This is the best hang podcast featuring Max Kerman Shane Cunningham and I and Mike Bierman Welcome to the best hang podcast. I'm here with Shane in person and we are looking at a zoom of Max Kerman What are you doing? Are you laying on the ground or you up against a wall? I don't know what you're doing.
No, I'm sitting on a front porch right now I forgot the keys to get back into the house where I'm staying. I'm in Los Angeles, California And I don't know what accent works over here Accent work it was good. I feel like every other episode we get a good max accent There's lots going on for our listeners. It's been a minute, but we're back.
We're excited We got a new show out like Max said he's down in LA doing all sorts of stuff We'll get to the bottom of that and we got lots of discuss. So what do we want to start with fellas? We're talking about just guys We're talking about there's no other way to start this episode but talk about bulges because I miss the premier I want to hear all but the premier in Hamilton because I was in Los Angeles and the show is out streaming on craves You can watch it. It's a it's a TV special, you know There's it's 26 minutes of comedy that you have created and our friends have helped make and it's a real family affair You know Nathan did the photography for the poster Mark Myers directed it you guys wrote it and created it talk about it Max you have an original song on there that you know It's right a lot of our Kels fans that listen to this very podcast and they should rush to crave and sting right now If you want to hear Max kerman not only do the themes on off the top But maybe a little reprise at the back end with some some sweet yeah, that song brought some people to tears and scene I think a lot of people were expecting it to be kind of a gross-out show of course it being a spin-off from our show the dessert Which maybe people didn't expect to be a gross-out show which some people might have accused it of being So then bulges people think oh this is gonna be really out there But it's actually kind of a subdued show in many ways and I think caught some people off guard and Mike's own wife Danica was seen crying At the end of the show during the screening she said that she she shed tears and that's a testament I think to the storytelling the directing Shane's acting and Max your your song which really hits hard on that last It is it has become one of my favorite scenes because I think of what all of the things do in concert with one another You know it's the thing while making a TV show it all comes together in certain moments And I think fortunately this show has a lot of those moments Which is really really great, but enough fucking platitudes always saying is go stream it if you listen to podcast We'd really appreciate it and we're hoping for big things.
However the screening I was saying Oh for an unall I have our platitudes up the screen Screening seemed to go very well. I don't know maybe people are just kissing our ass But we did do a screening for the dessert in Hamilton, which I thought went as well as it could like very very well This was last summer. Yes, this was in I think June and this I think went even better I don't know maybe it was a better crowd. Maybe it's a better show, but I just felt like everyone truly loved it And Max I know you're in LA right now with Matt Unsworth who was one of the contributors to bulges and a writer on the dessert So he might be giving you the full skinny on what how it actually was what what he actually thought Are you able to share anything that he's told you?
Oh, he loved it He says pack the eater huge laughs. It was fucking awesome. Yeah, he he did mention that the Ubers cost him $250 to go back and forth If you know he was there in the rain he yeah, he did No, but he fucking loved it and you know talking to your bro about it Mike because his I don't know how much Greg watch the desserts Which is hilarious because you're best friend-shaking your brother Mike and all of his friends work on the show and Greg Yes, yes, probably I didn't watch all of it. I'll watch all of the show But he did say that bulges was amazing.
He said you know what to do say He wrote down some notes to preface this though Max He's by far in our friend group our toughest critic, you know, he does not fuck around really and he'll sort of either not say anything Or he just very you know, he's the one you worry about the most yes He's disarmingly authentic we could say or alarmingly sometimes if you're on the you know bad end of that Yeah, it's funny. I told I forgot this came up the other day by the way I'm because I'm sitting outside on a front porch You might hear like a dog barking and other shit in the back of her but I was talking about Greg's cynicism the other day because we're talking about the concept of Taking a dog out to a farm or cat out to a farm actually telling time to Unsworth Because I'm just like we have to take this cat up to a farm with the cat like doesn't stop shooting all right places up And I was telling the story about how as like a child Mike like a year after the dog had been taking to a farm in Calgary You asked Greg do you think the dog out taking the cat actually got taken the farm in Calgary? Greg just doesn't even look from the TV. Nope So Greg goes I said did you not watch the dessert?
He goes I watch a few episodes of dessert I don't love sketch shows. I want story so I like bulges a lot. I'm a fan of Shane It's the most Shane half hour of television ever he gets a few 20 year old jokes in there the human beat on my alley And he was like yeah, this is totally of Shane and all the sensibilities and this is and so he's super proud of it full swing Love it. Yeah, but that's sweet of Greg to it's a really dig it and you know you say you're saying you're gonna say he posted a nice thing on Instagram Which is also you know him being publicly demonstrative is not very much you know just it's real nice You know it's even bringing out the the heart in good old sinic Greg.
Well, what I want to say was you know When we hung out a few weeks ago in Toronto, we were talking about How the show is actually kind of weirdly sweet, you know, it's like actually as ridiculous the premises It's a very sweet show and like the sort of the love stories that are happening between the different characters are quite real and You know, I thought it was worth saying that and also talking about how hard you guys worked on the show because again It's a crazy show, but is this the hardest you've ever worked on anything? Well, I think we worked really hard and unfortunately when it comes to creative work whether it's good or bad the amount you work is usually Very close and similar. Yeah dessert was probably the most impossible thing that we've ever worked on collectively I would think everyone would agree with that and because of that it made bulges a little bit more doable So sometimes a big challenge would come up like a near impossible challenge and all of us would just say at least it's not the dessert We've already done this we've proven we can do it. So I think newcomers to the project We're kind of like what the fuck are these guys doing whereas we were just like this is all we've ever known and we're kind of Used to it by now and nothing can break us I can never do this again, I don't think anyone's willing to go through this again.
