Without Reality It Falls To Pieces - Nina Jankowicz On The Path From Disinformation To Autocracy

Hi out there, how goes it? My name is Nathan Robertson-Ball and welcome to the finding nature podcast. Today is a huge episode and one I’ve been excited to share with this audience for months. Nina Jankowicz is one of the world’s leading authorities on disinformation and democratisation - and what a time to be having this conversation. Nina was recently in Australia and after having the privilege to speak with her for the first time in 2024 getting to do so again was a thrill.Nina’s own career charts well beyond this moment of political, social, moral and cultural crisis we seem happy to slip further and further into. As a Fulbright Scholar her work and research focussed on how Russia organised and deployed mis and disinformation across many parts of Europe through the late 2000s and early 2010s, before undertaking a huge operation in the lead up to the 2016 US election. Her first book - How to Lose The Information War is both one of the best and worst books I’ve ever read - I no longer see the world the same way having read it - simply, it pierced the trust and confidence I had in what was real. And when everything could be fake to me, and when everything could be fake to you, and my truth is this and your truth is that, how do we do anything together? At a time when we’re bombarded with the impacts of simultaneous crises occurring now, how are we meant to address any of them if none of us have a shared set of facts and a common understanding of reality? The answer - what’s happening here and around the world every day.It’s hard not to feel dispirited about a tonne of different issues and challenges right now. Both here in Australia where mainstream media institutions seem intent on platforming anti-reality and far right politicians on a daily basis, where protest has been met with unprecedented police violence, where coal mines keep getting approved, and to where a lot of this chat focuses - the USA, which is difficult to comprehend and sad to observe from afar.Nina is a valiant. Courageous and wise beyond her years. What she knows, we all need to know.Links to check out and support Nina's work:American Sunlight ProjectThe Wayfinder - Nina's SubstackAmerican Sunlight Project SubstackHow to Lose The Information War - Russia, Fake News, and the Future of ConflictHow to Be a Woman Online: Surviving Abuse and Harassment and How to Fight BackSupport for the show comes from:Reposit Power - get $500 off your installationAltiorem - get 25% off your annual subscription with code findingnature25Jamberoo Mountain Farm Tiny Home - get Hot Tub Sunset Package for free when you add Finding Nature to booking comments.Send me a messageThanks for listening. Follow Finding Nature on Instagram