The Mindset and Self-Mastery Show

“Giving up is not failure; it’s a strategic move.” In this episode, Nick speaks with Cleous Young about his journey of self-discovery, the importance of interests in life, and how giving up redundant pursuits can lead to greater fulfillment. They explore mindset shifts, the power of curiosity, and the role of legacy in personal growth. What to listen for: The role of interests in personal growth The concept of giving up and making space for new opportunities The importance of self-awareness and curiosity Legacy and the impact of life stories “Your life can be a legacy that inspires others.” Our lives are our own, yet we can serve as an example to others Legacy isn’t just what we leave behind, but HOW we leave things behind The way you lead your life may just be the reason why someone makes a change in their own life “I’ve been giving up things because in the back of my mind it’s like, hey, if you let it go, if it comes back, then it’s meant for you.” Most people think “giving up” is failure, but that’s not always the case When we let things go from our lives, they make way for new beginnings Changing our perspective on giving up can change the way we maneuver our lives About Cleous “GloWry” Young CleousYoung is an author, speaker, and advocate for personal growth, resilience, and ethical living. Through his unique philosophy and storytelling, he helps both adults and children navigate adversity, discover purpose, and cultivate values such as kindness, integrity, and nobility. Cleous shares practical life lessons and inspiring perspectives to empower people to live intentionally and make a positive impact in their communities. https://cleousyoung.com/ https://www.linkedin.com/in/cleous-glowry-young-a1856218b/ https://www.instagram.com/cleousyoung/ Resources: Interested in starting your own podcast or need help with one you already have? Learn how I can help! Learn more about our host, Nick McGowan. Thank you for listening! Please subscribe on iTunes and give us a 5-Star review! https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-mindset-and-self-mastery-show/id1604262089 Listen to other episodes here: Click Here To View The Episode Transcript Watch Clips and highlights: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCk1tCM7KTe3hrq_-UAa6GHA Guest Inquiries right here: [email protected] Your Friends at “The Mindset & Self-Mastery Show” Click Here To View The Episode Transcript Nick McGowan (00:02.126)Hello and welcome to the Mindset Self Mastery Show. I’m your host, Nick McGowan. Today on the show we have Cleus Young. Cleus, how are you doing today? Cleous GloWry Young (00:12.487)Hey, I’m doing good, good, good. Very good today. Yeah. And you? Nick McGowan (00:17.198)Awesome. My man, I’m excited that you’re here. I’m good. I’m really good. You know, I maybe I can add a few more goods like you did. I appreciate when somebody gives a real answer or when they like, actually when they’re like, I’m good. I’m good. Yeah, I’m good. I’m good. Instead of somebody be like, how are you? I’m shit. This is awful. Fuck. Why did I wake up this morning? That’s a totally different feeling. So Cleous GloWry Young (00:21.957)Okay. Cleous GloWry Young (00:38.447)Yeah. No, I had an event yesterday and it’s a little unique event and it went tremendously well. So it’s like the residual from yesterday is still hanging on today. So it’s like, yeah, woke up feeling good. But then I thought about the event and the outcome and it was like, hey, add some more goods to that. Yeah. Nick McGowan (00:52.632)Yeah. Nick McGowan (01:02.924)Yeah, cool. I love that riding on a high in a sense. That’s also part of what this show is about. We talk about mindset, self mastery and transformation and being able to understand that some days are gonna be great because you’re riding a high. Some days you might be grieving because of the thing that happened the day before. And there’s stuff to get into all of that. So why don’t you kick us off? Why don’t you tell us what you do for a living and what’s one thing most people don’t know about you that’s maybe a little odd or bizarre. Cleous GloWry Young (01:06.194)Yeah. Cleous GloWry Young (01:19.379)yeah. Cleous GloWry Young (01:29.371)So I work in the community. I have a nonprofit and one of the things that we actually particularly specialize in is helping people figuring out things. For me, that’s what I had to do for my own life. So even now I have this context, it’s called transfiguration, where it’s like saying trans, right? Moving from one place to another. And then figuration is that comp. concept of what you would say figure things out, right? So for me for the last say past eight years, I’ve been figuring out things for my own self, not what I’ve been taught, what I’ve been given. And for me, it’s like, hey, this is what I now find applicable that whatever I did for myself, I can also do for somebody else. Perfect example, I hosted an event around trauma and this Three generations of women came to that event, grandma, mom, and daughter, and it’s like they were treating themselves a certain way growing up, right? And it was until they came to the event and they started to figure out that, you know what? This has been a trauma pattern in our life, generation after generation. And it just allowed them to now systematically put different things in place and started to actually move forward. So for me, this is what I do on a day-to-day basis. The one weird thing about me that most people would never understand, like yesterday at the event, people will see me out here doing all these things, but they would never understand that there’s a saying that says never give up, right? I’m somebody who have given up so many times. And it’s interesting, and I didn’t give up because it’s hard. I gave up because it’s redundant. Like I get up every day, I’m seeing the same old thing over and over again. And it’s like, even when you look at self-master, right? So I used to teach. And when I was teaching, it’s like, hey, the students are doing well. And it’s like, when I look at my life, I’m like, whoa, I’m not doing well. They’re doing well. And what I end up doing, I just give up teaching. Like. Cleous GloWry Young (03:52.923)It wasn’t hard. The students are doing well. Like even one of those set of students that I taught, they got the highest score in the entire school in the math. The entire score on what is called the PSSA. Right? That means they’re doing well. Was teaching hard? No. But it just became redundant that I went to school every day doing the same thing over and over again. And I just got up and I just gave up. So continually, I keep giving up. Nick McGowan (04:18.99)Hmph. Cleous GloWry Young (04:23.141)I know the saying that says, don’t give up on your dreams. But for me, I just give things up. And know, you know what’s so funny? I’ve given up so many times and then something else just comes in my way to start a whole new journey. And it’s like, I guess you’re not supposed to finish right here because I’m thinking that, hey, I’m done. Nick McGowan (04:41.44)Yeah. Cleous GloWry Young (04:44.123)And I’m telling you, it’s not because it’s