“He believes what he's saying, I think. I think that's sort…” — Pod Save America at 1:49:35
“He believes what he's saying, I think. I think that's sort of one sort of takeaway from the book I hope people get is like you need to – you can have the debate like did he always believe it? Did he sort of do this out of cynicism? But he's been saying it long enough now and he's been successful in saying it that I…”
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1:52:36