'd want to go over those yeah definitely you know because it's kind of weird if you start to look at some of these patterns that mike's gonna get into uh it ties into a lot of the cave systems in the united states it ties into a lot of the national parks state and national parks and people believe for years that these especially national parks are some kind of cover for the government and uh these people go missing and they're never heard from or found again nothing remains at least the stuff that i've read and it's just it's odd so yeah let's get right into some of these patterns and some of the information that you found on this because it is very very interesting okay well uh the way i'll just go through the list here um whenever they bring uh search dogs in to look for the missing people uh it's very common that these search dogs won't search can't find descent or will refuse to search too as when body when they do find bodies of the missing sometimes lots of times the bodies are found where they've already been searched where it's and in a few cases even on a commonly traveled path that they would go into the woods and pass this one area every day and then that's where they would find the body like someone had just dropped it there or it just appeared there overnight um lots of times the people are found at extreme distances from where they're at and the thing that makes that odd is it's often small or young kids and they're it's more common for them to be found uphill than downhill but there's cases where you're talking three and four year old kids that are found two and three thousand feet up the side of the mountain along with the dogs not searching another one is weather it's very common for once uh the person disappears as soon as they start uh searching uh bad weather will set it making the search more difficult people often are missing their clothing or remove their clothing whether they're found or not sometimes they do find the clothing because it's very common for for people to take off their clothes and shoes um they've also said that uh the uh it's common for the people to either one be the people that disappear to either one be extremely intelligent on the high end of the intellectual scale or they are uh have disabilities or down syndrome or something to that effect the numbers show that the most common genealogy of people that disappear is german these are all things for light it says some of them seem you know like they could be a bit of a stretch but just looking at the numbers this is what he's come up with you know what like what's odd about this he's done his research he's done it he's put these patterns together he's looked into cases from all over the country and it takes a lot of time to painstakingly put patterns like this together but if i can parallel it a little bit to the paranormal i mean they say that people who have higher intelligence are more tapped into something they also say that people who are autistic or have some kind of mental disability are also tapped higher into something and to me that you know would make sense that this is something paranormal or something you know ultra terrestrial or dimensional or something like that that they are able to feel or maybe receive these telepathic messages from something telling them to come somewhere one of the other main things is uh people tend to disappear near boulder and granite fields mostly granite and coincidentally yosemite is like the largest granite field area and it's also the largest area for disappearing people couple other things just simple uh people listen this is an odd one but berries people tend to disappear around berry bushes or picking berries people often say they're tired or not feeling well just before they disappear and then when it's groups of people and sometimes people disappear almost out of like real close to other people and they just disappear and so they're saying being the last person in a line of people is often the person that disappears and that's what i have for common similarities yeah it's crazy that you know he spent a lot of time doing his research his due diligence putting these patterns together and this stuff's not easy because you really have to dig into a case to find a lot of these things and missing persons or you know if they find a body or something like that a lot of times it's hard to have access to it and he probably you know is able to do it because he was a former police officer he understands the detective work and what it takes to find some of these answers but what i find weird is all the weird parallels to the paranormal field you know you talked about people with disabilities are people who go missing they are say to be tapped into some type of paranormal you know phenomenal psychic abilities or they're just you know they're it's something can talk to them without hesitation as opposed to people who are not disabled people with higher intelligence the same thing they're tapped into something higher and you put all these things together and it makes sense you know the stones the rocks like you said yosemite national park is that what you said yosemite with granite yes yes granite is uh a big a big one there because it's supposed to be like it defeats negativity and it creates a strengthening energy field you know people carry granite stones in their pockets for good energy and that kind of stuff so all these things combined make for a i'm gonna use a zach bay higgins quote here a cauldron of paranormal activity and i'm one of these people that i hear about all this stuff and you want to tie together and make it about something that we don't understand because we don't and i believe it does have something to do with maybe portals opening or aliens or maybe even bigfoot