Never Perfect Faith

Have you ever felt like you have to earn your place with God, work harder, do more, prove you belong? What if the most freeing truth of the Christian life is that you simply can't? In this warm and laughter-filled conversation,   Dr. Beth sits down with Joy Gulick, author of “A Perfect Minister’s Wife: Another Work of Fiction”. At the age of 90, Joy simultaneously exhibits a beautiful balance of  passion for God’s word and the lightheartedness and joy of a little girl . She  reminds us that grace is a gift already given, fully paid for, and impossible to repay. ”, Joy was married to a minister and is a former missionary. She has had a life of faithful adventure, as she and her husband, Roger accepted God‘s call to move around the country to serve different churches, and to move around the world and preach the gospel in other countries.  Beth interviews Joy today alongside her son, daughter in law, and (kind of) a son in law, for a tender, joy-soaked conversation recorded just months after the passing of her beloved husband, Roger (also a guest of Never Perfect faith in early 2025) . Together they reflect on a lifetime of ministry, from buying thrift-store clothes for an unexpected mountain church to serving as missionaries across the world (including five trips to Iraq) well into their seventies. Through stories of Sabbath rest, small-group revival, bold discipleship, and irrepressible humor, Joy models what it looks like to live freely, love people boldly, and never lose the "glow." What You'll Learn: Why the Sabbath is a gift to enjoy, not a rule to obey and how rest protects you from burnout in ministry and life How small groups and everyday discipleship can multiply faith and transform an entire community The difference between earning God's love and receiving it as a gift you could never repay Why honesty about our struggles makes Christians more relatable—and the gospel more believable How to lovingly empower others (and yourself) to step out of comfort and into bold, God-sized obedience Why laughter and lightheartedness can be signs of a deep, grace-filled maturity About the Guest:  Joy Gulick is an author, pastor's wife, and mother of two who, alongside her late husband Roger, gave decades of her life to ministry and global missions. Known for her warmth, humor, and gift for seeing the best in others, Joy has spent a lifetime encouraging baby Christians to study, share, and reproduce their faith. Her husband Roger's own conversation with Dr. Beth is available on the Never Perfect Podcast. Get a copy of Joy Gulick’s Book: The Perfect Minister's Wife: Another Book of Fiction Wherever you are on your journey, weary, doubting, or just longing for a little more freedom, this episode is a gentle invitation to receive the gift you don't have to earn. Take a listen, let Joy's joy remind you that grace really is good news, and share this episode with someone who needs to hear it today. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

What does it take to walk away from everything you've built: a thriving business, a beloved farm, paid-off debt, and a community you cherish — to follow God into one of the least-reached nations on earth? For John and Lydia Young, the answer wasn't found in their strengths. It was found in their weakness. And in that surrender, they discovered a peace and joy that only God can supply. In this deeply moving episode, Dr. Beth sits down with John and Lydia Young, fourth- and third-generation missionaries preparing to move their family of six to Japan. From a successful tree care business and veterinary practice in Tennessee to a calling that defies worldly logic, John and Lydia share how God closed door after door  and then dramatically opened the one to Japan. Together they explore honor-shame culture, the loneliness of one of the world's most spiritually dark nations, the danger of tying our identity to performance, and the radical truth that God's power is made perfect in our weakness. What You'll Learn Why God often calls us away from our strengths and how that's where true peace is found The eleven-year journey of becoming debt-free before stepping onto the mission field How honor-shame culture shapes Japan's deep loneliness and resistance to the gospel Why perfectionism is a form of bondage  and how grace sets us free from earning our worth The biblical model of sustainable missions: discipleship, the local church, and cultural humility How God still speaks today through small, ordinary moments of obedience and trust About the Guests John and Lydia Young are missionaries with Mission to the World (MTW), preparing to serve in Japan with their four children: Eden, Celia, Jesse, and Silas. John is a skilled arborist and woodworker with a heart for relational evangelism, and Lydia is a veterinarian whose journey through Uganda and rural Tennessee shaped her vision for cross-cultural ministry. Together, they are laying down successful careers to follow God's call to one of the most unreached nations in the world, where there is only one church for every 16,000 Japanese people. To learn more about their mission, partner with them in prayer, or support their work financially, visit Mission to the World at mtw.org and search for the Young family. You can also watch their full ministry introduction here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYUQMbLiwmM If you've ever wondered whether God could use your weakness, your fears, or your unfinished places — this episode is for you. Take a few moments to listen, let the Spirit speak, and consider whether God might be inviting you to step out in faith too. If this episode encourages you, please share it with a friend, leave a review, and join us at www.neverperfect.org for more stories of growth, resilience, and faith. Subscribe to the Never Perfect Faith Podcast wherever you listen because perfect isn't the goal. Faithful is. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Have you ever found yourself wondering, "Have I done enough? Does God really forgive me? Am I truly saved?" These aren't just questions whispered by anxious children — they echo through the hearts of believers at every age. In this spontaneous and Spirit-led episode, Dr. Beth Capecchi gently dismantles the lie that our salvation depends on our performance. Sparked by a heartfelt conversation with a client whose young daughter has been wrestling with deep spiritual anxiety, Dr. Beth opens her Bible and her heart to address one of the most profound questions of faith: what must we actually do to be saved? With warmth, honesty, and rich scriptural grounding, she walks listeners through the freeing truth that salvation is not earned through good deeds, church attendance, or perfect prayer routines — it is received through faith alone in Jesus Christ. What You'll Learn Why human nature struggles to accept a free gift — and how that resistance fuels spiritual anxiety The biblical truth that faith, not works, saves us (Acts 16, Romans 3, Ephesians 2) How even the disciples doubted, failed, and questioned — and why their humanity comforts ours Why our spiritual walk often mirrors our struggles with nutrition, discipline, and self-care How to lovingly engage friends whose choices differ from our own without judgment The deep assurance found in Psalm 23 and John 14 — that God has prepared a place for you Helpful Resources Recommended reading from this episode: "What Must I Do to Be Saved?" by John R. Rice — at wholesomewords.org Helpful Bible study tools mentioned: Bible Gateway and Bible Hub Pair This Episode With "How Deep The Father's Love For Us" by Phillips, Craig & Dean — a worship song that beautifully echoes the heart of today's message: a love so deep we could never earn it, only receive it. Listen on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/track/0u9NNRu07VbnH15cnycBWN If you've ever wrestled with whether you're "doing enough" for God, this episode is your permission slip to rest. Take a breath, press play, and let truth wash over the weary places in your heart. When the message ministers to you, share it with a friend who needs to hear that grace — not performance — is the foundation of faith. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

