Connection Therapy

This year, for Mental Health Awareness, Brenda reviews current statistics for mental health in the US. To support clinicians with skillful interventions that are informed by research, she also shares how her practice is shaped by some research she participated in at an early training site that still resonates. She then invites mental health therapists themselves to consider being part of communities, as a way to deepen their skills and bolster their longevity in the field.Attend a Course at Connection Therapy:https://connection-therapy.com/courses-and-eventsWe Want to Hear Your Feedback! Please Contribute to the Conversation: Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usLeave feedback or ask a question with a message on Instagram: @theconnectiontherapypodcastEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistReferences:Adverse Childhood Experiences (ACES)https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/72/wr/mm7226a2.htmNational Alliance on Mental Illness (NAMI)https://www.nami.org/Stephen Porges (2011). Polyvagal theory: Neurophysiological foundations of emotions, attachment, communication, and self-regulation. Bessel Van der Kolk (2015). The Body Keeps the Score.Health Resources & Services Administration:https://data.hrsa.gov/topics/health-workforce/shortage-areas

Learning to improve assessment capacity is a continual journey for the practicing mental health practitioner. This episode provides a research article that endorses the clinician’s instincts and highlights ways that what is happening inside for our patient (i.e. nervous system activation, etc.) is displayed in facial movements.Brenda then adds a discussion of interventions she uses, and offers them for listeners to consider for applications in their own practices.References:Additional podcast episodes on heart rate variability: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistRachael Draaisma’s discussion about Calming Signals are in Connection Therapy episodes 48, 49, and 50Optimal HRVhttps://www.optimalhrv.com/Stephen Porges (2011). Polyvagal theory: Neurophysiological foundations of emotions, attachment, communication, and self-regulation.Torres EB and Elsayed M (2026) Facial micro-movements as a proxy of increasingly erratic heart rate variability while experiencing pressure pain. Front. Neurosci. 20:1702124. doi: 10.3389/fnins.2026.1702124Attend a Course at Connection Therapy:https://connection-therapy.com/courses-and-eventsWe Want to Hear Your Feedback! Please Contribute to the Conversation: Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usLeave feedback or ask a question with a message on Instagram: @theconnectiontherapypodcastEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlist

In this last part of Brenda’s interview with Janet Jones, they discuss the many ways learning to understand how horses communicate make humans better at communicating overall.In this episode, listeners will hear clear indications for the practice of mental health, rather it be in animal-assisted or in-office environments. Janet also discusses how there are wide-ranging audiences gaining interest in her work, so all listeners are welcomed and encouraged to apply her expertise to their environments.For More Information about our Guest:Janet Jones, PhDhttps://janet-jones.comAttend a Course at Connection Therapy:https://connection-therapy.com/courses-and-eventsWe Want to Hear Your Feedback! Please Contribute to the Conversation: Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usLeave feedback or ask a question with a message on Instagram: @theconnectiontherapypodcastEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlist

In this part of Brenda’s interview with Dr. Janet Jones, they explore the differing ways that horses and humans display their emotional states. Dr. Jones emphasizes significant differences in meaning and preference for some behaviors, particularly eye contact. The conversation yields important information that can be used to improve equine-assisted services by learning the differences in needs between species, and exploring how that can be communicated to make interactions more effective and supportive.For More Information about our Guest:Janet Jones, PhDhttps://janet-jones.comAlso, Brenda reviewed some of Dr. Jones’ work in podcast episode #85Attend Dr. Janet Jones’ Course at Connection Therapy:https://connection-therapy.com/product/janetWe Want to Hear Your Feedback! Please Contribute to the Conversation: Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usLeave feedback or ask a question with a message on Instagram: @theconnectiontherapypodcastEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlist

Brenda invites Dr. Janet Jones to the podcast to discuss her many areas of expertise including human cognition and memory, as well as horse training. Dr. Jones combines her education and experiences to support listeners in learning about the neuroscience implications across species.Dr. Jones begins by describing horse brains and human brains, what both species need and how they can partner best, including the importance of cross-training for horses, and ways to enhance teamwork and communication.For More Information about our Guest:Janet Jones, PhDhttps://janet-jones.comAttend a Course at Connection Therapy:https://connection-therapy.com/courses-and-eventsWe Want to Hear Your Feedback! Please Contribute to the Conversation: Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usLeave feedback or ask a question with a message on Instagram: @theconnectiontherapypodcastEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlist

Dr. Brenda Murrow studies, teaches, and practices psychology, and she has a specific interest in how working with animals can inform us about the human experience. Her experiences shape her understanding of why this is possible and why she has come to the perspective that working in animal-assisted therapy environments is not just therapeutic (there is a lot of evidence to confirm this), but also that it can be diagnostic.In this episode she shares some introductions into how she uses her learnings and experiences in animal-assisted therapy encounters to be able to assess and intervene in in-office therapy environments, so that all practitioners can benefit from these insights.References:Bruce Perry, MD, PhDhttps://www.bdperry.com/aboutDan Siegel’s “Window of Tolerance”Dan Siegel, https://drdansiegel.com/Attend a Course at Connection Therapy:https://connection-therapy.com/courses-and-eventsWe Want to Hear Your Feedback! Please Contribute to the Conversation: Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usLeave feedback or ask a question with a message on Instagram: @theconnectiontherapypodcastEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlist

Brenda and Haley continue their conversation and in this part, they consider applications of the respective information about horse and about humans, and how it can be integrated to support better relationships.They also explore the differences between interspecies relationships, for example when humans relate to horses vs. when humans relate to dogs each brings out different behaviors from humans.Listeners will benefit from these perspectives by considering different viewpoints on common interactions that take on new meaning in their discussion.For More Information about our Guest:Haley Mathews, PATH Intl. CTRI®https://www.xenophontrc.org/staffhttps://pathintl.org/Attend a Course at Connection Therapy:https://connection-therapy.com/courses-and-eventsWe Want to Hear Your Feedback! Please Contribute to the Conversation: Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usLeave feedback or ask a question with a message on Instagram: @theconnectiontherapypodcastEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlist

Brenda and Haley met at a Professional Association of Therapeutic Horsemanship (PATH), International event, where Haley spoke about the behaviors of horses, and Brenda spoke about the behaviors of humans. After their respective presentations, they realized their discussions were complementary. In this conversation, they review each of their presentations for listeners to be able to similarly hear the complementary presentations horses and humans make.Practitioners will benefit from learning both of these perspectives in their application to mental health and equine services.For More Information about our Guest:Haley Mathews, PATH Intl. CTRI®https://www.xenophontrc.org/staffhttps://pathintl.org/Attend a Course at Connection Therapy:https://connection-therapy.com/courses-and-eventsWe Want to Hear Your Feedback! Please Contribute to the Conversation: Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usLeave feedback or ask a question with a message on Instagram: @theconnectiontherapypodcastEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlist

Learning to relate to other species can make us more aware of relating to our own species. In this spirit, Dr. Murrow reviews some similarities and differences between horses and humans as described by Dr. Janet Jones in her book, Horse Brain: Human Brain: The Neuroscience of Horsemanship.This episode has insights for mental health therapists and resources for anyone interested in improving their abilities to relate with others.We Want to Hear Your Feedback! Please Contribute to the Conversation: Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usLeave feedback or ask a question with a message on Instagram: @theconnectiontherapypodcastEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistReferences:Gottman Institutehttps://www.gottman.com/blog/how-to-improve-your-relationship-in-24-hours/Janet Jones, PhDhttps://janet-jones.com/Horse Brain, Human Brain: The Neuroscience of Horsemanship (2020), Trafalgar Square, Vermont, pp. 32-34, and 169-174.

