Raising Grace

Lori Holden, a veteran parent of two young young adults, writes at LavenderLuz.com and hosts the podcast Adoption: The Long View. She’s the author of the acclaimed book The Open-Hearted Way to Open Adoption (recommended by People magazine in 2021), written with her daughter’s birth mom. Her book is featured on adoption-agency required-reading lists across the country. She has keynoted and presented at adoption conferences around the US and Canada, and she is available to coach families through tricky adoption situations. In 2018, she was honored as an Angel in Adoption® by the Congressional Coalition on Adoption Institute. Her new book, Adoption Unfiltered, co-written with adoptee Sara Easterly and birth mom Kelsey Vander Vliet Ranyard, will be available in late 2023. Lori and her family live in Denver, CO.    

Viviana Colelli is a multi-talented individual with a passion for photography and education. As a mother of two young children, Viviana balances her role as a parent while pursuing her career. With a loving husband by her side for the past decade, she finds joy in nurturing her family and cultivating a strong bond. Viviana's versatile skills have led her to teach photography at a college level, sharing her expertise and enthusiasm with aspiring photographers. This new opportunity has sparked excitement in her life, motivating her to continue honing her craft. But Viviana's ambitions don't end there. She is also embarking on a new venture as the host of a podcast tailored to immigrant mothers. Through her podcast, she aims to address the challenges faced by these mothers in connecting with their true selves while simultaneously managing the demands of raising children. Originally from Colombia, Viviana takes pride in her cultural heritage. This Colombian-born mother, photographer, educator, and podcast host is determined to make a positive impact in the lives of immigrant mothers and beyond.

Janell opens up about her journey as a parent and her experiences raising a child with a chronic illness. She shares the challenges and emotions that come with parenting a child with cancer, as well as the strength and resilience she has found through her faith in God. She bravely discusses her own battles with mental health and how she has navigated the ups and downs of life while being a caretaker for her children. Through heartfelt storytelling and vulnerability, Janell imparts her wisdom and insights on how to find hope, acceptance, and joy in the face of adversity. She reminds us that there is no manual for parenting a child with a chronic disease, but by doing the best we can with the information we have, we can create a loving and supportive environment for our children. Join us as we dive deep into topics such as parenting, faith, mental health, and finding purpose in the midst of challenging circumstances. This episode is filled with touching anecdotes, relatable experiences, and a reminder that we are not alone in our struggles.

On this episode of Raising Grace Podcast, we have the privilege of speaking with Gabrielle Crichlow, the owner and director of A Step Ahead Tutoring Services. Gabrielle shares her journey from Trinidad and Tobago to the United States, and how her experiences in the American education system shaped her perspective on school. Gabrielle discusses the differences she noticed between the American and Trinidadian education systems, from date formats to spelling variations. She opens up about her parents' generation, who view school as simpler back in their day, and the challenges they perceive in today's education system. School-related issues, such as low self-esteem, anger, and yelling from parents, are plaguing many students. As an educator and tutor, Gabrielle's role is to help students navigate these challenges and understand the importance of education. While she acknowledges that not all students will love school, she teaches them to view it as important and helps them set and achieve their own goals. By understanding students' motivations and creating personalized strategies, Gabrielle supports students in their educational journey. Gabrielle emphasizes the impact of outside factors on a student's attitude towards education, such as family dynamics, social influences, and health. She believes in meeting students where they are and fostering an environment of love, grace, and patience. Using creative and fun methods, like incorporating videos and games, can help motivate kids to engage with homework. Finding a balance between being strict and flexible, Gabrielle encourages parents and educators to understand kids' motivations and create middle ground solutions, like allocating time for video games in exchange for completing homework. By meeting kids in their own space and understanding their motivations, we can create a better engagement with homework and ultimately support their overall well-being. Join us on this insightful episode of Raising Grace Podcast as we dive deep into understanding the challenges students face in their educational journey and how we can support them to achieve their goals.   Follow A Step Ahead Tutoring Services: Facebook | Instagram | Twitter | YouTube | Eventbrite | Website | Podcast

