Tonight on 360, the president calls the Smithsonian Museum out of control, in part, he says, because of its focus on how bad slavery was. Also tonight, will they or won't they? The White House says Russia has agreed to a Putin's Linsky meeting. The Russians, though, have yet to say.
And later, House Republicans said to make some Epstein-Files public a question as to which one's and what's being left now. Good evening. Thanks for joining us. We begin tonight, keeping him honest.
With the president's latest attack on the Smithsonian, just a week ago, today, he unveiled plans to review and oversee what museums there exhibit or plan to exhibit. Although the White House led her to the Smithsonian's top executive at the time said the goal was, quote, not to interfere with the day-to-day operations of curators or staffers. It seems the president already has some ideas of his own. He laid them out today in a social media post.
In it, he writes, the Smithsonian is out of control, where everything discussed is how horrible our country is, how bad slavery was, and how unaccomplished the downtrodden have been. Nothing about success, nothing about brightness, nothing about the future. He goes on to say, this country cannot be woke because woke is broke. We have the hottest country in the world, and we want people to talk about it, including in our museums.
Now it was, of course, the slavery part that first stood out, and that even the best possible interpretation of what the president said is that by his way of thinking, the Smithsonian is focusing too much on bad things, including slavery. There's, of course, a less charitable reading that he could be implying slavery wasn't so bad, but even presuming the best, the complaint doesn't hold water, factually. Of the 40 exhibitions now running at the National Museum of American History, for example, only four even deal with discrimination of any form against anyone. None is on slavery.
As for negativity, there's an exhibit on women's achievers in business. The stories of eight strong women who made it to the top. That's how they describe it. There's one titled, American Democracy, a Great Leap of Faith.
You can also find exhibits on the history of computing, business, the genius of Ben Franklin, Dorothy's Ruby Slippers from the Wizard of Oz as well. And yes, there's also one of the Greensboro lunch counters hidden on the key moments in the Civil Rights Movement, which involved four black college students politely asking for service at a white's only lunch counter. It was an act of extraordinary courage, and it ultimately was a success and helped lead this country toward that brighter future the President so cares about. Success and brightness in the future, all the things the President wants in our museums.
Even at the Smithsonian Museum of American American History and Culture, which certainly does not gloss over some of the grimest aspects of the American experience, there's plenty to inspire. The President says they focus on, quote, how unaccomplished the downtrodden have been. Well, there's an exhibition titled, Making a Way Out of No Way, which tells stories that, quoting from the description, reflect the perseverance, resourcefulness, and resilience required by African Americans to survive and thrive in America. There's an exhibit about black combat heroes dating back to the revolution, also black artists and entrepreneurs who may have been born into circumstances where they were downtrodden to use the President's words, but they achieved extraordinary accomplishments.
You can see James Brown's, James Brown's his cape and jumpsuit, Chuck Berry's iconic red Cadillac, even Muhammad Ali's boxing gloves. They all made a way out of no way. Now being honest about our past is a sign of strength, a sign of how far this nation has come. As for casting America in a negative light, let's not forget President Trump seems to have no problem with that as long as he's the ones doing it.
Our country's going to hell. Our country is going to hell. We're like a garbage can for the world. But now we are a nation in decline.
We are a failing nation. We're now in this room. See, and then he joins me from the White House. One of the White House officials saying about all this tonight.
Anderson, White House officials are saying the President is serious about increasing his scrutiny of the Smithsonian Museum. He said a letter just yesterday, but again, really amplifying his words tonight in that social media post. One White House official explaining his objective quite simply like this. President Trump will explore all options and avenues to get the vote out of the Smithsonian and hold them accountable.
Beyond that, the President will be able to get the vote out of the Smithsonian and hold them accountable. Beyond that, it is unclear exactly what he's going to be doing except directing his lawyers, as he said, to scrutinize all of the works of the Smithsonian. Anderson, I'm thinking back to one month after the President took office the first time. Back in 2017, he paid a visit to the Museum of African American History and Culture, which is just a couple blocks from the White House here.
