Scalabrine, Bontemps, and Koreen

Listen to the C.J. McCollum show where every week New Orleans, Pelican stars C.J. McCollum that's C.J. McCollum discusses names and storylines in and around the NBA with inside perspective.

You can only get from someone in the locker room and on the floor. That's the C.J. McCollum show. Listen where you are listening to this podcast.

And now hello. Welcome to the low post podcast. We're at the quarter mark of the NBA season. And it started with all sorts of off court stuff, all of it unpleasant, all of it over shadowing basketball.

We've talked about it all. It's still relevant. And yet we're not talking about it today. The biggest story in the NBA, the biggest basketball story in the NBA.

And I don't think it's close. Is that the Boston Celtics through 21 games are on pace to not just have the best offense in the history of the NBA, to shatter, destroy, obliterate every offensive scoring record, efficiency record that has ever been put up, ever in the history of the sport. And yes, I know that offenses are generally more efficient now because of the three, even by that standard. They are so far above every other team that has ever played basketball before.

It's ridiculous. They lead the league with 120.9 points per 100 possessions. The second place team is five points below them. Five points is the same as the gap between that second place team.

I don't even care who it is anymore. And the 19th offense in the league, that is how dominant this symphony of cuts and screens and off ball screens and most of all three pointers is. And we got to dig into what in the hell is happening here because in part, it's a carryover of last year where over the last 40 games they had the number one offense in the league. But this is a whole different thing.

Rob Williams hasn't played yet. That's an interesting variable. There's no one I'd rather dig into this with than Brian the analyst for the Celtics broadcast, Sirius XM radio, the whole thing. Scow NBA champion Brian Scowbrini.

How are you? I'm doing well. Now, is that a kid last so hoodie? Like, am I seeing that right?

It is. Yeah, that's so great. So great. That's so pop culture.

Nice job of you, Zach. Um, I mean, you want to, you want to dig into this. It really, as simple as it sounds, it's not about plays. It's not about a system.

It's not about a coach coming up with some thing that's ahead of the curve. It really is about, you know, elite players making elite decisions and consistently doing that. Now, as a player, I can tell you, I always saw the extra pass, but I couldn't do it at a level where I can decide, can I shoot this ball or should I make the extra pass? And what the Celtics are doing when you watch them, they're doing that at such a high clip.

Everyone's a threat. Everyone could catch. Everyone could one touch it. And also, they can also catch not one touch it drive and create that whole scenario all over again.

So they're elite decision making, which the NBA has been trending towards that the last five years. They are just at that point where they're mastering it. And we have to talk about Tatum and Brown and their ability to step back and say, for us to be good, we have to move it. And they have been moving it now right around.

This is a year where Marcus Martin sort of called out Tatum and Brown. They said, we all got to move the ball. We all know that those guys are going to get to shots. We all know.

For us to win, we have to move it. And now a year later, we're talking about the best offense, maybe in history of the league. It's crazy. And you know, you watch them play and you just nailed it.

Like they can pass ahead of rotating defenses. They're making the extra pass so fast that they're moving the ball faster than the defense can move. And when they sense that the defense is actually kind of catching up to them, they instead of passing, everyone on the floor can pump the closeout, drive and move the ball. And it's, I was thinking of ways to talk about them.

They're like the perfect combination right now of speed of like read and react speed underneath an umbrella of like calculated predatory, hunt the right match up like even when they're just moving it, there's always a sense of we know when Tatum and Brown have a weaker defender on them or we're going to start every set by running Tatum off a pin down from the center or having a point guard like Derek Weider, Malcolm Brown, and come screen for him to start the chain with, you got to make a decision, switch into a bad matchup against our best player, double whatever it is we're going to exploit it. And I think frankly, Scott, you nailed it last night. And I would like you to talk a little bit more about this. You Tatum sent a little set a little flare screen for, I can't remember who got a three out of it, maybe smart.

And you said something so just on the point of that's a, that's like a selfless play by Jason Tatum. And he's setting so many offball screens for Horford for great Williams. It's like, it's not Steph Curry, but it's the same sort of impulse of I'm the best guy. If I set a screen, it's causing all sorts of problems.

And man, he's just like, he's a man in full right now. He can do everything. But the amount of stuff going on and the speed with which they do it underneath this umbrella of where are best guys and who's guarding them is just it's a perfect blend. Yeah.

So the NBA to me, and I don't know if everyone looks at offense the same way I do like the way you win in the NBA, right? You start you have to bend the defense. So you start that like it used to be five years ago, you'd run a spread picking role, you put two on the ball, then you play out of it, you get two on one the weak side, you get the lob threat vertical spacer, that comes in, you know, hit that pass in the corner. That's an example of bending the defense and you get shot at it, right?

What I'm seeing now, which is like, this is unheard of, in my opinion. Now, I think the Warriors at times have done this in the past, but the fact that they don't go off the dribble, it makes it a little bit different because they have a lot of guys that can do stuff like you can start seeing them bend the defense and all of a sudden Steph throws back the drain monitoring on big hand off, he gets down, he throws it up to, you know, come on, no need dump, right? That's them bending the defense using Steph Curry. I've seen possessions where the Celtics bend the defense.

The team will play amazing, recover. In the same possession, bend it again, ball move around, teams are on point with their rotations, building out, reading the gather, assessing the threat, building out, then they'll do it again. Now, there's, you know, eight seconds on the shot clock, bend the defense again. And then it's a corner three with three seconds to go.

Now, Zach, I'm telling you right now as an NBA player, like if I, with we or I, made multiple efforts and closed out the defense bent and I, we stopped that and we got it back, you know, we unbended it and we got it back and we did it again and we scrambled out and we fixed it again. But if time had happened the third time and they get a wide open three, I'm telling you right now it's demoralizing. It's absolutely demoralizing for coaches who want to call time out and say, come on guys, we got to give multiple efforts coaches want to call time out and say, come on guys, we got to do better. There is no better.