What if the very things the world counts out — a prison cell, a giveaway book, a child written off — became the exact places where God shows up most powerfully? Pat Clark has spent a lifetime watching that happen. And the stories he's collected will leave you in awe of what God can do with a fully surrendered life. In this powerful follow-up conversation  (to the episode published in April 2024)  with Pat Clark — founder of Open Gates Scotland and a former prisoner whose life was transformed by Christ in 1983. (Also Beth’s husband’s “Uncle Pat”).  What started as a quick catch-up turned into a soul-stirring update from one of the most quietly impactful ministry leaders in the UK. From Glasgow to Atlanta to Tanzania, Pat shares the latest miracles unfolding through his work, the book he refuses to sell, and a bold new vision to restore Glasgow's original motto: "Let Glasgow flourish with the preaching of Your Word and the praising of Your name." What You'll Learn Why Pat sends his book My Father's Genes to every prison in Britain — and the jaw-dropping moment a young inmate found his father written into its pages How a single "God-incidence" reconnected Pat with the sister of a childhood hero from his juvenile detention days Why Pat exclusively hires people with criminal records, and how that hiring philosophy built one of Scotland's most successful re-offending prevention programs How profits from Open Gates fund clean-water wells across Tanzania, Uganda, and South Africa The simple daily practice — a cup of coffee and a handwritten letter to the Lord — that has deepened his faith over 43 years What it looks like to stand firm with the government, trust God's provision, and refuse to be governed by fear About the Guest Pat Clark is the founder of Open Gates, a Scotland-based charity providing employment, mentorship, gospel hope, and community to ex-offenders, the homeless, and those battling addiction. A former prisoner whose life was radically transformed in 1983, Pat is the author of My Father's Genes and has personally visited prisons across the UK, Ireland, and the United States. At 77, he continues to lead, write, mentor, and dream — including a fresh vision to return Glasgow to its spiritual heritage. Website: opengates.scot Book: My Father's Genes (distributed free to prison libraries across Britain, Ireland, and Atlanta) If this episode stirred something in you, share it with someone who needs the reminder that no story is too broken, no past too far gone, and no city too lost for the grace of God. Subscribe to the Never Perfect Faith Podcast wherever you listen, leave a review to help more listeners find these conversations, and visit www.neverperfect.org for more stories of growth, resilience, and faith. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

