The Cottage Foodie Con and A Big Announcement

Today I'm talking with Matt at The Cottage Foodie. You can also follow on Facebook. https://www.homesteadliving.com/subscribe/ref/41/ https://homesteadliving.com/the-old-fashioned-on-purpose-planner/ref/41/ www.patreon.com/atinyhomestead If you'd like to support me in growing this podcast, like, share, subscribe or leave a comment. Or just buy me a coffee  https://buymeacoffee.com/lewismaryes 00:00 listening to A Tiny Homestead, the podcast comprised entirely of conversations with homesteaders, cottage food producers, and crafters. I'm your host, Mary Lewis. Today I'm talking with Matt, at The Cottage Foodie in  Minnesota. I think it's Eden Prairie.  Good morning, Matt. How are you? I'm fantastic, Mary. Fantastic. How are you? I'm good. Are you in Eden Prairie? Yes. Yeah, you got that right. Good. I've talked to a lot of people in Minnesota lately and I was like, I... 00:27 Don't remember where the heck he is. know the conference wasn't even very so.  All right. So Matt's been on the podcast, I think three times already. Might only be two. This might be the third. I'm not sure.  And typically I would ask how the weather is, but I'm guessing you have the same kind of overcast gray, drizzly day we've got going in  Lasur. Yep. Exact same thing.  I think the rain has passed over us and, but yeah, it's, 00:55 It's just kind of a dreary, dreary day so far. So hopefully the sun can break through by this afternoon.  Yeah, we got 1.8 tenths of an inch, 1.8 inches  of rain yesterday between 2.30 and 5 o'clock. Oh wow. That's more than we got here. I  looked at the rain gauge and from uh my front window, I can't see  that anything is in there. So I know I did not get an inch.  Yeah. 01:22 It was sheets of rain coming down yesterday at about 2 40. Um, my husband had gone to have lunch with his dad for his birthday and he drove in just as it started raining sheets of rain. came and he was soaked and we need the rain. You know, I hate to sound like a typical homesteader, but as a homesteader, we need the rain. Yeah, but that's a lot in just a few hours. That is, yeah. 01:51 That is a lot. Luckily, the ground is probably dry enough that it soaked it all up. if that would have been where even the ground was  partially wet, could have been, eh you know, that could cause flooding and things like that. So it's good that we needed it and we got it. Yeah, we have a useless garage and there's a cement pad in front of it. Like we don't use the garage because the doors are broken. It was that way when we moved in  and we were told that it's not even worth fixing it.  And  it's a low spot. 02:21 And every time it rains like that, we say, oh, Lake Lewis is back because that's our last name.  So anyhow, that's the weather report from Minnesota today.  Yes.  And it's going to be super freaking hot tomorrow and Wednesday. So for those of our friends who live in Minnesota, definitely stay hydrated because otherwise you're going to feel like crap tomorrow and Wednesday. 02:49 Yeah. And what are they describing the humidity level? They call it, it's going to be tropical.  So yeah, that with the heat, you're absolutely right.  Hydrate, hydrate, hydrate. In the second week of June, it's not supposed to do this until at least the last week of July, as far as I'm concerned. I don't love this at all. This is not my favorite weather. oh So,  um,  you,  I met you because of your Facebook page, Sergeant Shortbread. 03:19 Yes.  Are you still doing shortbread? Yes. Yes, I am. um Sergeant shortbread, much like Matt Rosine, is he's not completely retired like Matt Rosine is. yeah, just slowly.  I don't do a whole lot of posting on my  Sergeant shortbread  social media accounts anymore, a little bit here and there. But uh and I do some uh some some events, farmers markets and things like that here and there. But 03:48 For the most part,  my focus is mainly turned towards um what can I do for the cottage food industry as a whole. So that's kind where my  focus has turned, but I do still take orders. I just did an order  in February, which is my largest order ever.  A company in Chaska, Minnesota ordered 187 dozen cookies and they wanted them  packaged in packs of three cookies per pack. 04:17 Oh my god.  So yeah, that was a big order.  So yep, still doing it, but I think most of the people either know me or they find me through Google now because I just don't do a whole lot on my certain short put  social media like I mentioned. Okay, I gotta know.  187 dozen.  