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Hey, I'm Molly. I'm a teacher raising two kids in St. Augustine, Florida. And I'm Sarah, a new mom to one sweet babe living in Brooklyn, New York. Between five busy households, it's a miracle we make it on the mic at all. But trust me, we need this as much as you do. Hi, guys. Welcome to Nursing and Cursing. Hey, guys. Hi. Hi. So we're going to talk about how you know when you're done having kids. How do you know when you're done having kids? How do I know? Exactly. Take it away, Sarah. No, thanks. Did you guys have a preconceived number in your head like growing up or when you got married? How many kids you wanted to have?
Yes. No. Yes. What was your number? My number was three because I'm one of three. And I just figured, oh, OK, yeah, you have three kids. But growing up, I also thought that every parent's name was Betsy and Jim. For a lot of years. For a lot of years. With our dolls and both of our husband's name was Jim. I just I thought that's what it was. I thought a mom was Betsy and dad was Jim, like all parents across the board. But no, three. I always imagine.
I always imagine three as well, Allie, for the same reasons. And it wasn't until I had one that I was like, oh, yeah, no. Wait, so Molly, did you, when you and Tim got married and started planning a family, were you like the numbers three? No, work that way. He is never going to okay something that far in advance. He's always like, well, we'll see how it goes, we'll see how it goes, we'll see how it goes. And I would just be like, mm-hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm.
That's a very realistic approach to the number of kids you should have. That's the kind of husband I have. He's very realistic. Once I actually had the pregnancy and then the birth and then the actual having the child, I was like, okay, the other thing I thought I wanted, which comes from the way I was raised, is I thought I wanted my kids really close together because Allie and I are 18 months apart and we have been two peas in a pod since the day she was born. Very, very close. So I thought, I'll just replicate that. You're right.
Yeah. Like actually doing that, you would have to be pregnant with a nine month old baby. Like, and many women do that, but oh my God, no, I could not. That would be like me or Chrissy getting pregnant right now. Oh my God. Can you imagine? Wow. Wow. That's crazy. It is crazy. But people do it way even more intense than that. All the time. Yeah. In a way that's so smart because it's, because a six month old baby, you're, I mean, you're obviously like, you're so tired and you feel.
fucked up and whatever but in a weird way you haven't hit the worst stage yet like I'd be more likely to want another baby when I was hanging out with a six-month-old than I would be to want another baby when I'm hanging out with a 22-month-old because when I'm hanging out with a 22-month-old I'm like oh my oh my god kids are no no I'm never doing this again yeah it also just depends like what stage you like too but um Did you have any idea what you wanted? I think I wanted just two also because I was a family of just two, me and my sister. But I definitely wanted closer in age. My sister and I are seven years apart. We are not close at all. And I always kind of attributed that to the age gap. I think three would be so awesome, but I just don't want to have the baby stage again, even though I love it so much. It's so hard for me. I would love to just kind of cut to age two and have my head. Sarah's on her first kid. I mean, I'm sure the jury's out. How do you feel?
Well, I mean, I don't know how I felt growing up. I don't remember. I think I went through that stage where I was like, oh, I'm never having kids. I don't want to pass on my genes. But then I kind of went through a phase of like, I don't want to have an only child. But now I feel like I would love to adopt a baby. Wow. And you can have adoption in your family too, Sarah. Yeah. Yeah. I have two nieces that are adopted and some cousins that are adopted. Yeah. So. That's really cool. I think it's great. Well, and so is there, the question really in this episode is, is there.
A deep, deep calling that tells you when you're done. And that's going to be different for everybody, right? Right. I think I think so. Yes, there is for some women and there is not for others. I think there I've spoken to women who, you know, are in their 60s that look back and, you know, we could call it regret. We don't have to call it regret, but just have said, oh, I should have done another one. But, you know, then I didn't. And it's fine. But I really knew, you know, you guys are talking. Those are the women. Allie, the hair on the back of my neck is standing up even to hear you say that because I feel like that's my future. I'm going to be that woman. OK, so where are you? Where are you? Tell us. I'm just waiting. OK, so we have three and I never had a number.
I never had a number, but I do have a theory that however many kids are in your family, however many you're one of, so I'm one of three, that I feel like that number feels like a natural baseline to you. That number will never feel excessive to you. So three kids might seem excessive to somebody who was a single child, but I'm one of three. Three kids seems normal to me. Having four doesn't seem crazy. But then when I say that to people...
they look at me like I have two heads like okay four kids like maybe especially New Yorkers though or yeah like I'm wondering how people in Florida feel or about four kids or is that more there's definitely I mean there's a stigma in you I mean I'm just gonna call it a stigma I feel like there is a stigma against big families some of it is like some of it is practical like no space uh just like city life but some of it also I feel like is like weird I don't know how to explain it like Like there's something farm like about having a big family. Like that's just not tidy. It's not sensible. It's so olden days. It's so olden days. It's not green. I remember Michelle, my sister telling me one time that if you have no babies, you're like.
Weird or? I don't know. But if you have one baby, you're contributing to overpopulation or something like that. I'm getting those statistics wrong and I never looked it up. No, that's true. That's the other thing, right? There are already way too many people on the planet. Well, when you say four kids to me, I go to a place of expensive. So that jumps out at me and I'm like, oh God, I start sweating it. But something else comes out at me, which is I think of the future future. They've left the house and now they're coming back to your Thanksgiving table. I am obsessed with that idea of them coming back. Me too. That's why it sounds great to have a lot.
My youngest will be five this year. Like it would not be, I almost have waited too long. Like I would have, if I had a baby now, I would have, by the way, I love that my husband's opinions and my real life have not factored into any decision making. No, and they're not going to. It's right. It's all like what I decided on my text message with my girlfriends. That's how many babies I'm going to have. But it's like Wilder would be 11. Edie would be coming to eight. Mavis would be just over five. It sounds perfect to me. In a way, but in another way, like.
In another way, like Wilder's going to be in college in eight years and I will have a second grader. And so like the longevity of my parenting life, like, wow, I'm still going to be making Valentine's. It's like a bitch and it's crazy, but it's also where you shine and it's where you get your deep love. I would say, I don't want to offend anybody on this podcast, but probably more than any of us girls. Would you agree? Oh, yes. This is Kate's calling in so many ways. You're a great mom. I feel like it's not how I feel about myself at all. Wait, did you just rate Kate as the best mother on this podcast? No. That was a great episode. Good night, guys. Bye. Not at all. I didn't say that. You guys ready for nailing and nailing?
As far as multiple kids, she's like, yeah, bring it on. Bring on the crazy, the play date, the cooking, the chaos, and all of it. Yeah. You thrive. You do it so well. So, Kate, you're saying you're not sure. Is that where you are, that the answer is not clear to you right now?
I'm just confused. Like I'm scared to have another baby and I'm scared not to. Do you know what I mean? Like I'm saying, I want another baby, but I'm not craving a baby. I believe me. I'm not, I mean, I hear babies and they're delicious, but the idea, like my boobs hurt when I think about breastfeeding, the cries in the middle of the night. Oh my God. I don't know if I can do it again. Do you know what I mean? Straight to formula. That would be amazing to skip it. Now. Also is saying that she is saying it's because I'm agreeing with pretty. It's sound.
Sounds like you want one because the alternative is how we feel. I know that Critty and I, wait, I think we feel the same, Critty? About our own lives? We're on the same page. I pushed out my daughter, my second kid, and it was as clear as day. It was the most complete feeling and I felt that way ever since. Do I have baby fever? No, I see a baby and I'm very attracted to them and I want to hold them. You have a baby. You have a baby. You have baby fever from your own baby. You have a baby. Okay, so that newborn stage is like, whoa. Okay. It's so different than having it. Are you worried that you, has it ever crossed your mind that you could change your mind when Marigold is three or you're so sure in your bones? I feel very sure in my bones and I, is this because I had one of each?
Not sure. Yeah. It has something to do with it. I have two sons and I'm never getting a girl. Everybody on this podcast has a girl. I don't. Okay. So yeah. Well, okay. Yeah. I blonde, but.
I, you know, who knows what kind of sons they will be, whether they stay close or leave or whatever, but it's, I'm never going to have that relationship with a daughter. I totally want that, but you can't have another kid for, you know, hoping that you're going to get a certain sex. Cause we all know that's not going to happen. Although there are some crazy things I think that you can do some witchcraft. You'd get twin boys. You'd end up with four boys. But still a third kid. No.
I cannot have another baby. And for me, it's mostly because of how grueling the first five years of it is and the way we do it and on this hill and the amount of money and just the way that we live. I can't do it. I'd go under. Well, you wouldn't be the kind of mom you would want to be. That's what you're saying. Right. Well, but yeah, I mean, their lifestyle is such where she's still going to have to be feeding that baby some organic groceries. She's still going to be having to, you know, like she's got her husband who is involved in the way that they're raised. It's not as easy to just be like off.
fuck it let me just order up a dominoes and put on a daniel tiger well i can order up a dominoes and put on a daniel tiger i mean not i you know i could get an amy's pizza and a daniel tiger but i don't have but i don't have child care really never have i work with my kids or i've stayed you know i've mostly stayed home the past seven years and i don't it's like even a babysitter i haven't have we talked about this just getting somebody up the hill two miles of four-wheel drive it doesn't happen it never happens it's too much so one more. It's literally, I don't see it as the baby stage or just getting through two years. I see it as getting through about five and a half more years of staying home. And that's a whole other topic. I don't think you have that. The other kindergarten is a half day kindergarten. So it's basically six or seven years. Age is the other thing that confuses me though. Like, am I going to have that? I mean, first of all, like I'm not, I'm not convinced I'm like a really great mom to my last kid. I mean, I'm lower on patient, every kid you're lower on patients, right? So imagine me lower on patients and five years older, like, wow.
Should I bring another person to the world just to subject them to that kind of parenting because I want a lot of people at Thanksgiving? Five years later. But then again, Kate, they're all going to be well into school, right? You're going to have a lot of one-on-one time with the baby. I do like the idea of, like, spreading your seeds wide instead of deep. Do you know what I mean? Like, not really doing a great job with any kid, but just having enough kids that one of them is going to turn off on. That's true. I mean, one will be good. Yeah, but all your kids, Kate, feel very safe and very loved. Like, I think you're comparing yourself to your own standard of what you think the best mom is. You know, you're doing great. Can I ask, Molly, it was after you had Marigold, right after the birth, that was your defining moment. Critty, do you have a defining moment where you know that you're done? You also have one boy, one girl.
um let's see right after matilda i think there was like a three week grace period where i was like maybe we should have a third oh wouldn't it be great and we're older we'll have such a full house and just really romanticizing it and you know now that we're well into babyhood we're at nine months now matilda's really kicking our ass in a next level way that levi didn't and garrett just looks at me and he just we both agree like we cannot do this again it's it's very hard this time around it's just too hard just the thought of it It's like taking a risk that there's another kid coming that would be as hard as Matilda. Don't get me wrong. I love her so much. I'm obsessed with her, but it's just so hard and it's hard because you can't, I'm having a hard time dividing my time with her being so difficult and she's always needing me. So Levi, take the back seat and you know, on top of guilt, we've moved and we're in the Midwest and we're kind of trapped inside all the time. And so I'm just always ready to snap. I just feel like my husband almost more because of me. I think he's maybe scared of what a third kid might do to me and my sanity.
Oh, that's interesting. More than anything, like, I don't think, I think he thinks I can't handle it and I'll be really hard to be around. My husband says the same thing. I love that I didn't even factor in his decision. Right, Kate? Oh, it didn't even cross my mind. But he's the same way. He tells other people, no, we're not having another one. Allie can't handle it. Which is fucking bullshit. Total bullshit. Yeah, I feel like you could do it with your eyes closed, but anyway. Right. Well, you know what? I was talking about this with my friend who, she's very.
smart she's very practical she has two kids a boy and a girl and she and her husband she said like oh yeah I would have loved another baby they literally are the kind of people who are so smart they just wrote she in her mind just like went down all the reasons why you should or should not have another kid and was like okay good we're gonna call it it too which is like I wish no I wish I could be like that because it's like they just couldn't find a reason to have another one so they didn't but you know what she said to me she said and it really freaked me out she said what if What if things are not always as perfect as they are today and you have an extra person in your family? What if one of the other kids needs something that you don't, you can never anticipate that they're going to need today or something happens to you or something happens to Jeremy? Do you really think it's a good idea to stretch your resources that much thinner? And when she said it like that, like she was coming from a place of such caring and love, like nothing but caring. It's a personal decision. It's the same exact thing where I was worried I wouldn't have enough love in my heart for a second baby.
And once somebody is there, it works itself out, you know, Kate. And I just, either way, it's a beautiful, I think you have a beautiful, beautiful thing going either way. And I really hope you find some peace, you know. Listen, my mom is one of 12. I'm sorry, Ellie, I had to press the button. Finish that thought. I was just saying mom's one of 12. I mean. Yeah, but that was not a woman saying, should we have another yes, honey, let's. No. No, I'm just saying. Yes. Yes. 12. Okay. All right. Nailing it and failing it.
Go for it. Who's got one? Well, I got a failing it. Today, actually, I locked Francis and myself out of our brand new apartment. Oh, no. So that was a first. I was like, it was the first time I'd ever lock myself out with Francis. I lock myself out all the time. But this was with my baby. And like, what were we going to do? But thank God for your tits. What did you do? Was it cold? Thank God for my tits. It was cold. Yes. But my nail is that I have the most amazing nanny on the planet. And I text her and I was like, can I come get my keys from you? And she was like.
Like, oh, it's no problem. I'll just ride my bike over and give them to you. Oh, my God. I love her. That's awesome. It's just the best. I should have given her a hug. I didn't. Your nail is that you picked the best nanny ever. You didn't give her a hug, Sarah? What? You heartless bitch. Fuck, it's wrong with me. I was like.
I was holding Francis. It's okay. When she walks in tomorrow or whatever day, just first thing, I just need to give you a hug. Thank you so much for coming to our rescue yesterday. Done and done. Okay, good. Done and done. Okay, I have a nail, guys. It's a simple one, but Augie and I did his first year of Valentine's. Yay. Yep. That's so sweet. I'm going to count that. Did he like them? What was his feeling about them? He liked the idea beforehand, and then midway through, there was some crying, and I was like, okay, whatever.
yeah but I tried to get him to use some Ninja Turtle ones from Dollar Tree and he cried about that and said he wanted to make his own which I was so pissed because I thought I was taking the easy way out but it was still lazy I just cut some hearts and let him decorate cool alright I gotta fail Um, Phoenix had a sleepover the other night and he decided to play a game with his friend. They were going to build booby traps all around the house. And I was like, guys, come on. He had a string out and the scissors and he was like tying toys to doors that were swinging, you know, on Leo when he opened the door. And I was not paying attention to it at all, cooking dinner. And they were down in his room. And so I was like, guys, went down to go get them for dinner. And I opened up the bedroom door and a huge, a can of LaCroix seltzer dumped down on my head. Okay.
He had a string from the bunk bed in the ceiling so that when you open the door, the soda dumps on your head. Hold on. This is a total nail. Your kid is really smart. He used to go to school for little shits. I was like, okay, you guys come. I lost it in front of his little girlfriend. And I was like, okay, okay, just no liquid all over my house. Don't put liquid in the booby traps. And then I was like, on another note, I'm really proud of you. Like that was really, really cool. What you just did. Very clever.
remember that picture that you sent us of phoenix and leo hanging from the ceiling that's the best one oh my god oh my god and one yeah one of the one of the instagram um comments was like this is really really dangerous like yeah we know it could have been his neck right which the woman was right i know but it's like that point it was shocking it was very shocking oh god anyway thank you kate or critty my fail actually my fail is just I think I texted you guys last night my I've been letting my so weird that you guys think I'm a great mom I've been letting my kids they were sick last week hashtag the flu of course and I've been letting them watch like basically whatever on the iPad and I mean like they burned all the cartoons and they're on to fuller health oh my god Oh, Fuller House. That's okay if you're like, okay, that's okay-ish if you're 10, almost 11. But it's trickle down. Mavis is watching. She's four. So she's sitting on the toilet last night just kicking her legs and she's just saying things that I can't understand. The things that she's saying are like, well, if you want to have a baby but your body won't give you a baby, you need somebody else to get pregnant for you. Is this directly from Fuller House? I need to watch. What the fuck?
Wow. These are some mature topics on Fuller House. Is it Becky? Like, who wants the baby? Becky would be like 80 now.
Uncle Jesse's like geriatric level. It's okay. I've never seen one of our listeners. He explained it to me. Who's the one that lives next door? Kimmy? Kimmy Gibbler. Kimmy Gibbler. Kimmy Gibbler on the show? Yes! Wait until you see it. Just watch the pilot and then you'll get such a good LOL and you will never have to watch another one. Just watch the pilot and then call Mavis. So Kimmy Gibbler's like 40? I'm so embarrassed. I'm so embarrassed. You got DJ? You got DJ? Stephanie? You got Kimmy Gibbler?
The Olsen twins would not sign on. I mean, no way. They're way too glam. How did they go around that? Kimmy Gilber, it becomes, there's some storyline, I guess, where she's a surrogate. But it took me, I was whispering in Edie's ear while Edie was half asleep last night, demanding to know what the fuck was going on in Fuller House. And finally, Wilder sat up and just shamed me and said, why don't you try watching it, mom? And I was like, okay. Is Bob Saget on it? Bob Saget is fully on it. That's unbelievable. Wow. Uncle Jesse is on it.
All of it. Anyway, that's a fail. Uncle Jesse's hot as shit still is. Okay. Great hair. Thank you, Katie. Great hair. Okay. I have a nail. It's quick. My husband and I had a five-year wedding anniversary and we did an overnight in Dallas because it's a little quick drive. Amazing. Cut it out. I know. Cut it out. And we watched Fuller House all night. That would have been a nail. And then my fail is that we had some people over a few days ago.
Levi really only wants to hang with me when there's people I'm trying to hang out with. So he's like, mom, let's look at this magazine. And I'm like, yeah, yeah, okay. So I'm kind of, you know, totally ignoring him. And he's like, oh, mom, look at this picture. They're playing hide and seek. And I'm like, yeah, cool. He's like, why? They're playing hide and seek. And they're so, what are these? They're all wearing red. And I'm like, yeah, baby, they're just wearing red and playing hide and seek and just ignoring. And then I look down and he's looking at like Time Magazine tragedies of 2017. And it was like a horrible picture of like the Vegas shootout.
eyes not funny not funny it's like this horrible picture a photographer took and Levi's asking all these questions and I was just totally going yeah yeah they're hiding they're playing hide and seek awful anyway just terrible fail I was like oh babe let's go get a different magazine let's put this one up this one's all done thanks I feel way better about letting Mavis watch Fuller House yeah Uncle Jesse small potatoes compared you should feel really good about actually Fuller House you're right I am a good mom okay you guys it was fun I'll miss you till the next time all right everybody have a good night Check us out next week for another episode of Nursing and Cursing, where it's safe to admit that you just left your kid in the car to run into Ace Hardware for five minutes.