There is no better when a team is moving it like that. And you're playing the best defensive possible we can and you end up giving up a wide open corner three, like most valuable shot and basketball outside of the dunk. So that's where you just start to barrage of this and it's not, it's not like one time, Zach, it's 55 times a game out of the, you know, 100 possessions that they get with their bending the defense multiple times on a position. Here's what I mean by their intellect, their combination of intellect and speed.

So they're still switching a lot on defense. We can talk about their defense, their average on defense right now. I'm not worried about it all. I think they're going to be an elite defensive team when all is said and done.

They still switch a lot. And one of the trickle down benefits of switching a lot is that it screws up the match ups for the other team if you get a stop. So here's what happens against the Kings the other day. They switch and switch and switch and Kevin Herder gets stuck on Tatum.

Now Kevin Herder's fine. Decent defensive player Jason Tatum is Jason Tatum. Derek White, who by the way, all the attention is on Brogdon because he's the new guy and it's always fun to see how the sexy new toy looks. Derek White has maybe been not good.

His play has been maybe the most important variable lifting them from elite to like whatever the hell this is. He's shooting like 45% on three. He's playing with such confidence. Derek White speeds the ball up after a stop and they're doing that.

They're playing a little faster this year and they're doing the thing where they play fast off rebounds just for the sake of playing fast. Like even if I just drive it and nothing opens up for me, the trail three is going to be there. So Derek White speeds it up. He sees oh Tatum's got her on him.

Pitches the ball back to Tatum. Absolutely no hesitation. Just bowls herder over for a layup. Same game.

Possession number one. Marcus Smart, Jason Tatum, pick and roll. Tatum's the screener. Okay.

It's designed to like you can switch the Aaron Fox or whoever on Jason Tatum. Good luck. Possession one, they trap it. Smart slips a bounce pass to Tatum who cuts to the rim as a screener.

Defense rotates up to him. Drop off the Horford dunk. Next possession. Same place.

Smart Tatum, pick and roll while we trap it didn't work. Let's switch. Switch a guard onto Tatum, immediate bully ball floater and one. It's just like every possession.

Last season, what undid them was it just didn't seem like they were thinking on a lot of possessions against the Warriors like they would ignore good matchups. They would attack bad matchups when they were better just never doing that anymore. Every possession is this like calculated speed. It's really, really impressive.

Yeah. I think the most impressive part about all that is it's what you're saying they're doing, but they're doing it at an incredible rate. They're not doing it like a, oh wow, Jason Tatum has Steph Curry on him. Let's spend 10 seconds getting the ball to Tatum.

Let's stand around and watch what he does. It's like still happening in a blink of an eye. That's what I was telling you with the whole bending of defense. To bend the defense three separate times on a possession, you have to go fast.

So they're doing all that. Like you just said, like they're coming down. Kevin Hurst on Tatum. You move it to Tatum.

Now Tatum all of a sudden drives and comes over. Then you start moving that thing and eventually you're just going to give up a wide open look. So it's been really impressive to see. I think a lot of the, I think it's like a conglomerate of teams that kind of play out of ISO like the Phoenix Suns kind of pick on certain individual matchups.

We were a very good team by the way. Maybe they like getting a book around this guy combined that with the Golden State Warriors to do a lot of split action and off-ball action. You're like, you're blending that in combine that with having superstar players that can at any point, not off the catch off the rib off the dribble. They can break you down and then once again, then the defense.

So Zach, I'm all into this number right here. It's never been done. Could this be the first time that we see like 50, 40, 90 is like this huge historic thing. I don't think we're going to get to 90% from the free to line as a team, but that's not as relevant as we have never seen a 50% from the field of 40% from a three point line on a team level.

So last night, obviously was ridiculous last night. They started out at 49% from the field. They ended up on a game, 46%. And I think if they didn't, and that's like, this is 20 games in.

It's hard to like go up a point. They didn't put in like the, I hate using the word garbage time because I lived in garbage time. It's not garbage. It's just like, what, this is the black from a better term.

Like that made the percentage go down. They only scored like 19 points in the fourth quarter. But like they had a chance of raising their percentage up one point and being a legit 50% from the field, 40% from three. If you get that from a team, like that's insane to get and sell this right now or flirting with it every single night.

Well, and you mentioned garbage time and how you don't like that term. One of the stories of their season, I mentioned white who's been just fantastic and we saw how gunshot he got at when the likes were brightest last year. Hopefully I know they've worked Ben Sullivan, one of their assistant coaches has worked on Derek White's shot a lot. It seems to have worked.

One of the other stories of the season is like, whenever Peyton Prichard comes in, good stuff happens on both ends of the floor. Whenever Luke Cornett comes in, good stuff happens on both ends of the floor, elite rim protection. I mean, was it Uber that tried him twice in a row last night? And he was like, yeah, no, get that, get that out of here.

Sam Houser is everyone kind of like, it became a punchline. How like, oh, all these Celtics guys are hyping up. Sam Houser, he's good. And he can shoot off movement, which is an ingredient that I remember talking about it last year when they were approaching the trade deadline and the white rumors started.

I talked about how, man, I would love for this team. I like Derek White as a basketball player. I just wish they could find a movement shooter because it's an ingredient they don't have. And it would just, it would just snap up their offense, give them another, another way to draw too.

He does that. And those guys are all like, like two of those got pritchered in Cornett, might not even be in the rotation in the playoffs for some games, at least in their, they're coming in and they're killing it. Just top to bottom, this team is, is, is outrageously good. And to your point about the warrior stuff, I bookmarked it first game of the season.

We talked about it on NBA today. Early in that game against Philly, right? The opening is Philly smart, posted up, which is something I've always liked. And he's doing it more this year than ever in his career.

It's not much, but it's more than his career. It's posted up and they ran a split action that created an open three for Tatum. One of those actions where smart post up, he draws a little help and on top of him, right above the arc, there's two guys screening for each other, Tatum pops free. I booked him, mark that and I was like, ooh, that wasn't a big part of their playbook last year.

