Hey, how's it going? This is Craig Cannon and you're listening to Y Combinators podcast. Today's episode is with Marquez Brownlee. Marquez is a YouTuber.
He has over eight million subscribers to his channel, MKBHD, where he reviews electronics, drives electric vehicles, and interviews people such as Kobe Bryant and Bill Gates. You can find Marquez on YouTube and on Twitter at MKBHD. All right, here we go. All right, Marquez Brownlee, how's it going?
Good, how are you? Doing well. So I'm curious, I've followed your channel for a while, but I definitely did not follow it in the beginning when you were reviewing software on your laptop. You've been doing it for a long time.
What would you attribute your success to on YouTube? Well, I do tech videos. So I think the obvious answer there is tech has been interesting and important for so long that just being in a tech space generally for that long has done a lot for it. The channel itself, I mean, there's plenty of other successful tech channels, but has its own unique style, has a consistent voice.
It's been me for 10 years. So I guess just if you combine all those factors, consistency plus tech staying interesting, that's mainly it. Was there any particular inflection point where it really took off? No, I get asked a lot about like, can I point to a certain video or date or month or something?
Like what happened to go from nothing to where it is now? But from to this day, I look back and it's mainly just like, you can look at charts even. It's just an upward slope from zero videos to 1,000 videos. It's obviously when you get to certain points, like the reputability of the channel becomes more significant.
So you're more likely to subscribe to a tech guy with a million subscribers talking about something you should buy than a guy with 100. So that's helped. But I feel like a consistency against major. Really?
Because I follow a couple of subreddits on weird YouTube channels. And there are people that have 1,000 videos reviewing elevators, simple boring tricks. Well, there's always going to be niche stuff, which people will get really into. But I think when something as personalized as a tech product, you want some sort of history to go on or a sort of reputation to look back on.
When phones are $1,000 now. So yeah, I think that's helped being able to have a history of stuff. And because in the beginning, you were just doing software, right? For the most part.
Free software. Yeah. And then did you start getting phones sent to you in the early days of influencer culture? I remember early days pretty well.
I started with all this laptop stuff. So the first stuff I got sent to me was laptop accessories. A mouse, a keyboard, that kind of stuff. Some paid software.
I'd get a key for $30 off of $50 software. And I didn't have that access. That was awesome. Phone stuff didn't happen so much later.
I remember the first event I ever went to was a Samsung event in New York City, where I met a YouTuber for the first time. That was probably like six years in. So it's like a lot. You were in it for a while.
I grew up getting pirated keys off of Lime wire and all that kind of stuff. Did you ever dip into that and think, man, maybe I should review Final Cut Pro on my channel. Oh, man. At one point, I definitely did a whole Hackintosh thing, which was definitely not kosher, I guess.
But Hackintosh world is a whole world. So I was curious about it and I got into it. I was never really into downloading pirated music or any of that stuff. But I could imagine that was its own world for a long time.
Yeah, because I was curious. Because as a kid, you have no money when you're starting on your channel. And I wonder if you grew up with that hacker ethos. Have you done a teardown video before or anything like that?
Really? I used to be much more into building PCs and taking them apart and upgrading them. I had a Mac that won the Tower desktop Mac, bro. The G5?
Yeah, I did. I was replacing the GPU and upgrading the RAM and all that. And I had an XPS tower. I had the same thing too.
But I guess never was really fully into the building process, as much as I was the final result. How well that finished products would work for you. But when I watch your videos now, you're pretty into the stats of it all. All those hard metrics with the products, right?
Yeah. So it attracts you in some way. Yes. I think if you take a huge step back and just look at what the videos are about, period, especially with the reviews, it's how good is this product that this company made going to work for you?
And there's a whole bunch of different ways to measure that. I'm trying to measure that. So what are those metrics? Well, I've heard you talk about it before in the context of, this is a feature that's going to maybe spark some interest.
And this is a feature that I'm going to use every day. Yeah. Like gimmick versus daily. Yeah.
Yeah, that's one way. I mean, I kind of, you can pick up a phone and use a really cool feature for two seconds. You're like, whoa, that's amazing. But when you actually buy the phone, are you going to use that feature?
I'm trying to evaluate that. There's all sorts of benchmarks and things people do. How fast is the storage? Well, obviously, if you have more demanding needs for your phone.
But a lot of it is literally just evaluating, like, is this a gimmick or is this really going to be daily driver material? One thing I was talking about on a recent podcast is how it's very hard for the market to recognize how good a product's quality is, like just that actual feel. Like when you touch an iPhone for the first time. Yeah.
And so how do you go about quantifying that when you're making a video? I mean, sometimes I see my job as a professional user. I really just have to use it. And you get the briefing, obviously, and the breakdown of all the new features and what is new versus what's not new and you can compare to things you've used before.
