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I'm going to show you all the time today. You're listening in to Dateline's morning meeting and 30 Rockefeller Center. The tutorial team is catching up on breaking crime news around the country. The tech start revealing this really kind of devious plot.
They try to put that in his margaritas. No, I do believe the defense will rest today. So she's directed the month's murder? No.
Welcome to Dateline True Crime Weekly. I'm Andrea Cannon. It's November 14th and here's what's on our dockets. A 26 year old mother of two was missing from months before her body was found in a drainage pipe in southern Minnesota.
We've got the latest on her alleged killer's trial. She was able to get a change of venue claiming that a lot of people in the community participated in the search for her in Dateline Roundup dramatic developments in the case of missing Texas mom Suzanne Simpson and a judge here's arguments in the Brian Cobra case for the manic user murdering for University of Idaho students face the death penalty. When somebody sits on death row and there's no real means of executing them. That is dehumanizing to that person.
Plus Keith Morrison will be here on the 20th anniversary of Scott Peterson's conviction Keith looks back on the blockbuster case. Evidence at that stage was hard to figure out except at this guy. The husband he was a strange cat people can figure out. But before all that we're headed to a courthouse in Carroll County, Indiana where this week a jury reached a verdict in the trial of the manic user murder in two school girls in 2017.
It's a case we talked about several times on the podcast, the brutal double murder of middle schoolers Abby Williams and Libby German who were found stabbed to death in the was near winding creek. The case hung over their hometown of Delphi, Indiana for five years until 2022 when investigators arrested a local man by the name of Richard Allen. Allen's trial began almost a month ago with the prosecution and the defense presenting starkly different accounts of the defendant. Was he a killer without mercy who forced to two terrifying girls down a hill at gunpoint or was he an innocent man caught up in a botched investigation.
Here to fill us in on what the jury decided and how the community reacted is dateline producer Mary Ann O'Donnell. Hey Mary Ann, give us a sense of what the jury had to go over once they went into that jury room. I'm sure that the ever movie German phone of a man who looks to be telling the girls to go down the hill had to be a big focus for them. Well, you know, the prosecution said look look at that image taken by Libby German just before her death.
We're saying who but Richard Allen fits the description of that man that you see there one other little bombshell the prosecution delivered was in one of his confessions from prison Richard Allen said I killed those girls. I had the intent to rape them, but then I saw a vampire passing by and I got scared and sure enough there's a man that was driving a van that day around that time. Oh, his driveway which runs parallel to the creek. So the prosecution is saying look you've got to get credibility to this confession because it matches up with this witness.
That's right. And who about the killer wouldn't know that detail. What do you think were the most powerful moments the jury took away from the defense as they deliberated? Well, I have to say so much was in the video.
You see this video of him in prison and he is at times gone at times he's covered in VCs. The business and listen to this guy in prison. Those confessions have gotta be thrown out because this man was not in his right state of mind. And there was one more thing at the end of the defenses arguments about the headphone Jack of Libby's phone.
Tell us about that. This was another one of those job dropping moments. The defense expert said look at 5.45pm, the state series of girls already get this point. Why them does the data show that something was plugged into the headphone jack of the phone at 5.45pm and then unplugged some buyouts later around 10.30.
That's your killer. And by the way, that cannot be written out. He's home by them. Oh my goodness.
That is an interesting nugget. Mary on the jury deliberated for around 19 hours over the course of four days. Take us inside that courthouse while you and everyone else were waiting for the verdict. We were not allowed inside the courthouse until they said there's a verdict.
But when we came into that courtroom, there was no sound. Everybody was just holding up. What do you hear people who were here? They were talking like you normally did.
And then they handed the judge the form. And she went like she was ripping off the band. Count two, guilty, guilty, guilty, guilty, guilty, guilty. After that first guilty, you heard one guess and then silence.
One guess, likely from one victim's family. And then you hear this very silent weeping and it was right behind me. And it was his wife Kathy Allen and his mom. Can you write down the four counts for us of what he was talking about?
The first and second counts were called felony murder. The first four, Abigail Williams, a second, early journey. But that really refers to is includes kidnapping and the commission of murder. And then the second two counts, read four, are called murder felony, the opposite.
And those refer to intentionally causing the deaths of these girls. Did he have a reaction? Did he say anything? He said nothing.
He looked stoic. But then at one point he turned his head around and he looked at his wife and he just kept nodding his head as if he was suddenly communicating to her like it's going to be okay. How has a community reacted to this? The past three weeks, the people lying outside have been people not until that.
But from other parts of the country who come in just to watch this trial. And many of those people that I interviewed were really rude for general. However, after the verdicts as I came down the courthouse steps, I all decided to get this whoop. And this round of applause and I see the street filled with people.
People of Delphi had heard about the verdict and they came out to show the support for the families of victims. What is next for the case, Marianne? Sentencing. Sentencing is step December 20th.
