42: Mayonnaise Malaise

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Tickets go on sale to the general public June 30th at somethingworthknowing.com. So come build a better world with us on September 16th and experience something worth knowing you can get your ticket at Complexly.info slash something. Hello and welcome to Dear Hank and Job. Or is I for thinking about Dear John and Hank?

It's a comedy podcast about death where my brother John and I will answer your questions. We'll give you a few of these advice and we'll bring you all the weeks news from both Mars and AFC Wimbledon. The AFC Wimbledon news this week. Hey, it is a big, big, big AFC Wimbledon news week.

The biggest one ever. I, uh, you're just gonna have to wait though. All of you people listening to the end of the podcast because we can't tell you we have to do all the questions stuff which I know is the boring stuff that nobody's here for. They're really all just here for the AFC Wimbledon news.

John. I actually think that this week they will be pretty pleased and surprised and excited about the AFC Wimbledon news. It's pretty, it's pretty, pretty cool. Um, but, but first I have to ask you John, how are you doing?

I'm doing great entirely because of the AFC Wimbledon news that for some reason I'm not about to talk about until the end of the podcast. Um, I have thought about nothing else all day. How are you? I believe you.

I'm good. I'm in Los Angeles. It's actually a little chilly, but I do like it chilly. So I'm not complaining and I've gotten to see so many cool people in the last two weeks.

Uh, I'm just so pleased to be a part of this, uh, this community of creators and, uh, and I just think it's so fascinating and I love talking to them and I'm just such a fanboy and it's such, it's so cool to be both a fanboy and a creator and for people to like, uh, to want to talk to me. Uh, even though I'm mostly just, uh, just in a fan and they're like, well, let's have conversation about it. It'll be useful to both of us and I'm like, yeah, sure, I'm sure it will, but really I just want to talk about how great you are and how I like, how I like the content you make. So it's been really fun and I, I'm gonna make at least two videos out of the stuff that I've collected while I'm here and I'm excited for both of them.

Well, I am thrilled for the fact that you're in Los Angeles on my behalf so that I don't have to be there. Yeah, I mean, there are lots of bad parts about it, uh, mostly the getting from one place to another. You know, I thought that it was the traffic in LA was bad, but it's really just that it's gigantic. Uh, the traffic can actually be quite good, but it still takes like 45 minutes to get somewhere because it's just a very big place.

Also, the traffic is terrible. Would you like a short poem for the day? Yeah, tell me all about it. I thought I would read you another, uh, haiku by Richard Wright.

Actually, I like the last Richard Wright haiku so much and I like this one so much written right at the end of his life. When he was living in exile in Paris, he wrote burning out its time and timing its own burning one lonely candle. Oh, yes. The beautiful little haiku by the end of life.

That was great. High quality. I know. That Richard Wright, you know, he could do a lot of different things.

Great nonfiction writer, great novelist and turns out a pretty darn good haiku writer. I don't know anything about this person. What do you mean you don't know anything about Richard Wright? Of course, you know something about Richard Wright.

What do I know about him? I mean, I'm googling right now. I'm fairly certain that you read a Richard Wright novel in high school, like Native Son or his memoir Black Boy. I'm pretty positive that every American high school student has to read at least one Richard Wright book.

Well, I will say that despite what I may have been required to read in high school, I didn't read all those books. All right. Well, let's just answer some questions from our listeners before I start getting mad at you for all the things that you haven't read. All right.

We got a lot of good questions here. John, do you want to start with a fun one or a serious one? Fun. Oh, John, this may be my favorite Dear Hank and John question of all time.

It's from Sam who asks Dear Hank and John, I work at Subway. And sometimes I worry about the health of my customers, especially children. I assuage this by giving customers light manes when they don't specify what kind of manes they want or giving them far more spinach than lettuce when they ask for both. Is it wrong of me to sneak these healthier options into customers sandwiches if they don't know about it?

Wow, that's a great question. I do not know how to feel about you, Sam. You're a little, you're a little sneaky Subway sandwich artist. Hey, as you know, my wife is also a former Subway employee.

Aren't you also a former Subway employee? I was never a Subway employee. I think that you're mixing it up. I'm a frequent Subway customer.

Okay, okay. It's a common mistake. But I will also say, John, I am a frequent Subway customer. And in fact, the guy who Ethan who works at my Subway, he made I'm pretty sure he's a fan.