This was it is hell to I think Mark Myers is broken I think a lot of us, you know We've we've cashed all the checks that our butts have written and now it's it's time to live a little bit more comfortably And I think it will ultimately serve the comedy if we can do things more comfortably because yeah I do think this was an achievement and I think we can achieve more without killing ourselves as much that well You should be very very proud. It's very very funny. It's so executed Obviously, you know, everybody is pulling their weight in a thousand different ways and going above and beyond any one role designation So it's yeah pretty amazing more of that please just more more you guys making stuff, you know Bruce McCulloch kissed me on the lips at the after-party He's obviously such a professional live performer so the Q&A every single utterance that he said was just murdering with this audience Like he is funny insightful like every time he answered one of the questions at the Q&A after he was like Shane said He just sort of like yeah, just was like want to listen to Bruce And but he was also very kind to point out like there were certain things that Bruce maybe thought wouldn't play in the show That we kept in anyway because Mike was huge in the fact that there were some jokes that I almost felt like oh Maybe this is too much just for us and Mike was like no. Hey, we like Magruber.
We like this super style of comedy It's not for everybody Let's keep it in and if we're gonna you know fail Let's fail on our own terms or succeed on our own terms So we kept in some steak stuff and people have seen the show will know what we're talking about that could have easily been Cuppa we kept it in and the steak stuff murdered and you know Bruce had suggested maybe taking some of that out But Bruce also suggested adding a dance scene having a rival restaurant part that was so crucial to the show So Bruce was very good at praising us for keeping the things that we were passionate in and also listening to his suggestions That also did very well So yeah, Bruce was complimentary in that regard and was glad that we kept it we kept and added what we added the dancing was very pivotal That's a huge huge scene That's sort of I know Max like you loved it the way that like groups work together and things come together and creative collaboration And that's sort of a great example of Bruce You know doing the table read a Bruce's house and all this which you and Ash right you're on this EP's on it And it was like just sort of like banding around what works what doesn't work Bruce in some initial meetings with us He's got such a good sense of like sort of like beats that need to be hitting order to tell a story in a sitcom style And again, this is expanded of like 30 minutes from a two-minute sketch right and I think a lot of what Shane was talking about the idea That like we killed ourselves to make it in some ways we wanted to like we wanted in many ways We wanted to prove that maybe we could do like tell a story that's a little longer than two minutes Yes, we're a different format, you know And it's something like mark to direct a long format sort of story because he's obviously done incredible music videos and all sorts of stuff Or some reality TV stuff back in the much days But this is like a different thing that we're all like can we do this? It's a really hard thing to do But the challenge is exciting but it's hard to get people to sort of believe in you and let you make something like this because it costs a Lot of money and if it doesn't work out everyone kind of looks not great You know there's that old saying success as many parents and failures and orphan It's like, you know and this is a big sort of hat tip We talk about him on this podcast to the podfather Justin Stockman because he's the guy that sort of let us make the Dessert let's make Michael much in conversation with and then obviously now with bulges It's been great and so in making it having a conversation with someone like Bruce McCullough He's like hey if you thought about this what if it's all leading up to something like the big dance at the end You need like a rival to add some tension Maybe Trent feels like he needs to go somewhere and those story beats ended up playing huge and elevated the whole thing and we're just grateful That we have someone like Bruce in our corner actually since we're giving out praise I got to say huge creative suggestion early on in the process This was originally was all shot in Hamilton originally was just gonna be Hamilton's gonna be Hamilton restaurant called bulges and one Max Kerman suggested hey, what if I put it in Niagara Falls? Which is this weird sort of place where restaurant like this might actually exist that was a conversation I was saying so you guys can speak to that because everyone's shame like hey Max What do you know this Max at this? I was like that's fucking yeah Oh, yeah, well one Max and I we you know We just kind of randomly met up one day and had a long walk where we talked about I kind of saw Max leaving a hotel and I was like I'm not seeing this but it was totally like you know kosher thing that was going on So then once he spotted me we talked about it We went on a walk and we just talked about bulges the whole time and everything Max said I listened to like things he responded to like He'd be like yeah, that'll work But how about this you know in his own max way and casting one day max and ash called with casting suggestions Yes, and I listened oh yeah I was like oh yeah, of course.
Yes, this makes sense doing that like just type of characters who to cast in which spots And I thought that all made perfect sense, but yeah, there was so many outside people who contributed to this my father-in-law contributed a lot my mom even there's one joke about people in any time somebody has died They're shown in a casket and that's a joke my mom came up with so we included that in a couple scenes So that's kind of huge laughs because I was worried I was like this is kind of a weird joke might not get laughs But it definitely did I was able to tell that story at the Q&A which was kind of nice to have my mom in a bit of the show But yeah, definitely I forgot what the initial question was but yeah That's huge because and Max called and he said even after he saw a screener He's like make Niagara Falls more of a character in the show I got to give Ash that Ash was like the interstitial space. I like crediting the messenger though We did take that advice and it found it elevated it a lot just like one or two shots You think would make that much of a difference, but it totally makes the show feel way more Niagara Falls centric and moves the story I'm better you have a nice break in between scenes where we're at the falls or at this place But that's that's a note that came from you guys after an early edit, you know and then the show becomes what it becomes It's so crazy with these kinds of projects where you're like you start with a kind of a simple idea And I'm so naive anybody who's done this a lot probably knows this is a stupid thought but like you start the very simple idea You go, oh, yeah, it just kind of writes itself. It's great bulges You know, it's funny It's like there's some guys and you write a story and what you start getting into it It's an endless amount of work like endless like if you didn't have to hit the deadline that you did You guys could still be talking about it and arguing about each well We definitely still be mixing it like we'd be working on the audio We probably still be in an edit like there were a lot of like things leading up to sort of the finish line and whatever You know not to get too deep in the weeds in our process But like kind of like the final sort of last two days of editing was like shame myself pops and Myers like in a basement my basement You know my kids would come down we get some food We were kind of getting it to the finish line and then the mixing was again the four of us like from multiple days in the studio And it's like yeah, it's a lot of work, but you know, I know we're giving out our flowers here I want to give some out to Jonathan Populis as well, you know, he's writing on this thing He's in it So if you want to see him in the thing he's back there banging pots and pans in the kitchen He's one kitchen guys and just like editing like all of these things that sort of people do to contribute John is obviously The top of the list and I feel like sometimes just cuz he's such like a just part of the group So you don't necessarily say his name. I want to say it on this podcast.
