PODCAST · health
Licensed to Lead
by Patty Fahy, MD
Join host Patty Fahy, MD as she shares the evidence for why physicians must lead healthcare and lead us out of the current healthcare system morass. Patty has twenty years of experience working with leaders in healthcare—as a member of an executive team, founder of a successful coaching and consulting firm, and as a committed physician advocate. This podcast is for you if you want expert physician leaders at the helm of U.S. healthcare systems and if you want practical advice and critical conversations about honing the leadership skills of physicians. The Licensed to Lead Podcast offers new angles on the neuroscience of leadership, challenges a “burnout industry” that is profiting from physician burnout, and offers a no-holds-barred investigation into the business school mindset that puts profits over patients. Patty and her guests provide provocative and clear recommendations for changing the business of medicine so that it fulfills the professional obligations of medicine.
Episodes
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042 - Dr. Susan Rogers Tells Senate: Don’t Hand Medicare to the Profiteers
Community, connection, purpose: these values are almost palpable even in a virtual conversation with Dr. Susan Rogers. Dr. Rogers is an internist, educator, and activist on behalf of those who suffer when profit motives bulldoze the institutions that are meant to serve the public. A neon example…
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041 - Mining Mintzberg for Management Gold
McGill Business Professor Henry Mintzberg is the author of 20 books on management, creator of two revolutionary international management programs, and the recipient of a mountain of accolades and honors for his thought leadership in the business world. Mintzberg minces no words in his pointed...
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040 - Stanford Physician Writes the Book on Wellbeing
Author and certified lifestyle medicine physician, Iris Schrijver, MD, describes a fulfilling and fast-paced academic career at Stanford as a full professor of pathology and director of a molecular genetics research lab. A few years ago, in an unlikely turn of events, an opportunity to design a...
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039 - Attorney Drops Truth Bombs about Physician Employment Contracts
Attorney and author Dennis Hursh helps physicians navigate their employment contracts. He describes his shock early on in his career when he saw the lopsided language in the contracts offered to his highly trained physician clients. He points out that no hospital executive would ever agree to…
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038 - Physician Leaders Ask about Influence and Incentives
In response to listener questions and comments, we dive into two topics in this episode. The first is influence, especially when managing “up” or when dealing with a high profile colleague. The second topic is incentives. Podcast episode #35 featured Alfie Kohn who surprised listeners when he...
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037 - Physician Ownership and Group Wisdom Prevail Through Crises
Christopher Obetz, MD, is the CEO of an organization which started with a handful of physicians 30 years ago, and now they have over 150 physicians and APPs. The group staffs nine emergency rooms in the Minneapolis St. Paul area. One year ago, Dr. Obetz was my guest on Episode #15 (Title…
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036 - Physician-Owned Surgery Center Says “Goodbye Insurance…Hello EXCELLENCE!”
Dr. Keith Smith cofounded the remarkably successful and wonderfully disruptive Surgery Center of Oklahoma. He and fellow anesthesiologist, Dr. Steven Lantier, left their hospital-based practices in 1997 to launch a physician-owned surgery center promising high quality care at a fair, transparent,...
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035 - Incentives Serve the Powerful, Undermine Autonomy, and Gut Creativity
Alfie Kohn is a prolific author and expert on the psychological and organizational effects of rewards, incentives and competition. As a longtime fan of his thinking and writing, it was a huge treat (no pun intended) for me to talk with him about the counterproductive impact of incentive systems…
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034 - Value-Based Care: The Programs, the Problems and Why Physicians Must Lead
My guest is Dr. Roger Fowler, Vice President, and Chief Medical Director of Quality, Performance and Innovation with CHRISTUS Health in Irving, Texas. As an expert in population health, quality, and healthcare reform, Dr. Fowler offers a rich perspective on the historical events that underpin our...
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033 - Physician Autonomy: A Legal Perspective and a Blockchain Solution
Leah Houston, MD is a serial entrepreneur, emergency medicine physician, and activist. She is the founder of: HPEC: Humanistic Physician Empowerment Community is a platform physicians can use to own and store their own digital identity and credentials. A secure, self-sovereign identity is the...