So he may be listening right now. Hello, Ethan, if you're out there. I have to say that a well made Subway sandwich is so much better than a poorly made Subway sandwich that first off I value Sam's seriousness about his work. I also value the fact that he uses more spinach than lettuce, even though spinach is more expensive.

I don't know if his manager has told him that, but the manager at my Subway definitely has. And I don't think if there are no specific requests for kind of manneas, I think it's fine to use light manneas. If you think that's the better manneas for the sandwich. I don't know that I think it's fine to use more spinach if you think that's better for the sandwich.

I don't think that Sam that it is your place to make other people's health decisions. I think that I think that the light manneas at Subway and the manneas manneas at Subway are not even close to the same thing. If I ask for manneas, I know what I'm asking for. And it is not the light manneas, which is a very different thing.

I'm looking up. It's like if I asked for manneas and they gave me ketchup. They are that different. Really?

To me. They are deeply or like ranch dressing instead of manneas. It's just not. Okay, light manneas has 50 calories and 5 grams of fat.

Manneas, regular manneas, has oh my 110 calories and 12 grams of fat. So it really isn't the same thing. No, it is not. And also it is fairly significant contribution to the health of your customer.

But maybe it's okay to, you can sort of feign the fact that you made a mistake if they come back and they're like, what did you do? And then you have to throw the sandwich away. But if it's a child especially, they probably aren't going to be able to tell because children have just notoriously no connection with reality. I do not understand them at all.

But I do think that it is somewhat problematic to be sort of making the health choices of other people for them. And I think that. Right. I mean, to use an extreme example, like without being their doctor, you for instance don't know if maybe they've been told that they need to get much, much more fat into their diet for some reason.

So I think that obviously that's unlikely, but it's not impossible. So I don't think it's your place to make other people's health decisions or in fact to judge there, to judge the food that they're eating. Right. Right.

No, yeah. And I do like that's sort of my bigger problem with this is like the way that we judge other people for the way that they eat is I think problematic. But if somebody asks for spinach and you give them more, they can always take it off. But I don't think many people wouldn't complain about having more spinach on their sandwich.

In fact, usually I am wondering why I got so little. So I'm always out to guiltily ask for more. I've actually started to offer an extra quarter in exchange for a proper amount of spinach. All right.

Our next question comes from Janine who asks, Dear John and Hank, despite my university having a strict honor code, a lot of students cheat on homework and tests. On the one hand, I know these students are missing out on getting the most of their educations, but on the other hand, their cheating hurts me because class grades are often curved depending on class averages, especially if I won't be able to directly apply what I'm learning outside of an academic setting. How can I come to terms with people around me getting higher grades than I do when they aren't grappling with the material? Do they deserve these high grades if they can successfully cheat and not get caught?

Am I just a sucker for not figuring out how to play the system? So let me submit that you are asking many different questions that have different answers. Are you a sucker for not figuring out how to play the system? No, they are suckers for spending money on a college education that is not educating them.

Do they deserve these high grades if they can successfully cheat? Of course, they don't deserve the high grades. How can I come to terms with people around me getting higher grades than I do when they aren't grappling with the material? I would answer that question by saying that grades don't actually matter very much and grappling with the material matters a lot.

So to me, that's how you come to terms with it. I don't think that it's your moral obligation to turn those people in. No, I agree with that. But I also think that we have this structure in our education system that makes us think that the grade is the most important thing.

And in a lot of ways it is, but mostly on the way to university, it doesn't matter. Mostly it's like judging you to make sure that you are placed into university and can get scholarships if you need them. But once you're there, this is not about the letter that you end up with at the end of the semester. This is about learning and being a better person and gaining that knowledge and insight.

I think that it's more important that you struggle and that you even maybe talk to your professor about the success and perils of your struggle. And depending on what you're studying, of course, this is all very different stuff. But the knowledge and the connection between you and your professors is going to be just by the virtue of you progressing and struggling is going to be more significant than your peers who are just coasting and using whatever tools they can to get that letter bigger. Yeah, the letter is, I mean, as someone who hires a lot, I just don't buy the argument that the letter is very important.

I just don't think GPA is very important. I think where you go to college is like slightly important. I think what you study is slightly important. But I think in the end, it's about skill sets and being able to contextualize yourself and understand social cues and work in teams.

And lots of things that frankly, college isn't very focused on in most cases. I have never looked at a GPA while hiring, ever, ever. I have no idea if any of these people even graduated from college, to be honest with you. Yeah, I was recently surprised to find that one of the maybe the highest person at our company who isn't me and John.