Dr. Leslie Greenberg found some helpful insights that are still in use today in the practice of emotion-focused therapy (EFT). In this episode, Brenda reflects on how these early findings can be used in treatment. Whether you are an aspiring practitioner of EFT, or not, there is likely to be some ways these foundational elements can apply to your practice.We Want to Hear Your Feedback! Please Contribute to the Conversation: Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usLeave feedback or ask a question with a message on Instagram: @theconnectiontherapypodcastEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistReferences:Elliott, R., Watson, J. C., Goldman, R. N., & Greenberg, L. S. (2025). Research on emotion-focused therapy and implications for practice. In Learning emotion-focused therapy: A comprehensive guide. 2nd ed. (pp. 21–37). American Psychological Association (pp. 32, 326). https://doi-org.pgi.idm.oclc.org/10.1037/0000458-002

In this final segment of Ladan Safvati’s interview, she describes what an Emotion-Focused Therapy (EFT) session involves, from what the therapist is tracking to examples of the ways things may unfold. She ties in the concepts presented in the first two parts of the interview to integrate the learning and show how the theories can be applied.For More Information about our Guest:Ladan Safvati, LMFTDirector and FounderSouthern California Institute of Emotion Focused Therapyhttps://www.eftsocal.com/about-socaleftWe Want to Hear Your Feedback! Please Contribute to the Conversation: Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usLeave feedback or ask a question with a message on Instagram: @theconnectiontherapypodcastEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlist

Connection Therapy’s guest, Ladan Safvati, LMFT, continues to share an introduction of Emotion-Focused Therapy (EFT). In this episode, she discusses the difference between Emotion and Cognitive Schemas. She explains EFT’s focus on empathy, and provides guidance on the importance of “feeling our own pain” in order that we can be with other’s pain more effectively.She also provides helpful information such as the process of Following is a form of “being with” our patients; whereas using techniques such as Guiding or Leading are “doing” interventions.For More Information about our Guest:Ladan Safvati, LMFTDirector and FounderSouthern California Institute of Emotion Focused Therapyhttps://www.eftsocal.com/about-socaleftWe Want to Hear Your Feedback! Please Contribute to the Conversation: Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usLeave feedback or ask a question with a message on Instagram: @theconnectiontherapypodcastEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlist

Our guest this episode is Ladan Safvati, LMFT. Join us as she shares the history of Emotion-Focused Therapy (EFT) and highlights the theories of emotional change that guide EFT. She also provides a background to the ways EFT addresses and encourages emotion in therapy in service to its tenet that emotion is the way to evoke therapeutic outcomes.For More Information about our Guest:Ladan Safvati, LMFTDirector and FounderSouthern California Institute of Emotion Focused Therapyhttps://www.eftsocal.com/about-socaleftWe Want to Hear Your Feedback! Please Contribute to the Conversation: Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usLeave feedback or ask a question with a message on Instagram: @theconnectiontherapypodcastEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlist

It is a common misunderstanding that there is a lack of evidence for mental health therapy beyond Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT). CBT certainly has a significant body of research supporting it, but so too do many other styles of therapy. This episode reviews a meta-analysis (summary of research) to support mental health clinicians in increasing their confidence about the variety of styles to select from that they can employ to support their clients.References: ​​American Psychological Association 2025 Year in Reviewhttps://www.apa.org/news/science-spotlight/psychological-scienceElliott, R., Watson, J., Timulak, L., & Sharbanee, J. (2021). Research on humanistic-experiential psychotherapies: Updated review. In M. Barkham, W. Lutz, & L. Castonguay (Eds.), Bergin and Garfield’s handbook of psychotherapy and behavior change (7th ed., pp. 421-467). John Wiley & Sons, Incorporated.

Research articles are built on current-day practice and in order to fully understand their implications, it helps to go back to the original sources. This is especially true for some of the original therapy modalities, so that practitioners today can more fully understand the research findings in light of the original intentions.In this podcast, Carl Rogers’ foundational article about the six conditions for therapeutic personality change is reviewed. This article by Dr. Rogers has been cited 12,000+ times since first publication in 1957, and has significant implications for research, as well as the overall field of psychotherapy. We Want to Hear Your Feedback! Please Contribute to the Conversation: Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usLeave feedback or ask a question with a message on Instagram: @theconnectiontherapypodcastEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistReferences:Rogers, C. R. (1957). The necessary and sufficient conditions of therapeutic personality change. Journal of Consulting Psychology, 21(2), 95–103. https://doi-org.pgi.idm.oclc.org/10.1037/h0045357American Psychological Association (APA) Information:https://www.apa.org/about/governance/president/carl-r-rogers

Typical mental health interventions to support someone who is understood as “resistant” to making necessary changes include attempts to encourage and motivate the needed behavior modifications. However, for someone who is overwhelmed with fear, these interventions may further inhibit action.This episode considers the nonverbal communication signals that can assist mental health therapists in determining when other interventions would be more successful, enabling the best outcomes for the client.We Want to Hear Your Feedback! Please Contribute to the Conversation: Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usLeave feedback or ask a question with a message on Instagram: @theconnectiontherapypodcastEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistReference:Prochaska’s Transtheoretical Change Model:https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK556005/

At this time of the year, it is common for patients to be interested in New Year’s Resolutions or other goals and aspirations. Mental health therapists are typically skilled in interventions to support crises and problems, but what about when things are calm for the moment and the main need is to observe and endorse a good outcome?This episode highlights non-verbal communication that signals a regulated nervous system state, in order to support the treating clinician in determining when their patients are experiencing these and makes suggestions for how to respond.We Want to Hear Your Feedback! Please Contribute to the Conversation: Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usLeave feedback or ask a question with a message on Instagram: @theconnectiontherapypodcastEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistReferences:How Horses Move:https://mechse.illinois.edu/news/blogs/mechanics-motion-natureProchaska’s Transtheoretical Change Model:https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK556005/https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transtheoretical_model

It is so natural to want changes at this time of the year, and as mental health therapists we are very likely going to support someone with a significant change that makes them anxious. Knowing how to support their exploration of possibilities while intervening non-verbally can help keep the momentum going in a way that simultaneously encourages a more regulated response that sustains the change process. Listen now for some potential ways to work in this way!

As mental health therapists, it is common to hear someone speak of New Year’s Resolutions or other big changes they hope to see in the New Year. The challenge is sometimes people are not fully bought into the anticipated changes, despite their discussions of wanting them to happen. Learning to view nonverbal signals, such as eye-contact, can support the mental health therapist in best supporting their patient. That is, if there is consistency across the stated intentions in verbal and nonverbal communication, then typical mental health interventions usually work. However, when there is inconsistency, the mental health therapist can learn to assess these discrepancies in order to better support their patients.We Want to Hear Your Feedback! Please Contribute to the Conversation: Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usLeave feedback or ask a question with a message on Instagram: @theconnectiontherapypodcastEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistReferences: Pew Research on New Year’s Resolutions:Who makes New Year’s resolutions, and why? | Pew Research CenterProchaska’s Transtheoretical Change Model:https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK556005/https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transtheoretical_model

Brenda reflects on the highlights from the year on the podcast, including guest interviews and her own explorations. This year, episodes integrated the works of scholars including Stephen Porges, PhD and Jaak Panksepp, PhD, as well as reviewed many clinical research articles in the pursuit of improving the practice of mental health. As she reviews in the highlights, the podcast strives to find a balance between the art and science of practice, that is integrating theory and research while always recognizing and honoring what happens during the session as profoundly insightful.Highlights are from these episodes:Episode 28: Brenda and Kinsey Rone on the Power of Therapist ConnectionEpisode 27: More Than a Profession: Brenda’s Love for PsychologyEpisode 36: How Animals Detect Human Nervous System States Through ScentEpisode 44: How Embarrassment Builds Trust in RelationshipsEpisode 49: From Fear to Curiosity: Exploring the Seeking System with Dr. Rachaël DraaismaEpisode 63: Gazes between Species and the Application to Mental Health PracticeEpisode 68: How to Provide Better Mental Health Treatment for Veterans with Adam Magers, MA, LPCEpisode 71: Expecting Great Outcomes - A Look at the Pygmalion (Rosenthal) Effect We Want to Hear Your Feedback! Please Contribute to the Conversation: Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usLeave feedback or ask a question with a message on Instagram: @theconnectiontherapypodcastEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlist

Kinsey Rone returns to the podcast for some reflections on the year. She and Brenda consider what interventions worked in their own practices. Brenda also shares feedback she has heard, particularly in the discussions across disciplines with the practice of equine-assisted services. And, the invitation is enthusiastically extended for listeners to share their feedback and questions, which will be shared and answered in future episodes. See below for ways to send in yours!We Want to Hear Your Feedback! Please Contribute to the Conversation: Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usLeave feedback or ask a question with a message on Instagram: @theconnectiontherapypodcastEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistFor More Information about our Guest:Kinsey Rone, Licensed Clinical Professional Counselorhttps://www.arrowcreekcounseling.com

This episode begins by normalizing difficulties over the holidays by sharing national statistics that demonstrate the commonness of this experience.  Supporting patients with concerns over the holidays can be a challenge, in part because of the difficulties themselves and also because of the strong tendency to isolate these concerns at this time.  Brenda then considers how nature operates during this time of winter as a helpful example for supporting these experiences.Enjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistContribute to the Conversation!  Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usReferences: American Psychiatric Associationhttps://www.psychiatry.org/news-room/news-releases/americans-more-anxious-about-the-holidaysAmerican Psychological Associationhttps://www.apa.org/news/press/releases/2023/11/holiday-season-stressNational Alliance of Mental Illness (NAMI)https://www.nami.org/press-releases/mental-health-and-the-holiday-blues/https://www.nami.org/blog-post/surviving-painful-holiday-emotions/https://www.nami.org/from-the-ceo/the-most-difficult-time-of-the-year-mental-health-during-the-holidays/Old Farmer’s Almanac (information about the Winter Solstice):https://www.almanac.com/content/first-day-winter-winter-solstice#:~:text=The%20first%20day%20of%20winter%20in%20the,December%2021%2C%202025%2C%20at%2010:03%20AM%20(EST).

In this episode, Dr. Brenda Murrow goes back to one of the foundational studies in psychology that still has resonance today.  The Pygmalion or Rosenthal effect is from research that explored how when teachers viewed their students as having high-potential, the students did better.  It speaks to the uncanny experience that when we expect greatness from others, especially young children in grade school as this study originally investigated, it sometimes becomes reality.Brenda combines the concepts from this foundational study with the idea of Winnicott’s potential space and incorporates recent real-life and timely examples from guests on the podcast to have an important discussion.  Essentially, she illustrates that we can do the simplest of therapeutic acts, that is looking at someone with expectations for great things, and see results.Enjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistContribute to the Conversation!  Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usReferences: Pygmalion (Rosenthal) Effect:https://www.ebsco.com/research-starters/education/pygmalion-effect-rosenthal-effectD.W. Winnicott’s idea of “potential space” in Playing and Reality. (1971, Penguin).

Brenda continues the discussion about the research on mental health treatment with veterans, as referenced in earlier podcasts in order to assist practitioners in understanding the implications for practice.  She provides historical context to some of the current treatments for PTSD and invites consideration for future possibilities.Enjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistContribute to the Conversation!  Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usSign-up for the February 2026 Course with Adam Magers, MA, LPChttps://connection-therapy.captivate.fm/course-with-adam-magersReferences: Adam Magers, MA, LPChttps://www.odysseusandtheoar.com/https://www.thebattlewithin.org/teamMore information about classical conditioning, prolonged exposure, Pavlov & Seligman:https://www.ebsco.com/research-starters/psychology/learned-helplessnessMonroe, M., Whitworth, J. D., Wharton, T., & Turner, J. (2021). Effects of an Equine-Assisted Therapy Program for Military Veterans with Self-Reported PTSD. Society & Animals, 29(5/6), 577–590. https://doi-org.pgi.idm.oclc.org/10.1163/15685306-12341572Mentioned in this episode:Feb 2026 Course with Adam Magers, MA, LPCLearn more about the Feb 2026 course with Adam Magers, MA, LPCCourse with Adam Magers, MA, LPC

Dr. Brenda Murrow reflects on recent experiences of spending time with specialized professionals including interviewing Adam Magers, MA, LPC and presenting at the Professional Association of Therapeutic Horsemanship (PATH), International conference.In this episode, she shares an understanding about how to tie clinical practice to the existing research in support of veterans.  This is done to support current practitioners who support veterans, whether in in-office settings or equine-assisted services.  She also explains the importance of the guiding theories that drive the ways these can be connected.Contribute to the Conversation!  Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usSign-up for the February 2026 Course with Adam Magers, MA, LPChttps://connection-therapy.captivate.fm/course-with-adam-magersEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistReferences:Matthew Bennett, PsyD, Towards an Integrated Analytical Psychology: Return to Freedom and Dignity (2024)Butler, O., Willmund, G., Gleich, T., Zimmermann, P., Lindenberger, U., Gallinat, J., & Kühn, S. (2019). Cognitive Reappraisal and Expressive Suppression of Negative Emotion in Combat-Related Posttraumatic Stress Disorder: A Functional MRI Study. Cognitive Therapy & Research, 43(1), 236–246. https://doi-org.pgi.idm.oclc.org/10.1007/s10608-018-9905-xAdam Magers, MA, LPChttps://www.odysseusandtheoar.com/https://www.thebattlewithin.org/teamMaria M Steenkamp, PhDhttps://med.nyu.edu/faculty/maria-m-steenkampSteenkamp MM, Litz BT, Hoge CW, Marmar CR. Psychotherapy for Military-Related PTSD: A Review of Randomized Clinical Trials. JAMA. 2015 Aug 4;314(5):489-500. doi: 10.1001/jama.2015.8370. PMID: 26241600. (https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26241600/)Steffen, P. R., & Anderson, T. (2025). Primary appraisal is affective not cognitive: Exploring a revised transactional model of stress and coping. Applied Psychophysiology and Biofeedback, 50(2), 197–211. https://doi-org.pgi.idm.oclc.org/10.1007/s10484-025-09699-wMentioned in this episode:Feb 2026 Course with Adam Magers, MA, LPCLearn more about the Feb 2026 course with Adam Magers, MA, LPCCourse with Adam Magers, MA, LPC

In this final segment of the conversation with Adam Magers, MA, LPC, he shares his views on how to improve mental health treatment for veterans.  He provides specific steps that practicing clinicians can take immediately to see benefits.He draws from both perspectives, as a clinician and as a veteran receiving support, in his own work with veterans, first responders, and frontline medical professionals.  In this episode, he shares freely how he works and what any therapist can do to improve their skills in treating veterans.Connect with our Guest:Adam Magers, MA, LPChttps://www.odysseusandtheoar.com/https://www.thebattlewithin.org/teamContribute to the Conversation!  Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usSign-up for the February 2026 Course with Adam Magers, MA, LPChttps://connection-therapy.captivate.fm/course-with-adam-magersEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistMentioned in this episode:Feb 2026 Course with Adam Magers, MA, LPCLearn more about the Feb 2026 course with Adam Magers, MA, LPCCourse with Adam Magers, MA, LPC