Same thing with these staggered screens and these Spain pick and rolls where it's like, Horford and Tatum are the screeners. So you put your center and your best player in that screening action. It's like, it just creates all sorts of problems. Like the other team centers involved.

Oh my god, the best players moving over there. What the hell we supposed to do? It's just they just amped it up. Joe Missoula is a really good offensive coach.

I mean, that's the bottom line. Yeah, he lets those guys go. Like, I think they have, I seem called about five plays a game and added that. It's just a way of like kind of organizing them to get into it.

But, no, they'll do things like two guys will randomly run up to the pick immediately. One guy will fly to the corner. It's just like, they're just reading basketball at such a high level right now. And Joe was talking about these guys or basketball IQs or off the chart.

So Joe doesn't get bogged down in the weeds because for the most part, like they're, they're like flowing out of all this action. So instead of, and this is like, and you hear a lot of coaches talking about this now, like instead of me calling plays, we have to teach action. Like we want to teach what two man action looks like and what does that mean for the rest of the people. I will say this, Zach, I will say that I personally like when the Celtics run any type of four out one in, it doesn't have to be like showing out a post player to be market smart.

You know, I like it when like I like the line up with Luke Cornette's out there, especially with a guy like Jason Tatum. I think their five out is good. When they were at their best or five out, they were cutting a lot better lately. I don't know, it just feels like they've settled into not cutting.

I just think we can really elite team. This is gonna be great because we're recording this on takes Tuesday. We got Miami and Miami Wednesday and Friday. I'm really curious to see how like Miami is not gonna go for five out.

I can tell you right now the way that they spread out. Now, maybe our offensive decision making is just too good, but in general, I feel like the best version of the Celtics is always having a guy cutting to the basket or like a luke cornet relocating or when Rob Williams comes back and he's that you know vertical threat. So that's what I think of like, I know it's weird. It's a historic offense.

I think it's actual room for improvement when a Rob Williams comes back and they have like more of that vertical spacer after rim. Well, they're not gonna shoot. Maybe they will. I don't think they're gonna shoot 41% from three as a team the whole year and they're elite.

Why not? Well, maybe they will. I don't know if they do like screw it like we're all screwed and long twos. They're killing it.

Jailing is shooting 55%. I'm long twos. Maybe that comes down that that would probably come down. So to your point, maybe they do at some point have to sort of not diversify but make sure they're slicing inside.

And I was gonna ask you the biggest question now is I think Joe Missoula has kind of revealed through his lineup choices that he leans a little towards smaller and spacing. I think he likes that starting five where they start white, smart, brown, Tatum, Horford. So only one big I think he likes that better than the Grant Williams, our Horford version. And so what do you think happens when Rob comes back?

Do they go right back to starting Horford and Rob Williams with smart Tatum Brown? Or is there any chance like Rob does Rob Williams become like six nan is Rob Williams? My guess I could listen. You never know in like what their intent is.

It's obviously until you see it. Like I think when we're in the playoffs, I can't imagine Rob is not starting. I do think in the regular season just to keep his minutes down. I think you would see him coming off the bench.

But like my, if you were to ask me like, this is the best team I've ever covered. I think this team, I'd be shocked if they don't end up winning a championship like something has to happen where it doesn't happen. But I am a little bit worried about Al Horford's minutes. Blake Griffin started last night.

That was great. Oh my God. That dunk that I thought Grant Williams, who was on the bench, was going to like run into the tunnel and never come back with the celebration was it was an awesome, you know, it's we're laughing about it. We all know who Blake Griffin was in the league.

For sure. We all know what happened to his body and how fast it happened and how prematurely kind of his career not ended. But he's not Blake Griffin anymore. That was an awesome moment.

Like I'm happy for him that he had a game like that. And he was great. Like that role was supposed to be Danilla Galinari to sort of Al Horford Galinari kind of go back and forth and see like just not navigate their regular season. But you know, like those things are important.

And I think Al Horford, I don't know, it's just my opinion. I know they have 100 Australian medical sports science guys walking around. I don't even know every one of their names. And I see them every day.

But I know what their job is. Their job is to make sure that Al Horford is healthy for comes into the air and that's everybody. And so, you know, I think when Rob Williams comes back, you'll see, you know, a little bit of Al Horford's minutes will take a dip, which will be a good thing. But I don't think that Rob will start off the jump.

And I don't think that guy should be a guy that you play all those minutes. And it'd be great if Luke Cornette continues to play as this year goes along. And if Luke Cornette is not a playoff player, which I don't know if he is or isn't, he definitely has assured himself a regular season player where he can go back the game impact winning or just keep you afloat. Like there's no doubt about it that this seems Deaf is going to be really important moving forward.

And I think that's everybody, Joe Mazzouba in that Washington game tried so hard not to put his starters back in, you know, Jalen Brown, but it's just like a lead strong from 29 to 14. And so, I think that would be the next challenge. Can you navigate a season winning games being great, but still not play guys like 37 minutes tonight. Like that's the challenge.

Well, one of the one of the positives about their start offensively is that they've been absolutely lights out dominant when it's just Tatum and when it's just Brown, like they don't, they haven't suffered at all when one of them sits. Part of that is white. Part of that is Brogden, who we should probably talk about. Brogden, he fits everything that we're talking about IQ, decision making, shooting, passing.

The other thing about him is that heads have been talked about as much. He's another something from nothing guy late in the shot clock. Like if a team actually does defensively, what you talk about, two, three sets of rotations. Okay, I'll just like kind of burrow bully ball drive in and get a layup or just I'll run like a normal high pick and roll and shoot along too.

Like he said another, the more guys you have that in a pinch with five on the shot clock and get you a decent shot from like nothing, I think that's an underrated part of what he's brought to their team. See the thing about Brogden, and he's mentioned it, and I've never heard a player talk about it like this, even though I think maybe they think about it, listen, I was never a star player. So I didn't, I never thought like this, but Brogden said, look, I was a main guy, but being the main guy for 35 minutes a night, that's hard to do. My body, he's admitted my body couldn't handle that type of workload, but he plays like the main guy, but he plays like 20 minutes a night.