I don't believe graduated from college. And one of the highest people didn't graduate from high school. Right. I mean, I think that there is kind of an equivalent experience category when it comes to applying for jobs.

That said, I still think that it's best to go to college and complete it in the vast majority of cases. Yeah, absolutely. And the statistics are with me, although less and less each year as college becomes less and less reasonable. But yeah, in terms of its cost, you mean by reasonable, less and less reasonable by cost.

Yes, I think that it remains reasonable in terms of valuing reason. All right, Hank, we have another question. This is from Catherine. She writes, Dear John and Hank, in 2009, John made a video about the stimulus plan that was going to be signed into action by the president on February 16th of that same year.

I was wondering how has this affected us? Has it worked? Has it hurt or helped us? What has happened since then?

It's a great question. I don't know. I do. You know, you tell me, John, you tell me.

Okay. So it is very hard to find economists who do not acknowledge that the stimulus plan, which was called the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act of 2009, was a success in the sense that it probably lowered the basement of the recession. In fact, the stimulus plan has been used in lots of conversations among economists since then as evidence for the Keynesian economic model in which during recession's governments offset decreases in private spending by increasing public spending. Lots of economists have been like, look, it worked.

It pretty clearly worked. This is as close as we can get to a real world example of the Keynesian economic model working. Now, of course, the other side of the Keynesian economic model that governments spend less during periods of growth is the part that nobody wants to embrace, right? Because that's the part where you have to be like, oh, things are going well.

We're going to spend less money and just keep it in a lockbox somewhere. So for when things aren't going well, that's a little bit of an actually unfair oversimplification of Keynesian economic theory. And also I'm not an economist. I was however the third best C student in economics when I was in 11th grade at the Alabama State Academic Decathlon.

That's not often. Did the stimulus work? Yes. Obviously, it did not immediately end the recession, but it probably made the recession suck less.

And there's a chance that if it hadn't been for the stimulus, the recession would have sucked so much worse that it would have led to a deflationary spiral, which would have led to a big depression-like thing. But it speaks to our short political and economic memory that almost no one ever talks about the 2009 stimulus anymore. And when we do talk about it, we talk about it as a thing that made a small impact because it was ultimately a pretty small impact one way or the other. So if the stimulus had failed, it would have failed in a minor way.

And I think the stimulus succeeded, but it succeeded in a minor way. And in general, that's the case for almost all of these legislative initiatives that we fight and die over and say are going to save or ruin America, right? When we look back at them eight or nine years later, we think, well, that was a modest success or that was a modest failure. Like we look back at the Bush Medicare prescription drug plan and say, well, that was a modest failure.

And we look back at Obamacare and say, either, I mean, I think, either that's a modest success or that's a modest failure. I mean, the truth is not that many people are enrolled on the exchange. It hasn't changed things that much for that. So I just think a lot of times the stuff we fight over is the wrong like it's stuff that's not going to be that important in the future.

What I mostly hear in these conversations is Obamacare is a massive failure. It's hard to say that Obamacare is a massive failure when no, I completely agree with you. I completely agree. But that is, it is, you know, in terms of what we want to talk about it, I think it often has more to do with how we want to how we how the people in the news media want to frame the issue because they want to frame the issue in a way that is good for the politics that they ascribe to.

I, yeah, I think that we shouldn't get too caught up in this, John, but I do like your answer. All right, well, then let's just move on. All right, I got a question from Renee who asks, dear Hank and John, now that we have established some armrest etiquette, I feel it's time to decide another one drive-throughs. What are your thoughts on a threshold to decide whether a person needs to order inside or use the convenience of the drive-through?

No more than three complicated Starbucks drinks, no minivans ordering for the family of six? Should they be treated like 10 items or less lanes at the grocery store? Oh, come on, Renee. You can't you can't you can't tell people how they're going to use the drive-through.

Anybody can use the drive-through if they want to. If they don't want to pull 8,000 kids out of their car seats and put them back in, that's fine. You, if you want convenience, can get out of your car and go inside and have the shorter ones. I always feel like the drive-through is the short is the long option.

The drive-through is always takes longer because it's people who don't want to get out of their cars. I'm going to go inside and talk to a person because I like them. And I have strong opinions, apparently, on this. I actually don't know which is longer, but I do know that if you have 17 kids, you should be allowed to use the drive-through because anyone who's ever put one child in a car seat knows that the thought of taking that child out of that car seat for five minutes to get food and then putting that child back in the car seat is so overwhelming that I'll sit and drive through line for three hours.

