Yuba County Five

Hi, welcome to Studio Sisters, a podcasting with sister and I tell you true crime series. I'm Kristen. And I'm Davana. And this week, Davana has a story for me.

We're finally back. The last couple of months have been just a huge dumpster fire for me, but I'm hoping that 2019 is going to be worth our time. So this week I'm covering a disappearance that I stumbled upon while I was lost in a Wikipedia whole like two days ago because I didn't know what I was going to do. And I mostly picked it because it's like the area that we know, but I haven't heard of the case.

Okay. So the disappearance of Gary Matthews, but they're also called the U of the U of County five. So he looked them up as the U of the county five. So it took place on February 24th, 1978 and Gary along with his four friends.

So Bill Sterling, Jack Hewitt, Ted Weir, and Jack Medruga decided to attend a basketball game at Chico State University to support the UC Davis basketball team. So they had traveled 50 miles from U of a city to Chico in Medruga's 1969 Mercury Montego. Sounds like a fancy car. It does.

I don't know if you should have thought it was probably just crap. I don't know if I was like 10 or two. I don't even remember what it was. But so after, I think we're like going to support Davis at the game.

So after UC Davis won the game, they drove to Bear's Market, which was in downtown Chico, and they just bought snacks and sodas and curtains of milk. And it was just before shortly p.m. And then none of the men were ever seen alive again after this point. Oh, fuck.

So Gary served in the Army, and he was stationed in West Germany in the 1970s. So he went in some background on him. So during his time in the service, he developed drug problems, which is like a blame a dude, right? And he was eventually diagnosed with schizophrenia.

A police record show he'd become violent on occasion and was charged with assault twice. When he returned from a service, he had a difficult period where he would fail to take his medications and would lapse into a disoriented psychosis and was hospitalized with a VA. But by 1978, Gary was treated on an outpatient basis and was considered to be a sterling success case. So he was like, doing a pretty good job.

So, so Gary was 25. And he was close friends with the four other men, which were some of them were slightly older than he was. And the four men had either been described as having intellectual disabilities, or they were called slow learners, which is like not the fun thing to say. But it is like the 70s.

So that's a problem. So Bill was 29, and Jack was 24, Ted was 32. So there were two Jacks, I think. So Jack Hewitt, I think is the second one.

Okay. So all the men had lived at home with their parents and were referred to as the boys collectively. So the men often got together to play a game or watch one on TV. So they just like really like sports.

So they played basketball games together as the gateway gators and were sponsored by a local program for the mentally handicapped. The gators were due to play their first game in the week long tournament sponsored by the Special Olympics the next day, which was February 25th. The winners would win a free week in LA, which seems like a shitty prize to me. But that's just me.

And then there's some good stuff in LA. I had to bet this. I wondered around that as at one point for a couple hours. It was cool.

I'm just, I'm so claustrophobic. Sometimes in the city like, I know Portland's not that big of a city really, but even then when I'm there, I'm just like, get away from me, all of the people. I couldn't have the dining in it. I had to pull over.

I'd be like, no, it's your turn. I can't do this. I'm going to cry. So it's your turn.

Like when I flew over LA once at night, the lights from all of the traffic, like on the highways, short-circuited my brain, like, I was just like, what? Like, I can't. Yeah. And then there was some people like it for me.

Yeah. So they were all, but all the men were very excited about the upcoming game. So they had been talking about it for forever. And Ted had asked his mother to wash his new high-top sneakers before the tournament.

Gary had kept reminding his mother about the big game and asked her not to let him oversleep like multiple times. Like, dude, I got it. So Ted Weir's mother was the first to notice that the boys had not returned from the game. She called Bill Sterling's mother at 5 AM.

So Bill's mother had been up since two waiting for him. They confirmed that Bill hadn't come home either. And Bill's mother had already called Jack's mother and found out that he hadn't returned either. Which Jack?

Of course. Oh, the second one. Okay. Questioner.

I didn't notice that when I was typing it, I didn't notice that they were both named Jack. Oh, God damn it. But... But...

So the second Jack. So that's... I think my Jeruga's the first one and he went to the second one. Okay.

Then finally, it was also confirmed that Gary was missing as well. So he didn't come home. So at 8 PM that evening, the first Jack, so Jack and I Jeruga, his mother, called the police. Police in Blue County, of course, in Yuba counties began searching along the route that meant to Chico.

So no sign of them was found. But a few days after, a Plumas National Forest Ranger told investigators that he had seen the Montego Partulama Orville Quincy Road on the 25th. He had not considered the car out of place since many people often drove up into the Sierra Nevada's on winter weekends to go cross-country skiing. Which is just like, stay at home.

Yes, yes, yes. I'm driven through that area of the winter. I don't want to get out and see through all those fucking trees and that shit showed up. No.

It does not sound fine. That's a whole lot. Like, cross-country skiing out here in the middle of the winter. There's nothing but sagebrush and it's nice and flat.

That's fine. Right. I'm not getting into that. I saw a car.

So he reported the car to the authorities on the 28th. So that was technically four days after they went missing. So inside the car was evidence suggesting that the men had been in it, but between when they were last seen at the store and when it was abandoned. The wrappers and empty cartons and cans of purchase were strewn on both the seats of the car.

And everything had been eaten except for a marathon bar, which was half eaten. And then the car was found 70 miles from Chico far from any direct route to Yuba City or Mary'sville. I don't know why it really mentions Mary'sville, but maybe that's like a way to get to Yuba City. So none of the men's families could think of a reason why they might have driven up a long and winding dirt road on a winter night into a high elevation of remote forest without any extra clothing.

And on a night before the big basketball game. And then so Jack's parents, the first one, so Jack Medruba said that he did not like cold weather and he had never been up into the mountains. And then Bill Sterling had gone fishing with his father once, but Bill had not enjoyed himself. Which is just like, I also get back because Nate's always trying to convince me that fishing is fun.

I'm like, sometimes, but also like most of the time I can't be swayed. Now, Michael is fishing and I like going out there and I'll sit with him and I'll bring him up and I'll sit there and wait and see if he fishes. It's fucking boring. I just like, yeah, I don't want to wait.

I'm tired. I'm cold. I'm wet. I don't like it.

Let's see, I said I'm the edge of the lake and I was there and read. Yeah, you know, Nate always likes boat fishing and I'm like, I don't want to be wet. Get away from me. So, but he had usually remained home when his father took later trips.

So he looked just like, peace out. I don't like this. And so police also could figure out why the man had abandoned the car in the first place. So they had reached the snow line, which was 4400 feet in elevation, just shorter where the road was closed for the winter.

They had gotten snuck in some snow drifts and the tires had spun, but the five men should have been able to push the car free. Police thought that maybe the car wasn't running properly, but the keys were not present. So they thought that the men had left the car to get help and had intentions of returning with help later. But when police hotwired the car, it started with no problems.

They even had a quarter tank of gas. So like, they could have driven the car. They had just like pushed it out of the snowbank. But I mean, if none of them are used to the outdoors, maybe they've never occurred to them to push it?

That's true. Maybe they just thought if the car was stuck, then it's stuck. And you need like a tow truck to drag it out? Yeah, like if you're not familiar with the winter and like how to drive in it for sure.

Yeah. But then the car was towed back for a more thorough examination and the questions like just kept coming. There were no dense gouges or even mudscrapes, like even on the low hanging muffler or under carriage of the car, even though it had been driven up a long distance, like up that rutted and rutted and bumpy mountain road. So this suggested that either the driver had been very careful, or it was someone who knew that the road, like who knew the road that they were driving.

And so knew how to avoid all the bumps. Right. Yeah. But then again, the car was left unlocked and with a window rolled down, which was not something that Jeff Majoruda was known to do with his car.

And like no one ever drove his car. Like he would not really let anyone. Yeah, what are those guys? If my baby, you're not alone.

Exactly. So like that was just like not something. It didn't seem plausible that like either he would leave the car like that or that he would let someone leave the car like that. Then the day that the car was discovered, a severe snowstorm rolled in and dropped like nine inches of snow and efforts to continue searching had to be halted.

And two days later, searchers and snow cats nearly got lost themselves and the search was called off due to the weather. And no trace of the men had been found except for the car. So that's all they had to go on at that point. Local media covered the case and police began receiving reports of some or all the men being cited after they had left Chico.

