Disorder

Don’t you just love when decency interjects and sometimes people do the right thing, the orderly thing, the sane thing? Well voters of Makerfield have chosen order and unity over disorder and division, and now Starmer has done the right thing. The Orderly Transition to Burnham is on its way and it is an example of a prime opportunity for the institutions of Britain to showcase themselves to the domestic and international publics as orderly and functional.  So Jason starts by introducing this existing moment and then pivoting to regularly scheduled programming about international ordering that still works: NATO. With the NATO Summit in Ankara fast approaching, will the fractures between Europe and America be on full display? Or will one of the world’s most successful alliances in human history come together and make a show of unity? To preview the summit and survey global affairs from peacemaking to defence spending, Jason is joined by Ambassador Alessandro Minuto-Rizzo, the President of the NATO Defense College Foundation and former Deputy Secretary General of NATO (2001-8). The duo discuss what will come out of the Ankara communique, the future of Italian politics, and as they Order the Disorder - the role of NATO in the years to come. Ambassador Minuto-Rizzo puts forth his solutions to the Ukraine war, various ideas why giving up territory might not be that important these days, and his overall philosophy of optimism and keeping calm and carrying on. It might not be how everyone would look at global affairs, but it is very interesting that a man with five decades of high level diplomatic experience has this approach.  Hope you enjoy. For ad free listening, early release episodes and more bonus content, join our Mega Orderers Club at disordershow.com/club Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: For more on the work of the Foundation: https://www.natofoundation.org/ For more on Amb Minuto-Rizzo’s background and that of the foundation: https://www.natofoundation.org/about-us/ For more on Amb Minuto-Rizzo’s comments on global security alliances: https://www.natofoundation.org/regions-at-the-centre-cooperative-security-cooperation-versus-fragmentation/ For a great pod on what Burnham needs to do for an Orderly transition: https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-fourcast/id1542796249?i=1000773763527  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this episode of Disorder Latest, Jason is joined by Thomas de Waal, journalist, author, and Senior Fellow at Carnegie Europe who has spent decades studying the politics, conflicts, and societies of the Caucasus and wider Eurasian region. His book ‘The Caucasus: An Introduction’, is a must read for anyone looking to understand the region—its ethnic diversity, its ties to Russia, its cults of personality, and its geopolitical importance. Jason and Thomas discuss the  June 7 Armenian election—won by pro-EU incumbent Nikol Pashinyan--, the Trump negotiated peace deal between Armenia and Azerbaijan, and whether Georgia is moving permanently away from Europe and the West. For ad free listening, early release episodes and more bonus content, join our Mega Orderers Club at ⁠disordershow.com/club⁠ Producer: Sam Cluely Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Get Thomas’ book at ⁠https://www.amazon.co.uk/Caucasus-Introduction-Thomas-Waal/dp/0195399773⁠  Listen to our previous episodes with Armen Sarkissian, Armenia’s former president ⁠https://pod.link/1706818264/episode/OWJlOTI5YTYtMDBjZC0xMWVmLTg0N2MtMmIzNDcwZTAyMDQx⁠  And for more on the Armenian election: ⁠https://apnews.com/article/armenia-election-result-pashinyan-7168ab86aa0d9f2c967171c91c9611c9⁠  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

For a special live edition of Disorder, we come to you live from the United Nations Association – UK, where Jason, Jane and Mark were  joined by a special guest-- Alexis Akwagyiram, Managing Editor for Africa at Semafor. Mark and Jason discussed the latest disorder in the UK and if Andy Burnham might be able to bring Order to Britain? But will he even be able to order its bond markets? Jane and Jason look at the reigniting of fighting between Israel and Iran, and what happens next, and Alexis and Jane discussed the fallout from the disorderly war on inflation and food prices in Africa and provide the latest on Nigeria and the role of African countries in restoring some global order. For a full, unedited edition of the episode with full q and a, join our Mega Orderers Club at disordershow.com/club Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: For full list of Makerfield Election candidates visit https://makerfieldcandidates.co.uk/  Watch Wes Streeting on News Agents https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8VUDvtZWrtg  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Over the weekend Iran launched waves of missiles at Israel, while Israel retaliated against military targets and a petrochemical complex in Iran, as an uneasy two-month truce appeared to break down. Trump had earlier appeared keen to avoid an escalation, telling Bibi not to respond to the first barrage of Iranian missiles. Under the surface, Israel wants to complete the job in Lebanon, but Trump wants all the wars over so he can cover up his failure. We start the ep by Jason explaining these late-breaking developments and then introducing the electoral fight between neo-populism and progressivism in one of Latin America’s most geopolitically important countries. As we pivot to the feature topic, we ask what is going on in Colombia's presidential election and will it jeopardise the country's peace agreement which former Disorder guest Jonathan Powell helped negotiate many moons ago? Might we see multiple Latin American countries moving to the neo-populism right helped by Trump - including the return of the Bolsonaro family in Brazil? What are the interests that the Trump administration is pursuing in Latin America? Is it mostly just about critical minerals or is it more of a shared worldview? And how can people in the continent pursue democracy and rights when the US and China are competing to get hold of their critical minerals?  This week Jane meets distinguished human rights lawyer Viviana Krsticevic, executive director of the Center for Justice and International Law, founder of GQual and member of the UN’s independent fact-finding mission on human rights in Iran. They discuss how Vivi's childhood in Argentina under the military junta left her with a determination to fight for democracy, gender equality and human rights after seeing the costs of authoritarianism firsthand, and they discuss strategies for advancing freedom and justice despite the current age of political disorder and democratic backsliding. In the Ordering the Disorder segment they discuss, Latin America's role in global politics and how the key aspects of multilateralism are highlighted by the current search for the next UN Secretary General - likely to come from Latin America. To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit disordershow.com/club To tell us more about Disorder, visit disordershow.com/survey  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: For background on the electoral situation in Colombia pls consult: https://www.americasquarterly.org/article/reaction-colombia-heads-toward-polarizing-runoff/ And https://www.theguardian.com/world/2026/may/30/colombia-presidential-election-vote-resurgence-political-violence    Check out Vivi's interview with IranWire on human rights abuses in Iran: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFM9Z5Zyhxc For more on Colombia, read this Q&A from the International Crisis Group: https://www.crisisgroup.org/qna/latin-america-caribbean/colombia-united-states/right-and-left-vie-victory-colombia-under-us-shadow And for more of Jane's recent takes, check out her recent interview with Lewis Goodall on LBC on how Trump is redefining "ceasefire" - and not in a good way - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vrjB2q7qYQQ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