How do you do that? Do  you make a few batches and freeze them and then you'll just keep adding or how do you get that done? 04:48 So  the nice thing with shortbread, course, you can make the dough ahead of time. um You know, they're icebox cookies. So I made the dough the week before  and it just sat in my fridge. And then when it was time to bake,  I  baked, think for three days,  three days straight. It was just nothing but baking and packaging and then delivered them on day four. Cause shortbread cookies,  you know, they stay good for, you know, two, three, four weeks. um 05:17 So yeah, it, yeah, I baked, literally did nothing but baked and packaged for, I think it was two, three days, three days straight, and then delivered them on that fourth day. You must have been so happy to be done with it and have them off your plate. Yes. Yes. And to be honest, one of the worst things, and I've said this from the beginning, one of the worst things that I hate the most about the, I don't want to say, 05:45 you know, doing the shortbread cookies. It's the packaging, putting all the stickers on. You got to put a sticker on the front. You got to put an ingredient label on the back. And so it just seems like it takes forever. And if I was to ever hire somebody, it would be to put the stickers on my packaging and do my dishes. Those would be the two people. So if anybody out there is looking for a job to put stickers on and wash dishes in my home, just let me know. Right there with you. I had to label some soaps last week at the farmers market for this weekend. 06:15 And it was only a few. And the thing that I hate about putting stickers on is I have this thing where I want the stickers to look perfect.  And they're round. They're like  one and a half inch diameter stickers.  And I want them to be centered and I want them to be straight. And it's really hard to do that by hand.  And I was like, nevermind. We are a rustic homestead. They don't have to be perfect.  I agree. 06:42 It sounds like I have the exact same sticker. I think it's a one and a half or between one and a half and two inch round sticker. Oh I gave up on that a long time ago. I'm like, can't. These just have to get on there, make them at least 90 % straight and we're good. Yeah, having OCD with stickering is not a good plan and I don't have it. So that's good. But I do definitely lean toward perfectionism. And if it isn't perfect, it drives me a little nutty. 07:08 So yeah, I get it. Stickering things and not only the process of doing that but the cost of labeling things is just ridiculous. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I order all my, I order my, my, I do my own ingredient labels. I print those myself, but the, the logo sticker that goes on the front that um I just order that pre-printed and yeah, that, that adds up quickly. 07:33 but you can't not do it because that's how you have marketing right on your product. you've got  to do it. It's so frustrating and so important at the same time. It's just the way it is. okay, now we've got all that.  don't think I ever asked you what prompted your interest in  furthering the cottage food  registration or law. 08:02 thing. Yeah.  So mean, when as I was doing Sergeant Shortbread  and this,  I believe we talked about this last time maybe, but I'll just kind of, this is kind of how part of the whole story, guess, went from Sergeant Shortbread to the directory,  the Cottage Foodie directory, which then of course, led to  Cottage Foodie Con, the conference. um So  the directory, I mean, that's, I thought I saw a need or I found a need. um 08:32 where people were cottage food producers were looking for uh visibility. And so I thought, well, I'm going to create a directory. They can put a profile on there and then I will just do paid Facebook ads for them driving customers to the directory, not necessarily to individual  cottage food producers, but to the directory itself where the consumer could then start shopping for somebody in their local area, for the product that they're looking for and so forth. And so once I 09:01 Once I started that in order to create visibility for myself in front of cottage food producers, I went to Cookie Con in Reno a year ago. So was March of 2025. I went to Cookie Con and had great response at Cookie Con. I had people come up, ranged everywhere from, they came up to me and they're like, I have never heard of you and I have no idea what you do, but tell me what it is that you do. 09:29 I'm interested in  hearing about it. And so I would tell them. And then I had all the way to the other end of the spectrum, people will come up and say, we came here just for you. How do I sign up? And they would sign up right on the spot.  And  so while I was there, I'm like, oh my gosh, this is great. This is just really great visibility, whether they sign up or not. This is just incredible visibility. uh so  then as I was there, I was like, okay, but I need to add, is cookie con is for just decorated sugar cookies. 09:58 And so then I realized, well,  I need to get in front of all of the cottage food producers, regardless of what product. And so that's where I came up with the idea to do the cottage food conference, which  I Googled it and  in-person national in-person cottage food conference had never been done before. The last uh national cottage food conference was a hundred percent virtual and it was in 2023, I believe was the last year. uh 10:26 but it was  100 % virtual.  