hard. None of the things that I’ve ever done has been hard. It’s just becomes redundant. It’s like you get up every day, you’re doing the same thing. And it’s like you’re looking at the results of the community and it’s like it’s not getting better. And people are putting on this facade that, things are better. No, look at the numbers, look at the killing, look at the violence. It’s like, so at one point I just gave up. And I remember the last time I gave up. Nick McGowan (04:58.318)Mm. Cleous GloWry Young (05:13.105)July 28, 2016. Like this time I just called my mom, Like I just finished school. Two months ago I graduated. Magna cum laude, right? And then two months after I was like, I called my mom and said to my mom, mom, I can’t do this anymore, man. And it was because of the stuff that I learned in school. Like when I tell you it was so redundant, we’re sitting out here trying to do these things, right? Nick McGowan (05:30.894)you Cleous GloWry Young (05:39.092)And it’s like somebody sitting in the background making it hard for us. So when I started to learn certain things about psychology, I was like, wow, I’m just out here wasting my time. So July 28, 2016, I called my mom and I said to my mom, hey, I’m done with this community work. And then I went into behavioral therapist. Funny enough, right? Nick McGowan (05:49.262)You Cleous GloWry Young (06:03.431)So I’m working with students now in the classroom, right? Helping them with their behavior problem. I’m like, hey, I’m done with the community. Let me just find a population that I know that I’m gonna work with on a day-to-day basis. So I’m in the school now and day by day I’m working with the students, right? And then I look around, I’m like, why is everything academic here? Like, don’t they have anything social context around here? And I kid you not, I sat down and I designed this. Look how funny it is. This is what I actually designed. You see that? It says, be the ant. And I was like, something like this need to be in a classroom where they come and they can see that life is more than just academic. Again, I was coming from a teacher, right? And when you told me as a student, you got an A, I’m not impressed. Because I know the ins and outs of getting an A. It’s nothing difficult. You come to school, pay attention, do your work, participate, you get the A. Nick McGowan (06:35.192)Mm-hmm. Nick McGowan (06:46.669)Yeah. Cleous GloWry Young (07:02.129)So when I looked at it, I was like, wow, I’m in here as behavioral therapist helping someone with their behavior. I’m now looking at it from an academic standpoint. Now, like not from teaching, but from a behavior standpoint. And I’m like, why everything in the classroom is so academic? And I sat down and this was the poster that I actually designed. And that literally led me to start looking to go back into community where I just gave up. Nick McGowan (07:24.558)Thanks. Cleous GloWry Young (07:30.011)So that is something that most people don’t know about me. It’s like, Clay C Oatley, you’re doing all these great things. But they would never realize that I’ve given up so many times, not because it’s actually saying hard, because of the redundancy that I keep seeing in the… Nick McGowan (07:46.99)Even just the fact that you consider it giving up and the things are redundant and really the story that you’re telling and how that all worked. You’re making these little shifts and pivots, et cetera. One of the things that I love to nerd out about in my life and obviously here on the show is to take those moments. Like this is sort of a safe space in a sense. We can talk about the craziness and the stuff that’s happened, but this is like a lab where we get to go, well, what actually happened there? Like, what did you do? How does that work? How do we implement it? What changes did we make? Or just watch the damn movie in a sense and go, wow, that was really cool. So I think that’s some of the fun part of living because that’s where we actually get to do the work. Like when you’re in those moments, when that thing comes up and you go, wait a minute, everything’s redundant. This is not what I want to do anymore. You’re kind of still reacting or responding to the situation. And then from there, you really have to rely on the fucking work you’ve done in the past. Cleous GloWry Young (08:20.435)Mmm. Nick McGowan (08:44.846)like these little moments to go, all right, what do we do now? I think of it almost like you’ll have an issue or something that happens and you go, all right, well, that didn’t work out the way I wanted it to. What do I do? Some people will kind of watch their game tape in a sense. Other people will go, I don’t want to go anywhere near it. Like that wasn’t a thing I wanted to do or whatever. And then they run past. So when you talk about giving up, I want us to dive into that a bit because really there are people that have their own businesses. Cleous GloWry Young (09:08.605)Mm-hmm. Nick McGowan (09:14.646)or there are people that are working for a company or they’ve been in a marriage or a relationship or a system for so long, be it a family system, the whole fucking systems that we’re part of, capitalism and everything else. And they’re starting to look at that and go, and well, shit, I wanna give up, but it’s not really giving up like from the interpretation that you could have right off the bat. I can almost guarantee somebody listened to you say, I give up a bunch. Cleous GloWry Young (09:20.211)don’t wanna. Cleous GloWry Young (09:33.139)I need to give up. Nick McGowan (09:43.266)And then what you say where they’re like, well, that’s not really giving up. That’s like giving into where you should be going. And when I think of giving up, could mean this or that or whatever. When people give things up from a negative perspective, because it was like, it was a hard thing to do or didn’t work for them. I think there are some times where we can look at that and go, fuck man, I gave up. Or yeah, you’re damn right. I gave up on this thing. Instead of saying, I moved that out of the way so I can go do these other things. So breaking down that moment, even 2016 or something that happened as of late of like, all right, well, if you give something up, that’s a big choice that you’re making to say, I’m actually removing this because of all the work that happened underneath. So let’s break that apart a little bit. When you give something up, what’s sort of the, I don’t know. Cleous GloWry Young (10:31.61)much. Nick McGowan (10:40.502)not like the framework or like what the fuck process do you do? But if you really think about it, what are you doing in those moments? Because you feel something, you see something, and then you’re making an actual decision to go, moving you because I’m expecting something else to come along. Or am I off from that? Cleous GloWry Young (10:58.895)So a part of it is going to my interest, which is something that I started to pay attention to. Like, what is it that I’m really interested in? And I think you also hit a nail on the head. It’s like, hey, it has come to a point where it’s it stopped. So I remember going into teaching, it’s like, hey, I was promised all these