Oh, he's the most underrated guy in the world He has unlimited bandwidth the things he did for the show are insane I don't think the show like it wouldn't even exist if he wasn't involved So Populis is we're lucky to have him like I've never met anyone like him He's kind of similar to mark Myers in the sense that he'll just work forever at a very high Unfathomable levels that because I'm the exact opposite where I have like a four-hour bandwidth every day and once that's used up I'm simply done like I just have to go to bed at 8 p.m. Every night or I'm screwed unless I'm running on pure adrenaline Like the final stages of the show then I can kind of stay it very late But I really appreciate people like mark and pops who can operate at a high level and very little sleep and still We just as good Shane I called you the other day and we were talking about something else But you kind of brought the fact that you've had these very intense life partners over the course of your entire life Where it's like whether it's a girlfriend or a best friend It's like you're tied at the hip with somebody, you know for a finite period of time often and it's like you are married to that person Well, obviously you're married to Alex and does not to make Alex jealous. I'm not trying to make a show I know she's got a little job. No, but but with pops on the show.
He was like you're But you've had this with Mark Myers. You've had this with Bert. You've had this with other friends Well, I have it with Mike to work. I'm married and Mike people know Mike's the only person I talked to in this building I don't think I've uttered a word Support crutch people.
I don't talk to many people in day-to-day And I'm like 50% of a person I need that other half to operate and I need to rely on you for everything cuz in a lot of ways I'm incompetent as a person Me too, and that's the truth. That's a good answer. Yeah, in some ways, you know I'm good I'm definitely good in some ways, but I just bandwidth is something I struggle with and I need a lot of help in day-to-day life Well, you should be very proud everybody watch that damn show. It's fucking awesome Oh, yeah Oh, my father-in-law if we're just giving out everything this week last thing I'll say about it My father-in-law it was his idea to pitch it as a full show and my cousin-in-law too They both kind of were like this could be a show I could see this being a full series changing up to pitch it and It worked so yeah full credit to them and was even able to get my father-in-law in a very small role But with big impact in the show itself playing my dad.
He was great. That was very cool huge moment in the theater too for John Then-Parski who was a listener of his positive shadow to John because he killed that scene This is why it's important if you are a creative person and you have some ideas You just have to start talking about it out loud just talk about to anybody who will listen Just because I'm thinking about doing a thing because you'll get a bunch of feedback Some of it will be useless, but some it will be really really good So the fact that like all these creative conversations just through just by bringing it up with your father-in-law with me With whoever you know it helps shape it and for the better And I always think that a lot of people have great ideas that are living in them But don't have the instinct to just like talk about it out loud and you're missing out if you're not talking about it loud because There's people are giving free advice away all the fucking time Do you mean there's so many good free ideas out there if you just ask somebody and 100% yeah, I think it's a little this kind of gets back to something we talk about in a lot of endeavors is it's like It's like you'll see somebody accomplish something and you'll oh man that's such an obvious idea It's kind of not the hard part coming up the idea. It's like doing it. Nobody wants to actually do it It's like you see somebody become a tik-tok star.
You'll see somebody become they'll succeed at whatever field They're in or whatever and you go oh man. It's like I can do that like the hard part's actually doing it and like committing to it for an extended Bearded time not doing one or two podcasts doing two years of podcast whatever that is if it's podcast if it's whatever your field Is or what you're interested in going through the stages where it's embarrassing because because ambition in and of itself It's kind of embarrassing. Yeah, like if you're especially if it's a forward-facing thing It's like hey, do you want to like come out and see like my band or do you I'm working on a TV show? It's like okay.
It's like until it becomes a thing like I always think about like imagine you're starting the spice girls or like a boy Band it's like it's the lamest shit in the world until you actually become wildly successful But the point is it's like it's the pursuit of anything that's forward-facing is kind of fraught with indignities because it's kind of like It's like how do you measure success? Obviously being on craves is something that helps with the sort of story and people will see the work But it's the execution or actually sticking with something that that's like the kind of the hard part in my opinion Yeah, just being on craved whether people watch it or not to me that's successful like it exists Yeah, yeah, and this is all it ever is. We're really proud of this 30 minutes or 26. What'd it end up at 29?
Yeah, it's about 29 So it's like you know, we're really proud of this piece and that exists in the world And I think that's kind of the way you got to approach like any of these things I completely agree and it's so funny I think about this a lot because the times I'm probably most unhappy is when I'm thinking about what other people think of me or where I stack up and compared to my peers or if I feel like I'm as far along in my career path as I ought to be like I'm gonna sometimes I can be in a good mood and go Oh my god, I'm so happy that we're doing this cool shit or we get an offer to play a cool show and I'm like Feeling good about myself, but most of the time it's like I wish we were a little further ahead or I wish we had a chance to do that And that's just natural like I think any artist regardless of their size like can go down that those rabbit holes But the times I feel best is when you're just doing the thing when you're working on something There's nothing better and every time I miserable I go just work on something just work a call call somebody You will help you through the creative problem that is right in front of you and you'll feel better and you know Mike as I called you a couple weeks ago and Ashen I called you because we had a word riddle that we wanted help on and you're of course one of our guys You're like the guy that we call for this kind of situation about like okay How do we're workshopping some like copy and how do we figure what's the best and coolest thing to say and we spent an hour on the phone with you Mike like laughing our fucking faces off And I don't know if we came up with the answer, but it didn't fucking matter. It was the word riddle I'm so curious. I can't say it on air. It's a max thing.