anybody who knows me knows that  I  am a in-person, I'm a very outgoing type of guy. So I need to see people in person. And so that's why I decided, well, this has to be in person. So let's try to figure this out. uh But yeah, that's how  everything built. But yeah, I guess my passion for just helping grow the cottage food industry is just, I've just been an entrepreneur, I believe, all my life. 10:55 For part of my life, was hidden,  I just always have been an entrepreneur. so I've got a real soft spot for entrepreneurs who are just trying to  do their own thing. And it just so happens that I found a passion for  baking and the food industry. so that's  kind of where the passion for helping grow the cottage food industry came from. Okay. That catches everybody up to right now.  cottage foodie comp. 11:24 The Cottage Foodie Con was back in April and I want to hear how it went. It went fantastic. It was incredible. It was just, I mean, it's almost hard for me to talk about because it just was so great. I can't even figure out words to describe it. yeah, so overall we ended up with 143 11:52 individuals physically walked through the door at the conference and they ranged from 18 different states were in attendance  and even two countries. we had  friends from Canada come down,  cottage foodie friends from Canada wanted to attend. And so uh we had 160 registration, but 143 of them actually showed up.  So it was just, it was amazing. It was two and a half days of just networking. 12:21 and breakout sessions,  a couple of keynote speakers.  And it just the biggest takeaway that  that people were giving us as far as feedback goes, is they couldn't get over how it just felt like almost like they were in their home kitchen with with people all around them. I mean, it was just everybody was there for the same reason. There was no like competitions. There was nobody trying to outdo each other. It literally was just a huge community. 12:50 of like-minded people all in the same building and learning at the same time and sharing stories and networking. it just, yeah, it went fantastic. We're beyond excited how the first one went and of course, how year number two, 2027 is it going to go. Awesome. So my next question is how many of the attendees did you actually get to talk to as the person who was hosting this? 13:20 So  funny thing is, that was my job, was to talk to everybody. So I bet I probably talked to oh probably three-fourths of them. oh that was, uh we knew going into it,  all of my co-organizers, were like, man, you have one job and one job only during this conference. And that is to take your personality and your  outgoing  attitude and you need to just talk to everybody. 13:48 So yeah, think I got to talk to, gosh, probably three fourths of them. 13:55 Awesome. When it was over, did you need two days  to have some quiet and regroup?  I did. I didn't get it, but I did.  after it was all over and we had everything cleaned up from the venue and  we left, four of my co-organizers, they're all from out of state. And so they all had flights to catch and then none of them 14:21 I mean, the earliest one was like four or five in the afternoon. So they were, and we were done by like 1230, one o'clock, I think on Saturday. And so they were like, Hey, you know, we're to go grab lunch. Matt, you want to come with? Absolutely. So we went and grabbed lunch. And while we were there, we all made the commitment. We're like, okay, we were going to take a week off. We're, not going to, we're just going to re just think about everything. We're going to kind of gather our thoughts. We're going to catch our breath. We're going to rejuvenate and then we'll come back a week from Monday and 14:50 jump on our regular column or start we'll start planning 2027. Well, Sunday morning at 8am I got a an email, Matt, what do think of this idea? Super long email about here's an idea for next year. I was like, and I'm available right now if you if you want to hop on the phone. So and that was that was David Crabill who does the the forger podcast emailed me Sunday morning. So so yeah, I got probably about I don't know. 15:20 16 hours to gather my thoughts and catch my breath. it's great. It's awesome. were all, we were just riding high from the whole experience. And then once we started getting feedback, that just threw fuel on the fire because we got great feedback. It was good and bad. There were some things that people want to see different, which that's what we wanted. I would have been 15:46 pretty upset if everybody would just said everything was great don't change anything because that's not true. We have to change something there's no way that it went perfect because we know that it didn't go perfect so um yeah  it's it's exciting we're  ready we're ready to uh we're ready for  for year two.  I am so glad that it was pretty much everything you hoped it would be from what I knew you hoped it would be. um 16:15 I said before we started recording, had two questions.  One was  how many people who attended were brand new  to the cottage food concept? And the second question is how many people were already in cottage food production, but just wanted to learn more?  