PODCAST · business
Don't Say Content
by Devin Bramhall & Margaret Kelsey
The marketing and business strategy podcast that executives and marketing leaders can't stop talking about. Marketing veterans Devin Bramhall (Animalz, Help Scout) & Margaret Kelsey (InVision, OpenView) use their combined 20+ years of experience to increase the business impact of marketing by creating shared understanding of its purpose and outcomes among marketing leaders, founders/CEOs & others in the C-suite. No tactics, playbooks, guides, or interviews with smart people (or anyone). Just in-depth conversations about B2B marketing behind the scenes: Communicating value of marketing to executives and founders Managing marketing teams Trends in B2B marketing: AI, TikTok, YouTube, LinkedIn, social platforms, email, and more Marketing strategy: Product-led Growth (PLG), Community marketing, Influencer marketing, micro influencers Created in partnership with Share Your Genius An award-winning podcast pr
Episodes
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Here’s What Exactly to Do When You Feel Like a Failed Marketer
Did you just get fired? Spend a bunch of money on a marketing project or campaign that didn’t work? It can feel like marketing failures are happening today at a higher rate than ever before. Markets are changing; buyer’s processes, decision-making, and budgets are in flux; and companies are...
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Let’s Just Say the Things We’re Most Terrified of Talking About: We’ll Go First
We're even less filtered than normal in our Season 3 finale, so buckle up: we’re talking about our challenges with gender inequity, patterns of entrenched misogyny, societal expectations, unhealthy boundaries, and reflections on how our careers are viewed by others in the industry. Big life…
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Why Investors, Boards, CEOs Are Marketers’ Real Target Audience
What if we started looking at marketing as a business growth strategy instead of a promotional department? Devin and Margaret discuss the role Marketing plays in fundraising and investor board meetings. They explore how the current startup investing structure only widens the trust gap between…
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What Are CEO & Founders’ Biggest Marketing Problems Right Now? Questions from Our Network
Q4 has begun, and the year is coming to a close. But you’re in overwhelm—from setting new goals for next year, setting the big vision for your strategy, and oh yeah—finishing out this year strong. But that overwhelm and busyness is not new to the B2B tech world. Some of the problems that rear…
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The Truman Show-like Experiment Playing Out in B2B with Rachel Downey
😱WHAT. A GUEST?! 😱 We said we weren’t doing an interview show, but we did need a hand with this week’s topic: how do visual mediums help achieve business growth, and what role do executives and team members outside the marketing team play in modern marketing strategy? Rachel Downey, CEO and...
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In a Darwinian Tech Economy, CEOs Need Business Strategy Not Playbooks
Newsflash: your lifeboat has a hole in it. Oh, and that life vest you’re wearing—lol. It doesn’t help when you’re sinking into an ocean of lava. No, we’re not talking about the apocalypse, we’re talking about what it takes to make your company survive in 2024 and beyond. If you’re reaching for...
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A Babel of Buzzwords is How Marketers Created a Category of Chaos (and other stories)
Confusion. Miscommunication. Misunderstandings. That’s what happens when marketers and business leaders use too many buzzwords. YET WE ALL KEEP USING THEM (us, too). Chaos agents disguised as trendy trifles that we claim to aid in communicating our marketing plans and getting buy-in from CEOs,...
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BONUS: Candy Corn, Wolf Dorks, & Why Marketers Don’t Need to Fear a Solo Career
We’ve got a sweet treat for you this week: a deep dive into Halloween candy, horror movies, and a deep analysis into how much Margaret pumpkin spice lattes in the fall vs summer months. …And we continue our convo about the marketing gig economy and how fear-based decisions are causing marketers…
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Is Marketing the New Gig Economy?
Times of chaos can be huge opportunities for companies who are open to thinking outside the playbooks and frameworks they’re familiar with. Leaders who approach current industry and economic challenges with curiosity and bravery will find themselves uniquely positioned to win. It’s time to get...
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Is Old School Networking Coming Back? In These Uncertain Times, Community is Our Unlikely Hero
Moments of chaos are moments of opportunity. That is your marketing mantra heading into 2024. In this conversation, Devin and Margaret cut through the chaos that is the present-day marketing landscape to offer marketing leaders a bit of clarity. The key to your company’s strategic growth may not…
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What Do You Actually Want From Your Job?