Hi, I'm Sheila Kay Chester, and I'm excited to welcome you to the Racing Grace podcast. As a mother of three, I do not know what I am doing. I know firsthand the joys and challenges that come with raising Children in today's world. But I don't know if I'm doing it the right way on this podcast. I sit down with parents and professionals of all walks of life to talk about everything from the latest parenting trends to navigating difficult situations with our kids. We'll cover it all from the highs to the lows and provide you with valuable insights and maybe even some advice that would work for you and your own family. So whether you're a new parent, a seasoned veteran or just someone interested in learning more. Join me on the Raising Grace podcast. Hey, all in this episode, we will hear from Cheryl Barker. Cheryl is a foster and adoptive parent who has dedicated her life to helping Children in need of stability and care from overcoming personal health challenges while taking care of her special needs Children to navigating the complexities of the foster care system. Cheryl has experienced it all along the way. She has learned valuable lessons about giving herself grace while supporting the emotional needs of the Children in her care. Join us as Cheryl shares her inspiring journey and provides insights into the realities of the foster care system. Oh, who is your family that you live with? Who are the people that you consider your family? Oh, ok. Uh I'm a single parent of three adopted kids, three long term kids and I took guardianship of three. And then I also have, uh, former foster kids that be back into my life and need a leg up. And so I'm trying to be there for them too. So right now it's just currently, Shane is 24. Soon to be 25. Tyler just turned 16 in November. He lives here and I have a 17 year old adopted son. He has been in treatment for three years and he graduated from high school January and he's going to start job Corp next month. That's great. Congratulations, mom. You did it. So you, the reason I wanted to interview you is because you have, I remember when you started to foster kids and that wasn't a thing that a lot of people did in our, in our small town so that you were the one that kind of taught me about adoption because I didn't know what that was before. Oh, yes. So how, when did you start adopting and why, or fostering? And why did you start doing that. Ok, I started, uh, well, I first started teaching down on the reservation and 19 89 1 of my students was being abused. So I had called social services and they came and interviewed her and after they were done interviewing the social worker came in and said, ok, we just need to fill out this paperwork and da da da and I'm like, what, what, what are you, what, wait, wait, what, what are you talking about? And she says, well, so, and so said she's gonna come live with you and I'm like, uh, that, that can't happen. Um, she can't come live with me. I, I'm making $800 a month wages and my propane bill is $400 wages. And I still have to call my parents to help me out in between because I'm living in this rickety old trailer house that sucks up the gas bills. And so anyway, she was very, very bummed. So then I got out of the reservation and moved to my hometown and I said, well, I've always wanted to be mother of lots of Children. And if I wasn't an, a parent by 30 I was going to foster. Well, then the end of July, I had one girl for approximately a week from out of town and then August 12th, 1993 I get a phone call. I take a brother and sister and I'm like, sure I can do this and I was working down at Nelson's as a summertime evening cook and the social worker showed up with these two kids and my mouth, I'm sure I kept stepping on it because my mouth just dropped open and I'm like, what did I do this time? So I'm like, ok, ok, so I got these two very, not real clean kids and they gave me these biggest hugs and these very thick, thick glasses. And the first thing Conrad said, are you going to be my new mom? I'm like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa I said you're gonna stay with me for a while. Well, can I call you mom? I said, no, you can't call me mom. You can call me Cheryl. So the next week their attorney came and interviewed them and there she was getting ready to leave and she asked the kids, do you, do you have any questions? And Conrad beeped up and said, yes, can I call her mom now? And the social worker says, well, I don't see why not. I said, well, this is supposed to be a short term thing. And uh she said, well, I don't think it, it matters if, if you're comfortable with it. And I'm like, ok, so that was 30 years ago and he's still calling me mom. I remember Conrad. He was so he was one of your first placements. Yeah, Conrad and Autumn. Ok. I have Shannon for like five days, but that was just kind of a fun thing because our family was from Kansas and they got in some trouble at Custer State Park and she came with clothes and so a little bit of trauma, but it was very short term. 55 days, nothing prepared me for what I was getting into. But how, how can you prepare as a foster parent? You have to keep an open mind. I have a one of my counselors said, the biggest thing is Cheryl. If you can think of your heart like a vase and it gets shattered and somebody puts it back together with a glue that it's just all that much bigger so you can receive them again. And you just have to think of, I'm gonna cry. Sorry for today. I'm going to give them everything I possibly can to maybe make another brick in their foundation of life and then you wake up the next day and you're gifted another day. So you try to do everything you possibly can fit in that day that maybe will make their life a little bit better. And you just hope and pray. And a lot of times I, you know, being from the adoption world, the question that a lot of adoptive families have and a lot of families have is how do you take these kids in, fall in love with them and give them back to their family? And I have some ideas on how you can do that, but I've never done it before. So you tell me, how do you do that? The man upstairs, when I get the phone calls, I would always pray and I've turned down some because I just felt like it was not a good match even though I hadn't met the kid. So when, when God would say, yeah, this is one that I'm like, I know he has a plan and I don't know what the plan is, but we're gonna go for it and it, it you can't really plan for the separation. It, it shatters your heart and it breaks it. But I go back to that mental image my counselor gave me as your heart's just a little bit bigger so you could do it again. So and there's, there's lots and lots and lots of blessings and in fostering these kids, it's not a a give give give. It's definitely give take, they give back to you. What are some of the lessons that you have learned from Children in traumatic situations which is all Children that come to you have are coming from traumatic situations, right? My first lesson I used to joke with, with Conrad. I used to pray for patience and God delivered me Conrad. Oh yeah, I've prayed for patience before Cheryl. Not recommended. No, no, no. And Conrad and I can still laugh about it today. This child helped me learn patience. This child was so laid back. I swear to God. He walked horizontally. Sometimes I'm like, Conrad, you gotta move. The buzzards are circling overhead, let them know you're still alive. And he would say mom, you prayed for patience and you got me and he has a sense of humor. Yes, he does. He does. So, uh patience and the other thing I learned from kids is you have to love unconditionally and sometimes the housework isn't that important. You know. So you have a, a pile of dirty laundry that is waiting there screaming at you to get done. But the child needs you to just sit in their lap and rock them and cry with them. You have to take those moments and love unconditionally and let the housework sit. Yeah. No matter what, even though it goes against everything in your living being. Right. And you've gotta create memories, positive memories, positive memories for them to go home with. Yes. Right. And um some of our craziest memories, I'd say, hey, who's up for making a crazy memory? You know, and they'd get all excited and it'd be below zero and we're, we're dressed in multiple layers and we're sitting out watching a, a solar eclipse or something. And that 30 below zero, you know, so make positive memories, make sure, make sure you're there for them if you can be um emotionally, not just physically. Right. Right. I've had kids. Well, one just lived with me for the last year. He, he went into treatment, but I hadn't had him since he was four years old, but I kind of kept in touch with the adopted family and kind of kept in touch with him. And he got a hold of me a couple of years ago and said I'm not doing well. I, I wanna change. Can, can I come? And I'm like, there's some rules and he agreed to the rules and I said, well, let's do it, you know. So they, they still remember that security even though it's 20 years later. Wow, that's really huge. That a child, I mean, those childhood memories, it's what I've found. I look back at my childhood and it is as a mother, I know my kids are gonna have this nostalgia like I have growing up. But as a mother, I'm like, this is just regular life. This isn't. But when you're a child, the way you see things is in a dreamlike state and if it's negative, it is much bigger than what, worse than what it is. And if it's positive, it's much better than what it is. It's just this dreamlike state of childhood that you look back on and to have that space of positiveness where you are, what you're giving them those really crazy fun memories. That's something that is gonna turn into this hopefully big bubble of positiveness that'll explode all those negatives away. I hope so. I hope I had uh three out of the family of four have come back after they were adults and have stayed with me for a period of time trying to do a leg up in a system. So that's, that made me feel good that they felt comfortable enough to, to seek me out again. What do you think prepared you most to be a foster mom? My parents growing up, we always always had extras at the house. Christmas, regular Sunday dinners. I remember one Christmas. Um my, my dad told my mom he brought some company home for Christmas dinner and come to find out he was a hobo that had hopped on the train and it was too cold and the trains had shut down due to Christmas and then he was cold. And so he was at our house, you know, and then they used to have um town families for the bus kids that the buses. So we always had the bus kids, extras at our house. And um my cousins spent a lot of time at our house growing up. We just always had extras. Well, you came from a family of six kids, right? Yes. And you are the only girl. So that might have, that might have prepared you a little bit having. Yes. And my cousins, my actually it was my mom's cousins, spent a lot of time with us growing up and we always used to kind of think of him as another brother. So, so you have a career in education. Yes. And what, what part of education do you work in? So, I'm a, I have a K through 12 special ed degree and then a K through eight general ed degree and then a master's in special populations and also a preschool endorsement. But right now I'm working as a literacy math specialist. I work with 47 literacy students a day and 27 math students a day. And I work in small groups on very specific holes in their literacy or their math. And we work on that for four weeks, assess and either move on or readjust. What are, what are some special, what are special populations that you have worked with so I can work with artistic, special needs, gifted, those type of people that are outside the, the norm. OK, type thing, just how to help them better fit into society. And I feel my foster care helped me with that a lot. So, did you move further into special ed after foster care or did you do those coincide at all? I took lots and lots of classes when I got, was a foster parent. I got shine. I don't know if you know, shine. I remember shine. Yeah. You had him as a baby. Yes. And I still have him. Yeah. Yeah. 17, I got him at 17 days old and, uh, then he came back to me and I got long term guardianship of him and then when he turned 18, somebody says, well, why aren't you adopting Shine? I said, well, Shine always knows that we're together. They said, well, have you asked him? I'm like, no. So I said, Shine, do you want to be adopted? And immediately he said yes. And usually it takes him forever to say one way or another. I said, well, we'll get it done. We'll adopt when I adopt the other two, we'll just do all three. So that's how that came to being. But, um, because of his disability, his disability or his different ability is like what I like to call it, I took lots and lots of classes on fa s and how do the brain develops and what we can do to help. And then it got to be, I took so many of those classes that I couldn't get credit for it anymore without my master's. So I just went ahead and got my master's. I, I was teaching in the regular classroom but they would always put the special needs kids in my classroom. So that helped pre prepare for my master's degree. Also. How many kids have you fostered? I've had 100 and 11 kids in 25 years. And what is the most you've had at one time? Oh, I had eight. Oh, my gosh, at one time. Or, and that was only for two weeks and then the most I had after that was six. And I had that for about six months and then shine was mixed in there. But he was not considered a foster child at that time. But I had five kids under the age of four and Conrad and Ok. Yeah. And was in my class. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, do you take in predominantly boys or girls or just whatever comes when I took the foster parenting classes, they asked me what was my ideal age? What was my ideal sex of the child? And I said, well, how would I know that? And they said, well, think about it, think about it and pray about it and see what comes up. And I'm like, I'm going to take the child no matter what age that's in need. I said, you don't really get to pick what you're having when you're pregnant. I, I just felt really wrong that I could say, ok, I will do foster care. That's the age limit only and only if it's girls. I just felt I would know and there's three times in my 25 years that I went against what, what God was telling me. And, um, which is pretty good. I don't know how many placements but three different times I'm like, well, I'm gonna do it anyway and they turned out disastrous and I ended up calling social services and I said I tried, I, I did the best I can, but this is not working. So your lesson was listen, listen and accept that, that you have limitations and maybe I have limitations. Yes. Who are your biggest supporters alongside this? Because as a single parent bringing in foster kid after foster kid and traumatic story, after traumatic story, you can't do this alone. You had to have support. No, you have to. So my family was a huge support and the community of Mont was a huge, huge support because these kids would come with no clothes, no shoes, no coats. I mean, it was just like overwhelming at times. It's like how and, and you know, Edgemont, there's not a place to shop in Edgemont, South Dakota. But, uh, I remember one time I got a group of six. Oh, I was supposed to get a family group of six and it was February below zero. Some of them had one sock, some of them had no socks, some had one shoe and three of them were in diapers. And I'm like, I, I, I can't do this because I had my kids at home still. I can't do this. They said, can you take the oldest four? I said, let me call Darryl dot And see. So I called Darryl after hours. I said, Darryl, I got this, this bunch of kids. We have no formula, no diapers, no bottles. I said I could give up the other two but these two before I send them to Custer really need some provisions. Is there any way he said, yep. And he went down to the grocery store. I got diapers for the three and formula for the two littler ones and they went on, you know, and, uh, it didn't take long for the word to get around. And the next morning I had bags of clothes sitting in my front porch so I could get the kids dressed and bathed and everything. That it was a, it was just a miracle. You took four kids in. Yeah. Who did you call? Did you have your mom come over and help you with this? Do you or do you know? Because, because it was already, she was already in bed. I called Darryl because it was late. I woke him up and he went down and got that. And Darryl, I think Darryl told Michelle or something. I don't know how it all happened, but I mean Michelle could get things done. Yes. Yes. And I, I took uh Conrad and t-shirts and we tied, tie them for nightgowns and things and bed him down. And I remember that the five year old come up to me and says, auntie, auntie, can we take a shower? And I said, well, of course, you can take a shower. Auntie. Auntie, can we take a shower with the bubbles? I said, you mean a bath? No, the bubbles. Oh, the hair. Yeah. And I said, yes. Auntie. Auntie, can we get rid of these two? And he pulled one out and it was head lice. Oh my God. Yeah, we can get, we can get rid of the tomorrow. I didn't have any, you know, I didn't wanna call Darryl Du again and say, hey, call you in the morning, let's get a shower in, let's get you in the bed. So a lot of times when, uh, social services comes into a family, there's, there's obviously there's no notice they have to come, they get the kids in whatever they're wearing and they put them in the car. So that's why they're coming with no clothes, no shoes, no socks. It's not necessarily that they didn't have those at their home, but they weren't clothed at the time. Most of the time they weren't clothed some of the time they didn't have it. Sometimes it was just a traumatic situation and you gotta get him out as soon as possible. Once I moved up to Rapid, they had these little care kits that they would try to throw in together trial size shampoo lotion, um, socks underwear and maybe sometimes a pair of pajamas or a t-shirt that you could use for pajamas. And that was helpful, you know, and then once I got trapped, they would give you a clothing voucher. But the thing is like I got Tyler when he was three and I had to strip him out in the, on the deck because he is full of head lice and bed bugs. And I didn't want that in my house and he came with no clothes but two diapers. And it's like, and it was 10 o'clock at night. So they said, well, as soon as it, this is on a Friday night, we'll get you a clothing voucher soon as Ds S opens up on Monday morning. Ok. But it's Friday night. Is he just gonna be naked all weekend? Is that what we're going with? Yeah. And two diapers is not going to last that long, you know, uh seek in Edgemont. I had started making boxes of clothes, gender in different sizes. But when I left Edgemont, I didn't have a place to live up here and I just got rid of all that because I wasn't gonna do this anymore. How'd that go for you? Not very well. See I said I would never teach in my hometown and I never teach on the reservation. And the first job I got was on the reservation and God said, and who's driving this car? And I'm like, ok. Ok. And my second job was teaching in my hometown for 16 years. So, uh I've learned that sometimes I gotta take the back seat and not be a backseat driver. Isn't that what we all have to learn? I mean, that's the primary lesson in parenting. Yes. And what works for one kid might not work for the next and what works this week might not work next week for that kid, you just gotta be fluid all the time. What is that? Is there something that you're consistent with, with your kids? Like, what are your house rules that you always have for your kids that come in? They have to make their bed every morning and help pick up and they have to shower, brush their teeth. And when they, they're little, like if they were four, they had to do four, pay it forwards in a week and then when they turn five, just so they could start thinking outside themselves. So, and, and try to make a conscious effort if that makes sense. So it might be holding the door open for the lady that would be pay it forward. Or maybe they would break somebody's lawn as they got older or walk a dog or just different ways, they could help people to help them think of others besides themselves because sometimes the trauma is so great, they can't see the good that's out there. Does that make sense? What I'm trying to say? So, help spread the good and it's gonna come back to you too. And, and so they can be the enforcer of good. Yes. Yes. So they could be the reason someone's having a good day. Yeah. And that also makes you feel better, right. So you can be in control of, in some ways of how you feel by doing good things to others, for others. And then why the making of the bed. It's, my mom raised us that way and just said, it's your first accomplishment of the day. If you hit at least accomplished that, it sets, sets the tone for the day. I accept. I still am probably not gonna do that. But I, I like your reasoning. I know, uh, we, we tried to get by without it growing up and of course, we always had chores to do before we went to school. And one particular morning my mom wasn't taking us to school. We got to take ourselves. So we kind of slacked on the chores, you know, thinking, ah, we got a good, well, about 10, 10 30 in the a, in the morning, the principal came on the intercom and said, would the barker Children please report to the office? Oh, no. So we went to the office wondering what the heck's going on and my mom had one word March. Oh, no. Out, out of, she took you out of school and we went home and we did our chores and we came back and you know what? It never happened again. This explains the barker kids a little bit more and I did it to Conrad and They still laugh about it. I had to take one up to rapid early morning for an appointment and they were supposed to get themselves to school and make sure they did their chores and I got home and nothing was done, I took them out of school and they went and did their chores and I brought them back and have them explain it to your peers. He never wanna do that again. I feel like we should have had this conversation a long time ago because this would have been really helpful for me. But I guess for moving forward I now will utilize the Cheryl Barker way of doing things. Yeah. I don't know if it's the right thing, but it worked, it worked. What resources do you have in South Dakota as a foster parent that you use, that have been helpful for you. Not a lot of resources you really, really have to, you have to research a lot and you have to dig and when I first got shine, um, I didn't realize they sent him home from the N U expecting him to die over the weekend. Who did they send him home with, with you? They sent him home with you? Did they tell him they thought he was? Did they tell you that? No, I didn't find out till I Monday morning. I showed up for his doctor's appointment and the doctor said, oh, I'm surprised you're here and I'm like, I'm a foster parent and I keep all of my appointments and I'm very religious about that. I don't just not show that's a pet peeve of mine. He says, no, I, I never expected him to be here still. Why would they discharge him if they thought he was gonna die? And he said, why I expected him to expire over the weekend? And my brain is still trying to take this all in. And I also, I could think of, I looked at the doctor and I said expire, expire like a can of peaches. I mean, I, I just could not wrap my head around this £4.04 pound eight ounce baby that they sent home with me 90 miles from the nearest resources and they expected him to expire. And I just looked at him and I said, I'm, I'm sorry. I said I have to get it. I have to have you off my team. Yeah. He says, well, good luck with that. He says, if you can find somebody and he said, see here and he did that to shine's chin. He's not going to amount to much. Is that because he was native American or because he was born with FA S because he was native American. He was life fighted into rapid city. His blood alcohol content was so extremely high. They gave him blood transfusions to try to, oh my God. He had extremely, he had no suction. He didn't have enough. Yeah. And he, his roof of his mouth was so high and I went through every nipple bottle combination possible and I took him to a wick appointment and I'm starting to cry and I'm like, I can't find a bottle that he can eat. And, uh, she says you need a speech therapist. And I looked at her and I said, he's four weeks old. I don't need a speech. She said, no, no, you need a speech therapist. They can help you. And I said, you're kidding. And she happened to be filling in for the county nurse. She was a retired nurse. I can't think of her name now. She set me up an appointment in Rapid City and I went to Rapid City regional rehab and we spent four hours there and we went through nipple bottle combinations possible. And they showed me how to support his chin. And we went with the one with the bottle because I could kind of squirt a little bit into it. And they gave me a prescription for predigested high calorie formula, which was enormous price and have your special ordered. But wick covered it and from the, from the speech therapy, I'm like I need this and I need that. And finally somebody gave me so I'm set trying to set these up and I'm trying to find a doctor that would authorize it. And somebody gave me the number to Beth how out of Custer. And I explained what I was trying to do and she was a birth to three coordinator and I told her everything. She said, that's my job, Cheryl. And I said what she said, this is my job. I said, I fired the doctor. So now I, I can't find a doctor that's willing to work with me, but he's not going to end up being nothing. He's not on my watch and she hooked me up and we got a cardiologist and a pediatric cardiologist, a pediatric gastro intestinal person. I mean, she helped me tremendously get all these supports in place and they didn't think he would ever walk or talk. He's played basketball, he's run soccer, um, played the violin for two years. Graduated from high school in three years. You know, he's, he's, he's my miracle baby. He's had 11 surgeries. Oh, my gosh, we went, he had to have a lot of jaw and facial surgeries. In fact, six of those were all to reconstruct his, his jaw in his mouth and, uh, his sinuses pretty significant surgeries. We went to Chicago through Shriners. So, uh, yeah, we're where God guides, he will provide what is, what is shine doing today. He, he works for a tire company. He's at home living with me. He lived out, he lived for a while and got into a toxic, um, relationship and he, he, he and his roommate had a toxic relationship and then, uh, he got emotionally really in a bad situation and I said, I think you need to come home. It's, it doesn't mean you're a failure or anything. But this relationship, your roommate and his girlfriend are, you're, you're supporting them and that can't keep happening and he has done great a year ago today. He gave his life to Jesus. That's incredible. That was like, you're like, I ma heart explosion, heart explosion. Yes. That's incredible. Have you ever had uh relationships with biological families with some of these kids? Yes. So shines. So she actually got put back with his parents when he was 18 months old. They moved to Edgemont to be closer to me because Shane and I had such an incredible bond and my parents actually helped them purchase a house, but they weren't able to keep up with the payments and they both started drinking again and things went south. So there's only six months and Shine's life that we weren't together and he went through hell those six months. But it was a very unique relationship. They would call, Rhonda would call and say, hey, when are you celebrating? When's your family celebrating Christmas? So we can plan our Christmas around because we want shine to be part of that. And they would even come down for some of our holidays, you know. And then they're like, we would really like trying to get baptized Easter Sunday. And he was like, I think he's three or four years old. And they said, would you consider coming down to? I said, sure. And, uh, they asked mom and dad and we all went down there. It's like down there in the middle of nowhere, you know. And, uh, participated in Easter Sunday baptism and Easter egg hunts and they take Easter egg hunts seriously seriously. All ages. Oh, Jeez. Yeah. So, uh, so I, I have become France. Um, Shine's mom and dad. We, we openly talked about it how they didn't like me in the beginning and I didn't like them in the beginning and we put it aside, um, because not liking Rhonda and Jean, because of what they did to shine is not gonna change his situation. Right? And Rhonda feeling bad about it and beating herself up for drinking while pregnant wasn't going to change the situation. And uh we did what was best for the kids. And she told my dad one time because she, she had a rough childhood too tossed around and being, being raised by a step grandmother and husband, you know, and she said, uh I, I didn't know how to be a mom and tell I could watch Cheryl with Shine and they taught me how to be a mom. So I thought that was a huge, huge compliment and honor. And I've tried, I've had a lot of, I did a lot of visits myself. DS s had allowed me to do visits. Sometimes it's very hard, very hard. Uh sometimes the parents are too toxic and it's not in the child's best interest. But how do you fight that? Because so much, so often that's a court order, you have to take that child to that family, regardless of the toxicity. How do you fight that? You try to prepare the child for it as much as possible. And, you know, with Tyler and Zach, I'd say the visits one hour, you know, I'm gonna drop you off and I'm gonna be right here the same place waiting for you when it's over and just know I love you. And sometimes I would do the kissing hand, you know, the, the, I'm, I'm right there, you know, and, and sometimes they were doing visits behind a two way mirror trying to help the parents learned how to be parents. And Tyler didn't have a large vocabulary, but he figured out that was a two way mirror and he would just fight with the parents and not cooperate with them at all. And he'd come up to the two way mirror and mama, mama, mama mama and it would just break my heart, you know, because you'd have to force them, you know, and Conrad and autumn that, you know, my first real long term foster care and they would force visits and they would have defecate on themselves and pee on themselves just before the visit or after the visit because it was so traumatic for them and had I known I would have fought more for them, but I was a brand new foster parent and the social worker is like, it's court ordered blah, blah, blah, we could have called the judge and said you are traumatizing these kids. But I didn't know at the time you