Cleveland doesn't belong. In my opinion. In fact, if you went behind theinnacle, ...it's my reason that you didn't believe in other markets. Buddy...
And the next one, and the next one in the next one, is the next day. That's the beginning of this conversation. You're an orphan. You're not a professor, you're an orphan.
You're an orphan, you're an orphan. And you're not a student, you're not a student. You're not a student. So, Janimask went on America War, which is Norwegian state television.
And it became quite controversial. Yeah, absolutely. For so many reasons it was controversial. What I did, first I interviewed this social constructist construct this and asked them to you know explain why men and women tend to work on different areas and then I went to United States and talked to Stephen Pinker and a lot of you know well logically informed psychologists and scientists and then I said and I looked at the Norwegian sociologists and I said what are they saying this is all wrong I mean how did they heard about evolution and then I went back and showed that again to these first guys I interviewed and then they said we don't believe this so they felt betrayed in a way because even though I told them that I'm going to show these clips to some other experts they didn't know that I was going to Cambridge and Harvard and find these top-notch people so it felt unfair but in science aren't you supposed to be peer-reviewed yeah but normally your peers are agreeing with you when it comes to some of the gender researchers so but even though it was controversial I felt when the debate started that the we kind of we convince people and it and it and the debate about gender hasn't been the same since you have to consider this nature perspective all the time you have to before you can ignore that you could just pretend that there couldn't be any inborn differences between women and women now you have to at least take that into consideration yeah and this led as far as my research can tell that you were sort of not sued I wouldn't call it sued but someone reported the show to your press ethics committee yeah yeah because it's it's that of course you edit this show you don't show like when I interview people I talked them for an hour and I edited down so he felt he was edited and so he was quoted out of context yes yes and then I put out or we put out the whole interview like two and a half hours so everybody could see it and then I was I was uh would you say I was not committed no I was not uh I was freed you were acquitted acquitted yes by the press ethics committee who said that your lawyer and son was in the wrong basically and your show had committed no flaws in its reporting and its method no that's right but uh if I'm I was not aware whole angry people but on because people I was on the you know on the common man and woman side so people but so angry so he was I made his life hell for a couple months there so it was tough on him so uh you have to I was so I thought so much about these ideas and the truth and all that so I kind of forgot the people when I made the show so but I think he has a good life now he's not a he's not a researcher anymore he quit so um yeah I hope he has a happy life now he's a good man and you know he wants the best thing he wants men and women to be equal and but he's not the scientist according to what I the road to hell is paved with good intentions sometimes for the children for science for a gender equality yeah yes so yeah it was fun um so I hope I always wanted you to make that show in swin but that has not been so easy I don't know because when I contacted you and said I want to make a show like yours but um since you've already made your show can I just get the rights or buy the rights and you're like you can have the rights for free and I was like yay and you and then you added because I already tried to give the this to us with you which is the Swedish state television and so would you please tell me about that first we uh we wanted to just we asked us or the buildings that are doing that's a that's a part of public service which is our name public service is our name for Swedish state television Swedish state radio and it would be links to origin which is kind of like educational radio but it's on tv so yeah it's a bit radio it's just radio with pictures so tv is radio but and then they wouldn't show it and then finally didn't give you any reason like you can show it for free and I just thought it was fun to put it out in Sweden where I thought it was even gonna be even more controversial so um and okay they have some reasons I don't know about those but then we pitched it we pitched basically the same concept um for Svetan and they thank no and when you pitch those shows you don't get like a long explanation of why they don't want it so I don't know what the discussions were behind closed doors but I know you did some research did you well I did and then I tried to get your show made in Swedish with a female uh show host and you know uh I tried to make it I tried to get it made for years horrid yeah I went to every department on Svetia and pitched this show and they all said no most of them didn't want to even respond to my emails so I continued to dig in this but but then I turned my attention to Norway again because I realized I wasn't gonna get this made in Sweden and I did my own stand-up show about it and released it on youtube for whatever that's worth and I have informed people in this podcast and so on and so forth about your show and that they can watch it on youtube and I hope it has helped us that some because I think it's a very important show for people to see and then but it had something happened because in 2011 Norway stopped funding NIC which was like the Nordic Nordic countries Institute for Gender Research right so what happened there it's hard to know what was going on behind closed doors again whether it was speculated whether my show had had some impact on that decision I don't know to be but it was a huge debate in Norway in all the papers for six months yeah yeah and it was it was obvious to everybody that a lot of what was going on in the gender research was not very scientific and I got a lot of email from you know other academics saying you know we talked about this for years but we don't have the courage or we don't have the time to go into all those arguments so thank you so much for doing that shitty job because it was time it was over time that somebody did it so it was obvious that like the scientific consensus was that this is bad science but okay doesn't cost too much money let them do they work you know it's always like that in every organization you have to have some people are the list doing something that doesn't really work but just keep them quiet so and then I guess it was when all this came into the open when we did the this TV show they felt that they couldn't finance it anymore maybe I don't know I haven't done any inside before it's but what I was struggling with all the time when we made the show that this was not an anti-feminist show it was not a right-wing show it was all about truth and science and being curious so when I we were struggling with you know emphasizing that this is not an anti-feminist show we never criticized any feminists they can you know they're doing a legit struggle we're just criticizing gender researchers and this is not a right-wing show we're not anti-gender equality in any way we're not personally I'm a social democrat but when I pitched it to the SOTEP I just realized when I talked to them that in their ears this is such a right-wing project this is so it's a reactionary conservative and a man white male I just felt it was all so wrong it was easier for me when I was I worked in our case I was already on the inside so I can talk to all the bosses and say you know it's gonna be so and so we're gonna do it this way it's harder to come from the outside and to convince them that I realized this is not going to be like a Saudi democrat or whatever kind of a show so I realized that for them it was it was impossible but to make it because it would look so bad it would look like SOTEP all into you know being republican right-wing all-fashioned 50s reactionary you know all that so um but you're pro-genre quality right oh yeah absolutely absolutely and I'm even I'm quite open to you know should we I think it's important to have more female engineers likewise I think it's important to have more male psychologists which which there are hardly any young men going into psychology anymore so I'm pro this kind of name and project totally with the wrong method you won't get the result you want I think it's I think it's even more important if you uh if you want to make the gender gender egalitarian society you have to know what gender is yes you can't base that on the line foreign