Yeah. So we  had it broken down to  when they registered, they had to  kind of tell us where they were at in their journey. And so I'd have to 16:45 dig the exact numbers out, but I broke it down by percentage. And I think I remember correctly, it was probably 60 to 70 % were at either three or more years of experience. And then one to three years of experience was another, I think 20%. And then there was maybe a dozen to 15 individuals who hadn't even started yet or. 17:13 for less than one year. yeah, was, the good majority of it was  people who have been doing this for  three or more years. And so  next year, we really want to,  we wanna expand  on um those demographics. So next year, we're gonna be a little bit more um intentional about having specific classes for brand new. 17:40 people who either are looking at the cottage food industry or know they want to do it, but just don't know where to start. So we're going to be more intentional about having a broader variety of classes geared specifically towards the zero experience up to a year of experience. That's awesome. Cause that'll draw new people in. And it's also kind of hard because I'm going to say this, I shouldn't, but I'm going to anyway.  We have had so many,  um, 18:10 little cottage food stands popping up around here, around LaSore.  And I'm really tickled for the people who are doing it. There's one young woman, I don't think she's even 25 yet, and she lives right in town in LaSore, Minnesota. And she has a little shed where she sells her cottage food baked goods.  And she has really good success because she's in town.  People know she's there and they just stop by on their way home from work and pick up goodies or bread for dinner or whatever. 18:40 And that's fabulous. But  I,  my husband and I had this conversation this weekend because he was at the farmer's market  and  it was okay. He sold some things, but it wasn't like a big killer weekend for  money coming in.  And  I said, it because it was so sticky out? Cause it was so muggy this weekend. It was hot. And  he said, I don't know. He said, I think maybe. 19:09 He said, but he said, do you know there's like at least 10 farm stands within a five mile radius of Lesor? Oh my gosh. And I said, no.  And he said, yeah. He said, it's great. He said, I'm glad that people are doing it. He said, but he said, that's a lot. He said, Lesor only has like 6,000 people.  said, our market share is going to be split. 19:39 more this year than it was last year. And I laughed and I said, well, good, my podcast is doing its job, encouraging people to grow their own things and sell it. But it's also bad because other people are growing their own things and selling them. And he just laughed. I guess it's that be careful what you wish for, Adij. You there? Yep. You're kind of cut out. 20:06 I say, guess is that be careful what you wish for adage that we all hear.  exactly. Exactly. Yeah. It's yeah. I mean, I think the latest count uh for cottage food producers in Minnesota is fourteen thousand.  And so,  yeah, it's  they're starting to pop up everywhere. And so, yeah,  I just hope that it doesn't end up being like uh like we're seeing with with breweries in Minnesota. There are so many breweries. 20:35 you in the last 10 years or so. now it just seems like every time once a week, I see here's a brewery closing, here's a brewery closing. And so, um so yeah, it's, uh you know, you just you hope that that's not the case in the cottage food world. but um yeah, that's where the cottage food producers in these farm stands, you just you need to figure out a way to differentiate yourself from the next person. Even if you're selling the same products, you got to figure out a way to differentiate, differentiate. eh 21:04 differentiate,  you know, that word. ah You need to stand out.  Yeah, need your stand to stand out.  Yeah, exactly. Okay, so I was looking at your Facebook page today and I saw that there's something very new on the horizon that you weren't at Liberty to talk about a month ago, but you are now. So what is the new thing? ah Well, we just, mean,  with the, what we believed 21:32 as you know, the success of Cottage Food Econ, we wanted to create something and actually  myself and my co-founder, we've been thinking about this for a few months now. It wasn't just like, Cottage Food Econ went great, so let's do this. But we've been actually talking about it for a few months, but just kind of like, okay, let's just focus on Cottage Food Econ right now. Let's get this off the ground and let's get the first one in the books and then we can uh think about  this new venture. um 22:00 So yeah, it's the National Cottage Food Alliance, which it's a nonprofit organization and it's going to be dedicated to uh empowering cottage food producers through education, resources, uh advocacy,  and  just a sense of community, a place for cottage food producers to find that community that they find at Cottage Food Econ, but they're going to be able to have that throughout the year. 22:28 It's a non-profit, so it's going to be set up. We're going to be applying for a 501c6 status, which means we're going to be set up almost identical to a trade association. So it'll be identical to a chamber of commerce. cottage food producers will be able to sign up for memberships. we're in talks with vendors who 22:56 partners and vendors who will offer discounts to our members through whether it's packaging or um online or you know digital marketing  or  Ingredients I'm drawing a blank, you know anything that a cottage food producer that needs as a resource uh So packaging things like that. We're we're in talks with different providers that are going to be willing to partner with us and give discounts to our members so 23:26 Yeah, that's, that is what is,  is, uh is on the horizon. Well, it's not even on the horizon. It's, it started. have, we have incorporated as a nonprofit here in Minnesota. We have our, our board members and  we've already had our first board meeting. So, so yeah, things are moving forward for the Alliance.  