The other day I was driving past an in and out and I was like, I should get in and out. I'm in LA. And the line was that long. I was like, I'm going to go to McDonald's.

Oh man. No line at all. I made sure to go to In and Out Burger on my way out of Los Angeles. It's always my way of saying goodbye to Los Angeles so I have a nice memory.

I still haven't been to In and Out this trip. I need to figure out how to do that. You should do what to take. Go through sitting right next to me.

She's looking at me with these eyes and she's holding her hand to her mouth and making mouth motions. And now the whole hamburger's in there. The mind hamburger is inside of my wife. I think we've settled this question very quickly and efficiently, John.

Great. Let's go to the next one. Anonymous writes, Dear John and Hank, recently my partner of half a decade broke up with me out of the blue. Let's just start by saying that you're saying half a decade as a way of trying to like make it longer, which I'm going to say more about in a second.

He has been my best friend for the many years. We were a couple. We lived together and talked all day. Now he has moved out and we have no contact.

We've broken up and gotten back together before in the past, but I think this time is different. My friends all say that space and no contact now is the best thing in order to heal and have a chance at friendship later, but actually taking this advice feels like the worst thing in the world. What should I do? I actually think that you should probably take your friend's advice, although I am very sympathetic to the fact that it truly probably does feel like the worst thing in the world.

There's an element of catastrophizing that accompanies any major trauma or major loss, like losing a relationship like this, because the people around you don't understand what a big deal it is, especially if you weren't married or if you didn't have, because it's not legally complicated, they think that it's not emotionally complicated and that you just need to get over it. But of course that's very hard to do practically slash impossible. It hurts because it mattered. It hurts because it was important and because there's a real profound loss there, but not acknowledging the loss is not a way forward.

You have to let yourself grieve. You have to let yourself be inside of that loss. You have to know that it's okay, not judge yourself for being sad or angry or whatever you feel. Because only through that process of grief are you going to get on the other side when it is no longer the worst thing in the world.

So I really think that at least in my experience, space and no contact is the way to sort of rebuild your life and go out with your friends, you know, have as much of a social life as you can handle, and you will find yourself slowly over the course of time rebuilding a life that doesn't include that person. And eventually you will probably, if you're anything like me, look back on it and be like, huh, sure, I'm glad that happened. Now that's no comfort now, but I do think that sometimes it takes years, but you look back on your life and you feel grateful for the way things happened. I don't know.

Maybe that's maybe that's hope too much hope. Just give you the little bit of hope that going out and hanging out with your friends is a good thing to do. Yeah. Yeah, I agree.

I that's real rough. It's real rough. I have another hard question, John. Do you want another one?

Greatly out. Let's keep going. This one's from Gabby who asks, Dear Hank and John, I received a sexual invitation from a 60 year old former teacher a while ago. I am 17.

I was going with him. And I know him to be a very good man otherwise, but this thing made me so angry. I was angry that he felt attracted to me. I was angry that he expressed those feelings to me.

Why am I so angry? Well, Gabby, I think that your anger is justified for a lot of different reasons. I think this is all tied up with how you imagine this man is like a mentor and a friend, but obviously more of a you know, an authority and a leadership figure rather than a peer. And you had an image of this guy's a good person in your mind and he broke it and he did that with me.

He must have done it with the knowledge that that was the likely outcome. And I just can't I can't imagine that in another way. Yeah, I know. I mean, I think you know, you're angry because you've been hurt and betrayed in important ways.

Your trust is not betrayed. Your friendship has been betrayed and you've been sexualized and romanticized in ways that are really abusive to you ultimately. And it's not fair. It's not right.

And it's okay to be angry. I think that I think sometimes we feel guilty about being angry and that just like worsens the spiral of it. So maybe there's some comfort in knowing that it's okay to be angry that in fact, like I think anger is probably the appropriate emotional reaction there. And then just to create the distance that you need to to be well, but it's a huge betrayal and a big loss.

Yeah. And likely the cause of that is like some internal problems that he has. And it is completely possible to be a good guy otherwise and have also, you know, real issues that are very, you know, very problematic and that he, you know, at this point probably will never be able to deal with fully. And that's, you know, like, it's in like, yeah, I mean, this person intentionally sacrificed a good relationship for his own weakness.

And it's very difficult to see that weakness in someone who is much more powerful, much older. And so the result is just this sort of like deep, like, how could this have happened kind of feeling and also like oftentimes? And I don't know, this doesn't seem like a case in your situation, but it could be that somehow you are responsible for that, but you are not. Yeah.