Yeah, okay You can help for sure Shane and we haven't found the answer yet, but it was it was on max max max always has like five projects He's multi simultaneously working on like you like and so it was one of Max's many projects that hopefully the public will see Yeah, but it was but honestly it was the best part of my entire day It's the best part of the week calling you Mike and just laughing with you about it and feeling we're getting something getting somewhere like the back And forth and so yeah, that's the only antidote to any of the ego stuff that we're talking about here about like Well, how people receive it what people think of it's like no you fucking make the thing you try your hardest You learn a bunch of lessons and then you're gonna make the next thing They should go make the next thing like you start thinking about the next thing You don't have to be like in production But you can start diligently writing down ideas and having conversations and collecting good thoughts and putting them into your own work I think you spoke a bit about this to at the screener on Thursday But it's like I think the heart of it and we've talked about this before is it's like getting with the right people that you want to make Things with and that's the hardest thing if you're listening to this and you're in creative work or anywhere Really and you're like I want to start something up It was a band or whatever make TV whatever that is It's like if you get with the right amount like the right people that you actually like being around then when it gets hard It actually almost weirdly turns into a fun thing because it's like I think about all the time Like when we're sitting there and it's like one in the morning and we've been in a room for 12 hours in an edit Even if things there's tension or there's some you know the debate about some edit or some joke or whatever the fact We like love each other and can literally turn like a tense moment in two seconds into one where laughing Oh my god, yeah, really fucking hard. That's like the heart of it I remember in your basement like 2 a.m. Things were getting a little tense But John had brought up that he was a tuba player in high school and Mike started grilling him about It's like sexual history in high school. It's like oh, did you lose your virginity in high school?
And like it's indignant. He's like of course I did it was a tuba player But we could stop making fun of the idea that the tuba player was the coolest guy So anytime things got really tense and marks like guys I need to go home right now We would just make a joke about his tuba player ex-bloits and it really We weren't close for that. I don't think we'd be able to have humor like that But it was just so memorable to be fun. Yes, it was but and that's it max You know, it's a cult you know It's like laughing with you and ash on the phone like that's that's the best part of creative work is when you enjoy We're also sort of getting some accomplished and the other thing too And it's fun It's really fun being down here in LA and we've gotten lots of kind of creative work done But you see a lot of people who kind of have to be mercenaries in their jobs even in a creative industry where they're just kind of chasing Something that might be popular in the moment and they're you know, that's how they're paying the bills and that's what they got to do And I totally understand and I respect it but when I'm asked like what I want to do I'm like I only want to do shit with my friends I like that is I don't really care about projects that are outside of like ideas that I have or ideas that my friends have It's not just that we can't collect more friends like of course like, you know, let's make lots of friends You know and the friends group doesn't have to be three people it can be a large network But it's like you own the stuff that you want to do especially creatively It's like I don't only worth it if it's if it's like with people that you love and then you that you want to share that you want to Share the experience with just knowing that it's all just about the experience It's like you want to make something you're proud of but like because it's all about the experience you want to experience with people that you love Are you able to divulge why you're in LA right now or is it just kind of a good creative place to hang out while you're fiddling around doing things you'd be doing in Canada?
No, no, it's a good question No, we our kels are always thinking about new music. We're not recording anything down here But there's just like new music people that we're like producers and you know writers and just other talented people that maybe we want to work with And there's some babies being had in our band in the next couple months, so not Congratulations Thank you Guys, I'm here to tell you children in LA I'm gonna be a father No, no, no Mike and Tony have kids. I like that babies are being yeah, congrats to Mike and Tony by the way Actually, I was just with Mike and Molly on on Saturday night and yeah, they're due very soon They are they are it's funny how when the babies are eminent max gets the hell out of town. It's classic me.
Yeah Every handle like you give gifts and if so, what does that look like when the baby comes out or is that not your style or I can tell you that for you. I guess we've only had two babies in the band so far I don't think did I send it I don't know I can tell you if I sent anything I don't remember I kind of don't care to be honest, but I'm very happy Saturday though Mike and Molly we'll be there. Yeah, of course So I'm staying with the friends Tim and Jess and Tim of course is celebrated comedy writer himself He's written on the office in the Gruber last night on earth and Jess is a writer herself. She's making movies and writing stuff It's they're just like super fun couple they live in Silver Lake and it's fun being here because you're sort of at ground zero for the music industry Like every music producer that you like or care about is sort of like wandering around here It's kind of like the ausington of la like the East side and there's just tons of creative people that are working around here and I went from meeting with this guy who's a producer had a coffee with him and He's working on a bunch of Beck stuff and so I was asking like a hundred questions about what it's like to work with Beck They lived basically in Beck's house in Malibu and was just like just sort of I was so fascinated with you know Beck's career to begin with and very curious to know what it's like to work with them etc It's just really interesting to learn about that experience and then ten minutes later There's a guy we're staying on the patio of a coffee shop and there's a guy behind him.
I was like back And of course it was back and then back to me. Oh my god. Yeah, you talked about yeah We talked about for well he gave our my guy a big hug and they caught up and I I tried to insert myself in conversation I was like oh We actually worked with this guy Tony offer who knows you because you guys did record he said Tony it was in Texas now right? I'm like anyway, I think the conversation carried on I think he was that interested in that factoid that I offered Still cool.
Yeah, still cool And then he also could I saw him at Bloodstage this past summer with Phoenix and he was like oh yeah like Phoenix really had the crowd that night that bands amazing We talked about that he was just in Brazil doing at a festival. He's talking about like Brazilian music. He look cool Yeah, of course. He looked really cool and then big big brim had her normal.