things. And when I looked at it, it was like, hey, these things are not being fulfilled of what I was promised. So it’s like, hey, you know what? I’m going away. So a part of it was looking at it and saying, hey, these are the things that I’m interested in, but those interests are not being met. So it’s like, hey, I’m going to give this up. Why? Because it’s like, I don’t know, for me, my mindset is set on this. So I grew up in a culture where they say if you love somebody, right, let them go. If they come back, then they were meant for you. So that’s my mindset that, when I give up things, it’s like I have this program in me that says, hey, if it comes back, then it was meant for me. If it doesn’t, then let me look for the next thing. Funny enough, even with my, I’m an author. The first book that I wrote, this was 26 years ago. Even that, I let that go and moved on and actually wrote on different books. I’m up to my 10th book now, right? But what came back actually now was my first book, which I just republished and launched last week. So 26 years later, it came back to me and it’s like, lately I’ve been sitting down and I’ve been paying attention and it’s like, okay, this must have been meant for me because it’s no way that I let it go 26 years ago. And then now it’s now back in my life, like showing me the reality of what I needed to do. to the point now I started to concentrate just on this concept for the last couple of months where I’m like, hey, I got this published now, right? So a part of me is like having your mindset where it’s like, hey, yeah, I’m giving this up, but it’s not giving it up because it’s hard. It’s like, where’s the interest in it for me? Yes, I’m doing these things. I’m doing a great job as a teacher. But again, even when you look at the poster that I created, right? I was in the classroom. Nick McGowan (12:54.062)Hmm. Nick McGowan (13:03.246)Yeah. Cleous GloWry Young (13:23.183)I’m doing a behavioral therapist work, but then I looked at it as like, where’s my interest? So my interest is not being fulfilled here. And it’s almost like when I started to understand these things now, it’s like, hey, you got a bigger calling on your life. And it’s based on the things that you’re interested in. And then here’s a key component that I never understood until now, right? The reason, so I’m Jamaican. Nick McGowan (13:29.016)Mm-hmm. Nick McGowan (13:40.896)Yeah. Cleous GloWry Young (13:52.678)I came here to live in America, say 31 years ago, right? When I came here, my interest was playing soccer, which is called football. Very, very good at playing soccer, right? In high school, very, very good. I wanted to be the next Pelley. At one point, I sat down and I looked at it and I said to myself, what would life be like? to become the next Pele. And when I looked at that, I was like, wow, that’s not something that I’m interested in. And what I did that moment, I gave it up. So when you ask that question, now what I’ve been doing over the years is paying attention to the things that I’m giving up and realizing that it’s not that, it’s not hard. It’s just that my interest is no longer in these things. And it’s like I’m searching for something greater Nick McGowan (14:32.878)Yeah. Cleous GloWry Young (14:50.683)And the greater can’t come until I give those little things up. And as a soccer player in high school, where it’s like, I even started to sign autograph because people thought that I was going to be this big time player. So there’s this big future waiting for me. And I looked at it and I’m like, hey, I’m not interested in that. Like the lifestyle of being a celebrity, kicking a ball in a goal. And it’s like, at that moment, I was like, no, I don’t want that. I want something more meaningful. I never knew what meaningful meant to me at that particular moment, but I know that being a soccer player, a celebrity, that wasn’t meaningful for me. So I gave it up and I started to look for something more meaningful that has interest in it for me. And the more I kept on going. when I look at my path, I became a teacher, was very good. But it’s like, hey, this is not meaningful. This is not interesting to me. I gave it up. I became a behavioral therapist. Same thing. Nick McGowan (15:31.822)you Nick McGowan (15:50.104)Thank Cleous GloWry Young (15:51.676)So all these years what I’ve been doing, I’ve been giving up things because in the back of my mind it’s like, hey, if you let it go, if it comes back, then it’s meant for you. If it’s not coming back, then the next step now is to search for something greater. And that’s what I’ve been doing, just searching, searching for something greater, right? And it was eight years ago. that I found what I’ve been looking for for the last 26 years. And it has piqued my interest in such a way that it it drives me on a day-to-day basis to say that, hey, this is what I was looking for. I never knew it 26 years ago when I said, hey, I don’t want soccer, right? But I knew that I was looking for something that was meaningful, that intrigues my interest. And it’s like, hey, this is what actually led to now. Nick McGowan (16:23.053)Hmm. Nick McGowan (16:37.934)Sure. Cleous GloWry Young (16:49.267)Eight years ago, I had this breakdown, which they would call depression. And something just came in my spirit and said, hey, look at what is called the black box of an airplane. And while it came in my spirit to look at that, it gave me the instructions of what to do. When I did that, I moved from what is called mental depression to mental aviation. And that alone piqued my interest to say that, wow, I was depressed a few weeks ago, right? And then now I followed this methodology around this blockbusters thing that just virtually came to me, right? As a revelation. And then here’s it that I’m on a whole nother level of thinking now. And that piqued my interest. from eight years ago, I’ve been into this concept of understanding what is called the aviation industry. And I’ve never. Nick McGowan (17:22.509)Mm-hmm. Cleous GloWry Young (17:45.936)never had an interest in saying, hey, let me give up. Because there’s always something that’s making me look at it and say, wow, I need to learn this. This is gonna make me greater. And the more I learned it now, now, going back to the first question that you asked, it’s like looking at it and saying that, hey, this is how I now make a difference in someone else’s life. I use the aviation platform to help them to understand and figure things out now. Nick McGowan (17:56.536)Yeah. Cleous GloWry Young (18:14.491)so they can get to their destination. Nick McGowan (18:17.998)I think the fact that you talk about interests and asking yourself the like, what’s actually interesting to me and being able to see the self awareness of, well, this is redundant or I don’t want to do these things anymore. The thing that I like to be able to take from whatever we talk about on the show myself or with other people is for somebody to be able to go, right, well, what’s actually going on in my life? What do I get from this? Like, what do I do in my business or my relationships or what have you? And I think the interest is a big thing that a lot