Yeah. That's really important to emphasize. And also that like, there is no such thing, at least in my opinion, I feel pretty strongly about this as a healthy romantic relationship between a 17 year old and a 60 year old, because the power dynamic can never be equal, especially if that person is a former teacher, like in every way, this is clearly the wrong thing to have happened. Yeah.

Yeah. I'm just really sorry. But I think you've handled it well. All right.

Let's move on to another question and just try to see if we can continue this hilarious comedy podcast, Dear John and Hank. This might be the least funny episode of our comedy podcast ever, which is really saying something, not least because we haven't really talked about death yet. Let's try and work it out. Well, I will try to work death into, uh, into this question, actually, because I think I think it's almost impossible to be honest with you.

I think it's almost impossible to answer this question without talking about death. So that might be why it's an appealing question to me. Okay. You ready?

Yeah. This question comes from Maya, who asks, Dear John and Hank, I recently took a shower with another person for the first time and I very much enjoyed the experience and everything turned out fine. Even though this was a rather spontaneous event, I did find some time to worry about it, which left me wondering, why do Fartz smells so much worse in the shower with love? Maya, Maya even heroically included her last name, but I'm not going to read it in case her parents was in this podcast.

Well, Maya, I'm glad that you asked this question about why Fartz smells worse in the shower, especially when you're in the shower with someone else. The answer is that there are trillions of bacteria inside of your body and they are dying and eating, and as they die and eat, they make scent and that scent comes out as focus. Okay, but that's not the question. And in fact, I think you actually do know the answer to this question because you wrote about it in I believe an abundance of catherens.

I mean, I wrote that book like 10 years ago, I have no memory of it. Is that is that the I apologize for having done this to you right now, but that's the one with Colin who is who's the the child product? Yes, that's the one about the child product. Okay, well, he says, I do remember I do remember it's a basic subject matter.

Yeah, there's a there's a scene in that book where they talk about how when the shower turns on that shower curtain gets sucked toward you, but that seems like the wrong thing, right? It seems like the shower turned on and it should push the air out in the shower curtain shouldn't try and touch you with its cold sininess, right? You remember this part of the book? I do.

So what happens is, and Colin knows the answer to this. Colin, Colin, that right? Colin. Okay, good.

I got to remember his name. It creates an air current inside of the shower that's kind of like this like weird sort of heat and humidity tornado that is happening around you. And that brings air into the shower and in toward the middle of the shower in particular. And what's happening is all of the air that's in the shower is sort of like being rushed around your face and it's being taken from all around you and sort of brought up and out in this convection current in your shower.

And what's happening is your fart smell is just being brought much more quickly up to your nose without being dispersed very much. You're also of course an enclosed container when you're in a shower. It could have been the partner's fart smell. I don't know that somebody's fart smell.

The point is somebody's the sort of the remnants of the dead and dying and eating bacteria that colonize your body as being forced into your face. Yeah, right. Well, my read of this question was that Maya is worrying about a future potential problem rather than an actual occurrence in the first lovely experience of a partner showering. Maybe.

I don't know. I assume that it was like a sweet funny thing that happened and they were able to like laugh it off because you know we're having our first shower. Etc. Either way, I do believe that that is.

I'm just you know what I'm just happy that somebody is in apparently a happy relationship. Or just real close friends. You know. Yeah, yeah, right.

But that's still a relationship whether it's romantic or not is of less concern to me than just being like highly function. Well, John, this podcast is brought to you by non romantic partner shower farts. Non romantic shower farts. It's a little embarrassing but mostly just fun.

And of course, this podcast is brought to you by the news from A.M.C. Wimbledon, the news from A.M.C. Wimbledon. Oh, God.

I can't believe that I still don't get to talk about it yet. And of course, this podcast is brought to you by all those suckers who don't cheat in college. What are they thinking? Pay it money.

Learning. Come on. And finally, this podcast is brought to you by regular subway manes, regular subway manes containing more calories and fat than bread like the whole sandwich bread. So good.

It's delicious. Yeah, I love it. I love it. I hate manes.

There is no other than pickles. There is no sort of broadly available American food. I find more reprehensible than American manes. Oh my God.

I disagree. It is the best. It is the best. It is disgusting.

It always looks to me like some kind of industrial lubricant, you know, like it's used to make ball bearings work properly. I think it's color. It's sort of off white, yellowish color is a problem for manes. I think it's a branding issue.