What matters more to God? Appearances or authenticity? Public displays of faith or private devotion? What if the loudest, most "put-together" version of faith isn't actually the truest one? What if the Christian who wins you over isn't the one with all the answers, but the one who simply listens, remembers your name, and lets you be exactly who you are?  In this conversation, twenty-seven-year-old artist and interior designer Effie Rostand says the quiet, in-process, unpolished version of faith might be the one that actually changes us. Dr. Beth Capecchi sits down with Effie Rustand — fifth of nine kids, SCAD-trained designer, and one of the most refreshingly honest voices you'll hear on the show — to unpack what happens when a curious, contrarian thinker grows up inside Christian culture. From homeschool Sundays around the family table, to an all-girls high school, to art school in Savannah where everyone treated their body like a canvas, Effie shares why the loudest expressions of faith often felt the least real to her — and what a "quiet faith" rooted in listening, love, and showing up actually looks like.  What You'll Learn Why "performative Christianity" — the right outfit, the right small-group answers, the right Christian resume — can actually push people away from Jesus, and what authentic faith looks like instead How God works through community, not just through "casting your burdens" — and why showing up for each other is part of how He answers prayer A fresh lens on the woman at the well: how Jesus' upside-down kingdom welcomes the rejected, the unconvinced, and the still-figuring-it-out Why creative expression — piercings, platinum hair, art, fashion, humor — isn't a threat to faith when "God looks at the heart" How to move from a fear-based faith ("don't go to hell") to a love-based faith ("I was carefully placed here on purpose") What two unlikely mentors — a soccer coach and an art professor — taught Effie about presence, listening, and leading without lecturing If you've ever felt like you don't quite fit the "Christian mold"  or you've watched someone you love walk away from faith because the culture around it felt heavier than the love at the center of it — this episode is for you. Press play, take a breath, and let yourself imagine a faith that's quiet, curious, and free. Then share it with the friend who needs to hear that God isn't keeping score on their outfit, their piercings, or their unanswered questions — He's just inviting them in. Scriptural references:  “He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? But to do justice and to love mercy and to walk humbly with thy God.” Micah 6:8  “For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith-  it is the gift of God, not from yourselves, so that no one should boast.” Ephesians 2:8 Listen now on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you stream — and learn more at neverperfect.org. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

What happens when faith is manipulated, truth is twisted, and the people you love most are turned against you? In this powerful episode, author and former sports broadcaster Peter Young shares the deeply personal story of how he unknowingly became entangled in a destructive religious cult—and how faith ultimately helped him find freedom and healing. Dr. Beth Capecchi sits down with Peter to explore his remarkable life journey—from college basketball and broadcasting to a devastating spiritual and personal crisis. Peter opens up about how a manipulative “family guru” slowly gained control over his marriage, faith, and family. Through heartbreak, loss, and rock-bottom moments, Peter discovered profound lessons about discernment, humility, and the true nature of faith. His story is both a cautionary tale and a testimony of God’s redemptive power. What You’ll Learn in This Episode How spiritual manipulation and cult dynamics can subtly infiltrate everyday life The warning signs and red flags of destructive religious leadership Why vulnerability and isolation make people susceptible to cult influence The difference between authentic Christian faith and manipulative spiritual control How faith, community, and truth can help someone recover after deep betrayal Why sharing our failures and struggles can become powerful testimonies About the GuestPeter Young is an author, storyteller, former sports broadcaster, and real estate broker living near Bozeman, Montana. After a career that included college basketball, coaching, and broadcasting for networks like ESPN, Peter now focuses on writing and sharing stories that explore faith, resilience, and personal transformation. His memoir recounts his experience surviving a destructive cult and rebuilding his life. Connect with Peter Young Website: https://authorpeteryoung.com Memoir: Stop the Tall Man, Save the Tiger Novels: Blue Team and Wardrobe of the Wolf Available on Amazon, Barnes & Noble, and other major retailers If this episode resonated with you, share it with someone who might need encouragement or clarity in their faith journey. Remember—you don’t have to be perfect to experience transformation. Sometimes our hardest seasons become the very stories that help others find hope. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this deeply honest episode of Never Perfect Faith, Dr. Beth sits down with Doug Lynam, a former Marine, former monk, financial advisor, and spiritual thinker—to talk about doubt, deconstruction, spiritual trauma, and rebuilding faith from the ground up. Doug shares his journey from evangelical Christianity to agnosticism, from the Marines to 20 years in a Catholic monastery—and the painful unraveling that followed. Together, Dr. Beth and Doug explore unhealthy or toxic Christianity, spiritual ego, tribalism, and why faith must mature beyond rigid rule-following if it’s going to survive real life. They also talk about the dark night of the soul, projection, judgment, grace, and how spiritual growth often follows the pattern: order → disorder → reorder. This conversation is thoughtful, vulnerable, and refreshingly nuanced. In this episode, you’ll learn How spiritual trauma and abuse can distort our image of God What “sin” originally meant—and why that’s actually hopeful How we project our parental wounds onto God The difference between tribal religion and mature spirituality Why deconstruction doesn’t have to mean abandoning faith How prayer, nature, contemplation, and gratitude can reconnect us What it means to move from believing in God “out there” to experiencing God “within” If you’ve ever felt disillusioned by Christians… hurt by the church… or confused by your own doubts, this episode is a reminder that faith isn’t about perfection, performance, or pretending certainty. It’s a journey.And sometimes falling apart is the most faithful step forward. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

