The Great Simpsons Debate

This podcast is being brought to you by WXAV.com. WXAV, bringing the best artists to you. Hello, and welcome to a special presentation here of WXAV 88.3 FM and WXAV.com. My name is Peter Creighton.

I am joined with the Xavierites' very own senior viewpoint editor, Brian Lawford, and Brian. Welcome. Hey, Pete, how are you doing? I'm doing okay.

We have a lot of important business that we have to talk about today. Yes, we do, yes we do. This episode that you're listening to right now is entitled The Great Simpsons Debate. And Brian and I are lifelong Simpsons fans.

Brian, you've been watching your entire life. Oh, absolutely, yeah. It's one of the greatest television programs of all time. And you can spend countless hours talking about it, debating about it, watching it.

And for the next half hour, that's exactly what we're going to be doing here on WXAV 83 FM. Brian, why don't you give a little background of what motivated us to record this program? So what initially inspired this great endeavor of picking some of the greatest or at least our favorite Simpsons episodes of all time was WhatCulture.com. Posted online, their top 100 greatest episodes.

And we took exception with a lot of them. We took exception with a lot. Let me tell you, this has been dissected, yelled about, discussed, agreed upon, because they do have some great picks. I don't want to sound like we're completely trashing their list.

But there are a few questionable calls that we just felt we could not let stand. So we were taking to our microphones and we are going to bring out episodes that we felt got the shaft. We're going to talk about awful placements. To me, the problem with what culture's list isn't necessarily that they pick bad episodes.

They certainly didn't do anything like that. Absolutely not. No, they picked some great episodes. They put them in such a weird order to me as the problem.

There's been some weird placements. And we'll just give a few examples of this, if you will. Number 86 of their top 100 episodes is I Love Lisa Simpson. One of the greatest Simpson episodes ever, without a doubt.

It's the one where Lisa gives Ralph Wiggum the Valentine's Day card because she feels bad for him. And Ralph falls in love with her. Hard felt, hysterical, great chief Wiggum moments. Yes.

But number 86, no way. This is a top 20 episode. And it's got the I Choo Choo Choo Choo's you, Valentine's Day card. I Choo Choo Choo, not only that, the radio DJ's mistakenly playing the Monster Smash for not only Valentine's Day, but for President's Day.

You have Bart as John Wilkes Booth shooting Millhouse's Lincoln and Millhouse complaining that the beard is giving him a rash. I still love you, sir, A.B. Yes. Just great moments.

But not at number 86. This deserves much, much higher on the list. I'd say the very least, top 20, if not top 10. Absolutely.

Absolutely. Now, there are some other ones that kind of surprised us. Like number 39 was the episode with Joe Quimby's nephew and beating up the French from Waiter, which is my favorite episode of all time, full disclosure. I don't think it's one of the best, but it's one of my favorites.

And I was surprised with how high it was. Yeah. And herein lies, we start to get into another area of this list of just things that also aren't on there, like episodes that are sheer classics. Yes.

And we will be discussing about some of them, because what Brian and I have decided to do was we're going to go with our top five best Simpsons episodes ever. And we have a whole criteria of what we developed. And we're just going to go over the criteria for what we feel makes a great Simpsons episode. So the first thing's got to be the humor.

I mean, it's a comedy. If it does not make you laugh, it is not a great episode. What's the point? Yeah.

Our second criteria is rewatchability. You need to be able to rewatch this episode and still find it enjoyable. So that's a big portion right there. Our third criteria, quotability.

I mean, we were just talking about it with, I love Lisa Simpson. You can quote that episode almost verbatim. And people will know what you're talking about. Yeah.

Like if I go to Brian and say stupid, sexy Flanders, he knows exactly what I'm talking about. I know exactly what he's talking about. Fourth, general story and how it makes you feel. I mean, one of the great things about the Simpsons show and its peak was not only would it make you laugh, but it would make you think and it would make you feel.