He's looking at 45 to 65 years for the death of each girl. Alan White Kathy, she is right if I've ever known to any civilian WTRR as she left the courtroom. And then Richard Alan White Kathy, Alan came out. She was crying and she just said to me this isn't over at all.
That was her one indication. And then she came out and had been a constant person there in the court. His mother has been there in most days. And even though they were weeping when this came down, they had a bit of, I guess, I don't know, stoicism or determination that this was not going to be the end of things.
What about the girls' families? Do we know where they go from here? Sometimes family members of victims, you know, they channel that pain into helping others. Your 100% right.
And that is the case in respect to Libby's family, her grandmother and her sister have become very outspoken at this victim's rights. And I think Abby's mother, I know that once a year she does this really beautiful charity service for kids who don't have access to things like pencils and paper and games and people in the community come and join her. And they feel shoe boxes with all these great things that kids would love and they go out over the country to kids. And that's in Abby's memory.
So nice. Thanks very much for your reporting and for bringing it to us on the podcast. We appreciate it. Thanks, Andrea.
Up next, thousands of people turned out to search for a young mom who disappeared in southern Minnesota. But it wasn't until Sheriff Stephanie heard flies swarming over a pile of logs that she was found. A year and a half later her ex-boyfriend went on trial for murder. On March 31st, 2023 at 8 in the morning, Madeline Kingsbury entered ex-boyfriend Adam Freyville dropped their kids off a daycare in Winona, Minnesota.
It was the last time the five-year-old and two-year-old would see their mother. She was 26 years old. Her family reported her missing the next day and a little over two months later, a body was found wrapped in a fitted sheet in a culvert. Her affiliate KTC covered the news.
Long horsemen has confirmed the remains are those of Madeline Kingsbury. Adam was arrested for her murder a few hours later and for the past month his trial on four counts of murder, two for killing her and two for killing her while committing domestic abuse, has riveted the state as the prosecution has told the story of a woman trying and failing to escape a relationship that had become violent. Olivia Pronzinski, who reports her KTC was in the courtroom every day and joins us now from Rochester, Minnesota. Hey, Olivia.
Hi, thanks for having me. What has been the reaction in southern Minnesota where all of this happened? There was a search, of course, when a young mom was missing like that. I would imagine a lot of people turned out to try to find Maddie.
Yeah, thousands. There were several large searches every weekend. It seemed like there were 5200 volunteers coming out on top of several non-force agencies doing stuff on there as well. And during this time that Maddie is missing, what is that I'm doing?
Is he helping search for her? Is he doing pleas on the news? Is he going on social media? Adam claims that he was told by the BCA not to participate in searches.
Don't go to any press conferences, but later on, I confirmed with the BCA that they never said that. I'm going to NBCA is that are those crime scene investors. Sorry, not everyone is around the Minnesota. The BCA is basically the top crime investigator in Minnesota stands for Bureau of Criminal Action.
Yeah, that would seem really odd for law enforcement to tell someone significant other not to participate in a search that I've never heard before. Of course, they're in the middle of a breakup at this point. Yes, the relationship had actually been done for, I believe, a couple of weeks, if not months, but they were still living together for the get-sake. So we talked from April 1st until June 7th for them to find Maddie's body.
Yeah, so where her body was found, it actually been searched numerous times by law enforcement agencies. And she was found in a culvert that nobody knew existed, which is a piece of pipe that directs water underneath a road. And so the investigator just so happened to go down that road one day. And he said that he got out of his car and walked up and down the road and then he could smell even decalposition.
He could hear flies and he looked down and he said that he had trouble seeing it at first, but poking out from underneath the pile of logs. He could see a grave at a bed sheet that was arrested. The day the body was found charged with murder two days later. Did the police give insight into what evidence they had that led to this quicker rest about him.
Really, it was all of the abuse allegations that came from Madeline's family and friends. I think the biggest one was the abuse allegation where it happened in December of 2021. We were watching a, I believe a special on Gabby Petito. And after that, I think Madeline expressed that the murder made her upset and it was sad to see.
And then allegedly put his hands around her neck and pushed her into the couch and said that she didn't wise up that she would end up like Gabby Petito. Oh, I don't have ever heard anything quite like that. My goodness. Yeah, it's Gary's information for sure.
This not just a minute, but it also comes into play because he was committing domestic abuse allegedly and if there's a pattern of domestic abuse, that kind of fact, your charges. Yes, according to Minnesota law, the prosecution had to prove two other instances of alleged domestic abuse and in this case, they had multiple. They had the Latino incident. There was the incident with one of Madeline's friends where they were on a FaceTime call and she watched an hit across the face.
There were also instances where friends noticed bruising around her neck. You were in court, Olivia for the entire trial. Yes, I was there for the whole month. The state was arguing that Maddie's murder was premeditated.