of us are really pushed away from because of the systems that we have to deal with. Society here in the States tells us you need to go to school, you need to get a job, you need to have a family, you need to do these things and blah, blah. That’s changing. That actually changed back in like the 90s, but it’s taken now our generation to be able to understand like time out, we need to do things differently. And the context of where things are with technology and just Cleous GloWry Young (19:00.403)Butch. Cleous GloWry Young (19:06.323)Mm-hmm. Nick McGowan (19:16.448)life in general and all of that. But the interest, it’s a through line for all of our lives that if we look back at what are the things that are interesting to us or what are the things that drive me, I think sometimes we get lost when people ask like, what gives you passion to wake up in the morning and people are like, well, I hate my job, but I really like the money it pays me. So fucking I guess that thing. And I think the big thing that we’re looking at here is like going deeper to that to go, wait a minute, if I pause for a second. and I understand what actually moves me a bit, we can then actually take steps from there. You pointed out with being a soccer player, I had a similar, not similar in a sense, or I wasn’t signing autographs and stuff like that, but I wanted to be a rock star when I was in high school. And I remember thinking like, I’m not gonna do anything else, fuck you guys, fuck your school, I’m gonna go be a rock star, blah, blah, blah. And I remember being probably 18 and registering, I don’t know if I wanna be on tour constantly. Cleous GloWry Young (20:02.099)Hmm Nick McGowan (20:16.334)but I didn’t talk to anybody about it. And I was into all types of drugs. And honestly, if I went on tour, I probably would have been dead within six months. But I remember thinking, I don’t know if I really want to do that. And a couple of years later, actually really diving into that and going, I like traveling, but I don’t want to sleep on a fucking amp. I don’t want to sleep on a bus. I don’t want to do this. I don’t want to do that. And I think the point that I’m making with that is no matter what situation we’re in right now, Cleous GloWry Young (20:23.235)Thank Cleous GloWry Young (20:34.717)playing. Nick McGowan (20:44.866)business, relationship, whatever it is. To take sort of a pros and cons list as one thing, but to understand what actually fuels you, then actually helps us to understand what’s pulling us from the situation. Like you still wanted to teach, but you were being called to do something else, where it wasn’t a major detriment to what you were doing, but it just wasn’t the right vehicle. Like get out of that and jump into something else. And I don’t want people to take from this to go, yeah, all right, well, fuck it, I’m telling that woman tonight, we’re getting a divorce, or I’m telling my boss, he can eat shit right now. Like, that’s not it at all, but being able to understand why do we feel movement inside of us? So when you feel that movement, when you start to feel like there’s something else there, what sort of advice do you give somebody that’s like, I feel there’s something in there, at least like starting to percolate a bit? what advice would you give them to be able to actually move that onto the next path in a healthy way and not just like, I’m gonna burn the whole place down. Cleous GloWry Young (21:44.924)So it starts paying attention to your, and it’s funny that you mentioned these things earlier, that society says, hey, go to school, go get this job. So it’s like, what you look at is like, hey, these are not the things that I’m really interested in. It’s what society has given to me. So what society has given to us, it’s like, hey, my goodness, this is what I’m gonna formulate into. And I’m gonna formulate into somebody that I’m not interested in. So when you look at it now and it’s like, hey, these little things begin to peek inside of you, it’s like, stop and pay attention. Like, pay attention to these little feelings that you’re having inside because this is where everything starts. Yes, you have the money, but if you feel like, wow, I don’t feel like myself, then pay attention to that because it’s like, how do you have all this money but you don’t feel like yourself? Nick McGowan (22:16.526)Mm-hmm. Cleous GloWry Young (22:44.175)Again, going back to what society has given to us, society has given, and I learned this from psychology, that they have given us what they wanted us to formulate into. So society, if you go to the library, what’s the norm that you have to do? You have to be quiet. Why? Because that’s the norm. If you go to the bar, then you start to rile up. What happened is that society has given us all these norms that they want us to participate in, right? And at that moment, it may not be the things that we’re interested in. People are interested in, no matter who you are, you’re interested in getting love. No matter who you are, you’re interested in getting support. No matter who you are, you need some type of interest in someone attending to what is it that you want to do in life. So when we look at it, it’s like society just says, hey, go do this and get this, right? And you get it. And when you look at it, it’s like you’re not fulfilled. Why? Because your interest is never there. They just told you, go do this and you did it. Just like me, I never understood this, but I grew up in Jamaica and soccer was the predominant thing for our culture. So it’s not like I had any other choice to be interested in something else. It’s like, hey, soccer was always around me. So that’s what I became interested in. When I came to America now, when I sat down, it’s like, yeah, I’m playing soccer. I’m doing well, right? But it’s like something inside of me is like, hey, this is it. So when it started to come now, I started to sit down and I’m like, all right. Nick McGowan (24:21.816)Yeah. Cleous GloWry Young (24:24.883)what’s going on? Then I’m like, all right, what is it gonna be for me to be like the famous soccer player like Pelley? And when I envisioned that and I saw it and I’m like, hey, you have this wealth, you’re popular, you’re famous, all of this. It’s like, hey, that’s not me, that’s not what I want, that’s not what I’m interested in. And I sat down and I was like, hey, I want to do something more meaningful out of life. And that little thing that just came about, I just started to pay attention to it now. What is more meaningful? What is more meaningful? That’s when you started now writing more. Because I started to look at that’s more meaningful than just playing football. It’s like a master now writing. And he’s like, but that’s not it. Let me go into teaching. And I now went into that and it’s like, hey. Nick McGowan (24:51.566)Hmm. Nick McGowan (25:06.402)Yeah. Nick McGowan (25:14.872)Yeah. Cleous GloWry Young (25:17.883)It’s not it. So it’s like when you have these little things and it took me 26 years to find my interest, but it’s like, hey, when you have this little thing inside of you, it’s like start to pay attention to it. And that’s what I could give anyone as good