I was thinking back to that day when he was walking through the exhibits as you can see right there on the screen. He spoke very gloingly about the resilience that was shown. He spoke very movingly about what the museum said. I went back and looked exactly to make sure my memory was correct.
He said this, he praised the museum, he said the museum tells of the greatness of the struggle for freedom that prevailed against the sins of slavery. That was back in 2017. Many of those slavery exhibits have not changed since then. It's unclear what the President has stirred up about this and how they became woke.
It's one more example of how he's leveraging the power of his office in ways he did not do in his first term. He liked the museum in 2017 and talked about slavery. He didn't solve those exhibits. Is it clear how the administration is going to determine what should or should not be in their estimation in the Smithsonian Museum?
It's not clear. He said he's going to have his lawyers look at this both here in Washington and in museums across the country. It's largely an extension of the fight that he's already raging against universities. It clearly is something the administration and the President liked to discuss.
They liked to talk about the idea of this so-called wokeness at museums. But it's less clear exactly what that means and what museums will be asked potentially to do differently here. But again, Anderson is so striking from the President's own words. Even after his visit, he dedicated one of his own weekly addresses back when the President used to give those weekly radio addresses.
He dedicated it specifically to his visit there. It was in Black History Month of 2017. He praised the museum. But now he calls it woke.
Anderson. So it's only thanks very much and joined by seeing an political commentator who has a far griff in his service, White House Communications Director, Drinks President Trump's first term, and Pulitzer Prize winning historian, Annette Gordon-Reed of Harvard University. Professor Gordon-Reed, as we mentioned, said his post that everything discussed is, quote, how bad slavery was, how unaccomplished the downtrodden have been. I was struck by that line.
I wonder what your reaction was. Well, I've been to the museum and it's exactly the opposite of that. It's much more like the way he described it in 2017. It is very inspirational.
It talks about slavery, but it talks about American progress. Doing things to make promise of the Declaration of Independence become real. So it's not a place that I recognize in the way he describes it in that post. Alyssa, were you there during the first term when he went?
I was glad Jeff Zellini brought that up because I traveled to the African American, African American History Museum with Mike Pence at the time, so shortly after the current president did, and he had the same takeaway, and I recall the president having the same takeaway, which it was something he was honored to attend. He thought that it was in many ways a testament to those overcoming and the terrible circumstances they come out of. I remember sitting with Donald Trump in his first term when he put out a statement about Juneteenth. But then later there's this decision to move away from some of those things, and I think it speaks to the moment we're in the second term.
There were some, I'm going to call him Normies, people who came from old school government who realized we recognize our history, we acknowledge our past, there's a certain way we speak about those things because it's for the good of the entire country. They were there in the first term. In the second term it's a lot of folks who seem purely driven on ideology, and at times that can lead you down some pretty dangerous places. What you're seeing here with the Smithsonian, I mean I don't even know what this would look like.
Generally what's in it is brought together by curators, by scholars, by a board of regents, but we do know that he's already wanted to include removal of his first and second impeachment from the Smithsonian. So you get to a scary place when you've got ideologues kind of changing facts and history. What kind of a, I mean it's such a whitewashing of history and an elimination of black history and the history of others as well in this country. What is the danger of this, as you say, as a historian?
Well the danger is that you get an incomplete picture of what happened in the country. If you can't learn from history, if you don't know what actually happened. So it's a way of keeping people ignorant of the past, and that's not what historians try to do opposite of that, to bring it, bring what we know to the fore. And that's what Americans want.
These museums are incredibly popular from every survey, everything that I've seen. People like to go there, they're always full, and Americans want to know the unvarnished truth of that. You wrote a book about Thomas Jefferson and Sally Hemings, which never used to be mentioned long ago at I understand Monticello, that has changed. Yes, it definitely has changed.
They realized that Monticello was not just the home of Thomas Jefferson, it was home of others, hundreds of other people who live there, you know, longer continuously than he did, because he was away in politics and so forth. So now the story is much broader, it's much more expansive, and it's much more realistic. It's what people want. It's complex and maybe confusing and upsetting, but it is also real.