And it were more like ranch dressing, which is sort of white with fun speckles. That would be better for manes. But in the end, I think that manes, it has a rich and rich flavor. And I'm 100% on the manes boat.

Emphasis on the rich, for sure. This podcast is brought to you by the manes boat. It's a boatman of manes. This podcast is also brought to you by our supporters on Patreon.

If you want to go to Patreon.com.com. You can join the community there. Whether or not you give us money, there is stuff there for you. But also, you can give us a buck or something to help us pay for our intern and our editor.

And they would appreciate it. This episode of Dear Hank and John is brought to you by Shopify. There are a lot of things that stand between I have an idea and this is an idea that actually exists in the world and people are buying things from me. And that is what Shopify makes easier.

When you start with Shopify, the tools, to design and launch and take payments, they're all there from day one. You don't have to build a whole machine before you can start building the business. And this is important because you also have to look good and with Shopify's templates, you can get a site set up really quick that looks credible and professional without needing to code or duct tape a bunch of different tools together. And when things look real, that works on my brain to be like, I'm doing a real thing.

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This episode of Deerhink.com is brought to you by Factor. Imagine for a moment that you are absolutely immersed in some work where you're creating something beautiful or useful or useless and ugly but you love it anyway. And suddenly you have a feeling and that feeling is that it is 2.30 pm and you did not eat lunch. What are you going to do?

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With new subscription only, wild supplies last until September 27th, 2026. See you website for more details. D.A.T. also we just got this question from Josh who writes deer, John and Hank is it possible to purchase a deer hank and John t-shirt.

Heck yes it is. Josh at dftba.com you can get an oh my god it's burning shirt which reminds me. Oh my god it's burning. Well done John.

Well done. We have another question this one's from Ryan and Ryan says deer hank and John my name is Ryan and I'm fortunate enough to live a pretty comfortable lifestyle by the way. Wait what's his name? By the way my name is Ryan.

So as the 17th time you said that his name is Ryan in the course of 12 seconds. So I've recently started to attend a new university and my new friends who call me Ryan are not as fortunate as me. One of my friends told me I don't know why Hank I don't know why that joke got me so much but it got me so much. Oh my god.

One of my friends told me oh god one of my friends said to me Ryan I can't afford groceries this week Ryan. Just keep doing it it doesn't stop being funny for me. It's like a sine wave. It's like every time I think that I've heard enough Ryan's another one comes and I'm like I'm literally in tears.

So I Ryan offered to pay for her groceries and she got mad at me who was Ryan for suggesting that for suggesting that and now won't even talk to Ryan anymore. I've had other similar experiences when trying to help my friends out. Am I wrong for trying to help my friends out financially? I just want to help them love Ryan who is Ryan Ryan.

I like your podcast. I'm sorry to laugh at what is not not a funny question. It's not a super funny question. It's also not like the heaviest one we've dealt with in this episode though.

So if I were gonna make a judge during one question. Here's what I would say Ryan. Ryan I think that you are trying to be nice and helpful. Would you say John?

would you say would you say he's trying? I would say Ryan that you are trying to be nice and helpful but when lots and lots of people tell you that you are not being nice or helpful it is important to listen to them. Right so if I am I think probably it ultimately isn't helpful to them to be constantly reminded that at a moment's notice you could help out with small problems they may have like groceries because probably the big financial problems that they have while they wouldn't be big financial problems for you are things that you can't easily solve for them like tens of thousands of dollars of college debt or whatever. So in my experience if someone asks for help that's one thing but I would wait until they ask.

Right I mean it's so hard to understand how weird money is in our society and what a gigantic divider it is among us. I would say to be conscious of your friends economic positions and like don't like if you know that your friends are having problems like paying for groceries don't be like let's go out to have drinks. Right find ways to like host at your house or at there. You can do nice things for these people and you can talk to them and like and help them with their issues but and also like don't loan them money to be clear giving money to a friend is always better than loaning money to a friend because then you're setting yourself up for a really weird power dynamic if you're sort of always expecting them to come back to you.

But you know if a friend is in a seriously bad situation and they need help it is willing is worth maybe having a serious conversation with them but this isn't a little thing when you're just like start to you know front your friends cash all the time. And like you know understanding the position that you are and can be very confusing to people who have never been in your situation just like just like you are going to not fully understand what it's like to be in their situation. So I applaud you for wanting to help out but it is surprising how weird this all is and you have to be careful because it's it's our weirdest thing I think we are we are we are I don't know if I don't know if money is our weirdest thing you know what I think is our weirdest thing at any moment completely without cause or explanation your entire existence can be snuffed out. Oh good go out again.