What happens when you pray for years without an answer—and then God responds over lunch? In this episode of Never Perfect Faith, an unplanned Saturday morning hospital visit turns into a deeply meaningful conversation with Dick Crotteau—a beloved friend, Air Force veteran, husband, father, and man of deep faith. Recovering from strokes and surgery, Dick shares stories from nearly 85 years of life, reflecting on what he calls his “final approach,” a term drawn from his Air Force days that now carries profound meaning in this later chapter of life. You’ll hear about decades of service with adoption ministries like Bethany Christian Services, an unexpected calling into prison ministry, and mentoring a man released after 27 years in prison with nothing but a single box and a hopeful smile. Dick also shares his love of contemplation, the practice of slowing down, noticing God’s presence in creation, and even using the stars to navigate—a beautiful metaphor for how faith can guide us when we take the time to look up. In this episode, you’ll learn: How faith and service can unfold in unexpected ways. The quiet power of stillness, reflection, and noticing God in everyday life. That wisdom, purpose, and spiritual growth can deepen with age. Why the most meaningful conversations often happen in imperfect, unplanned moments. This episode is a reminder that God invites us into love, service, and presence in many ways—sometimes through action, sometimes through silence, and sometimes simply by being together. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Dr. Beth’s father Dr. Jack Muller (retired professor of sociology) passed away in August 2025, leaving behind a legacy of "imperfect faith" that touched everyone from college students to inmates at Walker State Prison to the elderly at Thrive at Brow Wood. In this heartfelt and humor-filled episode of Never Perfect Faith, we sit down with two of “Diamond Jack’s” closest friends and colleagues: Dr. Ray Clark (professor and minister) and Dr. Ed Salter (minister). Together, they reflect on the life of a man who devoted his life to teaching and encouraging his students at a Covenant College, but after his retirement, he found ways to use his gifts of faithfulness and encouragement to serve his community in various ways. He wanted to spend his entire life, even when he was physically unwell, serving his Lord and Savior and loving God’s people, whether it was mentoring prisoners, co-facilitating a support group at a nursing home, calling to check on friends who were sick or grieving, and being known as the cookie man. He even brought meals to people in his late 70s, even though his culinary skills were not his strong point. Ray and Ed share intimate (and often hilarious) stories that paint a portrait of a man who was as frugal as he was generous, and as witty as he was humble. Join us as we celebrate a life of someone who was changed by God’s love which is “ so amazing, so divine, it demands my soul, my life, my all.” Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

About a year ago, Dr. Beth’s father  took her to hear Lilli Meier speak at the Thrive Senior Living community on Lookout Mountain, GA, where he volunteered up until the time of his death August 25, 2025.  He suggested that Beth interview her to hear about her story and her book….so this is the culmination of his sweet suggestion. Lilli was born in Cuba in 1949, which she describes as an idyllic paradise before Fidel Castro took over and imposed a totalitarian system on this beautiful country. Lilli shares about her trauma and grief she had to endure when school-aged kids were forced to do a morning chant every day, “We are pioneers for Communicatism and we will all be Chegavada.” She adds,  “Our family had a hard time for a long time and Catholicism felt robotic.” She and her family left her beloved country in 1961 to go to America and she wasn’t able to return for a visit until 2008.  She said “America will always be the beacon of freedom.” Lilli shares how her faith sustained her through all of this, saying, “ I found my freedom in Christ.” She adds,  “God takes a lot from us sometimes and we have to hold on to him. “ To order her book CLICK HERE Listen to this episode and more: ⁠⁠⁠neverperfect.org⁠⁠⁠ Follow us on instagram ⁠⁠⁠@neverperfectpodcast⁠⁠⁠ Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: ⁠⁠⁠[email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Today Dr. Carol Stoney, Beth’s most frequent (and very likely one of the most popular ) podcast guests returns to the show to talk about marriage. She likes to encourage married couples to ask themselves the question regularly: “ Why did we get  married?” Like when things get hard  or when transitions happen, she urges them to sit down and have a conversation “What’s our purpose?” Sometimes couples have change their mission, she said. Dr. Stoney stated “I don’t care what couples are fighting about, I care what they are fighting FOR“ “What is the mission and the purpose and the reason you are staying together?” In essence, it is important for couples to know and remember what it is they are trying to achieve and what stands in the way (or threatens) what it is that they are trying to recover to achieve that goal they never knew they had. She urges couples to consider, why is this so important to me? What is it that we’re fighting for? To hear more episodes with Dr. Stoney, go to your favorite podcast platform and Google Never Perfect Dr. Stoney To learn more about her, you can go to healingforcouples.com Listen to this episode and more: ⁠⁠neverperfect.org⁠⁠ Follow us on instagram ⁠⁠@neverperfectpodcast⁠⁠ Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: ⁠⁠[email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Many of us who experienci significant pain and suffering, may start to doubt that God is still taking care of us and still loves us and still wants to give us good things . Sometimes we doubt that he is doing good things for us personally, even when we know that he is good globally. Many of us also think that we need to clean ourselves up before we can approach God and turn to him, or return to him after a period of withdrawal or retreat. We also forget that we don’t have to be good enough because he is good enough. When we cling to him, we need to be reminded that him clinging to us is the thing that we can really count on Today beth shares the highlights of an amazing sermon on the book of Ruth by Dr. Mary Willson Hannah. Listen to this episode and more: ⁠neverperfect.org⁠ Follow us on instagram ⁠@neverperfectpodcast⁠ Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: ⁠[email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Today’s episode is dedicated to Pastor Roger Gulick, who passed away March 21. He left a wonderful legacy which you can hear about on the last episode which was published February 13. Today Beth shares her journey of faith and her frequent struggle to tune into God and His Word, oftentimes going through the motions in a rote way, because she wants others to learn from her regrets and missed opportunities of knowing God and engaging with him in a deeper way. She encourages the listeners to find creative ways to engage with God and scripture, using their own unique minds and learning styles, whether that be through studying Scripture, creating art or poetry that represents biblical truths, Bible Studies, topical studies, etc. she emphasizes the importance of the Holy Spirit as a “tutor “or “illuminator” of Scripture. She shares strategies she has discovered to study the Bible in a more engaging an interactive way. see below for links to Bible Gateway and to some of the books Beth mentioned. See below for links to Bible Gateway and to some of the books Beth mentioned. Bible Gateway HERE Also, If you’d like to check out, Laura Pettit’s art, her website HERE    Instagram is @Laurapettitfineart Bible study on Philippians HERE Daily devotional HERE Listen to this episode and more: neverperfect.org Follow us on instagram @neverperfectpodcast Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

