This is the Rose and Shine podcast featuring the Swedish sisters Josephine Rose and Victoria Rose Olsen They used to stop from in New York which experiences from our international lives and careers Good afternoon from Stockholm. This is Victoria and good morning from New York. This is Josephine. Welcome back from Malta.
How has it been? Jo-san Thank you. It's been good. I had a lovely lovely wedding weekend in Malta, which was fantastic meeting up with old friends And yeah, now I'm back in New York.
It's a it's a full-on week here in New York It's the General Assembly the meeting of the General Assembly Which means that all the world leaders are gathering in New York for one week, which is very exciting and makes it really hard to get to the office How exciting I can imagine. Yeah, no, it's it's really cool. You have a all of the yeah All of the presidents and prime ministers they're all here and they're sharing their views in the world and yeah, that's really good So I saw the pictures from the New Zealand Prime Minister with her little baby. That's so cool.
It's the baby really in the meeting Yeah, so that was in the pre meeting she hasn't done like the big meeting yet, but yeah, it's super cool Yeah, so she the Prime Minister in New Zealand seems to be doing everything right at the moment So she has her three-month-old baby that she's breastfeeding and so her and her husband and the baby are coming along on her trips and yeah, no, she's just giving a really amazing sign of a motherhood and being able to be in office and taking care of kids at the same Time, so it's it's quite inspiring. I have to say that's brilliant. Yeah, yeah, definitely So while you are kind of taking care of the big world out there by the UN I've been having family board meeting which been really interesting I took an ego day Which I you know we've talked about it before and it doesn't happen too often But every third month or so and that was just so lovely a day of reflection and just not thinking so much bringing no digital Gadgets with me and just really resting that was really lovely and me and Patrick were part of our brother were part of helping organizing this ego day Right, you made the ego day so much nicer than my previous ones because it was actually your birthday gift that made me not only having the ego day But having the ego day at a spa which was beautiful and very nice. So thank you very much.
I'm happy. Enjoy that Yeah, so now we are super busy working on all the different things going on Yeah, yeah, and for example setting up the rose and shine Clubs which we've gotten a lot of registrations for which is really fun and cool and we'll have this first event in Stockholm actually where Obviously we have most applications to form a club from so it will be on the 17th of October So if you're interested, let us know yeah, it sounds like it's going to be a really nice evening at welcome hotel Right, so you're inviting everybody who's been interested and everyone who might be interested. Yeah, exactly So that's really exciting preparing for that and then we're preparing for our very first challenge Yeah, so today's episode is really about our first challenge which we call give a boost Yeah, and the idea is that we want to inspire you to go out and give more people around you both actually So it's a third-a-day challenge and we of course this is for ourselves as well, right? We're gonna give at least 20 boosts during the month of October during the month of October exactly Yeah, so to all women and basically that's what this episode is gonna be all about Inspiration and ideas on why boosts are so important how we should do it when we should do it and some stories on how and when it happened Just as well, right?
Yeah, and this is I think it's going to be so much fun. This is really a call to action You know, this is really how we create and boost and build this community of a strong and fun and cool women really supporting each other Exactly. So we're really quite excited to be throwing this challenge out there and see what we can all do with it Yeah, exactly And I'd say this is kind of the core of Rosenshined entire idea the power of sisterhood and us having said and do believe that we want to be This positive force together with all of you out there listening in really boosting each other and closing that gap out there between Men and women in leadership positions around the world, right? Yeah, and when we talked about this podcast episode we were thinking what on the one hand, you know, women are I think we're really good at boosting each other You know in a in a private setting we're really good at giving compliments to our sisters or mothers or friends Or you know, I think women can be very sweet like that But we still feel that it might be lacking a little bit in the corporate world Yeah, the boost energy that we give in the you know everyday lives We don't always bring it with us into the office, right?