But at the end of the day, you actually have to use it to figure out if it's actually useful. Yeah. Yeah. There's all kinds of use cases.
They'll tell me about a new feature and they'll tell me exactly, there's some New York for you, how the ideal use case scenario, how it works well. This came up recently because I did a video with an LG phone that came out, has this feature where you wave your hand over it and do these gestures to open up apps and things like that. It's called the G8. And on the surface, this is cool.
This is future type stuff. But then you actually use it and you're like, all right. So I don't know what I have stuff on my hands. Maybe I'm cooking, but I just want to open the YouTube app real quick and search for something like, now what?
I have to still type in what I want to search. There's limits to the usefulness of that. So that for me fell in the gimmick bucket just because using it actually changed my mind. But then what about the features where you thought it was great and it didn't catch on?
Are there examples of that? Well, there's lots of examples of things that are great to me that aren't a big deal to other people. I love high resolution, really nice screens. And you can hand me a phone with a 1440p, AMOLED, great display, and you can hand me a phone with a 1080p LCD display.
And I'd look and I'd immediately want the better one. But to an average person, a lot of times, whatever, they both look fine to me. One of them's bigger. I like the bigger one.
So sometimes there will be things that will evaluate. You've got to get this because it's got a great screen. And it won't matter to a lot of people. But at least then you can calibrate yourself to what I've in the past liked a lot.
So in the past, I keep saying, I really like these phones because of their screens. And you know from your past experience that screens aren't a big deal to you. Then you can at least say, all right, I'll discount this point because screens aren't my thing. OK.
Yeah, because I've kind of wondered if we're going to reach a point of complete diminishing returns with smartphones, right? Like, oh, man, iPhone 10 or whatever. Like, this is awesome. iPhone 11, is it 100% better?
Unlikely, right? Do you think we're going to reach peak smartphone? Peak smartphone. It's a common question.
I don't. And the only reason I don't is because I've heard that question for the past five years of smartphones. And then the next year I'm like, well, that's new. And I think it's mostly because the trends change.
Like there was a thinnest trend a couple years ago, where it was like, we got a 9 millimeter spin and then 8.9 and then 8.1 and then 7.9. And holy crap, there's a 6 millimeter thin phone. How we reach peak smartphone. And then it changed to like, OK, now we want these bezel-less phones.
So thickness, whatever. It's just going to be thin. That's just the way it is. But now, can we get a 90% screen to body ratio?
Can we get this notch smaller? Can we get 93%? 95? Eventually, we're going to be like, have we hit peak?
Like, we got the whole screen. And then the next trend is going to happen. I don't know what that next trend is. But I feel like because of I've observed these cycles over the past couple years, it doesn't seem likely that it's just going to we're going to get this end product of the perfect phone.
I mean, maybe we will. That'd be great. But yeah, I don't see that. I know a lot of people are holding onto iPhone, basically, 5, 4 and 5.
Well, that's definitely true. If you buy an iPhone XS now, that phone's probably going to be good for four years. Like, legitimately iOS has gotten better. So it's true.
You can hang onto an older phone longer. I think you used to be able to. But that's also something tech companies got to think about when they make their next product. So what do you make of these new trends?
Like, folding things, like new trends right now? There's a lot of folding ones. It's one of those interesting ones. Because I'm trying to imagine the future of like, why folding phones matter.
At this point, like, generation one folding phones, they're like, all right, proof of concept. You can technically fold it. But there's a big ugly crease in the middle on these bezels and it's not really, it doesn't seem that useful yet. But that challenge is to go like eight, nine years down the road where it's like, oh yeah, you can just, you have a tablet and a phone.
And you just unfold your phone and it becomes a tablet. In that world, it was worth it. Like, 2019 folding phones were worth it because we got to that point. So if we get to that point someday, then I think it'd be worth it.
So then I've noticed you've filmed a bunch of Tesla videos. Based on the ratio of types of content on your channel, are you just betting electric vehicles is the next big trend? Partially, yes. And partially, I just love the thing.
Yeah, I mean, but that's like a cool signal, right? Like, I remember people wouldn't shut up about their iPhones when they got them. And the same thing is true for the Model S. Yes, and that's in comparison, I've heard like, the Tesla is the iPhone of cars again.
Like, it's kind of just that next wave and electric does seem like it's future. You see all these big companies like, yeah, we're gonna go electric by 2028. Like, great, someday. Yeah, no, I'm a huge fan of the Tesla.
And it's like, it's kind of like a perfect segue into me. I've always been into cars, but like, I'm 25. Like, I went to cars could I be really gonna drive all kinds of cars and stuff. But the Tesla's a perfect segue into cars because it's a tech product.
It has all these tech features. It's basically a tech company. So it was sort of a natural segue into the car world. Yeah, cause I've just been curious, like, on the performance side how much it actually matters.