advice. Pay attention to those little things because it will lead to something greater later on. Nick McGowan (25:39.554)Yeah, I mean, the fact that we all notice things. Obviously I only know my own reality and you only know your own reality and whatever we spew to each other. But all the conversations I have with people, the mentoring or the coaching I get or coaching I give or any of that stuff, or even people here on the show, it’s like, we hear different things and we feel different things. And there are times where Cleous GloWry Young (25:49.779)Mm-hmm. Nick McGowan (26:07.598)If we had to put an action to it, we basically go, fuck you, I see you, and just turn the other way and run, like, because we don’t want to deal with it. And I always like to ask again, and like the times when I do think of it, I’m aware of it, I’ll grab it like it’s an intruder in my house. Like you’re not going anywhere. I’m not going to let you leave. Let’s figure out why you’re here and what do we do with it. And I don’t think people need to be that intense with it. And I’ve actually calmed down a little bit because the first… Little while I did that, it was too much where I’d be fucked up for like a day or so, because I’m like working on this thing. But if we are aware of those things and it keeps coming back, do something with it. If you have to have a conversation with somebody and it’s tough, sometimes it’s just a matter of saying, I don’t know how to talk about this, but I feel I need to because it keeps coming back. I think that’s a big thing that you’re pointing out of like, I saw that I was interested in these things. I did these things and then I realized like that’s a step onto the next path and not in like a cheesy leadershipy sort of way like this is a step to success but like you do a thing and go, cool, this is in the end all be all. I feel like this is a part to what happens next but because of that, you’ve made those other decisions that have led to that sort of stuff and I think sometimes like the mindset portion of this is that people will get stuck and like today sucks, sure. Cleous GloWry Young (27:09.01)Mm-hmm. Nick McGowan (27:33.282)Today may suck and like this week or this season or whatever. But for those people that are saying, look, I’m struggling. I can understand that I need to be aware of these things and work through it specifically for the people that are trying to figure out their own version of self mastery. What advice do you give to them? Cleous GloWry Young (27:51.316)So, you know, as I said, 26 years ago, I had this inclination inside of me, right? That I want to do something more meaningful out of life. And I look at that now and I can see it, that has been my, what you would say, compass. So even though I gave up teaching, even though I gave up being a behavioral therapist, even though I gave up soccer and stuff like that, The context was that hey, I had something in the background that was my compass. So no matter what I gave up, it’s like something was still guiding me on that path until I found it now 26 years later. So when you’re on this self-mastery, now I look back, right? And everything that I’ve done, I’ve said thank you because I needed to do it. I needed to give up that teaching otherwise I wouldn’t have been here and I don’t look at it and say that was a bad experience. No. Even when I went through the depression I was blaming some friends. When I sat back and started to look now and it’s like hey this is beyond my friends right? This goes back to my childhood. And when I started to look at that now before I was blaming my friends and like hey they did these things behind my back and Now that I found out I was so old, like I went into a state of now I was high. And then now I went into a low state because I found out that like one of my business partners did this thing behind my back, right? And that’s what led me to this depressional state. But when I looked at it now and started to peel back certain things and go back, it was like, wow, you know what? Thank you. Because if you never did that, then what happened, this black box revelation wouldn’t even come in my journey. Now I’m having this interest in this black box theory, right? So when I look back at it now, I just go back and I’m like, wow, you know, it was bad. Yeah, the depression was bad. But guess what? It was needed. You know, I gave up teaching, but guess what? It was needed. You know, I gave up being a behavioral. All of these steps that I’ve done in the last 26 years, they were needed. Nick McGowan (29:42.478)Yeah. Cleous GloWry Young (30:00.948)Even though at that time they were painful and whatever. But going back to 26 years ago, I had this one little thing inside of me that says, hey, this is the compass. You need something more meaningful out of life. And that became a mindset and it just guided me to where I’m at right now. So anyone that’s looking for like a self mastery stuff like even for me now, yeah. I found my interest but it’s like now I’m working on how do I master it. But I set a vision from 26 years ago that says, this is what I want. I want something more meaningful. And all these things for me was just a trial and error. that’s why I said it wasn’t hard for me to give it up because it was like, hey, this is not what I want. Why am I saying that? Because I know that Nick McGowan (30:30.702)Yeah Cleous GloWry Young (30:51.635)A couple years ago, I said I wanted something more meaningful and when I look at the equation of what I was getting, I was like, this is not meaningful. All right, let me let that go and get to somewhere else. And all of that now I started to know what is called, so I learned about this and going back to this, you remember I said about interest. Now talking to someone from a financial standpoint, right? We talk about what is called compounding interest. And compounding interest is when you make an investment and that starts to compound. The interest starts to compound and it gives you more. So for me, it’s like I started to look at it. I’m like, wow, 26 years ago, everything that I did, it was like a compounding result to get me to this what is called a compound interest. It’s like I made an investment 26 years ago and now I’m seeing the results of all the things. And yes, I didn’t get the results when I was a teacher. Nick McGowan (31:40.172)Hmm. Cleous GloWry Young (31:49.01)I didn’t get the results when I was a soccer All these things I didn’t get the results, right? But it was what is called a compounding effect So the things that I did here, the things that I did there Everything was needed to the point of where am I today? And I know people don’t say this like, my life is perfect And that’s to them For me I could say my life is perfect Why? Because even with the downs, the ups, the left, the right Nick McGowan (31:49.07)you Nick McGowan (31:58.038)Yeah. Nick McGowan (32:08.782)the Cleous GloWry Young (32:17.957)I set out 26 years ago to accumulate something in my life and that’s where I’m at now. Like, perfectly. I’m not one mile off or one decision off. I’m perfect to where I said, hey, this is what I wanted 26 years ago. So it’s like life is