No, we were talking about this and sometimes it's like okay If you make I mean I've been sitting in quite a few leadership teams in the past 20 years and been also most of the times one of the Few women on that leadership and it's kind of I think sometimes you have that idea that you have one of the let's say three spots on that leadership That team that is designated for women So you better do your outmost to keep that but maybe you don't really think about what can I do to actually Amplify and encourage other women that we take on more space in these environments actually Yeah, and I think you're so right about that I think it's sometimes it's a feeling of even we wouldn't admit it to ourselves But there might be a feeling of competition or a feeling that You know, we have to fight to get to that place and that there's not an abundance of roles for women Yeah, so I'm thinking about a moment earlier in my career when we were all young ambitious women heading up the different departments in Heading up similar departments, but in different sectors of the organization Uh-huh, we were so ambitious and loved meeting with each other, but I'm thinking could we have amplified each other better? I felt that slight sense of competition and not really working together But rather in silos and to really we should have just sat together said hey Let's see what we can do to increase the importance of what we're working with even more within our organization Did that to a certain extent, but I think we could have been even better actually Okay, so let's talk about different ways of boosting and I remember when we had our first club meeting with the the Stockholm or one of the Stockholm clubs We were discussing, you know How could we boost each other and one word that kept coming up was the word that we should amplify each other and I mean amplifying It literally means to increase the volume and you gave such a brilliant example then on an article that you had read, right? Yeah, it was actually a seminar at the UN I was talking about you know How do we more actively engage women and how do we more actively engage women into leader positions and it was everything from peace processes to to local politics and the ideal amplifying really came from women that were working in the White House under the Obama administration and They were finding that in the first administration there was a lot more men that were working as AIDS than women Mm-hmm. What they then started to do was that they actively started to reinforce or amplify each other in meetings So when a woman had said something they would repeat it and say you know as Victoria said previously I think that's a really good point and really making sure that the points that women had made were being really loud and clearly heard by everyone That's really what a great idea.
Did they see results or how does it work? Yes, that was the amazing thing that they've really started to see results So women were much more included and at the second Obama administration there were 50 50 50 men and women in the administration So it's kind of just like finding out the strategy What are we really doing to make that difference and making each other heard exactly? And I mean how often haven't we been in meeting? I've been laughing with women reflecting about this where you say something and then you know 10 minutes later a man repeats it and just kind of Take it as his own idea and no one else had heard it before.
Yeah, that's true So by really you actually give it a name you give it a person you give it a woman Yeah, that's a really a great idea to do yeah and simple Yeah, exactly very simple and could be very practically incorporated So that's what I'm trying to do now in meetings I'm trying to think about is there a way of you know picking up what another woman had previously said and reinforcing that That's that's a really nice idea I mean I'm working with this project group that we're writing this book on management together And I must say that many of the ones in the group they're really good at doing this I mean just across border women men everything and it's just so really nice when someone said you know as Victoria said previously Yeah, I said that you know and it's a simple cool way that makes you feel good as well as amplifying what you just said And I wonder whether Americans are maybe a little bit better at that in Sweden I don't know if we do it as much you know We maybe don't give credit so much is a little bit kind of cringy sometimes in our culture to be seen over the top Whereas whereas here I feel people are very articulate and very good at doing that so that's maybe something that we can learn Yeah, I guess I take it out to the Europeans to be a bit more amplifying each other, you know, that's a great idea Yeah, so so you're definitely you're already doing this now conscious. I'm trying yes But so you I mean you're working in the I would say conflict industry But I guess a better way to say the piece process, etc So how is that how are women heard and amplified within? I mean that's a big problem in a sense And we talk about it quite a lot right now because women are often not active parts or active fighting in a conflict Which is interesting in itself in itself Yes, and then when you come to the negotiation table or to draw the peace deals often those who are rewarded are those that have been fighting Right, they are the ones that get to decide the future of the country whereas women then are often excluded And I mean the statistics around it are are really sad I think at the moment we have something like in statistics of the peace deals about eight percent women were participating in these negotiations worldwide And the study that has been made that's just so interesting I mean just in general the fact that you use the people who created the war to discuss peace when maybe you should talk more to the people Who were not there making the war happen in the first place Exactly and the ones that actually have been keeping the social fabric together during that time And you actually have often kept some of the normality going and yes So you and women have some really good statistics on this if anyone is interested But they found that if women are included in the peace process There's a 20% increase in the probability of agreement lasting at least two years I mean often peace agreements break very quickly and there's a 35% increase in the probability of an agreement lasting for 15 years Wow, so it really increases the odds and again This is you know imagine if more women were participating more than the 8% that we're talking about it could really have some some impact Yeah, that's super cool But okay, so that's like you and peace processes is quite big and quite honorable if we were to sort of move it down to a level and say You know give a boost I think it also doesn't have to be that super complex But it could also be simple things like being better to give energy and encouragement to give thumbs up and you know simple ways of actually Making people feel better because I think that would make the world a better place really Yeah, absolutely and trying to do it as we said a little bit in the work environment Not only, you know, not only on kind of outside of work but in the work so we've written a little bit or yeah No, yeah, exactly So I think that's that's it, you know and also not only at home or with your friends But really do it a little bit more consciously look for opportunities to share energy because you know when you meet someone who is giving you that energy boost How great you feel so what can you do to give that out to others? I think that's a great thing.