And he has no problem handling that workload. And you're right, like something out of nothing, right? That's, that's the key here. Hey, don't do it round to do it.

You know, why could do it, but really Brogden can get to the basket, like with four seconds on the shot clock and get you a decent point blank layup most of the time it's with his left hand. And so that's also once again, from a psychological standpoint, going against this team, it's also demoralizing that you did everything right. And Malcolm Brogden, who checked into the game, just got right to the basket and got a point blank layup after you just had a great defensive possession. So yeah, underrated pickup, he, and he, when he's on the floor, don't be mistaken by he is the man, like he's the guy and he's aggressive.

He is like out there as a one option or a two option. And I think it's great because it allows like that group, one of my favorite groups to self-exhale is the Hayden Brogden and then Houser, Coronet and Grant Williams, like that group, you see the best version of Tatum, you get the best version of Brogden, Houser, Coronet and Grant Williams, like everyone's playing at their peak with that group. And Tatum, that's when you start talking about MVP, he does it with the starters, but man, when you get in with that group, like he, he himself goes to another level. And I think having Brogden out there helps him with that.

I think Tatum, Tatum's at 31 a game, eight rebounds, four and a half assists, 48% shooting. I think at worst, he's third in MVP right now, and he's probably passed Luca given the Mazzarista struggles to be second. He's playing defense at a borderline all defense level. Like, Scout, I don't, he's too young for these conversations to really start internist, but I mean, what he's doing is if he's a Celtic for life for most of his career, he has a chance to be historically for the one of the two historic giants in the league as great as any player who's ever worn that uniform, including Bird.

I mean, it's too early because you got to only know what could happen, but like, that's how good Jason Tatum is right now. Yeah, I mean, he's good. It comes down to just banter. So that's why, you know, like you asked me to come on here, so I'm going to need a favor from you.

Like, I'm not here to convince you, I'm just here to show you the light. He is, he is the MVP of the league to a quarter of the season. He's on the best team. Like, he played, he just sat out of game, but he plays every night.

He's like, he's durable, he defends, he rebounds, he has defensive versatility, offensive versatility. You see him in the post, you see him in the mid range, you see him from three, catching shoe, you see him. How about a block? Again?

Yeah, I mean, at this point, when I, you know, like, you can make that, you can make the Luca argument, Luca's nasty, right? Their team is struggling, but he's unbelievable. I think it's, I think it's Curry Tatum won two in some order right now. And I had, when I did it a week ago with Pelton, I had Curry number one, if you look at his numbers and the on off numbers and the words but you're right, 17 and 4, 17 and 4.

Like, I look if I had to vote right now, I don't know who I vote for, but he's right there. And if they have the best record in the league, he's probably gonna win. And that would be completely fine. I mean, where are you at?

Like, I love Curry too. I do, but, but Tatum is taking on like, he takes on the best matchup every night defensively. Not only does he take it on, but he like wants it. He like, I watched the play against John Moran.

And he was like, at the end of the game, it was a close game. Wait, I got John Moran. This is what people want to see. I got Luca Dodges.

Luca Smart though, Luca had a way. He's like, you know what, come over here instead of pick, I don't want this guy on me. I don't want this 6'10 frame on me that if I can't use that little step back and get, you know, he went 1 for 2 against him. That's not, that's Luca saying to himself like, I'm just not.

I'm not into your match up, your MVP match up and for you guys to see this. I'm just gonna go with a match up that I like. So like, Tatum is doing that. I'm like, eventually we're gonna play against Kevin Durant on Sunday.

Like, he's gonna want to see that matchup. By the way, Durant is playing nasty too right now. Durant is playing unbelievable. So, like, a lot of guys, like a lot of guys might duck that it's better for the team for me.

Not, we have defensive players to do that. Like, when your best player is doing that, come on, that's at the big time tone in the locker room. I had, I had like, Derrick Rose was like that. When I was in Chicago, he won the MVP.

He loved the matchup, you know, like Kevin Garnett, he didn't win the MVP, but you tell he was in that conversation. He loved the matchup. When your best players, Jason Kidd at times, loves it. We're going against the mat.

When your best players are doing that, Zach, it changes the entire complexity of your team. When your best players is wanting to take on the other team's best player defensively. Not just worried about their numbers. And we mentioned, you mentioned screening and sacrifice and, you know, they run this pet play where Horford or Grant Williams, Everett Center will set a pin down on the left side of the floor in the left corner for Tatum to come off the pin down and catch the ball on the move with an advantage.

If Tatum sees Horford's guy hanging back in the paint to protect penetration, he'll abort the play and screen instead for Horford and screen both guys and let Horford or Grant Williams come out and shoot an open three. Like, that's the kind of stuff you're talking about. And like, one of the numbers of the season I looked this up this morning, last year, Celtics set 48 off ball screens per 100 possessions. That was in the middle of the league.

This year, they're up almost at 60 in the top five in the league, and they're scoring like off the charts when they do that. And a lot of that is Tatum. Like he's using himself as a weapon in lots of different ways. And, you know, look, Rob is going to come back.

That's going to change the five out spacing a little bit, but it all obviously increases their upside on defense with the rim protection and all that. And just, you know, to win four playoff series, you need every tool in the toolbox, every look. So I think they're sealing only goes higher when he comes back, even if their offense takes a little dip as they kind of adjust to his presence and what he does to their space. And I'm not sure.

I mean, it's going to take a dip because right now, it's just if it doesn't take a dip, if we're having this, if they're at 120 points, 100 possessions in February, they're going to be like 42 and six or something like that. No, I just Rob is a like, I like Luke Cornette a lot, a lot. I think he's, I told everybody at the end of the year, you guys probably haven't watched him enough. He passes at a high level.

He's above the rim threat. But Rob is a better version of Luke Cornette. So I just think, I really believe that it's going to get better. I just, I do there.

The ability to make the right read doesn't go away. Playing, having a superstar player that carries the team, that comes and goes the right play, moving the ball, unless there's like crazy injuries, but it doesn't seem like they seem like they can sustain that. That doesn't go away. And they had their moments like they've lost to Chicago twice, two bad losses.