Most of us used the wrong criteria when we evaluated job opportunities at some point in our careers. You know what they are: reactive, emotion-driven departures. Being lured by pay without evaluating the health of the company. Taking a lateral move at a company based on a promise that - if we…
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BONUS: Our Recap of HubSpot's Inbound Conference
Did you attend this year’s HubSpot Inbound conference? Whether you did or not, Devin and Margaret are here to break down the highlights of everyone's favorite marketing conference. What did they take away? What was their favorite part? (And maybe even spill a little tea about where they leave…
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You’re Thinking About Marketing Data Wrong
Is the marketing industry better or worse off in today’s day and age based on the fact that we have access to more data than we could ever possibly report on? They share stories of the good and bad ways they’ve seen data used to adjust marketing programs, the power of data in marketing...
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Breaking Down Buzzwords: the Good, the Bad, and the ‘Sexy’
We asked, you answered. What are your least favorite marketing jargon terms? Sourced from our loyal community on LinkedIn, hosts Devin Bramhall and Margaret Kelsey discuss some of the most used marketing terms in the industry today, challenging marketers and executives to move beyond “strategic”...
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Why Can't Sales and Marketing Get Along?
We’re back for season 3 with a topic sent in by a listener: the relationship between sales and marketing. Fraught relationship or not, there is so much opportunity and growth when these teams are aligned. So why is it so hard to make that happen? Devin and Margaret challenge leaders to bridge the...
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BONUS: Peeling Back the Podcast Curtain with Rachel Downey from Share Your Genius
In this bonus episode, Devin Bramhall and Margaret Kelsey sit down with Rachel Downey, CEO and Founder of Share Your Genius (their production company) to reflect back on how the podcast came to be, how transformative it has been for themselves and their personal brands, and how this podcast has...
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BONUS: How Many Times Did We Say "Content" in Season 2?
We’re back with a bonus episode to hold you over until season 3 drops in September of 2023! What are your guesses for how many times our hosts Devin and Margaret said the word “content” during season 2? Hint, it’s over 50. 🤯 Devin and Margaret reveal the total number and more in this episode,...
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BONUS: Marketing in a Down Economy from Exit Five
Here’s a bonus episode where our host, Margaret Kelsey, joined Exit Five, hosted by Dave Gerhardt. Layoffs, budget cuts, slower sales cycles, and a lack of urgency to buy your product right now. That's become normal in B2B SaaS over the last two quarters. But what does it mean for marketer? Do...
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Why Don't CEOs and Marketers Get Along?
The relationship between Founders/CEOs and their heads of marketing is broken. The Boss doesn’t understand how marketing works, so they micromanage their marketing leaders into poor performance. Marketing leaders struggle to communicate value because much of their work isn’t tied directly to...
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Lessons in Maximizing Your Motivation
Have you ever had one of those days where you just don't feel like doing anything? Or maybe a deadline is looming, but it's not quite here yet, so you're putting it off? You just can’t seem to make your brain do what it needs to? Devin and Margaret jump into their shared insights into what...
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Are You a Content Marketing Grifter?
The Year is 2014. The article title is 7 Tips For Cooking The Perfect Marry-Me Chicken. You wade past the thick veil of misogyny, but the stench of grifting just won’t go away. The first tip is to Check Your Local Grocery Store For Sales, with an affiliate link listing nearby sale produce. Flash...
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Your Content Strategy is Outdated
The market has rapidly evolved over the last few years. What worked 5 years ago isn’t working as well as it used to, and we’re seeing signs of more “traditional marketing” fading into the background in the B2B space. So what can we do to increase our chances of success? Where is the future of...
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Stop Bringing Your Whole Self to Work
The People-First movement in workplace culture has risen in popularity over the past several years and ushered in the concept of bringing your “whole self” to work. It aims to prioritize the well-being and satisfaction of employees. But does bringing your whole self to work truly benefit you and...
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So, You’re in the Job Market…
Over the past 5 years—and especially in 2023—hiring in every industry has been turned upside down. Marketers want to know what has changed, and what has stayed the same. What goes on behind the scenes of hiring the best marketers? How do marketing execs evaluate cover letters and resumes? What…
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You Should Play More
The world of creativity is multifaceted. How do you tap into it? How do you use it effectively? And how do you enjoy it? B2B marketing execs Margaret Kelsey (VP of Marketing at OpenView, Director of Brand and Creative at InVision) and Devin Bramhall (former CEO of Animalz, Director of Content at...
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BONUS: From Content Manager To CEO: The Future Of AI And Content, And How Marketers Need To Evolve
It's bonus episode time! Our host, Devin Bramhall joined David Khim, Co-Founder of Omniscent Digital, on Onmiscent's podcast, The Long Game. They discuss Devin's rise from content manager to CEO, the future of AI, content marketing, and leadership lessons, where Devin reflects on lessons learned...