Yeah, so we said that the things that you can do in order to you know giving everybody a little bit of Inspiration for the challenge so it's really about uploading someone who makes an effort. Mm-hmm giving sincere compliments Yeah, definitely I'm a firm believer in giving people smiles actually I sounds like a dull thing to do but it's you're so simple and really like a proper one, okay Yeah, well that count is like hey, I smiled to someone today. Well that count is a boost you think I think it's a nice thing to do and I think it's gonna like it really ties the women's empowerment At work, but maybe it could help to give that extra encouragement to make that person there saying what she needs to say or do what she needs to do I guess you know if you're a bit more aware of the energy that you spread and sometimes I say I'm very often in front of Audiences and it's quite interesting to watch your audience because sometimes it's like everyone in the audience kind of forget that I see them too, right? They see me but I see them and you see all this yeah some people that you know You really want to keep looking at because they're sharing this brilliant energy and they're all enthusiastic and they're nodding and smiling and that makes you feel great And others to kind of have this deadpan look on their face and just like yeah And sometimes I'm thinking like I wonder if they're aware of what kind of energy that they're spreading around and how much yeah Happier I feel to sort of share the ideas or the theories or whatever it is that I'm working with them on with the people that really look that they want to have Yeah, and put away your phones, right?
Like when people are looking into your phone when you're having a lecture speaking Oh, that's so not so much of encouragement. Yeah, actually I always set up the rules You know before we go into workshop and I share some statistics on the brains and how you learn and how you don't learn and then Usually people voluntarily put away their phones. Yeah, same how you voluntarily But social media and phones often get a lot of bad or negative publicity, right? Yeah, but we saw some good There are also good ways of boosting people.
Yeah, and I guess you know exactly as you say, you know social media gets lots of negativity And we say that we're addicted to all these likes, etc And then I'm thinking to myself if we're so addicted to all these likes, isn't it because it also makes us feel good? I mean, I'm not saying that we should take fancy selfies of ourselves and be happy because people actually just complimented our looks or anything But to do a little bit more of likes, I think is great And then we saw this LinkedIn initiative that they were really giving I think like five or six different options on how to thank people around them So if that's definitely would count as this boost I think to share one of those for people that really meant something to you and they call it hashtag kudos or something like that Yeah, yeah, exactly It's a perfect way of boosting each other and that was really aimed towards professional, you know, giving it professional recommendations and yeah Yeah, it's cool Yeah, and I also think you know reach out to those people that have meant a lot to you in your career You know, maybe a previous manager and you say hey, this is what I really learned from you And this is what I really loved about working with you and thank you, you know Take a little bit time to consciously do that. Yeah, and doing that. I mean now it might sounds calculating But doing that can also give you so much back.
Yeah, I mean it opens so much doors I think at any point when you want to interview someone or talk to someone if you just start by genuinely really saying what you appreciate with them And it's so much more likely and then so much more possible But of course and not in a malicious way But just rather like if you say what you appreciate about someone you will make them feel more relaxed and comfortable If your intention is to really share what you like about people I think to look for opportunities to say that is great Yeah, so it can be people that you know, but also you could look for people that you don't know I mean last year I decided to really try to see if I could arrange meetings with people that I admired and that you know that I thought were cool role models to learn new things Right. Yeah, so I reached out and and sent you know like for one person for example She's the founder of this big school Organization in Sweden, so she's I don't know how many schools they have now But I really love her style and I love what she's created in Sweden It's called the Inga school on the English school So and I met her at an event briefly and then I did send her a mail and you said hey I just really loved what you've been doing we met there and there could I invite you for lunch because I would just want to hear more about your life journey And she's now in oh, I don't want to say this wrong, but I would guess in her 70s. Maybe Anyway, she's a bit older And so anyways, I sent out this invite and I ended up going with her and her husband on this most lovely Lunch that lasted for almost two hours and I got to hear their entire life story and like challenges and things And I learned so much from that lunch And maybe she didn't learn as much but I do think that I gave her a boost by just sort of really being really interested in You had to say I think that's one of the best foods when you're really interested and when people really take interest in you, right? Yeah, so do that go out and take interest in people So think actually consciously think about who are people that inspired you and they can be famous or not so famous But let them know send them a message and just share that right?