And I think for me, that's why I love Lisa Simpson is so great is it makes me feel. You feel for Ralph Wiggum. He's a humanized little boy in this episode who has his heart broken for the first time. Who cannot relate to that?

And finally, the last criteria we have is how were the characters used? You have a certain criteria of what these characters are. What were the situations they were put in? Were they overly stupid?

Were they enjoyable? What were they? So those are our five criteria for what makes great Simpsons episodes humor, rewatchability, quotability, general story, and how were the characters used. But before we get into our top five episodes, I think we should go over Brian at the top 10 of what culture's list of what they feel are the greatest Simpsons episodes ever.

OK, so I got the list right here, and I'm going to be honest. It starts out with an episode, and I'm a huge Simpsons guy watching every day. I don't know their number 10 episode. It's dumbbell identity, identity, which comes from season nine, episode 16.

They describe the plot as Mo gets a girlfriend by spending all his money on her. But when he runs out, he enlists Homer's help to commit insurance fraud by stealing his car and ends up with Homer going to jail and then seeking revenge. I don't. Is that?

Yeah, it's Helen Hunt is the guest star, and she plays Mo's girlfriend. She's like a flower card person, and she's beautiful. And Mo being insecure buys her things to kind of make up for his lack of physical attractiveness. Is it the one where Homer's on the book mobile going must kill Mo?

Yes, it is. Oh, OK. Yes, it is. Yeah, I remember that one now.

No way is that a top 10 episode? No way. It's a good episode, but there's so many more that are just better than I was done at this point when I first saw that. Ryan was there when I first saw this list, and I was infuriated by it.

Yeah, yeah, it does. If I couldn't remember it, like what is it? What does that say? Just right off the bat.

That's right. What's our number nine? Number nine is the city of New York versus Homer Simpson. This is the one that I always remembered by Homer getting the boot on his car.

And it ends up in New York, and he's got so many parking tickets that he gets the boot. It's a it's a fine episode. Not a bad episode. Totally agree with you.

For me, this would be the perfect reversal of I love we said number 86 with this one. It's a fine episode. It's a good one. He's a drink between crab juice and Mountain Dew.

And he's like, oh, terrible. I'll take the crab juice. And the musical journey through the Betty Ford Center when they go see a Broadway play. Absolutely.

It's a fine episode, but the number nine greatest Simpsons episode of all time. I don't think so. Okay. So at number eight, we have radioactive man from season seven episode two.

I kind of like this episode. I am totally fine with this. That is a great episode. It's worthy.

I mean, I wouldn't have it in my top 10, but it's definitely a top 20 episode. It's a great one for the sheer fact that you get Rayner Wolf Castle screaming. My eyes, the goggles do nothing. And this is one I love Millhouse.

Millhouse is probably one of my favorite TV characters of all time. So underrated. This is a Millhouse episode. It is a total Millhouse episode and it is a fantastic Millhouse episode.

It's excellent. Okay. So at number seven, we have brother from the same planet. And this is the one where Bart joins sort of like a big brother program.

Yes. Homer has let him down. He did not pick him up from softball. No, soccer.

And he gets a big brother who is voiced brilliantly by the late great Phil Hartman and Homer to to get revenge does the same thing. The next episode, I am okay with this. This is definitely a top 10 episode. This they got absolutely correct.

My only problem with this episode and I agree, it's a good episode. It's just that it sort of deteriorates at the end and it just kind of becomes a fist fight. It does, but it's a fun fist fight. Yeah, it's funny, but you know, you're just building to something more, I thought.

Okay, fair point. What is our number six number? Number six is a great episode. Absolutely.

See, I feel bad because, you know, we started this whole, this whole program saying they had an awful list, but the last three episodes I'm totally fine with. Yeah. And especially number six, this is, I feel kind of an underrated, like not a lot of people talk about this one, but it's a great episode. Great moments in this episode.

Absolutely. This is the lemon of Troy from season six, episode 24, where Springfield's coveted lemon tree is stolen by a group of Shelbyville Hooligans who are like the Bizarro world Simpsons characters. I think this might be the first and only time we actually see Shelbyville. Yeah.