At the age of 86 and only six days after moving into an assisted living facility because of terminal cancer, Roger Gulick has agreed to share his life story with us today. Roger and his wife Joy have been in ministry, for more than 50 years. He and his wife Joy have been married for over 60 years, and their life has been quite the adventure, whether that was pastoring one of the churches in four different states, or traveling around the world ministering to pastors and their families for 17 years. Up until his college years, Roger believed that being a nice person would get him to heaven because he felt like he was “nicer” then 93% of the population. When someone explained to him that Christ did for him what he couldn’t do for himself (ie, live a perfect life) and gave himself up for him, his whole life changed and he has devoted the rest of his life to ministry. Joy has published a couple of books and she will soon be a guest on Never Perfect Faith as well. Attached is a beautiful song written 119 years ago that echoes the sentiments shared today, entitled “He Will Hold Me Fast” Listen to this episode and more: neverperfect.org Follow us on instagram @neverperfectpodcast Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

How many youth have been able to wrestle with the question: “ What does God want me to do with my life?” Annette and Tim Gulick have devoted much of their lives traveling the world to help Youth (and adults who work with Youth organizations) discover who God created them to be and what their highest purpose is. They explain that Jesus gives shape to all of reality and to who we are and what we are meant to do, much like gravity gives planets their shape. Allowing Christ to shape you can fit into reality. After many years of doing this work and writing several books, Annette decided to write “Aligned: Flourishing in a World of Choice”, summarizing the principles that she and her husband Tim had been teaching for so many years. The book and workbook includes activities to help readers discover what it means to live a more fruitful life. The Gulicks were also recently on Beth‘s mental health podcast called Aligned and Flourishing on December 31, 2024. Check it out HERE To learn more about Annette’s book, go to HERE Listen to this episode and more: neverperfect.org Follow us on instagram @neverperfectpodcast Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hollee Brock has a passion for living, holistically, and healing holistically. As a Christian and licensed Energy 4Life practitioner, she lives out her philosophy that “faith and science should not be separated.” While raising her six children ( now young adults) she studied and practiced a variety of things, including dance and earthing, and is currently using somatic techniques called bioenergetics. In her work, Hollee takes a bioenergetic approach to health and wellbeing by working with the energy and information of the body system, understanding that they are the control center that drives our biology and chemistry. Today she shares part of her fascinating journey with us. Hollee also has a podcast called Along the Camino at Basecamp. You can find her podcast at HERE Or learn more about her practice at wellnesscornerchattanooga.com Listen to this episode and more: neverperfect.org Follow us on instagram @neverperfectpodcast Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

How can you tell that God is with you when you feel alone? Today Dr. Beth shares a story about a client from many years ago who believed that God did small things to help her all the time. Her client had struggled with serious health issues for years, and was broken hearted when her husband left her when she was around age 60. She began sensing God's presence and noticing little ways, he was helping her on a regular basis Listen to this episode and more: neverperfect.org Follow us on instagram @neverperfectpodcast Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