Cause if you look around, you know, obviously the Model S is nuts to drive, right? But then, you know, the Prius is, have you driven a Prius before? Yeah, not the most exciting works. It gets you there.
Right. And so, yeah, I've been kind of wondering where the EV market will end up going. Cause the Model 3 is also pretty quick. Yeah, yeah.
But, you know, yeah. What's your impression of like the low end EV market? The thing about EV is you still get like that quick torque. So even though the performance from like, you know, 90 might not be like high end gas car territory.
Most of the acceleration and like merging and quick things you do on an EV, even a low end EV is still like Zippy. Like you still feel like you're in that like Zippy go-kart type of feel. Even in like, I drove a Model 3 when it first came out. And so it was rear wheel drive.
I'm pretty sure there's 60s, like five and a half seconds or something, which is fine. But like, that car felt quick. Okay. Like I'd step on the pedal.
And I felt like Zippy, like I was a modelist. So even low end EVs will have that feel and that's attractive to people. I think a lot of people over rate how much sound matters. Like in the high end car market, everyone cares how the car sounds.
But for 90% of people who are just like. You mean interior or the actual engine sound? Yeah, the engine sound. Like when I hit the pedal, I want to hear it working for me.
Like that's a common like resistance to the EVs. So yeah, I think for like 90% of people or taxis or just commuter vans or just basic transportation, like silence is great. Huh. And in terms of features within the car?
They tend to be ahead. Yeah. I think. I mean, maybe I'm just cause I'm looking mostly at Tesla, but like the amount of things, you know, having a smartphone controlled app where you can sum on the car to you, like all these remote start stop features and gas cars are great.
But when you look at the amount of, I mean, Tesla's tech companies, these are all kinds of tech features. Yeah. Yeah. I guess I just kind of wonder like where, cause you spend so much time reviewing products with like smartphones and cars and stuff.
Like you kind of get an impression of the bleeding edge, but I'm wondering like where you're seeing it going, like things that are just popping up where you're like, oh, that's actually a super cool feature that people aren't talking about or thinking about right now in the context of cars. I mean, honestly, just going electric and then everyone thinking about it's charging and already charge it. Like how fast is it charge? How long does the battery last?
Things like that, those basic questions. The more like those big companies think about answering those questions, like Ford and like Chevy and those big guys, the more you realize how far ahead Tesla is but how far there is to go to actually make EVs useful for most people. But I think the basic premise is you're just going electrically, you just put a battery in it, you charge it and you drive it the same way normal car drives, but I don't think there's any sort of magic sauce to it other than that. You just kind of have to get to it.
So it's more like on the infrastructure side, it's really important getting it on the other side. Which is flashy and like magic feature that's winning the market over, but it's like that's what you have to nail to make a good EV. Okay. And so, you know, now you're, you said you're 25.
Yeah. So now that you're 25. Do you feel like there's going to be a point where you have less of a pulse on like the new car? I'm so scared of that.
Yeah. Dude, I'm 29 and I'm like, oh no. Do you feel out of 29? I'm like, I don't know.
I'm scared of being that like old guy who's like out of touch. Like, but at least, at least I think that process will be slower for me because I'm so immersed in it now. Like with music, maybe I'm already there. Like music, new music comes out of that.
Like I tried to listen to like the billboard 100, like whatever the other day and I was just like, this is objectively bad. Like I can't do this. I clearly am out of the loop. But I guess with tech, I don't know.
Maybe I'm a little more immersed so that might take longer. Yeah. Or just near and dear your heart so it really matters. Yeah.
Well, there's also hope because there are plenty of much older, you know, tech journalists and tech YouTubers who are doing the thing. I mean, if you stay like in that world, it's kind of just part of what you're doing every day. No, and I know plenty of older people who are way more into music than I am and like catch things early. Yeah.
But it is this like core fear as a creative person where you're like, dude, am I'm like, oh, it's cool right now. Am I out of it? Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah. So do you, uh, does that fear like motivate you to try like that weirder YouTube stuff or are you like kind of, you know, this kind of phone, whatever video works and I'm just going to keep banging it up? I don't know. Yeah.
I mean, I'm definitely trying to diversify the breadth of coverage, you might call it. Sure. I don't think that's out of fear of like forgetting what's popular. I think that's just because like I'm interested in other things.
So there's other ways to talk about them. So there's reviews and there's smartphone stuff, but there's also the car videos now, which is the auto focus series. But there's also like, I'm into production naturally because that's what I'm doing all the time. So I'm doing this, this whole like spaces series where I'm talking about other creators and how they use their space.
I'm ideally starting a podcast pretty soon where I can just talk with people about things like this. So there's, I think that just comes from like all the other things that I've become interested in, of course, through, you know, making tech videos. Interesting. So what else would be on the podcast?