No no hat I don't think he's I think it's a baseball hat on yeah I had a baseball hat on and then I left and I walked up the hill To go back to Tim and Jess's place and I saw this like a redheaded guy who was sort of like 20 feet of me walking up This really steep hill I think it looks so familiar and it turned out it was aerial rush night And that is the producer of Haim and vampire weekend and a bunch of other like really cool like indie stuff And I've thought about aerial rush for a long time and I walked him I watched him go right into his house I was like oh that's where he lives He's got like a cool like vintage land Rover and then two hours later I saw the land Rover driving around and then the next night We're at the Italian place with Unsworth for dinner and he was there too So just like you just kind of run into people all the time down here You got to start with aerial rush date and then work up to back and then Okay, but I will say I know you guys are curious about my celebrity status down here Absolutely and on the plane I I was just getting off at LAX and a fan gave me a letter Basically there was a fan that was sitting right in front of me and very politely was like Hey, I want you to have this letter and and then just walked off the plane because everyone was de-boarding and I was like Okay, cool. And so I'm kind of feeling good about myself probably Canadian But you know it's nice to have interaction down here. Don't me read you the letter. Yes, it's a ransom letter When I texted my husband to tell him you were sitting behind me He suggested I call you a loser and a sellout to your face, but that's not really my style Although I do think those things I'm glad you and your band behave like rabbit big It's in public.
I'm sure there were many other artists who shared your opinion but stayed quiet I'll never know for sure who they are but I know 100% who you are I will never be refunded the thousands of dollars I spent seeing you play live over the years I can never undo bring your music into my home and sharing it with my children But I can't turn off the radio whenever I hear your voice Which is exactly what I do now turn over to me and many other ex-fans your voice and this legacy will rest only in your contribution to damaging and dividing our country On a scale that I can never imagine their families who have been torn apart friendships That will never recover and those people and bands like yours echoing that divisive message who played a major role I don't have high hopes, but I hope you learn something from this do better next time. Wow, it sounds like she prefers her earlier So she must what is the thing that she remains a name? Vaccine vaccine that's it who gives a shit. Oh my god You're on the plane we're both on the plane.
We're both on the plane. It's fine Like the thing is kind of over you know like the world you get mad at people if they don't get vaccinated Did you get mad at were you just saying hey get vaccinated? They were in a campaign and so then fans feel like they probably played a role if you were like a huge anti-vaxxer You feel like that was some you know great injustice So I guess them being part of the apparatus in the machine that was pushing the narrative No, that's exactly and also I think we had mandatory vaccine like for entrance to the show So I think that was a law. I think that was just the law I think if you wanted to go to any shows or if you wanted to go to like a tenant event you had to be vaccinated So I think we gave that a thumbs up.
We were like we leaned into that probably a little bit But I don't know She's got children and like a husband like a fan But she's like traveling on her own like if I had a loan time I would not be taking the time to write such an angry letter like I'd be watching a movie I'd be thinking about what I'm gonna do I grab some drinks like what a that's I man to hold that much inside you Don't much anger was she presenting as nice when she handed it to you kind of yeah She's like I want you to have this and kind of smiled at me. I was like okay cool. I'll be later. No problem Thank you It would have been awesome if you're like oh were you headed and you're staying in a similar place you're like sure I'm sure to cap and then read the letter.
It would just make her feel terribly uncomfortable Oh man, I know I was that would have been very close a little shaking at first But then it kind of made me want to just meet her a little bit more like somebody like won't you piss off of it? But I'm like no not really more just curious That yeah as you say there's she's still holding that resentment and I'm curious in a high-tour their family apart But yeah, I don't know it was it was definitely unexpected Exactly, but isn't it kind of flattering that she still likes the music I've listened to you for hundreds of thousands of hours. No thousands of dollars. It's spending thousands of dollars Do you offer to cut her a check to get her the money back?
I did put the note in the ban chat took a photo of it and One of our band members said well, she's right about one thing hashtag no refunds The other way I was thinking I was like okay, how much do we owe you? I don't care. Do you want $3,000? How much do you think you spent over there?
Oh, yeah, that's your old Starbucks move at the ten bucks. Yeah, I always want to give people a tip yeah, I mean like I always want to give people the money back and Okay, this is bother you so much. I'll just dig it Would you be more insulted if they were like listen? I hate your music every one of your fucking stupid songs make me ill However, I think you're a hero for promoting the vaccine and you save my family's life Question that's a great question what do I prefer?
Probably the second one I probably prefer if I save some lives. That's probably really yeah more useful than oh Yeah, if someone was like you're a piece of shit shame your stupid as hell, but goddamn your handsome Thank you like I'd be so flattered Yeah, but what would that be so but so but so you like you prefer to get this letter right like the one where someone like really loves you Yeah, just yeah, it's a good idea. Yeah, someone's like the bulges was so fucking funny It was hilarious, but your stance on the vaccine makes you a piece of shit and therefore I'll never watch it again I'd feel so satisfied when you want to be yeah It's like I think I think deep down you probably want to be complimented for what you've done like the work You know your your music max and then if they got a problem with a very reasonable stance on on vaccines Yeah, it's like I'd rather than like the work. Yeah, I contemplated like posting it on our Instagram story or something I think I'd be funny and people love that kind of stuff But then I was the thoughts like I kind of hate that you know like just where the internet has gone when it comes to like yes I can fight you guys agree with that right that I probably didn't need to talk about a podcast funny But it's this is different than like Instagram posts obviously.
Yeah, I think a podcast is a perfect forum. It's good It's good. Yeah, I'm so like I'm so outside of the realm all I know is years ago I promise myself I would never engage in like Facebook comments like you know You'd see someone post some thought or story where you want to call it like a whatever We call it like a yeah post whatever they do a post they say something You know and then some and then someone would be like argue it and then they're being argument They're not you'd have this big chain of arguments which I enjoy grabbing some popcorn and reading some argument between some old people in high school Mike Vierman is a piece of shit. I would probably not engage really no I know I just I'm like don't it's poison Man, it's poison.
