Digging Deeper Podcast - Perimeter Church

In this episode, Jeff and Laura engage with best-selling author Gary Thomas to uncover the deeper meaning of marriage—why holiness matters more than happiness. They discuss scriptural foundations, the role of accountability, and the refining power of marriage as a reflection of Christ’s union with the Church. With practical steps for navigating challenges and fostering growth, this conversation frames marriage as a sacred journey toward spiritual maturity. Related Resources: - Learn more about Gary Thomas’ writings and ministry at garythomas.com. - Check out Gary’s best-selling book, Sacred Marriage.

In this bonus episode of Digging Deeper, Jeff and Laura are joined by Andy Bannister, Director of Solas Centre for Public Christianity, to explore how evangelism can thrive in today’s complex cultural landscape. Together, they tackle common fears and misconceptions surrounding sharing the gospel. Andy offers practical strategies for overcoming barriers along with ways to spark meaningful spiritual conversations rooted in genuine curiosity. Whether you're new to evangelism or looking to grow in confidence, this episode offers actionable steps to help you share your faith with clarity and compassion. Whether you're new to evangelism or looking to grow in confidence, this episode offers actionable steps to help you share your faith with clarity and compassion.

In this special episode, Jeff and Laura take a thoughtful pause to look back on this season, The Mission of the Church. They discuss the deep conversations, surprising revelations, and unforgettable guests and share their favorite moments. With ten compelling interviews behind them, they revisit the moments that challenged their perspectives, sparked big ideas, and lingered long after the recording stopped. Jeff and Laura share personal takeaways and behind-the-scenes anecdotes. Whether you’ve been along for every episode or are just joining in, this is a heartfelt, inspiring close to a season that aimed to explore the core of The Mission of the Church.

Today’s guest is Sandy Willson—pastor, author, and former interim president of The Gospel Coalition. Join us for a rich conversation about the mission of the church in today’s world. Drawing from decades of leadership and pastoral experience, Sandy offers wisdom on the vital balance between local ministry and global engagement. This episode is both an encouragement and a challenge to resist the pull of secularism and materialism and to live with gospel intentionality across generations. Whether you're a church leader, a parent, or simply seeking to live more faithfully, this conversation will inspire you to think bigger, live bolder, and dig deeper into God’s global mission. Listen now and be stirred to live on mission—locally, globally, and generationally.

In this episode of Digging Deeper, Jeff Norris and Laura Story Elvington dive into the mission of the church and God’s heart for His people with special guests Carl and K.A. Ellis. Together, they explore the challenges and triumphs of living out a mission-driven life, sharing wisdom, personal stories, and biblical insights that inspire and equip believers to make an impact. Listen as they unpack what it means to live with purpose, walk in faith, and engage in the work God has called us to. We hope this conversation will encourage you to step boldly into God's calling.

In this conversation, Jeff and Laura sit down with Katie Davis Majors, founder of Amazima Ministries, and discuss her journey from Nashville to Uganda, her experiences in orphan care, and the importance of community and education in transforming lives. Katie shares her insights on the realities of family dynamics in Uganda and the mission of her ministry to support children and families. In this conversation, Katie shares her journey of faith, adoption, and global missions, emphasizing the beauty of connecting with others and the challenges faced while serving in Uganda. She talks about the hardships of living in a different culture, and the lessons learned about God's faithfulness and dependence. The discussion encourages believers in the call to serve locally and globally.

In this episode, host Laura Story Elvington is joined by Jimmy Kim to talk with author Rebecca DeYoung. Together they explore her new book, Glittering Vices. They discuss how these vices are not just historical concepts but are relevant to modern life, emphasizing the importance of self-examination and community in spiritual growth. The conversation delves into specific vices like greed and sloth, highlighting their impact on personal and communal life, and the necessity of grace in the journey of faith.

In this episode, Jeff and Laura are joined in the studio by Russ Ramsey—author, pastor, and storyteller—who reminds us of the deep significance of seeing and honoring people’s life stories. Together, they explore how we engage with others as whole people, teaching and relating in ways that reflect the beauty of their unfolding narratives. Russ challenges us to embrace transparency, recognizing our own need for a Savior as we share the hope we have in Christ. Through authenticity and vulnerability, we embody the true mission of the Church—living as a community that extends grace, compassion, and truth. Listen to this powerful conversation on faith, storytelling, and what it means to be the body of Christ in the world today.