I want to talk to other creators. That's like probably the main thing because that's not something that is readily available to me. I think like when you get to a certain, a certain place in this creative world, there's no longer like a, an article you can go read to figure out how to do something. Like when you're starting YouTube, you can figure out like what's the best DSLR for a thousand bucks and buy it and find the lens that works best with it and then start from there.
But like when I'm trying to figure out like, hmm, how do I best like start a new series given the current uploads and like the pace of, you know, the way things are moving like all these nuanced questions that don't necessarily have answers, but that other creative people think about too. Just talking to people about that kind of stuff. Yeah. I mean, it sounds a lot like just strategy, right?
Where like two things can simultaneously be true, but you have to pick one. Yeah. And that can be a little intimidating, I guess, and helpful. Yeah.
So like, yeah, it's less math more just like strategy. Yes, strategy and like creative insight. Yeah. Are you going to try and like innovate in your podcast anyway?
Because what I'm kind of fishing for is like, you know, obviously YouTube video, right? Like what are the other mediums that you're like testing out to feel like, oh, maybe there's an audience here or like maybe I can break ground here. Yeah. I feel like video as a medium is my favorite by far.
So I think I don't think about new mediums as much as I think of new ways to do video, new topics, new formats within video podcasting being like a sort of an auxiliary way to also talk. That bixby. I don't know. That is bixby.
I've never even heard it in real life. I've never intentionally triggered bixby. So that's like the third or fourth time that it's thought I've been talking to it. Or was I, oh, I mean, video, yeah, I think I'm still trying to figure out the whole video thing generally.
And that might be a battle I never win, but I feel like that's going to be taking most of my time is doing different types of videos. Okay. Okay. And so have you tried 360?
Have you tried VR? Like, have you tried these new formats? I have tried one, I've published one 360 video. Okay.
And it was one that I thought was a really good idea. It was a studio tour. So it would be like you're sort of moving around the studio, but you can also look around and see what's behind you and around you. So you sort of feel like you're in that space.
That's a good use of VR. And that was fun. But that was one of those things where I struggled to find other genuinely productive uses for it in my case. It's awesome for games.
I love it for games. I love for other stuff. But for video, it's been sort of a head scratcher. Well, it's very, we did a podcast with Jessica Brilhart, who's a VR creator in New York.
And it's a difficult storytelling challenge because with film, you're inherently controlling the viewpoint of your audience. Yeah. And with games, you explore. Right.
Exactly. And shooting a 360 video. Right now, a bunch of wires that should dangle over the place. It's no big deal with camera control.
Yeah, exactly. Yeah, that's not a challenge. I mean, the rig we use was really cool. We could have basically like, it's not literally following me around, but it went from place to place.
And we had a couple of set up places around the studio so the video would move between these places and you could follow me around. But yeah, that to me was like peak 360. I figured it out. This is the best use of 360 in my case.
Real estate. Yeah. But outside of that, yeah, it's been maybe just tours in general. A lot of car stuff is already because it's such a small space.
Maybe getting a smaller rig in there. We can sort of look around as if you're in the car. That's tough. Yeah.
But do you feel limited by cameras in any way at this point? Only slightly. Okay. I feel like I'm like not even allowed to complain because the cameras I use are so obscene.
But on occasion, I wish the camera had autofocus. I wish the camera was smaller. I wish the camera's bad or lasted longer. But those are like pretty minor things as far as I can still get the image I want eventually if I work hard enough.
You don't have autofocus on all your cameras? I don't. Really? Yeah.
Just the lens or the actual camera? The camera essentially it has a really, really poor autofocus system, but it's a red camera and no one uses autofocus for red cameras, so they don't really work on it. So it's not good. So it's manual focus all the time.
And that has its downsides obviously, especially when we're doing car stuff, trying to do fixed focus car stuff when the car moves all the time. It's tricky. There's a lot of weird things with fixed focus, but we've messed with rigs where we can do remote, follow focused stuff and all kinds of other hacks to get around it. But yeah, that's one of those weird things.
Do you do much drone stuff? A little bit for cars. It's funny because I always wanted to do drone stuff, but for the longest time I was mostly doing handheld gadgets. So it felt like what do I need to drone for?
I was just going to fly away from me holding an iPad like that's not compelling. But now that we're doing car stuff, yes, there's plenty of useful drones. Okay. Have you mounted anything to the hood?
I don't know. Like those giant gimbals. Have you tried that out yet? We've gone a little into that.
We have this whole, I guess we're always trying to make setups for scenarios. And I think the next scenario setup we're working on is like the chase car. How do you shoot a car from any angle you want from another car? So you can obviously go out the side because there's a window or you can get a sliding door.
We shut out the back. So we have the lift gate go up. We can go like hold a gimbal out of the back. But shooting the back of a car in front of you is hard because there's a sloped windshield storage distorted so you hang out the side but then you're off-axis.