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032 - A Voice for Physician Leadership: Essential, Courageous and Magical
My guest this week is national healthcare leader Dr. Jack Cochran. As CEO of the Permanente Federation, he was the top national leader for over 20,000 physicians who cared for more than 10 million people in their Kaiser Permanente medical practices. In this animated conversation, the inspiring…
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031 - Jung's Physician Archetypes and the Loss of Meaning in Medicine
Lisa Marchiano is a Jungian psychoanalyst and cohost of the marvelous “This Jungian Life” podcast. We discuss Swiss psychiatrist Carl Jung’s work and the implications for physicians and the ailing medical profession. Lisa explains that Jung believed: “We are all on a path toward wholeness. The…
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030 - Monetization of the Physician Imagination
This episode is a continuation of my animated conversation with Professor J.-C. Spender, a nuclear engineer-turned-business school professor, author, expert on the history of business education, and former executive and business school dean. At the onset of episode #30 I asked Dr. Spender if...
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029 - Medicine and Managerialism: A Clash of Values
J.-C. Spender, PhD, is an engineer-turned-business school professor, an author, an expert on the history of business education, and he’s a former business executive and business school dean. These credentials equip him to have insight into the goings-on of business schools and real expertise in…
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028 - Corporate Practice of Medicine Laws: Employed Physician’s Remedy—or Nightmare?
What is the Corporate Practice of Medicine? In this episode, Brad Adatto, a business law and healthcare attorney, takes us on a journey through the intent, implications, and risks associated with state laws that “ban” the corporate practice of medicine. He describes how these state laws arise…
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027 - 13 Ways PBMs Profit Mightily and Hurt People
Pharmacy benefit managers, or PBMs, are companies that manage prescription drug benefits for payers like insurance companies, government programs such as Medicare and Medicaid, and self-insured employers. They are the middlemen and money handlers who negotiate with pharmaceutical manufacturers to...
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026 - Five Myths that Sabotage Physician Leadership
In today’s encore episode, I am sharing an excerpt from an earlier episode discussing myths about physician leadership and dispelling those myths with evidence. MYTH: a widely held but false belief or idea Time to bust some of the myths and stereotypes about physicians being arrogant, un-herdable...
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025 - Don’t Throw Away The Physician Career
For today’s episode, I asked Dr. Barbara McAneny about her upcoming talk: Stop Blaming the Doctors! My main intention in asking Barbara to come back on the podcast (she was a guest on Episode #13) was to have her guide me through the malodorous sewer where Pharmacy Benefits Managers live. But…
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024 - Burnout and Moral Injury: Products of a Business School Mindset
In this encore episode, I’m touching on some of the enormous quantity of research that has been directed at physician burnout. We have clear and convincing descriptions of the causes of physician burnout. What we don’t have, is a lot of action directly tackling those causes. How is it that...
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023 - To Be a Physician Is To Be a Leader
In this encore episode I highlight a portion of my conversation with Dr. Patty Gabow, former CEO at Denver Health. During this 15 minute segment, Patty reacts to my question about the value of physicians’ tacit knowledge and the built-in leadership qualities physicians develop in their training....
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022 - Provocative Questions and Leadership Challenges
In this episode, my longtime colleague and friend Lynn Elliott joins me to take a look at the arc of the Licensed to Lead Podcast’s first season. The first three episodes launched the podcast with data dives to support my foundational beliefs about physician leadership, then we turned to…
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021 - If You're Not Happy - You're Not Helping
In this first Licensed to Lead “Espresso Shot” podcast—designed to be short but potent— the topic is the unhealthy underbelly of “helping” professions. Cory Katuna and Patty spin-off from their Episode #20 conversation when they talked about Levels of Energy or “mindsets.” They dive into a...