The mission of the church is to make disciples. In today’s episode, Jeff and Laura sit down with two Perimeter staff members: Ryan Brown, Executive Director of Life on Life Ministries, and Kelli Means, Women's Discipleship Director. Together, they explore how God works through discipleship to transform lives. The conversation focuses on the biblical model of discipleship that Jesus demonstrated, revealing a pattern woven throughout Scripture—God’s presence with His people and His sending of His people. Ryan and Kelli emphasize that the most significant spiritual growth happens when believers walk alongside one another, helping each other deepen their relationship with Christ.

In this episode of Digging Deeper, Jeff and Laura talk with Paul Miller—author and director of See Jesus Ministry—about the vital role of prayer in the church’s mission. Paul shares practical insights on overcoming prayer struggles, embracing honesty with God, and understanding His promises, especially in disappointment. He also reflects on his family’s journey with disability, the fight against cynicism, and the power of love, faith, and hope. Together, they explore the J-curve—how suffering leads to resurrection—and offer practical ways to overcome prayer fatigue and foster radical dependence on God. Additional Resources: Learn more about Paul’s ministry at seejesus.net Read (or gift) Paul’s book, A Praying Life

In today’s conversation on Digging Deeper, Jeff and Laura talk with J.D. Greear, pastor of The Summit Church, about the mission of the church and church planting. They discuss the need for churches to equip members for mission rather than catering to consumerism. J.D. discusses the importance of recognizing the call to mission. It’s not about if you’re called, but where and how God leads you to be on mission for Him. Together, the three discuss the challenges of sustaining passion for their mission in the face of personal struggles and sufferings. They emphasize the significance of the Christian community in providing support and guidance during these times. We hope this episode encourages you to seek opportunities for evangelism in everyday life, being confident that even in times of personal struggle, God can use you to impact others.

What does it mean to be spiritually formed? In this episode of Digging Deeper, hosts Jeff Norris and Laura Story Elvington are joined by Dr. Jim Wilhoit, author and retired Wheaton College professor, to explore how spiritual formation is central to the mission of the church. Together, they unpack how transformation happens not just through personal devotion but within the context of community. From Jesus’ own formation to the role of suffering in shaping our faith, this conversation challenges the modern tendency toward isolated spirituality. Whether you're a new believer or have walked with Jesus for years, this episode will encourage you to engage more deeply with the church and embrace the lifelong journey of becoming more like Christ.

In this episode, Jeff and Laura reconnect with Dr. Michael Reeves to explore the mission of the church, its biblical foundation, and its connection to union with Christ. Michael emphasizes that mission isn’t an optional add-on but an essential part of the Christian life, rooted in a deep relationship with God. They discuss how delighting in God naturally fuels a life on mission, making gospel-sharing a joyful overflow rather than a duty. Tune in for a rich conversation on how true mission stems from a heart that enjoys God.

In this episode of the Digging Deeper podcast, Jeff and Laura wrap up our series on ‘Kingdom People’ with a look at how the Christian grieves with hope. Today’s guest is Sandra McCracken, a singer/songwriter and worship leader. She shares her experience with grief, resilience, and maintaining hope as a follower of Christ. The conversation digs into what lament looks like and how lament allows believers to acknowledge pain while still holding on to hope in Christ. Sandra shares her personal experience of what a gift communal lament is and how faith communities can support each other through structured services of lament. This episode offers comforting insights and practical encouragement for anyone seeking to understand how faith sustains us in times of grief.

Prayer is a vital characteristic of Kingdom People, and the Holy Spirit instills a desire to pray in believers. In this episode of Digging Deeper, Jeff and Laura engage with Dr. Don Whitney, professor at Midwestern Theological Seminary, to explore the significance of prayer in the life of a believer. The three discuss common struggles Christians face in prayer and the transformative practice of praying through Scripture, particularly the Psalms. The conversation also touches on how to hear God through His Word and the importance of praying in alignment with God's will, especially in the context of cultural moments like elections. Learn more about Dr. Whitney’s work and ministry at mbts.edu/whitney.