I'm so like that was Facebook many years ago But the policy has continued with me to Instagram and Twitter. I'm not on tiktok So I like but I'm just not a comments guy and so like the whole idea of like taking that letter and then blasting it Oh publicly and then it would get all this engagement I don't even the game's engagement. I know I work in media But I'm just for me. It's not my I can't I can't let that lure it in though into something in the last year or something I thought you came in and you're like I never do this shame, but I got sucked in I thought maybe maybe it was basketball related.
Yeah, it might have something basketball related I regretted it because I don't need that I don't want people to see my arguments in public and you know my argument tactics You know, I got a real style when I'm going back and forth I don't need to put that on public display. So anyway, not my scene I think you did the right thing by not posting it. Yeah, I used to try to deliver more Twitter hot takes You know and I look back think just thinking about it It makes me cringe just being like wake up in the morning and I still I still tweet a bit But but 90% of things I think to tweet I go what's the point? I don't want to do it And my Twitter as a result is kind of boring and bland and mostly just about like supportive like ideas I suppose to like a hot day.
It seems like a very like the only people left on the internet doing that are kind of crazy people, right? I don't yeah, it's a means to engage me I actually keep seeing these videos on Twitter They're like people basically are trying to like get engagement by like like you go up to like there's this guy I went to somebody like a grocery store and they like hey Can I ask you a question and then I'll say something super insulting about the guy's girlfriend and so they want It's like they're trolling it's like trolling engagement Yeah, and these videos are like oh is like I gonna hit them is you gonna do whatever and you're just like it's crazy that there's this world where you Can monetize videos like harassment videos essentially for entertainment and I'm just like wow that's kind of what's happening out there in the world right now Yeah Curtis Connor who's actually in our show I was surprised as big as he is he still tweets and like Regularly and kind of says like not even a controversial joke, but something that I'm like ooh for as big as he is I'd be a little scared even put that out there like he just tweeted It was something like I want you to germy on my allen till I white Everything and it like it got a ton of retweets. I'm like as a 40 year old man like I'm clutching my pearls In the morning 9-5 I guess if you really think about it, how could that go wrong? But I am impressed when somebody has that perfect Cleverness where it's not really offending someone but it seems like it's kind of racy and they're just in that right pocket Which I think Curtis Connor he navigates that world amazing.
There's only one person on Twitter that That can tweet like opinions on culture and politics, but like rides the line perfectly and it's Elamine host of CBC's commotion Oh, yes, he's so smart. He's so smart. He's so fucking funny. He's like quite brave with his opinions, but he's but tonally It's always the correct spirit.
You know, I mean, it's never yeah like bitchy or mean or unnecessarily bit you mean like it's always just I nailed it like we just yeah Ash just sends me his tweets all day long and I'm like he's the only guy who could do it the way he does it You know it's very very impressive just El me and I think he does have a kind of a corporate job like he's a Personality, but he's owned by like a big company. So that's even cooler that he's able to do that. Yeah Um guys, let's wrap up real quick with a recap of the we are the world's documentary greatest night in pop music history We did this last episode which was like a month ago. We did we did like do you remember anything?
Oh, it's been so long all I would say is I would say the reason I found the talk compelling I think I kind of said on the last part of something we wanted to get into some real moments But like I just think that it is one of those I think it's such a great doc because they filmed this thing and whatever was What 1984 something like that? It's like to get all those big big massive artists in a room without their like their people Their managers their agents whatever it's like they got in the room Quincy Jones is like this is the policy in the room Just the stars and then the documentary crew and the engineers and there's such a vulnerability to sort of these massive massive stars That just would never happen today No one would ever like you never have someone like Taylor Swift in the room like that completely with no say over what the Documentaries gonna be or how the footage is gonna be used they would all have like a staker and interesting how it would sort of be Presented and how they would come off and Bob Dylan would have people they're like oh Bob look really sort of indecisive and lost there That's not a great look take it out of the dock. Well, it's been so long and whoever has the rights was able to put whatever the fuck They wanted in this dock and so I think there's a an interesting sort of Sort of like study of how these huge stars sort of worked in group work Who's the leader in the room? Who's sort of like the connector of people like it all kind of gets revealed?
You know like and I think that's the sort of value of the stock Well, and I had watched it the day after we did the big dancing for bulges Yeah, and so I'm like it's so hilarious how something which seemingly seems simple like doing a dancing I was relating to the difficulty of pulling that off and how they got like 38 of the biggest stars in the world together in one room Yeah, but there was a lot of similarities even coming down to how some people in the dancer team like there was one Person who I was I can't get too specific here, but he was like I can't do this dance It's gonna be a disgrace my family I have to back out and then I had to like go out and convince this man and come up with solutions on how to bring them back Into the dance and pull it off and at the end of that day We felt like we just did the most impossible thing I was living vicariously through Lionel Richie How calm he is he's the perfect personality and so much fucking talent Lionel Richie has but he's almost egoless in a way Like he and he had to do his bandwidth like he was fucking hosting the Grammys that night Yeah, the amaze the music. Yeah, well, this is this was kind of my huge takeaway from the doc Well, he took a little line of Richie is a documentary starts and I know Lionel Richie I know he's like in the Commodore's I know you know hello. I know his hands like three hits or whatever easy like Sunday morning It's like lady and rent is it really? Didn't I don't know anyway, what look that up, but um Lionel is like this guy But he's always felt like a an ancillary star like yeah He's a star but he's not like a star with a capital S And so I saw that he was a producer the main producer on this documentary He's kind of doing most of the talking head stuff because it the story really centers around Quincy Jones him and Michael Jackson Sort of making this thing happen and Stevie Wonder was involved to in the early stages But Quincy's not talking head in this Michael's not with us anymore and Stevie's not so it's really left to Lionel Richie tell The story so I'm like oh we're gonna get like the Lionel Richie version of events where he was a major You know, it's like you may be elevate in that of the four though You kind of Lionel might be the whatever so I start watching this doc with a bit of that going in like okay I'll see this through Lionel's lens, but the more I watch Lionel Richie talk like just in the talking head the modern-day Retelling I'm like okay, and then it like she said he's hosting the amaze and they show clips.
I'm going Oh, he's not gonna watch the close my fucking great host Oh, yeah, then you start watching the footage from 84 and you realize he is the glue in the room He's the guy keeping it light if he's somebody's been a little nervous he walks over and just hey How you doing? He's cracking joke. I'm like oh my god I'm becoming a massive Lionel Richie fan and I see your value sir I was definitely with your game and then at the end when they wrap it up in line will talks about being in that room and what it meant to him And he gets emotional. Yeah, I fucking love Lionel Richie Oh, you're kind of like our Lionel Richie might cuz I was like if anyone who could in our group who could kind of pull his out You too max you could host the thing right be kind of like a duck where you seemingly calm But underneath you'd be so many years spinning but still pull it off without having a nervous breakdown and then Be talking to all the people and common pulling it together.
So yeah, and then also the Bob Dylan part I was relating to him cuz like Bob Dylan you think is this massive talent But his voice is kind of shit So he's in a group with a bunch of people who can sing and actually know everything about singing and everything And he just chooses not to sing Like simply an inch away from his face It must have been a long lens but he's having a miniature panic attack Of course And he just wants a moment to pass and like have no one look at him and that to me was super relatable I feel like I've been Bob Dylan and that's an area where I'm somewhere I shouldn't be with a bunch of talented people who are totally outclassing me and I just want The 10 minutes to go by and just cut to the part where it's done And then they had to build up his confidence and like Bob Dylan needs a pep talk I was like rubbing his shoulders and you can do it man He's like how much like this and he does it and they're like that was great And they're like do it like that and then they actually goes no less But yeah, and they got in the Bob actually sang and that Bob Dylan weird way and they got it out of him Well that the great part is so like Stevie Wonder her one point kind of brought them on a tangent and it was really funny But Stevie they say in this doc is this amazing mimic and so one point Stevie sits down on the piano and he starts doing an imitation Of all the different people singing it so Stevie's doing like his voice very And then he starts doing like a Bob thing like we are the world or whatever and then when Bob's time to sing his isolated line Everyone did it in the room together Bob's the only guy they cleared the room for because clearly he was having this What you're saying is I anything where you didn't want to do around all these other people but when you stand at the mic He's kind of like hey Stevie Could you show me how you did it like you needed Stevie to show him his imitation of him So Bob could get the cadence of the lyric of the melody and yeah So it just was like really fun and he gets in and he kind of does is like people forgotten He was kind of doing the thing in his Bob voice, but it's like oh he kind of needed Stevie to imitate him to show him how to do it And all those little pieces are amazing and would never get on tape today Well, it was so awkward and I like I love cringe humor and this wasn't really like humor But I did find it kind of funny when Stevie's going off on a tangent clearly in the wrong direction Yeah, and one of the ad like Swahili was it was you know Adequivirce that was like yeah, yeah Bob yelled out that comment and he's like well Stevie This song is really more for the audience like people that are going to be sending the money not you know I mean it's so what Stevie's so talented so that alone It's hard to shut down a town but he also has this disability that makes it awkward a pipe in and you can't give him non-verbal Communication to kind of put him down slowly So Stevie just keeps going and going I'm like oh my god This is like perfect cringe captivating yes humor and it's such a moment to behold and I had to look away from the screen And it's like so many things were going on so it was one of those like almost immersive documentaries where I was getting up And I'd be like yes, that's hilarious like when they succeed. Yeah, it just was it hit at the perfect moment And you and I were watching it kind of in tandem Totally didn't realize it just putting it in the group I was like I think I've had said the pog room like yo this this dock is a banger And then you're like I'm literally watching it right now I'm so glad you said that because another person in the bulges cast was also watching it and they put out this is the shittiest I've ever seen do not watch this boring as hell. I was like, oh at least something at least Mike and I share that opinion Yeah, did you like to do right now? So here's I was thinking about you two I was saying about you I say what Ash this is your business this bread and butter this like the group work You know people with big hits that are like in a room like this What are you thinking all time you're watching you must be thinking what would I do in this situation?
Well, I think you're right about the Lionel character being a very rare kind of artist who's a genuine people pleaser and a leader Like I felt like a lot of these guys were sort of temperamental odd super famous celebrities who like we're kind of not in the mood To ever like take on that kind of role So the fact that the Lionel had that in him I related to because I he felt more like a camp counselor and sometimes I feel like a camp counselor more than artists I like that a lot a lot Honestly, you could go through like each scene of this documentary and then like stop it and then talk about it because it's just like You know like the scene when we're wailing Jennings leaves because he's like no southern boy ever Yeah, he's wally like swally like like amazing Also like Ray Charles sitting down and kind of performing a better version of the song like a gospel version of the song Yeah, because the song is kind of shit right like it's a song good I don't know it works by the end like I don't know if it's just an earworm or that thing where repetition, but I don't know I think someone's compared to a jingle like it's more like a commercial jingle then like a Happy birthday is that a good song or is it just an institution where we can't even judge it? And that's the we are the world. It's almost like a parody when I listen to it. It's so like ingrained in our culture It's easy for everyone.
