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“So one of the very, it's not engineering, but in some ways…” — The Pragmatic Engineer at 1:10:58

“So one of the very, it's not engineering, but in some ways it is, is there's Ben Horowitz wrote this hard thing about hard things book. And it's been super interesting for me because a lot of the things, Howard talks, for instance, about something called management depth, which is, you know, working with people who…”

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