I mean, it's magnificent and it does have the great Millhouse line of, so this is what it feels like. Yeah. The Millhouse meets the Shelbyville version of Millhouse. So that's the world culture 10 through six.

We're moving into the top five. This is their top five greatest Simpsons episodes ever. What's number five? Number five is King size Homer from season seven.

I disagree with this one. Why do you disagree, Brian? I love the premise that Homer wants to just get so fat that he can't go to work anymore. And this taught me what a moo moo is.

But I don't know. It's just the plot of this one. It's not really a plot so much as it is a premise. You know what my issue with this episode is I think it's a great episode.

There's a lot of laughs. I've seen it too many times. Really? Yes.

There is a period of time probably late nineties, early 2000s where when the Simpsons first entered syndication, they just reran the classics, which now we would kill for. But at that time, you get tired of it. And I just remember it felt like every other week, you just saw King size Homer and was just you couldn't. You needed a break from it.

I haven't seen it in a few years. I actually would love to go back and rewatch it. So I don't know. It's a good one.

It's a great premise. Top 10. I'm not sure yet. Right.

So number four, we've got deep space Homer from season five episode 15. And this is totally totally disagree with this. Really? I like this one.

I kind of like this one. It's a good one in my opinion. It's a fine episode. They got some funny jokes in it.

But overall, it's your soul outlandish and just so stupid for me. No, I think this is one of those episodes though where it's just so silly that it's like the humor comes from just like, all right, if you're going to go with the premise, you'll have and it's got a great line by Buzz Aldrin when Homer opens the chips and he just goes to be careful. Those are ruffles. They have ridges.

Sort of the way you feel about number four is the way that I feel about number three and it's Homer bad man from season six episode nine. Homer accused of sexually harassing the babysitter. Yeah. After he grabs a gummy bear off.

The Venus Deliimo. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's off a rear end.

I'm indifferent to this one. Again, I think it goes back to Homer with weight gain. I've seen this one so many times. I love the opening gag of March with the huge coat to fit all the candy in.

But it just after that, it just kind of bleeds away into nothingness for me. Just the whole concept of the episode just bothers me a little bit. I agree. I agree.

It's just unsettling and not in a meaningful way. I agree. Number two, this is going to be controversial. Yeah.

Very controversial. And it's the mysterious voyage of Mr. Homer from season eight episode nine. I can't say this Spanish title.

It's the one where Johnny Cash is Homer's spirit guide. And that was actually how I was first introduced to Johnny Cash. Really? Yeah.

Was like, you've heard the name, but you don't know who he is when you're younger. He was the spirit guide Fox and he was a great guest star. I don't know. I almost think that it just got listed just because of Johnny Cash being in it.

I don't think it's that great of an episode. I like this episode. To me, you could put this anywhere in the 15 to 10 range and I'd probably be fine with it because it's a great Homer and March episode. It is.

I just felt like it's the whole premise of the episode is Homer and March are having marriage problems. And they've done dozens of episodes beforehand covering the same subject matter. So it's just kind of like rehashing it. But I understand why because with the marriage and marriage isn't perfect and that's always a fruitful area for storytelling, but it's just really, really indifferent.

For me, if that was number 100, I would be like, yeah, that's number 100. There's so many more better episodes than that in my opinion. No, I totally agree with you and that there's, you know, there are better episodes, but it's a funny episode. There's there's memorable moments to it.

My favorite being Smithers at the Square Dance. It's a middle of the pack episode. Yeah. And I would say that's almost my complete complaint with what culture's list is the fact that they did make a point of incorporating newer episodes and even have episodes on that that I haven't seen from like season 14 or 15.

But because they wanted to be fair and I understand that. However, if you're doing the greatest, do the greatest. Right. It's nowhere near the greatest.

You know, there's so many more and like when we go over our top five list, I think both you and I, Brian, come up with way better episodes, even with our honorable mentions. Yeah. Then the mysterious voyage of Homer. Right.