didn't know what your, your rights as a foster parent are. You think you think your job is to be the temporary care caretaker? But it's ultimately, you're a guardian a light up, right? You are the person that is, is representing this child and it wasn't until I met a guardian. Lim Court ordered that I realized I had a lot more rights than I thought, you know, the social worker at the time jokingly and said we'll put up a donation can for new seat covers for Cheryl's car because I drove them to hot springs once a week because, and her, your kids are being so traumatized. And so she, she joked to get seat covers for you rather than stop traumatizing. That's horrific and to be a a to be a social worker who is so used to that, that you can just joke about it. Yeah. And, and, and things like that happened more times than you would like. Yeah. You know, and I, I know, uh one of my favorite stories about Conrad. So I, I dropped him off for counseling and I had a meeting up in rapid after counseling and 15 minutes into counseling. It's a brand new counselor and the counselors on the phone saying you gotta get here, you got, you, you gotta come back, you gotta come back and it sounded like he was crying. So I'm like, oh my God, oh my God. What happened? What, what, what's, what's going on, what is going on and the counselors like he just shared, he's, I, I, I, I, I just need to step away. I'm like, we still have 45 minutes of counseling. What do you mean? You need to step away? This kid just opened up a huge wound and he is sobbing hysterically. I gotta get for the, the counselor was sobbing or the child was sobbing both both and the and the counselor was apologizing and said, I'm not. Mm Was it ready for what Conrad divulged? And uh I can't divulge on it right now just unless I have permission from, from Conrad. So, so we are driving to Rapid City and Conrad is still just upset as heck and thundering and lightening around and he's like mom, I just wanna be adopted or I just want to be baptized and then a great big crack of thunder and I'm like, ok, but his parents were, were not let him get adopted because you can't do anything like that unless they're fully adopted. You can't even cut their hair unless they're per foster. Yeah, without permission. So I get rapid, I get on the phone, I'm calling the social worker and I'm like this happened at counseling, the counselor lost, it had to coun cancel them counseling appointment because this is so traumatic. Conrad's been crying and hitting my dashboard because he wants to be baptized and the parents say no, blah, blah, blah. And I, he said, put him on the phone. So I put Conrad on the phone and he's still crying. He's back into that because he's been crying for over an hour and a half now. And he says, I just want to be baptized. He said, well, buddy, can you calm down for your mom? Let her go to our meeting and her appointment and we'll see what can happen. Ok. Well, like a couple days later, he said, hey, he can get baptized. I'm like, are you serious? How did you do this? He says, no, he, he can, he can be baptized. He is 13 years old. He has the right to be baptized if that's what he needs to, you know, and it was right before Easter Sunday, I call up. I said, hey, he's, we're gonna, we're gonna do it as part of Easter Sunday mass. We, we'll make this happen and I'm still in awe because we had been fighting this back and forth, back and forth. And once Conrad decided what he wanted, there was no, this is what he wanted. This is the path he was going to take. So make a shorter story. He got baptized on Easter Sunday. And I think he literally walked on water that day. Everybody in the congregation thought he was walking on water too. So then comes Tuesday after Easter and the social worker called because we had Easter Monday off. Social worker calls me, hey, Cheryl. I have some bad news and I'm like, oh, no, what happened? He's, I resigned. I'm gonna take a, a job up in Rapid City. I'm gonna work for another part of the agency. He says I can't do this. And I said, you're kidding. After all this work, I finally get a social worker that's advocating for me and then it finally hit me. I'm like, did you really have permission to get him baptized? And he said, what are they gonna do? Dry him off and say, I unbaptized thee. I said, did you know you were resigning when he told me I could baptize him? Yep. And you neglected to tell me and until today. Yep. And he says, what are they gonna do? And, and that turning moment that little fine for, for Conrad made a huge impact in his life. It gave him control of his life saying this is the direction I wanna go and I choose this. Yes. And, and the social worker bless his heart said he needed that healing to know that he was no longer part of this toxicity that he had a way to get out. So we laugh about it today and Conrad would say, yes, they can't drive me off for that one either. Mom can't. They, that's a good house joke now to have. Yes, it is. Were you able to go to all these appointments and keep a job. It's tough. And Edgemont we would leave. Um, sometimes I would, I would try to make him early, early, early in the morning. We would leave the house at six o'clock. And if I could show up for the Orthodox appointments, like at 7 30 I could be back at Edgemont by 99 30 only miss a short portion of work many nights we would leave. So the school was out and come up to Rapid for, for counseling. I would like to say now that I live in Rapid City, it's much easier. But my schedule is still just crazy, crazy, crazy. Um I've had other foster parents not sign their, their kids up for anything and, and just not extra counseling and things. But my philosophy is what if this one thing can make a difference in their life? What if this horse therapy turns the switch and turns their life around? Or what if this brain core therapy makes a difference? You can't just sit back and not, not do. It's all part of that building the bricks, building the bricks. So I'm that crazy foster parent that five days a week. I have some kind of appointment with the kettles. Now that he's 16, he can get on the bus and go to some of his appointments and I just have to pick him up and how do you, how do you pay for all this out of your pocket. A lot of the stuff is out of your own pocket because the state does not cover it. And you're a single mom working as in education. Yes. So, all your money is going into kids. Yeah. I don't have much of a retirement but you can't take it with you. Right. Right. Well, hopefully some of those successful brothers will help you out at the end of the day. I, I know, uh, Ken, um, when I got Conrad and Adam, they had nothing and their shoes were too big. He sent me $200 and he says, I want you to go get them shoes that fit. And they had what was called the big shoes shuffle. So they couldn't, their knee, their knees were permanently bent and their ankles were per because they would shuffle with in their shoes to keep them on. So we're going through a F OS and occupational therapy and physical therapy. And so he told me to go get shoes and I took them to Sears to go get shoes. And he says, and the other thing is Cheryl, I want them to, I want you to buy them a toy, let them pick it out, you know, and it took forever because they had never gotten brand new shoes. So then it's like, ok, we got brand new shoes, underwear socks, and now you guys gotta get the toys, you know, you can spend toys. They took forever to find the perfect toy. And Conrad came up with a semi truck car, call hauler because it had two cars in there. He says, mom, mom, if I get this, I get four toys and got a doll that had a change of clothes and I think a pacifier and a rattle or something. And she was thinking if I buy this one thing, I get four things and it was such a novelty to them. So then we get home and they didn't have any clue on how to play the, their imagination. You know, I said, Conrad play with your truck and he just laid on the floor and it went back and forth and back and forth. And I says, honey, you know how to play with the truck, you know, build the roads and they didn't have any, any imagination to do that because of, I guess, from all the trauma, you know. So I was down on the floor and we were building roads and bridges and go on all over thing and the doll became a truck driver, you know. So they, so they would learn how to, to play and not, you know, and they kept asking me, does this have to go to the, so a secondhand store tomorrow? Their shoes and I'm like, no, these are your shoes, these are for you to keep, you know, these are your toys. Yeah. You know. So, uh, some things that you just take for granted. You, you don't realize it's amazing what a child learns in the first five years of their life, what they're supposed to be learning, they're supposed to be learning play, they're supposed to be learning speech. And when you, when there's trauma involved, if there's any flight, fight or flight, those neurons stop because those are not important. Survival is important and learning is not important, right? And that emotional loss of those first five years that you can if there's any literally not, not no touching, like no positive touch, that could mess a kid up for life. Like, yeah, it was I remember going through these adoption classes and just learning all of the things that could go wrong. And I'm like, wow, this is a really positive adoption class. Thank you for teaching me, you know, and then people are like, well, I'll get an infant, I'll just, you know, I'll get a baby, it'll be easy. And then you learn about all the things that could go wrong in pregnancy. Any like the stress upon the mother is the one of the worst things that that could cause lifelong trauma. If a mother is stressed during pregnancies, I if the mother is in a traumatic situation during pregnancy and now if the mother is in a traumatic situation during pregnancy, there's probably drugs and alcohol involved to to cope with that. So then add that to the list of trauma that that kid is gonna start their first day of life with. I know it. And, and prime example, she was in denial of, of this pregnancy, her pregnancy. And how old was she when that happened? 13, 13, she came to you pregnant pregnant, 13, denial, denial, denial. And wow, we learned a lot, we learned a whole lot, you know, and we, we adopted that, that baby out and I still keep in touch with that grown girl now and her parents. But even though had the best prenatal care after the fact, I mean, she was for almost four months pregnant when I got her, that little girl still had attachment disorder. Yeah, because of in neal trauma, you know, and they went to a family that had a farm that never, ever, ever had horses and loved, loved horses and she would spend hours brushing my dad's Belgium and then she wouldn't cry. So we, we had her comb and brush the Belgium and ever since that little girl could talk, she wanted a horse. So, you know, how much connection goes on in pregnancy and that genetic makeup. Yeah. Yeah. You definitely taught me a lot about childhood. I remember when came to school, our class was talked to about her situation. I don't remember if it was you that talked to us or if it was a principal or I don't remember who talked to us, but they said this is the situation you don't ask her about it. You don't bring it up, you include her in everything and any questions that was a life lesson that you brought to our school. Yes. You know. And uh to this day she said that was the best thing that ever happened to her. And I had to give a talk to Bethany Christian services and where I was talking about what she wanted me to include. And she said it was the best thing that ever happened to her. And I'm like, what is the best thing? What was the best thing getting pregnant? And I said, how could you say that? How could you? She says because it got me out of that life. But finally somebody noticed, oh, wait, a 13 year old should not be pregnant. Oh my God. I'm like, wow. Wow. You know, you know, so what we viewed as horrendous and horrible, she viewed it as life a great blessing. Life saving. Yep. That's unbelievable. Cheryl. You, you asked me why I wanted to interview you? I don't know if have you noticed any themes in here that might, might be helpful for other families? But I'm gonna ask you one more question. What is it? How can you give yourself more grace as a, as a mom? Wow. I'm going to be turning 60 years old this summer and I just have been working on that the last 3 to 5 years because I never gave myself grace. And I almost died. In 2017, I was given less than 10% chance of living surviving. I turned in septic and I remember kind of waking up in the IC U. I had adopted the three boys March 17th, 2017. And this was August. And I remember seeing God, I, I don't think I could make it and I remember getting given permission. I could just lay back and know it was over. But then my eyes came open. It's like, what about my boys? What about my boy? I don't have, I don't have a will. I don't have anybody to take these boys on and who's going to take on three special need boys. So I remember saying, God, I, I don't have anything set up for them, so I need to stay. So I stayed and I got out of the hospital on August 13th and celebrated my mom's 80th birthday and I went back in the hospital, August 15th and she went into hospice, August 15th and we were going through some of the similar things. They were trying to get fluid off her lungs and trying to get fluid off my lungs. And my birthday was August 17th and everybody thought she would pass away August 17th and she passed away the next day and I got out of the hospital the day before her funeral and I was learning all of that it's like Cheryl, you gotta give yourself grace. So through lots of counseling and setting time aside to myself and lots of healing. I, I've learned, you gotta give yourself grace or you can't give grace to others. I think that the thing is if you don't really take care of yourself and love yourself as much as you love your kids, how can you really show them what love is? If you can't even love the person that you're asking them, you know, I can give you everything, but I'm not willing to give myself everything. Yes. Yep. That was a huge, huge lesson. And you can't, you, you can't be around people that always empty your teapot and never fill it back up. That was a huge lesson. There's not. So I'm very uh I do a lot more even though I'm busy and sometimes I want to do nothing. I, I make connections with friends that fill my teapot and I'm there for them equally. I, I, I've always tried to go on one on one dates with my kids just to give them that individual time because sometimes life gets hectic. But you have to same for this hour. I'm gonna give you everything I got. I'm gonna be here for you and show them grace so they can give grace to others. I want to give a huge thank you to our guest, Cheryl Barker for sharing her heart and her incredible journey with us. Through her experiences, we have learned the true meaning of grace and the importance of self healing. Remember a little bit of grace goes a long way, not just for ourselves but for others. Thank you so much for joining me on the Raising Grace podcast. Remember you are not alone in this parenting journey and we are all in this together doing the best we can with the information we have. If you want to stay up to date on the latest episodes and news for this podcast, head over to my website at Sheila K Chester dot com. Thank you again for listening. And until next time, let's be sure to give each other a little more grace.