At some point in our lives, most of us have felt lost/confused, due to failure, feeling like an “outsider”, or a disappointment; and most of us have battled some sort of addiction. Francis Thompson, the “Ne’er Do Well” and “misfit poet” experienced it all to a staggering degree, and unintentionally caused his family, a great deal of stress and heartache, and disappointment. Dr. Beth shares his story in this episode, explaining that it’s one of the most touching and compelling stories she’s ever heard. His story is timeless and relatable, even though he lived from 1859-1907. As a young child, he was drawn to reading and writing, but his family encouraged him to pursue other studies and occupations. He was brilliant (scoring at the top of his class) in some subjects (like writing) and at the bottom of his class in other areas. He was viewed as odd and “Mooney” at school. After being rejected at seminary, failing three rounds of exams at medical school, being refused in the military, Thompson moved to London England to pursue writing, with his parents reluctant approval. Little did he know that “a life of destitution awaited him”. He was unable succeed in any of his odd jobs and he ended up homeless and addicted to opium for three years. He continued writing during these years and submitted his writing on dirty and crinkled paper, to the owner of a literary magazine (Wilfrid Meynell), who was eventually able to locate him and help rehabilitate him, although he was on the brink of death. His most famous poem “The Hound of Heaven” (written while he was being rehabilitated for his opium addiction) has been a source of inspiration for over 130 years. This redemptive poem has been taught in university classrooms worldwide and impacted countless people, including literary giants and heroes such as JRR Tolkien, G.K. Chesterton, Eugene O’Neill, Madeline L’Engle, and Dorothy Day. this poem is autobiographical and depicts God as the Hound of Heaven who never gives up pursuing our souls.  Listen to the poem HERE This “ne’er do well misfit” poet’s work has been compared to the likes of Shakespeare and Robert Browning. His poem echoes sentiments from Psalms 139:7-12 and the story of the Good Shepherd (Matthew 18:10-14) who never gives up rescuing the one sheep who is lost. To learn more about Francis Thompsons story, check out the following articles and documentaries.  Documentary abut Francis Thompsons Article on Wikipedia and Natcath Listen to this episode and more: neverperfect.org Follow us on instagram @neverperfectpodcast Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