Cleveland twice, not bad losses. Cleveland is better than people think, but I shot the lights on him. Yeah, but I just feel like this is what you're going to get. So when we saw last year, historic, ridiculous game for by Steph Curry sort of changed into the momentum.

There were times last year where they were turning the ball over. Zach, I did a advanced stat, their second in the league and assist a turnover to assist a one-term. So the turnovers are down. The turnovers last year really killed them.

So they just shore up a few small things. Yeah, this team is going to be, I mean, it's going to be a really interesting run playoff run and what this group ends up doing. Well, you just nailed a really interesting thing about the Celtics is despite the fact that I think they will be in a lead defense team, they're decent now by the numbers. They're last in forcing turnovers and they're last in deflections by like a lot.

And you wouldn't expect that given their personnel. They also don't offensive rebound at all. And you're like, oh, that's okay. Maybe that sort of seems right.

They play small out. They care about transition defense. And then you look like if those are quote unquote weaknesses, they're compensating for them with the exact strengths, like mirror image strengths. They have the fourth lowest turnover rate in the NBA.

So it doesn't even matter if they're not forcing turnovers. They're going to be nice. They're offense would spike even more because they get fast breaks, but they're not turning it over. And there's sixth in defensive rebounding, which is a massive, massive story for them because it's been not a weak spot, but not a strong spot the past couple seasons.

I wrote about their gang rebounding in my column a couple weeks ago. They're they're like, all the wings and guards are coming back to crash. If this team can maintain sixth in defensive rebounding, the way they run and score off rebounds, that's a huge, huge deal. So even their weaknesses, quote unquote, are compensated by the exact strengths you'd want to compensate.

Like, I don't know what they're for them to be fourth in turnovers and moving it the way they are. They're eighth in assists rate. They were 14th last season. So they're sister up a bit.

I mean, it's a it's a tribute to really their two best guys, even though jail and browns is just eternal, ratio is still kind of close to equal. He's he's a more polished score, 26 a game and Tatum is data. I mean, they are they are a machine. Yeah, I did this podcast with you in the Celtics for struggling.

I don't know if it was last year of the year before early last season. And we talked about the hockey. No, no, it was with Brad. It was with Brad.

So the hockey assist, they were like 28 29th and hockey assist. And a lot of people didn't like make a lot of it. A lot of people asked the coaches to stop about it. I see all the writers, they do listen to your podcast.

So, but this year, they're number one hockey assist. And they're so you could just tell if you if you if I just said watch, what do you think they are in hockey is this and you watch the NBA for sure. Yeah, so I think they're number one this year in hockey assistant. I do believe in the NBA now with defenses as sophisticated as they are like coaches are so much better players are so much better taken away the three.

I do think that's a stat that it stands out. And if you want to be a great offensive team, you've got to make extra passes and you've got to be able to knock down shots off those extra passes. And that's what the Celtics do right now in a high clip. Look, here's here's the bottom line.

I picked the bucks to win the title this year. That was my preseason pick. I stick by the preseason pick. I don't I just like that's what it is.

I still think they can win the title. There's just no argument that a quarter of the way through the season, the Celtics are the champions of favorites. They are. Don't you have to wait and see Chris Middleton?

You do. And that's why I've said all along. I remain optimistic about the bucks. But just by the numbers right now, they're on pace for like 60 wins, 538 and best of all, reference have them about 60 wins, which is like seven more than anybody else.

Five or eight has a 30% chance of winning the finals, which is double anybody else. I don't again, I don't buy that I'm sticking with my bucks pick, but they have been beyond impressive. And the last thing is like, my favorite thing about not my favorite thing, but one thing you notice, every game for a team that a year ago, as you said, smart was calling them out. They were like, it was in fighting and like, Oh my God, is this a disaster?

They are taking so much joy in the success of their teammates. Like you'll see Tatum. He doesn't have to be involved in a play like when Derek White shoots and open three, he'll have to arm up with the three raised pump and his fist cheering. Like that's the sign of good stuff happening when your whole team is like, not just the bench guys who bench guys always celebrate when they're guys who are resting on the court are like, that was an awesome play.

We just made together. I'm happy you made that shot. That's a sign of good. It sounds cheesy, but it's a real thing.

Yeah. I mean, just going back to your, and yes, the scene really gets along and they they they play the right way. They care about winning and all that, but just going back to your bucks pick. Like I got a chance to interview Janus this year before the season in Steph Curry.

Like I'm as a Celtic fan who wants my team to win. I'm scared to death of those two guys. Like they just they have a non quit in them. That is a scary thing for a team because it's not like you go in there and like with Steph Curry, you have to beat him and you have to like, it's like, it's almost like you have to take his soul.

I think the same thing about Janus like last year, how did he, how did he push the Celtics to game seven that team had no business being out there with the Celtics? But he's just a scary guy for me like that from a guy who it's probably the same way people thought of Michael Jordan back in the 90s. Like you to beat Michael Jordan, what do you have to do? So four times four times.

Yeah, I know you I know. So it's like that's where when it comes to the box and I know the way you're struggling right now and the way you're struggling right now, the way you're going to be different when the playoffs start and all that stuff. And I do think the Celtics are the best team in the NBA and they can win. But like all the it's it's not you to beat those guys, you got to go to a whole new level.

And that's where I want to see the Celtics be able to do that show that I want to watch these matchups and like it is it is very difficult to beat those guys when they're full strength. And that's what I think the Celtics could get to that point. I think that their defense will get to that point. I think their mentality will get to that point.

But that was the thing that beat him last year, like the mentality of like, man, we got loose with the basketball, like Miami going on a 23 to two run like those things. We're not seeing anything like that team this year, but you still have to go through those two guys. If those teams are healthy, they're going to be a challenge. I think the Celtics are going to win.

But man, those two guys are impressive individuals. And we'll see what the Sixers have to say about it if they ever get healthy. And the next few games for the Celtics, you mentioned Miami, a back two game series in Boston with the heat who always seem to play the Celtics top. And then Brooklyn, and you can better believe that KD remembers state of malplate him in the playoffs last year, starting a whole conversation about like, what was this guy in the series?

And blah, blah, blah. I'm going to bring on Tim Bond times now to talk about that Miami Heat, but Brian Scalabrini will do this again. I look forward to seeing you soon in Boston just an unbelievable job on the broadcast with the Hall of Famer Mike Gorman. Keep up the great work, my friend.

All right, thanks. All right, let's talk about the very strange and maybe discouraging season of the Celtics next opponent in their next two games. Actually, the Miami Heat 10 and 11 was it was borderline Def Con one for a second when they were seven and 11. They've now won three in a row, two over the wizards and one over the Hawks who are kind of flailing around a little bit recently to get to 10 and 11 and stabilize like the heat always seem to do.

They always seem to stay there. Are we playing five two way guys in G-Ligars? Yeah, we still kind of want a six minute stretch. We stabilized our team, bam out of bio, playing like an all-star scoring like an all-star scoring more than ever.

Jimmy Butler maybe back soonish from lingering knee issues. That's kind of not encouraging. When they were seven and 11 Tim Bontemps, I started thinking, is it over? Is it just over?

Like is the window? Is the Butler window closed? Do they have another move in them? Is the move this summer?

Is the move now? Is this just a placeholder season for them? And now they've won three in a row. You know they're going to punch above their weight.

That's what they do. They're up to eighth in defense. That's what they do. They're plus 10 per 100 possessions when Jimmy and Bama on the court together.

It hasn't been that much, but they're plus 10. That's something. What is this team Tim Bontemps? I think they're a decent to good team that I mean, when you talk about their window being closed, I think unless they can swing, you know, one of these Miami Heat moves to get another big time player with not a lot of stuff.

I do think the window is kind of closed for them being a championship caliber team because if you look at the way their season is played out, even with the injuries, I came into the year wondering if they were going to have enough juice offensively to really be able to hang with these elite teams. And ultimately, when you watch and play, that's just the thing that just I keep coming back to like for as good as Bam out of bio has been. If he's one of your top two players, I just don't know if your offense is going to really be able to be good enough to hang with the likes of the Bucks and the Celtics and you know, be a team that's a true contender to get out of the East. And you know, obviously if they get Jimmy back to get healthy, they start hitting some more shots, their offense is going to look better.

But that was my fear about them coming into the season. And so far, in the limited time they've been healthy when I was actually around the bit to start of the year when they played Boston and Toronto. That was the question I came away with then. It's the one I still have now.

Yeah, I mean, half court offense is going to be the question for this team always. You know, I can hear the Heat fans. I can hear hashtag Heat Nation right now. So wait a second, wait a second, wait a second.

We made the finals in 2020. And we're a Jimmy Butler in and out three from beating the, oh, the juggernaut, Celtics, everyone's so scared at the Celtics. Oh my God, the Celtics, oh, the Bucks, we've also beaten them in the playoffs, by the way, we're a joint about the right now three from making the 2022 finals in your, your rightness off. We're the eighth, eighth best defense despite the fact we've been missing all these guys with a PJ Tucker walking your, your rightness off plus 10 with Jimmy and Bam on the floor Kyle Lowry starting to perk up now perk up like Kyle has been good.

Kyle is second in the league in minutes. That's right. The only reason he eats are even a float right now is because Kyle has been really good while they've had all these injuries. Although I will say number one second in the minutes scares me like I'm worried that they're doing what the next did to a lesser player in Patty Mills last year where they just played him to death in the first 40 games of the season to survive.

I would like if Kyle just wanted to take two weeks off and go to the beach right now, I'd be cool with that. Probably going to play golf if he was taking two weeks off, but that's the only difference. Well, whatever, whatever he is, he is a big golfer, whatever he wants to do to be second in minutes. But you know, and defensively, they're on pace to shatter the record for most zone defense ever played in the recorded history of the NBA.

They've already played 570 possessions of zone. The record, the record is like a thousand and we're 20 there. So they're going to double the record, but they're scraping by. We can talk about their zone and why I think it works for whatever is back and hear the nation saying wait a second, you're writing us off, you're writing us off.

Kyle Lowry's working up. Tyler heroes back after he was injured for a while, had his nice has a nice two man chemistry with Bam on these little wing picking rolls got Bam a bunch of lob dunks recently. Yeah, Victor LeDeepo is alive. I mean, he's alive.

Is he going to play? That's a great question. He exists. We have some basketball player though.

We have some graphics to play and we're always a top out, but I think a couple of things happen. They, the Jimmy Health stuff is worrisome. Let's just be optimistic and assume he's healthy in the playoffs, even the last playoffs he had to miss games. Sure.

Boston's better and Milwaukee's going to be better like the top of the east and the middle of these. I forget the middle of Cleveland, the mid tier to good playoff teams. The top playoff teams are also better. And that's I think is much the reason why it feels like the moment has passed Miami as anything else.

I'm never going to doubt the team. I've learned better than to doubt them, but it's one thing to say. You can go toe to toe with any one team, get some breaks in a playoff series. It's another thing to say.

I'm just making this up. I can go Philly, Milwaukee, Boston, Toronto, Milwaukee, Boston in a row beat three of those teams in a row. It seems like a little bit of a stretch. Well, look, last year, they didn't have to play the two best teams in the east, right?

They had to play one of them. And the Celtics, you know, as we saw throughout the playoffs, had their ups and downs. And Miami, as you said, was, you know, was one Jimmy Butler three from winning that series and going to the finals. But the way this year is shaken out, it's going to take a lot for Boston and Milwaukee to not be the top two teams in the east.

And so that means to your point, if you're getting out of the Eastern Conference, you've got to be both of them. And I just, as it stands right now, this heat team has too many flaws to me to be a legitimate contender, to be either Milwaukee or Boston, let alone both of them. By the way, that's the same for this whole group of teams, Toronto, Cleveland, Atlanta, you know, I'm forgetting one of the group of five teams. Oh, fairly, obviously, that whole group of teams, so three to seven, you put them in a hat, any, you know, they could go any order from three to seven to me between now and the end of the season.