It is our favourite time of the month, listeners questions! This week Jason and Jane take listener questions around topics including: Will Netanyahu be ousted in this year’s elections? Have the Israeli anti-Bibi bloc learned the lessons of Hungary before the next parliamentary elections? Can Reform UK be trusted to do what they say they will? Is a constantly changing leader now the norm in UK politics? Does Trump’s trip to China change anything? And what’s the Disordering role of the UAE in global politics? And should the West give the UAE a tough love approach to help them play the role of global citizen better? To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit disordershow.com/club To tell us more about Disorder, visit disordershow.com/survey  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Pls find out about the 8 June 530pm in Westminster live podcast event and join the Mega Orderers club or Pay for Substack here to attend here: https://natoandtheged.substack.com/p/disorder-live-podcast-at-un-association  To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events like the 8 June 530pm Westminster event, visit disordershow.com/club Jane’s recommended The Economist Bagehot column on whether Britain is ungovernable https://www.economist.com/britain/2026/04/22/sir-keir-starmer-cannot-govern-he-has-only-himself-to-blame  Read Will Self’s new column on Starmer as mentioned by Jane https://x.com/wself/status/2054946706723160363  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The crises across our disordered world are more interconnected than ever. As states pursue their own self-interest, genuine collective action for mutual shared benefit seems further away than ever before. How can we ever hope to Order this Disorder? To try, Jason is joined this week by his old friend David Tafuri. David previously served as the US Department of State’s Rule of Law Coordinator for Iraq, was an outside foreign policy advisor to President Obama’s campaign in 2008, has worked for the United Nations in Turkey, and is the founder and current President of the US-Kurdistan Business Council. The pair start with the latest in Ukraine--following up on David’s recent visit there. Then they embark on a whistle stop tour of the Middle East, exploring the latest in Iraq, Syria, Israel, and Lebanon. And… as they Order the Disorder, the discuss the situation in the Gulf, how the Gulfis and European Allies could help open Hormuz, the need to tackle misinformation, and why the Trump admin needs to put aside its destructive unilateralism and work more closely with traditional American allies on Ukraine and the Iran war. To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit disordershow.com/club To tell us more about Disorder, visit disordershow.com/survey  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit disordershow.com/club Watch more on David’s attempts to address misinformation in Ukraine:  https://youtube.com/shorts/TWRqQNojKvg?si=dRu81hERC5-HYGNz More on David’s career here: https://www.afslaw.com/attorneys/david-tafuri  Plus his reporting from Ukraine’s frontline: https://www.instagram.com/reel/DYX_0c8kTjl/?igsh=eTY2dHh4Zm44eTJp  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Today marks the 18th anniversary of the arrest of Ryan Cornelius, a British businessman stuck in jail on dubious charges over a real estate development project gone awry. And yet… the UK Government is doing nothing substantive to get his release, too scared to pressure a close ally. Does this episode showcase a key aspect of the Enduring Disorder: medium power democracies are too scared to pressure their wealthy allies to abide by the rule of law? Originally sentenced to 10 years for a ‘crime’ -- that the first Emirati judge that saw the case declared was unsubstantiated -- he remains still detained after his initially unproved sentence was extended by a further 20 years. The UN Working Group on Arbitrary Detention has found his detention to be arbitrary, and his family has spent years campaigning for the UK and UAE authorities to secure his release.  To find out more about this case and what it reveals about international relations, Jason is joined by Chris Pagett, Ryan’s brother-in-law. This is the first in our ever-other Thursday Disorder Latest series. Chris and Jason discuss what the UK Government should (and has so far failed to) do, the ways that automatic sanctions could order the disorder, and why cases like this spread in our era of Enduring Disorder and in turn spread yet further Disorder. To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit disordershow.com/club To tell us more about Disorder, visit disordershow.com/survey  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit disordershow.com/club Read: MPs call for sanctions over British man detained in Dubai for 17 years https://www.irishnews.com/news/uk/mps-call-for-sanctions-over-british-man-detained-in-dubai-for-17-years-HSOY7IGZZRJGNEO5TA3KGFZUYA/  Read: Dubai prisoner: Wife pleads for help to get husband home https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-62162686  Read: Families of UK prisoners detained abroad urge ministers to keep promises of help https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2025/jul/16/families-of-uk-prisoners-abroad-urge-ministers-to-keep-promises-to-help  Watch Chris in conversation with Iain Duncan Smith: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M9QXdNGsj_A  A brilliant article from a few years back that tells the story in its entirety: https://www.economist.com/1843/2021/12/15/the-dubai-debt-trap  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This week on Disorder, in a slight break from the Mayhem in the UK over the possible Leadership challenge to Starmer, Jane catches up with the President and CEO of the Chicago Council on Global Affairs and host of the Deep Dish podcast, Leslie Vinjamuri. Leslie and Jane used to work together at Chatham House. They start by discussing Leslie’s final project for Chatham House where she worked with a host of experts to analyse how rising powers, middle powers and US adversaries see the international order as well as new possible ideas of global Order.  Surprise, surprise mega-orderers, the conversation proves the depressing result that we already know! -- i.e. that there are no serious alternative visions of order that are emerging and no non-neo-populists are putting forth compressive visions of global order. Will the continuance of the Enduring Disorder therefore be the hallmark of our times? Probably yes :-< On a brighter note, Leslie thinks the US will revert to a more “normal” politics in Trump’s wake. Jane is not so sure: she and Leslie discuss why the UK hasn’t been able to “get back to normal” under Keir Starmer and how the breakdown of the political centre is making it harder and harder to address the long-term economic issues that underpin Britain’s current malaise.  This week we also delve into Trump’s trip to China; the role of Europeans in enabling China, and how different camps in Washington are looking at the China trip - with think-tankers pretty skeptical that it will make any difference, while business leaders are eager to join the trip to what is, after all, the world’s second biggest market for most of them. No matter what happens there we must ask is Europe working with or against the US’s China policy? And will any coherent transatlantic order emerge out of a re-alignment over China? To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit disordershow.com/club To tell us more about Disorder, visit disordershow.com/survey  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit disordershow.com/club Leslie’s podcast, Deep Dish - https://globalaffairs.org/commentary/podcasts/deep-dish-global-affairs-podcast  Leslie on Bloomberg about Trump and Xi - https://www.bloomberg.com/news/videos/2026-05-11/us-iran-tensions-flare-ahead-of-trump-xi-meeting-video  Leslie’s Chatham House project on competing visions of the international order - https://www.chathamhouse.org/2025/03/competing-visions-international-order  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In the May 7, 2026 UK elections, Reform won biggly. They did so well that they even stole the show from the ascendent Celtic nationalists in the periphery. Gaining thousands of councillors in England, becoming the second largest party in Wales and the joint second biggest in Scotland. Meanwhile, in Wales, Scotland, and Northern Ireland the biggest parties (Plaid Cymru, SNP, and Sinn Fein) are all separatists. This has ushered in disorderly ‘five party politics’ in England and a real threat to the union emanating from a Celtic periphery led by parties that wish to break up the UK.  On this special episode of Disorder we ask: does the UK have a future at all anymore? Will it be very disorderly? And what are Reform’s actual policies? To find out – and in our attempt to present a range of views on Disorder – Jason and Mark are joined by Alan Mendoza, Chief Advisor on Global Affairs to Reform UK. The duo push Alan to clarify Reform’s actual policies around local government, migration, and Reform’s attitudes to Brexit. Jason sees Reform as Disorders, but Alan makes a full throated and quite eloquent case as to why he sees Reform as Orderers rather than Disorderers.  Hopefully the debate is podcasting at its best, filled with respectful disagreements that elucidate the underlying differences in world views. Either way, Reform UK is here to stay so we might as well understand them. To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit disordershow.com/club To tell us more about Disorder, visit disordershow.com/survey  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit disordershow.com/club How the winner-takes-all voting system has turned on Labour and the Tories: https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cdxpqyndqwlo How Reform won votes from Swansea to Sunderland  https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cwy2nz4gwj5o Hear Alan’s previous appearance on Disorder: https://pod.link/1706818264/episode/YTk0MzNmZDQtY2JhMS0xMWVmLWJjYTQtOGJjMjMxNmNhZTli  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Something smells royally fishy. The stench has been detected wafting from Sandringham all the way to Balmoral. The scandals around Lord Mandelson and former Prince Andrew have showcased that the rich and powerful have been operating beyond the law and that royal sinecures have been used to obscure the provenance of ill-gotten gains. Consider: In America, you make your money. But in Britain, you can use it for access. If the Epstein affair has shown us anything, it’s that a royal seal of approval is infinitely valuable. Friendship with a top working Royal takes one from the shady jet set into the global elite establishment. And if you can buy a royal seal of approval - like Epstein did with former Prince Andrew -- you get the keys to some of the most influential people in the world. To discuss Epstein’s relationship with Prince Andrew, Ghislaine Maxwell and Sarah Ferguson, Jason is joined this week by Andrew Lownie, author of the Sunday Times number 1 Best Selling book, Entitled: The Rise and Fall of the House of York. The pair look at what made Andrew’s personality so easily corruptible, how Andrew’s narcissism and megalomania were fueled, the role of Royal Reputation Washing across the globe, and why there could be more nasty revelations about what the royals have been up yet to come. Plus, as they Order the Disorder, they discuss making the royal family more accountable, transparent, and better at serving the British people. To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit ⁠disordershow.com/club⁠ To tell us more about Disorder, visit ⁠disordershow.com/survey⁠  For more on our partnership with the New Books Network visit: ⁠https://newbooksnetwork.com/category/up-partners/disorder⁠  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit ⁠disordershow.com/club⁠ Get Andrew’s Book, Entitled: The Rise and Fall of the House of York ⁠https://www.amazon.co.uk/Entitled-bestselling-devastating-biography-written/dp/0008775451 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This week’s episode was recorded before the Trump Assassination attempt at the White House Correspondents dinner, but Jason inserted a late breaking addition to reference it at the start. In the regularly scheduled programming, Jane and Jason take a range of listener questions on topics like: Is the Iran War on or off? Does the downfall of Victor Orban mean a turn away from neo-populism and authoritarianism? Are Starmer’s incremental moves towards the EU Mega Ordering or not? Will he be forced out of office on May 8? And will the dynamics of the Iran war and higher oil prices change things between Ukraine and Russia? And what is Israeli ‘hasbarah’=public diplomacy and does it fuel antisemitism? And as they Order the Disorder, the duo experiment with a quick fire round where they discuss: What might actually happen on US-Iran negotiations, Trump’s tanking approval ratings, his constant firing of staff, Virginia Redistricting, and what that means for this year’s Congressional midterms. To tell us more about Disorder win a chance for money, visit disordershow.com/survey Write us to get your question answered at [email protected] Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases, exclusive access to live events AND A GUARENTEE WE ANSWER YOUR QUESTIONS, visit disordershow.com/club Watch Jane’s Iran series here https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLsRO_Izf4VcJkN3vlpbFdTYnx0lpZyPus Listen to Jason on The Bunker discuss Orban’s defeat and its implications for US and EU politics here https://podcasts.apple.com/in/podcast/populism-will-eat-itself-how-orb%C3%A1ns-defeat-changes-the-game/id1496246490?i=1000761547591&l=ml Listen to Jason on BBC Scotland talk about the Assassination attempt on Trump at the WHCA: https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m002vm42 Watch Jason recapitulate the Disorder Paradigm on a sister show Democrats v Dictators: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wFJekUfZ6wg Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Over the last week, a spate of Jewish communal targets have been attacked in North London. According to its founder Theodore Herzl, Zionism was supposed to normalize the position of Jews in the world. Has Zionism failed or is a new consensus form of Zionism still the answer to these outbursts of Disorderly Antisemitism? In 2026, April 21 is Israel’s Independence Day. These are tough times for the Jewish State in international public opinion. By all accounts it has made mistakes, violated international law, committed war crimes. But it has also been defending itself against an unprecedented multipronged assault.  Other states don’t risk losing their international legitimacy because they have bad or immoral leadership. Support among Americans and Europeans for Israel is down and even young diasporic Jews report increasingly negative appraisals of Israel.  To investigate the situation in the Middle East, the position of Jews in Britain, and the rise of anti-semitic attacks on Britain’s Jewish community, I am joined by returning Champion Phil Rosenberg. He is the President of the Board of Deputies of British Jews.  Phil is a former Labour councilor for West Hampstead and previously Director of the Faiths Forum for London. In today’s episode, we wish to use this commemorative day to look at a few deeper questions:  How is Antisemitism surging globally and why? How does  Antisemitism manifest itself in the UK and Australia and how it is fascinating how differently it portrays from anti-Americanism? What is Zionism? Is it relevant in today’s world? Is it part of an orderly world or is it a Disordering ideal? What is the Role of international entities and Diasporic Jews in supporting Israel’s right to defend itself while criticizing certain policies?  To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit disordershow.com/club To tell us more about Disorder, visit disordershow.com/survey  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: A Partial list of the North London Arson Attacks: https://x.com/philr_r/status/2045605612072132860?s=46&t=cw4unVonh1qJ-YBPzgIl2Q Origen Story on the Meaning of Zionism : https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/zionism-part-1/id1624704966?i=1000618863154 Call Me Back Pod.. Analysts find in the Iran-Israel-America War confirmation of their pre-existing political beliefs: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-continuation-of-war-by-other-means-with-tal-becker/id1539292794?i=1000761725136  Iran directed arson attacks in Australia and ‘fanned the flames’ of antisemitism, country’s spy chief says: https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.theguardian.com%2Faustralia-news%2F2025%2Faug%2F26%2Firan-directed-arson-attacks-in-australia-spy-chief-says-ntwnfb&data=05%7C02%7C%7C605a5ea26d9b48554e2408de9d6ca385%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C639121287069184737%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJFbXB0eU1hcGkiOnRydWUsIlYiOiIwLjAuMDAwMCIsIlAiOiJXaW4zMiIsIkFOIjoiTWFpbCIsIldUIjoyfQ%3D%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=1wSJ%2BxaXICsYlRBvsu2Rbd4MJ08DRc%2BrqlbAIv%2Fv0HU%3D&reserved=0 The most recent Sunday morning April 19 attack: https://www.thejc.com/news/uk/attempted-arson-attack-at-kenton-united-synagogue-in-northwest-london-pfbikif1 And: https://x.com/philr_r/status/2045782024338768271?s=46&t=cw4unVonh1qJ-YBPzgIl2Q What is the Board of Deputies: https://bod.org.uk/  Phil’s Bio: https://bod.org.uk/who-we-are/phil-rosenberg/  Phil’s Article: https://www.jewishnews.co.uk/were-family-not-critical-friends-rosenberg-sets-out-boards-israel-stance/ History of Israel Independence Day: https://nationaltoday.com/israel-independence-day/ Trump and Tehran’s series of mismanaged posts stall progress towards peace Patrick Wintour https://www.theguardian.com/world/2026/apr/18/donald-trump-tehran-war-mismanaged-posts-progress-peace  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The Chinese are cleaning our clock when it comes to lithium batteries and EVs, while the Russians still dominate at nuclear energy? Why? Why can’t the West play the geopolitics of climate change better? Why can’t Western countries work together to prepare for, mitigate, and profit from the upcoming cataclysm? Why are we sleepwalking off the cliff?  To find out, we return to friend of the show and former Co-host Arthur Snell returns to Disorder to explore the themes of his new book, Elemental: The New Geography of Climate Change and How We Survive it. The overall approach of the book showcases how the Enduring Disorder paradigm epitomizes the collective action challenges democracies face as they compete against each other and see-saw from one policy to another while dictatorships tend to think much more long term when it comes to how to prepare for the opportunities and challenges of climate change. This investigation comes at a highly relevant time as the Iran War has made clear how the geopolitics of energy, electricity, AI Data centres, critical minerals, and climate change are the top table issues of our day. Arthur and Jason start off talking about the situation in the Straight of Hormuz and how developments there will affect the energy transition. They quickly pivot to a discussion of the geopolitics of the Arctic and Antarctic, especially the scramble for the Northwest Passage.   Jason points out that China has been strategic about how to benefit from climate change, while Western nations have only notched tactical successes, but have not systematically prepared for the top table challenges that climate changes poses for humanity. As they Order the Disorder, Arthur explores who the approach of Antarctic of international legal treaties could be expanded to other domains and how we could international, socialize, and demilitarize the geopolitics of climate change. To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit disordershow.com/club To tell us more about Disorder, visit disordershow.com/survey  For more on our partnership with the New Books Network visit: https://newbooksnetwork.com/category/up-partners/disorder  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Relentless sun and ruthless populists: how the climate crisis will change the next 20 years https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2026/mar/04/arthur-snell-interview-geopolitics-climate-crisis-book-elemental?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other Elemental: The New Geography of Climate Change and How We Survive it https://www.hachette.co.uk/titles/arthur-snell/elemental-the-new-geography-of-climate-change-and-how-we-survive-it/9781035412945/ Listen and watch Jason explain ‘How will the Iran war reshape global supply chains?’  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UoZyAP5tFXo Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