perfect. Do I have everything that I need? No. Do I always get everything that I need? No. But guess what? 26 years ago when I said I wanted my life to be meaningful, Nick McGowan (32:33.741)Hmm. Cleous GloWry Young (32:46.771)My life is meaningful today and not only can I figure things out for myself, I help others to figure things out for themselves. And to me, that is what my meaningfulness is all about. How could I make my life better for somebody else? When I look back at soccer, I was like, hey, when I become a celebrity, that’s me. When I make all this money, that’s me. That’s not meaningful to me. I want my life to be relevant to somebody else. Nick McGowan (33:03.49)Yeah. Nick McGowan (33:08.332)Hmm. Cleous GloWry Young (33:15.793)and that’s what I’ve done in the last 26 years. So anyone that’s out there that’s looking for self-mastery, it’s a journey of up, it’s a journey of down, it’s a journey of left. You’re going to cry, you’re going to feel like giving up all of that, but it’s all a part of the process. And I wish I had someone there that could actually give me these advice. Akhiles, when you’re going through that hard times, right? Nick McGowan (33:29.508)Thank Cleous GloWry Young (33:42.844)is not to think about, this is the end of your story. But that’s what’s needed for you to go to the next chapter. And chapter by chapter, your life is like a book in this world. Chapter one, you start out with this. Chapter two, and by the time you finish your life in this, you’re supposed to complete a book. Why? Because that book is gonna be given to somebody else now. So your life is gone. Nick McGowan (33:50.929)Yeah. Cleous GloWry Young (34:09.341)but that book can now be given to somebody else and said, hey, this is what Cleos did. And it made a significant difference for him. You can read this book now about his life. And then now you have some type of path that you can actually go on to discover your path and begin to figure things out. And for me, that’s what I could tell anyone. Nick McGowan (34:32.617)Yeah, what a great way to put that too, especially to think of the legacy component of that. Even if it’s not an actual physical book or digital book or what have you, there’s still lessons and things that I think people that are within our circles see and take from us, even if we’re not freely giving it out, we’re just being who we are. And for us to be able to be aware of that to go, this thing feels off to me, or it feels right to me, or I’ve noticed this, like, I hope that somebody listens to this and goes, damn, I keep hearing these things and now I’m hearing a podcast episode about it. Like there’s something to it, you know, like great, go do something with it. Like here’s your chance, you know? So Cletus, man, I really appreciate you being here today. Before I let you go, where can people find you and where can they connect with you? Cleous GloWry Young (35:04.733)So, Cleous GloWry Young (35:18.353)So I’m on the different social medias. They can go on either say LinkedIn or what is called Facebook or Instagram or TikTok. And you can find me there under my name, Cleus Young or the Airport Adventure or the Mountain of Miracles. Those are things that are used to actually identify me. I’m currently in Philadelphia, but I travel with different. go to different places and stuff like that. So if people are interested in me coming out, I could come to the different locations as well. But Philadelphia is my base and it’s been a journey here. Even that, it’s like learning about who I am in this city called Philadelphia. Like learning how to master yourself in Philadelphia. So anyone that’s interested, if they’re in the Philadelphia area, I do monthly events here. They can reach out to me. through any one of the social medias. You want to contact information as well, like phone number. Cleous GloWry Young (36:26.383)Okay. Yeah. So, and then just to what you just said about the book, right? You know, the Bible is a book. The Bhagavad Gita is a book. The Quran is a book. These are all stories that are put together to show that, this is what others have done. You can learn from it. And it’s like for me, that’s all my life is. It’s like… Yeah, I write books, but I also want my life to be that book that somebody can open up afterwards when I’m gone. And it’s like, hey, this is what I could learn from this person who was here once ago. So that’s life. And to me, that’s what meaning is. Not only when you’re on here on Earth, but when you leave and you go, you can still have meaning here to somebody who is gonna take a new path to life. Nick McGowan (37:20.28)Yeah. Awesome, man. I appreciate you being on today. Thank you so much for your time today. Cleous GloWry Young (37:24.973)And thank you for having me.

“Everything that we do has some sort of creative flair to it no matter what—because it’s really our flair to it.” In this episode, Nick delves into the concept of creativity, exploring its presence in everyday life beyond traditional artistic expressions. He shares personal anecdotes about his journey with music and the creative process, emphasizing that creativity can manifest in problem-solving and interactions with others. Nick encourages listeners to embrace their creativity, trust themselves, and find innovative solutions in various aspects of life, even when faced with challenges. What to listen for: Creativity exists in everyone, not just artists Problem-solving is a form of creativity Creativity can be expressed in everyday interactions Trusting oneself is key to unlocking creativity Creativity can help navigate life’s challenges Small acts of creativity can have a big impact Overcoming setbacks can lead to new creative opportunities Creativity is not limited to one medium Everyone has the potential to be creative in their own way “Creativity isn’t just one medium. In fact, it’s not a medium at all.” Creativity shows up in everyday life, not just in art It’s how you think, not just what you make Problem-solving is a form of creativity You don’t need fancy tools to be creative Real creativity isn’t limited to one form or field “If you find yourself saying, ‘I don’t feel like I can do this,’ that’s a great opportunity to be creative and ask why.” Feeling stuck is a chance to get curious Doubt can lead to creative breakthroughs Ask what’s really holding you back “Why?” opens the door to new solutions Resilience grows when you think creatively About Nick McGowan I’m Nick McGowan, entrepreneur, podcaster, and mental health advocate, and I’ve been on a 20+ year journey of personal development, learning to master my mindset, emotions, and the art of living with purpose. As a Mindset and Self-Mastery Mentor, I work with ambitious men and women who want to live their most authentic and joyous life, by helping them master their mindset, emotional awareness, and authentic communication. My mission is to empower people to lead lives that feel aligned, grounded, and truly their own. Throughout my career, I’ve built teams, streamlined systems, and improved client experiences across SaaS, media, marketing, and personal development spaces. Whether I’m leading cross-functional projects, optimizing