So there's kind of a weird problem with shooting the back of a car. That's like one of those things we're working on. I guess putting something on the hood would be a way to shoot a car in front of you but then you're fixed in your height. So you can't really go low.
Then there's those camera cars that have a jib on top of it and you can go all kinds of angles. So that might be fun. But as of right now, it's pretty early. Yeah.
This is a funny creator problem because industry people have figured this out. Yeah. Like if you see like professional, you know, like Tesla shoots, like they got it locked down. Yeah, absolutely.
But like Marquez individual YouTube guy, like just a fly to LA and like film on the PCH. And so those are the kinds of questions that you're curious about. Yep. Okay.
And there's not like a YouTuber network where you just like call it what. There's, I mean, there are YouTube friends that also have similar questions. Like we can talk about it all we want. I've had a couple friends who are obviously in LA because that's where almost everyone is.
But we talk about gear all the time and like production strategy in a way. Like how do you shoot these things? We've collaborated on one of the last things we did was when we interviewed Elon, we did a factory tour, which was like, how do you shoot a factory tour with like two people walking through it? Have one person hold the camera while you're out or do you have a person next to it?
You know, that's like, that was a whole thing where we have to figure out how to do that. But yeah, and the industry has got it all locked up. Yeah. But it's also, I think what a lot of people could get from you is like storytelling techniques because that at the core of it, like obviously the product is cool, right?
But like you're a storyteller too. Yeah. And so when you're going to go and do an interview with Elon and I saw most of your interviews like 10 minutes, 15 minutes long, right? I assume it's cut down to.
Yeah. Yeah. And a lot of it also is because of really busy people. Yeah.
And that's just all the time that we get with them and all we have. Like, it's like a heavy medium of talking a little longer than a 5 minute video. Yeah, which is a nice format for you too. Like we've tried both.
And I mean, I'm so impressed with Rogan. He's like three hour videos and people are into it. Yeah, he's amazing. Yeah.
So when you think about like, okay, I'm maybe we should do a product scenario, right? Like how do you think about storytelling in the case of a review context? So what came before it? What came next to it?
What is up against? And momentum in a way. So it's like new phone comes out. You naturally compare it to the phone that came before it.
And then you compare it to other phones around it and how much those steps forward versus how much get steps forward. And that right there can be enough of an interesting story for a lot of devices that come out. I remember when iPad Pro came out, that story was like iPad was already so far ahead in tablets. And then iPad Pro took a massive step forward versus the last iPad.
Like this is obscene how much like there is no other $1300 tablet I would even consider. Like that's alone in its category, which is really fascinating. So yeah, I guess those two things. Like the context of other products that exist next to it and what came before it.
Okay. And when it comes to storytelling of you as a person, like expanding it, like all the gross words like personal brand and all that stuff. Where do you go? Like how do you tell your story and then how do you fit in what your future plans and hopes are?
I guess I kind of I do less of that because I consider tech the star of the show. I think I do inject my own personal humor or perspective on occasion just because it's fun and keeps it interesting. And that's its own challenge. But I've always considered tech the star of the show.
And anyway, I can I try to make that the main story. Interesting. We'll just continue to drive future projects for you. Yeah.
The one string that ties everything together is it's coming from me. So it's always the same perspective. So like when you see a new car video, like with Top Gear, for example, you know that guy's driven these cars before. So he's going to think of it in the context of all those other cars.
So when I do a car video, you know, I'm going to compare it to the other four or five cars I've driven which are electric. So like that's that's the difference between, you know, a car video from me and someone else. But at the end of the day, the car is the thing. Like that's what I'm talking about and sharing with people.
But I guess I'm probably underweighting how important my own personal voice is, but I really try to make the tech, the star show. Well, I think it's the focus in your video. I appreciate the modesty. But like there are how many million YouTube channels of people reviewing phones.
True. True. So you've stood out in some way. So you've got like a hundred plus questions from Twitter.
I want to answer some of them. We're going to skip the middle initial for 10 million subscribers. Yes, yes, of course. But there are a lot of best practices around YouTube.
You may have answered these before, but Marco Castro asks, what advice do you have for new creators on YouTube? New creators. New creators being pretty broad because you can be a new creator in a tech or a comedy or a new photographer. There's all kinds of new creators.
But on YouTube, generally, like if I was starting over today, I would kind of do a lot of what I'm doing now, which is like you take your inspiration from other places, but you always have to come back to your own voice and your own perspective. Don't try to be something else that already exists or there won't be any reason to watch it. It already exists. So find your own new angle, your own new voice, your own new way of showing or talking about things.
Yeah. And then get started and a lot of it just comes to look. And you can see the consistency is very important. When do you think you found your voice as a creator?
I think super early. Really? I've always been like, I want crispy video. I want quality.