Yeah, and also, you know, I think some people have talent for this. I'm thinking of a friend of mine She said the general and you know her as well, Prinilla She's the general manager of a large hotel in the north of Sweden a large resort ski resort Yeah, and she's just she's doing this so brilliantly so every time I've been talking with her I just really feel like wow I'm such a great person, you know because she's like wow we try and no one can and you know She's just like giving me such a great boost and of course when I get that boost from her I want to give it in return, right? So that's like we usually talk when we're driving somewhere and we try and call each other and maybe we succeed like every Time or something, but then that you know that's like a 15 minute power boost. So that's great.
Yeah, okay. That's perfect Very good examples. I think the calling especially when you live in a different time zone So I have my morning routine where I always walk to work and call someone and now it's always you because now it's always about the risen shine Thank you. Yes, that's lovely But I also beforehand before there was only you in my life I actually used to call other people and see that as a chance of you know, but my call was the nicest Maybe not my mom's was better Anyway, let's move on to our third which is the scary word of feedback, every enforcing feedback You want to explain?
Yeah, and why is it scary? Well working on this book we came across some research on feedback And do you know that if you hear the word if someone tells you I want to give you some feedback Most of us get the same physical reaction as if some if you're standing somewhere dark night and someone comes up from behind you That's the feeling that you get from hearing. I want to give you feedback. Yeah, and that's supposed to be a neutral word, right?
It's supposed to be a neutral word. Yeah, so I think what we want to talk about here in the topic of boost is to be better in giving reinforcing feedback And I read this other well actually someone told me that made me think of a feedback also But someone said to me every time you shop, you know You go to supermarkets and you pick your brand of different serials or whatever it is You're kind of voting for what product the supermarket should keep in stock. Yeah, right? You're casting your vote This is what I want you to keep in stock for me.
Yeah, right? And in a sense I'm thinking reinforcing feedback should be the same idea, right? That you're like every time that you you should think I'm like, hey, I'm voting for this behavior, right? I saw something that I really liked to be a bit quicker.
Yeah, and share that exactly So when you're seeing friends, you're voting for friends behavior in a way, or friends colleagues. Yeah, definitely Yeah, so what is it that you like to see in your work environment that you really like when someone is doing? So point that out vote for that behavior, right? Yeah, I will go voting today.
Very good. Yeah, so you'll go into some votes and or cast some votes And just really from the management expert within me, I used to say if you want to give reinforcing feedback You don't just want to say, hey, well done But you really want to explain what it is that you saw and how that made you feel why you liked it so much and the impact that behavior had on you are on others, etc So that's the way. Okay, that's good to remember. Yeah, it actually Makes me think of something you told me that your manager gave you some feedback and she told you that you were such a natural connector, right?
Yeah, look where it took us here. We are trying to connect everybody. Yeah, exactly Yeah, no, but it's super important sometimes to hear those things and yeah, it can really reinforce behavior. Yeah, very good Yeah, so reinforce and then what else did we talk about?
Well, we talked about so that our fourth kind of boosting was to recommend someone Yeah, right. I think it's a little bit similar to kind of give your vote But but it's more about doing it, I guess to other people as well So recommending one person to another person and I think in my I've seen it quite a lot now lately I have quite a few people that are working within starting up a new company or a new business and you know, you get these emails with requests Can you like this page? Can you give me an Amazon review? Can you do something like that and you obviously have much more creative friends tonight because I usually don't get that I think many of my friends are more like in corporate business.