That is you're right. I think that is our weirdest thing John. All right. I think before we get to the news from AFC Wimbledon and Mars but mostly from AFC Wimbledon I am so excited we have one update from Katie who writes Dear John and Hank I love the podcast listening since the very first one.

Thank you Katie lots of people say that but only you mean it. I know several times you've discussed the issue of the human microbiome it is one of my passions and how bacteria can outnumber ourselves by several times or at least are a comparable number. However Hank did bring up that they are normally very small and this didn't seem to sway John since he still considers himself to be half bacteria. I don't consider myself to be half bacteria.

I am factually half bacteria. So I posed this question to you John do you consider a cupcake with one sprinkle to be equal parts cupcake and sprinkle. Do you consider a cupcake with even a couple sprinkles to be to be overwhelmingly sprinkle human and bacterial cells are similar in sizes relationally to a cupcake and a sprinkle. Is it not impossible to see that you are in fact not overwhelmingly bacteria and plus they're only really isolated to your mucus membranes and skin most of your inside is sterile.

Most of my inside. What are you saying about some of my inside Katie? Great deal of your inside is covered in bacteria as previously discussed. Yeah I mean lots of my stomach I was bactere crawling all over it.

The question would I consider a cupcake with one sprinkle to be equal parts cupcake and sprinkle. The answer to that is yes. So well I think without the context of our current conversation maybe you would have had a different take on that but I understand you sticking to your guns John because you're a stubborn dude. I am a man who passionately believes that he is half bacteria and there is no talking me out of it.

All right John let's do the news from Mars. Hey what's the news from Mars? What's the news from Mars? What's the news from Mars?

Okay well the news from Mars. Make it fast. Make it fast. We've got a science bat going on in the Mars community right now.

Neil deGrasse Tyson and Elon Musk are having a bit of a tiff. Mostly it's Neil deGrasse Tyson and Elon Musk ignoring it but Neil thinks that it's ludicrous that SpaceX is going to lead the space frontier. He in fact calls it a delusion and said that it's just not going to happen because the US government or governments have much more long-term views of these things and can afford to invest over decades to make one thing happen whereas private sector is much much worse things. People have different takes on this of course and in the Mars community it's been quite a little bit of a frockus I believe is a word that means what I mean and Elon Musk's take on the other hand is just to ignore the whole thing and continue to just make billions of dollars.

Right oh it's hard out there for Elon Musk. Sometimes he has to mute Neil deGrasse Tyson on Twitter. All right John I made it as quick as I could so that you could get to the AFC one of the news which I agree is pretty cool. This week it was announced that the AFC Wimbledon story.

Do you want to first tell us how they're doing in the table just like just a quick overview? Not good. Yeah AFC Wimbledon have dropped to 10th in league to having lost a critical game against Hartlepool, one Neil and are now unlikely to reach the playoffs but there's eight games to go and you know hope is the thing with feathers etc. For instance if you told me three months ago that I was going to get to announce this news today I wouldn't have believed you so who knows the future is unpredictable that's what makes it so amazing and terrible.

This week it was announced that the AFC Wimbledon story will be told in movie form. This is in a movie to be made by Fox 2000 studios produced by Wic and Isaac at Temple Hill and by Rosiana and me at We Don't Have a Name for Our Production Company. But this is amazing. So I mean like you've told the story of Avis Wood and many times in fact it appears sometimes to me that you tell it every single time you do the news because you gotta make it seem interesting but you have not told it in the true full exciting built into a narrative movie way.

I love love sports movies. I don't like sports but I love sports movies. They just get me so excited. I always cry.

I know you're gonna cry. You're gonna cry with Danny Kenwell. It goes up to take that critical penalty. Don't don't spoil it for me.

I mean I am so excited about this. This is something that I've wanted to do of course for ever since I got a production deal with Fox and so I pitched the idea to them. I told them the AFC Wimbledon story you know just a small group of really middle-aged people who had this community institution that they love taken away from them and responded to that not with hopelessness or despair but with a strange and beautiful commitment to restart it even if that meant being in the ninth tier of English football even if that meant you know sitting on hay bales to watch games and even if it meant having public you know public tryouts in a park with no uniforms or coaches or anything and then they built it up in just nine years all the way to a football league team that's a full-time professional club again. It is an amazing story about how people who have a shared commitment in what in the time that we often associate with midlife crises can instead like find real meaning in their lives and a real community and kind of have a new life in a way.