stealing people but something where these people just end up obviously somewhere that they don't know where they're at and then you know you said it sometimes kids are found 2,000 feet up a mountain when they're like two and three years old it's like how does that happen how does that happen well i'll go on the record right now and say like a lot of these cases and i mean he has i think almost 1,400 cases a lot of them you can look at them and come up with a pretty sensible answer but the ones that fascinate me are the ones that seem like there's no easy solution like it almost has to have some kind paranormal kind of aspect to it and you said about portals and that's my favorite theory the ones where it almost seems like the person just disappeared and i do have a few cases here where i think that's demonstrated oh yeah that you know tickles my funny bone my paranormal funny bone because anybody who's been listening to serial spirits long enough knows that the theories that i have that this stuff's gotta have something to do with interdimensional travel and i mean this stuff is it just makes sense it makes sense to the point that it doesn't make sense for people who don't want to believe it but it makes sense to people who do believe it because where do these people go i mean they have to go somewhere and how far away like that really got me like you said people will search this area they have this whole grid and when they search for people they set up grids and everything like that it's a full-on you know what's the word i'm looking for it's like a full-on i can't think of the word i'm not being a help either it's like a it's you know they have it down to a science where they're like we're putting all these grids out these patterns this is where we're gonna search we're gonna search here we're gonna search there you're gonna go here they're gonna go here when this is done we're gonna go back and recomb this and canvas this area and they go into places that they've searched before and they find the person in the middle of the trail or in an obvious place that they should have been found the first time and there they are it's weird man oh yeah super weird so let's get into some of these cases that you're talking about because you know i i haven't done a lot of research into this i've only like you know i'm part of that facebook group uh the missing 411 facebook group and i see some of the posts only because i try to get cases for the show but i know you know there's a lot of strange cases out there i know you looked into a couple of them so since we were talking about portals and this one just seemed like it there's one aspect to it that like i don't know how else you would explain it man's name of colin finnery and he was actually a college football star he went on a fishing trip during his fishing trip he called his wife and uh claimed that he was being followed and that he was frightened he was breathing heavily and uh oddly he said that he was going to start taking off his clothes without giving any reason why and shortly after that his phone was off so the police started searching for him and uh while they were searching for him they were pinging his phone his wife must have had an app where she could ping his phone this happened in 2013 so we're talking smartphone technology where was it at um michigan fishing trip on the baldwin river in michigan and his wife must have had the ability to gps or ping his phone and it showed that he was near where he was supposed to be on his fishing trip a little bit later when the police went to look for him they were using that same technology to ping his phone while they were paying his phone they would show up and they would go to that location and there was nothing there he wasn't there none of his items were there they would ping the phone again and it would be a mile away and they would go immediately there and he wouldn't be there and i think they pinged his phone three or four times and went to the locations and did not find him i just google earth baldwin river it doesn't look like it's a huge river like you know it's not like the ohio river or anything like that but i mean it looks like a pretty remote area yeah and then they did find him around a week later he was they found him dead in a dense wooded area about one mile from where he was fishing and there were no signs of trauma or injuries and he was well dressed for the weather conditions oddly enough was not nude like he said he was going to take his clothes off on the phone call um and the autopsy was inconclusive no drugs negligible amounts of alcohol and no external injuries it was inconclusive because they couldn't find anything or is inconclusive because they didn't want to report what the findings were um the best they could come up with was because of his football injuries that he did take oxycodone on occasion and they said a combination of basically oxycodone and a cold which is not a very solid conclusion no i mean that's kind of a bs answer but he was found with clothes on and he was dressed appropriately but he was nowhere near where he was a mile from where he was supposed to be fishing and it was in a dense wooded area like not on the path or on a road or anything i mean yeah it's kind of strange because i mean the strange part about it is what he says to his wife that he wanted to take his clothes off and he's found dead in the woods i mean he's not too far away from where he was fishing but it's still it's an odd kind of odd kind of thing in a densely wooded area on a river perfectly healthy guy found dead in the woods there's just so many good cases when you if you sit down at the computer and you search strangers missing for 11 cases you can be there wow oh i bet it's like diving in a wormhole like