According to the lead prosecutor on this, we were several things that make it seem like it may have been planned. They had security cameras in their home and they were ripped down just a few days before she went missing. The prosecution argued that no one else knew that cohort was assigned out of free. Adam chose not to testify.
Did the defense present any evidence that there was some doubt on the prosecution's case? Yeah, they were calling it a case on panel vision because they said that other suspects were possibly overlooked. They were also trying to, I guess, pull holes in the investigation by saying that essentially Madeline King's body wasn't in that cohort before and there's no way that Adam could have done it because after April 1st, Adam was under a constant supervision. There was a track group on his car.
Adam Frable was down guilty on all four counts last week. Yes, he was down guilty on all four counts of murder. I think a lot of people are relieved. The family described it as a weight off their shoulder.
I mean, I can't even imagine what has gone through the family's mind throughout this past 19 months waiting for justice. Sentencing is coming soon for Adam Frable. Yes, he'll be sentenced on December 17th and for first the murder in Minnesota. It's a mandatory life sentence.
Olivia, thank you for taking us through this very, very tragic case. Thank you, for having me. If you or someone you know is experiencing domestic violence called the National Domestic Violence Hotline at 1-800-799-SAFE, that's 1-800-799-723-3, or visit www.thehotline.org. Coming up over a month after missing Texas mom Suzanne Simpson disappeared.
Her husband is charged with her murder and Brian Koberger is back in court with his life on the line. Plus, Keith Morrison joins the show as we look back at spot here since case on the 20th anniversary of his conviction. Welcome back to the show. Join me for this week's roundup is a date line correspondent, Blaine Alexander, and welcome back to the podcast.
So let's be here. All right. So first up, we have several updates in the case we first talked about a few weeks ago out in a wealthy suburb of San Antonio, Texas. Suzanne Simpson, a mom of four, has been missing since the beginning of October.
In the days that followed her husband Brad was charged with assault and a federal weapons charge as well as tampering with evidence. Then last week he was charged again. Here's our NBC affiliate, W-O-O-A-I. This obviously is not the development that Suzanne's loved ones and community wanted to hear.
Brad Simpson now charged with her murder piece. We are now talking murder. Tell us how this all went down and what Brad is facing. This is huge.
Although, remember, Suzanne's body has still not been found. So right now, his total bond is set at $5 million and his attorney has previously said that he does intend to plead not guilty to all charges. What do we know about why they're charging Brad with murder now? So there's not much that we don't know about this Andrea.
First, the arrest affidavit was originally sealed by the judge for 30 days, but it has since been obtained by our affiliate W-O-O-A-I. And it doesn't include an alleged timeline of events and new details like cameras showing at least two trash bags and a large ice chest in the back of Brad's truck, along with a quote, a large item wrapped in a blue tarp with a firewood rack placed on top of it. We also know that investigators are now searching an area that's near the property in Ben Deretexas. That's where Brad reportedly went after Suzanne's deer.
One of Brad and Suzanne's children also spoke out last week. Their daughter, what did she have to say? We heard from her on Instagram, Chandler Simpson, she's a 20-year-old daughter of Brad and Suzanne. And she calls Suzanne quote, a victim of abuse from my father and added, my father took my mother's life in a state of rage and control.
Wow. Still a lot. We don't know about this case. We'll be sure to keep it posted on what happens next.
For our next story, Brian Koberger is back in headlines. Koberger is of course accused of murdering for University of Idaho students in 2022. He was back in court for hearing last week, laying what happened in the hearing. So this really centers around the depenalty and whether the depenalty can be used in this case.
Of course, as we know, Koberger's lead in that guilty, the trial has yet to get underway. But at the ceiling, the defense argued that the trial should not allow the depenalty as a punishment should be found guilty in the case. What was the defense of argument? Well, basically they focus on some ongoing issues with the depenalty in the state of Idaho.
Idaho has had real trouble obtaining drugs used to perform lethal injection and they've not used the depenalty since 2012, some more than they did. Here's some coverage from our NBC affiliate KTVB of the defense of argument at the hearing. When somebody sits on death row and there's no real means of executing them, that is dehumanizing to that person. How did the prosecution respond to all of this?
What was their argument? Well, the contract is that lethal injection is currently available in Idaho and that it's availability should not determine the outcome of whether the depenalty is on the table or not in this case. Even if you assume that I hope cannot do lethal injection, that's not to say the decades from now, there's not going to be a method by which the state can put in the depenalty. The judge said he would issue a ruling on the death penalty at a later date, but we'll be watching this one.
We'll keep you posted. Thank you so much for coming back on the phone. You're so welcome to me. Twenty years ago this week, in November, 2004, a crowd of people gathered outside the San Mateo County courthouse in California.