As the Iran conflict enters its sixth week and Trump’s ultimatum is upon us, what is Trump’s real plan here? Is it merely to Disorder, or is he genuinely seeking to negotiate his way out of this conflict? To discuss the latest, including the role of Europe and whether the Strait of Hormuz can be theoretically and practically opened by military force, Jason is joined by Michael Stephens, senior fellow at Global Nation and an associate fellow at RUSI. He ran to be an MP for the Tories in Putney; he speaks Hebrew and Arabic; and has decades of expertise in the Gulf States, Syria, and inside the UK government. Michael and Jason discuss the theological background to the Islamic Republic’s ideology, the positive role Britain can play, whether the mere existence of this conflict helps the Chinese exert more power globally, and what the Europeans could do to Order the Disorder if they wanted to. To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit disordershow.com/club To tell us more about Disorder, visit disordershow.com/survey Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit disordershow.com/club To tell us more about Disorder, visit disordershow.com/survey Listen and watch Jason explain ‘How will the Iran war reshape global supply chains?’ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UoZyAP5tFXo Listen and watch Jason explain, ‘Why did Trump fire Pam Bondi?’ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Id8jarTtdFI Want to learn more about Shi’i Islam and how it informs the Islamic Republic’s decision making, read Moojan Momen’s brilliant An Introduction to Shi’i Islam: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Introduction-Shii-Islam-History-Doctrines/dp/0300034997 To listen to our previous interview with Michael visit https://pod.link/1706818264/episode/Zjk5NzljMzItOGNkNS0xMWYwLWFiNGEtMDNjMjExN2VkNWU3 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This week, Mark Lobel and Jane Kinninmont take listener questions on topics including: the future of Iran and the Iranian people, the decline of Britain’s naval power, whether NATO can survive Trump’s ongoing attacked, what role the Enduring Disorder played in causing Brexit, and how to solve global inequality. To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ Give feedback on Disorder here: https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/CX7JB3W  You can get in touch with Mark, to host or speak at your event here: https://www.mark-lobel.com/getintouch  Chatham House Prize | Chatham House – International Affairs Think Tank https://www.chathamhouse.org/2026/03/sudans-volunteer-led-aid-network-receives-2025-chatham-house-prize   Donate to the Emergency Response Rooms - Donate | Support Sudan's Emergency Response Rooms — SUDAN MUTUAL AID COALITION — SUDAN MUTUAL AID COALITION - https://www.mutualaidsudan.org/donate  Article that makes the case for the Iran war - https://apple.news/Ac9j4I-MHSFuj6tgL1zCiUA  Senate foreign relations committee on the folly of waiving sanctions on Iran’s oil - https://www.foreign.senate.gov/press/dem/release/shaheen-schumer-reedwarner-warren-statementon-trump-administrationdecision-to-ease-iran-oil-sanctions  The Times on European leaders considering a scenario where the U.S. makes a deal with Russia and turns its back on Europe - https://apple.news/A-NCiRk_2QVCXwWoStWlppg  U.K. Parliament’s Joint Committee on the National Security Strategy says U.K. must plan for a transition to greater European leadership of NATO - https://committees.parliament.uk/committee/111/national-security-strategy-joint-committee/news/212889/mps-and-lords-call-for-more-clarity-on-governments-plan-for-uk-national-security/  Frankly podcast on “What To Do As The World Falls Apart” which Jane found super interesting - and which highlighted the need to think now, in the current window of relative stability, about the institutions of the future, before the institutions of today actually fall apart (referenced in our discussion on NATO) - https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-great-simplification-with-nate-hagens/id1604218333?i=1000756316022  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The world is steeped in conflict. From Ukraine to the Middle East to Sudan, so what role do UN Peacekeepers play in a world with little peace? And what role can they play To discuss, Jane Kinninmont is joined by Jean-Pierre Lacroix, the Under-Secretary-General for Peace Operations. They discuss the current role of UN peacekeepers, what they can and cannot do, and how they can find a role in a world where fewer peace agreements are being made. To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Read more on UN Peacekeeping here: https://www.visionofhumanity.org/un-at-80-why-it-needs-to-reinvigorate-peacekeeping/  Read more on why UN Peacekeeping works here:  https://cic.nyu.edu/resources/conflict-and-violence-prevention-works-how-do-we-sell-it-politically/  Jane adds: The Institute for Economics and Peace has highlighted the long-term downward trend in funding for peacekeeping and peacebuilding around the world:  “Between 2008 to 2024, peacekeeping and peacebuilding funding declined by 26 per cent, with peacebuilding falling 39 per cent (from $8.7 billion to $5.3 billion) and peacekeeping down to $5.8 billion” As a result, “Despite a nearly unchanged number of missions over the past two decades (60 in 2008 vs 61 in 2024), the number of deployed peacekeeping personnel has halved – from 187,586 to 94,451 – largely due to funding shortfalls.” Meanwhile the same institute estimates in its 2025 Global Peace Index that “The economic impact of violence is now US$19.97 trillion, or 11.6 per cent of global GDP, driven by rising military spending and conflict-related losses.” In 2026, those costs are going to be way higher because of the enormous damage already being done to energy infrastructure in the Gulf and to global trade flows. So part of the ordering solution needs to be spreading an understanding that cutting the funds for peacekeeping, peacebuilding and conflict prevention is quite literally a false economy. This case is powerfully made in a great new article from NYU’s Centre on International Cooperation: Few news headlines describe when a city’s homicide rate falls quietly over a decade, when a community at risk never quite tips into gang recruitment, when a potential terrorist is redirected by a counsellor rather than arrested by a counter-terrorism unit, or when a conflict is narrowly averted. Successful prevention is often invisible. And that is why it often keeps losing to the politics of urgency.” Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The Iran war rages on, oil prices continues to surge, and inflation spikes. When will we be in a global recession? Do we see stagflation coming back? Can military action open and secure the Strait of Hormuz? Or is that also a Chimera? Are the Disorderers doing this all on purpose do they benefit from all this Disorder? This week, Jason Pack and Mark Lobel discuss the big picture economic problems of the Iran war, including: America’s doomed insurance and military proposals to get oil moving through the Strait of Hormuz again, the collosal impact of continued closure on the global economy; the situation on America’s and Britain’s relationships with their Gulf allies; what rising oil prices and swelling Russian coffers means for Russia’s war on Ukraine; why China could be a surprise Orderer in this (if they chose to play the part); Starmer’s triangulating response to this crisis; and – as they Order the Disorder – the role Britain and Europe could play in mediating this conflict. To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Listen: OIES Podcast – The US-Israeli War with Iran: Continuing Impacts on Oil Markets  https://open.spotify.com/episode/2kLZsWi4x8d6LU7d1le91J?si=0tVfxYmdRRS7QYx7GhZNbQ&ct=1&t=1  Nations Respond With Caution to Trump’s Call to Send Warships to Strait of Hormuz: https://www.nytimes.com/2026/03/15/world/middleeast/trump-strait-of-hormuz-iran-warships.html  Is Trump having another Taj Mahal moment on our YouTube channel:  https://www.youtube.com/shorts/V6HTwiNG_Ck To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Well, the quagmire has set in. The Iran war is in its second week and Oil Prices are above $100 a barrel and even though it was clear from the first shots being fired it is now manifest that Trump has no strategy. And his ability to act with impunity shows that constraining leaders to act with strategy rather than just opportunism is a key aspect of democracy and accountability. We are trying to focus on solutions, to see what is working in Britain, and to chat through various amorphous topics, such as: ‘What is Strategy?’ and why does democracy have a communications problem. In 2011, statistics show that 11 democracies suffered backsliding into autocracy. Today: that number is in the mid-40s. With Trump’s America at the peak of that shift, what can be done to reverse that trend? And better yet, what can be done to protect all democracies going forward? Can institutions be made in advance that could protect democratic backsliding before it happens?!? To build on our recent episode with Graham Zellick on how democracy is protected in the UK, Jason is joined by Richard Symons. Richard is the founder of Compass & Co —a UK-based strategy and communications firm helping leaders with policy, corporate strategy, and clear messaging in complex environments.  They discuss the pressing issue of democratic backsliding, what it means, what causes it, some innovative solutions being proposed, including in Wales, and as they Order the Disorder, they look at the need for a ‘right to facts’ type law, and why bold leadership is needed to maintain democracy. To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: For more on compass and Co https://www.compass-strat.com/  Read: The Revenge of Power: How Autocrats Are Reinventing Politics for the 21st Century - https://www.amazon.co.uk/Revenge-Power-Autocrats-Reinventing-Politics/dp/B096WDF625/  Read: Has Wales found the solution to Autocracy? https://justhinkin.substack.com/p/has-wales-found-the-solution-to-autocracy?r=3cs2wr  Read: What's Really Driving America to In’soul'vency? https://justhinkin.substack.com/p/whos-driving-the-insoulvency?r=3cs2wr Listen to our episode with Sir Geoff Mulgan to hear more about his Right to Truth idea: https://pod.link/1706818264/episode/Y2Y1ZTFhOTAtZjJjNC0xMWYwLTljMTMtYzc5MjBhZmIxYTU0  Listen to our episode with Elie Honig where similar issues are addressed in the US context and how the powerful are held to account via the Special Prosecutor system: https://pod.link/1706818264/episode/NmU0ZGIzZTQtYjhhMS0xMWYwLTk0NWQtZWZlN2MwMWI1YWJm  To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