everything else you sit there and you just keep finding something more fascinating and like you know he obviously spent a lot of time going with a fine tooth comb through all these case files to figure out all of these all over the country it's insane the similarities are insane that's why i wanted to cover it because it's a weird a weird thing and he also has some books out about um disappearances in cities and i personally think that the ones in cities like i have not found very many cases that i really think could not be easily explained as soon as you have a disappearance even if it's quick or mysterious if it's in the middle of a city where there's people everywhere i mean things things could happen well yeah especially with all the sex trafficking stuff that's going on i mean that's a huge deal especially ohio i think is ranked number five where i'm from or originally where i'm from it's uh ranked number five in the country for sex trafficking because it's close proximity to a bunch of airports and canada but some of them people just disappear without a trace nobody knows what happens to them i would i would honestly put my finger on some of that being in a big city or something like they just disappear without a trace while somebody took them for an activity like that you know they're either it's human trafficking sex trafficking some kind of human you know tragedy there that somebody else called somebody else did it so another one and this one i think also kind of kind of can go with a portal theory but this one could also be looked at as maybe alien or something like that but on february 1977 24 year old steven kubacki was cross country skiing near lake michigan that's another michigan i didn't plan it that way anyway once he reached the edge of the lake he took his skis off sat down to rest um when he got up to leave though his tracks were gone and he became lost And the last thing he remembers was walking through the snow, feeling numb and exhausted, and apparently he blacked out. Well, to him, it felt like he immediately woke up. Also, this is a case where the person actually returned. He woke in a grassy field in a forest wearing clothes that weren't his.
And sitting next to him was a stranger's backpack with running shoes and glasses that didn't belong to him either. He walked to the nearest town and found out that he was in Pittsfield, Massachusetts, 700 miles from where he was skiing. And his aunt and father lived in Pittsfield, so he went to their house. He had been missing for 14 months.
When they searched for him, after he disappeared, the search team found his ski poles and skis at the edge of the lake. And there was only one set of footprints leading to the water and none walking away. So, easily, they assumed that he had drowned in the water and they assumed he was dead. How crazy is that?
He ends up in Massachusetts, but not only does he end up in Massachusetts completely hours and hours away, probably, what, 10, 15 hours away from where he was, but he ends up in a town that his family lives in. I mean, that's an odd coincidence. Yeah, and the official explanation, the best explanation they could come up with is that he had amnesia and he was wandering in a fugue state. But can you really wander in a fugue state for 14 months?
With stuff that's not yours? I mean, did they ever identify whose possessions he had? Like a lot of the missing 4-11 cases, there are some details that are missing that you would think that's something that could be found out, but you can't find the information. Yeah, but this guy actually changed his, after this happened to him, he was so baffled by it that he took up psychology instead of whatever his major was, oh, linguistics.
And he went back to school for psychology, and he's actually written a book called Mathematical Foundations of Existence, Godel, Quantum, God, and Beyond. And he writes about the possibility of alternate universes. Sweet. I'll have to check that out.
I'll have to see if I can get a hold of that guy, because, I mean, that's a pretty bizarre case. He ends up, like, how do you end up in a completely different state and not realize it? We're not doing a whole Walter White thing here. You know, was he cooking meth out in the desert and didn't want his family to know, and so he created the fugue state to end up somewhere else?
You know, 14 months is a long time to be missing. Yeah, and to travel that far, I mean, I guess you could easily travel that far in that amount of time, but they have no memory of it. Did you actually see in 2018 where almost the same thing happened, but it was only a week long? No.
Because this one, I've still heard talk about lately. In February 2018, a man named Danny Philippidis, a Canadian man, was in New York skiing with his friends. They were all finished, and they got ready to go to the lodge. He said he wanted to go for one more run down the mountain, and he would meet them.
After that, he didn't return any phone calls, texts, and his friends couldn't find him, and they began searching for him. He was gone a whole week, and his wife got a call from California, and he was incoherent and confused and actually hung up on her. And she called back, and he was still confused, and she called 911 and got him help. He was still wearing his ski gear, but he had a fresh haircut, and he had a cell phone that was brand new that was not his.
And, you know, 2018, this is pretty fresh, and from what I've read, people have still, they try to talk to him about it, and he gets emotional and doesn't want to talk about it. Like, something about it scares him. He has, like, a Travis Walton experience. Some of these cases, I can honestly 100% attest to being legit, where people have no recollection of some things, but there's other cases.
Maybe they were in something illegal, and they got involved with something they shouldn't have, but it just, how do you, like, go back to the guy who was gone for 14 months. If he legitimately was gone, has no recollection of this. Think about, like, I guess, human traits or human instincts. He's eating, he's drinking, he's surviving, and then he gets his memory back and has no recollection of what happened.
But all them things, like, he's still doing that. Was he somewhere? Was he being held somewhere? Like, it's kind of nuts.
14 months is a long time. It's depending on how paranormal you want to go into it and what you think could happen, but you would think it was almost like somebody else was controlling him. Yeah. There's another theory that people have, that, like, people aren't necessarily going into a fugue state, but it's almost like somebody took control of them for whatever amount of time.
You know what? Honestly, I didn't even think about that sitting here. That didn't even cross my mind, and that's, like, totally a valid point, too. Like, these people are being controlled by the government by something else to do a task that, you said in the beginning, there's all these different traits, people who are intelligent, you know, they have this high intelligence, while maybe they need their brain for something.
Let's do a couple more, and then we can wrap this up, we'll give our final thoughts. Since I've done ones where they find the people, I was trying to find one here where they found the person deceased instead of alive, because, to be honest, most of the cases, that is what happens. They either don't find them, or they find them deceased. It's actually kind of rare that they find them alive.
That's another thing, a lot of the ones that are found alive are kids that are unable to speak about what happened. Or you have the one kid, and I don't have anything here with me on this, I just know I've heard about it enough, that claimed that he was with a copy, he called her Robot Grandma. He was with a Robot Grandma, and that sparks were shooting out of her neck, but she took care of him, and he was returned. And I can't tell you his name, because I don't have the information here, but if you search Robot Grandma, you will find information on that one.
Robot Grandma. That's another one of the oddest ones. I'm going down this wormhole after we're done talking here. I've got to look into Robot Grandma, because that's something I want to figure out what that's about.
June 2005, Todd Geeb, I guess that's how you would say his name, attended a bonfire party. He lived about a mile and a half away, so whenever it got late, he told the party and everybody that he was going back to his place, and he left between 12.47 and 12.57 a.m. The next day, he wasn't at home, so they started looking for him. There was a massive search, 1,500 police and volunteers, as well as aircraft.
That was June 12th. On June 5th, three weeks after he was gone missing, he was found, but there were several things off about it. The body was found in a pond in the middle of the area that the search had completely and thoroughly combed, and the body was reported as being discovered standing upright in the water with the head and shoulders breaking the surface. Autopsy concluded that he had no external injuries and had a blood alcohol of .12.
The case was closed, but lots of people don't buy the official ruling. Even though he was missing for three weeks, the autopsy showed that he had only been dead for two to five days, and he had no water in his lungs. Where was this one at? I'll give you a guess.
Once again, Michigan? Yes. Wow, Michigan. You have a lot of these cases.
I was going to say, whenever I was looking through the ones that I wanted to talk about, I really barely took notice of where these were all at, and all the ones I've done so far, which seem to be the weirdest ones, are Michigan. That's kind of crazy. Like I said in the beginning, there's a map out there that you can see that he's done research, and he shows pinpoints on all these places where these events have happened, and they do. They take place by these cave systems, by these national parks, all over the country and Canada.
Mike, we're going to wrap this up here, but I want to get your final thoughts on this. I know you've been interested in this for a long, long time, and I mean, to me, I'm a newbie when it comes to it because I really got into it, but as far as missing persons goes, I mean, people think that it's just something that happens in true crime or by accident, but do you think there's something otherworldly afoot here? I think that's why I'm fascinated by this, and like I said, I think if there's 1,400 cases approximately, I think a lot of them, maybe even the majority of them, could have a pretty reasonable explanation, but that still leaves you with nearly 50% that are somewhat odd, and then, you know, even 10% that are extremely odd, and almost like the people just disappeared completely and just popped back up somewhere else, or like they were taken from somewhere and dropped somewhere else. And I think those are the weirdest ones that, like, lots of people think Bigfoot, and there's even some cases where, you know, something happened and people witnessed what they thought looked like a Bigfoot or a large hairy man.