It's life. And the way our lives are complicated. And Thomas Jefferson can be an extraordinary figure, and have written extraordinary words, which a previous guest pointed out. Martin Luther King Jr.
used the words that Thomas Jefferson wrote in the Constitution, the Declaration of Independence. Absolutely, absolutely. I mean, African-American people have used the words of the Declaration from the time it was first read to make the claim for our Americanness, and that has been the basis, part of the basis of the struggle that we've had, is to make real that creed. Listen, this from a political standpoint, the anti-wook movement, it works for what the President wants it to work for.
Yeah, he's not totally off-base and wear his bases on this issue. So there is, if you were traveling around the country ahead of the election, you, sure, the economy, crime, the border were the top issues that polled, but one of the most common things I would hear from Republican voters is, we don't like the direction the country's going, it's going too well. However, they may define that. And oftentimes it was, we feel like we have to apologize for being Americans, we feel like we have to dwell on our history rather than focus on our accomplishments.
What I would point to is the Smithsonian's as an example of how you acknowledge your history, but you also, the good, the bad, and the ugly, but you also honor the great economy. I don't think to the point of your intro that that's the place that does just one or the other. But this is something that is incredibly animating with a certain segment of his base, so I don't think the politics of it are necessarily bad. How he goes about it will be interesting though.
We saw the Kennedy Center board taking over. Is that what he's going to try to do with the Smithsonian? I don't know. Well, the Smithsonian was set up to be an independent entity.
It's not supposed to be on the control of the President. You know, Congress makes appropriations. It does get federal funds, and I suppose that's how he's going to leverage this, to use that power he has. But he doesn't have any specific authority.
So it will be interesting to see what actually happens. I mean, one doesn't want a situation where with every incoming new administration, because I mean, whatever's done at some point, Donald Trump will not be President, and maybe there will be someone else who's President who's... President Newsom, President Pritzker, President whomever. And they will have a different vision.
And they will have to switch everything around. And do we really want our museums and our school kids every time switching suddenly how American history is taught? Correct. Things can over-correct the other direction.
I'm Barry Weisz, the free press, had a great piece about this recently where she pointed out the excesses of the far right now. They are going to feel the whiplash at some point when Democrats win and the far left gets a greater control and sees the power and the expansion of the executive that Donald Trump has put in place. And that is a reason conservatives have always believed we should not expand the power of the presidency, because it could go just as easily the other direction. It's also a professor not as if there is a, you know, groundswell of accomplished academic historians who are outraged at portrayals of, you know, how the African American History Museum is portraying history.
I mean, yes, there were controversial things a couple years ago that the head of the museum, testifying from Congress, pointed out something that was written on the website that seemed silly or absurd, offensive to many. He said, yes, it shouldn't have been on there. It was taken off. Who do you think the president is going to get to be reviewing the work of all these historians in all these museums?
Well, it doesn't appear to be, there will be other historians doing it. It may be- You're talking about lawyers. Yeah, lawyers, people who need points to do this, but it won't be as far as I can tell. I don't know what it said in his head about this, but it doesn't seem to be historians are going to be doing.
It's people who are outside of the profession, people who haven't been devoting themselves to doing it. So it could be interesting. But again, I just don't know how it's going to be done in that there is no specific authority that he has to do this. The regents, I suppose, he persuades the regents with the leverage he has because of the federal grants to go along with it, but they're the ones who are in control of it.
And the vice president is a part of that and the chief justice and other appointees. So it may be through that method, the way he will be able to try to do this, but otherwise it's just very unclear how he's going to tell curators and historians and other people what his vision is and why it should obtain. Elizabeth, do you think the follow-through on this matters as much as the announcement? I think the announcement may be the- all that we get out of this.
I mean, in his last term, he proposed the Garden of American Heroes, which didn't fully materialize, but this was something he wanted to stand at the honored Americans he chose to honor. I think you're far more likely to see something like that. He has a lot more authority to add something rather than to take over something that's existing. That would be my guess of what you would do instead.
Alright, Elizabeth, I'm Greg Griffin. Thank you, Professor Nick Gordon-Reed always. Thank you so much. Next question is about what was really accomplished at the S.C.