I think all of them have real flaws below Boston, Milwaukee, you know, and like you said, sure, Miami's got the ability, you know, got incredibly creative for an office, they've got arguably the best coach of the league, you know, if anybody's going to pull off a trade to improve this team, it's them. But there's just a lot of structural flaws in the team, I think it's going to make it hard. Well, and heroes hard to trade this season because of his extension, he's also essential to their team, as much as Tyler heroes become kind of a polarizing player among NBA diehards, like there was this whole is really better than our Jay Barrett debate, which I think isn't was worthy debate to have. He's a good player.

Yes, he's a minus defender. We all know that we get that he's a pretty good rebounder. They need his playmaking a lot on this team because Kyle Lowry is just not going to be an elite driver playmaker. In fact, man, he could he take a layup like once could he take a layup.

I know, you know, we like everyone just Ben Simmons career was temporarily ruined by one pass out of a with Trey young as the only defender under the rim. How allow we made that exact pass two nights ago against us wide open layup. Yeah, Trey young was not even near. He was like five feet away and he kicked a Caleb Martin.

God bless his soul. Caleb Martin's playing really well if Caleb Martin's starting power forward. I don't know if you're a ton of kind of like Kyle, can you even even the heat broadcast was like, can you maybe shoot a layup? My man?

Like you're a tight tear. I don't know. I saw the same play. I had the same reaction.

I was like, this is today's NBA. We're passing out a layup. But that was the same play that like Ben Simmons was right over the cold and I understand it's game seven of the playoffs. There's a different he's also he's also he's also six inches taller than Kyle Lowry too.

Just another slight difference. Don't just say it. Think of layup. They're going to need all the points you can get, man.

You need all the point all the easy points you can get. That's a fair point. I do think, you know, there's one obvious name to keep an eye on with the heat. Might be more of an offseason thing than an in-season thing.

Can you can you guess the name? I'm not sure actually, but what you're saying it's an offseason thing. Who is it? Who are you thinking of?

Well, I think they're ever they're forever going to be linked to sniffing around, investigating, thinking about analyzing, holding meetings about Bradley Beale. If and when the wizards ever get there and the wizards are game over 500. So maybe they'll never get there. And of course he has a no trade clause.

You know, they have a good record of sort of prying away, as you said, the heat these heat deals where they get great players like Jimmy Butler for a song. And but that may be down the line. If this is their team, more or less, right? If this is their team this season, I think they I think their defense will carry them.

I think that five 38 hasn't for like 46 wins. Best of all reference. I can't remember something. I admit that's about right.

That seems about right to me. And you know, right in that band of those five teams, Cleveland, Atlanta, Philly, Toronto, Miami, put those teams, they're going to be somewhere I think between three and seven, all of them. And could be third, could be seventh. I think all those series in the middle of the East playoffs are going to be awesome.

Because all those teams have, you know, differing flaws and they're really competitive. And you know, it'll be interesting to see how it shakes out. But yeah, I mean, they're just they've got a solid, a very solid team, but they just have these really strong flaws that are just going to make it difficult. You mentioned Tyler Hero, he is really critical to what they do.

They really need him to be a creator offensively. But if you're leaning on Tyler Hero that much, to be honest, you're just not that level of a team, in my opinion. Because at the other end of the court, in particular, you're going to get demolished in the playoffs. Because teams are going to line him up, they're going to go right through them, and it's going to be a huge problem.

And that's where there's a difference between the best teams and the rest of the league. If you look at the numbers, you know, the numbers say you asked this question, can you survive defensively with hero and Struce on the floor? Because you need their shooting, they're two of your top five players right now. Your inclination would be to say, well, no, that's, you know, Struce is okay in some matchups, Tyler Hero is not.

The numbers are elite regular season and playoffs the last two years. But you've seen it with Jason Tatum or Gianna Sata Nakugo or whoever Chris Middleton, it's a little uglier against those kind of players. The playoffs have become about minimizing your weaknesses. It's really more than anything else.

You look over the past few years, you've got the teams that have won, like when Toronto won, Toronto ran out eight or nine guys who there weren't really a weakness at either end. Some of them, you know, Marcus all wasn't much of a shooter by the end. Other guys weren't great defensive players, but there wasn't a there's a guy you're just going to go at every time. The Celtics last year didn't have a guy at either end.

You really were going to go at every time and have success against, you know, but if you have a guy who either doesn't shoot or can't play offense or is a guy you're just going to line up an attack on defense over and over and over again. When you get to the later stages of the playoffs, teams are just going to relentlessly hunt that over and over and over, and it's not going to end well for your team. Well, and you know, we talked about their half court offense and why those two guys feel so essential. And it's when you have Butler and BAM on the floor, you have two guys who are not three pointers.

Now Jimmy shooting 36% from three by his standards, high volume, right? BAM is a non-shooter from deep. Even his long two kind of comes and goes. And you have Caleb Martin on the floor with them.

He's hanging in the dunkers spot like the spacing just gets as smart as those dudes are as much as they can make something from nothing is with handoffs and cuts and whatever. It just gets a little gummy sometimes and Caleb Martin shooting well from three to his just he's in the dunkers spot a lot and people just don't respect him as a shooter. So you feel like you need those two guys. But you know, can you survive defensively?

Look, the vision for them is in the playoffs, Jimmy's a top 10 player. I think that's been proven out. Jey Butler's a monster. He's a top 10, two way player when the chips are down.

I voted for for Easter Conference finals MVP last year. I mean to sell me. Oh, I forgot about that. I forgot that was he was that named after bird?

Is that the Larry Bird? I have to. I know the other ones, the Magic Johnson? I guess so.

I guess so. I don't know. And after that, the vision is A, we defend well because we're the heat and B, we have an apex guy who may not be like a 30 a game battle. Sometimes he is.