SEO, Podcasting, designing strategies, or guiding clients through transformation, I bring a hands-on, solution-focused approach to everything I do. I’m also the host of The Mindset and Self-Mastery Show, where my guests and I unpack the stories that shape us, challenge us, and ultimately guide us back to who we are at our core. On this show, we uncover the secret gems others have discovered through trial, error, and breakthroughs so you can fast-track your growth, and master your mindset on your pursuit toward self-mastery. Check out the latest episode here. With years of podcasting and two decades of marketing experience, I’ve mastered the storytelling, interview flow, strategy, and technical production that elevate a podcast from “just content” to something truly impactful. Whether you’re a leader looking to amplify your message, or a seasoned speaker and podcast host looking to sharpen your edge or even a beginner who is wondering how to share their message, I mentor thought leaders through every step of having the conversation they’re here to have on this planet. So, what message are you here to share?! So, what message are you here to share?! https://nickmcgowan.com/ https://www.linkedin.com/in/thenickmcgowan/ Resources: Interested in starting your own podcast or need help with one you already have? https://themindsetandselfmasteryshow.com/podcasting-services/ Thank you for listening! Please subscribe on iTunes and give us a 5-Star review! https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-mindset-and-self-mastery-show/id1604262089 Listen to other episodes here: https://themindsetandselfmasteryshow.com/ Watch Clips and highlights: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCk1tCM7KTe3hrq_-UAa6GHA Guest Inquiries right here: [email protected] Your Friends at “The Mindset & Self-Mastery Show” Click Here To View The Episode Transcript Nick McGowan  (00:01.743) Hello and welcome to the Mindset and Self Mastery Show. I’m your host, Nick McGowan  McGowan, and today I want to talk about creativity. Now it’s been a little bit since I’ve done a solo episode and I was talking to some of you the other day and telling them that with a lot of the solo episodes I kind of just go along with what is driving me, kind of using my sacral in the sense like, oh, I want to talk about this or I want to talk about that. And I knew that I wanted to do some solo episodes. We’re traveling this summer. So I want to do some more of them while we’re out traveling and be able to talk about different things that are going on, etc. But one of the main things that’s really been floating around in my head for probably my entire life, but a lot recently has been creativity and how creative we are or how creative we aren’t. Nick McGowan  (01:03.19) I’ve had different people on the show that have talked about creativity. There was an episode, I think episode number 20, with a friend of mine, friend at this point, Joe, who has been creative in so many different ways. And we talked about kind of that bone that everybody has of being creative. There’s some people I’ve talked to in life that have told me, I’m not creative. Like I am the furthest thing from creative. And when I ask them, or we get even deeper into like, what do you think creativity is? It turns to some direction of art. Like they can’t sketch or paint. So therefore they think they’re not creative. But in the way that they handle problems, the way that they move through life, they are super creative. And that’s what I want to talk about. That creativity in which everything that we do It has some sort of creative flair to it no matter what because it’s really our flair to it. I think if we look at something that has a very systematic process you do this thing then this happens and then that happens after that and then you get this result every single time like a factory in a sense. That’s not real creative however it took creativity to be able to actually get to that point. Somebody had to go wait a minute This all sucks. All these bottles keep dropping off the floor or falling off this thing or whatever and we’re losing money and blah blah blah blah. Somebody had to be creative at that point. Even if it was somebody a hundred years ago that said, have an idea to be able to change this a bit. Like Henry Ford even. People go, I want to change this and how we do things. And then other people have taken that from there. You can be creative in those sort of ways. You can be creative in really, really small ways, like in how you say something back to somebody, how you respond to a situation, how you’d react to some news and what you do with it from there. There’s creativity in that. Now we can call it different things, especially in those little sections of our lives. But when you think about being creative, I know for myself, I’ve stunted that at different times. Nick McGowan  (03:13.516) a lot. I have been working on music since I was probably, I don’t know, 12, 13, like really actually working on music. was banging on pots and pans and dancing around with the washer and dryer as a little kid and making up my own little music. So I’ve always had that creativity to it. But music for me is one of those outlets that I can… get different feelings, emotions, can process things through, can even just literally put my head down and work on mapping out drum parts for hours. and forget to eat, you know? I know there are tendencies with ADHD and things of that sort that we can look at with a flow state, but that is where that flow state comes into play for me. I don’t believe I have ADHD and I hold nothing against anybody that’s neurodivergent. I love having people on the show to talk about that because those are additional things to work with and work through. It’s like having different tools, resources, some things that can be limitations, but it’s creativity. and how we use it and what we do with those things. So over the past, I’d say few years, I’ve been working on writing music. In 2020, I think when COVID hit, I really started to actually buckle back down because years before that, I was in different bands. played in front of thousands of people a week for the churches that I played in and… different groups that I went out with to different bars and venues and studio sessions and all that. And I took a step aside from that to be able to go get married, start a business and do the thing that I think I needed to do, which was live a life, make money, kind of that white picket fence sort of dream in a sense that actually doesn’t actually make sense to me. Nick McGowan  (05:09.416) And it’s something that I thought I needed to do because this is how we live in this society. And I started to really push my creativity to the side. So 2020 came around. I got deeper into it. I had a friend of mine helped me out with some software and some new stuff that was coming out because honestly it been years since I’d really touched any of those things and started to work on it. And I can listen back to those first initial jams and they were terrible, terrible. I think a couple of them were just straight mono where like everything was right down the middle, drums, bass, guitar. was