It is a crazy week for the Middle East and the World. For those wanting the Iran War content mentioned at the episode start where Jason appeared on three different podcasts addressing various aspects of the conflict (its congressional illegality; the parallels with the No Fly Zone over Libya; and the Epstein distraction aspects) please consult those links in the shownotes, we think those podcasts are awesome. But back to the matter at hand, Trump certainly knows how to dominate the news cycle but mostly he does so via means that illegal and impeachable in the United States. Why then are the powerful able to be held to account in the UK (e.g. Lord Mandelson and former Prince Andrew) but not in the USA?  No one is above the law in Britain. TRULY. Not the Lords, not the Princes of the realm. And Parliamentarians don’t decide who is prosecuted and the Government can’t protect its friends. And this analysis isn’t BS. It is literally vouched for by the people who have designed and operated the current legal system. With the arrest of Lord Mandelson and Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor, Britons can TRULY say that their legal system does actually seriously investigate powerful people who have done something wrong and that the system is beyond partisan influence.  What makes the British legal system work? And what are its vulnerabilities? Is it more fragile than we realise? Today, Jason Pack is joined by Professor Graham Zellick, a distinguished public and constitutional lawyer, university leader and judge, to explore the UK’s rather remarkable constitution (or lack of). They look at the independence of bodies like the Crown Prosecution Service; how and why they are beyond political interference; and whether they need to be protected from a potential future Neo-populist leader. And as they Order the Disorder, they debate whether these bodies need to be strengthened yet further, or if Farage or an equivalent could dismantle them as quickly as Trump has done in the US. They explain that Britian has built into its ‘constitution’ a lot of the solutions already and that there is actually much that can be learned from it on the world stage. To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Iran content as discussed in the intro to the episode: Why the Iran war is congressionally illegal ‘Jason Pack debating Trump’s NSC Exec Dir on BBC 5 Live: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tQ0rg-Dmw5M But What if Iran Disintegrates Into Chaos? Great Espionage, Where's the Wisdom Now? Jason Pack on the Mossad Files with Dan Raviv https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/but-what-if-iran-disintegrates-into-chaos-great-espionage/id1796257169?i=1000753187080  The 2011 Libya No Fly Zone is the correct analogy for the 2026 aerial war against Iran https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OIbfFKJYLOo #50 - Epstein, Iran, and Who Benefits When the World Burns Jason on Regilio v Everything.  https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/50-epstein-iran-and-who-benefits-when-the-world-burns/id1834972973?i=1000752957478 For more on Graham visit https://www.academicspeakersbureau.com/speakers/graham-zellick  Listen to our episode with Elie Honig where similar issues are addressed in the US context and how the powerful are held to account via the Special Prosecutor system: https://pod.link/1706818264/episode/NmU0ZGIzZTQtYjhhMS0xMWYwLTk0NWQtZWZlN2MwMWI1YWJm  https://www.nytimes.com/2026/03/06/world/europe/iran-london-spying-arrest-jewish-community.html?smid=nytcore-ios-share To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Trump is clearly bored of peace.  So bored. Shortly before the United States and Israel were poised to launch an attack on Iran later in the week, Israeli and American intelligence spotted, on Saturday morning local time, that the entire Iranian leadership including the Supreme Leader Ali Khamanei (and likely his son Mojtaba) as well as key IRGC commanders were going to meet to discuss the ongoing negotiations strategy in central Tehran. Hence, The United States and Israel therefore decided to adjust the timing of their planned attack and decapitate most of the country’s leadership. So now, the entire Middle East is at war, Trump has practiced another regime decapitation operation without Congressional approval and Iran has rained down missiles across the Sunni Gulf and Israel killing civilians and targeting key infrastructure like airports and tourist hotels.  Jane and Jason ask why, when and how? Is this whole thing just a disorderly distraction from Trump’s appearance in the Epstein files and his desire to give Pam Bondi cover for her ongoing coverup? Jason thinks that is the primary motivation. Jane and Jason agree that Trump is unlikely to have an end game and that regime change has never worked solely via airpower and that even with a popular uprising that may now emerge, the situation could resemble Libya, which hasn’t exactly had the greatest track record since Western airpower helped a popular uprising oust Qadhafi. As Jane and Jason try to Order the Disorder, they talk about solutions and where Europe, the UN, and regional allies could try to steer the region towards a more peaceful outcome. Critically, they discuss the issue of the lack of depth (i.e. America and Israel running out of missile interceptors) and how the political and military realms may interact to provide solutions and offramps, especially if the Gulfis and Europeans mediate. Time to head to the Omani Embassy in Geneva… that is my favourite place to be. To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: The C.I.A. Helped Pinpoint a Gathering of Iranian Leaders. Then Israel Struck:  https://www.nytimes.com/2026/03/01/us/politics/cia-israel-ayatollah-compound.html  At Least Eight Killed After Iranian Missile Hits Central Israeli City:  https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/israel-security/2026-03-01/ty-article/.premium/at-least-five-killed-after-iranian-missile-hits-central-israeli-city/0000019c-a962-d4dd-a9df-bbe250410000  Few will mourn leader of ‘evil’ regime Ali Khamenei, says UK defence secretary:  https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2026/mar/01/uk-defence-secretary-john-healey-few-will-mourn-ali-khamenei-iran-us-israel Iran Is Built to Withstand the Ayatollah’s Assassination The U.S. and Israeli militaries are targeting Iran’s leaders—but that may only strengthen the state.: https://foreignpolicy.com/2026/02/28/iran-khamenei-ayatollah-assassination-israel-us-war/?tpcc=must_read_email&utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=%5BMust-Read%5D%20Obit%20Khamenei%20-%20022826&utm_term=iran_israel_conflict_interest_90day_emailopen  Why are the US and Israel attacking Iran? What we know so far:  https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2026/2/28/us-and-israel-attack-iran-what-we-know-so-far Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

For this bonus episode, we invite the orderers to hear a lightly-edited recording of Jason Pack appearing on our sister pod, KeenOn America, where Andrew and Jason discuss Jason’s belief that there was a genuine cover-up by Anglo-American media and the US and UK governments of the Jeffrey Epstein case—not orchestrated by the CIA, but by prosecutors who didn’t want to go after powerful people, journalists who didn’t want to go against an oligarch who could sue them for libel, and a system where orders of magnitudes too much wealth has accrued to too narrow a sliver of global elites. So despite being anti-conspiratorial, Jason concludes that the cover up and the conspiracy were real. To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: For more on KeenOn go to https://www.keenon.tv/episodes/  To join our Mega Orderers Club for ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ Podcasts mentioned: Disorder Episode 167 — "Epstein Survivor Rina Oh on Getting Justice: https://pod.link/1706818264/episode/MThlZTFkZjgtMGI4NS0xMWYxLWJkMWMtOGY0YjYzYzZiZGYw  Disorder Episode 168 — "How Can Epstein's Victims Get Closure? with Civil Rights Attorney Lisa Bloom: https://pod.link/1706818264/episode/M2M2NThlNjAtMGI4NS0xMWYxLWExOWItMDcxODNmNmQ5OTky  Bobby Capucci's "Jeffrey Epstein: The Cover-Up Chronicles" — deep dives into the Epstein files: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Jeffrey-Epstein-The-Coverup-Chronicles/dp/B0DZPKRYFG  Jewish Currents — left-wing Jewish treatment of Epstein's connections to Ehud Barak and the Mossad: https://jewishcurrents.org/on-jeffrey-epstein  Peter Bale interview (Episode 2813) — discussed the Epstein media cover-up and Michael Wolff's attempts to interest mainstream media: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HUNxStxgdxg  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Here at Disorder, we love solutions, so much so that we’re going to be putting even more solutions into our episodes, by trying to zoom out from developments in the news to potential solutions. This week we start our treatment of news items and then zooming out to solutions with the arrest of former Prince Andrew, the latest from the Epstein files, and the inaugural meeting of Trump’s Board of Peace. In this episode, Jane and Jason are brimming with ideas, including: how to better police the role of British elites when they play the role of Butlers to the world of dark money and act as useful idiots in reputation laundering; how we could possibly learn from the Olympic spirit to create our very own Mega Ordering ‘diplomatic Olympics’; why Europe needs to step up and play the Ordering role; and how they – and other democracies globally – could set up their own ‘diplomatic board of peace’ to counter Trump’s largely farcical iteration. To join our Mega Orderers Club, to get our bonus episode answering Jonathan Bull’s question about Jason’s elitism and political mobilization in America, as well as ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: To join our Mega Orderers Club, to get our bonus episode answering Jonathan Bull’s question, as well as ad free listening, early episode releases and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ LISTEN: Epstein and the Capitalist Conspiracy - Jewish Currents Podcast https://jewishcurrents.org/epstein-and-the-capitalist-conspiracy  Something’s Rotten in the Norwegian Royal Family - Vanity Fair https://apple.news/A1A_GZVoYR1mIJeh5TYqXZQ  Watch Jane about the Munich Conference: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6SjrRsPpUQ&t=751s  New law will 'criminalise lying' by senior ministers: https://x.com/skynews/status/2024746880656163082?s=46&t=Tbkgp9CYb-P2gQf2YVZ19g Trump gathers members of Board of Peace for first meeting, with some U.S. allies wary – NPR  https://apple.news/AFjSdW9dCTu6SdN_niMDNHg Who is at the Board of Peace Conference: https://x.com/mike_wagenheim/status/2024439124845895684?s=46&t=Tbkgp9CYb-P2gQf2YVZ19g  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This is the second in our two-part series shining a light on Epstein survivors and their real-life stories. In this episode, Mark Lobel is joined by civil rights attorney Lisa Bloom, who represents many of Epstein’s victims. Bloom reveals how she has recently been approached by new potential clients in the wake of the recent release of yet more documents from the Epstein Files. She calls Epstein “one of the most prolific sexual predators the world has ever seen”. She discusses why the American Justice system has not helped the powerless achieve justice against the rich and powerful. She explains how this needs to be fixed. As Mark and Lisa Order the Disorder, she outlines what justice would look like for the Epstein victims and how we as a world can improve how we acheive justice for victims of grooming and sexual abuse. Lisa proposes the concrete step of advocating for a blanket ban on the statute of limitations for sexual abuse.   To join our Mega Orderers Club, and get ad free listening, early episode releases, bonus content and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: For more on Lisa and her work visit: https://thebloomfirm.com/lawyer/lisa-bloom/  READ: Chuck Schumer's Floor Remarks Introducing Virginia's Law To Help Provide Justice For Survivors Of Abuse https://www.democrats.senate.gov/news/press-releases/leader-schumer-floor-remarks-introducing-virginias-law-to-help-provide-justice-for-survivors-of-abuse   READ: Todd Blanche says review of Jeffrey Epstein sex-trafficking case ‘is over’ https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2026/feb/01/epstein-files-todd-blanche-deputy-ag  READ: Epstein files reference 'nine-year-old victim' in disturbing unredacted emails seen by lawmakers https://www.standard.co.uk/news/world/unredacted-epstein-files-girl-9-mention-emails-b1270395.html  The theatrical play 'Here There are Blueberries' discussed on the show: https://www.stratfordeast.com/whats-on/all-shows/here-there-are-blueberries  READ: Melinda French Gates References a 'Reckoning as a Society' over Bill Gates Epstein Claims https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/celebrity/articles/melinda-french-gates-references-reckoning-180726489.html  You can get in touch with Mark, to host or speak at your event here: https://www.mark-lobel.com/getintouch  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey Elon are you listening? And King Charles and former Prince Andrew, what about you? We want actions, not words. Order isn’t gonna magically appear, powerful people need to help bring it about. This episode has tips for how the most powerful could use their wealth and power to try to Order the Disorder.  As the implications of the Epstein scandal grows ever larger and the whole affair presents terrifying perspectives from which to view our geopolitics over of the last two decades, we here at Disorder, would like to spend real time focusing on survivors, rather than just paying them lip service. Hence, we have two shows this week focusing on their stories. In today’s episode, Mark Lobel talks to Asian-American artist Rina Oh about how she was groomed and drawn into Epstein’s network - and how he used grooming tactics to manipulate countless young women. She is writing a book in which she will soon ‘reveal all’ about the man she describes as a “raging paedophile”. Rina is incredibly brave to be speaking out and we applaud her and are honoured to be platforming her. To finish the episode, as Mark and Rina Order the Disorder, Rina talks about what must happen next for justice to be done for hundreds of victims – specifically she describes how law enforcement should go after what’s left of his network.  Donate to the fund for Carolyn Andriano’s memorial: https://www.gofundme.com/f/carolyn-andriano-memorial  To immediately get part two of this series with Lisa Bloom – an attorney who represents several Epstein victims, join the Mega Orderers Club now: https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Subscribe to Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: For more on Rina and her work visit: http://rinaohepsteinfiles.com For more on the US Virgin Island Mental Health Fund, read: https://www.usvimentalhealthfund.com/ Read: Bondi’s Incompetence Is the Latest Insult for Epstein’s Victims: https://www.nytimes.com/2026/02/14/opinion/bondi-epstein-justice.html Read: Musk Offers To Pay Defense Fees Of Anyone Who ‘Speaks The Truth’ About Epstein And Is Sued: https://www.forbes.com/sites/siladityaray/2026/02/09/musk-offers-to-pay-defense-fees-of-anyone-who-speaks-the-truth-about-epstein-and-is-sued/ If you value this kind of content and want early release episodes, pls join the Mega Orderers Club: https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/  You can get in touch with Mark, to host or speak at your event here: https://www.mark-lobel.com/getintouch  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