Some reports put them elsewhere in California or in the country, but these were easily ruled out. Yeah. The lead detective was so desperate for answers that he overcame his skepticism and he consulted a psychic. He always just like love that when they do that.

Yeah. This is probably bullshit, but I'm out of ideas. So I might as well try it. So one had told him that the men had been kidnapped to Arizona and Nevada and had claimed the voice of another, sorry, another claims, the voice of murdered in Orville, which is like, yeah, I believe that.

Yeah, people that murdered in Orville. That's what happens when you have that many tweeters and that's not an area. Right. So in a two-story red house, they were very specific, which was either brick or stained wood with a gravel driveway and with a number four, seven, two, three or four.

Seven, five, three. That was just like fascinating. It was so very specific. But the investigator looked at the house for two days, driving every street in Orville, which was like big surprise the house didn't exist.

In the article by The Washington Post, which I got a lot of this information from, it says that the lead investigator was so obsessed with finding the men that he could rattle off their names and vital stance almost automatically. Yeah. And finally, there were two reported sightings of the men that stood out. Okay.

Yeah. It's like shit just keeps getting weirder and weirder. A man named Joseph Johns of Sacramento told police that he'd been driving up the same road the men went missing sometime after 5.30 p.m. He was checking the snow line since he wanted to bring his wife and daughter up that weekend to the cabin that he owned, which again is just like, I don't want to go to the cabin.

I want to stay home. And when's my mother's electricity? But yeah, I feel you. Yeah, I want to be warm.

So Joseph also got stuck just above the snow line about 50 yards where the men's car was found. And as he was trying to free his car, he had a heart attack, which is just like, oh, Jesus, look, right? He fucking started the snow and then he just had a heart attack. And he was just like trying to do this nice thing for his wife and his daughter.

Yeah, they just come up in bursts of a sheist. Yeah. So, so poor Joseph, he gets back into his car and he keeps the engine running to provide heat. He lays in the car for six hours.

Oh, fuck. Yeah. So when he finally saw headlights coming up behind him, he saw a car parked behind him with the headlights on and a group of people around the car. They said that one of the people appeared to be a woman holding a baby.

He called out to them for help, but he reported that they stopped talking and then they turned out their headlights. Weird. Later, he sees flashlights behind him, but they also went out when he called to them. So like, super sketch, they don't want to be noticed.

Yeah, but I remember that baby, that's not the same group he wouldn't think. Right. Okay. Right.

Just keep that in mind. After the car ran out of gas in the early morning, the pain had subsided enough that he was able to walk eight miles down the road to a lodge. We thought we were able to get the... Oh, Jesus!

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

You're a heart attack and you have to fucking take an email. I can be weird in this snow. Yeah. Shit.

Or a guy like, can I catch a break? Jesus. Okay. I'm sorry.

I'm still listening, but Jesus. No, I know. I was like, this poor guy, like, he just needs someone to help him. Right?

So finally, he gets a little odd. She walks eight miles. Like, fucking fuck. He just had a heart attack.

Jesus. His family had another one on his way. Yeah. Like, his wife probably has no idea where he is because it's like the fucking 70s.

There's not cell phones. Yeah. I guess he'd be like, well, I guess he'd be in the mountains too. It would be like great service, but...

He's just like lost in the fucking wilderness. Jesus. Yeah. So I felt so bad for this dude.

So when he gets to the lodge, he gets to ride home from the manager. So they passed the abandoned... Why not at the hospital? I'm sorry.

No, no. You let home? It said he's riding home. What the fuck?

Okay. I'm gonna continue. Ernie, like I said, he got to ride home from the manager and I was like, okay, he got to ride. You just hit the hospital.

Sorry. Continue. He can't get me this way for years to go. Continue.

At that point, they had passed the abandoned Montego. Where he recalled hearing the voices when he laid his car. So he saw that car and was like, huh. That's where I thought there were people last night when I was laying in my car.

Yeah. But then also... I mean, it could have been coincidence. Maybe the Montego ended up there afterwards.

Great people. Like there was a one group being all sketchy out there. And then they left. And then he did his own hike back into town.

And then the Montego ended up there. Who I guess? But that's what he says. So he thinks, like he sees the car and he's like, for sure, like that's where I heard voices coming from last night and they ignored me when I needed help and I was having a heart attack.

Yeah. Which is what he should have said. Yeah. Those people are the worst.

Yeah. Fuck you. So then in every article I found on this, it also states that the doctors later confirmed that he had indeed had a heart attack. It was just like so weird to me that they always put that in there.

Like that he would lay in his car and freeze in temperatures for fucking reason. And then hike eight miles into town just to make it a bad proof of this. Or that he was like faking it the heart attack thing that he would like not the heart attack thing because they confirmed it. But like, or that he was able to like somehow overcome and murder all those men.

And suppose if their bodies and then hike to the lodge all while having a heart attack. Right. Like I don't know, like it was just a weird implication like that he would make a heart attack. And then Ted's mother said that it was unlike him to ignore someone's police for help.

Like if he had indeed been there. So he had once driven a friend to the hospital after they had overdosed on Valium. So like he seems like such a nice guy. He's like, I'll help you.

No. So after the other sighting was a woman who worked in a store in Brownsville, which is about 30 miles from where the car was found. But the men could have reached if they had continued down the road from where they left the car on March 3rd. So a little bit later, after flyers were distributed to no or no.

On March 3rd, after flyers were distributed with the men's pictures and information with the $1,215 reward. And also, it also like also felt that it was important to tell me that that's $4,700 in modern dollars. That's nice to know. I was thinking it was.

Yeah, so there's that. So the woman told deputies the four of the men had stopped in the store in a red pickup truck two days after the disappearance. They corroborated her accounts of a store owner. Sorry.

The woman said that two of the men had stayed in a phone booth outside while the other men went inside. The items that she reported they bought had matched like they're buying habits. But not much else came of this sighting. At this point, there's not like evidence point to do any clear conclusion about what happened to the men.

And police were fake and the families were not ruling out foul play. Although what comes next seems to suggest otherwise, it still raises more questions than answers. It's so okay. So now we're getting into like the real crazy like me part of it.

So that's all just like set up. So they're just like missing. No one knows what the fuck happened to them. They just disappeared.

Okay. On June 4th, a small group of motorcyclists wandered into a deserted forest service trailer camp at the end of the road and encountered a nauseating smell. Quick side note. Quick side note.

You think the group of motorcyclists? You think the population is in that group? Right area. Right area.

Right time. Just say it. Who knows? Okay.

Sorry. They like a small fat. So they discover the body of Ted Weir. Uh huh.

So he was stretched out on a bed in. I lost my spot. Okay. There it is.

Uh inside the main 60 foot trailer refers to death. So his body was wrapped in eight sheets which were pulled over his body and tucked around his head. Fabric sheets and plastic sheets. Fabric.

Okay. So his shoes were also missing. The table by the bed held his engraved ring, the head is named on it. His wallet, his necklace and a watch which family said to not belong to any of the missing men.

The fuck? Yeah. Okay. So and then Ted had been a tall, heavy set man when he went missing.

But by the time his body was found, he had lost from 80 to 100 pounds. And his feet were badly frostbitten, like almost like rotting. But the weight lost in the frostbite. Before he died or after.

Like we were starting to decompose and he looked thinner. Okay. So also, he had a beard growth that showed that he had lived anywhere from eight to 13 weeks. Oh shit.

Serving inside the trailer. Oh shit. Okay. He was about 20 miles from the car and was wearing very lightweight clothes.

Like just like not winter clothes at all. Like the type of shit you'd wear to a basketball game. Right. Yeah.

In she go. Yeah. So and then he had either walked or ran or has somehow been taken through four to six foot snow drifts to reach the trailer where his body had been discovered. But trailer kind of been broken into through a window.

And there was no evidence that there was a fire started, even though there were matches and an abundance of paper back novels that would have burned easily. So like there was a way to just like start a fire, keep yourself warm. Yeah. And then also more than a dozen sea ration cans from the outside storage shed have been opened and emptied.

They opened with an army P 38 can opener, which is like very specific, I guess, which only Jack or Gary would have known how to use since they were in the service. Yeah. But there was also a locker in the same shed that those sea rations were in. They had emptied the food rations that held enough dehydrated Mexican dinners and fruit cocktail and like other meals to keep all five men alive for one year.

So there was enough food to feed all of them and they found that one guy. Start. Also, there was a propane tank on the outside of the shed that no one had touched. And if they had just turned that on, they would have had heat and a way to cook the food.

And then the day after Ted's body was discovered, searchers found the remains of Jack Madruga and Bill Sterling. They lay on opposite side of the road to the trailer about 11 and a half miles in the car. So not quite as far. And Jack had been disturbed by animals and dragged into a stream, which is really sad.

And Bill sadly was only scuttered bones over about 50 feet. And then two days later, in another search, Jack Hewitt's father found his son's backbone. And investigators had tried to talk him out of joining the search, fearing that this might happen. Yeah, but his father couldn't be talked out of it and he just really was adamant that he did it.

Yeah. Don't do that to yourself. That's not fun. Never understand it.

Yeah. So, and then there were also a few other bones around along with Jack Hewitt's Levi's and his shoes. And then a skull was found the next day and was identified as Jack Hewitt's. And like Bill Sterling and Jack Madruga, Jack Hewitt's remains were found northeast of the trailer.

Searchers found three wood forest service blankets and a two-cell flashlight northwest of the trailer. But it was impossible to tell how long those items had been there. And there was no sign of Gary Mathews other than his tennis shoes, which were found inside the forest trailer. Weird.

Right? So it appeared that maybe Ted wasn't alone. And also, like, how did he wrap himself in the sheets, right? Yeah.

But why were you the sheets behind the wrap and then in the sheet? So, we'll get to that. Okay. So, investigators wondered if Gary could have taken off his shoes to put weird shoes on, which were larger and might have been more comfortable if Gary's feet were swollen with frostbite.

Okay. Right? So they're like, maybe his feet are just like super fucked up. He knows his buddies in bad news and he just like takes his shoes.

I don't know. Just to guess. Like, they don't have any proof that that is what happened. Could you do that?

So, say, take a dead person's shoes if you needed them. Fuck yeah, good. I don't know if you're good. Yeah.

Yeah. I'll take your shoes. I think it depends on how close we were. If it was a stranger, yeah, sorry your dead sex would be taking your shoes.

Because it's like mom? I don't think I could. What if it was like, oh god, this is terrible. But what if it was like, you had to get help so that we could have mom, like, buried, like that we could know where mom is forever, like, you know, like, you know what I mean?

What if you're like in the wilderness and you're like, I got to walk out and tell people where mom is. Could you take your shoes to do it? Because I could. I could do that.

So, I could do that. This shoe is often like dead mother. To save her? Yes, I could.

Are dead mother. No, she's already dead. There's nothing you can get to save her. Well, I don't want her to be just like left there.

Yeah. I don't want her to be like, people. That's where my mom is. Go get her.

I don't know. I think I have a hard time touching her dead mother's body. This is a very, very conversation. You know mom listens to this, right?

You can just stop. In this part. We didn't see what happens. We didn't see what happens.

I don't think any of us are getting Christmas presents ever again. I'm right. Whatever. You know, she's just going to see what I get when her shoes.

I get Christmas presents. You get nothing. I'm respectful of her corpse and I'm not going to desecrate it. But me and DJ will be like, where's mom and Kristen?

Like, they're just gone. We'll find this eventually with all of our clothing on. I don't know. I don't know.

It's still her question. I don't know. That's why I never have to find out. But Will to live is strong in me?

I think I could do it. I don't know. I was telling me like, I don't want to save you. If it's between you and me, it's me.

I'll win it. You know, I'm fully relying on Mike to save me. Mike, when we were in Winimato, we almost got murdered by Twikas, I was fully relying on Mike to save me. I will push Nate down.

Like, it's been, I know when you think for loving you. Go by. No, thank you. Okay, we don't go off track here.

Sorry. I'm done. I'm done. I'm done.

No clove. They don't know what happened. So, they distribute descriptions of him to the state mental institutions, right? Since he was schizophrenic, he was taking meds.