As he approaches his 80th birthday, minister and chaplain Ed Salter shares his story of caregiving his wife Christine, who passed away almost 10 years ago. She was battling Parkinson’s 27 of their 50 years of marriage. Today Ed shares their story and their, including many of the sorrows enjoys that came with it. He spent his life savings on healthcare costs, had to endure sundowners syndrome for years, while he and his wife both maintained a witty sense of humor. He regularly sang to her, while pinching her toes or her nose, “You are my sunshine “. For years he has facilitated grief support groups and caregiver support groups and he talks about how God, his family and community has sustained him through it all. One of his greatest desires is to “finish well” and he is using the story worth platform to write his story and leave a legacy for his family. Near the end, Beth shares a little bit about her dissertation research on grief and the five themes that emerged from her interviews with grieving individuals. The five themes were Details/ telling the story of dying/loss, how they coped, How they felt (affect), How they changed, and the Relationship with the deceased. Here is an article summarizing her research. Listen to this episode and more: neverperfect.org Follow us on instagram @neverperfectpodcast Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Today Matt Monahan returns for another interview with Dr. Beth, following a great conversation on the Never Perfect Faith podcast on 6/20/24 entitled “Allowing hard questions and honest answers.” So many men find it difficult to face their pain and be vulnerable, and Matt is willing to share his story of growing up with childhood abandonment and emotional neglect. He barely knew his father, and has spent most of his life, wondering if he is good enough. He realized that his feelings about his father translated into his assumptions about God, which unconsciously happens for many. He felt that “if God existed, he would be a capricious and attentive military “type of person. Matt discusses how his insecurity and self loathing translated into his 25 year marriage. He discusses various triggers, including his wife, rejecting, sexual intimacy, and the despair that followed. He talked about the relationship challenges that presented during Covid, and the unexpected healing that came as a result of having more time for introspection. Tune in to hear how Matt pursued healing through self help and faith. And if you want to check out his artwork, go to his website at themightybluegill.com Follow Matt on instagram @themightybluegill Listen to this episode and more: neverperfect.org Follow us on instagram @neverperfectpodcast Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Andy Mendonsa has devoted his life to helping widows since 1987, and surprisingly, his passion for this work is what most would expect with a newfound calling. In addition, he’s been studying the biblical meaning of widowhood for 25 years and in 2017, wrote a book called “Spiritual Widowhood”, which addresses the idea that we are all spiritually desolate without God, and in need of deliverance, redemption, and restored. Andy explains that the gospel is a betrothal of marriage, essentially involving a spiritual oneness with Jesus.  Widows Harvest Ministries (423) 266-0260 Spiritual Widowhood Listen to this episode and more: neverperfect.org Follow us on instagram @neverperfectpodcast Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Dr. Kelly Kapic, a professor of theology, has written over 15 books. Today he shares biblical and philosophical perspectives on humility, self-esteem, being limited, using your gifts, how efficiency can be an enemy of love, and the distinction between loving people versus liking them. Over the years, Dr. Kapic has discovered that almost all college students feel loved by their parents, but many of them do not feel liked by both parents. Beth asks him to elaborate on his conversation with Jonathan Rogers on the Habit podcast. He says it takes courage for us to “genuinely soak in the forgiveness of God and His presence and kindness, to actually believe he’s kind to us and that he ‘(as it says, in the minor prophets) ‘rejoices over us with singing’. “ he admits his own own struggles with productivity shame are ongoing, saying “ when I lay my head on the pillow at night, I don’t feel like I crushed it. There’s always so much I didn’t do.” Listen to this episode and more: neverperfect.org Follow us on instagram @neverperfectpodcast Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Today Beth has a very interactive conversation with Matt Monahan about a variety of faith related questions and topics, Matt had an absent father growing up, and became a teacher largely because he experienced personally the difference teachers can make in students lives. Matt’s passion for this calling outweighed his concerns for financial ease, so he and his wife, also a teacher, raised five kids on teacher’s salaries because he found greater value in making a difference in eternal ways. Today he explains his philosophy as a Bible teacher, and how he encourages students to wrestle with difficult questions and to be real about their faith while he does the same. In the discussion today, Matt shares some of his favorite philosophies, insights, and authors, and brainstorms wisely about Beth‘s comical idea of viewing Gordon Ramsay and Hell’s Kitchen as a way to think about God and holiness. Listen to this episode and more: neverperfect.org Follow us on instagram @neverperfectpodcast Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Today, Dr. Beth shares a little bit about herself personally and professionally also explains why she wanted to have a Christian podcast as well as her mental health podcast called Never Perfect Dr. Beth. She discusses some parallels between Faith and nutrition, specifically how we often know what’s good for us, but we still do it and lack self-discipline. She also laughs about the silly idea of being graded as a Christian, and explains would probably earn a grade of C or D. And she ends with some lyrics from a hymn called “In Christ Alone.” (listen HERE) Listen to this episode and more: neverperfect.org Follow us on instagram @neverperfectpodcast Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this episode , Beth talks with Dr. Melissa Powell, a registered dietitian nutritionist, about her journey with multiple losses and how she learned to “shield her joy “ (ie, protect and preserve it) through reciting ancient prayers, liturgy, community and God‘s promises. Melissa shares her story of losing both parents in her 20s, and fertility issues in her 30s, and a battle with breast cancer in her early 40s. She shared some excerpts of favorite readings that helped her maintain hope and joy during times of loss and struggle. Beth suggests an idea that envy might actually be a manifestation of grief. Listen to this episode and more: neverperfect.org Follow us on instagram @neverperfectpodcast Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this episode, Beth talks with Avery Campbell, a Young Life staff member who works with teenagers every day and tries to help them understand faith and grace. Beth and Avery discuss ways that it is difficult for many people, including themselves, to accept a free gift and love that you don’t have to earn. So many of us feel a need to prove ourselves in all of our relationships, and many of us experience imposter syndrome. God’s love for us seems so counterintuitive and often different from human love , so it can be hard to accept and digest. The idea of doing good things as a result of receiving grace (unmerited favor) and NOT in order to earn it is also hard to fathom for many. Good works will be an aftereffect of receiving grace (unmerited favor) and not a method to earn grace, because it’s a free gift. Very little in human life Seems to work that way, and most things are based on merit and performance and worth , whether it is making an athletic team, or getting graded, or the amount of money you make. So the truth of the Bible and the message from a supernatural being, is countercultural and so different than what we are conditioned, and often hard to believe and accept. Amazing grace… ineffably sublime. Beth reads Isaiah 55:1-9 Listen to this episode and more: neverperfect.org Follow us on instagram @neverperfectpodcast Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this podcast, Pat Clark, author of several books, including “My Father’s Genes”, describes his journey from the tenements of Glasgow, Scotland to a life of violence, crime, and many years in and out of prisons and institutions. He shares the story about how God worked in his heart to lead him to set up a charity to help offenders find a new purpose in life. This interview was recorded in June 2022 when Beth was visiting Scotland with her husband, Remo and their three kids. Interestingly, Pat Clark is “Uncle Pat” to Beth’s family (a third cousin to Remo, also a native Glaswegian.) Hopefully you can understand Pat’s beautiful Scottish brogue, and if not, you can just listen to it for sheer listening pleasure.  Pat Clark Waterstones Open Gates Scotland Listen to this episode and more: neverperfect.org Follow us on instagram @neverperfectpodcast Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Many of us may be surprised by the unexpected twists of the Bible and by faith and what it entails. Jesus was very countercultural and outside the box. Did you know that the first person to see and speak with him after he rose from the dead was a woman, at a time when women were not respected as credible witnesses? Did you know that many of the disciples of Jesus struggled with doubt or confusion, in spite of seeing countless miracles and having Jesus talk directly to him? Aaron Tolson, a youth pastor, explains how Jesus meets them (and us) and meets us where we are, and understands our distinctive struggles for faith. They also talk about some of the confusion surrounding sin and faith, and how people who feel self-righteous may be blinded to the power of the gospel and to their need to have their debts forgiven. (Jesus compares this to a mortgage debt in Luke 7:41-50. ) Those who have been forgiven more (or at least realize how much they’ve been forgiven) love more. Some may find it hard to believe that Being “good” doesn’t save you, but “those who give their life to the Lord begin to look and act like Jesus”, Aaron explains. Our faith in God changes us, no matter what our past was. Listen to this episode and more: neverperfect.org Follow us on instagram @neverperfectpodcast Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Today Beth interviews Shonda Caines, the Head of Exceptional Education and Head of Lower School, about her experience of having a child with Down’s Syndrome and autism having to undergo open heart surgery as an infant. Shonda explains how her faith has been both challenged and strengthened, the questions she has for God, and her ongoing wrestling match with Him for control. One of her favorite Bible passages is Psalm 139. Her grief and concern for her son’s struggles and pain and her sense of helplessness to fix it were the hardest parts. She’s learned that in some of the hard things are also the really good things… knowing that we live in a fallen world but sometimes wondering “why did God let it fall?” Although Shonda doesn’t think she was initially equipped to handle a disabled child and thereforeGod can equip you to handle the hard. Two good books on God and suffering are:“Where is God when it hurts?” By Phillip Yancey and “The Problem of Pain” by CS Lewis. You celebrate the little triumphs along the way. A very shocking document about how disabled kids were treated was by Geraldo “Willowbrook: the Last Disgrace. ” In terms of inclusion, Shonda is trying to make a difference , still “in a place of kicking down doors” and barriers to disabled kids. You can put people in a box. We need to give everyone an access to good places. How would Jesus treat disabled children? He would “open the door.” And he would serve them. There is so much work to do to take care of others who need the help and support. The poor the alien the widow the orphan the sick. Never Perfect: S1E28 "Unpacking Intelligence with Shonda Caines" Listen to this episode and more: neverperfect.org Follow us on instagram @neverperfectpodcast Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