They were there to hear the verdict in a case that had captivated the nation. We're the jury in the public hall of cause. Final dependence that the Peterson guilty of the point of murder of the A.C. D.D.
Peter Suck, guilty of the point of murder of baby chronic Peter Suck. We asked Keith Morrison to cover this story from the very beginning, along with date line senior producers who's in legal hits to come and chat about why this case struck such a nerve back in 2004 and continues to do so today. Thank you. Thank you.
He had decided to drive 90 miles to San Francisco Bay, he says, to do some sturgeon fishing. One of my early memories was standing outside of the Peterson house hoping that we could get an interview with him, and indeed he got the Peterson walked out of his house. He was very calm. I don't know what he meant of anything.
It's just this first impression was quite remarkable. You felt like if your wife and your unborn child are missing, you would be, you know, a wreck. Exactly. I think that's one of the things that made this such a big story that the public was looking at and looking at this guy with the WVVAs.
And yet, you know, the police didn't have the evidence to arrest him. Do you consider him a suspect? We didn't love to eliminate Scott from this investigation. We haven't been able to do that.
But a month after Lacey's disappearance, a woman by the name of Amber Fry, consorted and reveals an press conference that she was romantically involved with Scott Peterson. Scott told me he was not married. We didn't have a romantic relationship. Amber Fry was a huge thing.
And the thing that sticks out of my memory about that particularly is that when there was a vigil for Lacey, everybody was holding candles and singing songs. And he was at the back of the crowd and he was on the phone. And later on, it was discovered that he was on the phone with Amber Fry. But Scott's team went pointed out he didn't participate somewhat in visual.
We have a digital ability to marry him in the middle of the video with the tear running down his face, but he never got on the stage with the other people who were looking for her. Tonight, the news Lacey Peterson family have been dreading ever since she disappeared last year's miss Eve. And then in April 2003, two bodies washed ashore a few miles from the Marina where Scott said he went fishing the day Lacey disappeared. The body being found the way it was.
Everything in this story is put it that way. Inspired to make him seem pretty darn guilty. When Scott was arrested, there is that image of him with the dyed hair. You know, he was caught with certain things.
When police arrested Peterson, he was carrying $10,000. He's brothers ID and a password application if he was innocent, prosecutors asked. Why was he evidently preparing to flee? From the very beginning, Scott has maintained his innocence.
He pleaded not guilty to two counts of capital murder for the deaths of Lacey and Connor at his murder trial, the end of June of 2004. And he was terrified at trial. I think that turned the tide. The trial wasn't going over the prosecution until Amber got there.
As we said, Scott was found guilty and sentenced to death years past. And we know that he has found a new ally in the Los Angeles Innocence Project. So what can you tell us is the latest with that? The Innocence Project has asked him many things.
The judge has said no to everything except a piece of duct tape that we found on Lacey when they recovered her body. Right now they're looking for any DNA that can find out. Susan, you sent a text to Sharon Rocha Lacey Peterson's mother about the 20th anniversary of Scott Peterson's conviction. And she replied to you.
The only thing I want to say is remember Lacey. I feel bad for Sharon. I mean, I think it's a hard on her. And she just says she's so tired.
So tired of all this. I think there's probably no greater curse to a family than being at the middle of a story like this one. It's just a constant pain for the rest of your life if you haven't been to family at first. Well, we will see what what transpires in the months ahead.
Keith and Susan, thank you so much for your insight into this case that has captured the world's attention. Thank you. That's it for this episode of Dateline True Crime Weekly. You can find out more about the cases covered on our show at our website, Dateline True Crime Weekly.com.
And come up this Friday on Dateline, a former valorina shoots and kills her husband leaving a jury to decide if it was self-defense. This reads like a lifetime of you. You have allegations of poison tea, stalking, murder. It goes on and on.
Every time I thought, this is the craziest thing I've ever heard, then I would hear something else. Watch my new one-hour mystery, Deadly Dance, airing at a special time this Friday at 10 9 central on NBC, or stream at starting Saturday on Peacock. And be sure to listen to Keith's newest Dateline original podcast, The Man in the Black Mask. It's a haunting story about a man who was missing her this out of a horror film and a killer arrested on Halloween.
I have never, in my life, felt here like that. You can binge all six episodes now wherever you get your podcasts. Take out your listening for all our podcasts. Subscribe to Dateline Premium.
Thanks for listening. Dateline True Crime Weekly is produced by Franny Kelly and Katie Ferguson. Our associate producers are Carson Cummins and Caroline Casey. Our senior producer is Liz Brown-Korla, production and fact checking help by Saracadier.
Veronica Moseica is our digital producer. Rick Juan is our sound designer, original music by Jesse McKinsey, rice and borins inside of audio production. Paul Ryan is executive producer and Liz Cole is senior executive producer of Dateline. See you soon.