just a whole smattering of crap. And a few years after that, I started to really get deeper into production and mastering and took a course, met some people and all that. So I’ve been doing these things and working on my own album for the past several years. About a month and a half ago, accidentally reformatted my hard drive that had all of my music on it. All of it was gone in an instant and once everything was gone I knew there’s nothing to come back from this. I literally reformatted it to an ISO drive, basically a Windows disk. It was like three… Terabyte Windows disk at that point, which is awful. No way to get it back. So at that moment I thought I could be really upset pissed off and do things that I’ve done in the past or be creative about this and the creativity came to me pretty quickly of like Well, I can’t actually do anything I can’t go back in time life is not an actual video game as much as we can think it is sometimes you can’t just restart and not fuck up the hard drive so I thought, I could be creative and I can be creative in the new approach that I have. And maybe this is also silver lining to be able to take some of those songs that I’ve had that I thought were close to being finished. But now I get to be able to redo them. For those of you that know me and for those of you that listen to the podcast and you’ve seen some of the different like agitation marks, ever certainly agitation. I think I cried a little bit because I reformatted my whole fucking drive. It sucked. But I also knew that I’m creative and I can figure it out. Nick McGowan  (07:25.02) and that part of the process of it was really having fun with just the process of the creativity and figuring out how do I go about this. So I screwed up that hard drive, couldn’t do anything with it and figured I have to go through and figure out all new software, redo all the songs, all this stuff. Since then I’ve gotten I’ve gotten everything together. I’ll just leave it at that. For those of you that are geeky and want to talk music with me, feel free to message me and I can share with you what software I’m using, what drums I’m using, what all the things are that I’m using. But long story short, I got it all back together and I got it to a spot where I feel pretty good about it. There are tweaks and things I need to do, especially from the production perspective of setting up my bassline, my templates, but everything’s set up to where it needs to be. I’m at a point with a new version of an old song that feels 100,000 times better. And the creative process of being able to put that together, I leaned deeply into. Because again, there was no turning back. I couldn’t undo what I did to that hard drive. I could only do something going forward. and during that time I was also going through some other situations of life that called for me to be calm, peaceful, and creative. So I’m saying these things and telling you this bit of a story. I guess one, to remind you, don’t screw up your hard drive, especially if it has a lot of important things on there, but also to understand that you can be creative in any aspect, in any situation that’s going on. It’s about leaning into those situations, but also understanding what can hold you back from that. Like I knew I could get really upset, and part of my previous way of being was really getting upset and beating myself up because I shouldn’t have done that. And now I lost everything, and what am I going to do? Nick McGowan  (09:26.697) I’m sure some of you, if not most of you, can understand what that dark hole can be like, where you can just beat yourself up and all of that. That’s unhelpful. Totally unhelpful but also feels different now because of the things I’ve done to be able to heal through that subconscious roots that I’ve had ripped out and the things that I’ve processed through to get to the point where I go well, you know I’m creative and I trust myself to be able to do this so the purpose of this episode is to be able to talk about not only creativity but taking the hits with creativity and I want to dive a little deeper into whatever you’re doing for it, whatever your life is if you’re A full-time parent and that’s your jam and that’s what you feel your purpose is if you’re in a corporate world if you’re in construction If you’re a non-profit, if you’re doing anything at all Think creatively but trust yourself to be creative in whatever it is if you can’t draw to save your life if people have told you you should write with your other foot or They tell you you can’t sing to save your life or anybody else’s life or anything like that That’s fine. That’s just not what it is for you. But if you really think about the creative process that you take in the approach that you take with your garden, or maybe with your friends, having conversations, people at work, projects. the way that you handle your house, the way that you work within any sort of situation that has any assemblance of outside of just a flow, like a factory line flow where everything’s just laid out. If you’re not creating that, you’re working within that, you still get to be creative. So this is just really a reminder that creativity isn’t just one medium. In fact, it’s not a medium at all. It’s not just sketching or drawing, painting, Nick McGowan  (11:22.945) music or anything of the sort. It’s how you interact with different situations and how you use your brain to be able to put different scenarios and situations together and the creativity in which you use to be able to do that. I’m going leave you with two things. The things that have really helped me was to remember that I am creative and also that I can trust myself to not only be creative, but to be able to figure out the situation, the solutions, all of that. Even if you can’t get to the end of it all by yourself, That’s totally fine. You’re still creative enough and resourceful enough to be able to find somebody else. And if you find that you’re getting to points where you go, well, I don’t feel like I can do this, then that’s a great opportunity to be creative and why? Why aren’t you feeling that? What do you feel is holding you back? And what is it that you actually want to do? And what is tied directly to that? Obviously I can sit here and I can just ran off a lot of different questions and pose different scenarios. But use those little benchmarks and stepping stones as ways to be able to check in with yourself, remind yourself and love yourself. No matter what you’re doing, you are creative and you can be creative. And if you need help with things, want to chat through some of this, or just want some guidance of different resources or some ways to be able to look at this and work through some subconscious blockers and just different things that are going on, feel free to reach out to me. And I really appreciate you being with me today. I hope this helps and just be creative. Just be creative. Nick McGowan  (13:02.918) And if you’re telling me, Nick McGowan, fuck you, it’s so much harder than that, I hear you, and I can understand that. My challenge to you is to just give it a shot and let me know how goes. https://youtu.be/1s8JgQ0vHkM