And AFC Wimbledon got to have that new life and so did the people who are at the center of the story. I'm so excited about this. I mean obviously there's a long long way to go like they've got a higher writer and then find a screenplay that they like and then find a director. It's just an incredibly long process.

Things often go haywire but it's just so exciting. Like I just think I really believe that the story of this this club in the nine years that these guys spent together building it I should say guys and women spent together building it is an amazing it's just an amazing story and the more like you dig into the details the more amazing it becomes and I think you know that moment of getting back into the football league and a penalty shoot out with your 37 year old captain who's never played again professional football in his life getting into the football league in the most dramatic way possible. It's just a great it's a great story. I'm so excited.

I can't I mean I am so freaking excited for the prospect of an AFC Wimbledon movie and I know it's a little bit of a weird movie to be the first one that we produce with our still unnamed production company but it also isn't because you know we like heartfelt stories about real people and and this is that. So I think it's a great story. I agree. I'm so excited when you first told me that you were thinking about you know pitching this.

It seemed kind of like a no-brainer to me because it's just it's a great story and it's not a super expensive one to tell. It seems right up Fox two thousands alley and and I you know like I mean I think the movie is going to be very well in South London. It's gonna kill it in South London. We're gonna I mean I don't know if we'll be the number one movie in America but we'll definitely be the number one movie in South London.

No I think you know the other thing is that there's soccer fandom is growing around the world but especially in the US and and I think learning about the history of one club and how it's looked. How you know what makes English football special which I think AFC one really captures what makes English football so special and makes the football pyramid so special. I think I think it'll excite American fans too. So and it's it's a heartwarming love story really.

It's a love story about these these people who loved their club and love each other but it's also there's also you know some romantic love stories in it. So it's gonna be it's gonna have something for everybody. I'm very excited. Do you have any idea like what the timeline is on something like this?

I have no idea what the timeline is. Sometimes things happen in like two years like it did with the paper town's movie. Sometimes 11 years later like with the looking for a laskin movie it's just two people who no longer speak to each other. So you never know how it's gonna go.

All right John what did we learn today? Oh we learned that the AFC Wimbledon movie is going to be the greatest thing ever. We learned that John Green has a lot of thoughts on Keynesian economics and how the viewpoints of it have been reinforced by the economics stimulus plan of 2009 that is called. I'm gonna catch so much from America is better recovery act.com.

I am going to catch a lot of flack for what I said about Keynesian economics from the Austrians out there. Not the people in in Austria the people who ascribe to the Austrian school of I see I do not know I do not know. What else did we learn? We learned that there's something with Mars, Neil deGrasse Tyson going to Mars private enterprise public funds AFC Wimbledon movie.

I can't remember we learned something about Mars. Yes AFC Wimbledon movie something about Mars and we learned uh you know and also and also John a young man named Ryan taught us that Ryan's name is Ryan. The main thing we learned is that is that Ryan's name is Ryan. Hey can I tell you a quick story that probably shouldn't be included in the podcast?

Yeah okay. All right so for some reason there was a fact recently in a Menofloss video that caused me to laugh so uproariously that we had to briefly cancel the issue and this was the fact that in 2006 a New Zealand man tried to sell Australia on eBay. I mean there's so many good facts on Menofloss I don't know why that's the one. It's just every detail of that fact.

Every detail of that fact is just so beautiful. I could just picture the New Zealand man like putting together all of his pictures of Australia to use in the eBay listing. All right thank you for the story John. And thank you listener for listening to our podcast.

If you were watching it that's super creepy. You're looking at the LA and in the NFL is at the same time and which of these windows are you looking at there's a lot of windows in this house. But thanks for listening and thank you John for joining me. Yes our podcast is edited by Nick West Jenkins.

Our intern is Claudia Morales. We're very grateful to Rosie Anna Hausberg for help in gathering questions. You can email us at hankandjohn at gmail.com or use the hashtag dear hankandjohn on Twitter or snap us on snapchat. I'm John Green Snaps or John Green Snaps depending on how you read it.

Hank is Hank GRE. Gunnaral is responsible for our theme music. John is responsible for all of our thoughts of morbidity and I am responsible for basically attempting to carry this entire thing on the weight of my own shoulders because everyone knows that John's bad stuff. And as they say in our hometown don't forget the awesome.

I'm not going to give you a chance to respond. Ha ha ha.