So Gary, was it carrying his billfold when he went to the basketball game in Chico? So he didn't have any ID on him? There was also concern that since he was now office medications at that point. And he had been like taking them faithfully for at least two years.

Yeah. So Gary steps on what we continue to look for him. Did I write steps on? I meant stepfather.

Oh my gosh. That made a lot of sense. I was looking for some steps on what I was saying. Yeah.

No, I totally meant stepfather. So Gary, stepfather, we continue to look for him around the area that he disappeared from, thinking that his glasses would be the most likely to find. Oh, and this is so sad. He was quoted in the article as saying that he didn't think a bear would eat his glasses.

Like, he was like, that's like the one thing I look for, because I think I might find that. So they got eaten by an animal. That's really upsetting. And I was like, oh, why'd you put that in there?

So I had to tell you, because I had to read it. She picks. Even if it's the four of them five men's bodies, they still couldn't explain what had happened to the men. They did learn that Gary had had friends in the small town of Forbes Town, and police believe that it was possible that in an attempt to visit them on the way home, the men may have taken a wrong turn near Orville that put them on the mountain road.

But friends said that they had not seen Gary in a year, like those friends. And I didn't think it was likely that he had gone out of his way to see them. So for whatever reason, after the men left the car, they had, instead of going down the road, which would have taken into the lodge, that our heart attack friend, Joseph, was who? They continued along the same road in the direction that they were originally going.

And police said that purposeful emotion like this is not consistent, but the circular patterns traveled by those who genuinely believe themselves that they're lost. Yeah. So another theory is that the men had followed a forest service, snow cats, tracks, which had passed through the day before on its way to the trailer to clear snow off the roof. And police had speculated that they could not, uh, no, police speculated that they could have believed that shelter was not too far away.

And they suspect that Jack Madruga and Bill Sterling had succumbed to hypothermia midway along the walk to the trailer. Okay. So like maybe they all just like got stuck in the car, tried to get to the trailer. Two of them didn't make it.

Right. But how did they know the trailer was there? Exactly. Well, that weren't other bodies that were found, like, on the way.

They were dressed and they thought people had to do that weird thing. And they suddenly get super hot and start stripping their clothes off. Yeah. Like this people didn't like that Russian pass, right?

They thought that that happened. Call this the American dead left pass. Jesus, I am good. I am psychic.

I mean, it's fine. Yes, you are. Almost case. So which I thought was crazy.

Please also assume that once they had reached the trailer, they were meeting three broke a window to enter. But they may have feared that the trailer was private property and they were afraid that they would be arrested for theft if they had used anything else in the trailer. Which like, I don't, I mean, they call them, like, intellectually disabled. But that doesn't really seem possible.

Like if they eat some of the food, it doesn't seem possible that they would be like, oh, you can't eat any more of the food or what go to jail. Like they already broke in. My concern with the place like that would be if they got like a serious store of rations and stuff like that to live off the grid would not be going to jail. It'd be the crazy redneck who lives that place coming in and shooting with this message.

Personally, like a national forest service one, you know, so it's like on. Oh, sorry. I just forgot Matt. I didn't realize it was forest service.

Kevin. Yeah. So it's just like forest service. Kevin.

Yeah. I don't know. It just seems weird too that they would think like, oh, they're just like scared of using anything in the trailer. Yeah.

That seems odd. But again, like, why didn't they start a fire? Yeah. So after Ted died, the other two chose to attempt to find help and died a lot of way.

Like that's the thing. But there are still questions as to why the men would have abandoned a perfectly operable car to walk us through the snowy forest in the middle of the night. Yeah. Like, why would you do that?

And I walked through 20 miles of deep snow to break into a trailer and die. Like, why do I go there in the first place? And how? And if someone was chasing them, why was the car undamaged?

Why is the car undamaged? It doesn't sound like any of them genuinely getting up in the woods. So how come there wasn't anything underneath? Yeah.

Like, why was the car in such pristine, like, why didn't it show that they were not experienced? What the fuck? So who, who would the people that like our heart attack friend heard of the road that night? The woman with the baby and all that shit being sketchy and weird.

Yeah. Like, was that him hallucily? You know, like, what was that? The people who were listening to their attacks?