As this show predicted at the end of 2025, Jeffrey Epstein has become the Disorderer-in-Chief of 2026 – with Keir Starmer’s credibility and ability to govern the latest victims of the document release. So how could there possibly be any Order emerging from this Disorder? It is only possible if McSweeney is ejected from Number 10. That is the only answer and the longer Starmer keeps him on, the weaker he will become relative to the Labour backbench. This week, Jason and Jane look at the ongoing fallout from the Epstein files on British high politics and why we need more transparent and more courageous leaders. Plus: the duo investigate the rise of women in leadership roles within the UN, examine upcoming US negotiations on both Russia/Ukraine and Iran/Nuclear, present Jason’s observations about the depoliticisation of Trump’s America, and answer questions from members of our Mega Orderers Club. Finally, as they Order the Disorder, they imagine a world with new institutions that could actually track what diplomats (current and former) do with state secrets and their privileged access to power. To join our Mega Orderers Club, and get ad free listening, early episode releases, bonus content and exclusive access to live events (and the chance to ask your questions), visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Pls Join the Mega Orderers Club for ad-free listening and early release of the episodes, via this link: https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ Watch Jason discuss “Do the Epstein files spell the end for Sir Keir Starmer?” https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DMgrUgOjGbk  Statement from the Arms Control Association on New START and what the U.S. should do now: https://www.armscontrol.org/pressroom/2026-02/statement-end-new-start-requires-more-coherent-approach-trump-administration  Global Women Leaders’ Voices report on women in multilateralism: https://www.gwlvoices.org/resources/wim-26  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hear real life stories about meeting the Pope, briefing the Prime Minister, and creating legislation to safeguard future generations! As we settle in to 2026, it feels like we are stuck in a permanent state of Disorder:  Trump’s power grabs around the world, the timidity of Starmerism, and the lack of future-focused collective solutions to the world’s most pressing issues like AI regulation and climate. But… could another world be possible? Could something like mega-ordering spread throughout the world? If so, how do we get there? This week, in association with the New Books Network, Jason is joined by Sir Geoff Mulgan. Sir Geoff is one of the world’s leading thinkers on social change, innovation, and the future of democracy. He’s the founder of Demos, former head of the UK Prime Minister’s Strategy Unit, and the founding CEO of Nesta, the UK’s innovation agency. His latest book, ‘Another World Is Possible: How to Reignite Social and Political Imagination’ (Hurst), is a sweeping and provocative examination of how we might redesign our political and economic systems to meet the crises of the 21st century — and why doing so is both necessary and achievable. Jason and Geoff discuss why our leaders need to spend more time on long term thinking, and how ‘collective intelligence’ can help us address the world’s most pressing global challenges. They discuss how bland centrists like Starmer are actually quite unrealistic in their realism. Plus: why we must regain trust in experts, the need for more engineers and scientists in leadership positions, and the role religion could play in bringing about Mega Ordering. And as they Order the Disorder, Mulgan explains why a public ‘Right to Truth’ is key to saving democracy. To join our Mega Orderers Club, and get ad free listening, early episode releases, bonus content and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Get Geoff’s book, ‘Another World Is Possible: How to Reignite Social and Political Imagination’:  https://www.hurstpublishers.com/book/another-world-is-possible  For more on our partnership with the New Books Network visit: https://newbooksnetwork.com/category/up-partners/disorder  Read Geoff writing on future generations: https://tial.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/07/TIAL-Future-Generations-Mulgan-Bennett.docx.pdf  His pitch for rights to truth: https://www.geoffmulgan.com/blog/blog-post-title-two-p722w  Follow Geoff’s substack: https://geoffmulgan.substack.com/publish/posts/published Listen to George Monbiot on Disorder: https://pod.link/1706818264/episode/ZjU5MmVjOTYtZmFhZC0xMWVmLWFiZWUtODNlZjQ0YWYwZTgz   How Marco Rubio Went from “Little Marco” to Trump’s Foreign-Policy Enabler: https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2026/01/19/marco-rubio-profile  Pls Join the Mega Orderers Club for ad-free listening and early release of the episodes, via this link: https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

It’s telling to hear NATO’s future is not “guaranteed” according to a former NATO boss. After a jaw-dropping US threat to take Greenland shocked the world. President Trump’s first year back in power is also overshadowing the United Nations' 80th milestone. Prompting calls to retool the world’s top diplomat.  In this episode of Disorder, hosted by Mark Lobel, the former head of NATO tells Disorder we should make the United Nations Secretary-General the "chairman" of the Security Council. Brazil’s former Ambassador to the United Nations says the role should be a single mandate term of six or seven years, "to retain the willingness to displease certain sources of power”. Recorded at a special UNA-UK event, George Robertson and Ambassador Antonio Patriota reveal how Donald Trump’s disorderly approach is causing a major re-think of organisations and leadership in the world. Speaking in the same building that ushered in the United Nations General Assembly in 1946, exactly 80 years ago this month.  The Brazilian Ambassador to the UK didn't hold back ...  On Venezuela:  “I feel very uncomfortable as a South American to witness an intervention that is a flagrant violation of international law.”  On Nigel Farage joining climate talks:  “I don’t think (he's) very eager to engage on this topic”  On presenting the Nobel Peace Prize to Trump:  “As a South American, I felt embarrassed by this gesture, because I don’t think it enhances anybody’s dignity to do that.”  Plus - George Robertson tips a British politician as the next big thing ... and it’s not who you expect! Stay news of a special live event with Disorder and the UNA-UK for mega orderers, and to join our Mega Orderers Club and come along, and get ad-free listening, early release episodes, and bonus content, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: You can get in touch with Mark, to host or speak at your event here: ⁠https://www.mark-lobel.com/getintouch⁠  To join our Mega Orderers Club in honour of Greg, for ad free listening and early release episodes, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ UNA UK website www.una.org.uk UN official article summarising the event - https://news.un.org/en/story/2026/01/1166783 Gordon Brown’s call to action for democracies to reinvigorate the international order, highlighting the Attorney General’s speech at the event - https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2026/jan/20/donald-trump-greenland-world-plan-leadership Devex video interviews on Insta - https://news.un.org/en/story/2026/01/1166783 Sky News - 'Is the US attacking the UN's principles?' (Interview with the President of the General Assembly) https://news.sky.com/video/is-the-us-attacking-the-uns-principles-13495782  The Guardian - 'Guterres warns of ‘powerful forces’ undermining ‘global cooperation.’’ https://www.theguardian.com/world/2026/jan/17/antonio-guterres-warns-forces-undermining-global-cooperation-un-80th-anniversary-secretary-general-multilateralism-international-law  NPR - 'United Nations leaders bemoan global turmoil as the General Assembly turns 80.’ https://www.npr.org/2026/01/18/nx-s1-5678366/united-nations-general-assembly-80-london#:~:text=LONDON — Just over 80 years,the importance of international cooperation.  Full speech by SG: https://webtv.un.org/en/asset/k1u/k1uo45t198 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This episode is dedicated to Disorder’s only ‘Founding Sponsor’, Greg Merriman, who passed away from Pancreatic Cancer last week. He was a software entrepreneur, a wine lover, and an American-Anglophile. To Jason’s mind he was a classic example of that old time Midwestern decency, which the world is sorely lacking these days. He was a true Mega Orderer and will be sorely missed. This week, Jane and Jason analyse the endgame scenerios of Trump’s sabre rattling over Greenland and what the protests in Iran might lead to. They sketch opportunities for how the Europeans could step up and lead at this moment – if only they chose to. And as they Order the Disorder, Jane discusses Donald Trump's disregard for international law and how we could try to make International Law Great Again. To join our Mega Orderers Club, and get ad-free listening, like the true Mega Orderer Greg Merriman, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: To join our Mega Orderers Club in honour of Greg, for ad free listening and early release episodes, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ How Marco Rubio Went from “Little Marco” to Trump’s Foreign-Policy Enabler: https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2026/01/19/marco-rubio-profile  For More on Greenland: https://x.com/ilvestoomas/status/2011593795373318648?s=46&t=Tbkgp9CYb-P2gQf2YVZ19g  https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/2026/01/trump-greenland-risk-global-conflict/685616/  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

To kick off the year, Disorder held our final live podcast recording at the Royal United Services Institute (RUSI), as part of our one-year partnership with the think tank. Hear Jason Pack in discussion with Disorder co-host Jane Kinninmont, RUSI Associate Fellow Arthur Snell, and Jonathan Eyal, Associate Director at RUSI. They discussed the rather disordering implications of Trump’s actions in Venezuela, whether it might embolden China and Russia to behave the same way in their ‘spheres of influence’, and whether Britain can continue to play a Mega Ordering convening role, as geopolitics are potentially realigning into a ‘might-makes-right’ and ‘spheres of influences’ phase. To join our Mega Orderers Club, to get a full recording of the event including live listener questions, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: To join our Mega Orderers Club, to get a full recording of the event including live listener questions, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ Join Jane at her event, UNGA at 80: From 1946 to Our Future https://www.eventbrite.co.uk/e/unga-at-80-from-1946-to-our-future-tickets-1975305412663?aff=oddtdtcreator For more on RUSI: https://www.rusi.org/  And Jonathan Eyal’s great work: https://www.rusi.org/people/eyal  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Smartphones have revolutionised warfare, and we are still learning exactly the implications of this. The extent of our full spectrum dependence on Wi-Fi and the internet is profound. Military organisations routinely rely on civilian infrastructure to operate digitally. Now, with AI accelerating the pace of change in tactics, strategy, and targets even further, what does that mean for war? And how civilians participate in it? And what nodes of connectivity can become enemy targets? To find out, Jason is joined this week by Matthew Ford, author of ‘War in the Smartphone Age: Conflict, Connectivity and the Crises at Our Fingertips’. Brought to you in partnership with the New Books Network, this episodes focuses on how technology, particularly smartphones and digital communication, has transformed military strategies and civilian involvement in conflicts. Jason and Matthew explore the topic looking at the case studies of: Hamas; the ongoing war in Ukraine; vulnerabilities in Britain and the West more generally; and the role of civilians in modern warfare.  And as they Order the Disorder, they return to the oft-cited need for better information resilience and media literacy. To join our Mega Orderers Club, and get ad free listening, early episode releases, bonus content and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Pls Join the Mega Orderers Club for ad-free listening and early release of the episodes, via this link: https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ Join us at our live event in RUSI on January 8th: for details on the event https://my.rusi.org/events/disorder-podcast-live-what-disorder-will-2026-bring.html  Yet to attend the event you need to join the Mega-Orderer’s Club or the Pay For substack and RSVP through a special form available on either platform: https://natoandtheged.substack.com/p/disorder-podcast-live-with-jane-arthur  Get Matthew’s book https://www.hurstpublishers.com/book/war-in-the-smartphone-age/  For more on our partnership with the New Books Network visit: https://newbooksnetwork.com/category/up-partners/disorder Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