It's kind of like a lullaby thing the words the chorus is anyone can sing I think and it's easy You know, I don't know but yeah, you did not fan of the song I love this song but I did get impressed because Michael Jackson I think I knew this before but he doesn't really play any instruments But he writes all the songs and he produces all the songs that he's a part of so it's like everything I kind of need to go History Bad musician I can play piano play guitar, but I have lots of ideas and seeing Michael Jackson know even less about a musical instrument than me But like being responsible and also being credited as being an amazing songwriter really pumped me up because like I don't really tree and My cousin amazing talking to people like I'm like oh so good I'm like dude doesn't even know how to like play any instrument so that empowered me to not learn anymore instruments moving forward I'm like Michael probably got handled a lot of those notes on planes, too I like that also is interesting to see which careers because they were all like top dogs in 1984 whenever the thing was shot But it's interesting to see like whose careers kind of carried on and have remained at the top and who are sort of like less So I guess like Cindy Loper like she seemed to be like one of the biggest things in the room And she's like I'm still a big name, but I think they chose her over Madonna like Madonna wasn't there Yeah, it was a debate in the 80s and interest back to Madonna is the bigger thing so I thought that was interesting Cindy killed it though I thought like she did a great job. I thought with her vocal I like it because it was so unique I you know why related to a lot like just in sort of like because like when I was when I was in a band or even as a singer It's like there's people that can like sing you know they can go on American Idol or something like that I was like I'm like a guy that like can sing with a guitar and I'll do all right in a room But if you put me again someone that's gonna be on the voice I'm gonna get demolished to eat I really had so much to cue Lewis in that room because he's like he'd sing his little bit And he'd be fucking flat and he knows he's flat and he's dying because he's got Michael Jackson He was right he's got Cindy Whalen to his left He just came off Steve Perry and like Daryl Hall, you know Daryl Hall's like I think Steve Perry like outside of Michael Jackson might have the best voice In that room it's the voice every time it went who Steve Perry the guy from Journey. Oh, right? Okay, yeah, it's like Bruce and Bruce Springsteen talk We even talk about Bruce Bruce Springsteen talks about Steve Perry's voice He's like I got that great voice man He's like it's like the same paper old no down thing And it's just like I anyway when when Huey's like dying in the footage and then in his talking head modern day thing I was like oh yeah, that would be the thing where it's like if you get me in the right moment I can sound awesome, but it takes me like ten takes I don't know how do you think you're a very consistent singer Max is well, no, no, no, no, no, no, I'm not a real singer though I really exactly to what you said Mike It's like I can kind of do what I can do but if but I've been in sessions with other people that are like real singers and like on the first Take everything is perfect.
I'm like oh, you're like a real singer Yeah, I did love that springsteen was a talking head in it and the reverence that the other artists have Springsteen was sort of the top of the world They're like 84 was like his year and of course he's gone on to be like the biggest thing like much bigger than Huey Lewis Or any other of the rock I bigger than Hall notes, but it was interesting I got woman in time. He still people still felt that way about him My big question maybe ended here because we should all go is do you think like it feels a culture We're like in a post culture world like we're post everything It's like post advertising post like you think the idea that this could happen again is conceivable Like a we are the world thing like our health participated in the Canadian version of it in 2010 when for K non-song when I get old I will be stronger. Yeah waving flag waving flag. That was a big hit this country Yeah, but do you think that could ever happen again like like on a pop like on a massive pop culture level I know they tried to do other smaller versions But the world were like the biggest 15 artists of the world sing a song It's almost because like the whole world is like ironic and Gen Z are so eye rolly like anything I was like kind of done earnestly we just be sort of laughed at right?
No, I feel like if you're scared into some massive event where everyone's just like in it together Like the George Floyd thing like where everyone was just like fucking in on that and like if you did a some event like that Happened again and there was a song paired with it and you'd look like a total asshole to say no I'm not gonna be a part of it I think that would be the perfect formula for 15 biggest artists together We've seen examples this like friends like when the Manchester shooting happened There's like they've done big concerts right or there'd have to be some threat or like a perk earthquake or something on a Mascula that brings them together, but some axis point It's like there's other mechanical things like we haven't seen a song written for a group Who's the person that writes it like Michael Jackson Lionel Richie writing that song it seems like everyone fell in line It's like oh, it's my Jackson song will do the song It's like is it Chris Martin has to write the anthem and is like, you know I have to be drinking another We have to be drinking Taylor Swift like those two right Taylor Swift is perfect. Yeah, but the but Taylor Swift wouldn't necessarily get like the hip-hop Urban side Yeah, I mean like I think so it have to be Drake and Taylor Swift if they did it than everybody else with online because they're the two Biggest thing I think Drake was from the world thing maybe Jay Z Beyonce Taylor Swift remember when that what's that actress's name who started the Imagine all the people Had her version of that Was like day three of being in our homes playing Xbox Well, let's wrap it But yeah, I think it'd be a unique thing if it came together this day and age because like you said There's so much more self-awareness in sort of every aspect of everything we do and people are scared to look silly Yeah, nuclear threat could be a big thing to bring it together Yeah, all right. Well, also, thank you so much listening I do want to show out the whole cast and crew of the St. Baldges day special on crave please watch it We're so grateful because all the guys that play the bulges guys This is a rare thing, but we have real camaraderie We have real chemistry and sometimes you don't know what actors you know and and these guys were awesome also listen The dessert they're the best is about Campbell Jillian smart the killers that everything to do they're amazing So I want to give them a huge huge amount of praise because they're amazing in the show and we've talked about former podcast Kurtz Connor showed up knocked out of the park fitting with the guys awesomely and felt like one of the dudes Oh my god.
Yeah, everything you just listed It's like my favorite grouping of people was that cast I could work with them forever like usually there's one bad Apple We've all experienced that but there was no bad apples on that set. I'm so good so fun And hopefully we see more bulges coming up. Okay, that's it. That's all.
Thank you so much to Official Baldges photographer Nathan Nash put this whole thing together. Thank you to executive producer St. Baldges special Ash, thank you to executive pretty swell max on you to thank you to everybody for listening and hopefully watching our show on crave now Good hang guys, maybe the best