And then it's this sort of democratic. Everybody can hurt you. Kyle, hero, BAM. All these guys are capable of getting 20 on a particular night.

That's the vision. And as I said, they're plus 10 with Jimmy and BAM. They're starters who have barely played together are a solid plus. And by the way, I got to have perk on to debate this because I am so tired of like, well, I'm disappointed in Bam on a bio.

When is Bam on a bio? I'm gonna average 27 points a game. When is Bam on a bio? Going to carry his load as number two guy like the heat have a lot of problems.

Bam on a bio is not one of the heat's problems. He's averaging 21 points a game, nine rebounds, three assists, 55% shooting on twos. He's making a case for defensive player of the year in his own right. Yeah.

And look, I mean, one of the reasons I like their zone is it keeps him closer to the rim where they really need him near the rim because they're so small other than him. Like he's not going to average 27 a game. There just aren't any big men who are going to do that. He is going to average 20 on some nights when he's feeling it or you need he's going to get you 28.

This is not quite who he is. Like, I think he does have 22 23 in him. But like, I just I know why we do it because we're like, well, the number two guy needs to do more. That's not the vision for the game.

Not the problem here. Just not at all. I love Bam. I mean, he's a he's a fantastic player.

He's the definition of the modern NBA big, right? He switched out to the perimeter. Like you said, he could protect the rim and guard point guards and a pinch. He can handle the ball and offense.

But at the other end of the court, I mean, while he is a terrific passer, he does a lot of things on offense. He isn't a guy that's going to be your number one or two guy on a championship level team, right? He is your third guy in theory, a guy who is going to be an 18 to 20 point a game guy. And then that's, and that's to me like, yeah, like, bam, is it going to get to 2728 game.

But because of that, that's why I look at the seat team and they just feel like they're a guy short, right? Because in theory, you have Bam and you have Jimmy and then you have a third guy, who is your other high scoring guy that goes with them. And then you've got, you know, kind of the traditional big three and then you're a championship caliber team. I'm sure like you said, he nation is sitting at home screaming saying Tyler hero is going to be that guy.

He's developing it further by the way, he might be a big thing about Tyler hero last summer when he was like the sort of Durant, yeah, the Mitchell, you know, theoretical centerpiece. And my takeaway after watching tons of film on him was a he needs to be a little more clay Thompson than he has been like, I get that you want to be a ball handler, but you also need to dialed into this part of your game because you're such a good shooter move and shoot fast. And I said, I think his upside to me, you can call it a ceiling if you want his upside scenario is like C. J.

McCollum. I think he can be that good of a scorer. And he's not numbers wise, not even far away. It's a really good player.

Like it's not a perfect player. It's not an all star. It's not it's like, he's never been an all star. He's been close, but it's a really good player.

I don't think that's as polarizing as he's gotten. I don't think that's like out of bounds. Not only so either. And it's interesting to bring up C.

J. because I find that whole there's a whole group of young rising two guards right now, Tyrese Maxie and Philly, Anthony Simons and Portland, Jordan Poole with the Warriors Tyler here in Miami. I think all four of those guys are pretty fascinating to me because I sort of wonder if three or four years from now, we're going to look at them in sort of a similar group to guys like to my bonus Julius Randall, John Collins, in the sense that in today's NBA, where things are going, if you're an offense, first power forward, that's become a pretty devalued position in terms of being a player that drives winning doesn't mean those players are bad players. I love watching the most players play, but you have a ceiling if that's one of your best couple players.

And I do wonder if these offense for shooting guards, I can't really guard anybody, you know, we saw Jordan Poole really struggle late to play us last year. We saw Tyler before he got hurt, you know, struggle with the Celtics defensively. I love Tyrese Maxie. He certainly still has issues defensively.

I just wonder if we're going to look at a couple of years at that same is kind of the guard equivalent of those forwards where they're really good players. They do a lot of things that help you win games. But if you're trying to be a team like we both would agree, the mind of heat are a team that focuses on one thing, which is winning titles. And if they're not, they're trying to get back to that point again.

Like, I don't know, C. Jim McCollum, if he's one of your top three guys, like maybe that player, maybe he could be a guy in the Jameson caliber team, maybe, but I don't know if you can, like that, if you're looking at the heat going forward, that to me is the number one question. Like can Tyler here, I'll be good enough to make that a real big three? Or what I think is more likely is the contract he just signed.

Is that the piece with the draft picks that he'd have? Is that what Miami uses to try to get that third guy, whether it is Bradley Beal or it is somebody else down the road that they then put with Bam and Jimmy. And then there's their big three. I think that's the pivot point for Miami going forward, which is why that piece for the last summer was a very interesting one because it really laid out sort of what the trajectory is for Tyler on what it means for that.

Yeah. And to your larger point, you know, when they were seven and 11 and really struggling, they may be seven and 13 or sorry, 10 and 13 after these games against Boston, they have Memphis F-F-F-F as they could be 10 and 14. Good. Same.

Oh my God, conversation again in a week. Yeah. There was a lot of like, should they just move on from this era chatter? Like, let me dial up some fake Jimmy Butler trades.

I think they'll go the other way and try every possible means of something this Jimmy Bam window, maybe Kyle if he's around next year, just a crack open. Explore every possible. He had already about going backwards. No, that's not their move.

Their move is to try to incrementally increase, especially when they're close enough. We're like, I think we both agree. They're able to make one move. They're right there with the teams at the top.

Like, it's not like they're, I mean, I'm talking one move like to get a real player. I'm not talking about like, those teams are really good. No, they're really good. But I'm saying like, they're close enough to being a championship contender that it's not a pipe dream that they could find a way to get a star and be right there.

That's my point. That's more much more likely to me than anything that goes the other direction. Look, real quickly to wrap up, there are some reasons to hope that this team is better than it's record. I mentioned the numbers with Jimmy.

I think their offenses looked a little crisper in terms of its continuity that it kind of lost earlier in the season. All that passing cutting was kind of stolen out. I think that's that's back to some degree. They've been shooting horribly from like everywhere.