So I think that the missing 411, I don't really think that there is one solid answer for all of it. I think there's a little bit of everything for everybody as far as paranormal and true crime and all that goes, but yeah, what fascinates me is the paranormal aspect of it. Well, I mean, we all want to solve that mystery, and I think that's what's so interesting to me about it, too, is that it's the mystery, it's the mystery aspect of it, it's the not knowing, it's the wanting to figure it out. But it also makes you want to be the person that's like, okay, I'm going to go into these caves, or I want to go into these national forests, find these places where it happened, and maybe I'll appear 14 months later in a fugue state somewhere else.
But not really, I don't want that. No, not really, and our friend Brad actually reminded me the other day of a time when we were younger, and Pennsylvania is supposed to be one of the hot spots, too, for missing 411. He reminded me about when we were in high school one time, we tended to wander out into the woods, because that's where we live, in the middle of nowhere. So if you wanted to entertain yourself, you'd just go looking for animals or wandering out into the woods.
And I honestly had forgotten about this until he reminded me. But we would ride our bikes way out this path to this place they call The Cut, which was like a valley through the woods, and we'd just kind of wander around out there, get into things. And we were out there one day, and it got completely quiet. And just before it got quiet, we were looking at a tree that looked like it had been clawed on, like you might think a bear or something, but it was really high up.
And we had just taken notice to it, and shortly after that, like, it just got as quiet as it's ever been in the woods, from being a normal, you know, birds chirping, and you hear squirrels jumping through the woods. And it got completely silent, and he looked at me and said, I think we need to get out of here. And we tore the hell out of there on our bikes, and didn't go back for a while. I always, you know, tell people that there's magic in the hills of West Virginia here, and I spend a lot of time in the woods at night.
Me and my brother-in-law, Taylor, we're coon hunters. We go hunting raccoons, and there's some nights you get out there, and it's just, the woods just feel so weird. And, like, we're in the mountains, too, so you can get to points where you're, like, in these hollers, and the air temperature is colder, and it just feels ominous. And those always seem to be the nights where we don't see anything, where we don't hear anything.
The only thing we hear moving are the dogs sniffing around in the woods, and, you know, I always tell people, you go with your gut, man. If something doesn't feel right, get out of there. So maybe you had a close encounter with some 411 incident that you evaded somehow. Yeah, maybe.
It's a possibility. I mean, when I first found out about the missing 411 stuff, my first thought was, man, I like camping, and I'm not as excited to go camping right now. Because just the thought of being in the woods, and you being gone, and nobody being able to have the slightest idea of where you went, or how you disappeared, it's just super strange. Well, Mike, if people want to talk to you about this more, where can they find you?
We have a Facebook group that is called Missing 411 Mysteries Discussion Group. Currently, we have it closed for membership, because we get so many members. Every time David Glytus is on Coast to Coast AM, we get, like, 100 members a day. But since I'm on here, I'm obviously going to tell people in the group about it, and I will open the group up for people to join.
There are a couple questions. Please fill those out, so we know that you're a real person. And we'll let you into the group. And it's a good group.
I'm part of it. And a lot of people post a lot of interesting theories. And they also post a lot of, you know, missing people stuff. And, I mean, if you know of a case, and you want it out there, hit Mike up.
You can hit us up here. You know, we're always looking for stories, too. But if you want to discuss it, that's the place to go, because it's a very interesting topic. Mike, my brother, thanks for coming on and talking with me on the Serial Snippet.
Thanks for having me on. Anytime, dude. And we're going to have you back on a full episode, because I think we're going to dig into this a little bit more towards the end of the year. I want to get a little bit more into this, because there's some other cases I've been looking into that I would like some people who are into this kind of things inside on.
It's about a little kid who disappeared out of nowhere in Hazard, Kentucky. And it's a strange case. So, yeah. Okay, sounds interesting.
Yeah, I'm for it. So, guys, thanks for listening to the Serial Snippet. As you know, you can find us on every platform. We're everywhere now.
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