I know what I want. Like I think that came at the very beginning. Even when I was doing these tutorial videos. Yeah, I watched a couple of their fun.
Oh, God. I'm sorry. I love going. I like you went through puberty on YouTube.
Yeah. Yeah. There's all these, I did all these tutorials, which are just screencasts. It's just my screen and I'm out smoothing.
And I was obsessed with getting the highest frame rate possible and the smoothest motion blur of my cursor on the screen and like that's so stupid. Like I've always wanted that production to facilitate the story as best as possible. I want the quality to be like as realistic as it can be so that it's not a distraction. And that's still the way it is.
Like I, the whole almost like shtick is like over produced like really. Filling in on real estate. Exactly. Yeah.
Overly realistic. But to the point where like if you look at this video on your screen, you'll feel the closest to actually holding it in real life. Like that's the goal. So I think that, I don't know if that's my voice or just my style, but I've found that to be a priority pretty early.
Well, I think it's kind of a combination, right? Because you both, you have your taste, which I think the world has decided is good. Sure. And yeah.
And then just your like hard and dependent that this is going to be super high quality. Right. Right. And so did you grow up with these like values given to you or is it a personal thing you just were born with?
I guess it must have been instilled in me in some way. I mean, I've always been in the tech and tech has always had a like an emphasis on like we're the best. It's like hard core. Like this is the highest quality mentality.
That's a great question. I guess, I guess it's just what I decided I wanted at some point. I never really thought about that. It's, it's just, it seems like it would be everyone's goal when I think about it.
Like striving for the highest quality production. It was a no brainer to me. And I guess it's when you end up in the position where you're able to, you know, use really high-end equipment and like you can make more of what you want because of the position you're in. It's even more of a no brainer because the barrier is lower.
But I guess, yeah, that challenge to make like the perfect video is like, so the air quotes for audio listeners like that's, that's always probably going to be a moving goal post. Yeah, you're always reaching for it and it's always slipping away. But there's something innate in you, right? And I think in a lot of people who are, I wouldn't go so far as always calling people perfectionists but to like want to do it over again and over again and over again until it's just right.
And that's the thing, that's the thing that creators have to overcome and that a lot of times you don't want to. Like if you end up like, I would consider myself borderline like, professionalist and some stuff. I remember doing like SAT stuff where it was like, okay, you have to write this essay, you're going to get the topic and like, you have to write it right then. But like, I want to think about this for a couple of days before I actually put a pen to paper and like you just have to spit out with three pages and hopefully it's good enough.
Like, that's kind of the way YouTube is like a new phone just came out. Go. Like, you form the best thing you can and if it's 95% there and it's done, that's better than 99% there and still working on it. That's a barrier for me.
Like I wish I could take more time with a lot of stuff but Tech just moves fast so you kind of have to evolve your production and ideally make the best thing you can. Do you follow your listeners or do you follow your gut when it comes to making choices? Is there like a data-driven approach to what kind of videos you're making? No, I'd say it's almost no doubt at all.
You get the comments of people who are like, this part of the video is cool. I enjoyed that or like you could have spent more time on, I wish you'd gone into this more, or I was wondering about this and I'm glad you addressed it, like certain things like that, where, and I guess the only data it comes down to is like, I made a six minute video on this phone, but I left out these three things, I wonder if an eight minute video would have been watchable, like knowing all the other things I go into YouTube and retention and how long people watch and the attention span of the internet. I guess that's all data, but at the end of the day, I'm just like, I guess I probably could have included that, or maybe I didn't have to go into that much detail about this new camera, it's almost the same as last year. Like that kind of stuff, wow, 12 minute video could have been nine minutes, it's almost the same thing.
Information density is my writing challenge. I'm trying to fit as much structurally sound information that's like, followable to most people as possible, which in tech is, I don't know if that's more or less of a challenge, probably more. Well, it's tough to decide what's most valuable to people. That's mainly it, like I, a lot of people, the best comments you get really are that I get are from people who've never seen the videos before.
And a lot of times they'll say, oh, you know, these are videos for like the mainstream buyer, like not for the hardcore tech person, but all the information that goes into saying those top level things, the way I said them, came from all the depth of using the device and all the hardcore stuff that I left out. So in a way it feels like, oh, I should just include everything so that they know that I'm like really into what I'm talking about. Yeah, I'm legit, I swear. But it becomes less presentable that way, it becomes verbose that way, like I can say the same thing five different ways, but the shortest most succinct, complete way is usually the best way.
So that's what I've been trying to do. That's kind of a mark of someone who really knows what they're talking about too. Like if you can teach it to somebody who's 10 years old, then you can explain it. And it's also the selling point of a lot of great companies, absolutely.