I don't know. Maybe he was in such bad pain. But it just doesn't make any sense. No.

And they still haven't found Gary's body. Like, to this day. So to this day. Shit man.

I saw that a little bit more. So then Jack Madriga's mother goes in for an ominous force that made them go up into the mountains. I just like wanted to tell you some stuff that the family thinks. She can't picture someone getting the upper hand on the five men, but know that it must have happened.

Which again, like, it's five grown men. Yeah. You would think that it'd be hard to get five grown men to be compliant. If you had a gun.

If you're, well, yeah. Even then, like, if it's, I guess you'd have to have, like, five guns to point out all of them, I don't know. You have the baby. The woman with the baby.

If they're nice dudes. If they're nice dudes. Yeah. Maybe that crazy woman she has a doll and she hasn't convinced it's a little baby.

And she's holding a gun on the doll. Right. Tell him to do anything out of her baby. Okay.

Okay. Somewhere I went, but hold on. Okay. I went somewhere, but it wasn't there.

And then Ted, we were sister-in-law, thinks that they must have seen something at the parking lot of the game. They might have known that they saw anything. And like, not even known that they were in danger. Yeah.

The Gary's mother can't imagine, like, what they would have been so afraid of. No. He can't understand why they didn't start a fire with all the people back in the cabin unless they were afraid. Yeah.

Like, unless they didn't want to draw attention to where they were. They did not appear. And she'd always say. And not that I know of, but again, it's not like I lived there my whole life.

Yeah. And so the foul play cannot be proven, but also investigators can't explain this case if there isn't any foul play. Yeah. So what happened to Gary?

We should. He thinks that he did die along with the other men. But the string of events just seems what? Because they're saying, yeah, probably, but it's just weird that they never found him.

They never found him. Yeah. To this day, which is so crazy to me. Like, I was looking for, like, updates, you know, and this is 78.

So you would think, like, those woods have been through so many times. Like, people haven't seen it. Yeah. Although, this might have also been through more than a few fires since I mean so.

Very true. So, and also, like, yeah, again, like, who the fuck is the lady with the baby? Yeah. Like, that are unlucky, hard tech friends, like, sees.

And like, how could a lady and her baby cause all five men to be in the car? Like, that's the only thing that kind of stood out the guy seemed to see. And like, the only other thing that I could think of was that maybe the lady with the baby was bait. Yeah.

And like, there were other more sinister people waiting to come, like, overcome the five men when they got out of the car. But why, though? Who knows? Is that I say, ah, fuck.

Like, that still seems so, like, urban legend, you know? Yeah. Oh, it's bait. Like, you know, those stories you hear about, like, people putting fucking babies on the road so single ladies will pull over and try to help the baby.

And it's like, oh no, oh no. And it's just like, that doesn't seem real. Yeah. But again, the 70s, who the fuck?

I don't know. Yeah. And then, like, also, that there may mean to have been no one with the baby. Like, maybe that wasn't even real.

And like, he really was hallucinating from the pain. Mm-hmm. And like, or that he just had a bad view out of his window through the storm. And instead of seeing, like, a woman with a baby who saw a dude with, like, 70s long hair, kind of hunched around over in the snow.

Exactly. Yeah. Maybe he just, like, was having a heart attack and couldn't recognize what he was seeing out his window. But still, if he did see the fight of that, why the hell did he kill him?

Which is so weird, right? Like, what do you think? They would go help this poor guy, yeah, it's so strange. I don't understand anything about this.

From what I can find online, no developments since the bodies were discovered. Fuck! Yeah. So, there you go.

Just a really random, like, fucked up, almost, hometown mystery. Well, I do these ones, too. This is not the first time you bought me just a complete mystery with nothing. I know.

It's like the kind of bizarre case that I just, like, need every once in a while or just like, what the fuck happened? Like, it blows my brain up and I'm just like, what? Shit, man. That was good.

Yeah. These are the ones I tend to lean towards. Great. Supergirl, they're in the room tonight.

I'm totally not going to obsess over this. Thank you. You're welcome. Anyways, you can email us at seriousnisters.outward.com and you can find us on Twitter and Instagram at seriousnisters.

Thanks for listening. Bye. Bye.