Green Summit, and one of the President raised today by suggesting the Korean start of the war. You don't take- you don't take on a nation that's ten times your size. Also tonight, all we're learning about House Republicans' plans for releasing certain parts of the abstinent file. Finding the source you could trust for Weather Forkast should be easy, right?
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I'm Dr. Sanjay Gupta, hosted the Chasing Life podcast. When the Wolverines asked me to deliver the 2026 commencement address to the medical school, I was honored and I jumped at the chance. We have a special episode because I'd like to share that speech with you all to all the recent grads, whether it's high school or college or maybe you know someone's studying hard to get in or just get through medical school.
I want to share a few lessons that I learned along the way. Even more than 30 years later, I never take for granted that the education afforded me the chance to say, I'm Dr. Sanjay Gupta, and this is Chasing Life. It's really now, wherever you get your podcasts.
New questions tonight about what progress came out of yesterday's unprecedented White House meeting between the President, Ukraine's President Zelensky and seven European leaders. What actual steps were taken toward any of the warm Ukraine and how much is stale for now at least undetermined? For example, bilateral summit Zelensky Putin summit. Tonight, the President told talk show host Mark Levin, quote, they were in the process of setting it up.
Earlier today, reporter asked White House President Caroline Levett whether Mr. Putin had in fact promised such a meeting. Here's what she said. He has, and I just answered that question for you.
The Kremlin has yet to confirm that with Russia's Foreign Minister this morning, adding the quote, any contacts involving top officials should be prepared very carefully. Also this morning, the President weighed in on Fox and the war, suggesting not for the first time that Ukraine started it. But this was a, and Russia is a powerful military nation, you know, whether people like it or not. It's a powerful nation, it's a much bigger nation.
It's not a war that should have been started. You don't do that. You don't take on a nation that's ten times your size. So just a couple of factual matters.
Russia is not ten times the size of Ukraine. It is actually far larger than that by area. By population, it's about four times the size of Ukraine's population. And more importantly, Ukraine obviously did not start this war.
For more on how this is being received, and it's been weed a minute there for us tonight. Anderson, a day after Zelensky and European leaders gathered with President Trump in the White House, Ukrainians are trying to figure out what happened and what comes next. Hours after Trump phoned Putin from the White House Monday, the Kremlin unleashed its heaviest barrage of drones and ballistic missiles on Ukraine in almost three weeks, killing eight people. Hardly assigned Moscow is ready to talk peace.
Monday, Trump hinted at the possibility of US troops on the ground in Ukraine as part of security guarantees in the event of a peace agreement. Today he ruled that out. Monday, Trump extended a warm welcome to Zelensky at the White House, much to everyone's relief. Today he suggested Ukraine is to blame for Russia's invasion, saying it shouldn't have taken on a country ten times bigger than itself.
The White House says Putin will attend a one-on-one meeting with Zelensky. Zelensky says he'll attend, but suspects Russia will slap on a hundred preconditions, making a meeting impossible. And on that bilateral meeting, Russia has yet to publicly comment. And all of this against a background of unease in Ukraine, where mistrust of the Russian leader is deep, where so many are opposed to letting Russia keep the land it seized, and where many suspect the promises Donald Trump makes today will mean nothing tomorrow.
Anderson. Ben-Reed, thank you from Ukraine. Joining me now for my US ambassador to Ukraine, Bill Taylor, and former NATO Supreme Allied Commander, Admiral James Stavridis. Ambassador Taylor, you heard the White House Secretary say the latter of Putin promised to hold a direct meeting with Zelensky.
What does it say that Russia has not committed to that yet? Anderson, Russia has no real interest in sitting down with President Zelensky. He doesn't have an interest in bringing this war to an end. He has an interest in taking over Ukraine and bombarding it, and bashing it, bombing it, until he gets what he wants.
So what has to happen is he has to be strong. And yesterday's discussion with all those Europeans there is one way to start on that. Admiral, you heard the President there saying you don't take on a nation ten times your size, meaning Russia. It appears, and we've seen evidence of this before, that he thinks Russia is not the aggressor here.