Friendship is a deep, felt need for everyone and requires work and commitment, which is hard to maintain in the busyness of life. Jeff Norris and Laura Elvington sit down with Pastor Bryan Loritts to explore the theme of enduring friendships within the context of faith and community. In this conversation, Dr. Loritts walks through major themes of friendship, emphasizing the importance of deep, meaningful relationships in a world that often prioritizes superficial connections. Listen as they delve into the challenges of maintaining long-term friendships, the lessons learned from the book of Philemon, and the distinction between forgiveness and reconciliation. You’ll learn how investing in relationships reflects the heart of the gospel and God's desire for community among His people. Learn more about Dr. Loritts’ work on his website, bryanloritts.com. You can purchase his new book, Enduring Friendships, from the Perimeter Bookstore or other retailers.

In this episode, hosts Jeff Norris and Laura Story Elvington engage with social researcher and author Shaunti Feldhahn to explore the concept of kindness as a transformative force in relationships and society. They discuss the 30-Day Kindness Challenge, emphasizing how our treatment of others significantly impacts our own well-being and relationships. The conversation also delves into the importance of kindness in civic engagement, especially during politically-charged times, and encourages listeners to embrace kindness as a core aspect of the Christian life. Learn more about Shaunti's work on her website: shaunti.com, or take The 30-Day Kindness Challenge at https://www.jointhekindnesschallenge.com.

In this episode of Digging Deeper, Jeff continues to discuss the concept of 'Kingdom People' with Clay Smith, pastor of Johnson Ferry Baptist Church in Marietta, and Dr. Crawford Loritts, founder of Beyond our Generation. Today’s conversation focuses on how Christians navigate dual citizenship in both the kingdom of heaven and the worldly kingdom here on earth. They explore the importance of the Beatitudes in parenting, the challenges modern parents face, and the role of the church in supporting families. In this pastor roundtable, the men discuss practical advice for both parents and grandparents on how to model faith and encourage spiritual growth in children.

In this episode of Digging Deeper, Jeff Norris is joined by Clay Smith, pastor of Johnson Ferry Baptist Church in Marietta, and Jason Cook, pastor of Fellowship Bible Church in Roswell, to discuss the concept of being 'Kingdom People' amidst cultural pressures. They explore the Beatitudes (Matthew 5) and their implications for church unity and peacemaking, especially in a politically charged environment. Part one of this conversation emphasizes the active role of Christians in both the church and society, advocating for a balance between political engagement and spiritual integrity. This episode highlights the importance of community, humility, and the transformative power of the church in addressing societal issues.

Spiritual gifts are given by God for the glory of God and the edification of the Church. In this special episode of Digging Deeper, we continue our conversation about the Holy Spirit, the third person of the Trinity. Laura Story Elvington takes the host seat to interview senior pastor Jeff Norris and founding pastor Randy Pope, who offer additional thoughts beyond our recent Sunday morning sermon series. Jeff and Randy share their biblically-based insights on the spiritual gifts believers receive from the Holy Spirit upon putting their faith in Jesus. Covering topics not addressed during the Holy Spirit sermon series, this episode aims to enrich your understanding of the Holy Spirit's role in the life of believers and the Church.

In this week’s episode of Digging Deeper, Jeff and Laura continue the conversation around faith and the next generation with Raymond Chang, pastor, author and member of the Fuller Youth Institute. Raymond lays out what he is seeing the kids that aren’t leaving the faith and the common thread of relational discipleship radically centered around Jesus. We hope this last episode in this series, Believe, will be an encouragement to you as we, believers in Jesus, actively live out our faith in front of the next generation.

In this episode, Jeff and Laura are talking with Justin Whitmel Earley, a business lawyer, author, father, and husband. Our hearts tend to follow the habits we practice. Those habits sometimes convince us to believe the lie that we are limitless, omnipotent, and god of our days. Recounting his own experience with stress and anxiety, Justin shares that while we would never speak those untruths out loud, our actions and our habits often demonstrate what our hearts truly believe. Justin gives some practical applications around the habits we keep and how we can model them for the next generation.