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020 - Culture, Levels of Energy, and “Leading A Deathbed Life"
Cory Katuna is a professional coach, writer, graphic artist and social influencer. She joins Patty in this episode to talk about the ways her work and Patty’s work intersect, ultimately creating excellent organizational culture that truly brings out the best in each person. She takes the...
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019 - Mother-Daughter Discussion on Physician Leadership
In the first of two special Mother’s Day podcasts, I’m in the guest chair along with my daughter, Jamie Katuna. Podcaster Keith Carlson, RN, (aka “Nurse Keith”) starts this interview by asking how we influenced and inspired each other as mom and daughter, in medicine and in leadership roles. I…
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018 - Physician Leader and Author Warns the Public of a Dangerous Trend
Niran Al-Agba, MD co-authored the book, Patients at Risk—The Rise of the Nurse Practitioner and Physician Assistant in Healthcare, which unearths the confluence of events allowing poorly trained practitioners to diagnose and treat patients. Dr. Al-Agba, who has a nurse practitioner in her own...
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017 - What is Direct Primary Care? BEAUTIFUL!
Jennifer McCabe Lentz, MD, and I talk about the Direct Primary Care (DPC) practice she built which transformed her professional life and home life. In 2017 she launched her DPC practice. Direct Primary Care means there is no middle-man between the physician and the patient—their relationship is...
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016 - Save a Doctor – Hire a Scribe
In this episode, you’ll hear from three physicians who work with medical scribes. If you haven’t had experience with either in-person or virtual (remote) scribes, this episode will give you a pretty good picture. First, Dr. Christopher Obetz, CEO of Emergency Care Consultants (ECC) and featured...
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015 - Emergency Care Consultants CEO: The Incalculable Value of Physician Careers
Is it possible to create an outstanding organizational culture in what is often a hellhole of anguished patients, staff dissatisfaction, and high physician turnover? Emergency Medicine, with its high stress, high stakes, and ever-diminishing autonomy, has been a burnout zone for decades.…
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014 - A Warrior Spirit For The Vulnerable with Jandel Allen-Davis, MD, President & CEO
Dr. Jandel Allen-Davis is the CEO and President of Craig Hospital, a superb rehabilitation center for traumatic brain and spinal cord injuries. Dr. Allen-Davis, an obstetrician and gynecologist, spent 25 years caring for patients and honing her leadership skills in multiple organizational and...
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013 - A National Leader with Tenacity and Compassion
Former AMA President Barbara McAneny is a relentless patient advocate who sees the harm done by the rapacious medical industrial complex. She spells out the toxicity caused by health system consolidation, purchase of physicians’ practices, and financial exploitation of government programs…
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012 - Physician Leader Development: What Works?
Amanda Goodall, PhD, joins me in Part Two of our conversation discussing the advanced degree program for physician leaders that she founded. She talks about barriers to physician leadership development including political correctness, assumptions that physicians aren’t interested, and the…
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011 - THE RESEARCH: Physicians and the Theory of Expert Leadership
Amanda Goodall, PhD, a professor and leadership expert, joins Patty in an animated conversation about her theory of expert leadership. Dr. Goodall explains how her research revealed that top scholars, not general managers, make the best university CEOs and the most effective department leaders....
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010 - AUTONOMY: with guest Bruce Katuna, MD
In this conversation about the neuroscience of autonomy, I roped neurologist and neurophysiologist Bruce Katuna into joining me. It wasn’t a tough sell since he’d already joined me in holy matrimony a few decades ago. My colleague, Lynn Elliott, agreed to facilitate the conversation and help us...
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009 - Patty Gabow, MD—How a Values-Driven CEO Transformed Denver Health
In this episode I spoke with Dr. Patty Gabow, a nephrologist and researcher who found the right match for her values at Denver Health, a city-center integrated health and hospital system. Dr. Gabow found her leadership chops early, and describes how her passion to care for the underserved fueled…
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008 - A conversation with Scott Smith, MD “A Bias for Action”
This is the first of many conversations with remarkable, consistent, and accomplished leaders in order to put a spotlight on the behaviors that contribute to their leadership effectiveness. In this episode, I talk with Scott Smith, MD, a healthcare leader, and physician. His journey wends its way...