Which is ridiculous. Let's face it, just over three years ago Vladimir Putin, Sergei Lavrov, his entire team were telling us, oh, we're not going to invade Ukraine. We're just conducting military exercises on the borders. Guess what happened?
They invaded. That's a fact. This is a war of choice started by Vladimir Putin, including war crimes by Vladimir Putin. And on with Ambassador Bill Taylor, we have got to stand strong and now put real pressure on Putin if we want him to come to the bargaining table.
I hope we do that. Ambassador, in an interview earlier, President Trump specifically ruled out American troops on the ground in Ukraine. That's no real surprise ruling it out to enforce any potential peace deal. What could security guarantees look like without U.S.
troops? Well, as the Admiral can tell us much better, Anderson, but there are a lot of capabilities that the Americans have, that we Americans have, that are based in Europe, that are in Romania, that are in Poland, that are in Germany, that are in Germany. They're air assets. I think the President even talked about using air assets in support of this coalition of the willing.
The Europeans, to give them their due, to give them credit, have talked about a coalition of the willing that is going to put troops on the ground. Is that not predicated, though, Ambassador, on the idea that the U.S. would come to their rescue if needed? Maybe, Anderson, but we haven't got there yet.
What we have is a commitment by Europeans, and now, frankly, a commitment by the Americans to be part of that, to support that. So that's a good thing, to have that kind of a deterrent force. They're deter the Russians from attacking again. Admiral, the word I think President Trump used was coordination with the U.S., but European countries doing what they're going to do.
Do you think Europeans, France, the United Kingdom, for example, would be willing to put troops on the ground in Ukraine if they're not certain the U.S. would be willing to back them up if they're attacked? They want U.S. backing, and it's not just France and the U.K., it's also Germany, Poland, the Baltic states, Sweden and Finland, the two newest members of NATO.
I think there are plenty of troops to go around, and I concur with the Ambassador. What the U.S. needs to provide is cyber security, intelligence, logistics, muscle, aviation. We need to really back up those F-16s that the Ukrainians are now flying.
All that can be done without putting physical boots on the ground. I think that's a good division of labor. I suspect that's how this comes out ultimately. Ambassador, in the same interview, earlier President Trump said about his meeting with Putin in Alaska, quote, there's a warmth there talking about Putin.
The President has said on several occasions he feels he has a strong personal relationship with world leaders that having those relationships is a good thing. How much of a role does that actually play? You think in negotiating something like a peace deal with Ukraine? I mean, it echoed to me somewhat, George W.
Bush said early on when First Meeting Vladimir Putin looked into Seoul and looked into his eyes and saw his soul. So that personal relationship is not going to win the day. It's not going to achieve the goal. What has to happen is that, what has to happen is that, as we just said, is we need to be strong, we need to put together a coalition, we need to put pressure on Putin.
And if President Trump can't put pressure on Putin, irrespective of his personal opinions or views or feelings, then that can actually make some difference, and that can get us to where we can get to assist fire. Do you see any son of that actually happening? He said that there would be severe consequences if nothing came out of this summit, if the war didn't end, or pause at least. And he's now backing off his demands previously that there should be a ceasefire.
There should be a ceasefire. He went into that. But Anderson, the other thing about President Trump is that he changes a lot. And he's changed before.
Putin is going to do what he's done before, and that is going to overplay his hand. He's going to stiff the president on not showing up at the bilateral. He's going to continue to bomb the Ukrainians night after night after night. President Trump is going to figure it out again that Putin is the problem and needs to be pushed, pressured, to come to the table for a ceasefire.
Admiral, in your opinion, what kind of pressure do you think would be necessary to get Russia to seriously consider peace deal? I'll answer that in one second. I just have to add an addendum to your comment, Anderson, that President Bush looked into Putin's eyes and saw his soul. John McCain, Senator John McCain, was asked once, well, you met with Putin.
You looked into his eyes. What did you see? John McCain said, I saw three letters, KGB, the Russian intelligence community. That's what's inside Vladimir Putin's eyes.
In terms of what pressure we need to put on, we need to increase the flow of offensive military weapons, more F-16s, more training for the pilots, more service to surface missiles. We need economic tools such as confiscating the $300 billion in Russian assets that are in Western banks, and we need, as the ambassador knows better than I do, we need diplomatic tools. Pull the Ukrainians toward NATO, integrate them. Don't bring them in as a full member.
That's a bridge too far at the moment. But get them deeply involved with every aspect of NATO. You do those three things. You'll put real pressure on Putin.
We can get him to the table. We can solve this. Admiral, to breathe these, I appreciate Ambassador Taylor as well. If next, it looks like there may soon be documents or some documents in every Epstein case released.
We have an update on what's happening on Capitol Hill. And thousands of Israelis take to the streets, to many Prime Minister Netanyahu strike a deal to free the hostages. Will he agree to a new ceasefire proposal? Mid-grown calls on Capitol Hill for more transparency, the Jeffrey Epstein case, including from many Republicans.
The House Oversight Committee now says it intends to publicly release some of the files that it's a peanut. It expects to begin receiving materials from the Justice Department on Friday. Before anything is released, the Committee first plans to redact the names of Epstein's victims, as well as sensitive child sexual abuse materials. Lots of discussions, including Kate Brown, an investigative reporter from the Miami Herald, who's work led to the investigation into Jeffrey Epstein being reopened.
The author perversion of Justice, the Jeffrey Epstein story, and Jessica Roth, former federal prosecutor in the Southern District of New York. Julie, this is the first time we've spoken since House Oversight Investigation was launched. Your knowledge is about this, cases better than anybody's. What do you think about who was subpoenaed and just as importantly who wasn't?
Well, I think like a lot of people, there's a lot of questions here about the choices of the people they decided to subpoena. It doesn't appear that they've subpoenaed anybody to be able to explain how Jeffrey Epstein got the light deal that he got to begin with and how he was able to continue to abuse hundreds of young girls and women over the years. So it seems to be a specifically targeted group of people that perhaps will tell them what they want to hear or won't have the information that the public really wants to begin with. I mean, to your point, they could have subpoenaed the attorney from Miami or from Florida who gave Alex Acosta, who gave Epstein that deal.
Well, I'll go even one better. I think the attorney, the prosecutor that they should subpoena, would be the line prosecutor, Maria Villafana, who handled the case from top to bottom. And in some ways had tried but was overruled, but she tried to prosecute. She wanted to bring like 60 charges against him.
That's correct. And there is a draft indictment that should be part of these records that would show the evidence that they had against him at the time. And that's part of the information that the survivors quite frankly would like to see. What did they know?
How much did they know at the time that they gave him the sweetheart deal? And who stood in the way because Maria Villafana wanted to prosecute him and the investigation that the DOJ did shortly after my series ran, showed him the investigation. And as a result of those mistakes, he was able to get a leaving and deal. Jessica, what do you make of what this committee is doing and the people they haven't called?
Yeah. I mean, so for background on the Epstein case, it's clear that federal law enforcement didn't take the allegations of the victims seriously soon enough. When they finally did, it's clear that Epstein got a sweetheart deal from Alex Acosta, the U.S. attorney in Florida.
And it's also clear that the victims were not kept apprised or developed in the case. Right. I mean, the police and the police reporting that they were lied to, the victims were lied to by prosecutor. The deal was affirmatively kept from them.
And so I actually think it would be a worthwhile investigation to find out exactly sort of what happened, why law enforcement was so slow at the federal level to take the allegations seriously, why Alex Acosta prematurely offered that deal, and whether there was any political interference or favoritism, the circumstances certainly smack of favoritism. And there have never been adequate answers about sort of how things unfolded. That would be a worthwhile investigation. But if that's what Congress wanted to get to the heart of, in part to decide whether they should legislate in a way that would improve sex trafficking investigations and also address the use of non-prosecution agreements in sex trafficking cases like happened here, they would be calling a different set of witnesses.
I mean, they're calling the people at the very top or at least likely to have granular information about what happened here. And it's a glaring omission that they haven't subpoenaed Alex Acosta or the prosecutor who was actually building the case against Epstein that was rejected by Acosta. And Julie, I don't know what you were the person for me, which I didn't realize that Epstein's autopsy has never been released. Is that something?