Jeff and Laura sit down with a special guest, Peter Kasirivu, pastor of Gaba Community Church in Uganda. In this conversation, Pastor Peter shares God’s passion and heart for the nations he has seen firsthand through his church. While the church in America is experiencing a great dechurching, people in Uganda are hungry for God. The joy, excitement, and passion young people are experiencing in Uganda are encouraging and remind us that our heart longings are the same. God sees and hears them all, even though His work looks different in every country.

In this episode of Digging Deeper, Jeff and Laura are joined by Courtney Doctor as we continue this series, Believe. Courtney is the Director of Women’s Initiatives for The Gospel Coalition. She is passionate about helping women in their local church around the world. In this episode, we take a look at where we see the theme of the book of John and why it is so important.

Join Jeff and Laura in today's podcast as they explore the basics of faith and belief with special guest, Gray Sutanto, Assistant Professor of Systematic Theology at Reformed Theological Seminary in Washington D.C. In this discussion, we delve into the essential concepts of salvation and what truly anchors our beliefs to faith. Hear from Gray's educational perspective on how the younger generation grapples with belief, posing fundamental questions like "What does it mean to believe?".

In this first episode of this series, Believe, Jeff and Laura sit down with Michael Graham, Program Director for the Keller Center for Cultural Apologetics. Mike unpacks the findings of his latest book, "The Great Dechurching: Who’s Leaving, Why Are They Going, and What Will It Take to Bring Them Back?" In it, he looks at the different profiles of Americans who are leaving or have already left the church. Their conversation sets up this series as we look at what it means to believe in the Christian faith, with a great reminder that belief is something we hold to, but it is also God holding on to us.

In today's episode, we experience a role reversal! Jeff is joined by his wife Rachel, while Laura Story Elvington steps into the role of the interviewee, accompanied by her husband Martin. Together, they delve into a deeply personal narrative of steadfast faith amidst an unexpected medical diagnosis. This heartfelt conversation aims to stand as a testament to the unwavering strength found in Christ. It's a reminder that despite life's most jarring challenges, followers are invited to embrace the stability of an unshakable God and the enduring reality of His kingdom, even amidst the most tumultuous of times.

In this episode, we discuss the ever-present topic of anxiety with speaker, author, mother and wife, Rebekah Lyons. Rebekah has been vulnerable in sharing her story of her struggle with anxiety and panic attacks across multiple platforms. Today, she gives hope and encouragement as she explains the holistic way of God’s healing through the redemptive work of what we know and understand about the brain and how it all works together with our faith journey.

Jeff and Laura chat with longtime Braves player and childhood sweethearts, Jeff and Catie Francoeur. The Francoeurs share their amazing testimony and how they had to trust God through difficult things from miscarriages, to dreams of a baseball career coming to an end, all while navigating the outcomes in the public spotlight. We pray this episode will be an encouragement to you in seasons where you experience the unshakable reality of the kingdom of God amid the shaken reality of life.

In this episode, Jeff and Laura sit down with author, speaker, and Bible study teacher Jennifer Rothschild. If you’re in the throes of something that is shaking you to the core, we encourage you to listen to this episode. You’ll be encouraged by Jennifer's story of dependency upon our unshakable God!

We wrap our series, Love Rules, around the 10 commandments and how God’s love is a pathway to freedom rather than a restriction on our life. Jeff and Laura sit down with longtime friend, Crawford Loritts, to examine the last three commandments and look at them through the lenses of humility and contentment. We hope this conversation is a blessing to you as you listen and believe that you are truly loved by God the Father, that He is enough and giving you what’s best for your life.

In today's episode, Jeff Norris and Laura Elvington continue to walk through the 10 commandments, camping out around commandments six and seven. They are joined by Erin Smalley, Licensed Professional Counselor and strategic spokesperson for Focus on the Family. Together they explore God’s heart for the covenant of marriage and how we can guard our hearts from bitterness and anger. She gives practical ways to show up for your spouse and resist the drift that comes with the pressures of everyday life.

In this episode, longtime friends David and Meg Robbins sit down with Jeff and Laura to discuss parenting and what that looks like through the lens of radical dependence upon the Lord. David and Meg share how we, as believers, face challenges and joys in marriage. Raising children helps build a bridge to share the gospel with an unbelieving world. The conversation also looks at the covenant of marriage and how it relates to the seventh commandment.