The conversation continues with Adam Magers, MA, LPC who joined the podcast to discuss his work with veterans, first responders, and frontline medical professionals.  He has experience both as a clinician and as a veteran receiving support, and he draws from both perspectives to share his expertise.  This unique and candid discussion offers many engaging insights, and is likely to widen your perspective on the treatment of veterans.In this part of the interview, Adam shares his personal journey and offers listeners a view into what the return home is really like, and the many ways in which it is a continual process for veterans.Guest:Adam Magers, MA, LPChttps://www.odysseusandtheoar.com/https://www.thebattlewithin.org/teamContribute to the Conversation!  Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usSign-up for the February 2026 Course with Adam Magers, MA, LPChttps://connection-therapy.captivate.fm/course-with-adam-magersEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistMentioned in this episode:Feb 2026 Course with Adam Magers, MA, LPCLearn more about the Feb 2026 course with Adam Magers, MA, LPCCourse with Adam Magers, MA, LPC

Adam Magers, MA, LPC joins the podcast to discuss his work with veterans, first responders, and frontline medical professionals.  He has experience both as a clinician and as a veteran receiving support, and he draws from both perspectives to share his expertise.  This unique and candid discussion offers many engaging insights, and is likely to widen your perspective on the treatment of veterans.Adam wrote the book, Odysseus & the Oar: Healing After War and Military Service (2024) which serves as a guide for veterans, their loved ones, and those who counsel them.  In his book, Adam applies the myth of the Odyssey by Homer to the experiences of war veterans.  He describes this as the ‘archetype of the warrior’s return’ and shares the ways this timeless story can illuminate paths through the pain of homecoming, in order to offer veterans a new perspective on the journey they have undergone during their service.  In this episode, he shares information about how this can be applied to mental health treatment.Guest:Adam Magers, MA, LPChttps://www.odysseusandtheoar.com/https://www.thebattlewithin.org/teamContribute to the Conversation!  Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usSign-up for the February 2026 Course with Adam Magers, MA, LPChttps://connection-therapy.captivate.fm/course-with-adam-magersEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistReferences:Matthew Bennett, PsyD, Towards an Integrated Analytical Psychology: Return to Freedom and Dignity (2024)Steenkamp MM, Litz BT, Hoge CW, Marmar CR. Psychotherapy for Military-Related PTSD: A Review of Randomized Clinical Trials. JAMA. 2015 Aug 4;314(5):489-500. doi: 10.1001/jama.2015.8370. PMID: 26241600. (https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26241600/)Mentioned in this episode:Feb 2026 Course with Adam Magers, MA, LPCLearn more about the Feb 2026 course with Adam Magers, MA, LPCCourse with Adam Magers, MA, LPC

In this episode, Brenda reviews the links researchers found between self-disgust and avoiding self-gazing, in studies with both veterans and older adults.  While the research is nascent in the ability to make significant conclusions, it does seem to have implications for clinical practice, especially in light of all the other factors associated with gaze and eye-contact.  Brenda explores the potential considerations for therapy sessions in this novel perspective on the ways body behaviors can be linked to internal experiences.Contribute to the Conversation!  Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistReferences:Ypsilanti A, Gettings R, Lazuras L, Robson A, Powell PA and Overton PG (2020) Self-Disgust Is Associated With Loneliness, Mental Health Difficulties, and Eye-Gaze Avoidance in War Veterans With PTSD. Front. Psychol. 11:559883. doi: 10.3389/fpsyg.2020.559883Ypsilanti, A., Robson, A., Lazuras, L., Powell, P. A., and Overton, P. G. (2020). Self-disgust, loneliness and mental health outcomes in older adults: an eye-tracking study. J. Affect. Disord. 266, 646–654. doi: 10.1016/j.jad.2020.01.166

As a mental health therapist, you probably have had the intuition that there is some type of shared experience between brains, in the therapy session, in a community setting, perhaps in the world.Today’s research review confirms this notion and even opens up more possibilities in that it appears the shared connections are enhanced by cooperation and amplified with eye contact.  Listen to consider the implications for mental health therapy, and your practice specifically.  There is even an opportunity to contribute to the conversation if you would like to do so.Contribute to the Conversation! Share your thoughts on the podcast and how these concepts work in your practice, or ask a question and I’ll answer it in an upcoming episode: https://connection-therapy.com/contact-usEnjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistReference:Luft, C. D. B., Zioga, I., Giannopoulos, A., Di Bona, G., Binetti, N., Civilini, A., Latora, V., & Mareschal, I. (2022). Social synchronization of brain activity increases during eye-contact. Communications Biology, 5(1), 1–15. https://doi-org.pgi.idm.oclc.org/10.1038/s42003-022-03352-6

How does gaze following and responses to vocalizations from cats and dogs apply to the practice of psychology?  This article was published by the American Psychological Association in the Journal of Comparative Psychology in order that mental health therapists would consider that exact question and we explore together in this episode how that might apply to your practice.Enjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistReference:Bogese, M. J., Johnston, A. M., & Byosiere, S.-E. (2024). Gaze in cats (Felis catus) and dogs (Canis lupus familiaris). Journal of Comparative Psychology, 138(1), 68–76. https://doi-org.pgi.idm.oclc.org/10.1037/com0000359

Dr. Brenda Murrow reflects on the life and legacy of Dr. Jane Goodall, who recently passed away, leaving behind a world forever changed by her compassion, curiosity, and scientific brilliance. In this episode, Dr. Murrow shares how Dr. Goodall’s discovery that chimpanzees use tools reshaped our understanding of what it means to be human and how her presence, kindness, and unwavering curiosity became a model for how to move through the world.Her passing also coincides with World Animal Day, now celebrating its 100th anniversary. Dr. Murrow shares how this global event connects with the ongoing work of figures like Dr. Temple Grandin, whose research in Animals Make Us Human emphasizes that emotions drive behavior in both animals and humans. Bringing these ideas into her own clinical work, Dr. Murrow discusses how conversations about animals can open pathways for connection, especially in therapy with children. By including pets and animal relationships in assessment and treatment, clients often reveal deeper relational patterns, empathy, and comfort, allowing therapy to feel more inclusive and authentic.This episode is both a tribute to Dr. Goodall and a reflection on how her compassionate way of being continues to inspire how we live, relate, and practice care for humans and animals alike.Enjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistReferences:Dr. Jane Goodallhttps://janegoodall.org/Jane Goodall. (1999). Reason for Hope: A Spiritual Journey.  Dr. Temple Grandin & Catherine Johnson. (). Animals Make Us Human: Creating the Best Life for AnimalsWorld Animal Day: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Animal_Day

In this episode, Dr. Brenda Murrow reflects on her journey as a clinician and how her early training shaped her approach to emotion-focused therapy (EFT), developed by Drs. Greenberg and Johnson. She explores the idea that all therapy, no matter the approach, involves emotions—because clients most often seek help in response to emotional challenges.Dr. Murrow discusses research by Steffen & Anderson (2025) highlighting affect as the “primary appraisal” in decision-making, connecting these findings to her own clinical observations. She reflects on how emotions guide clients’ responses, shape therapeutic interventions, and influence the choices therapists make in session.Drawing from her early work supporting survivors of sexual assault at a rape crisis center, Dr. Murrow examines how trauma can affect a client’s trust in their own thinking, the role of psychological defenses, and why focusing on emotions—rather than relying only on cognitive strategies—can support healing. She also shares reflections on working with children who have experienced trauma, discussing the benefits and limitations of play therapy, nonverbal communication, and developmental frameworks in guiding interventions.Throughout the episode, Dr. Murrow encourages therapists to consider their own approach, reflect on the decisions they make in session, and integrate emotion into practice in ways that strengthen the therapeutic relationship and support meaningful outcomes for clients. Enjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistReferences:Dr. Les Greenberg information:Southern California Institute of Emotion-Focused Therapy: https://www.eftsocal.com/Dr. Sue Johnson information:https://drsuejohnson.com/McWilliams, N. (2011). Psychoanalytic Diagnosis: Understanding personality structure in the clinical process (2nd ed.)Guilford Press.National Sexual Violence Resource Center: https://www.nsvrc.orgPanksepp, J. & Biven, L. (2012). The Archaeology of mind: Neuroevolutionary origins of human emotions. New York, NY: Norton.Piaget’s Stages of Developmenthttps://www.webmd.com/children/piaget-stages-of-developmentSteffen, P. R., & Anderson, T. (2025). Primary appraisal is affective not cognitive: Exploring a revised transactional model of stress and coping. Applied Psychophysiology and Biofeedback, 50(2), 197–211. https://doi-org.pgi.idm.oclc.org/10.1007/s10484-025-09699-w

Welcome back to the Connection Therapy Podcast. In this episode, Brenda shares her reflections on Emotion Focused Therapy and the powerful contributions of Dr. Leslie Greenberg, a tremendous mentor in the field.Brenda walks through what makes this approach stand out from more traditional models. Rather than moving too quickly into problem-solving, EFT asks therapists to slow down and notice what’s happening in the moment. She highlights some of the subtle signs Greenberg points to—like when a client circles around a story, repeats something they’ve said many times before, or suddenly touches on something moving and tender. These moments, though easy to miss, can be invitations into deeper emotions that shift the direction of therapy.The conversation also touches on the role of voice and tone in picking up on emotions, the importance of therapists paying attention to their own feelings during a session, and the challenges of catching these cues when working virtually. Brenda explains why slowing the pace, listening more closely, and making room for both the client’s and therapist’s emotions can create opportunities for lasting change.To close, Brenda offers reflection questions that invite listeners to think about how these ideas show up in their own practice. From noticing the small signals in a client’s words to exploring how to stay emotionally attuned, these prompts are designed to spark meaningful reflection whether you’re on your own, in supervision, or sharing with peers.Enjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistElliott, R., Watson, J. C., Goldman, R. N., & Greenberg, L. S. (2025). Learning emotion-focused therapy: A comprehensive guide., 2nd ed. https://doi-org.pgi.idm.oclc.org/10.1037/0000458-000Johnson, S. (2009). Extravagant emotion: Understanding and transforming love relationships in Emotionally Focused Therapy. In D. Fosha, D. J., Siegel,& M. F. Solomon (Eds.), The healing power of emotion: Affective neuroscience,development & clinical practice (pp. 1-26). New York, NY: Norton.Dr. Sue Johnson information:https://drsuejohnson.com/

Most interventions in our field are taught as cognitive-based. But in practice, what actually works often comes down to emotions, nonverbal cues, and affect. That gap between graduate training and what really helps clients is something every clinician has to navigate.In this episode, Brenda takes a closer look at why emotions sit at the center of lasting change. She reviews the landmark article The Rise of Affectivism in Nature Human Behaviour and explores how this new paradigm builds on behaviorism and cognitivism while placing emotions, motivations, and moods at the core of human experience. Dr. Greenberg’s reminder that “you have to arrive at your emotions before you can leave them” shapes an important way of thinking about emotional change in therapy. Rather than changing emotions through cognition or behavior alone, he shows us that transformation happens when one emotion helps shift another. This idea, along with the growing recognition of affect in research and practice, signals an important shift in how we understand healing.Brenda reflects on these shifts, considers their impact on child therapy and beyond, and explores what they mean for the future of psychotherapy.Enjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistReferences:Dukes, D., Abrams, K., Adolphs, R., Ahmed, M. E., Beatty, A., Berridge, K. C., Broomhall, S., Brosch, T., Campos, J. J., Clay, Z., Clément, F., Cunningham, W. A., Damasio, A., Damasio, H., D, A. J., Davidson, J. W., de Gelder, B., Deonna, J., de Sousa, R., … Sander, D. (2021). The rise of affectivism. Nature Human Behaviour, 5(7), 816–820. https://doi-org.pgi.idm.oclc.org/10.1038/s41562-021-01130-8Greenberg, L., & Selvam, R. (2024). The Future of Emotions. International Body Psychotherapy Journal, 23(1), 12–27.Southern California Institute of Emotion-Focused Therapy: https://www.eftsocal.com/

For decades, the cognitive model has shaped therapy with the idea that our thoughts determine how we feel and behave. But new research suggests the opposite may be true—that emotions might actually be in the driver’s seat.In this episode, Dr. Brenda Murrow takes a closer look at a newly published article, “Primary Appraisal Is Affective Not Cognitive: Exploring a Revised Transactional Model of Stress and Coping,” and unpacks how it challenges long-held assumptions in mental health. Drawing from neuroscience and the work of philosophers like Plato, Aristotle, Kant, and Heidegger, she shares how the article explores our subjective experiences and affective processes influence everything from decision-making to language.Dr. Murrow also reflects on what this means in the therapy room, especially with trauma survivors, where asking specific questions about thinking can miss the mark. Instead, she considers how paying close attention to emotions, the body, and the environment can offer deeper support—and how tools like biofeedback may help us better understand what’s truly effective.This episode invites you to think differently about what drives human behavior and how we show up with presence in the therapy space.Enjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistReferences:Steffen, P. R., & Anderson, T. (2025). Primary appraisal is affective not cognitive: Exploring a revised transactional model of stress and coping. Applied Psychophysiology and Biofeedback, 50(2), 197–211. https://doi-org.pgi.idm.oclc.org/10.1007/s10484-025-09699-w

In this episode of the Connection Therapy Podcast, host Dr. Brenda Murrow explores what surprising new research on goats can teach us about human connection and therapy. Two recent studies shed light on how these social animals respond to emotional cues, offering valuable lessons for anyone working in a helping profession.The first study, published in Frontiers in Zoology in 2019, found that goats could tell the difference between positive and negative calls from other goats. Not only did their behavior change, but researchers also noted shifts in heart rate variability, suggesting that positive vocalizations were related to a calming effect. The second study, published in Animal Behavior in 2024, extended these findings by showing that goats also reacted differently to happy and angry human voices—even when the voices were unfamiliar. While the responses in this case were behavioral rather than physiological, the research highlighted just how far emotional communication can reach across species.For therapists, these studies highlight a simple but powerful truth: our tone, mood, and presence matter. Just as goats respond to emotional signals, so too do our clients. What we bring into the room can shape not only the conversation but also how someone feels in their body.Dr. Murrow reflects on the practical takeaways for clinicians—reminding us that the therapeutic relationship is influenced as much by how we show up as by what we say. By being mindful of our emotional presence, we can create spaces that are calmer, safer, and more healing for the people we serve.Enjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistReferences:Baciadonna, L., Briefer, E., Favaro, L., & McElligott, A. (2019). Goats distinguish between positive and negative emotion-linked vocalisations. Frontiers in Zoology, 16(1), 1–11. https://doi-org.pgi.idm.oclc.org/10.1186/s12983-019-0323-zMason, M. A., Semple, S., Marshall, H. H., & McElligott, A. G. (2024). Goats discriminate emotional valence in the human voice. Animal Behaviour, 209, 227–240. https://doi-org.pgi.idm.oclc.org/10.1016/j.anbehav.2023.12.008

What we show on the outside doesn’t always reflect what’s happening on the inside—but sometimes the signals are there if we know how to read them. In this episode, Dr. Brenda explores her curiosity about the connection between behaviors, especially in children, and what’s happening internally for survivors of trauma.She draws from polyvagal theory and highlights research like the study by Park et al. (2011), which examined the relationship between autonomic function, voice, and mood states. Their findings show how closely our internal physiology—like pulse rate variability—lines up with the signals we send through our voice and facial expressions.Just as machines are being trained to read these signals, therapists and caregivers can sharpen their own intuition and skills to sense them too. This isn’t about confirming what we already think we know—it’s about exploration, staying open, and continuing to learn how and why these connections work.Technology is advancing quickly, and studies like this one are pointing toward what many are already noticing in practice: the heart, face, and voice are deeply connected.If you’ve ever been curious about the relationship between external behaviors and internal states, or you want inspiration to keep growing in your own therapeutic work, this conversation is for you.Enjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistChan-Kyu Park, Sanghoon Lee, Hi-Joon Park, You-Sang Baik, Young-Bae Park, & Young-Jae Park. (2011). Autonomic function, voice, and mood states. Clinical Autonomic Research, 21(2), 103–110. https://doi-org.pgi.idm.oclc.org/10.1007/s10286-010-0095-1

Working with children can be challenging, especially when they are experiencing emotional struggles. In this episode, Dr. Brenda Murrow examines how children decode emotions in voices and what this means for supporting their social and emotional development through therapy.Drawing on a 2023 study published in Cerebral Cortex, Dr. Murrow highlights how a child’s ability to recognize emotional tone—particularly sadness—is closely linked to their social communication skills. Rather than avoiding or downplaying negative emotions, tuning in to these cues can actually strengthen a child’s capacity for empathy and social responsiveness over time.Dr. Murrow also explores the practice of child-led play therapy, illustrating how children often express real-life experiences and emotions through their play. She emphasizes the importance of responding with authenticity, following the child’s lead, and creating a space where children can safely explore complex feelings. Through careful observation, reflective narration, and thoughtful engagement, therapists and caregivers can support children in processing difficult emotions without forcing positivity or over-interpreting behavior.This episode offers research-backed insights and practical strategies for therapists, educators, and caregivers seeking to approach children’s emotional worlds with empathy, skill, and authenticity. Listeners will come away with a deeper understanding of how emotional decoding and play intersect to support healthy social development and meaningful connection.Enjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistReferences:Leipold, S., Abrams, D. A., Karraker, S., & Menon, V. (2023). Neural decoding of emotional prosody in voice-sensitive auditory cortex predicts social communication abilities in children. Cerebral Cortex, 33(3), 709–728. https://doi-org.pgi.idm.oclc.org/10.1093/cercor/bhac095

In this episode of the Connection Therapy Podcast, Dr. Brenda Murrow explores the concept of voice prosody — the way something is said beyond the words themselves. Prosody includes the tone, pitch, rhythm, and other vocal qualities that carry emotional meaning and influence how language is experienced, which has implications for therapy.Dr. Murrow draws from her personal experience with voice differences and discusses recent research, including a 2025 study showing that emotions such as sadness, anger, and joy can be effectively conveyed and recognized through a single spoken word. The episode covers the clinical importance of listening for emotional patterns, shifts, and rhythms in clients’ voices. Paying attention to these elements can reveal underlying feelings that may not be expressed through words alone. This is particularly valuable in trauma-informed and developmental work, where clients’ voices may reflect earlier developmental stages or past experiences, providing additional insight for sensitive intervention.Dr. Murrow offers practical guidance for therapists on how to incorporate observations about prosody into therapy sessions. She emphasizes approaching this with curiosity and sensitivity to create a safe environment where clients can become aware of emotional patterns without feeling pressured or uncomfortable.Ultimately, voice prosody provides a unique perspective on client experience. Attuning to both what is said and how it is said supports stronger therapeutic connection and can improve the effectiveness of clinical interventions.Enjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistReferences:Coulombe, V., Martel-Sauvageau, V. & Monetta, L. The Expression of Vocal Emotions in Cognitively Healthy Adult Speakers: Impact of Emotion Category, Gender, and Age. J Nonverbal Behav 49, 35–51 (2025). https://doi.org/10.1007/s10919-024-00472-x

In this episode of the Connection Therapy Podcast, Dr. Brenda Murrow explores how our most basic emotional systems—shared with other mammals—shape both our behavior and overall well-being. Drawing from the work of Jaak Panksepp, Mark Solms, and Temple Grandin, she breaks down how concepts like allostasis, heart rate variability, and emotional flexibility connect to mental health and personality.You’ll hear how Panksepp’s seven emotional systems can be translated into meaningful clinical work, how Mark Solms defines consciousness through the lens of biology, and why it matters that living beings must stay within specific physiological ranges. Dr. Murrow also introduces the idea of personality as a reflection of our brain’s strategy for staying regulated over time—not just day-to-day, but across our lifespan.This episode challenges traditional personality assessments and highlights why moderate, adaptable functioning is often a more useful marker of mental health than extreme traits. Drawing inspiration from Dr. Temple Grandin, we consider how factors like genetics, environment, and sensory processing shape individual behavior—and how visualizing emotional systems like adjustable “volume knobs” can help both clients and clinicians understand themselves better.Whether you're a mental health professional or simply interested in how emotional and biological systems work together, this conversation offers a compelling blend of science, experience, and practical application.Enjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistReferences:Grandin, T. (2018). My reflections on understanding animal emotions for improving the life of animals in zoos. Journal of Applied Animal Welfare Science, 21(Suppl 1), 12–22. https://doi-org.pgi.idm.oclc.org/10.1080/10888705.2018.1513843Marchant, J., Khazan, I., Cressman, M., & Steffen, P. (2025). Comparing the effects of square, 4–7-8, and 6 breaths-per-minute breathing conditions on heart rate variability, CO~~2~~ levels, and mood. Applied Psychophysiology and Biofeedback, 50(2), 261–276. https://doi-org.pgi.idm.oclc.org/10.1007/s10484-025-09688-zPanksepp, J. & Biven, L. (2012). The Archaeology of mind: Neuroevolutionary origins of human emotions. New York, NY: Norton.Solms, Mark on Brain Science with Ginger Campbell, MD podcast, May 28, 2021Steffen, P. R., & Olsen, J. A. (2025). Conceptualizing personality as individualized allostasis: Exploring a balanced measure of personality for psychotherapy/psychophysiology integration. Applied Psychophysiology and Biofeedback, 50(2), 277–287. https://doi-org.pgi.idm.oclc.org/10.1007/s10484-025-09700-6

In this episode, Brenda explores the often-overlooked mismatch between what clients say and what they do. It’s a common experience in therapy: insight is there, but behavior doesn’t shift. This conversation dives into why that happens—and how unconscious motivation plays a powerful role in human behavior.Grounding the conversation with contributions from the work of Fonagy, Freud, Schore, Panksepp, McWilliams, and more she explains how behavior is often driven by internal states we don’t even realize are there. It's not just about what we think—it’s about how we feel, and more importantly, how our brains process primary emotional experiences. Westen’s idea that affect regulation is the primary driver of motivation helps reframe what might look like resistance or avoidance in the therapy room.From there, Brenda introduces the science of affective neuroscience, highlighting Jaak Panksepp’s research on the brain’s primary emotional systems. These systems—like Seeking, Fear, Panic/Grief, and Rage—are primal, fast, and often unconscious. She takes time to walk through each one, showing how they shape behavior in ways clients can’t always name. Whether it's a drive to connect, avoid danger, or lash out under pressure, these emotional systems often explain the “why” behind the stuckness.Brenda also brings this into clinical practice. Using Nancy McWilliams’s framework, she explains how anxiety can come from different systems—and how knowing the source changes the ways to intervene.Throughout the episode, Brenda encourages therapists to listen differently—to tune into the emotional system underneath the story. When we shift our focus to what’s happening in the body and deeper brain systems, we can meet clients in the places that words alone often can’t reach.Enjoying the podcast?There are now playlists for you to navigate to your favorite topics: https://connection-therapy.com/playlistReferences:Fonagy, P., & Target, M. (2003). Psychoanalytic theories:Perspectives from developmental psychopathology. McWilliams, N. (2014, September 2). 2012 Master Lecture - Beyond Traits: PersonalityDifferences As Intersubjective Themes [Video]. Youtube.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U_kUE2GWeYEPanksepp, J. (2009). Brain emotional systems and qualities of mental life: From animal models of affect to implications for psychotherapeutics. In D. Fosha, D. J., Siegel,& M. F. Solomon (Eds.), The healing power of emotion: Affective neuroscience,development & clinical practice (pp. 1-26). New York, NY: Norton.Panksepp, J. & Biven, L. (2012). The Archaeology of mind: Neuroevolutionary origins of human emotions. New York, NY: Norton.Schore, A.N. (2003). Affect dysregulation and disorders of the self. (and) Affect regulation and repair of the self. New York, NY: Norton.

In this episode, Dr. Brenda Murrow shares how learning from Dr. Rachaël Draaisma, an expert in horse behavior, has changed the way she shows up in the therapy room. What started as curiosity turned into a deeper appreciation for the power of observation, body awareness, and learning from unexpected places.Brenda talks about what it means to really pay attention—to notice what’s not being said, and how our bodies communicate even when our words don’t. She shares how working with horses challenged her to move beyond just reading and thinking, and instead practice noticing, feeling, and responding in the moment.We talk about subtle cues, like calming signals and body language, and how they show up in both horses and humans. Brenda also opens up about the discomfort of learning in new ways and why that discomfort can lead to growth.This episode is a reminder that there’s wisdom all around us—even in the barn—and that sometimes the best way to understand people is to step outside the usual and pay attention in a new way.References and More Information:Book Club: https://connection-therapy.com/book-clubWebinar December 8th with Dr. Rachaël Draaisma:https://connection-therapy.com/product/dr-rachael-draaisma-presents-language-signs-calming-signals-of-horsesTo learn more about Rachaël’s work, visit calmingsignalsofhorses.com or check out her book Language Signs & Calming Signals of Horses (2017).Podcast: Mark Solms on Brain Science with Ginger Campbell, MD, May 28, 2021Podcast: Jaak Panksepp on the Unadulterated Intellect #77Jaak Panksepp & Lucy Biven. (2012). The Archaeology of Mind: Neuroevolutionary Origins of Human Emotions (Norton Series on Interpersonal Neurobiology) 1st Edition.  W. W. Norton & Company.Lone Guardian, LLC, https://www.theloneguardian.org/

In part three of her conversation with Dr. Rachaël Draaisma, Brenda dives straight into one of the most persistent myths in the horse world: that chewing always means a horse is thinking—or being submissive. Turns out, it’s not that simple.Dr. Draaisma helps us unpack what chewing actually communicates and why assuming a single meaning can cause us to miss what’s really going on. It’s not just about thoughtfulness or calm. Sometimes, it’s a signal of inner tension, an effort to self-regulate, or something entirely different. The context—and the rest of the body language—matters.Dr. Draaisma also shares how our own body language plays a role in shaping how animals (and people) respond to us. Small shifts—a softer gaze, a change in posture, even the kind of eye contact we use—can dramatically change the feel of an interaction.One of the standout moments? Her distinction between having an open mind and an open gaze. It's not enough to say you're willing to hear something new—your body needs to see it. Whether you work with animals, as in equine-assisted therapy, or just want to be more mindful in your connections, this episode is packed with insights. Dr. Draaisma reminds us that communication isn’t just verbal—it’s energetic, physical, and often nonverbal. And if we want to be truly present and responsive, we have to keep learning how to read the cues.This episode is a powerful reminder: when we change how we show up—right down to the tilt of our head or the quality of our gaze—we open the door to more trust, more connection, and a whole lot more understanding.More Information:Book Club: https://connection-therapy.com/book-clubWebinar December 8th with Dr. Rachaël Draaisma:https://connection-therapy.com/product/dr-rachael-draaisma-presents-language-signs-calming-signals-of-horsesTo learn more about Rachaël’s work, visit calmingsignalsofhorses.com or check out her book Language Signs & Calming Signals of Horses (2017).

In today’s episode Brenda continues her conversation with Dr. Rachaël Draaisma. In part two of this discussion, they move deeper into what it means to support emotional health in animals—not just by shaping their behavior, but by helping them feel safe, curious, and motivated from within.Dr. Draaisma shares how she builds training sessions that work with the animal’s emotional state instead of against it. Drawing from the neuroscience of Jaak Panksepp and Lucy Biven, we focus on one powerful emotional system: the seeking system. In both animals and humans, it’s connected to feelings of motivation and joy. One of the simplest ways Dr. Draaisma helps animals engage their seeking system is through scentwork. Instead of teaching horses to follow commands, she sets up activities where the horses use their noses to search for treats or identify scents. Through these small moments of discovery, dopamine—one of the brain’s significant chemicals—is released, helping the animal shift from a state of stress to one of focus and enjoyment.By helping the horse enjoy the process of searching and learning, Dr. Draaisma creates an emotional shift that lasts beyond the training session. Throughout the episode, we also discuss how to recognize when an animal is operating from curiosity versus fear. Dr. Draaisma explains the calming signals you might notice. These small shifts in body language give us valuable clues about how the horse is feeling and whether our work is supporting emotional safety.This episode encourages us to look beyond surface-level behavior and instead ask: is the animal curious and engaged, or simply complying out of fear? Whether you work with animals or people, the same principle applies. When we help individuals feel safe enough to explore, we create space for meaningful emotional change.To learn more about Rachaël’s work, visit calmingsignalsofhorses.com or check out her book Language Signs & Calming Signals of Horses (2017).References:Jaak Panksepp & Lucy Biven. (2012). The Archaeology of Mind: Neuroevolutionary Origins of Human Emotions (Norton Series on Interpersonal Neurobiology) 1st Edition.  W. W. Norton & Company.

In this episode, Dr. Brenda Murrow welcomes Dr. Rachaël Draaisma for a truly fascinating conversation about the subtle, yet powerful, language of calming signals—what many in the clinical and animal behavior world might also recognize as appeasement behaviors.Rachaël shares how her work with horses opened a path to understanding the nervous system in a whole new way. What began as an interest in horse behavior quickly evolved into a deep study of nonverbal communication, and even scent tracking, which she has found enhances the mental stimulation of horses.Part 1 of their conversation centers around how mammals—including us—use calming signals to navigate social climates. These signals often operate beneath our awareness, yet play a major role in shaping connection and communication. They don’t require conscious thought or effort. That’s what makes them so vital—because they help us respond to one another in ways that are deeply wired into our nervous systems.Rachaël talks about what she’s learned from years of observing horses, highlighting how grace, curiosity, and emotional safety play into how these animals communicate and co-exist with humans. Her observations and research show that calming signals aren’t just something horses use—they’re shared across species. We also get an introduction to Scentwork, which Rachaël ties directly into mental well-being and nervous system regulation. There’s so much richness here, and this is just the beginning.This conversation opens up a new lens on social behavior, connection, and communication.To learn more about Rachaël’s work, visit calmingsignalsofhorses.com or check out her book Language Signs & Calming Signals of Horses (2017).www.connectiontherapypodcast.comFollow Brenda on Instagram @theconnectiontherapypodcastJoin the Bookclub! https://connection-therapy.com/book-club References:Lone Guardian, LLC, https://www.theloneguardian.org/

In this episode, Dr. Brenda Murrow explores the powerful role of calming signals—those subtle, nonverbal cues used to manage social dynamics, reduce conflict, and build connection. Building on past episodes on appeasement behaviors in dogs and humans, this conversation turns to horses—drawing on the work of two influential authors: Turid Rugaas (dogs) and her mentee, Rachaël Draaisma (horses) who have both published books on calming signals, also known as appeasement behaviors.Brenda shares takeaways from a hands-on class with Dr. Draaisma, where she learned that horses use a wide range of calming signals—like looking away, blinking, chewing, or curving their walking patterns—to create space or maintain harmony in interactions.But this episode isn’t just about horses. It’s about how easily we, as humans—and especially therapists—unintentionally send nonverbal messages we don’t mean. Brenda shares a personal moment in class when her body language contradicted her intent—toward both a horse and a human partner—and what that revealed about how her own unconscious patterns of somatic movement needs to be further understood.Brenda reflects on her discomfort with experiential learning and how participating in it revealed surprising insights about her own communication. She offers encouragement to those who might also feel more at ease with books and theory, reminding listeners that awareness begins by noticing what we’re actually doing in real time.There’s value in simply noticing the signals we give off—especially the ones we’re not aware of. These small moments of awareness can shape stronger connections with both clients and animals.References:*Brenda Murrow, (2013) A Quantitative exploration into the effects of the human and animal connection.  (Doctoral dissertation).  Pacifica Graduate Institute.*also mentioned in podcast episodes 2, 3, and 4.Jaak Panksepp & Lucy Biven. (2012). The Archaeology of Mind: Neuroevolutionary Origins of Human Emotions (Norton Series on Interpersonal Neurobiology) 1st Edition.  W. W. Norton & Company.Rachaël Draaisma, https://calmingsignalsofhorses.com/en/ Language ​​Signs & Calming Signals of Horses (2017), CRC PressTurid Rugaas, http://en.turid-rugaas.no/Lone Guardian, LLC, https://www.theloneguardian.org/Gurman, A. S., & Messer, S. B. (Eds.). (2003). Essential psychotherapies: Theory andpractice. New York: The Guilford Press.

In today’s episode, Dr. Brenda Murrow takes a look into behaviors we sometimes see in children that can feel confusing or hard to understand—like why a child might stay very close to a caregiver who’s actually causing them harm or distress. To start, she shares an example of how horses react unpredictably to things in their environments which helps us begin to see how behaviors in animals—and humans—can be shaped by their environment and survival needs.Dr. Brenda Murrow then builds on the article we unpacked in episode 45, Entrapped Mother Entrapped Child: Agonic Mode Hierarchy and Appeasement and Intergenerational Abuse and Neglect by Amos, Segal, and Cantor. This article looks closely at how children in abusive or neglectful homes develop what are called “appeasement behaviors” to help them survive. One behavior Dr. Murrow highlights that the authors mentioned is called “reverted escape,” which describes a child’s seemingly paradoxical choice to stay near a dominant or even oppressive adult rather than run away. While this may seem counterintuitive, it’s actually a common survival strategy found in both humans and animals. She also discusses other forms of appeasement behaviors like infantile mimicry, cowering, bowing, sickness behaviors, and even self-destructive behaviors—all ways that children might signal they don’t want conflict and are trying to remain safe in difficult environments. These behaviors, though often misunderstood, have deep roots in survival instincts shared across species.Dr. Murrow reminds us that understanding the why behind behaviors—not just labeling them as “bad” or “problematic”—is essential to supporting children effectively. By viewing behavior through this lens, we can find better ways to intervene and support healing.Understanding survival-based behaviors can change the way we respond—and ultimately help children feel safer and more supported.References:Amos, J., Segal, L., & Cantor, C. (2015). Entrapped Mother, Entrapped Child: Agonic Mode, Hierarchy and Appeasement in Intergenerational Abuse and Neglect. Journal of Child & Family Studies, 24(5), 1442–1450. https://doi-org.pgi.idm.oclc.org/10.1007/s10826-014-9950-3

Dr. Brenda Murrow began her career working with children and quickly realized that young kids don’t always use the language adults expect to describe their experiences. Each child has their own unique way of expressing what they feel and see, which makes understanding them a careful process. This is especially true when working with children who have experienced trauma or difficult home environments.Recently, Dr. Brenda Murrow has been exploring research on appeasement signals—nonverbal behaviors that both humans and animals use to show peaceful intentions and avoid conflict. She found a study titled Entrapped Mother, Entrapped Child: Agonic Mode, Hierarchy and Appeasement in Intergenerational Abuse and Neglect, published in 2015 in the Journal of Child and Family Studies by Jackie Amos, Leonie Seagal, and Chris Cantor. The study highlights how children raised in unpredictable or traumatic environments develop behaviors aimed at maintaining peace and connection with their caregivers, even when those caregivers may be abusive or neglectful.According to the research, children pay a high price to stay connected—they must constantly watch and respond to their caregiver’s moods to avoid conflict. Brenda sees this in her work, observing how children learn to adjust their behavior to protect themselves and maintain relationships, sometimes acting out in ways that can seem confusing or hostile to others.The study also shows that children’s behaviors vary depending on their caregiver’s mood—some may become clingy and submissive, others hostile or controlling, and some try to entertain or distract. Brenda recognizes these patterns in her clients and understands how challenging it is for outsiders like teachers or counselors to grasp why a child might stay connected to an unhealthy or harmful relationship.Brenda appreciates how this research adds depth to her understanding of trauma and its effects on children. It helps explain why children might behave in ways that seem difficult or contradictory but are really strategies for survival and connection. She looks forward to sharing more about appeasement behaviors in upcoming episodes.www.connectiontherapypodcast.comFollow Brenda on Instagram @theconnectiontherapypodcastReferences:Amos, J., Segal, L., & Cantor, C. (2015). Entrapped Mother, Entrapped Child: Agonic Mode, Hierarchy and Appeasement in Intergenerational Abuse and Neglect. Journal of Child & Family Studies, 24(5), 1442–1450. https://doi-org.pgi.idm.oclc.org/10.1007/s10826-014-9950-3Stephen Porges (2011). Polyvagal theory: Neurophysiological foundations of emotions, attachment, communication, and self-regulation. Bessel Van der Kolk (2015). The Body Keeps the Score.

We often think we need to show up perfectly, but the truth is—our imperfections are doing more work than we realize. In this episode, Dr. Brenda Murrow talks about how information moves between beings, especially through non-verbal signals, and how something as simple as embarrassment can actually build trust.Humans, like many species, show appeasement signals—subtle ways of communicating their peaceable intent.  When we are embarrassed, we often show these signals along with care, concern, or social awareness - all without saying a word.  It’s a non-verbal way of showing we care what others think, too. That moment when your face flushes and you look away? It actually makes people trust you more.Dr. Brenda Murrow breaks down the study Flustered and Faithful by Feinberg, Willer, and Keltner (2012), which found that when people witnessed someone reacting to an embarrassing moment with emotion, they viewed that person as more prosocial and trustworthy. It’s not the mistake that matters—it’s the way we respond. And often, we only feel embarrassed because we do care—about the moment, the other person, the connection.This has big implications in how we support our patients. When we normalize embarrassment instead of rushing past it or covering it up, we give people space to be human. That opens the door for repair, empathy, and stronger connection. And often, those very moments can strengthen relationships.Turns out, our flaws might be one of our best connection tools.www.connectiontherapypodcast.comFollow Brenda on Instagram @theconnectiontherapypodcastReference:Feinberg, M., Willer, R., & Keltner, D. (2012). Flustered and faithful: Embarrassment as a signal of prosociality. Journal of Personality and Social Psychology, 102(1), 81–97. https://doi-org.pgi.idm.oclc.org/10.1037/a0025403