All right, before we go more into the YouTube questions, dude, how do you deal with YouTube comments? I think people really hate YouTube comments and for whatever reason, it hasn't been that bad for me. Now I can say lately, meme culture has made its appearance in my comments section far more often in the past couple months for an unnamed reason. I'll just say it's most most fault, but I think that the comments section's actually been pretty helpful and pretty great for me for the past couple of years.
And whether that's like, I can also separate the comments section into kind of three categories. Hour one of upload, which is like useless. It's mainly just people saying either first or reacting to the title and thumbnail and not actually watching the video, or just like getting something in to hopefully get a response. Like the first hour is not really very useful.
Then there's like hour two through 24, which is like people watching the video and being somewhat thoughtful before leaving what I'd consider a useful comment. And then there's people who are finding it in search. So this is no longer subscribers. This is people who were looking for something about this device, found this video, clicked it hoping for something, and left a comment based on what they watched.
Those are the most useful comments. So if you can divide that, like if all your reading is the first three hours of comments or like this is useless, I hate YouTube comments. But if you can sort of stitch those out into like what's coming from what audience, then it can actually be somewhat productive, I think. Yeah, I always struggle with the personal attacks.
Yeah, I think they just kind of get drowned out and that's probably another benefit of where the channel is. Like people just bury that stuff. Okay, that's great. That's great.
Yeah, and you didn't get it when you were a kid. I definitely did and I ignored it. I think I built a thick skin from that. And now it's just kind of, it probably still exists and I just ignore it.
That's fucking awesome. Okay, so Austin Rider asked in the early years of the channel, Rakes took a several month hiatus from YouTube, but then came back with a new video format and seemingly renewed drive. What happened during those months off? That's great.
Very dedicated. I know. Very few people know that. That was when I was in high school and that was my senior year and I just had to finish, get my grades up, college applications, the last year of Ultimate like three days a week practices for hours, like that was just like, I don't have time.
I want to make videos so bad. But if I do, I'm gonna get in that rabbit hole again and I'm gonna try to make five videos a week and I'm just not gonna have the time for the things that matter right now. So that was the end of high school where I was applying to colleges, going to all these things and interviews and pre-college and all this stuff, SATs, the whole deal. Okay.
And the renewed drive was just exciting to be back. The new drive was like, hell yes, I'm back. Five days a week, let's go. College, no schedule, I'm in it.
I'm in it. Yeah, that was a pretty good time. Okay, right on. A bunch of people asked the same question.
Winston asked, what's your daily schedule? Because I'm particularly curious because you also maintain a level of fitness for Ultimate. Yeah, yeah, I practiced last night. My daily schedule, so I kind of, I would separate into weekdays and weekends.
Okay. Weekdays, I guess, are divided again into production days or pre-production, post-production days. Production days are filming, editing. The meat of making videos and writing especially.
And pre-production or post-production days are more of like the inbox, the strategy, the what comes next, the travel, all that sort of stuff that comes in between the videos. And then there's nights which are either like the leagues I play in or practice or a side I play for the pro-ultimate team for New York. We had practice last night on Randall Island. It was cold, so cold.
And then weekends are ultimate. I don't work on weekends and that used to be a thing. I would just work in between Frisbee, but Frisbee happens on weekends. So that's traveling, that's playing, that's resting, that's disconnected from the internet.
And so you train by practicing? Yes. There's no other regiment. I have gym in my basement.
I ask anyone who's around me a lot. I'm usually there at night. But as far as like playing a lot, that's kind of the best training you can get. So that's where I spend a lot time.
And so you're gym, what are you doing? Squats, what are you doing? I have a bike, I have the treadmill, but then I have a lot of free weights. I believe in free weights, I don't have that many machines.
So it's mostly just the dumbbells and the, I don't even know that the bar is called that. Oh, parallel bars? No, you're standing in it. And it's just, I don't know, to do dips and stuff?
To do squats or to do, dang, I don't know names or anything. Like a deadlift? Like a deadlift, but I know the bar is called. Hexagon thing.
Yes, that thing. So it's like a dead, I'm sure it's not a prize name. It's called a hex bar. Hex bar.
Yeah, you got a hex bar. Got some plates. So yeah, that's like some of the time, but then eventually you just have to throw. And I don't want to get into ultimate advice, but like.
So you have a scar on your hand. Ultimate related. I, in college, went to go lay out to get a defensive play. And I, on the turf, skidded forward and snapped my finger in half.
So I had, I got a little plate and screws in there now. Fixed that bone. Strong as bone in my body now. Reinforced.
That's great. Yeah, I got out. Screws in my shoulder. I feel the same way.
Yeah, yeah. All right. Ahmed Khan asks, are there any problems that you see or face that you really wish engineers or developers would solve? Engineers and developers.
I mean, we're kind of on it. They're kind of on it. A lot of times there's like the beginning, like folding phones, for example, like you kind of see the beginning of like some potential. And I'm like, oh, I hope they go all in on that.