On this episode, Sandra Cooze shares her perspectives on parenting, overcoming trauma, and rebuilding relationships. She discusses how she and her husband teach their son about honesty and owning up to mistakes. Additionally, Sandra talks about bullying, both her experience and her son’s, sharing the importance of focusing on being with the child and handling trauma with a professional. She also speaks about how to deal with trauma triggers, breaking down past troubling experiences, and rebuilding trust. Overall, this episode offers a lot of helpful and useful information on overcoming trauma and parenting with understanding, compassion, and love.

Sheila Chester [00:00:00]:All right, Jessica, why don't we just get started having our conversation? Can you tell me tell me who your family is?Jessica Tagler [00:00:08]:My family is my son King, who is twelve, and my daughter Ajana, who will be 17 this month, and my dog Jack. Jack, who I love dearly.Sheila Chester [00:00:20]:Do you have any, like, close friends or family where you live?Jessica Tagler [00:00:25]:So my sister is not far from me, my sister Genevieve. My friends are not close, however, but they did just fly in to see me last weekend all the way from South Dakota and New Mexico. So I've got amazing friends, but they're not close to me.Sheila Chester [00:00:41]:They do love you, don't they? I see your Facebook feed all the time. You guys spend probably three weekends a year or more together, don't you?Jessica Tagler [00:00:50]:Oh, yeah, we try to, definitely.Sheila Chester [00:00:53]:Why don't we dive into that friendship? Because you guys have all been connected through some interesting circumstances your entire lives.Jessica Tagler [00:01:00]:Yeah, absolutely. How long have you known them? More than 30 years. I think it starts in the fourth grade. Long time. We've been through a lot together. We have experienced some pretty amazing things together, and they've experienced amazing things in their lives, and it's just been quite a journey with all of them.Sheila Chester [00:01:27]:So how did your journey as a mother start?Jessica Tagler [00:01:31]:Well, as a biological mother, it started when I was 17. I had gotten pregnant in high school with my daughter Allison, who just celebrated her 25th birthday. It's fine, it's fine. She came along actually my senior year, about three months before I graduated high school. And I ended up giving her up for adoption. And we reconnected when she turned 18. She looked me up on Facebook and was able to find me by looking up my name, but it had been a closed adoption for 18 years. I had no idea where she was living. I was corresponding with her adoptive family through an adoption agency in South Dakota, and so I would see pictures and get letters and such, but I finally got to see her or talk to her through text messaging when she turned 18. We have yet to talk on the phone and we have yet to meet slowly but surely. And I'm just waiting for her whenever she's ready.Sheila Chester [00:02:38]:Doing the closed adoption and not really knowing how she's doing. So how did you get through that time?Jessica Tagler [00:02:47]:It was extremely emotional time, especially right after she was born. I did have the support of my mom always, which was good, and my friends. But I think just receiving those letters and pictures and knowing in my heart of hearts that she was doing very well, it was a good feeling just to know that she was being well taken care of. And she said, thank you for giving me such a good life. I have had a great life, and thank you so much for giving birth to me because there was a point, a very short point in time where I was considering an abortion just because of the guilt and shame and fear that's associated with teen pregnancy. But by the grace of God, that did not happen, and she was very grateful for that as well.Sheila Chester [00:03:38]:I'm going to tell this cute little story. I remember when you were pregnant in high school. We went to high school together because we did this prom dress exchange, and you were probably seven or eight months pregnant and trying on all of the dresses in Miss Cavell's room and just laughing hysterically. And the joy. I'll never forget that day, just like I did not see the shame in your face. You were always laughing. You're always laughing. That's wonderful.Jessica Tagler [00:04:18]:Mrs. Philvell was a huge also support system during that whole time. She was very light hearted teacher, and she really gave me good advice. And she'd always say, every time I was complaining because I did that quite a bit, she would say, Jessica, you're just pregnant. That's only thing that's wrong with you. And I'm like, I don't feel good. No, you're just pregnant. She was amazing. Love her.Sheila Chester [00:04:45]:What was your experience with the rest of the school? Because it was a really small school that we went to and a really small town, so there's no secrets. You can't keep secrets.Jessica Tagler [00:04:55]:Well, everyone was very kind to my face, but when you are a young girl that's pregnant in high school, there's always that gossiping, especially in a small school, gossiping, talking behind your back, making their judgments. And of course, nobody did it to me, but there's always just that stigma that goes with it, you know what I mean? I was very grateful for the people that were close to me during that time. But at school, the teachers were cool. They were real cool. Especially I just remembered Mr. Nelson just being, yeah, real accommodating, giving me the big old table in the back of the classroom because I couldn't fit in the desks toward the end of the pregnancy. And he was just very accommodating. He was awful. So I appreciate those teachers, I really do.Sheila Chester [00:05:54]:That's incredible. Obviously, it's a traumatic experience, but.Jessica Tagler [00:06:02]:It.Sheila Chester [00:06:03]:Could have been worse.Jessica Tagler [00:06:05]:It was extremely traumatic, and it was extremely traumatic, even to the point where I drove by Rapid City Regional Hospital when I was visiting a few years ago. And just driving by that hospital, I was like, oh. Because when you leave the hospital and you give your baby up for adoption, there is something terribly wrong, terribly missing. You carried this baby for nine months, and then all of a sudden she's not with you anymore. It's very traumatic. And I just thank God that I am in communication with her, just knowing that she's just living her best life. She's going to get married this year. I'm so happy.Sheila Chester [00:06:47]:That's so exciting. I'm so glad you have that. For people who have had closed adoptions. A lot of times they don't get to meet and, like, thank God. It's the age of Facebook and social media, where that is a bonus that it's easy to be found and you've let yourself also be easy to be found, too. I mean, you're not hiding, so that's amazing. And hopefully someday the sisters get a meet and the brother and sister get a meet. Like, that would be oh, absolutely.Jessica Tagler [00:07:19]:And they want to. And my daughter is communicating with her via Snapchat or whatever, so they're just fully but surely building a relationship. But, yeah, my son definitely wants to meet her. We all do.Sheila Chester [00:07:32]:So after you leave high school, you've placed this child. I have lost track of you after that. I have no idea what your life was like after that.Jessica Tagler [00:07:41]:It was very interesting. As you know, born and raised in Edgemont, lived there for 18 years, and just gave a baby up for adoption and had really no direction in life whatsoever. My mom reached out to her family on the East Coast in Maryland and said, can she come and live with you? Because she knew that they were a good family and I would have more opportunity there. They're like. Sure. Come on. So I moved to Maryland, got into very dark place there emotionally, and really still not on the track for success at all. I think I was kind of lost it a little bit. I had been through that whole situation with Alison and, you know, didn't know where I wanted to be, didn't know what I wanted to do, no direction, no real guidance or anything until my sister Genevieve. One day, she called me from Phoenix, and she's like, hey, I moved here. Will you come live with me? I'm like, sure. I'm not doing anything. So I got in my little car, and when I was 20 years old and drove from Maryland to Arizona by myself without a cell phone, using Map bus by the day.Sheila Chester [00:08:55]:I don't even know how that how did you even make it to Arizona?Jessica Tagler [00:08:59]:No, I'm not sure. There was no fear, I guess, back then, because it was do or die, and I did it. So I got here, and Genevieve had also given a son up for adoption the same time I gave Alison up for adoption. And so it was a crazy time in our lives. By the time I came to Arizona, we were just complete alcoholics together and just partied hard and on a fast track to absolutely nowhere. Until one day what amazing day, we had been invited to this church, faith Christian Center, 26 40 East McDowell Road, Phoenix, Arizona, if anybody wants to visit. And we walked into that church. We got supernaturally saved and delivered of all of our demons, and that's the best way that I can put it. And Jenna's version, of course, is much better than mine, but it put us on a completely different road, leading us to Naomi house, leading me to go to school, all these amazing things. So that's where I was in early 2000.Sheila Chester [00:10:16]:I got to tell you, I didn't have any trauma growing up, other than being a teenager, which was extremely traumatic. And my 20s were awful. Like, those first years out of high school, from a small town to a big city, I was in college, but changing majors all the time, it was awful. And then to imagine having a traumatic situation happen to you like that right after you leave, and then everything changes, and you're trying to deal with something so emotional, and you have only yourself to try to figure it out. It's so hard.Jessica Tagler [00:10:58]:So hard.Sheila Chester [00:10:59]:Just because we're 18 and we walk out into the universe, I feel like go to, like, at least a year of therapy before they let us leave.Jessica Tagler [00:11:08]:One year, if not five. Absolutely. I mean, it's necessary. We don't know anything when we're 18. And I had the guidance of Genevieve, especially in our early 20s. Thank God. I thank God for saving me from what could have been, because it should have turned out very different than it is. I should be probably addicted to drugs somewhere on the streets. My kids should have probably been taken away from me, you know what I mean? But God put us on a completely different path. And so I'm here today because of Jesus, and that's the only reason that I am in my right mind and my life is the way it is.Sheila Chester [00:11:52]:Yeah, I feel that to the core. And how is your faith? I know you kind of talked about that, but how has your faith shaped you as a mother?Jessica Tagler [00:12:06]:Well, I had to heal from so much in my life. It wasn't all roses. Even after I got saved, there was a lot that took place, and I definitely leaned on Genevieve and Jesus, and that shaped me to be the mom that I am today and able to instill in my kids. Faith. Forgiveness. Oh, God. Forgiveness, I think, is the key to anything. Anything that you forgiveness. Absolutely. So there was a major healing process, and that took place while I was at Naomi house for all those years, and that's what has shaped me to be the mom that I am today.Sheila Chester [00:12:50]:And how are you preparing your kids to I mean, your daughter's almost 18. How are you preparing her for adulthood? You're like, you're living in my basement for the rest of your life.Jessica Tagler [00:13:02]:Well, that's all there is to it. I'm like, don't go. That's my secret. Right? And of course, just telling her that no matter what, I am always going to be here for you. And if you ever find yourself in a situation that you can't get out of, please just let me know. There's no judgment. There's no fear of me being mad or whatever, and I hate to say that she's perfect, Sheila, but she's borderline just wow. Like, completely different than I was in high school. And I am very confident that Ajana. Is going to be successful no matter what she puts her mind to. She is amazing, but just trying to teach her about the responsibilities of being an adult.Sheila Chester [00:13:54]:Gross. I don't even like the responsibilities of being an adult.Jessica Tagler [00:13:58]:Now.Sheila Chester [00:13:59]:Seriously raising kids. So you've been a single mom to your two kids for 17 years, is that right?Jessica Tagler [00:14:11]:That's correct, yes.Sheila Chester [00:14:13]:How's that gone?Jessica Tagler [00:14:14]:Oh, I wouldn't recommend it. I wouldn't recommend it, and I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy. And that's another thing I tell my kids, one spouse with all your kids, have all your kids when you get married. Don't rush to get married, but just wait on god when it comes to that, because I think that that's probably the most difficult job on this planet, is single parent. And again, I've had a lot of help from my sister and my sisters, Jennifer also. And living at Naomi house, I was able to be a stay at home mom, which thank you, god, for Naomi house. And other than that, it has been very difficult.Sheila Chester [00:15:01]:And not only are you a single mom, but you're a single mom to biracial kids.Jessica Tagler [00:15:07]:Yeah, absolutely.Sheila Chester [00:15:08]:So that makes it a little bit harder, even.Jessica Tagler [00:15:12]:It does. And my daughter has taught me a lot about being black in America that I never knew, of course, because I grew up in South Dakota and because I'm white. So I've learned a lot through her. And that has definitely presented challenges, for sure.Sheila Chester [00:15:30]:It sounds like you have given birth to your own personal counselor.Jessica Tagler [00:15:34]:Yeah, exactly. She's my best friend and my therapist all in one.Sheila Chester [00:15:40]:Yeah, you really saved some money on that. That's a good call.Jessica Tagler [00:15:44]:That was my plan the whole time.Sheila Chester [00:15:46]:Planned that one out. All right, we've talked about Naomi house a little bit. Why don't you tell me? Tell me about this organization, because I'd really like to know more, and it sounds amazing. And all the things that you post.Jessica Tagler [00:15:58]:About these kids, I want to know it all. So Naomi is an acronym for native American outreach ministries incorporated. And I think it's so interesting, the whole aspect of Naomi house, it is an emergency placement, shelter and foster home for native American kiddos in northern Arizona. And my baby, Allison, she is a half lakota Sioux. And I think it's so interesting how god brought me back to native American children after I gave up my native American for adoption. And it's beautiful, you know what I mean? I just felt like I had the opportunity to raise my native Americans. So let's see. Genevieve, when she was living in Phoenix, she graduated from bible school and she googled native American ministry and found Naomi house. And that's how we stumbled upon it. And she is the executive director of Naomi House, www.thenamihouse.org for all the information. But I lived in a home with ten kids plus my own, and raised them, and it was hectic and crazy, and there was so much grace and love all at the same time. And I actually have moved from there last August, I moved back to the Valley, maybe temporarily, maybe not forever, but I go back to Naomi House every other weekend. It's a three and a half hour drive because I cannot stay away. And so I'm definitely still affiliated with them. But, yeah, it's a home that started in 1993 by Linda Thompson, and we are contracted with the Navajo Nation Department of Social Services, and they send us some pretty tough cases our way. I've heard and seen just about everything that these precious children have experienced and are experienced on most reservations throughout the United States. A lot of physical abuse, sexual abuse, abandonment, everything you can think of, these kids have gone through. And they've, in their seven years of life, have seen more than I probably ever will. And they come into our home, and they are scared and vulnerable. And somehow, because it's a Christ centered facility, I believe there is so much healing that takes place in their hearts and minds and bodies while they're with us. And some are with us for three weeks, and some have been with us for eight years and everything in between. And it's an amazing ministry. And we have just recently, this year, expanded onto the Pine Ridge Reservation in South Dakota.Sheila Chester [00:18:39]:How many different kids have come and gone? Like, how many kids can you keep in the Naomi House? And how does the foster system work for reservations and Native Americans? Is it separate from the government foster system?Jessica Tagler [00:18:55]:It is, as far as licensing requirements go, and I don't really know the major logistics to it. Their system is a lot further behind than the state system, so they're still trying to figure out their logistics. Right. So we have a ten bed home in Arizona for emergency sheltered children, and they come just on an emergency basis, but they end up staying for quite a while because these families, there's nowhere else for them to go because of the epidemic of drugs and alcohol on the reservation. It takes a long time for mom, if ever, to get her kids back. And then we have a six bedroom, long term foster care home, so we have anywhere from 15 to 25 kids on the property at all times.Sheila Chester [00:19:48]:Oh, wow. And how many adults are there?Jessica Tagler [00:19:51]:Well, on average, there's been five adults, maybe. And so it was