For this special partnership episode with Andrew Keen from KeenOn, Jason and Andrew discuss what Disorder we can expect in 2026. Jason crowns Mark Carney as 2025’s Mega Orderer-in-Chief and fears that even from the grave Epstein will be 2026’s Disorderer-in-Chief. The show ends with our looking ahead to the New Year with the Hebrew song, ‘Ba Shana HaBa’ah’ song by Yoav Oved. You can check out more of his operatic cantorial singing here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OolsTq5ZNNw  To join our Mega Orderers Club, and get ad free listening, early episode releases, bonus content and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Pls Join the Mega Orderers Club for ad-free listening and early release of the episodes, via this link: https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ Join us at our live event in RUSI on January 8th: for details on the event https://my.rusi.org/events/disorder-podcast-live-what-disorder-will-2026-bring.html  Yet to attend the event you need to join the Mega-Orderer’s Club or the Pay For substack and RSVP through a special form available on either platform: https://natoandtheged.substack.com/p/disorder-podcast-live-with-jane-arthur  For more on KeenOn visit: https://www.youtube.com/@KeenOnShow  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this festive edition of Disorder, our hosts Jason Pack, Jane Kinninmont and Mark Lobel reflect on a Disorderly 2025, and preview what could be an even more Disorderly 2026. They gather around the Yuletide fire and shoot the breeze, then discuss personal Christmas traditions, the biggest moments of Disorder throughout the year, while also pointing to some moments of hope that emerged.  As they Ordered the Disorder, they highlight the need for leadership and Jason returns to his desire for a collective grass roots ordering movement pushing for towards a better future, and why human connection will help us find Order in the new year. The show closes with some beautiful cantorial music giving us some hope for the New Year, while also reflecting our sorrow over what has happened in Sydney. To join our Mega Orderers Club, and get ad free listening, early episode releases, bonus content and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/  Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Pls Join the Mega Orderers Club for ad-free listening and early release of the episodes, via this link (and get access to our January 8th event): https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ Join us at our live event in RUSI on January 8th (Mega Orderer membership needed for attendance) https://my.rusi.org/events/disorder-podcast-live-what-disorder-will-2026-bring.html  Yet to attend the event you need to join the Mega-Orderer’s Club or the Pay For substack and RSVP through a special form available on either platform: https://natoandtheged.substack.com/p/disorder-podcast-live-with-jane-arthur  To attend Jane’s UN event, visit https://www.eventbrite.co.uk/e/unga-at-80-from-1946-to-our-future-tickets-1975305412663?aff=oddtdtcreator  You can get in touch with Mark, to host or speak at your event here: https://www.mark-lobel.com/getintouch  Listen to Ep 155. Can Canada become the world’s mega orderers? With Marci Surkes https://pod.link/1706818264/episode/YzQ2ZDhjNzQtYzg4NS0xMWYwLWJhMDItMzNiNDI3MTVmMDBh  Watch Jason on From Global War on Terror to the Global War on the Jews https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0pY9KSoQDHc  The show features our looking ahead to the New Year with the Hebrew song, ‘Ba Shana HaBa’ah’ song by Yoav Oved. You can check out more of his operatic cantorial singing here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OolsTq5ZNNw Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Are we witnessing rising Islamic militancy in Bangladesh? Or could it become a model for other developing countries? A nationwide celebration is underway. It’s Victory Day for Bangladesh’s 176 million people. Fifty-four years ago today -- December 16th, 1971 -- the former state of East Pakistan became the modern, independent nation of Bangladesh.   But few people are pleased with the trajectory Bangladesh is currently on. What’s been happening this past 15 months has shaken this country to its core. On August 5th, 2024 protests over government job quotas escalated into a wider anti-government movement, with a resulting violent crackdown leading to the ousting of the long-time ruler, Sheikh Hasina. She now faces the death penalty if she returns. Her whole political party, the Awami League, has been banned too.   Now the Muslim-majority state faces perhaps the most significant fork-in-the-road moment since its independence. The February 2026 election. Can the caretaker leader and Nobel Peace Prize laureate Muhammad Yunus pull it off? Will it be free and fair?  It is possible that stability and democracy will be restored. It is also possible that an Islamist takeover and the cancellation of Democracy will ensue. To find out how the election could not only reshape contemporary Bangladesh’s political foundations but also South Asian stability, security cooperation and geopolitical rivalries, Disorder co-host Mark Lobel is joined by three experts on the ground in the country. 1- Debapriya Bhattacharya-- Economist, public policy analyst and Distinguished Fellow at the Centre for Policy Dialogue in Dhaka, Aasha Mehreen Amin -- joint editor at The Daily Star, and Iftekharuz Zaman -- Executive Director of Transparency International Bangladesh. Although we don’t hear about it much in the Western press, investors and policymakers the world over certainly have their eyes peeled on South Asia’s second largest economy and what it decides to do next. We hope you the Orderers enjoy this exclusive journalistic content.  If you like more deepdives like this and appreciate the effort we are putting in please: PLEASE join our Mega Orderers Club, and get ad free listening, early episode releases, bonus content and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ [Join the pay for substack for the 8 Jan event] Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: You can get in touch with Mark, to host or speak at your event here: https://www.mark-lobel.com/getintouch  Aasha's 'No Strings Attached' column: https://www.thedailystar.net/author/aasha-mehreen-amin  National Survey of Bangladesh: https://www.iri.org/resources/national-survey-of-bangladesh-september-october-2025/  Citizen's Platform for SDGs, Bangladesh: https://bdplatform4sdgs.net/  Pls Join the Mega Orderers Club for ad-free listening and early release of the episodes, via this link: https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ Join us at our live event in RUSI on January 8th https://my.rusi.org/events/disorder-podcast-live-what-disorder-will-2026-bring.html (You need to join RUSI or the Mega Orderers Club or Paid for Substack to attend) Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Will the US and Iran always be at odds? What is the history of their feud? Weren’t the countries allies under the Shah? And today, what’s the chance that negotiations will resume after the 12 Day War earlier this year? And why has the Iran file always been one of the most toxic and divisive issues in Washington foreign policy circles? To find out the answers to these questions and more, Jane - who has analysed and tracked the Iran file for two decades - quizzes an expert, author and friend, Dalia Dassa Kaye, whose new book ‘Enduring Hostility’ explores the history of U.S. policy towards Iran based on interviews with the most important DC insiders from rcent U.S. administrations. Not many people realise it, but virtually every U.S. administration since Carter has tried diplomacy with Iran. They’ve also always tried various forms of pressure - especially sanctions - and at times threats of military attack. Why, then, do the U.S. and Iran keep circling around the negotiating table despite seeing each other as archenemies? What happened to the JCPOA and will there be another nuclear deal? Or are we more likely to see another round of war between Iran and Israel? Jane and Dalia explain it all here just before they both head to Qatar for a bunch of serious discussions about mediation efforts. To join our Mega Orderers Club, and get ad free listening, early episode releases, bonus content and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Pls Join the Mega Orderers Club for ad-free listening and early release of the episodes, via this link: https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ For more on our partnership with the New Books Network visit: https://newbooksnetwork.com/category/up-partners/disorder  Dalia Dassa Kaye - Enduring Hostility - https://www.sup.org/books/politics/enduring-hostility  Dalia’s op-ed in the Economist - https://www.economist.com/by-invitation/2025/11/28/dont-count-on-a-reset-in-us-iran-relations-writes-dalia-dassa-kaye  And now to close out, an oldie but a goodie - Jane’s analysis for Chatham House when the JCPOA was signed, looking at the deal’s vulnerabilities and arguing a parallel diplomatic track was needed to address the regional tensions between Iran and its neighbours - https://www.chathamhouse.org/sites/default/files/field/field_document/20150703IranGCCKinninmont.pdf  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

With the long-awaited UK budget finally revealed (in a leaked form a few hours early), will this finally restore a semblance of financial Order to the UK? And with Trump’s haphazard tariffs ongoing and constantly mutating, what does it all mean for the global economic order? To find out, Jason is joined by Philip Coggan, award winning journalist and author of The Economic Consequences of Mr Trump: What the Trade War Means For the World. This ep is brought to you in partnership with the New Books Network. Philip and Jason explore how major historical lessons in economics (concerning specialization, efficiency, growth, the advantages of trade deficits, etc.) can all be unpacked from the ongoing economic consequences of Trump's tariffs.  They draw upon the historical parallels of Trump's actions to try to understand the true motivations behind Trump’s tarriffs.  Is it all about misunderstanding the meaning of trade deficits, or all about manufacturing, or is it all about centralisation of power and political theatre. Listen to find out… Plus: the duo spoke right after the UK budget announcement and they tried to unpack the domestic implications of the recent UK budget and whether any of Reeve’s economic policies can actually Order the Disorder. To join our Mega Orderers Club, and get ad free listening, early episode releases, bonus content and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Pls Join the Mega Orderers Club for ad-free listening and early release of the episodes, via this link: https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ For more on our partnership with the New Books Network visit: https://newbooksnetwork.com/category/up-partners/disorder  Get Philip’s book The Economic Consequences of Mr Trump - https://profilebooks.com/work/the-economic-consequences-of-mr-trump/  Cockup instead of Conspiracy: How Rachel Reeves’s budget was leaked 40 minutes early: https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2025/nov/26/how-rachel-reeves-budget-was-leaked-40-minutes-early  Budget 2025: Key points at a glance-- https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cj4w44w42j5o  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