So my millennial friends. Yeah, out real jobs But you did and but yes very creative, but now we're doing it we're asking people to sort of tell us what they think about what we're doing Well, it's happy So that's the thing you start to do something like that on your own and you realize that those emails that you sometimes potentially have you know Missed or ignored or something you've realized how important it is to really support and boost others You know because everyone is putting such an effort and it is actually really quite easy to do it to go in and do it given Amazon review or or you know, like someone's new app that they have developed So now I really actively try to do that when I get that email I click on it immediately and I try to give that boost And I think that's yeah, that's really good I try to do it consciously too and I'm thinking this is what the digital You know revolution or digital society of today gives us so many more opportunities to do that and how it's kind of changed the rules Really look at TripAdvisor before you were really had to look at the official rating of the hotel I never really do that I look at what's the rating on TripAdvisor before I book my hotel Exactly, so it's kind of a community way of seeing what people really think. Yeah, so do that recommend people like their pages And you'll get a lot back from that as well. I think yeah Finally the fifth point that we really thought of is a very simple one But it's really about being kind, you know, take that time out and here again comes a big smile that we talked about But look for a moment to share a bit of love people are so stressed There's so many things going on what can you do to spread that energy and be a bit nice You know in the metro in a meeting at a conference to the speaker like we said before I really think that can make a big difference exactly cuts everyone a little bit of slack and think that they are probably coming from a good place So give them some time as well.
Yeah, and I also in that I guess also accept help from others You know and because usually that also creates a boost to really see that hey someone really wanted to help me What can I do? Yeah, didn't you have a story about not accepting help? Yeah, you're thinking yeah, I did And it obviously it's like 15 years ago and I still remember it It haunts me a little bit but so I was with my daughter at the time in the supermarket And she was just sort of entering her terrible choose and I was pregnant with my second daughter, right? So she's having this attack like obviously no other parents have their children's had But she had this attack and kind of fit really on the floor of the supermarket And I was there and I done all my shopping with all the bags and everything like completely distressed and pregnant and sweaty and everything Yeah, and then this lovely woman comes up to me and she goes do you need help?
And it's so weird, but you know what I said no, I'm like no no, I'm fine And then I'm like so then I'm like no, and I obviously wasn't fine You know so here I was super pregnant carrying Isabel under one arm and all these bags under the other arm and like all sweating getting myself out to the car You know and obviously I wasn't fine, but why did I say that? Why didn't I let this lovely woman actually help me, you know? Yeah, that reminds me of me doing absolutely completely the opposite when I was traveling with Raphael And he was like a small baby in the subways of London and I just like arranged like 10 people to help me You carry the back, you carry the front, I carry the baby T-word, yeah, exactly. That's a great example But I do think many of us are like we should be these good girls and not accept help from each other Like that's something that makes you less independent or anything So I guess on the other hand let people give you a boost let them help you I would say right?
Absolutely, let's boost and get help. So what's our conclusion right? Well, let's wrap up all of our amazing tips that we've been providing. Yes So concluding what we've said we want to create a challenge for everyone to really boost each other So for 30 days during the month of October, we want to challenge you to give at least 20 boosts to women around you ideally that you're working with or have been working with maybe on your same level and report about it because we know if we report it it's more likely to happen Yeah, so you download our pep sheets on rooseandshine.com I've been hearing comments that we say roose the way that we say roast which is wrong so it's R-O-O-S and shine dot com yeah, so use our pep sheet where you find first of all some inspiration on how and who you should boost and then yeah ideally write about it on Instagram use the hashtag give a boost and roose and shine so that we get to hear about all the great initiatives that you do.
Yeah, give a boost and roose and shine and yeah, please use Instagram like show us some pictures show us the consequences of your boosting Yeah, or even LinkedIn as we said before LinkedIn Facebook make it official make the world see all the love that you're sending out I would say sounds very good to me Hopefully this has given you lots of inspiration and that you feel excited to join our challenge and also talk to your colleagues around you you know the female leaders on your level in your organization and see can you be inspired from the White House challenge and really amplify each other at your workplace Yeah, so have fun have great boosting each other and we're looking forward to hear from you Yeah, exactly. Empathy, giving encouragement, giving forcing feedback, recommend and then share some kindness Yeah, there we go. Yeah, excellent. Well, thank you everyone We're looking forward to hear how your boosting is going and quite excited about it Bye