a crazy time, but we are evolving into something that is actually working. We have more adults now. We have a better system. We have somebody responsible for cooking meals, and we have long term health parents that have been there for over a decade, and they are so committed and they're amazing people, and the kids are incredible. And then we just started a young adult program for our kids that are aging out because there's nowhere for them to go. What are they going to do except go back to the reservation, which we've had kids do that before, and we found that they have become addicted to young parents and even had one of our kiddos commit suicide. And so there's a huge need for an aging out program, which we're just in the beginning works of right now. Some of our kids have graduated, have jobs, or are going to school, and so it's a cool thing to be a part of now.Sheila Chester [00:20:56]:Are there, like, scholarships and programs for Native American kids to get into community colleges or how do you even I.Jessica Tagler [00:21:08]:Think that the tribe, like, they get a certain amount of money when they turn 18. It's not a lot of money, but it's just something to give them that they could spend that in less than a few months. Yeah, it's not a lot of money. So I don't know exactly how they would pay for community college. I just know that the opportunity is there with the location of Naomi Health. There's a community college about 15 minutes away, and I'm also working, so I know that we're always looking for donations for our emergency shelter and foster kids, but I think we need to start really promoting this young adult program because these kids are good kids. They're so amazing, you know what I mean? And they just want a shot at life like the rest of us did at that age. So the opportunity is there, but we just need the resources.Sheila Chester [00:22:06]:Both you and I talked about what happened to us emotionally after high school, and you had trauma. I had no trauma. We both experienced hardships emotionally after high school. These kids have tremendous trauma and they're leaving the foster system with the clothes on their back and no direction and no other than, I guess, the Naomi house adults who are watching ten other kids, and it may be the same kids every week or different kids every week, but who do they have to come back to that they really can trust? It's not like we can go to Grandma's house or Mom's house without being potentially exposed to drugs and alcohol. And that's a scary situation, like, where's your safe space? And if there is no money to put them in a post foster house or a post foster program, then they have no choice but to go back to what they knew.Jessica Tagler [00:23:12]:Yeah, and that's why we ended up losing one to suicide, some tube and just drug addiction, is because there is no place for them to go. Not yet, anyway. And that's why I'm so that Naomi House is that place that they can always come back to. And we have had kids that have come back. We actually have a young lady that's interning there that I raised from when she was five years old, and now she's come back to be an intern. And that's the whole point. We want our kids to come back and then serve there and then eventually be employed with us.Sheila Chester [00:23:54]:Right. That's their path. If you can encourage that. All right, well, I will definitely post all the Naomi house information. Is there anything else you want to say about Naomi house? And, like, how okay, I have a question. How did Naomi house shape your kids growing up with other kids that have gone through these situations?Jessica Tagler [00:24:14]:Well, I think that well, they love it there. That was home. You know what I mean? It was just like being raised with a bunch of brothers and sisters. That's what they consider them to be. Imagine just having your own team of kids constantly, and there's so much land out there. They can run around and play and have fun and be kids, and it's a place for children. So they had a blast growing up there. And they, of course, built long life relationships, and it was like having a bunch of siblings. And there was never jealousy of mom not spending all of her time with you, or my attention was definitely shared, and there was never any jealousy because of that. And so now she loves the babies.Sheila Chester [00:25:04]:Of course.Jessica Tagler [00:25:05]:We all do. We love them babies. It's just a lot of fun.Sheila Chester [00:25:10]:Do you have any native American in you?Jessica Tagler [00:25:13]:So my mom is enrolled in the Lakota Sioux tribe on the pine ridge reservation in South Dakota. So, yes, I have Lakota Sioux on my mom's side and generate actually is enrolled with the tribe. I never did enroll with the tribe. I don't know why. I just haven't done it yet. But I don't know if you've ever been on the pine ridge reservation, Sheila, but it is the poorest reservation in the United States, and it's compared to a third world country.Sheila Chester [00:25:42]:Yeah, we played basketball games out there, and it was terrifying.Jessica Tagler [00:25:48]:Remember the big drum in the girls locker room?Sheila Chester [00:25:52]:The what?Jessica Tagler [00:25:53]:Remember the there was a big drum in there. Yeah, it was very interesting.Sheila Chester [00:25:59]:But yes, anything that had to do with basketball, jessica, I have PTSD, and I don't want to talk about it.Jessica Tagler [00:26:06]:That's hilarious, and that's fair. But yeah. My grandmother, my mom's mom, and my grandpa, they own 600 lake acres on the reservation and donated it to Naomi house for this Naomi house that's out there. So that's my grandparents land that this Naomi house is built on.Sheila Chester [00:26:29]:Oh, that's extra special.Jessica Tagler [00:26:32]:Hold on.Sheila Chester [00:26:33]:I'm opening playdoh.Jessica Tagler [00:26:34]:Okay.Sheila Chester [00:26:34]:We can't open all the playdoh.Jessica Tagler [00:26:36]:Okay.Sheila Chester [00:26:36]:Just some of it. Thank you. All right, what are some things we can educate the public on regarding native Americans and the state of reservations?Jessica Tagler [00:26:49]:There is a huge need for children's homes on every single reservation. These kids are experiencing more trauma than you and I will ever know. We need a lot of prayer. We need people to sow into the resources that are available for Native American kids such as homes like Naomi House. It's necessary and vital for these kids'lives and futures. I think that prayer is probably the most important thing for these kiddos. But just, you know, educating yourself on how this cycle that they're going through has started and just knowing where it stems from as far as how white people have contributed to what they're experiencing today. And I hate to put it like that, but it is what it is. Their resources are so limited. Also, I think that there's a stigma associated with Native Americans that they're just lazy drunks, right? And that's actually not what it is. They just don't have a way out of where they live and they don't have what you and I have. They don't have the know how. They don't have the education. They can't just go get a job. It's just not that simple. And so I think it's real important not to put them in that category. They're beautiful human beings, and their culture is so beautiful and they have so much to teach us. If we would just take a minute to listen and learn.Sheila Chester [00:28:26]:I have several churches that I know that do mission trips to Pine Ridge all the time. Is that beneficial? Do the Native Americans like having a bunch of white people coming up digging holes for them? Is that helpful?Jessica Tagler [00:28:39]:That's a really good question. There's so many benefits to the body of Christ coming and serving on reservations for Native Americans. But what I would suggest is don't do it the white way. Like, really just learn the culture, ask questions. Ask them, what is it that we can do for you to be helpful? And then listen to them, right? Because we have our ideas of what we can do to help. But let's hear it from them of what they need us to do. Because there's so many they're beautiful people. They are such beautiful people. They are kind, quiet, patient, and very wise people. And I think that if we just took time to listen to their needs that that would be the most helpful thing. But it's absolutely vital that mission trips come. That's how Naomi House survive, by the way, is because there's so many mission trips that come throughout the year to help us. Without them, we wouldn't be able to do what we do. And that's the truth.Sheila Chester [00:29:42]:And the other question is, and I don't know if you can answer this, but foster kids on the reservation don't go to families off the reservation. Is that correct, or can they?Jessica Tagler [00:29:55]:So non Native Americans can foster Native Americans. It depends on the tribe. But in general, they don't adopt Native Americans out of the tribe or to non Native Americans. But, yeah, anybody can foster. But as far as adoption, especially within the Navajo tribe, they want to keep it within the Navajo.Sheila Chester [00:30:17]:Right. And I talked about that on one of my other podcast interviews where we talked about ICWA and the Indian rights and how you want to keep the culture together, which makes complete sense, considering what white America has done to Native American children.Jessica Tagler [00:30:35]:They do want to keep it within.Sheila Chester [00:30:36]:The tribe, fully understandable and raise them as Native American children.Jessica Tagler [00:30:44]:I have learned so much just from living at Naomi House. I've learned so much from the social workers that I work with, the Native American social workers, from the families, and from the children themselves. They teach us so much about the Native culture, and so it is something that people need to be educated on, including myself.Sheila Chester [00:31:03]:And how does faith enter into the Native American culture? They have their own faith.Jessica Tagler [00:31:08]:Do they have a Christian faith? Yeah, there's a lot of Christian Native Americans that we know personally that have the same beliefs that we have as far as Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit and all that. But there's a lot of tradition, too, right? They definitely have their traditional belief system, and I would say that that's pretty common among most Native American families, that's the most common thing is traditional beliefs as far as dances. Traditional dances. Their traditions are amazing, too. There's a couple that I don't personally agree with, but it's amazing to learn about what they do. So, yeah, I would say most families are traditional.Sheila Chester [00:31:54]:And how is working with Naomi House and with these kids, how has that shaped your life?Jessica Tagler [00:32:02]:It's taught me to be a lot more gracious, a lot more understanding, not so judgmental that there's more in this world besides what I know. And I need to be open to learning and loving. Even if I don't agree with you, I still love you. And it just took me out of the box that I would put myself in, just because I only knew what I knew growing up. And so it's definitely just opened my eyes to a whole new way of living, and it's beautiful.Sheila Chester [00:32:41]:What advice would you give somebody who's been through some of the same things that you've been through?Jessica Tagler [00:32:49]:Oh, man. One of my passions in life is mentoring teenage girls, and I always tell them, Give yourself grace. Everybody makes mistakes. Everybody goes through stuff that they wish they hadn't gone through. Give yourself grace. Forgive quickly. Anybody that has wronged you intentionally or unintentionally, forgive them quickly. It's going to benefit you in the long run. I love Joyce Meyer. She says, unforgiveness is like drinking a bottle of poison and expecting it to hurt the other person. And I always think about that whenever I feel unforgiveness. And so forgive, forgive, forgive. And I would just say, no matter what you've been through, there's always healing available if you want it, and no matter where you've. Been. You can always change where you're going, and life is not final until your final breath. The possibilities are endless if you put your mind to it and trust in God.Sheila Chester [00:34:00]:That's really good advice that you just threw out there randomly.Jessica Tagler [00:34:05]:Well, you know, I had been practicing all morning.Sheila Chester [00:34:11]:You have so many good words, Jessica.Jessica Tagler [00:34:13]:I'm so impressed. Thank you.Sheila Chester [00:34:18]:What else should we talk about? I got, like, ten more minutes left. Come on, give me some more information.Jessica Tagler [00:34:24]:Let's see, what else can I tell.Sheila Chester [00:34:27]:You about your life? I don't know. You've had an interesting life.Jessica Tagler [00:34:34]:I have had an interesting life. I really have. I made some mistakes along the way, but I think that those mistakes have turned me into person I am today. And how cliche to say, but it's true. And I love my kids. I don't think that I'm the best mom. I do have a lot of self doubt when it comes to being a good mom, but I think a lot of moms feel that way. And in reality, I think we're pretty freaking great. We make the world run. Women are amazing in general. It's so funny how the amount of tasks that a woman can take on simultaneously all day, every day and get the job done, and I think that we don't give ourselves enough credit as women and as mothers, and I have to remind myself, you know what? I'm doing a pretty great job. These kids are awesome. I have provided for them as well as I can, and so I just need to give myself more grace. How about you? How do you feel you are as a mom? Because you're kind of terrible. You are kind of a super disagree.Sheila Chester [00:35:50]:My son would disagree. He's pushing every button that I didn't know existed. Jessica. Like, I don't even know. I'll say something to him, and then I'll walk into my room and like, oh, no, did I say the right thing? What if I said the wrong thing and he wrecked in ten years? He'll be like, remember that time when I was nine and that thing? And now I'm just living my life the way that you told me that one time.Jessica Tagler [00:36:13]:I seriously have fears that my kids are going to just, you know, need therapy when they're older. But, I mean, let's just call that.Sheila Chester [00:36:24]:A hope that they are in therapy to deal with the trauma that we've given them.Jessica Tagler [00:36:29]:Right.Sheila Chester [00:36:30]:You have a choice, kids. Do you want to go to college or therapy because they cost the same amount? I can't afford either.Jessica Tagler [00:36:36]:Exactly. No, it's fine. I mean, I'm sure it's going to.Sheila Chester [00:36:41]:Be probably most likely going to be fine, or they're going to live on the street. It's great.Jessica Tagler [00:36:47]:Everything's great. Yeah.Sheila Chester [00:36:49]:Constant fear that I'm not doing the right thing.Jessica Tagler [00:36:51]:I don't know.Sheila Chester [00:36:52]:Do dads have these same fears? I think maybe my husband does. I don't know.Jessica Tagler [00:36:59]:I don't know. I don't know if they have that same fear. I think their fear is not being able to provide. I think that's the most important thing for a man. I really don't know. But I don't know if they nitpick every little thought in their head like women. Yeah. I found something out so fascinating years ago about men. Did you know that they have a compartment in their brain called the nothing box? How do I get one of them? And they can go to this place in their brain and they are literally thinking about I don't know how that is possible. Can you imagine?Sheila Chester [00:37:32]:That sounds amazing.Jessica Tagler [00:37:34]:It really does. And so when they're watching football, they're literally just watching football and not thinking about I don't understand.Sheila Chester [00:37:40]:I think that sounds like a waste of time is what that sounds like.Jessica Tagler [00:37:45]:We could be getting so many thoughts done right now.Sheila Chester [00:37:48]:What are you doing in Phoenix now? What did you move? You moved from the Naomi house to what are you doing now?Jessica Tagler [00:37:56]:So I'm still with Naomi part time. Right now I am working within the Division of Developmental Disabilities, but one of the things I'm doing is getting my daughter through high school. And I just felt like there was just a little bit more opportunity here since we were living in a very small town in northern Arizona, and so just wanted to give her that experience and opportunity. So she's finishing up her junior year. She may graduate next December, a few months early. So I'm here for now, and I'm enjoying my time with my children because I do have a lot more time with them as opposed to at Naomi house and who knows where I'm going to be in a year or two. I don't have any real plans, which is how I've lived my whole life, by the way. Just kind of just kind of go with the flow and go as God leads. And I'm not really going to stay in one place for too long, I don't think.Sheila Chester [00:38:57]:And what is giving you hope right.Jessica Tagler [00:39:00]:Now that my kids are getting older? That's the truth. I mean, it does get easier as children get older and become more independent. And I'm so grateful for that because it was real tough when they were little kids, as you know, my faith and just knowing that I'm in the palm of God's hand no matter where I go. And I have a lot of assurance in that and just still taking it, sometimes one day at a time. I do struggle sometimes with feeling anxious about life and am I doing the right thing and am I in the right direction? But I feel like as long as I'm in his hands, I cannot go wrong. That's where my hope comes from.

Dr. Kim Dwyer is a mother of three boys ages 14, 18, and 21. She owns her own therapy practice, is an author and an artist. Kims work as a mother and a counselor is rooted in the belief that by managing and tolerating uncomfortable emotions, we can live intentionally, in accordance with our value systems. Kim talks about her experience going through stressful pregnancies and dealing with hard emotions as a parent. Check out her website at www.drkimdwyer.comThere you will also find her books. My kids and I love her childrens' book called “Rocky’s Christmas Journey”.  You can find more information including the show notes at my website www.sheilakchester.com Please follow me on social media. Facebook or InstagramThank you listeners! If you liked this podcast, please rate and review wherever you listen to your podcast. If you loved this podcast, donate to my patreon account.

Sarah Spurlock is a mother of a 10 year old boy through adoption, a family and marriage therapist, the owner of a multi-therapist counseling business, the wife of a pastor, and a long time friend of mine. Sarah is the kind of person I would describe as being a bulldog - she doesn’t take no for an answer and that comes especially with her child. She will teach us how to become advocates for our kids and our loved ones through never accepting no for an answer. We could all benefit from becoming a little more like Sarah. You can find more information about sarah’s company on her website at denvercounselingsolutions.com Resources for adoption related services whether you are beginning the process or are a seasoned guardian:  https://www.raisethefuture.org/https://growbeyondwords.com/You can find more information including the show notes at my website www.sheilakchester.com Please follow me on social media. Facebook or InstagramThank you listeners! If you liked this podcast, please rate and review wherever you listen to your podcast. If you loved this podcast, donate to my patreon account.