We’ve seen how the first five commandments are vertical in nature (how we honor the Lord). Now we pivot to discuss the last five commandments which are horizontal in nature (how we interact with each other). In today’s episode, Jeff and Laura sit down with a longtime friend, Tim Elmore, to share insights on how parents can create a home environment that reflects the kingdom of God. As Christians, we are called to love and honor our parents (Exodus 20:12). This not only applies to our relationship with our biological parents but also in how we parent our own children. Tim highlights the importance of building strong relationships with our kids, as it mirrors the heart of God and promotes human flourishing.

Perimeter Church’s founding pastor, Randy Pope, joins the conversation with Jeff and Laura to look at the 10 Commandments as a marriage covenant between God and His people. Randy gives a beautiful illustration of a covenant of grace as the reason behind the law. He focuses on commandment four where the Lord calls us to the keep the Sabbath day—a day of rest. This conversation helps us transform our way of thinking about a commandment that many see as restrictive to instead view it as renewing. Randy draws a connection of how the law is what enables us to love and enhances our love for others and for God Himself.

In today’s episode, Jeff and Laura sit down with author, professor and Bible teacher, Kelly Kapic. They discuss the connection between our human limitations and God’s fourth commandment of honoring the Sabbath. Kelly explains that, as Christ followers, we need to view the commandments as grounded in God’s character and the goodness of how He made the world. We pray this episode prompts you to experience the Sabbath as not just a restful day off, but the practice of entering God's rest.

In this conversation with Julius Kim, preacher and professor, Jeff and Laura continue their discussion of the 10 Commandments. Julius directs our thoughts toward the "who" of the 10 Commandments rather than focusing on the "what" of the set of God’s law. When our focus is shifted on God, the creator Himself, we begin to see the goodness of God and understand what it means to glorify Him and enjoy Him forever. Julius gives us a beautiful picture of what it looks like to be in right relationship with God and the shalom, or peace, it brings to our lives.

In this episode, Jeff and Laura sit down with pastor Alistair Begg to discuss how we can look at God’s law as more than just a list of rules to follow. Alistair takes us through how to look at the law of God as the tramways in which we live our lives as we put our faith and trust in Jesus.

In this bonus episode, Josh King and John Morris tackle the subject of Artificial Intelligence (AI) from their perspectives within the church and the marketplace. Using the Gospel Thread framework, they discuss the reality, responsibility, and redemption opportunity available in this groundbreaking technology. Their conversation is intended to be an example of how followers of Jesus can use the Gospel Thread to shape their approach to new technology. It is in no way meant to be an endorsement for or against AI, or any specific AI tools. You can download A Gospel Thread in the Digital Labyrinth at gospelthread.org. Josh King is the Director of Communications at Perimeter Church in Johns Creek, GA. John Morris is the Executive Creative Director and Co-Owner of Maze Creative, as well as an elder at Perimeter Church.

In part three of their conversation on A Gospel Thread in the Digital Labyrinth, Josh King and John Morris turn their attention to what John calls the redemption opportunity available to followers of Jesus who engage wisely with the digital landscape, as an extension of the gospel mission in the world today. You can download A Gospel Thread in the Digital Labyrinth at gospelthread.org. Josh King is the Director of Communications at Perimeter Church in Johns Creek, GA. John Morris is the Executive Creative Director and Co-Owner of Maze Creative, as well as an elder at Perimeter Church.

In part two of their conversation on A Gospel Thread in the Digital Labyrinth, Josh King and John Morris discuss the responsibility of followers of Jesus when it comes to the intent of our hearts, the digital content we consume and produce, and the considerations we have to make about that content. You can download A Gospel Thread in the Digital Labyrinth at gospelthread.org. Josh King is the Director of Communications at Perimeter Church in Johns Creek, GA. John Morris is the Executive Creative Director and Co-Owner of Maze Creative, as well as an elder at Perimeter Church.