Was that subpoenaed at all by folks on Capitol Hill? Not that I know of. And certainly, I don't even understand why they're not releasing that. Epstein's brother, his next up has been on the record in interviews saying that he has concerns about the way that investigation was handled and that he himself hasn't been able to get information that he's requested about his own brother's death.
So, you know, there are a myriad of problems here. And what the oversight committee right now is doing doesn't seem to address any of those issues. And just in terms of a Gillian Maxwell, she's been now transferred to this far less onerous prison. Any clue?
We don't know why. We don't know what, if there's, I mean, it seems, you know, a lot of people think there's some sort of deal being made. What do we know? Yeah, it's hard to know exactly what to make of it.
It's hard to imagine that it's disconnected from her meetings with the Deputy Attorney General. I mean, certainly her transfer. Those meetings went on for like two days. Yes, it's unclear whether they're going to be taken up again.
Certainly her transfer would make future meetings easier, easier for people to get to her to meet with her. But it's really hard to know exactly what prompted it in terms of whether there was a deal specifically struck and what it is that the Department of Justice is planning with regard to Ms. Maxwell going forward. She still has an appeal pending before the Supreme Court of the United States, by the way, where her main issue on appeal has to goes back to the terms of the sweetheart deal that Epstein got that provided immunity to unnamed co-conspirators.
Julie, what's your thoughts on Maxwell? Well, the one thing that sometimes is forgotten here is that her sister lives in Texas. So the geography of this perhaps played a part of it. I'm sure she wanted to get closer to her family, who by the way has been supporting her pretty publicly on social media.
They formed a website and they've been out there trying to, you know, they've been out there in her corner. So I think that part of it is that she probably wanted to get closer to her family, probably requested some kind of arrangement where she could go to a prison that was closer to her sister. Julie, I really appreciate your time. As always, Julie K.
Brown, Jessica Roth, as well. Thank you. Tomorrow on my broadcast, my conversation with Amanda and Sky Roberts, the sister-in-law and brother of one of the Jeffery Epstein survivors, Virginia Jeffrey, who died by suicide earlier this year. Just ahead, I've seen an exclusive Clerc Award, talks to a freed hostage who recalls how he and other hostages relied on each other.
I'd love to get a sense from you of the bond between hostages. The experience there and the connection of us, you know, the situation made us really connected. We really love each other. Also tonight, the latest on Hurricane Aaron, which is pounding parts of the East Coast with destructive waves and a powerful storm surge.
We'll be right back. I feel guilty. I feel guilty by myself. When I eat, I feel guilty.
When I get chowered, I feel guilty. When I go to the hospital to check something, I feel guilty because I know what they go through right now. On October 7th, 2023, when rockets started raining down, they ran to a shelter only to come under attack by Hamas militants. In this row, the first grenade inside, the grenade exploded and killed the most people at the entrance.
At that moment, I jumped on Zev and I told the other Zev I love you. I took the baddies and I covered me and Zev to survive. They came inside and they started shooting my legs. What's going through your mind in this moment?
I really start to pray to God, to tell Him God, I love you. Please keep me alive. And they came inside. And when I opened my eyes, I saw them film us.
It's a big smile. And when I came out of the shelter, I saw so many people with RPG, with Colachenko. With a lot of tools to kill people. They were so high.
For me, I saw them. They laughed. They seemed like crazy people. Helia was bundled onto the back of a truck and taken to Gaza.
Also on that truck, Israeli American, Hirsch Goldberg Poland. His hand blown off trying to throw a grenade out of the shelter. The pair would later be held together for a short time. We took a lot for three days.
After three days, they told him that here is Wake Up, you go to your mother. It's a happy day. You go to your mother. Be happy.
And he gave me his book. He got some book in English. I didn't know English before. You didn't know how to speak English before?
I didn't know. I didn't know English before. He told me, take it from me. Because I go home.
Keep it for you. So it really gave me power to continue because I said to myself that Hirsch came back home. May he come to my mother and to my father to tell him that I'm alive. And I will be okay.
But Hirsch never came back home. He was executed by Hamas, along with five other hostages. So for me it was difficult because I really love him. We were for three days, but it felt like we were friends for ten years.