Savanna Simmons is a cowgirl and creative entrepreneur living in very rural Wyoming with her husband ( a real life cowboy) and two boys. She talks about the challenges and joys of country living. she is a self-published author and artist. She gets inspiration from her two sons, Brindle and Roan, who live for adventures and exploring on the ranch.  Savanna is really living her best life on the great plains. Find out more about Savanna at her website.You can find more information including the show notes at my website www.sheilakchester.com Please follow me on social media. Facebook or InstagramThank you listeners! If you liked this podcast, please rate and review wherever you listen to your podcast. If you loved this podcast, donate to my patreon account.

It was my birthday this week so I talk all about what it means to celebrate ourselves! Even if that means your kids are home with strep throat all week long. See the corresponding blog post here: www.sheilakchester.comMost comfortable socks ever: Bombas.comYou can find more information including the show notes at my website www.sheilakchester.com Please follow me on social media. Facebook or InstagramThank you listeners! If you liked this podcast, please rate and review wherever you listen to your podcast. If you loved this podcast, donate to my patreon account.

Erica Koller is a lifelong friend of mine, a Veterinarian, a business owner, the wife of a business owner, a quick draw sharp shooter, a dancing fool, a full life liver and mother of two kids. To say she is a busy woman is putting it lightly. Erica survives every day with her community by her side. She couldn’t do it without her posse which includes friends, neighbors, and her family. She lives on her families ranch with her two kids and her husband outside of our rural home town in South Dakota. Check out this incredible lady vet clinic  that services 3 states in and over 180 miles in the middle of the great plains. You can find more information including the show notes at my website www.sheilakchester.com Please follow me on social media. Facebook or InstagramThank you listeners! If you liked this podcast, please rate and review wherever you listen to your podcast. If you loved this podcast, donate to my patreon account.

My sons bike go stolen last week and I've been processing a lot of feelings as well as figuring out how to help him through his own feelings. I hate feelings. Feelings are something I've tried avoiding most of my life - but avoiding feelings has left me in many many therapy sessions. So how can I help my kids confront their feelings - especially those of anger and loss? This may be a dumb old bike being stolen, but there is a lesson to learn here. Links mentioned in this episode: Mayo Clinic on the health of forgivenessPsychology Today on ForgivenessGreatschools.org on ForgivenessYou can find more information including the show notes at my website www.sheilakchester.com Please follow me on social media. Facebook or InstagramThank you listeners! If you liked this podcast, please rate and review wherever you listen to your podcast. If you loved this podcast, donate to my patreon account.

In this episode, we highlight some of the most prevalent financial mistakes you should work hard to avoid.

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