But let's go. Number one, I agree with. I think it's a great episode. I'm okay with this one and I think you're okay with it as well too.

I can live with this one. Yeah. I'll phrase it that way. They could have done a lot worse and it's, it's you only move twice where Homer moves the family to Cyprus, is it Cyprus Creek?

Cyprus Creek. Yeah. Cyprus Creek and works for Hank Scorpio, who is basically a bond villain. And he's by Albert Brooks.

And now that Homer's best boss ever. Oh yeah. He's like the nicest guy in the world. He just wants world domination.

But if you disagree or you agree with what culture lists, we definitely want to hear from you. You can email us at wxav88.3 FM at gmail.com or you can hit us up on Facebook. Just type in wxav83 FM into Facebook. Just write down your top 10 favorite Simpsons of all time and we'll talk about it.

Or you can always follow us on Twitter, twitter.com slash wxav83. Thank you so much for tuning in to Brian Lawfren and I talking about Simpsons. Yeah. This is pretty fantastic in my opinion.

Now it's time to get to the meat and potatoes, Brian. We have 10 minutes left. We now, I mean, we've called out what culture on their list. So it's only fair if we present our own list, our own findings, if you will.

And we're going to go back to that criteria that I talked about earlier in the show. And just for those who may be joining us right now, our criteria for great Simpsons episodes is humor, rewatchability, quotability, general story, how it makes you feel and then how were the characters used. Those are our criteria. I purposely when I made my list, I wanted to try and pick episodes that were not featured on what cultures list you went the opposite.

You took episodes that you felt should have been higher on the list. Crap, Brian. Some episodes that shouldn't have been that should have been higher and some that are not there at all. Excellent.

I think I have two that aren't on there. And this was really difficult to Brian and I. Yes. So what we've done is we've also given ourselves two honorable mentions.

Yeah. So I think we'll go back and forth and then we'll explain why we feel this is worthy of recognition as some of the greatest Simpsons episodes of all times. Brian, I will give you the first opportunity to introduce your first honorable mention. Okay.

So my first honorable mention is treehouse of four or five. It's just it's so this is the quintessential Simpsons treehouse of four to me. Absolutely. It's the greatest Halloween ever.

Halloween special ever. It's got the single greatest Halloween sketch ever in the shin in. Yes. You mean shining.

Want to get sued? It's excellent. It's terrific. That deserves top 10 recognition.

Even though it's a holiday special, it's still amazing. I think that maybe what cultures stayed away from that because then you get sucked into just the wormhole of the treehouse of horrors because there are so many good ones. But this one, this one won by virtue that it's my favorite. I'm okay with that one.

My first honorable mention is from early on in the Simpsons run and it's entitled Bart gets a D. Yes. And it's the first episode where you find out Bart is a bad student. And if he doesn't pass this history class, he's going to be, he'll have to repeat the fourth grade.

It is heartfelt. It's got some great humor moments. You really first introduced a Martin Prince in this episode. Yeah.

It's just rock solid. Oh, absolutely. And it's also like, like I just enjoy the irony of that episode that Bart has to buckle down to get a D. Yeah.

It's just like that's how bad a student he is. Oh, great episode. All right. What's your second honorable mention?

And as Homer versus the 18th Amendment, and that's the one where they realize that prohibition still exists in Springfield. So they bring in an Elliott Ness style treasury officer to bring law to a town that has chief wiggle miss. It's a chief law enforcer. Excellent.

Pick. This is a great episode. Homer becomes the beer baron. Yeah.

Oh, my second honorable mention. And if I had to pick one problem I had with the well cultured, I mean, there was a lot but like a main problem, not enough. Mr. Burns, the great villain of the Simpsons love him to death.

And this episode, it wasn't even on the list, which I don't understand why. Or it was it was just really far back. Mr. Burns runs for governor.

Yeah. Great episode. One of the great satires. Yeah.

All right. All right. Top five moment. What's your number five?

Number five. I have Cape Fear, but that's with an extra E at the end. That's a Simpson spelling. And that is the third appearance of sideshow Bob voiced, of course, by the great Kelsey grammar.

Such a great character. Great character. Great parody of the film Cape Fear. If you watch the movie, then you watch the episode, you'll have a greater appreciation for it even more.

You get Kelsey singing? Yes. The entire score from the HMS pit of four. I will send you to heaven before I send you to hell.

Just this is a top 10 episode. Yeah. It's without a doubt the greatest side show Bob episode ever. Absolutely.

Excellent choice. This is the encapsulation of that character. Absolutely. Absolutely.

My number five pick is entitled A Brush With Greatness. Which one is that? That is the one where Marge paints Mr. Burns.

Marge, she goes back to school to re-invigorate her love of art. And Mr. Burns finds her because he wants a portrait for a museum. They've asked for a portrait of him.

And she's very beaten down by Mr. Burns until she gets a package from the one, the only Ringo star. Her favorite beat, oh, she pointed a picture of. All right.

At number four, I have a Millhouse Divided. Now I said I was a Millhouse fan earlier. This is probably my favorite Millhouse episode. And it's one of those Simpsons episodes that deals with a serious theme in that Millhouse's parents get divorced.

But it's done with humor, but it's not insulting in any way. No. And it actually takes it really seriously. Yeah.

Along with the jokes. I mean, you have great jokes in there. It's a great story. But man, it's when you actually look at that's an intense episode.

And one of my favorite Simpsons songs, Kirk van Houten singing, Can I borrow a feeling? Yes. And he's a short-lived career as a singer. Who likes the Doobie Brothers?

We've got one of them. Oh, God. Excellent show. Your number four, sir.

My number four is the second greatest Halloween special, in my opinion. And that is Treehouse of Horror number four. You have Homer selling his soul for a donut. You have a great Twilight Zone parody with Homer with Bart on the bus with the Gremlin, which you were mentioning earlier with Cape Fear if you've seen the movie.

Well, if you see the episode of the Twilight Zone with this Simpsons Halloween special, it's magnificent. Yeah. That's the Bill Shatner episode. It is the Bill Shatner episode.

And you have the conclusion of the Simpsons version of Dracula with Mr. Burns as a state in Pennsylvania. Great episode. All righty.

My number three is Home Sweet, Home Didly Dumb Doodly. And that is the episode where Ned Flanders adopts Bart, Lisa, and Maggie after they're putting foster care. I totally forgot about this episode until you mentioned it. And my God, what a great episode.

And this is one of them that's not on what culture's list. It is not. And that's a travesty. That is a great episode, a great last, the whole opening sequence of how just these chance situations happened and then it's unbelievable.

And of course, when they're, you know, lamenting about about their children and Homer is just like, what I wouldn't give to hear Lisa play her sweet saxophone one more time. Saxophone. My number three, and I am shocked that this was not on the well-cultured list either. Crusty gets canceled.

Yeah, that's ridiculous. That is Gabbo. What a great, there's some great crusty moments. I think this is the pinnacle of Crusty.

It shows the great relationship with Bart. The guest stars are unbelievable. Johnny Carson after the Tonight Show had just ended. Luke Perry, Red Hot Chili Peppers, Bette Midler.

Bette Midler. Hey, it was like, it's Bette Midler. Time to take out the trash. I'll get you a Midler and the guy crashes into a mountain.

Even Elizabeth Taylor's in this. Yeah. I mean, this is a stacked episode. Number two, we're getting into it.

All right, here it is. Number two, I have the cartridge family where Homer buys a gun after a soccer riot erupts in Springfield. And what I love about this, it's one of those sort of like, it's so sly in its delivery of that you don't realize, you know, most soccer riots start because, you know, people are so charged for the game. This one starts out a sheer boredom.

You just need something to do. I love the Ken Brockman calling the game. The Spanish announce calling the game. Oh, just the contrast.

And there's like a, there's probably like a three minute scene of Homer actually trying to buy the gun in which he delivers maybe my favorite Homer line ever when they're like, you have to wait five days. We got to run a background check. And he just looks at the guy and he goes, five days, I'm mad now. Now, this is going to be controversial for anyone that knows me because they know of my disdain of Lisa Simpson.

But yet she was the subject of why I think is the second greatest Simpsons episode ever that was not on this what culture less. And it's Lisa versus Malibu Stacy. Simpsons, they take on politics. They take on religion.

They do satires. This is the moment they take on gender roles and sexism. And it's done brilliantly. They do such a great job.

Such a great job. Great smither moments. But it's just, it's, it's, it's magnificently done. Lisa's least annoying in this.

And there's just some great moments in it. Brian, here we go. All right. Number one, I selected Marge versus the Monorail.

I can't talk about how much I love this episode enough because it features who I consider a member of the primary Simpsons cast and it's Phil Hartman. You mentioned him earlier. That show is not the same without any of his characters. Absolutely not.

Troy McClure, Lionel Haugh. It's, it's, it's, you're absolutely correct. And this episode, the fact that it was ranked number 35 on what culture's list, that's a Travis. It's ridiculous.

This is, this was number one. I'd have no problem with this. This is a great episode. Yeah.

And the episode is called Marge versus the Monorail. But it's really, it's a Springfield episode. It's about all these great characters. They all have something to do in this, in this one.

It's great ensemble piece. It absolutely is. It has quite possibly my favorite Homer Marge exchange ever. When Marge goes, Homer goes, Homer, I got someone here to help you as the Monorail speeding out of control and Homer replies with Batman and Marge goes, no, it's a scientist and Homer replies back, Batman's a scientist.

It's not Batman. It's not Batman. Oh, it's, it's magnificent. And now it's my turn for my number one episode.

And this is the one that I am most upset about. Really? Yes. It's not on the what culture list yet.

It is, I think a top five episode ever. It's at the stage of what was to come. It's the pilot episode, the first ever episode. And without a doubt, their greatest Christmas special ever, Simpson's roasting on an open fighter.

I re-watched this episode about two weeks ago and it blew me out of the water how good it was. It was still fresh. It was still funny. It was a great introduction to what the characters are.

Now, correct me if I'm wrong, but is this the Santa's Little helper? Yes. This is the one where they get Santa's Little helper. Yes.

Bart's from a dog track. Yes. I mean, it introduces Santa's Little helper, which is such an important character to the son of the dog. Yeah.

You don't think about it. You don't. But oh man, it's, it's, there's not a boring moment in this episode. And how many times can you go and say a show's pilot?

He's in the conversation for their greatest episode ever. Yeah, I was just about to say, I didn't even think to like go back to season, season one at all and mining for some of my episodes because you don't think of a first season of a TV show as containing some of its greater episodes. And they do. There's some rock solid episodes in season one.

Yeah. You have them going to see Dr. Marvin Monroe to get help with the shock therapy, Marge with the French bowler. If you have 22 minutes, I recommend you go watch Simpson's roasting on an open fire.

And I also suggest you go watch Marge versus Momma Narelle. These are two great Simpson's episodes. And if you have a lot of minutes, watch, watch all, uh, how many, watch all 14 of the episodes that we named cause we picked some darn good ones. Absolutely.

And we're going to post this list up on the WXAV Facebook. We'll also put it on our website, WXAV.com. We'll have like a WXA versus what culture that posted. And for any feedback, we want to know what you think, uh, messenger us on Twitter, Twitter.com slash WXAV 883 or leave us a message on Facebook.

Just type in WXAV 83 FM into your Facebook like us there today and leave us your message or if you're old fashioned, shoot us an email. WXAV 80.3 FM at gmail.com. Brian, any closing thoughts for the people? You know, I think we've said all that needs to be said.

I think we did what we came to do and we did it the best that we can do. I absolutely concur. Brian, take us out. You're listening to WXAV 88.3 FM.

Thanks for listening. Thank you for listening to this WXAV.com podcast. Check out WXAV.com for future podcasts. WXAV, the Escape from Ordinary Radio.