I'd love to get a sense from you of the bond between hostages. The experience there and the connection of us, you know, the situation made us really connected. We really love each other. Most of Elia's captivity was spent deep in tunnels alongside fellow hostages or Levy, Alon O'Hail and Elishirabi.
He says he went an entire year without brushing his teeth. At one point, surviving on a single can of beans shared between them each day. I can tell you about a lot of situations that they came and really tried to do any torture to laugh on us. Like...
Mind games. Like mind games, you can call it mind games. After something like eight months without a mattress, without nothing, we slept on the floor. They came with big smiles.
We have big news for you. We gave you a mattress. But we have bad news. We gave you just three.
So check who slept on the floor and who will sleep on the floor and who will sleep on the mattress. When we look to each other, nobody wants to continue to sleep on the floor. After so many days, we tired one of the hostages. His name is Alon O'Hail.
That's still there. He came and told to the tourist, give them a twist for them. I will sleep on the floor. After 505 days, Elia was finally released, reunited with his parents and his girlfriend, Ziv.
Who he had assumed was killed in the shelter. And then I made Ziv. And it was like, it was like dream. For a week, it felt like dream.
I look at it and I tell Elia, Ziv, I can't believe you're here. Because I so... she's a five. And now you guys are getting married?
Is that right? I can tell you that's in the news. Since his release, Ziv is always by his side. She wanted to join us.
She wanted to join us? Okay. Let's put a microphone on you. I mean, Ziv, did you ever let yourself imagine that moment while you were waiting for Elia?
No, not really. Because I was scared. I never let myself to imagine this moment because I didn't want to fall. I told him myself, I believe, just when I see Elia cross the border with Ziv.
With soldier. And this is the moment that I look. And told him I said, okay, now you can breathe. Anderson, during the ceasefire, Elia did an interview with Israeli media where he said basically that if the fighting continued, he believed it would be, quote, a death sentence.
For the hostages. During our conversation, he was very careful not to criticize Prime Minister Netanyahu or his plan to occupy the whole of Gaza. But other hostage families have been more outspoken, Anderson. Closure word, thanks so much.
Next more breaking news. The new advisory in Hurricane Aaron is the powerful storm surge to affect North Carolina's coast in a very dangerous, potentially destructive way without ever directly hitting land. More breaking news, Tropical Storm watch is now extended into parts of Virginia as Hurricane Aaron threatens much of East Coast with huge waves and storm surge all without ever directly hitting land. Along North Carolina's coast where Tropical Storm warnings are in effect.
Already some beach homes on barrier islands are being battered and officials fear they could collapse into the ocean. In addition, Rip Current alerts are up along much of the eastern seaboard. Already at least 75 people have been rescued at North Carolina's right spill beach over the past two days alone. A number of beaches from Virginia all the way north to New York City are keeping swimmers out of the water until Aaron is no longer considered a threat.
Tonight the storm is now a cat to hurricane with maximum sustained winds in your 105 miles an hour. As for where exactly it's headed, according to the latest bulletin, it is expected to track north into the open Atlantic. And that is really some good news, at least I won't be making landfall. That's it for us.
The news continues. The source starts now. Hey, I'm Anderson Cooper. On my podcast, all there is we explore grief and loss in all its complexities.
You have been, and I mean, so sincerely, the soundtrack to my healing. My guest on this episode is Chanel Jones. In January she began hosting a long-term Bush Hager Today with Jenna and Chanel, the fourth hour of The Today Show. In May 2025, Chanel's husband, UJ OJ died from glioblastoma.
When you hear other people share, it is healing and you don't feel as isolated, you feel less alone. And so I feel like you've created this beautiful quilt of like nurturing our hearts. And so I am honored to be part of this quilt. Talking grief, building community.
That's what the podcast is all about. This is all there is. Listen and follow wherever you get your podcast. I'm Daniel DeKim.
I'm going to South Korea to figure out how this small nation conquered the world with its culture. Join me and meet the artists and creators behind the phenomenon. Kaye, everything. Now streaming on the CNN app.