What kind of people would be willing to inconvenience themselves and take in multiple refugees from Russia? And even more, what would possess a family to put jeopardize their lives or their freedom by hiding Jewish people in their attic? Who would do this type of thing? A person who models their life after Jesus, who made the ultimate sacrifice to save others. When you consider the saying “every man for himself”, this seems pretty radical and unexpected. Tiffany Dorizas is passionate about hospitality and having having people over frequently in a very casual and low-key way. One of her greatest inspirations is Corrie Ten Boom, a Dutch woman whose Christian family embraced a legacy of loving their neighbors, and loving strangers in a radical and sacrificial way. Housing them and protecting them at the ultimate cost to themselves.  Listen to this episode and more: neverperfect.org Follow us on instagram @neverperfectpodcast Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

When an 18-year-old senior is brave enough to share a vulnerable story in front of his entire high school for his chapel talk, including his battle with pornography addiction, to cry while the pain of a friend’s suicide, his mother’s life-threatening battle with cancer, the death of a grandparent, and to share his faith, it’s a story that needs to be shared with a broader audience. Gus explains that he was and is willing to talk publicly about his addiction to pornography because he has talked to so many friends who also struggle, and because he knows he’s been forgiven by loving God, who has his hand over him. Beth and Gus talk about the fact that we all look for something to fill our souls, and most of us succumb to some sort of temptation that is greatly lacking. Our souls are looking for some thing, infinite because our souls are infinite. Attached are several links: the link to Gus ‘s new podcast “The Watchmen’s Call.”  Gus's New Podcast The link to Jonathan Edward’s sermon that they discuss The link to the story behind the hymn “It is Well with my Soul” Listen to this episode and more: neverperfect.org Follow us on instagram @neverperfectpodcast Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this episode, Beth interviews 2 missionaries who have spent 25 years in Germany, and share their story, including their own struggles with faith and discouragement. They share a story of a woman who wanted to know God, but didn’t know His name or how to talk to Him, and the powerful answers she received. Extra bonus: Beth shares a silly prank she played using her high school German vocabulary words… “Wir essen fressen” (Translates into “We prefer animal food”)  Listen to this episode and more: neverperfect.org Follow us on instagram @neverperfectpodcast Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

So many people are understandably turned off to Christianity by those who are judgmental, self-righteous, and unloving. But that’s not at all how Jesus Christ lived his life. He welcomed the unlovable and the biggest screw ups. He embraced and forgave all who saw their need for him. Jesus was the epitome of refreshing and mind blowing. In this episode, Beth interviews Brian Salter, a pastor, husband, and father who has devoted his life to studying and teaching the Bible. He is a relatable, compassionate, and loving Christian who represents Jesus well. Beth poses questions to Brian such as, “Who did Jesus show the most love and mercy to?And who was he the hardest on?” If Christians claim to be representatives of Christ, then we should be the most humble and loving servants on the planet. In fact, Jesus was often viewed as a non-conformist and a bit of a rebel because he valued love over social convention and lived to please to God, not people. Author Sean Cronin says that Jesus was viewed as a rebel because “he was vociferously anti-establishment. And he was charismatic enough to draw crowds to him. He was a threat to the Pharisees, the religious elite and that made him a threat to the Roman rulers who did not want any trouble between the common people and the elite. His rebel message was simple (he was apparently a pious Jew): he spoke against the abuses of priestly authority and hypocrisy. He treated people of low status with respect. “ … Refreshing and mind blowing …  Listen to this episode and more: neverperfect.org Follow us on instagram @neverperfectpodcast Please rate and review this podcast. Send us an email with any feedback or requests: [email protected] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices