you What up, mom? Put down that coffee and grab a wine. Get ready for another episode of Nursing and Cursing, a parenting podcast that covers more shit than your baby's full diaper. I'm Kate. I'm a stay-at-home mom of three in Brooklyn, New York. I'm trying to figure out whether I should go back to work, have another baby, or spend the rest of my life waiting for my fresh direct order. Hey, I'm Christine, a video editor and a mom of two living in Oklahoma City, Oklahoma. Allie here, podcasting up in the mountains in South Kona, Hawaii. I work as a real estate agent and a mom of two boys. Hey, I'm Molly. I'm a teacher raising two kids in St. Augustine, Florida. And I'm Sarah, a new mom to one sweet babe living in Brooklyn, New York. Between five busy households, it's a miracle we make it on the mic at all.
But trust me, we need this as much as you do. Hi, girls. Happy recording day. We're back. This is Nursing and Cursing. Girls, are you there? Hi. Okay, cool. So this week we're talking about anxious children, how to raise them, how to deal with it. We have no idea how to deal with it. Please help us. Yeah. Kids who just have, you know, the worries.
And all kids have the worries, but some are worse than others, right? And it's like, how do you know if you have an anxious kid and where did the anxious kid in your family come from? Were you the anxious kid in your family? I don't know. I think a lot of it is about like, are confronted with an anxious kid. Can you relate to them or no, you can't relate. Well, who on this call was the anxious kid?
Shut up, Ellie. What? I was the anxious kid. This is Molly. I was definitely the anxious kid. Well, I could say that I totally was an anxious kid, too, but I was just keeping it all inside, quietly. Same. Same. Totally anxious, but bottled it and just put on a facade of confidence. Me, too. Anxious, but not emotional, but definitely anxious. I'm still, I'm not an adult.
Right. Anxious but not emotional. Well, we all grew up in, well, I think we all grew up in households that would like breathe anxiety. Yes. Yeah. Without pointing fingers. This season we're really good. I love that I'm saying that like as though my parents are listening to this. Right. It's not like our parents are supporting us in this podcast anyway. So I'm just kidding. Does anyone's mom or dad listen?
No. I sure hope not. I think just more like mother-in-law. Right. Right. I don't think my mom was interested. Agreed. That's the same thing in my life. I'm just not that interested. My mom could never figure out how to actually turn on a podcast. For sure. She would probably listen if she could understand how to do it. Wait till she figures it out. She's got such a treat waiting for her five more years. She does. How do you guys think that your parents, those of you who felt like you were an anxious kid, how do you think that your parents felt about the fact that you were anxious?
They didn't know and didn't care. Wrapped up in their own problems, never took a look around, and still 40 years later have never stopped to think like, oh, fuck, did I drop the ball back there? My parents knew because I was... the opposite of Allie. Well, I was anxious, but I was emotional. So yes, it was everything from my socks aren't right. It all, I just didn't want to get on the bus. And I would, I remember waking up in the middle of the night crying and my dad coming in and being like, I just, I'm so worried about when I'm going to break my leg. Like, I don't want to break my bone. My dad was like, Oh my God. Okay. I know who you are in my family. You're the same kid who woke up screaming, crying. I'm the only person in this family that doesn't have bangs. Oh my God. Yes. Wait, Molly, like you were just like,
At some point in my life, I'm going to break my leg. And right now in the middle of the night, I'm worried about it. Nailed it. Yeah, exactly. Worried about all kinds of things that she had no control over. I love that you say have no control over, Alec. Yeah, I feel like when you have an anxious kid, that's the hard part to get your head around. They're worrying about things.
it's like navigating the no control over part. Right. That's the hard part of being the parent. The unknown too. The unknown for Levi like is the worst. We have a birthday party coming or just some kind of event coming up. He just asks a million questions. He'll stay up all night. He'll cry. He'll chew his nails. It's awful. We have to go to like birthday parties. We have to be the first people there. Like we could go early and just kind of sit back and take it all in, watch people arrive. Critty, what happens? What happens? Have you ever tried the approach of not ever mentioning anything? And then.
just living in the moment and then arriving at something like that what would happen yeah he does not like it doesn't like it gets really upset i've tried it before and he feels like i've betrayed him like you lied to me you lied to me okay now if there was ever going to be a surprise like disney or something i would never in a million years tell him because okay you know what i mean too big and too exciting but like if it's something social i have to prep him because he has to take the time to like process it and plan for it right and it works it's just his process you know and it's so different for me like i can be thrown into a group of people and i'm okay or i can like fake it you know but like he has to really prep and then he's fine but isn't it funny what the universe or god or life whatever you want to call it gives us and they say that before you're a parent but you're like wow how did i get this kid It's the opposite of what I am or, you know, I get frustrated sometimes. I can't understand what's the big deal. You know, it's so different for me. Sometimes you're really frustrating, but then I have, you know, I feel so sad for him too. Yeah.
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your way give it a try you guys you won't be sorry yeah I mean we've talked before like I wow it's extremely like Levi I think Chrissy like has he's not anxious in all settings and he's not anxious across the board but there are some areas where his anxiety has like almost taken down our family before like has been so overwhelming we've gone through stretches where It's definitely come close to thinking me and Jeremy, just like feeling at a wits end for what to do for him. I mean, I remember crying in the office of his school when he was in third grade because he was going through this period of intense, intense anxiety. And his particular fear was that during the school day, something horrible would happen to me and I would never be at school to pick him up. That was so sad. That's like where his anxiety landed on. But it was crippling. Like he couldn't every day was a challenge. And my friend who's a therapist had suggested writing down my schedule for him so he could take it out and look at it every day, which I was doing. But his teacher.
Um, I went in one day to talk to her and she, she had, you know, 32 kids in her class. She didn't have the patience. I was like trying to explain what was going on. And she just got me off and went, look, is there something going on at home? Oh gosh. And I just felt so 32 kids guys. I totally get where she was coming from. And I love her and she had Edie and we have a great relationship and, but I get where she was coming from. But I just spent, I felt so hopeless. And so did Jeremy. It's like, ouch. And you're, you're probably racking your brain. Obviously you're talking to everyone. Like, how do I fix this? And she's just like,
Yeah, that comment doesn't handle this at home because that's not what I'm doing here, which is fine. But I was like coming undone in the office downstairs and that resolved. But then we had another that that did resolve. But then we had like another flare up a year later and another flare up a year after that. And still now in seventh grade, there are little things and he'll just get into a weird funk and it's like and then it will lift. But yeah, he's.
Yeah. And sometimes I feel like, oh, he's so different from me. And I'm like, well, maybe this would have been me if I'd had more emotional latitude in my family instead of being told to just fucking suck it up and keep going. Maybe I would have been just like him, sharing it, sharing it, sharing it. I don't know. That's a great point. Maybe it's actually healthy that they feel safe enough to completely break down and have these anxiety-filled moments, these tearful moments. I mean, I'm soaking it up. My son has them too, my older son, Phoenix, and his is based around.
not social anxiety. I think he thrives at parties and gatherings. His is around change, which is like, are you kidding me? That's what life is. You know, he has a very hard time being flexible. The key word in our family is flexibility. He is still trying to learn it and it's crippling. That's a great word, Kate. Any type of change. And so even in a weekly basis, we have a schedule where Wednesday mornings, I go to an early morning meeting and on Tuesday nights, he is in his bed. It's straight anxiety hanging on to me at bedtime. He's a third grader, like mom.
dad's taking me to school in the morning like he's freaked out the fact that I'm not taking him it's a different routine in the morning he hates it every week and I'm just thinking that maybe by January it will become part of our weekly routine but the fact it's not the same every single day um that's where I'm struggling the most because I've had mornings where it's falling apart at school where he's running back to Peter's truck and having a full-on anxiety attack basically I'll call it that just tears I can't do it I can't do it he works himself up all about somebody else taking him to school I know and it's silly that's how I felt too it's silly but then it's not because it's so real to them So what do you guys, what do you do in these situations? Like, so if he's having an, and I'm not saying like, I don't expect you to have like a clear cut answer. I'm just saying like, wait.
what do you do? I don't know what the answer is. I tried everything. We tried everything as well. I mean, at the point that it lifted, I was like leaving messages for psychologists in the neighborhood, like that my friends had recommended and trying to get as an appointment more for me. Cause I felt like, I felt like, okay, I've been a mom for eight years. I went to social work school and I have everything I have tried is useless. I've like, I'm, I've tried everything I know and that I can think of. So I need somebody else to help me. And, and then it lifted. So we never followed through, but I feel like the first few years I basically was messaging.
there's nothing to worry about slash I probably was messaging you're being silly and something something like calm down I wasn't using any of those words but that's for sure the vibe I was giving off and I also had like a five-year-old and a two-year-old so I know I was impatient I know I was impatient and now I feel like I'm more like um now I feel like I'm more and I know I know that Chrissy and Allie probably feel this way about their kids now I feel like I'm more like The flip side to this like crazy emotional anxiety that can catch him sometimes is that he's such a true empath. Like he really understands people's feelings. Yes. Yes. All three of our boys, I would say. I do feel like he's capable of emotional insight that not tons of 12 year old boys are. So I've come around to thinking like.
it's not just a curse it's also a blessing and now i try pete's advice write it don't fight it like you're anxious today you won't be anxious tomorrow like you're you know you're on the you're on the ride sometimes the tide is in and sometimes the tide is out and it looks like today it's out so let's do what we can but it's hard i don't know i don't have answers sarah this week yesterday or what is today i think it was yesterday was wednesday so tuesday night when i put him to bed he started it and i tried something new and i just said you know what baby mama has to ask you a favor. This, this meeting is something that I absolutely have to do. And I need you to try really hard to be a big boy about this. I need your help. Can you help me please? And it kind of worked and it probably won't work next week, but it kind of works this week. And he said, okay, mom, okay, I'm gonna help you, you know? And I don't think it's too bad for Peter. It's like redirecting the energy to something with purpose. But the whole point of this podcast is that we don't have the answers, right? Totally. This is our experience. We don't know. We're just doing the best we can.
Well, I get I get like a pit in my stomach because I have spoken to people with teenagers who it's just a new level nowadays, or maybe it's just more talked about. But, you know, and you read so many articles about the rise of anxiety and depression in teens and the pressure. And is it academic? Is it social media? I don't know. But I just am like, oh.
What's to come? What does it all turn into? The one thing that Wawa said helps him, and this has been a big breakthrough for him because he had this insight by himself, is the other day he told me that... After he plays basketball, he noticed that he can't get to an anxious feeling. He said he either feels great or he feels tired, but he doesn't ever feel low. That's how he describes it. I feel low. Endorphins. Endorphins. Exercise. Yeah, and I'm done. I'm not mapping the human genome. I know plenty of people have said exercise relieves anxiety, but I was happy for him that he connected those dots for himself because obviously it's not a cure-all and he really struggles with transition, but I was glad that he felt like he had a tool. Yeah, and that's his thing too.
That's his thing. He has that and he goes to it. I just think like addressing it and talking about it with them, with kids directly, like this is the thing that you're experiencing and I'm here with you for it. You know, like I think that, I mean, I remember being the anxious kid and having. these crazy feelings inside of my body, like, you know, something was going to explode in me. And I just knew there was nobody safe to go to with this feeling. Like there's, I'm not going to tell anyone about, I'm just going to sit here on the floor and rise. But, but I, but like your kids are talking to you about it and that's so cool because it is cool. Hopefully that leads to some.
you know, healthy outcome. It's true. I never would have expressed it to my parents. I never did. You know, even just, even though you had a great role model like me to show you how to do it. Right. No, I didn't. It could have been anything. My gymnastics meets or like lots of things that now I look back that are so silly, but they were huge inside my body as a kid. I got to do this perfectly.
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break your heart or have you experienced it like when you i remember the first time i saw my kid biting his nails i was just like yes awful awful oh and the skin levi bites like the skin off his fingers it's he's such a biter oh my god wow i went through a phase where he was like not exactly cracking his knuckles, but like obsessively twisting his wrists and obsessively moving his fingers. Almost like, honestly, almost like somebody with like Parkinson's, but on drugs would do like obsessively, obsessively, obsessively. And it was like, I mean, it used to make me and Jeremy insane. I would want to grab his wrist and be like, fucking stop.
But I see it in classrooms all the time, like the shirt chewer or the throat clearer or the nail biter. So is that something you're supposed to interrupt? Because like if they're doing those things like that, is that? I feel like that's a manifestation of something going on in the mind. Yeah. It's, it's like nervousness and it's just like an output for it. And I've, look, I can let it ride in my classroom for sure. But when it's my own kid, it's so hard to not be like, don't bite your nose. I'm not saying like behavior, like tell them to stop doing the thing, but like redirecting in some other way. I don't know. I just don't want to stop doing the thing. Me too. Honey, don't bite your shirt. Don't bite your shirt. It's past. He's done all kinds of things.
have passed they passed i don't know yeah jay and i made like a promise to each other not to um not to say anything about the wrist twisting this was like four years ago because just and this is not general this is just with wow because he also went through a thing where he was telling me he felt like he couldn't breathe and i was like dude you are breathing i was just like i was like wow you've been telling me that you can't breathe for 10 minutes and i'm not trying to be an asshole but you've been breathing the whole time i just i would just be at my wits end But that really showed me, like, that experience was helpful for me because it really showed me that, like, it is not about the physical sensation. Like, he's breathing the whole time. He's trying to tell me something else about how he's feeling. Right. It's not about logic either. I'm not hearing what he's trying to tell me. So when he was doing the wrist-twisting thing, Jeremy and I basically just, like, made a vow to only talk to each other about how fucking annoying it was, but to never let that spill over and talk to him about it. Right. We used to close the door and just be like, what the fuck? Oh, that must have been hard. I was going to say, you were so amazing. Remember when Levi had to pee all the time?
Yes. I felt like you were amazing. You were in New York. I remember being in Times Square. And this is Times Square, New York City, spring break with a four-year-old, a three-year-old who's telling you you have to pee every 10 minutes. And you and Garrett were like, okay, dude, let's find a bathroom. And I was like, wow.
Girl, can you hold it though? He was peeing every minute and a half at one point. You and Garrett showed you never cracked. You were both so loving and so patient and so kind about it. Thank you, girl. That was really hard. When he started preschool last year, his first year of preschool, he would bite his shirt so that it was soaked. The sleeves would be sopping, hanging down. I did find some company online that's like...
They make necklaces and bracelets with like a rubber Lego on them. And I had got him a little necklace. And I was like, I know you're nervous in school, but maybe instead of like sucking all over your shirt, you could just like chew on this little thing. And it totally worked. He stopped chewing his shirt and he kind of like chewed on this necklace for a few weeks and then it was done.
Wow. Oh my God. It was like elbow down, stopping wet. Disgusting. God, I love the internet. I know. Oh my God. I know. I know. I have friends who have completely implemented meditation with their children, like from such an early age. It sounds funny, but not at all. They're anxious kids who it's a lifestyle. It's not a weird thing. The children know how to meditate. They take a moment. There's full breath and meditation in their family. And that just seems pretty amazing. That's always a great tool for all of us.
that was my goal it was my goal to be to like from the day francis was born to like see me meditate every morning so that it was just like a normal thing yeah but fuck i didn't do that shit never never got to it i don't think it's too late though it is not too late and also like am i really gonna start I mean, I absolutely should. We all should. We do like, I'm sure you guys do, but the thing is like, I'm sure you all do a version of meditating with your kids. We, we do like, we don't call it meditation, but we do like guided breathing, right? Guided breathing where we all land on the floor together. I'm sorry, Kate. No, we don't, but I love that idea. But I'm sure you tell your kids to calm down and take a couple of deep breaths. That's what I'm saying.
I mean, yeah. The funny thing is I don't do it too much with my kids, but if I'm ever leading a class or, you know, with children for whatever reason, I'm constantly doing that. Okay, ready? Three deep breaths in just to ground that. Yes, of course. It works, you know, but I don't do it with my own kids. Same, same. It's a huge message in Daniel Tiger. Taking deep breaths. That's where I got it. And count to four.
Daniel Tiger hasn't really come up on this podcast for a while. Well, I just want to shout it out. Like, I'm still in love with that show. I am too, man. But Augie will not let her watch it. I know. So, guys, nailing it and failing it.
I'm going to just go for it because I got a good one this week. I got an excellent nail. Last weekend, Tim and I had a late date night and we just ended up working it out that Frances stayed over at her nanny's house for the night. She did her first full sleepover and she stayed in a room with three other kids. And they literally said that she like.
They don't know how long she was awake, but when they woke up at like 730, they looked over at her and she was just sitting up in her pack and play, just like looking at them. Oh my gosh. Sarah, I love it. And did you guys just make love all night long? Oh, obviously. That's where the fail comes in. Okay. So.
Obviously, we like, you know, we tried to get our show that we were. Yeah, we tried to get the show we were going to didn't start until 1030 at night, which what the fuck Rob Delaney? Like so late. That's too late. That's not OK. Anyway, so we were trying to have sex before we went out at the recommendation of the thread. Get it out of the way. I mean, enjoy it. Yeah. So but Francis is like out on her sleepover. So I have my phone, my ringer on because I'm nervous. And while we're like getting to it.
my phone dinged. Like there's a text message in my brain. I'm like, fuck it. You know, like I really want to go get that, but like that would ruin the mood. And, um, so like I use the excuse of like, when I'm going to get the condom, I was like, I'm just going to swing by my phone in case it's Maria. And so I do, I go, I swing by the phone, I check it and it's fucking not Maria. It's whoever the hell from, from Beto.
Beto O'Rourke. It's a political text? It's a fucking political text. Oh, gosh. Okay. I'm like, what a goddamn waste. And I could have just left it at that. But then I walked back to Tim with a condom and I was like, ugh, fucking Beto's texting me right now. Oh, boy. Beto? Beto? No, no, I can't say it. Beto. Beto. Chrissy's like, I can't take it anymore. You Beto believe it. Betoven. Like Betoven. Betoven, yeah. Anyway, so I definitely ruined the moment. We did end up still having sex. Beto?
In the end, is that a nail? I don't know. Yeah, you got nailed. It's a nail. I still have zero game. Good job. I got a boring fail, a quick boring fail. We recently went on a family trip where we stayed at a hotel, and we didn't get there until midnight. We went to Universal Studios in Florida again, which I don't want to talk about too much in case they get made fun of. But we didn't get there until midnight, and the tickets are like the flight and the park tickets and the hotel tickets are in one email that they send you, and it has a barcode, and you just are scanning that barcode on your phone for the whole weekend.
And we get there at midnight on a Friday after a full week of school. And obviously we're all cracked out tired. And the guy behind the desk is like, okay, just show me your, just show me this magical barcode and we'll get you guys to your room, blah, blah, blah. And I'm holding my phone up to him, showing him. And he's like, okay, I don't see it. No, it's okay. He's like, okay, I don't see it. And I'm like swiping my thumb, but I'm not looking at my phone. I'm getting so fucking annoyed with him. And I'm like, I did everything through JetBlue. Could you, could I just give you the phone? Could you just look on my phone? I did everything through JetBlue.
And finally he was like, I think it's like a tracker. And I was like, a tracker? What do you mean tracker? No, it's not a tracker. It's supposed to be a barcode. No, I think you're showing me like a tracker. And I was just showing this poor bastard my period tracker. Oh, my God. Stop it. A tracker? A tracker? You have a period tracking app. And that's what you showed him to scan your barcode. This tired night shift 19 Royal Floridian. He was like, no. Oh, my gosh. That's really good. That's hilarious. Wow. We figured it out. Good deal.
Okay, got a nail. Halloween is locked and loaded. All costume pieces are in the closet hidden. Oh, huge nail. Wow, way ahead of schedule. Way ahead. Hold on, why are they hidden? Oh, come on. You can't let them wear them. They'll be over it. They'll want a new costume. Okay, I'm sorry. I forgot that parenting tool. That's right. So that's my nail. My fail is just, I'm sorry. Like, my son is taking it to the next level with his insults.
Every time it gets nastier and nastier. And I'm trying not to react. But tonight, full tantrum. And as I was leaving to work out, he said, you know what? My kindergarten teacher teaches me everything wonderful that I know. And you and Day Day only taught me to be a jerk. Wow. I hope you were like, oh, go live with her. Bye. Bye, buddy. Oh, my God. They are. It gets worse. Last week, it was. I'm so sorry. Did I already tell you guys this? I'm so sorry to tell you, Mama. But at this point, I'm afraid of you.
Okay. They know exactly what to say. Like, Ali, you know that's my worst fear of being a mother because that's how we felt. Sure. And sometimes they're like, why aren't you fucking afraid of me? Come on. You know? They're like, why won't you be afraid of me? It's like he knew. Like, that's what I want to avoid as a mother. And I wasn't even being. Yeah. But I could have. He knew. You know what he reminds me of lately? Kevin McAllister in Home Alone. Yeah. For the trip. I wish my family would disappear. Yeah. I don't want to share the victim. Victim.
the victim we're like okay a little kid who gets shit on by his family we're like just fucking the victim right but also he's not entirely innocent Kate right no I'm just laughing at us like we're like you want to be sensitive to your anxious child cut to us 20 minutes later oh Kevin McAllister fucking victim the victim it's also like um Edmund from the Chronicles of Narnia. Why do I know that? Because I'm in it right now, but... He's gross, though. He's such a jerk to Lucy. He's a jerk. He makes all the wrong moves, and yet he's just a child that's basically been labeled. All right, let's save this for a spinoff. Okay. Do I have a... Critty, do you have a nail fail?
Kind of. It's more just a funny little ditty. I was in the bathtub with Matilda the other night, and she was, like, peering, like, face like an inch from my vagina, just staring. Just staring at it. And she just goes, Mama, what's this hairy thing? Is this Harry Potter? No, she did not. No, she did. Is this Harry Potter? Mama, what's this hairy thing? Is this Harry Potter? Your vagina is now nicknamed Harry Potter. I'm dead.
I'm dead. No, baby. No, baby. It's mom's vagina. Oh, my God. Her little voice is so cute. It's just Harry Potter. She, like, sure is, baby. And it makes magic. Okay. Pray. My fail is that my first grader came home. He's coming home with all kinds of things from a little boy in his class. And he's like, Mom.
pinky swear to me right now that there's no such thing or that santa is real and that it's not you wrapping up the presents and putting them under the tree that was so said that it's you that it's all a lie that the easter bunny is all a lie and it's just you i mean i still believe mom i believe and i told him he was wrong but you need a pinky swear to me right now i was like oh my god i do i was like oh changing the subject and then he was like and also he said I mean, this is getting a little bit deeper because we all have different beliefs. But he was like, also, he said, there's no such thing as God or any God. And that was just a big Christian lie. Breaking hearts all over the place. That's awful. What, Allie? Those are big, big words for a six-year-old, honey. So anyway. Did you ever walk into a pinky swear? I did not. I avoided it. I avoided it. I just put my hand on my heart. Like, honey, I believe. And do you believe? You know, I put it back in the score. He's like, I do, mom. I do believe, you know. Good job, Allie. Well done.
I'm like, fuck that little fucker. You're ruining my holiday. We're right upon it. Knock it off. You got to believe to receive. You got to believe to receive. Anyway, so. Well, you guys, anxiety is real. Of course, we all deal with it on some level. And our kids certainly are. And I think as they get older, it's not going to get any easier. But at least we have each other. And, you know, communicating is the best thing that we can do.
How's that for my timing listeners? Really good. Really hard job to get the timing. You know who you are. To anybody who wanted to write a review about how bad my timing is on nail fails, I'm doing my best. I'm doing my best. That's it for now. Check you guys next week for another nursing and cursing where we won't tell your husband that you accidentally let your kid eat a cat turd.