The Universe Called. It Says Your Theory of Change Is Cute.  episode artwork

EPISODE · Nov 9, 2025 · 48 MIN

The Universe Called. It Says Your Theory of Change Is Cute.

from Untangled · host Charley Johnson

If you’ve sensed a shift in Untangled of late, you’re not wrong. I’m writing a lot more about ‘complex systems.’ To name a few:* What even is a ‘complex system’ and how do you know if you’re in one.* How to act interdependently and do the next right thing in a complex system.* Why if/then theories of change that assume causality are bonkers — and how to map backward from the future.* How do you act amidst uncertainty — if you truly don’t know how your system will respond to your intervention, what do you do?* How should we think about goals in an uncertain world?* Here’s a fun diagnostic tool I developed to help you assess how your organization thinks, acts, and learns under complexity.I am obsessed with complex systems because the world is uncertain and unpredictable — and yet all of our strategies pretend otherwise. We crave certainty, so we build plans that presume causality, control, and predictability. We know in our gut that the systems we’re trying to change won’t sit still for our long-term plans, yet our instinct to cling to control amid uncertainty is too strong to resist.And honestly, in 2025, this shouldn’t be a hard sell. Politics, climate change, and AI are laughing at your five-year strategy decks.Complexity thinking helps us see this clearly — that systems are dynamic, nonlinear, and adaptive — but it, too, has blind spots. First, it lacks a theory of technology. The closest we get is Brian Arthur’s brilliant book, The Nature of Technology: What It Is and How It Evolves, which explains how technologies co-evolve with economic systems. (Give it a read, or check out write-up in Technically Social). But Arthur was focused on markets, not on social systems — not on how technology is entangled with people and power.That’s where my course comes in. I’m trying to offer frameworks and practices for creating change across difference, amid uncertainty, in tech-mediated environments — approaches that honor both complexity and the mutual shaping of people, power, and technology. (And yes, Cohort 5 of Systems Change for Tech & Society Leaders starts November 19.)Second, complexity is hard to talk about simply and make practical (that’s why my Playbook turned into a 200 page monstrosity!) Every time I use the words “complex” or “system,” I can feel the distance between me and whoever I’m talking to widen. I’ve been searching for thinkers who bridge that gap — who write about systems with both clarity and depth — and recently came across the brilliant work of Aarn Wennekers, who writes the great newsletter Super Cool & Hyper Critical (Subscribe if you haven’t yet!)After reading his essay, Systems Thinking Isn’t Enough Anymore, I reached out and invited him onto the podcast. I’m thrilled to share that conversation — one that digs into the mindsets and muscles leaders need to navigate uncertainty and constant change, the need to collapse old distinctions between strategy and operations, and what it really means to act when the ground beneath us keeps shifting. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit untangled.substack.com

NOW PLAYING

The Universe Called. It Says Your Theory of Change Is Cute.

0:00 48:13

No transcript for this episode yet

We transcribe on demand. Request one and we'll notify you when it's ready — usually under 10 minutes.

Technology Untangled Hewlett Packard Enterprise Why isn't talking tech as simple, quick, and agile as its innovations promise to be?Technology Untangled is just that - a show that deciphers tech's rapid evolutions with one simple question in mind: what's really going to shape our future (and what's going to end up in the bargain bin with the floppy disc)?Join your host Michael Bird as he untangles innovation through a series of interviews, stories, and analyses with some of the industry's brightest brains. No marketing speak, no unnecessary jargon. This is real tech talk from the people who know it inside and out. Discover which tools and systems are revolutionising the way we do business, what's up next on the endless innovation agenda, and, most importantly, how you can future-proof and get ahead of the curve. Bodybuilding and BS Bodybuilding and BS "Bodybuilding and BS Podcast: Your Ultimate Source for Fitness Wisdom"Welcome to the world of iron, sweat, and truths untangled. We're thrilled to introduce you to the "Bodybuilding and BS" podcast, where your host Nick Trigili dives deep into the realm of bodybuilding and fitness. Whether you're a seasoned lifter or just starting your fitness journey, this podcast is your compass in navigating the sea of information out there. Get ready to separate fact from fiction and achieve your fitness goals like never before. Support this podcast: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/bodybuilding-and-bs/support Grief Untangled: Untangling the Threads of Grief, Healing, and Hope Deepak Deopure Welcome to "Grief Untangled," the podcast that unravels the complex emotions, experiences, and challenges of grief. Join us as we explore the intricate threads of loss and navigate the profound journey of healing, growth, and transformation. Each episode delves deep into the various aspects of grief, offering personal stories, expert insights, and practical strategies to help untangle the knots of sorrow, pain, and confusion. We shed light on the profound impact of grief on our lives and provide guidance on how to navigate this intricate path. Whether you've lost a loved one, experienced a significant life change, or are supporting someone through grief, this podcast is here to offer solace, understanding, and hope. Together, let's unravel the complexities of grief, find strength in vulnerability, and discover the transformative power of healing as we navigate the journey of untangling grief. https://deepakdeopure.com/ Untangled: Fly Fishing For Everyone | Ventures Fly Co. Ventures Fly Co. Spencer Durrant hosts "Untangled: Fly Fishing For Everyone." The show answers user-submitted questions about fly fishing, helping others learn and grow in this wonderful sport.

Frequently Asked Questions

How long is this episode of Untangled?

This episode is 48 minutes long.

When was this Untangled episode published?

This episode was published on November 9, 2025.

What is this episode about?

If you’ve sensed a shift in Untangled of late, you’re not wrong. I’m writing a lot more about ‘complex systems.’ To name a few:* What even is a ‘complex system’ and how do you know if you’re in one.* How to act interdependently and do the next right...

Can I download this Untangled episode?

Yes, you can download this episode by clicking the download button on the episode player, or subscribe to the podcast in your preferred podcast app for automatic downloads.
URL copied to clipboard!