That could be really cool in the future. But generally, like it's all being worked on. I wish some of it was being worked on more than it is. I'm reviewing a lot of phones right now whose cameras are just not close to the pixels camera in particular.
And I know they could get closer. I know they could put a little more into that, but they don't. And that's their own choice and their own priority. But they totally could.
So stuff like that. That's just like things that I prefer in some devices. I wish were more of a priority. But generally, I think we live in a pretty good world.
Nothing really sucks anymore. You know? Like the tech we use, even at the lower end, just kind of works pretty well. Yeah.
No, it's very. So I haven't upgraded my phone for that reason. Yeah. It's just fine.
It's like could use a better camera, but it's OK. Yeah. So one question was from a startup founder, Chris Giordano. He asked, any tips on how to engage with influencers when you're a very early stage startup with little or no money?
Yeah. My biggest tip would be to offer something that would make it. It's got to be a win-win for everyone involved. So even if you're not a startup, even if you're a company who's just not into influencer marketing yet, the whole idea of creators working with companies is obviously they need the financial support.
But also, they want to be able to make something that they wouldn't have otherwise been able to make. So whether they're given access to something or they're given a behind the scenes look at something, something like that, you don't have to always pay them a lot. But if you can get something like that, suddenly their audience is really into, that's a win too. So if that's a win for the audience, because I've got a better video, that's a win for the creator because they can make something better that their audience now gets to see.
And that's a win for the company involved, because now your stuff is in front of a new audience. So even if you don't have the financial means to just dive right into paying for ads, you can always offer something that can make a video better. And if you do, I also notice a lot, not a lot of research is done. They kind of just have this list of tech channels and they just sort of wind it, carpet everyone the same email.
But if you really want to work with a certain creator for a certain reason, make that clear like that. Like you've watched their videos and you notice the theme and you think there's some potential for building on something there, that's worth expounding upon. So in addition to this kind of influencer marketing, where do you see the future of individual creators supporting themselves as a business going? We have this question most often in relation to podcasts.
How are people going to monetize? It's even shakier on YouTube, especially lately just so because of where we're at. And I get it. The easy answer is just be PC and be super clean and never push any buttons.
But like at a certain point that's not where you want to be, you kind of want to be able to explore and do different things. So you have to diversify your income. That's the simple answer. So at this point, I can use myself as an example.
The channel obviously has ads on it and that's been one version of income as an independent creator. There's also something called affiliate income where you talk about products a lot. You might as well share the availability to buy those products. So Amazon has an affiliate system, B&H has an affiliate system.
There's also a merch store. This is something I have a creator can do. But if you can, why not? I very recently super late got into it, but trying to make a sort of people asking all the time what sweatshirt I was wearing in videos.
I figured I might as well offer a sweatshirt at some point. You can turn that into sort of a fashion brand, if you will. And just having different ways of supporting the same thing, with all sort of point back to the same thing. What about those paid subscriptions or even around?
Oh yeah, the patreon. So at a certain point you can ask dedicated viewers who really want to support what you do directly, if they want to contribute more. Oftentimes they won't have a problem with that. If they really like your work.
Or if your work isn't common. And then a lot of times if they feel like they can just find what you're doing somewhere else, then there's no reason for them to stick around or pay for it. But if what you do is less frequent or it's really high effort or it's not something that they're going to find somewhere else and that'll come from you working on your craft for a long time, then oftentimes they'll have no problem deciding they want to help you out. And when it comes to you now that you're a pretty successful channel, what are those ratios look like?
Did you know off the top of your head? Yeah, I would say the, I'm still at a point where the YouTube ads are probably 40 to 50%. The, I don't do a whole lot of sponsored stuff. If I did that number would be much higher, but I think right now sponsored stuff is probably about 20%.
It's a 40, 20 and then affiliate stuff being another 10. So we're at like what, 70 now? So I guess YouTube ads is probably bigger. YouTube ads is probably 50% of what the streams look like.
So you think your biggest problem right now as a creator is figuring out how to do these more difficult things? Yeah. I'm still on that quest of production. Like I know my videos can be better.
Like there, there's still always a gap between like a great YouTube video and a movie, of course. Like everyone can tell a YouTube video from a movie and everything, but like ideally that like seamless like production where I can tell the story I want, show what I want to show and not have any barriers in the way of source production, that would be ideal. That's probably my biggest challenge. And then one of those like, I feel like an octopus like chopping off one of my arms and handing it to someone, but like having other people who can edit, having other people who can do set design and can contribute on things that I'm doing eight things at once.
I wish someone else could take the load off me. That kind of stuff is also a challenge for me right now. But that's something I'm working on too. That's interesting.
All right. So I guess my last question for you then, is your long term goal. Like what are you shooting for in 10, 15 years? Well, 10 years, 35.