What aboot Canada? Is Carney still popular? Has he pulled a Starmer of coming in with big fanfare and then flopping? Fortunately not! And with Mark Carney recently narrowly passing a budget, can Canada now play the role of the world’s mega orderers? And with the Canada-U.S. relationship on the rocks and trade talks stalled, what does that mean for Canada’s position in the world? To find out, Jason is joined by our returning champion, Marci Surkes. She is Chief Strategy Officer and Managing Director of Compass Rose and was formerly executive director of policy and cabinet affairs in Justin Trudeau’s  Prime Minister’s Office from 2019-2022. Jason and Marci discuss Prime Minister Mark Carney’s leadership style, the recent surge in Canadian defense spending, and the ongoing trade war with the United States. Plus: the challenges Canada faces in diversifying its economy, and the implications of its historical reliance on the U.S.. And as they Order the Disorder, they focus on Canada's future role in global politics and the importance of unity within the country. To join our Mega Orderers Club, and get ad free listening, early episode releases, bonus content and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Pls Join the Mega Orderers Club for ad-free listening and early release of the episodes, via this link: https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ For more on Marci and her work visit https://www.compassrosegroup.org/en/marci-surkes  Listen to our previous episode with Marci: https://open.spotify.com/episode/50T7tW7IXc0wmgHBgH8HUK  For more on Canada listen to Front Burner https://podcasts.apple.com/ca/podcast/front-burner/id1439621628  Watch The Ontario anti-tariff ad which led Trump to end trade talks with Canada https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XWQRuRIxMBI  Read about Trump’s new tariffs on Canada https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cx2ljgrm78zo  Read Canada narrowly approves Carney's first federal budget https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cp8531xvy26o Watch The Panel: What Trump means for Canada https://substack.com/@paulwells/p-151283084  Read 'Expect to see lots of borrowing of technique, borrowing of language,’ from U.S. progressives from Marci https://www.compassrosegroup.org/en/updates/2024/8/26/expect-to-see-lots-of-borrowing-of-technique-borrowing-of-language-from-us-progressives  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this bonus episode, Jane and Jason are joined by former Israeli Ambassador to South Africa, Ilan Baruch, to present a unique perspective on a possible route to peace between Israel and Palestine. Amb. Baruch is a part of the ‘Policy Working Group’, which advocates for ‘leveling the playing field’ between Israelis and Palestinians.  We discuss the need for ‘equality’ among parties in negotiations, the role of the UK and international community in peace efforts, and what recognition of Palestinian statehood actually means for peace. Plus: changes in Israeli and Diasporic Jewish public opinion regarding a two-state solution, and as they Order the Disorder, Amb. Baruch puts forward a vision for a peaceful future in the Middle East and the role of international powers in achieving it. Jason pushes back on this vision of an Israel-Palestinian condominium as overly optimistic, but hopefully it makes for a great listen. To join our Mega Orderers Club, and get ad free listening, early episode releases, bonus content and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Pls Join the Mega Orderers Club for ad-free listening and early release of the episodes, via this link: https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ NGO MONITOR—SHRINKING SPACE:   http://policyworkinggroup.org.il/  Listen to World Report https://open.spotify.com/show/5qaYz2SRxlPUszXZQWNl1U?utm_source=chatgpt.com  For more on Ilan Baruch’s work: https://www.pascalboniface.com/2024/09/11/interview-two-israeli-diplomats-denounce-netanyahus-gaza-policy/  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The US president has said he plans to sue the BBC, even after getting an apology for a misleading Panorama edit of his 6 January speech. But how could he do that national broadcaster of America’s greatest ally? And will the BBC cave? To find out, Jason is joined again by returning cohost, Mark Lobel. They discuss the BBC’s next moves and whether Trump’s lawsuit actually has any merit. Plus: they dissect a tumultuous week for Keir Starmer, Rachel Reeve’s budgetary reversals, Wes Streeting’s ‘leadership challenge’ and what this all means for actuality of centrist leadership. And as they look to Order the Disorder, they discuss the issue of wealth inequality as today’s greatest global challenge, and why radical transparency and generosity might be what’s needed to fix it. To join our Mega Orderers Club, and get ad free listening, early episode releases, bonus content and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Pls Join the Mega Orderers Club for ad-free listening and early release of the episodes, via this link: https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ For more on Mark Lobel visit https://www.mark-lobel.com/  Read Yuval Noah Harari: Only generosity can secure peace between Israelis and Palestinians https://www.ft.com/content/04078017-18b1-4c63-8521-198c69684255  Read Zach Polanski The right can mock my teeth all it wants – it shows the Greens have struck a nerve https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2025/nov/10/green-party-zack-polanski-struck-nerve-politics  Read Upper East Side Moms Are Melting Down Over Mamdani - New York Magazine https://www.thecut.com/article/moms-of-the-upper-east-side-facebook-meltdown-mamdani.html  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

For a special crossover episode with the Democracy Works podcast, Jenna Spinelle talks with Jason. They discuss the state of democracy around the world and why making America's government more like a European country might not be the solution to our current polarization that some democracy reformers hope it will be. We also contrast the current state of play in the US and UK and speculate as to why Keir Starmer has been such a disappointment and how the UK is not able to provide a model of centre-left governance to the US in the way that Jason might have hoped. To join our Mega Orderers Club, and get ad free listening, early episode releases, bonus content and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Join the Mega Orderers Club via this link: https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ For more on Democracy works visit: https://democracyworks.simplecast.com/  To listen to Jason on yet another podcast, try his appearance on Practical Stoicism talking about the completely different topic of backgammon and the importance of being disciplined and self aware: https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/practical-stoicism/id1603004118?i=1000734643776 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Central Park West Apartments for all! Freeze the Rent! Free Palestine! Jason goes on a screed that is sure to bemuse, offend, and enlighten. He showcases the myriad ways in which Mamdani’s leftwing populism is not so dissimilar to Trump’s disordering offerings. In the wake of Zohran Mamdani’s victory in the New York Mayoral Election, Democrats face a choice. How do they talk about the issues he won on – cost of living, housing, transport – but from a centrist perspective? Or do they even try and double down on the socialism? Because… if Mamdani’s populist hard left politics win out, could they be handing the next presidency to JD Vance? This week, Jason and Jane discuss the implications of the recent elections in the US, not just in New York City, but across the country. They debate the rise of Zohran Mamdani and how it raises questions profound questions about the soul of America, about nativism, identity politics, and the need for the Democratic Party to learn from centrist candidates to regain voter trust. And as they Order the Disorder, Jane and Jason discuss the growing need for experts in politics, and how populism – whether on the left or right of – isn’t the answer. To join our Mega Orderers Club, and get ad free listening, early episode releases, bonus content and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Join the Mega Orderers Club via this link: https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ The Fall of New York City in 8 Charts: This is why Mamdani won-- https://www.frontpagemag.com/the-fall-of-new-york-city-in-8-charts Listen back to Ep3. The Rise of the Neo-Populists https://pod.link/1706818264/episode/NGIxZDgwNGUtNGQ4Ni0xMWVlLWFlMTUtMWYxMWNiYzVkN2Jk  Timecodes Chapters 00:00 - 01:44: Intro  01:44 - 20:28: The Rise of Zohran Mamdani and the Dilemma for Democrats 20:28 - 37:56: What does this mean for wider US politics? 37:56 - end: Ordering the Disorder Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

To join our Mega Orderers Club, and get ad free listening, early episode releases, bonus content and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/  In institutional design, the US justice system is more independent than its European counterparts. Even though the US President selects his Attorney General, a corrupt President can be dealt with not only via impeachment, but in Principal through independent special counsels pursing justice while avoiding potential conflicts of interest. And yet… from Hillary’s emails to Trump’s possible collusion with Russia and promotion of an insurrection, the Special Prosecutor system hasn't worked as it should. And now despite all those checks and balances, we have a weaponized justice, with a more political DOJ under Pam Bondi being used to pursue revenge against Trump’s enemies.  How did we get to here? Why can’t the American system – designed with the most checks and balances -- work to hold power to account?   To find out, Jason is joined this week by Elie Honig, senior legal analyst for CNN and author of When You Come at the King: Inside DOJ's Pursuit of the President, from Nixon to Trump. This episode is brought to you in partnership with the New Books Network. They discuss the legal details of Watergate, Hillary Clinton’s emailgate, the Mueller investigation, and Jan 6. As they order the disorder, Elie and Jason consider whether and how the system can be reformed, and the importance of courage and integrity within the justice system. Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Join the Mega Orderers Club via this link: ⁠https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/⁠ For more on our New Books Network partnership visit ⁠https://newbooksnetwork.com/category/up-partners/disorder⁠  Buy When You Come at the King: Inside DOJ's Pursuit of the President, from Nixon to Trump by Elie Honig ⁠https://www.amazon.co.uk/When-You-Come-King-President/dp/0063447363⁠  Read Why The Supreme Court Might Strike Down Trumps Tariffs ⁠https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/why-the-supreme-court-might-strike-down-trumps-tariffs.html⁠ Read The John Bolton Indictment Is Different ⁠https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/opinion/the-john-bolton-indictment-is-different/ar-AA1OESRh?apiversion=v2&domshim=1&noservercache=1&noservertelemetry=1&batchservertelemetry=1&renderwebcomponents=1&wcseo=1⁠ Watch Elie Honig on the Lincoln Project ⁠https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vSEytVs2Er4⁠  Read a review of Elie’s book at ⁠https://www.kirkusreviews.com/book-reviews/elie-honig/when-you-come-at-the-king/⁠  Another take on Elie’s book ⁠https://historynerdsunited.com/2025/09/when-you-come-at-the-king-by-elie-honig-book-review/⁠  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

To join our Mega Orderers Club, and get ad free listening, early episode releases, bonus content (like this week’s special bonus about the UN’s and Jason’s Birthday) and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/  In this listener questions episode, Jason and Jane discuss a range of issues from Israel-Gaza, to football hooliganism, to Kaliningrad (the Russian exclave), to the possibility of mega ordering institutions. They start by analysing the strategic importance of an alliance with Israel to the US by dissecting the Realist and Neo-conservative cases. Jane and Jason revisit the controversy of Maccabi Tel Aviv fans being banned from Birmingham by delving into the intersection of football and politics and the difference of fan culture in the US and UK. After the break, Jane and Jason tackle the questions: do sanctions on Russia go far enough? Could there be sanctions against the Kaliningrad exclave? Are we closer to nuclear war with Russia since the drone strikes? Why are we normalising Trump’s White House renovations? And as they Order the Disorder: we return as always to the need for a mega ordering club of democracies, how we decide on a common set of European values, and if the Ave Europe charity is on the right track. Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Join the Mega Orderers Club via this link: https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/ Read the Ave Europa Charter: https://ave-europa.eu/charter/  Mearsheimer on ‘The Israel Lobby's Awesome Power’ https://mearsheimer.substack.com/p/the-israel-lobbys-awesome-power And push back against his thoughts: https://www.israelfactcheck.com/debunking-mearsheimer-walt-s-theories-on-israel-influence  Some background on Kaliningrad: https://besacenter.org/kaliningrad-russias-exclave-in-europe/  Other perspectives on the rights of football fans and Maccabi hooliganism: https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2025/oct/21/police-intelligence-on-extreme-maccabi-fans-with-history-of-violence-led-to-villa-park-ban Fighting for the rights of football fans How a Cambridge researcher fought for the rights of football fans and won: https://www.cam.ac.uk/stories/footballact2012  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

To join our Mega Orderers Club, and get ad free listening, early episode releases, bonus content and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/  As Trump parades across the Middle East collecting adulation for his ‘eternal peace’ deal, Jane and Jason break down the realities and explain that what was achieved was merely a hostage release, prisoner swap, and ceasefire. With Phase 2 looming and infighting already starting in Gaza, they look at the role of the various international actors (like Qatar, Egypt, UK, US) in possibly creating technocratic governance of Gaza. Plus: Is now the time for an Iran peace deal and as the UN Charter turns 80, what might the future of the organisation be? Finally, as they Order the Disorder, they discuss the need for progressive politicians to become better communicators. Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Join the Mega Orderers Club via this link: https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/  For an explainer on Iran latest, read Gaza Ceasefire Could Give Iran Another Chance at Negotiations with the US - https://www.stimson.org/2025/gaza-ceasefire-could-give-iran-another-chance-at-negotiations-with-the-us/  Watch Jane discussing what’s next for Middle East - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alTViSc3FJk  Read UN says countries are willing to help fund Gaza's $70 bln reconstruction https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/un-says-states-willing-fund-gazas-70-bln-rebuild-2025-10-14/  Read Why Was the President of FIFA at the Gaza Summit? https://www.nytimes.com/2025/10/14/world/middleeast/gianni-infantino-fifa-trump.html  Read What Gaza has been like since the ceasefire in Vox - https://apple.news/Ao4Xzg8yKT5-aVo-nm8769A  Read BBC Expert Says The Israel-Palestine Conflict 'Will Continue' Despite Trump's Peace Plan - https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/bbc-expert-says-the-israel-palestine-conflict-will-continue-despite-trumps-peace-plan_uk_68eb5d49e4b0abf20b6b0850?ncid=APPLENEWS00001   Watch Syrian President Ahmed al-Sharaa interview with CBC https://share.google/Eik7y67VmISQHiegN  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

To join our Mega Orderers Club, and get ad free listening, early episode releases, bonus content and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/  To discuss from a Palestinian perspective the fallout of October 7th, two years of the Gaza War, and the suffering of the Palestinians from occupation, displacement, cantonization, and bombardments, Jason is joined by Sam Bahour, a Palestinian-American entrepreneur based in Ramallah. There is much said in this episode that Jason does not agree with but rather than constantly arguing with the guest, Jason is committed to presenting different points of view and tried to err on the side of letting Sam speak so the listener can make up their own mind, especially when contrasting the narrative with the episode with Phil Rosenberg from last week. Sam and Jason discuss the implications of the recently announced and implemented Trump’s ‘Eternal Peace’ which is really just a Gaza ceasefire in exchange for Israeli hostage releases, the realities of life in the West Bank under Israeli occupation, the economic challenges of reconstruction of Gaza and standing up Palestinian institutions, and the role of the international community states in those state building and reconstruction efforts. Jason and Sam disagree agreeably about the role of the international community and technocratic governments in Palestine and beyond, while Bahour emphasizes the need for Palestinian self-determination and leadership.  And as Sam Orders the Disorder, he highlights how changing dynamics in U.S. support for Israel and Palestine could result in a different dynamic in the Middle East.  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Join the Mega Orderers Club via this link: https://disorder.supportingcast.fm/  For more of Sam’s writing visit https://epalestine.ps/sambahour/  To Check out our previous episode Commemorating October 7th Part 1: Phil Rosenberg, President of the Board of Deputies of British Jews click here: https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/ep-146-commemorating-october-7th-part-1-phil-rosenberg/id1706818264?i=1000730501569  Read Jason's piece Internationalize the Solution for Gaza and Iran https://natoandtheged.substack.com/p/internationalize-the-solution-for Read Gazans Are Finished With Hamas https://www.wsj.com/opinion/gazans-are-finished-with-hamas-commander-popular-forces-5d9a6345 Israel is backing a militia known for looting aid in Gaza https://www.lemonde.fr/en/international/article/2025/06/09/israel-is-backing-a-militia-known-for-looting-aid-in-gaza_6742148_4.html Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

To join our Mega Orderers Club, and get ad free listening, early episode releases, bonus content and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm?sc_promo=DISORDER10 This timely episode was recorded before the horrors of the Manchester Yom Kippur Synagogue terrorist attack of October 2nd and the potential optimism of the Trump deal to end the Gaza War which is currently in limbo. This episode deals extensively with issues of antisemitism, humanitarian suffering in Gaza, and the potentialities of Middle East peace. As we mark 2 years since the horrific October 7th massacre in Israel -- and the disastrous regional wars and tragic humanitarian crisis in Gaza that have ensued in its wake-- we here at Disorder are producing a two-episode series dealing with the legacy of that fateful day: one from a British-Jewish perspective and one from a Palestinian-American perspective.  To start with, we’re joined by Phil Rosenberg, President of The Board of Deputies of British Jews. Phil is the highest-ranking communal official representing the Jewish community to the UK government and media. Jason and Phil discuss the ongoing ramifications of the attacks on Jewish life in the UK, the rise of global antisemitism, and the role played by misinformation and conspiracy theories in manipulating public perception of Jews. Plus: is the UK's position on the ongoing Israel-Hamas conflict a help or a hinderance? And did the mass of Western states recognising a Palestinian state actually move the needle towards a two-state solution or has it just further entrenched the conflict? Join us next week to hear our conversation with Sam Bahour, who will give the perspective from Ramallah.  Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Join the Mega Orderers Club via this link: https://disorder.supportingcast.fm?sc_promo=DISORDER10 Read a report from Phil’s organisation on the Response to 7th October – how the UK Jewish community was impacted. https://www.jpr.org.uk/reports/year-after-october-7-british-jewish-views-israel-antisemitism-and-jewish-life  For more on Trump’s Gaza peace initiative: https://www.nytimes.com/2025/10/05/world/middleeast/trump-netanyahu-gaza-deal.html  For more on The Board of Deputies of British Jews work to tackle antisemitism visit https://bod.org.uk/bod-news/commission-on-antisemitism/  For a legal and structural argument for why recognition of a Palestinian State will  not help make piece listen to this Call Me Back episode: https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/call-me-back-with-dan-senor/id1539292794?i=1000727804529  Listen to our previous episode with Joseph Uscinski on Conspiracy Theories and their hidden logic: https://open.spotify.com/episode/2nvlI3hR1VFyMbgKaZddyi  Listen to our previous episode on extremism and Conspiracy Theories with Julia Ebner: https://pod.link/1706818264/episode/MjJkNjlmZDItMDExZi0xMWYwLTg4MWUtZGZjZDhiYzFhNTEz Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

To join our Mega Orderers Club, and get ad free listening, early episode releases, bonus content and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm?sc_promo=DISORDER10 When Trump stormed into UNGA last week, complained about escalators and tele prompters, and swung back out… the UN was faced with some questions. How do we navigate a world through Trump’s America? And what does it mean for the very future of the UN? To find out, and reflect on UNGA as a whole, Jane is joined by Richard Gowan, the International Crisis Group's UN expert. They discuss Trump’s speech, Netanyahu’s appearance, and who will be the next UN Secretary General when elections take place? Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Join the Mega Orderers Club via this link: https://disorder.supportingcast.fm?sc_promo=DISORDER10 Read Richard’s piece ‘Ten Challenges for the UN in 2025-2026’ https://www.crisisgroup.org/global/sb13-ten-challenges-un-2025-2026  Read Richard in Foreign Policy on America’s Infuriating and Irreplaceable Role at the U.N. https://foreignpolicy.com/2025/09/19/trump-washington-united-nations-unga-reform/  Read Calls grow for first female UN chief in 80 years https://www.reuters.com/world/americas/calls-grow-first-female-un-chief-80-years-2025-09-26/  Burmese academic Thant Myint-U on the legacy of his grandfather, former SG U Thant, and the need for the UN to reclaim its role in peace and security - https://www.chathamhouse.org/publications/the-world-today/2025-09/u-thant-helped-save-world-nuclear-war-1962-who-could-do-now  Martin Griffiths, former UN humanitarian chief, on the UN at 80, including his thought on the Black Sea grain deal that Richard referenced - https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2025/aug/26/un-recover-courage-palestine-ukraine-sudan  Listen to To Save Us From Hell, Mark Goldberg's podcast about the UN, focusing here on Trump's speech - https://www.globaldispatches.org/p/your-countries-are-going-to-hell-9f5 Watch Jane’s thoughts from New York https://www.youtube.com/shorts/iBppHmWp8Cc  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

We here at Disorder are thrilled to announce a subscription Club with lots of perks for our fans. Given these dire times and our inability to break even we really need your support. To join our Mega Orderers Club, and get ad free listening, early episode releases, and exclusive access to live events, visit https://disorder.supportingcast.fm?sc_promo=DISORDER10 Even a small amount from you on the lowest tier will go along way for us, so thank you so much for your generosity.  Now to today’s episode, this week, we take listener questions and announce on air our new Mega Orderers Club, how it will work, and what perks we will offer. Jason and Jane discuss the need for local government to both ‘fix the potholes’ while tackling long term issues. Plus: Is free speech dead in America? Are we doing enough on climate change? And what role will the UK’s Green Party’s new leader Zack Polanski play in fighting Farage’s Neo-populism? And as they try to end on a positive note – Jane feels inspired by her conversations about multilateralism, while Jason sees American culture as possessing reserves of strength and social cohesion, if only those can be drawn on for Order, tolerance, and acceptance. Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Join the Mega Orderers Club via this link: https://disorder.supportingcast.fm?sc_promo=DISORDER10  And For a legal and structural argument for why recognition of a Palestinian State will  not help make piece listen to this Call Me Back episode: https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/call-me-back-with-dan-senor/id1539292794?i=1000727804529  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

For a special bonus episode, we give you Jason’s conversation with Michael Baranowski, of The Politics Guys podcast. They discuss: Jason’s concept of global enduring disorder, the implications of this disorder for global politics, the role of the US, and the need for new governance structures to address transnational challenges. Plus: the rise of neopopulism across the globe, its implications for democracy, and the challenges it poses to the current global order. And as they Order the Disorder, they find rays of hope in the resilience of the US economy and the strength of Ukrainian allies. Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: For more on the Politics Guys visit - https://politicsguys.com/  Listen to their episode Is There Really Democracy in America? - https://politicsguys.com/is-there-really-democracy-in-america/  Hear Jason on the podcast - https://politicsguys.com/populism-power-and-the-enduring-global-disorder/  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Investors are frogs in a Trumpian pot. As he turns the water up will they jump or boil? Trump has chaotically imposed tariffs on the global economy-- replete with arbitrary numbers, 90-day pauses, and then different outcomes for similar countries. Many predicted this type of chaotic policymaking would tank the US stock markets, make the bond markets panic, and trigger a worldwide recession. Jason at least assumed UVXY would spike as volatility would soar. Yet US markets are hitting record highs. Even foreigners are still willing to buy US equities, albeit while hedging their dollar risk. What is going on here? Why do the Markets seem to love Trump? Why are markets addicted to low interest rates and cheap money? Why do markets want less regulation even though it can lead to crashes? Why don’t the markets react with Trump threatens Powell, Lisa Cook, and Fed Independence? To find out, Jason is joined this week by Katie Martin, the Markets columnist at the Financial Times and host of the Unhedged Podcast. They discuss how Europe should respond to Trump’s craziness, why US Big tech stocks (and the data centre construction fad) are keeping the market afloat, the implications of big money continuously ploughing into AI without knowing if AI will really be profitable, and the shifting focus from public to private markets. Plus: Gilts vs Treasuries, the UK’s fiscal woes, and whether the Euro could replace the dollar as the world’s most important reserve currency. And to Order the Disorder, they discuss the formation of a new global body to tackle inequality globally. Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: Read Investors are frogs in a Trumpian pot by Katie https://on.ft.com/3K67eCm  Read Time to give the euro a glow-up by Katie https://on.ft.com/4mhfWuP  Read The bond doom-mongers have got at least one thing right https://on.ft.com/41TpXqT  Check out Katie’s Unhedged podcast: https://www.ft.com/unhedged-podcast  Watch How has Trump changed the global economy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HwKt43ruWCo https://www.youtube.com/shorts/Rg9YCYehqQc Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

As Trump touches down in the UK, Elon Musk provokes a riot in Westminister and Kier Starmer’s government is set to recognise Palestinian Statehood. Last week, Israel attacked Hamas leaders in Qatar. Did they hit them? Did they miss? Did Mossad advise against the IDF’s plan? There’s a lot of Disorder out there. To discuss these issues as well as: his recent family vacation road trip across France, the politics of theme parks, how AI will transform advertising, and how Trump actually exudes a unique form of charisma  in person, Jason is joined by a new Mega Ordererer, Mark Lobel -- a BBC journalist and TV anchor with two decades experience covering business, technology, the Middle East, and more.  In their free-flowing conversation, they discuss the implications of Trump's upcoming UK visit, Israel’s risky move in Qatar, how AI will completely change political communication, and the debt crisis in France. Producer: George McDonagh Subscribe to our Substack - https://natoandtheged.substack.com/ Disorder on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@DisorderShow Show Notes Links: For more on Mark’s Mega-Ordering Background:  https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/profiles/4t9w5sRNMnyfdT77k0Ym4v7/mark-lobel and https://www.mark-lobel.com/bio  For more on the Israeli attack on Qatar and how Mossad was against the IDF’s plan: https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/call-me-back-with-dan-senor/id1539292794?i=1000725930815 For more on nationalist re-enactment theme parks in France: https://www.puydufou.com/france/en/must-see-france  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices