The Social Mobility Podcast

Marco Amitrano, PwC’s Senior Partner for the UK and Middle East, shares his journey from a modest background to leading a major firm, emphasising that social mobility is about expanding access to opportunity and unlocking talent for the benefit of both individuals and business. He highlights PwC’s own journey, noting that organisations must adapt systems to support diverse talent, while individuals must actively seize opportunities. Marco stresses the importance of education, workplace exposure, and access to AI skills, and calls for collaboration and investment in skills and infrastructure to drive social mobility and economic growth.”Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Rob Hornby is Co-CEO of financial advisory and global consulting firm, AlixPartners, and has held senior leadership positions in a number of top companies. In this episode, Rob reflects on the pivotal role his father’s belief in him and a grant-funded university place played in shaping his career. He discusses education as a powerful gateway to social mobility and explores the responsibility businesses have to create meaningful opportunities for those seeking to progress.Rob also shares his perspective on how artificial intelligence could reshape the landscape of opportunity and what that might mean for the future of social mobility.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Segun Osuntokun is the Global Senior Partner at international law firm, Bryan Cave Leighton Paisner (BCLP). He is also the head of the firm's civil fraud litigation practice.In this episode, Segun takes us right back to his childhood growing up in the second biggest city in Nigeria, home to the country’s first university. And he explains what first gripped him about the idea of going into the legal profession.Reflecting on what social mobility means to him, Segun explores the psychology of the human condition - why we continue to create structures that disadvantage certain people, and how to break them down. Segun also imagines an education system that brings out the best in people, rather than widening divides. And he discusses what BCLP is doing to disrupt the lack of social mobility in the legal sector. Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Malcolm Gomersall is Chief Executive Officer at Grant Thornton UK, where he has held a number of senior leadership positions - including Head of London Audit and Tax, and Head of People and Client Experience. He became Chief Operating Officer in 2019 before being elected CEO by the firm’s partners in 2024.In this episode, Malcolm reflects on how his own upbringing shaped his career, sharing candid stories - from changing his accent to being told to iron his shirts - and how these experiences fuelled his passion for social mobility.We hear about the work he and his team are leading at Grant Thornton to build a more diverse and equitable workforce, and why he believes big companies must look beyond academic achievement when seeking talent. Malcolm explains why a degree is no longer a prerequisite for success, and how he sees early intervention as the key to tackling barriers to social mobility. Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Kerry Dryburgh is bp’s EVP for People, Culture & Communications and the company’s chief human resources and communications officer. In this episode, Kerry shares her personal social mobility journey. From leaving school at sixteen, to becoming an architect of the employee experience at bp – influencing strategy, performance, culture, and transformation. Hear how her decision to take on an apprenticeship sparked a career that today influences people, programmes and policies in over 60 countries. And gain insights on how companies can help close the gap between potential and opportunity, while supporting the current and future workforce as they build skills for a lifetime. Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Peter Scott is the Global Co-Managing Partner, and Managing Partner EMEA of law firm Norton Rose Fulbright. Peter joined the firm as a trainee solicitor in 1997, and became a partner 10 years later. He was a member of the City of London Socio-economic diversity taskforce, a group of 30 cross-sector leaders aiming to enhance socio-economic diversity at senior levels across the UK's financial and professional service sectors, and a judge of the Women and Diversity in Law Awards.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Paul Lewis is the Firmwide Managing Partner of one of the biggest law firms in the UK, Linklaters. He’s been at the firm since he joined as a trainee solicitor in 1998 and was one of their youngest Partners ever. With his Oxford Law degree and his success at Linklaters, you’d be forgiven for thinking Paul grew up in that world, but how he actually comes from a small Welsh village and went to comprehensive school.In this episode, Paul tells us how the leadership team at Linklaters all play a role in sponsoring diversity and inclusion, and how he’s introduced billable credits for those who do DEI on top of their day job. And why his first order of business if he was in charge of the country tomorrow would be to double teachers’ pay.Find out more about Paul and his work here.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Matthew Crummack is the current CEO of Domestic & General, a firm you might have never heard of before, but that is present in all our homes. D&G is the UK's leading specialist warranty provider for kitchen appliances, TVs, and more. Matthew has over 25 years of experience working at companies including GoCompare, lastminute.com, Expedia, and Nestlé.In this episode, Matthew tells us how education changed his family’s trajectory. He talks about his focus on flexibility, diversity and inclusion as he took over D&G in 2021, and why creating an equitable environment is so good for business. And about some of the amazing initiatives he’s put in place over the years – from working with Code First Girls, to funding a scholarship for asylum seekers at Aston University.  Find out more about Matthew and his work here.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Shirine Khoury-Haq is CEO of The Co-operative Group – the first woman to hold the position in the history of the business. Shirine is a powerhouse and has held significant leadership roles in both the US and the UK.  In this episode, Shirine tells us about climbing up the corporate ladder as a woman and her choice to be outspoken about her perceived difference in a world full of men. How she and Co-op foster diversity and inclusion for a more robust business. And she reminds us that these policies aren’t just for the sake of a few, but for the collective - they ensure everyone can bring their whole self to work. Find out more about Shirine and her work here.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Lee Elliot Major OBE is the UK’s first Professor of Social Mobility at the University of Exeter. He has spent a lifetime researching how to uplift who he calls children from under-resourced backgrounds. Lee previously served as the Chief Executive of the Sutton Trust and played a key role as a founding trustee of the Education Endowment Foundation. His most recent book, "Equity in Education", introduces a pioneering equity-centred approach tailored for schools.In this episode, Lee tells us about his working-class background, being the first in his family to go to higher education, and what it was like climbing that social ladder. He explains how both education and business have a role to play in social mobility. And how social economic background should be a protected characteristic under the Equalities Act. Find out more about Lee and his work here.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Danuta Gray is the Chair of Direct Line Group and a Non-Executive Director of the fashion brand, Burberry. She started her career in the tech sector before holding a series of board roles. In this episode, Danuta explains how, despite her working-class background, she’s been given a number of opportunities which she credits for her success in business, and explains how she’s now working to pay that forward for others. She also explains how she is keen to get more women into leadership roles, and tells us about the work she’s doing to help businesses cater for neurodivergent people in the workplace. Find out more about Danuta and Direct Line Group here.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Jon Lewis is CEO at consulting, transformation and digital services business Capita. Previously he was the CEO of Amec Foster Wheeler, and before that he had a 20-year career at Halliburton where he held a number of senior roles.In this episode, Jon explains why he’s always been passionate about meritocracy - why we in the UK need to start focussing more on potential instead of formal qualifications. He tells us how he’s fostered a strong, purpose-led culture in Capita since his arrival in 2017, and how this has become the company’s “north star” of how they operate. And he even offers invaluable advice for new CEOs too.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Brian Duffy is the CEO of Watches of Switzerland. Previously, he served on several boards across the fashion, retail and sports sectors including several subsidiaries of Ralph Lauren. Brian is an ICAS Chartered Accountant and holds an Honorary Doctorate from Glasgow Caledonian University. Brian tells us about his childhood growing up on a council estate on the outskirts of Glasgow. He grew up with very little, but it was his drive and ambition to achieve more in life that got him to where he is today and believes others can achieve what they want to too. Brian also tells us about the Watches of Switzerland Foundation which launched a food bank support programme in 2020 in response to the pandemic and its ongoing work to support local communities through volunteering and fundraising. Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Dominic Carter is EVP, Publisher of The Sun, a role he’s only recently taken on, following his time as Chief Commercial Officer at parent company News UK. He’s also a Trustee of the charity NABS, the support organisation for the advertising and media industry. Born to a Nigerian mother and British father, Dominic comes from a working class background, and spent his early education in Nigeria before moving to boarding school in England. As an award-winning advocate for diversity and inclusion, Dominic explains why diversity matters to a business like The Sun, and why it should be reflected in all areas of journalism, from the makeup of the newsroom, to the way they write and the opportunities they offer. In 1991 Dominic became the first black display sales executive on a national news brand, and has seen a positive shift in attitudes towards diversity over the years. In this episode he discusses how a strong and considered diversity strategy can promote significant buy-in from staff, he explores the many programmes The Sun has implemented to advance equality, and he explains why you can and should drive for change no matter your position in your organisation. Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Tracy Garrad is the CEO at AXA Health. Tracy joined AXA from HSBC where she held a range of senior management roles. Prior to that she was at Abbey National and Santander.  Tracy grew up on a council estate in the North of England and after the death of her mother, she says she was forced to leave education to care for her younger siblings. In this episode, Tracy tells us how a chance encounter when she was 17, changed her life and gave her the confidence to succeed.  Tracy says she now feels a huge sense of responsibility to make a difference when it comes to social mobility. She tells us about the work she’s involved in to create more opportunities for people from all walks of life, regardless of their social status. Tracy also talks about what she believes still needs to be done to give women an equal playing field in the world of business. Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

John Boumphrey is the Country Manager for Amazon's business across the UK and Ireland. John has been at Amazon since 2011 and worked across several roles including three years in Seattle as Vice President for the company’s Consumables Programs.  John grew up in the North West of England and says he had a “great childhood” with a huge emphasis on education. After studying foreign languages at University, John started his career working in management consultancy where he says he learnt the ins and outs of business.  In this episode, John tells us about the work he’s involved in at Amazon to put social mobility and Diversity, Equality and Inclusion at the heart of the company. John also talks about why he thinks the key to social mobility lies in gathering and sharing data and focusing on education. Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Ed Couchman is Regional General Manager, DACH, Netherlands, Nordics and UK at social media company Snap Inc. Ed previously spent 6 years at Facebook and before that, he worked in senior tech roles, including at Channel 4. Ed tells us about his working class background growing up in a town on the outskirts of Birmingham and reflects on a recent visit to his old high school. He also shares some of the initiatives Snap has brought in to ensure its Diversity, Equality and Inclusion strategy is a success. Ed also talks about why he thinks it’s vitally important for companies to work hard to not only employ different people from all walks of life, but to retain that talent too. Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Nick Mackenzie is the CEO of the UK’s leading pub retailer and brewer Greene King. Prior to joining Greene King in 2019, Nick ran businesses across the world including spending 17 years with Merlin Entertainment. One of Nick’s top priorities when he joined the business was making it a more diverse and inclusive workplace, from the pub floor, through to top tier management. Nick explains how he’s made it his mission to create “more opportunities for more people” within the business, through a number of initiatives such as creating apprenticeships with The Prince’s Trust. In 2020, shortly after the Black Lives Matter movement peaked following the death of George Floyd, the company’s historic links to the slave trade were exposed. Nick says since then he’s been more motivated than ever to implement a solid diversity and inclusion strategy. He speaks passionately about continuing to educate himself to make sure the business reflects the communities it operates in. Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Steve Murrells is the CEO of the Co-op Group. He joined the organisation as the lead on food in 2012 and now heads every facet of the organisation’s business. Steve has a long history in retail, starting with an A Level Entry Scheme with Sainsbury’s when he was a teenager. Since then he’s climbed the ranks, working in various retail roles. In this episode Steve talks about his vision of an inclusive Co-op, where there’s no racism and no pay gaps. He’s campaigned on many issues including violence against shop workers, modern slavery, racial equality and food poverty. In his role as CEO, Steve looks to embody the business’s ethos - equal opportunities for everyone. Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Alderman Vincent Keaveny is Senior Alderman of the City of London Corporation and a partner at the international law firm, DLA Piper. Vincent has held the office of Alderman for the Ward of Farringdon Within since October 2013 - then in 2018/19 he became Sheriff of the City of London. From November, he will take up a new position as Lord Mayor of London. As a lawyer, Vincent specialises in banking and capital market transactions and is Chair of Samuel Wilson’s Loan Trust, a charity which grants loans to young people for establishing and developing new businesses. Vincent says lawyering has taken a bit of a back seat in the lead up to becoming Lord Mayor and during his term, plans to make positive changes to offer opportunity for better social mobility. He wants to see a country full of people allowed to be the best of what they are, unencumbered by perceptions. Vincent strongly believes businesses that encourage diversity become better businesses and says socio-economic diversity is a concern of the city of London. He wants London to be the home of the best global talent.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Charlotte Duerden is the UK Country Manager for American Express. Charlotte has worked for Amex since 1999, holding various roles in the UK, Australia and New Zealand. She has a keen interest in pushing equality within the workplace, with initiatives like The Women’s Charter and has a strong sense of community and service to others. Charlotte featured on a list of top 100 role models and while she’ll tell you she’s uncomfortable with the title ‘role model’, it set her on a mission to do even more through American Express for the next generation. Charlotte’s motivation for education stretches outside of the workplace - she’s also a trustee for the charity Friends of St Marcellin’s Children, and explains how the Zimbabwe orphanage the charity supports has even gone on to make the decision to build a school. Charlotte speaks passionately about wanting everyone to be able to walk in someone else’s shoes and through that, believes we could all be empowered to further equality. Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Christine Hodgson CBE is Chair of Severn Trent Plc, and before that spent more than 20 years as Chair of Capgemini UK. She has a portfolio of non-executive roles in the private, charity and education sectors. She’s a senior independent director at Standard Chartered Bank, Chair of the Careers and Enterprise Company, Chair of the Blackpool Pride of Place Partnership, and works with the Prince of Wales charity Business in the Community. Through her work in Blackpool, Christine has learnt the importance of a ‘place-based approach’ when tackling social mobility, and in this episode explains why efforts should be focussed on improving areas of the country which are holding people back. Highlighting her support of degree apprenticeships, Christine describes the essential role both first-class education and work life preparation play in supporting the futures of young people. Christine has faith in education’s power to break the cycle of socioeconomic disadvantage, and says any businesses failing to tackle the issue are setting themselves up for failure - “We all have to play our part in the communities in which we live and work”. Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Nick Owen is Chair of Deloitte UK, a trustee of Teach First and Macmillan, and a council member of Heart of the City. Nick’s interest in the importance and value of education began at school. He sees it as a massive contributor to social mobility, and backs this up with stark figures and statistics, and explains how the pandemic has eroded much of the progress we’ve made over the past 10 years. In an effort to play its part, Nick says Deloitte’s recruitment processes and apprenticeship schemes have been designed to level the playing field, so people from all walks of life have equal opportunities in the business. In this episode find out why academic achievement shouldn’t be the only factor contributing to success, learn how diversity in all its forms is good for business, and find out why businesses need to better understand their ‘fundamental purpose’. Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Chris Stylianou is Chief Operating Officer, UK and Ireland, at Sky. He was awarded an OBE for services to diversity and the economy - though he’s keen to point out that it’s been teamwork, not the work of one individual, that has helped shape Sky’s progressive policies. Chris’ interest in advancing gender equality stems from what he saw during his early days at university - a passion that has strengthened over the years, watching his daughters grow up. He believes social mobility is a massive enabler for achieving broader diversity goals, and discusses the importance of being bold and brave when tackling issues of inclusion. There are many fascinating insights, including great advice on how to deal with “naysayers”, and how subtle changes to job adverts can promote diversity. At the heart of it all, Chris’ motivation is about doing the right thing - it’s as simple as that. Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Clare Parsons is Chair and co-founder of strategic reputation management consultancy Lansons. Clare is also a board member for PROI Worldwide, a trustee of arts charity High Tide, and serves on a wide range of industry and not-for-profit committees. Clare’s father died when she was young and she was raised by her mother. She says it was her mother’s fortitude and belief that women can achieve anything that has allowed her to climb the ladder of success. Clare and her now husband set up Lansons 31 years ago with the premise of meritocracy at the forefront from the very beginning - a rather unique approach to business at the time. To this day Clare continues to ensure there are no barriers to entry, whether because of schooling, gender or race. Clare staunchly believes organisational diversity is what drives success in business, and that leadership needs to step up and show a willingness to change. Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Kevin Ellis is Chairman and Senior Partner of PwC UK, and a staunch proponent of social mobility in business. Inspired by his father’s journey to become a qualified professional, Kevin joined PwC for a qualification of his own, and has stayed for nearly 36 years. He believes social mobility is not just a societal good, but also an economic necessity - serving as both a benefit to the company’s diverse client base, and as an accelerator and escalator for staff. Kevin is particularly proud of the opportunities PwC gives to people from disadvantaged backgrounds, including the 9% of staff which grew up receiving free school meals. In this conversation Kevin discusses the “media blackout” around positive social mobility stories, and the issues that causes, he explains the importance of gathering diversity data, and he explores the role personal stories play in promoting the message of social mobility far and wide. Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Sandra Wallace is an employment law specialist and partner at DLA Piper global law firm. Passionate about advancing equality, Sandra is also co-chair of the Social Mobility Commission. Born in Birmingham, Sandra spoke Patois at home, and had her first glimpse of discrimination at the age of 5, when she was told to “stop speaking like you do”. Despite the negativity she experienced because of her decision to study law at Wolverhampton polytechnic, Sandra quickly found a job and began to rise through the ranks. That’s why she’s keen to tell her story - to serve as a role model to others who’ve been told they can’t succeed. In this episode Sandra explores how her socioeconomic status has been the biggest hurdle in her life, more so than her gender or race - though she does explain how tiring it is that she still needs to address the issue of racism in this day and age. She explains how business can benefit from greater diversity, what the Social Mobility Commission is doing to push the agenda, and why it’s important for companies to readdress their recruitment practices.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Tamara Box is managing partner of Europe and the Middle East at global law firm Reed Smith. She is also a founding member of the steering group for the 30% Club, which aims to improve diversity in UK boardrooms. Born and raised in Texas, Tamara was always encouraged to see education as a privilege. In a quest to learn alongside people from different backgrounds, she left Texas to study at the London School of Economics. Believing the idea of a meritocracy is a myth, she charts much of her success to lucky opportunities and a willingness to say yes. In this episode, Tamara explains why leadership requires diversity, and how her firm benefits from actively seeking people from different backgrounds, with different perspectives - “to have the best talent on a global basis, it needs to be diverse”. She also talks about how her clients are becoming increasingly interested in the firm’s diversity policies, which in part led the organisation to launch its racial equity action plan. Tamara explores the positive step forward the recent Black Lives Matter protests have had on our willingness to have open and frank discussions about diversity, and explains her aspiration for all young people - that every child is offered a glimpse into the “art of the possible”.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Jo Whitfield is CEO of Co-op food, having previously worked for Matalan and George. Jo is the first female CEO of a major food retailer, an achievement she is both humbled and shocked by. Because of the lack of representation of female senior leaders in the food industry, Jo set up Grocery Girls, which aims to redress the balance. As a strong advocate for diversity and inclusion, Jo has seen first-hand the impact of gender inequality. From a young age she saw how language was used to enforce compliance - “be a good girl”, “don’t cause a fuss” - and in her working life has seen how traits often displayed by men are viewed as preferable, undermining a woman’s contribution to the workplace. Jo says it’s important that we offer everyone the freedom of expression - “Our passions and our energies need to be fertilised and grown”. In this insightful episode Jo also explains how to reimagine education and the importance of careers support, why a diverse and unique background should be seen as an asset and a strength, and explains how the Co-op isn’t just a business, it’s a movement. Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Steven Cooper is CEO of Hoare’s bank, a role he took on after spending over 30 years at Barclays. He’s spent time living and working in Africa and India, holds a number of non-executive roles, and is a commissioner on the UK’s Social Mobility Commission. Passionate about advancing the agenda, Steven took the role at the Commission because he wants to pay forward the support he received from the people who were willing to give him a chance. Coming from a working class background, his success came as a result of the opportunities he received from people who spotted his talent, allowing him to excel far beyond the levels he’d considered possible. In this inspiring conversation, Steven explores the need to reform education, the importance of a more joined up approach to tackling social mobility in the UK, and the business case for better diversity in the workplace. Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Tom Ilube CBE is a technology entrepreneur and is CEO and founder of Crossword Cyber Security. Tom has many accolades to his name - he’s founded a number of other businesses, is a non executive director of the BBC, and he’s also an Honorary Fellow of Jesus College, Oxford. In this gripping conversation, Tom explores how education differed in the various countries he’s called home over the years. After growing up in London, Tom moved with his father to Uganda and later to Nigeria, before returning to the UK in adulthood. He also shares insight into his success, from a tireless approach to job applications, to a constant desire to “step up”, and the mental fortitude provided by a strong family unit. This episode also touches on racism, examples of great leadership, and the importance of providing equal educational opportunities for all.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Dr Louise Ashley is a senior lecturer in organisation studies at Royal Holloway, University of London. She specialises in researching the diversity and inclusion practises of large professional services firms. After a surprise admittance to Cambridge, Louise began to see how varying degrees of privilege can affect a person’s life. But it wasn’t until she joined a large law firm that she truly saw the impact of inequality - an experience that led to her current line of work. Louise says each equality strand faces its own challenges - whether it’s gender, race, or social class - but it’s when those strands intersect that the challenges faced by certain people grow deeper. Interestingly, in this conversation Louise explains why she believes the term ‘social mobility’ to be controversial and problematic, and how that’s linked to her belief that merit is an “ideological term”. This conversation delves into the subjects of unconscious bias, the depoliticization of the equality agenda, and the business case for diversity. Find out how Louise believes we can better tackle the issues faced by our society, to improve the outcomes and lives of everybody. Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Paul Cleal OBE is Vice Chair of Kingston University and also sits on the boards of a number of great organisations, including Guy’s & St Thomas’ NHS Foundation Trust and the National Citizen Service Trust. Before this, Paul spent 16 years as a partner for Big Four professional services firm PwC. As a young man with African heritage, born in 1966 and brought up in a single-parent household in Croydon, Paul faced many challenges growing up, including being attacked whilst playing football. Although he’s seen racial discrimination first hand, Paul believes socio-economic disadvantage is the biggest challenge to social mobility, because without money, second chances don’t come easily, and hard times are more difficult to recover from. Having received help and support throughout his life to achieve his list of incredible successes, Paul chooses to give back by mentoring young people, and believes diversity and inclusion need our full attention. In this conversation he explores ways we can address issues around education, equality and representation. One major concern Paul highlights is the coronavirus pandemic’s impact on organisations, as he worries they may put their social mobility and diversity strategies at the bottom of the pile while they focus on the immediate financial future. Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Melanie Richards is deputy chair of KPMG UK and has been a board member since 2012, working to set its strategic direction. She was recognised in the 2018 UK Social Mobility Awards for an outstanding contribution to social mobility, an experience that was unexpected, humbling and emotional. Though she’s proud of the award, in this inspiring conversation she explains how she’s not in it for the recognition - that it’s enough just to make a difference in the lives of others. Melanie explores the divide that still exists between the haves and the have nots, and says it’s everyone’s responsibility to shift the status quo. Remaining positive about the progress being made, she does add that the world has seemingly created a linear path for people to follow, and it’s time we move away from that, break out of our tired way of thinking, and put more emphasis on a person’s ability, rather than their background. Melanie is also an advocate for women’s equality, an area of the agenda she believes is making positive strides forward, and is hopeful for the future. She says the time for “good intentions” is over - that inclusion needs to be purposefully built into the structure of our organisations and communities.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

David Martin is a corporate mergers and acquisitions partner at the Magic Circle law firm, Llinklaters, and also the company’s global head of diversity. David grew up in Pembrokeshire in south west Wales, one of the country’s poorest regions, and so his story of becoming a lawyer highlights perfectly the benefits of positive social mobility. He’s tasked with figuring out how to make one of the most socially exclusive careers historically into one that is inclusive. He says his firm is changing conventional perception, with a number of its young lawyers coming from disadvantaged backgrounds. In this fascinating conversation, David explains the specific measures he’s taking to encourage diversity. Highlighting the benefits of these measures, he explains how the company’s reverse mentoring scheme allowed him to experience the firm through the eyes of a visually impaired employee – the direct result of this led him to changing the office environment to improve her quality of life. Success for David is to see companies no longer needing diversity and inclusion schemes, and he says that’s the future he’s working towards.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Laura Hinton is head of people at professional services firm PwC. She’s responsible for setting and delivering the company’s ‘people strategy’ in the UK and is an executive member of the board. Laura implements her passion for diversity by working with global clients to support them with culture change, performance management and talent related challenges. In this inspiring conversation, she recalls her “unremarkable upbringing” on a council estate with no big expectation or ambition to live a different life, being told by her careers advisor to apply to supermarkets – and how her life changed when she decided to apply to university. Laura is a strong believer in role models and how large companies have a duty to invest in their communities and young people, and explains how PwC is evolving the conversation to focus as much on inclusion as diversity, to create a stronger and fairer workforce for the future.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Fiona Hathorn is the CEO of Women on Boards UK, an organisation which helps people achieve success at leadership level. With a network of 30,000 members, the organisation has helped more than 1,800 people onto boards. Her own board positions include a role as non-executive director at Spktral, a technology company which helps organisations to simplify the gender pay gap reporting process. Fiona says she charts a great deal of her success down to her parents. Because her father’s mother was the main breadwinner, he raised Fiona without the usual biases that suggest men should earn more and achieve higher positions than women. She’s carried this confidence and belief with her throughout her life, and wants others to know there’s no limit to their abilities by removing arbitrary barriers. Inspired and motivational, Fiona explores the power of community support in achieving social mobility, challenges the concept of meritocracy, and explains the importance of role models. In this conversation she empowers you to open your mind to a role in the boardroom, a place where you can make real change in an organisation, by setting its culture, strategic vision and environmental policies.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Anna Smee is the new CEO of Youth Futures Foundation, a not-for-profit organisation set up in 2019 to help disadvantaged young people find employment. Previously she was chief executive of national charity UK Youth. Anna’s approach to social mobility is simple; she believes all young people should be helped to reach their potential, with access to support, networks and opportunities to find meaningful employment. In this episode, Anna describes the pressures felt by disadvantaged young people to choose a career path without access to the kind of support many people take for granted. She talks about the importance of the social development journey as young people transition from childhood to adulthood, and argues that everyone deserves a fair chance in life, regardless of their background, gender or race. She sets out the ambition for Youth Futures Foundation in finding, funding and evaluating projects that really work, and points out that it’s not just about upskilling young people, there are policy and structural changes which need work too. She also talks about the importance of working in partnership to achieve lasting change, to improve youth employment opportunities so that she can look back in ten or twenty years’ time and see significant change for the better.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Professor Binna Kandola OBE is co-founder of Pearn-Kandola, a business psychology firm with a focus on diversity & inclusion in the workplace. Binna has been named one of the UK’s Top 10 Business Psychologists and has authored many books, notably a series which focuses on the unconscious, gender and race biases within organisations. In this in-depth and informative interview, Binna takes us through his career journey and what has motivated him to spend over 30 years in business psychology. He explains and discusses the unconscious, gender and race biases, which, as part of our natural experience, can be very damaging to our society if it leads to the wrong conclusions. Binna breaks down the stereotype of gender and race differences, and explains the benefit to organisations, which diverse groups of employees can make. To Binna, an improved state of social mobility, diversity or inclusion in our society starts with transparency and accountability. Responsibility will be crucial in delivering that.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Lucy Martin is a weather presenter for the BBC. She is the first visibly disabled weather presenter at the BBC, and took on the role after completing a programme to help disabled people to kickstart their careers. Lucy is a role model for disabled people wanting to pursue their passions, and an advocate for improved diversity in the workplace. In this in-depth interview, Lucy reflects on her experience of growing up with one arm and the impact it has had on her career. She recognises that although her experience has been positive, there’s still a lot to do – and explains why better representation of disability in the media is needed. Her vision for improved access for disabled people in the workplace is by achieving a level playing field, not through highlighting a person’s disability and treating them as ‘special’, but by firms being more inclusive so disabled employees can access the same opportunities as those who are not. Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Dame Martina Milburn is the chair of the Social Mobility Commission. Her vision for the UK is that we can “live in a society where people have choices about the way they want to live their lives”. In this episode, Martina discusses her career, starting in journalism, becoming head of The Prince’s Trust and then moving on to lead the twelve members of the Social Mobility Commission. Her career has given her first-hand insight into the difference charities make to individuals around the globe, stressing the importance of fee-free, high-quality education in improving people’s quality of life. While discussing the “gloomy” nature of this year’s ‘State of the Nation’ report, Martina describes the hurdles the SMC faces in making change happen – and says although its work may not produce instant results, action must be taken now to prevent further erosion of social mobility in the UK.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Jon Cruddas is MP for Dagenham, Rainham, South Hornchurch and Elm Park. During his time as deputy political secretary to Tony Blair, he helped introduce the minimum wage, and played a key role in improving a number of socio-economic issues in the UK. He’s also been hugely involved in trade union reforms and improving workers’ rights. Jon comes from a large family who benefited from being socially mobile, and believes the lack of social mobility has actually become worse over time, and says we're going backwards when it comes to access, life chances, and routes to equality. In this open and frank discussion, Jon delves into his own life and the road to becoming an MP, explores the problems caused by a lack of access for some to higher education, and shares his hopes for a national living wage and fairer tax justice.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Sir Ian Powell is the chairman of Capita and former senior partner at PwC. In this episode, he talks about why, when it comes to social mobility, it’s important for leaders to set the right example to create a motivated workforce. His mantra in all of his roles, he says, is simply to ‘do the right thing’. As the first member of his family to graduate, Sir Ian says he was lucky to be offered the chances he did, considering his background, and while he believes there’s more awareness of social mobility these days, he’s not sure much progress has been made to improve it over the years. Sir Ian also talks about his chairmanship of the charity PoliceNow, his work on the board of the Old Vic theatre, and his support of the charity Wellbeing of Women.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Carys Roberts is chief economist at the Institute for Public Policy Research. She heads up the IPPR’s Centre for Economic Justice, which was set up because they believe the UK’s economy needs fundamental reform. The centre offers radical and practical advice on how to achieve that reform. During this incredibly informative chat, Carys talks about the need for greater taxes on wealth, and why inheritance shouldn’t purely be a luxury of the wealthy. She explains the vastly different impacts that economic policy decisions have on people of all backgrounds in society, and shares her thoughts on how to tackle the UK’s race pay gap.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Sir Kenneth Olisa is the first black Lord-Lieutenant of Greater London, chair of the Shaw Trust charity and chairman of Restoration Partners. He has more than three decades’ senior business experience, and was knighted in the 2018 New Year’s Honours List for services to business and philanthropy. In this fascinating discussion, Ken talks about being brought up in a single-parent home in the backstreets of Nottingham, and how the kindness of strangers propelled him to his current position. A strong believer in always accepting help from others and in giving back, Ken says it's his responsibility as a role model to share his story.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Kwame Kwei-Armah is the artistic director of the Young Vic in London. An actor, writer and singer, he previously led the World Festival of Black Arts and the Center Stage in Baltimore. He received an OBE for his services to drama in 2012, and the Urban Visionary Award in 2016. In this in-depth conversation, he shares his early memories of racial injustice, from playground division to watching Roots and tracing his ancestry to find a name that “represents the tribe we originate from”; describes the challenges of changing the notion of theatre from high arts to popular pastimes so that everyone has access; and explains how telling stories through a “cultural lens” results in socially relevant productions that truly matter to the community.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap. 

Justine Greening is MP for Putney, Roehampton and Southfields. She has held a number of posts in government, including Minister for Women & Equalities and Secretary of State for Education. Upon returning to the backbenches in 2018, she established the Social Mobility Pledge, a scheme aimed at broadening social mobility and opportunity in Britain. In this in-depth conversation, she reflects on her own experience of “climbing up the career ladder” from a working-class background, describes education's role in “firing up children's imaginations” about the wider world, and explains how the social mobility pledge is helping to close the achievement gap by encouraging employers to value talent over connections.Your host is Tunde Banjoko OBE, founder of Making The Leap.