Josh King and John Morris explore A Gospel Thread in the Digital Labyrinth, a framework for engaging technology as followers of Christ in a digital landscape. In this first episode, Josh and John discuss the reality of the digital labyrinth, and how disciples of Jesus must start with a keen awareness of the digital landscape today, both the good and the bad. You can download A Gospel Thread in the Digital Labyrinth at gospelthread.org. Josh King is the Director of Communications at Perimeter Church in Johns Creek, GA. John Morris is the Executive Creative Director and Co-Owner of Maze Creative, as well as an elder at Perimeter Church.

Jeff Norris previews the next four episodes of the Digging Deeper podcast, titled "A Gospel Thread in the Digital Labyrinth." This is a special mini-series based on the previous Faith & Technology episode, featuring John Morris and Josh King. John and Josh further discuss what it looks like for followers of Jesus to engage with the digital landscape in the world today. Get the e-book at gospelthread.org.

We are thrilled to present a bonus episode of Digging Deeper titled "Faith and." Jeff continues his conversation with John and Brianna Morris, Executive Directors of Maze Creative, and Josh King, Director of Communications at Perimeter, as they delve into the impact of technology usage on our faith. Throughout the episode, they offer practical applications on how to approach the digital realm with redemption and clarity. We hope this follow-up discussion provides you with useful tools to evaluate your technology platforms and ask yourself, "Does this technology allow me to be gospel-driven in my actions and thoughts?"

In this last installment of the ‘Faith and’ series of Digging Deeper, Jeff and Laura chat with songwriter and artist, Matt Papa, about how his faith intercepts his songwriting process. Listen and gain a behind-the-scenes understanding of many of the congregational songs that are sung weekly in churches across America. In this authentic and humorous chat, Jeff, Laura, and Matt address the tough questions and concerns around congregational music and what kinds of songs resonate with us as believers. Our prayer is that this episode enlightens your faith in how the songs we sing are an expression of worship to our Creator.

In today’s episode of Digging Deeper, Jeff and Laura chat with Trillia Newbell about her faith walk and how it’s been reflected in her writing. Trillia is the Acquisitions Director at Moody Publishers, an author of several books, and a Bible teacher from Tennessee. Her funny, insightful, and affirming conversation with Jeff and Laura is a testament to the art of writing and how God uses everything—big and small—in the journey of faithful gospel living that each of us is called to. We pray this episode will help you trust God with the whole of your work in concert with your God-given gifts.

Jeff is joined by Kelly Ward, Director of Compassion and Care at Perimeter Church, and Caleb Martin, Perimeter’s Men's Discipleship Director, to talk about emotional health in the context of our faith in Christ. While mental health and emotional well-being aren't new to human history, the conversation has become more prevalent in our society after the pandemic. As believers, we have faith in a good God who is powerful and sovereign. This truth often leaves us feeling a lot of tension in our daily life. We pray this episode challenges you to realize emotional health isn't just about feeling good, but it's appropriately feeling the things that come into our life and into this broken world we live in.

In this episode of Digging Deeper, Jeff and Laura are joined by Bryan Chapell, pastor and Stated Clerk of the PCA. Whether you are in full-time vocational ministry or someone who ministers in their home and community, this conversation challenges all believers to let our actions be filled with the aroma of Christ in both word and deed.

Our greatest gift to God is who we are becoming in Christ, and the work we are called to do Monday through Friday plays a big role. Today’s guest is Tom Nelson, pastor of Christ Community Church and founder of the Made to Flourish ministry. Listen as Tom shared how work is a major thread of the redemptive story of God’s love. This episode is rich and insightful in how the work we do here on earth has an eternal impact. Questions Covered in This Episode: How did the Made to Flourish ministry begin? How does our work play into the bigger redemptive story God has written for us? When do we see work show up biblically and what is God’s design for work? How does rest intersect with work?

In today’s episode of Digging Deeper, Jeff Norris sits down with John and Brianna Morris, Executive Directors of Maze Creative, and Josh King, Communications Director at Perimeter, to talk about our technology impacts our faith. In this conversation, they take a deep dive into how the technology we consume really does disciple us and how our faith is influenced by the digital landscape. Questions Covered in This Episode: How do we, as Christians, approach technology? How do you define the digital landscape? Where do you see believers getting caught up the most and technology begins to drive their lives rather than vice versa? How do we begin to engage this digital age in redemptive ways, and what does that begin to look like?