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007 - Why We're Not Fixing Physician Burnout
In this episode I’m offering my take on why we haven’t budged the needle on physician burnout. We have clear evidence of the causes of burnout—but we don’t have effective action. Why are we so stuck? My observations fall into 4 areas: 1. Weak, bureaucratic language that fails to put a spotlight…
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006 - Physician Burnout: The Impact
This episode moves beyond the definition and underlying causes of burnout to focus on the impact on physicians, medical students, patients, and healthcare systems. Patty Fahy interviews a neurologist who retired in his 40’s and then five years later dusted off his medical license and launched a...
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005 - Robyn Symon Interview: Physician Suicide & DO NO HARM
Robyn Symon Interview: Physician Suicide & DO NO HARM Robyn Symon, a two-time Emmy award-winning filmmaker, joined me for the Licensed to Lead podcast on April 30, 2020. Robyn has written, directed, and produced films and television series—and she specializes in documentaries. We spoke about her...
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004 - Physician Burnout: Definition, Controversies and Etiology
Physician Burnout: Definition, Controversies and Etiology The last episode waded into the murky waters of graduate business education. Anyone listening to that podcast should have emerged with serious doubts about whether an MBA is a desirable credential for healthcare, much less for healthcare...
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003 - Who Are The Masters Of Healthcare?
The Licensed to Lead podcast is for physicians, physician leaders, or anyone who thinks healthcare needs a transformation. Licensed to Lead means that physicians must establish the vision, the standards, and the culture in healthcare systems so that excellent patient care is central. The first…
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002 - Physician Leadership: the Myths and the Evidence
The Licensed to Lead podcast is for physicians, physician leaders, or anyone who thinks healthcare needs a transformation. Licensed to Lead means that physicians must establish the vision, the standards, and the culture in healthcare systems so that excellent patient care is central. In this...
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001 - Physician Leadership: The Foundation
The Licensed to Lead podcast is for physicians, physician leaders, or anyone who thinks healthcare needs a transformation. Licensed to Lead means that physicians must establish the vision and the medical standards in our healthcare organizations so that excellent patient care is the central…
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ABOUT THIS SHOW
Join host Patty Fahy, MD as she shares the evidence for why physicians must lead healthcare and lead us out of the current healthcare system morass. Patty has twenty years of experience working with leaders in healthcare—as a member of an executive team, founder of a successful coaching and consulting firm, and as a committed physician advocate. This podcast is for you if you want expert physician leaders at the helm of U.S. healthcare systems and if you want practical advice and critical conversations about honing the leadership skills of physicians.
The Licensed to Lead Podcast offers new angles on the neuroscience of leadership, challenges a “burnout industry” that is profiting from physician burnout, and offers a no-holds-barred investigation into the business school mindset that puts profits over patients. Patty and her guests provide provocative and clear recommendations for changing the business of medicine so that it fulfills the professional obligations of medicine.
HOSTED BY
Patty Fahy, MD
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Frequently Asked Questions
How many episodes does Licensed to Lead have?
Licensed to Lead currently has 42 episodes available on PodParley. New episodes are automatically indexed when they're published to the podcast feed.
What is Licensed to Lead about?
Join host Patty Fahy, MD as she shares the evidence for why physicians must lead healthcare and lead us out of the current healthcare system morass. Patty has twenty years of experience working with leaders in healthcare—as a member of an executive team, founder of a successful coaching and...
How often does Licensed to Lead release new episodes?
Licensed to Lead has 42 episodes. Check the episode list to see recent publication dates and frequency.
Where can I listen to Licensed to Lead?
You can listen to Licensed to Lead on PodParley by clicking any episode. We provide an embedded audio player for direct listening, and you can also subscribe via your preferred podcast app using the RSS feed.
Who hosts Licensed to Lead?
Licensed to Lead is created and hosted by Patty Fahy, MD.
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