So this is your baby. You, you came up with this? Yes.  Good God. 23:55 Yep. Yeah, it's that that was that was my wife's reaction to.  Yeah, it it just I don't know. mean, it just it it just goes to the the passion that I found for the cottage food industry. I'm just looking around like what else can I do? How else can I help? You  know, being retired military, I have the time to  put into this. And so I just keep looking around like what else can I do? How else can I help? What? 24:25 What else do  they need in the cottage food world? I can't do everything. ah But if there is something that I can do, which is, you know, plan a conference where we all can come and learn and network, and then also do a nonprofit where we can help cottage food producers grow in their business through financial resources, you know, education, things like that, then I'm going to do it.  So,  so yeah, it's, it's myself and Lisa He from 24:52 My Custom Bakes and she also owns Borderlands Bakery. She was also one of the uh co-organizers, one of the main co-organizers for Cottage Food Econ. Fabulous. um I have a couple things you can do. You can  educate our state representatives  and senators about it's not going to kill anybody if we're allowed to make buttercream frosting and sell it as cottage food producers. 25:20 And it's probably not going to kill anybody if they let us do cheesecake because I'd really love to sell cheesecake and we can't do that. We're not allowed. And be able to ship outside of Minnesota because apparently it's next year we're going to be able to ship our cottage food goods in Minnesota, but not outside of Minnesota. Yeah. I believe August of 2027 is when that is scheduled to go into effect. yeah. 25:49 It's just in Minnesota. So that's great. That's a great first step. And we're thankful for that first step because, you know, we can't we just sometimes it takes baby steps, but it just I don't know in my in my brain in my mind, it doesn't if we can ship in Minnesota, why can't we ship to South Dakota and California? What's the difference? Uh huh. I know I've talked about it like seven times in the last year. Yeah. On the podcast, because it's so frustrating to me. I'm like, it's all about knowing 26:19 where the food leaves from  the cottage food producer to where it ends up so that it can be tracked if someone does by some chance come down sick.  Well, if we're shipping,  that's why the US Postal Service has tracking numbers. oh It drives me insane. And I was talking to somebody about this. It might have been Stephanie.  Can't think of her name, her last name. 26:49 She has a radio show. think she was one of the people at your college. Yep. Stephanie Hansen. Yeah. I was talking with her and we were talking about it. And I said, it's so unbelievably frustrating that two years ago someone said, I'd like to buy your granola, but I am up in Detroit lakes or wherever. And I said, that's not, I mean, thank you, but I can't ship. 27:17 And she said, what? And I said, I  can't legally ship it to you. oh I said, I can ship it to you as a gift.  said, but I can't sell it to you that way. oh she was like, why? I said, ask our legislature because they're the ones that say so. And she was like, oh, my friend brought me some from the farmer's market, from your booth. And I loved it. And I said, I can give you the recipe. It's really simple. I know you can make it.  And she said, 27:47 I'm not a cook. And that was pretty much the end of the story. That was it. Yeah. Yeah. I just had an order. um A company in St. Louis Park ordered cookies for their office here in St. Louis Park. But also they  said, you know, can you ship three dozen? I think it was three to two or three dozen to our office in Thief River Falls, Minnesota.  for sure. A, I'm definitely not going to deliver that. So  just. 28:15 But I said, and I can't, I can't ship I don't have because I don't have my wholesale license anymore. I let that expire and I'm not in the commercial kitchen anymore. So I'm totally out of my home. And so said, I can't do that. But what I did is so then I, I said, you know, I can do one or two things, I can either refund you for, you know, that part of the order, or I can bring those and give those, you know, I can include them on the order that's going to your office in St. Louis Park. She's like, yeah, just included in the order that's going to St. Louis Park. 28:43 And um then I'll ship them from here up to Thief River Falls. So oh what I did was I brought them the box that I would use because it  was a standard size box that  I would ship those if I was shipping, when I was shipping. I brought the box, I brought the packing material,  and  I brought it to them. It was still, it was unopened. said, 29:08 If you want to ship these to Thief River Falls, here's the box and here's the packing material that I would use if I was going to be shipping them.  But I can't legally ship it or box it up for you. But here's the box and the packing material. And so just that little, that little extra customer service is going to go a long way. They're going to remember that I  went above and beyond like that and  brought that to them. So then all they to do was drop the box in there, slap a label on it, and then they could deliver to the post office. 29:37 YouTube found a great workaround. Yeah.  Oh,  it's so maddening.  I just, I do not know when  people are going to learn that when they're in positions of power and they're making a decision for the rest of the people, they might want to research how things work  and define  why  it's not unsafe to do the thing that we want to do. Yeah. 30:08 But that requires research and time.  I actually talked with um Brad Tabke back a month or so ago. He's  the rep for Shakopee Area.  And it was  just  after  all the stuff had gone down with ICE in Minneapolis. I talked with him  off record. 30:35 And I'm not going to go into big detail because it was off the record. Yeah. He was so tired. He and all of our representatives were just so tired because they've been dealing with all of this for over a month, over two months, think.  And I just told him, said, Brad, said,  I refuse to identify as Republican or Democrat. I'm just a person. I said, and  I appreciate all the work you guys do. 31:04 So thank you. And there was this very long pause. And I was like, Oh God, did I offend him? know, he was like, Mary, thank you. He said, we're doing the absolute best we can in a really terrible situation. And I was like, I know you are. Thank you. So, so I don't want to, I don't want to bad mouth our government, but 31:29 I feel like so many people are so far removed from the basic life skills of like, you know, cooking, or growing a plant,  or keeping a chicken, that they don't understand  what it is they're saying has to be true. Yeah. Yes. It's hard.  But anyway, I'm so thrilled that you came to talk with me about the Cottage FoodieCon experience. 31:57 and this new alliance that you're developing as we speak. And I will keep my eyes open on Facebook so I can see what's happening there. is the information for the alliance going to be on the Cottage Foodie website or is it going to be a website of its own? It's going to be a website all itself, all its own. So yeah, it's completely separate. It's not... 32:23 associated in any way really with the Cottage Foodie the directory. This is completely separate. mean the Cottage Foodie is for profit. The  Alliance, the National Cottage Food Alliance is a non-profit so they are completely 100 % separate. uh And so yeah, so the website and it's still in development. I think we just have a home page right now just doing newsletter  sign up and things.  It's  ncf-alliance.org. 32:53 Okay. Awesome.  And where else can people find you online, Matt? Social media, of course, uh Facebook and Instagram. It's Cottage FoodieCon on both uh Instagram and Facebook.  Now, NCF Alliance  is on uh Instagram and Facebook as well.  yeah, the Cottage Foodie is on both. Sergeant Shortbread is on both. So yeah, if you can't find me, then... 33:23 You're not looking in the right place.  Then you're, then you're looking on, um, Twitter cause I'm not on Twitter.  so you won't find me on Twitter. So anybody's on Twitter slash X anymore. Oh yeah, that's right. It's X now. See, that's, that's how much I, that's how much I follow up with that. I know, I know about that, but yeah, that's,  I would say the best, the best place to reach me is either  through the new NCF Alliance on Facebook and Instagram or, uh, cottage food icon  on Facebook and,  um, 33:53 Instagram. Okay, fantastic.  Again,  so thrilled we got to talk about this. I've been thinking about it since you said yes.  Yes, well thank you for having me and  I'm sorry that it took so long but I was kind of uh pushing it off a little bit because I really wanted to  be able to tell you about this and we'll do a big announcement. I I  did put it on  social media but this is another great way to kind of do the big reveal. 34:21 kind of pushing you off just a little bit. And plus I was in Texas for a while to see our son before he deployed overseas. So there was a few things going on, but thank you so much for having me. Always, always a pleasure and always have fun visiting with you, Mary. So thank you so much for having me on again.  Absolutely. And I will have you back again, I'm sure, because we're really fun to talk to and listen to.  As always, people can find me at AtinyHolmsteadPodcast.com.  Have a great day, Matt. Thanks, Mary. You too.