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Founders and Marketers: The Worst Situationship
Why can founders and CEOs let marketers do their jobs? From cutting marketing projects mid-flight, to not clearly defining goals or changing KPIs on a whim, founders and CEOs continue to mettle in marketing. Why does this keep happening? Last season we talked about what’s wrong with marketers and...
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Everyone is Saying Community, But What is it?
What if community wasn't a strategy? What if a community was part of your business model? What if it was just part of doing business? Community isn’t just about building a customer feedback loop or customer support center. And more importantly, it’s not a place to spread your message like a...
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"High Quality" Content Isn't Real
Quality content is a north star for companies, founders, CEOs and marketers alike. But few agree on what “quality” means. Those who do have a definition are often missing important criteria that can lead to ineffective marketing content that flops despite following their “quality” rules. Quality…
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Wait, Why Are We Podcasting?
Getting behind the mic and discussing industry trends, professional (and personal) growth, and sharing their stories has led to a lot of learnings and even more growth for our hosts, Devin and Margaret. In this episode, they reflect on what they’ve learned and where this podcast journey has taken...
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Fear is Your Frenemy. Make it Your Friend
When left unresolved, fear keeps us from being productive, connecting with others, and ultimately from personal and career growth. It also never goes away and in fact, can become an even bigger obstacle as you progress in your career. Whether you work for yourself, run a team or a company, fear...
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Killing Your Darlings
Killing your darlings. Creative constraints. Narrowing scope. In this episode, Devin and Margaret face the challenge of focus—how to create focus for your team without stifling creativity? How do you relinquish control to your direct reports and peers so you can focus on the bigger picture? High...
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Rage Against Frameworks and Playbooks
Instead of frameworks and playbooks, let’s talk about how culture, brand, content, and community intertwine to create a successful marketing strategy. In this episode, Devin and Margaret remind us that marketing isn’t always about numbers and tactics. What really makes marketing departments...
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Marketing Leadership Blindspots
Remember when you felt like your boss just “didn’t get it”? They didn’t understand your constraints, your blockers, how much you are doing? It turns out, when YOU then become a boss, despite your best intentions, it’s easy to make those same mistakes. How come? One contributor is that you’re...
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Yes, and-ing personal brand
In this episode, we're exploring how the evolution of personal brand in B2B is changing everything from strategy to roles to team structure. Plus Margaret and Devin share their very different personal brand experiences. Plus, Futurist Astrologer, Jenn Hirsch, shares her take on personal branding…
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What do the job market, viral LinkedIn posts, and quiet quitting have in common?
In this episode, Devin and Margaret discuss the wet blanket trend of marketers complaining about work. From quiet quitting to rage applying, they are totally bored by this macro passive-aggressive trend and can’t wait for marketers to start creating again. Devin and Margaret look back on the…
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Introducing Don't Say Content
Welcome to Don’t Say Content, a new podcast hosted by Devin Bramhall and Margaret Kelsey. Are you a: —a leader of people? —creative-minded individual? —someone who enjoys a good spicy take? Every Tuesday Devin and Margaret say what’s really on their minds about the marketing industry. After over…
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ABOUT THIS SHOW
The marketing and business strategy podcast that executives and marketing leaders can't stop talking about.
Marketing veterans Devin Bramhall (Animalz, Help Scout) & Margaret Kelsey (InVision, OpenView) use their combined 20+ years of experience to increase the business impact of marketing by creating shared understanding of its purpose and outcomes among marketing leaders, founders/CEOs & others in the C-suite.
No tactics, playbooks, guides, or interviews with smart people (or anyone). Just in-depth conversations about B2B marketing behind the scenes:
Communicating value of marketing to executives and founders
Managing marketing teams
Trends in B2B marketing: AI, TikTok, YouTube, LinkedIn, social platforms, email, and more
Marketing strategy: Product-led Growth (PLG), Community marketing, Influencer marketing, micro influencers
Created in partnership with Share Your Genius
An award-winning podcast pr
HOSTED BY
Devin Bramhall & Margaret Kelsey
CATEGORIES
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Frequently Asked Questions
How many episodes does Don't Say Content have?
Don't Say Content currently has 40 episodes available on PodParley. New episodes are automatically indexed when they're published to the podcast feed.
What is Don't Say Content about?
The marketing and business strategy podcast that executives and marketing leaders can't stop talking about. Marketing veterans Devin Bramhall (Animalz, Help Scout) & Margaret Kelsey (InVision, OpenView) use their combined 20+ years of experience to increase the business impact of marketing by...
How often does Don't Say Content release new episodes?
Don't Say Content has 40 episodes. Check the episode list to see recent publication dates and frequency.
Where can I listen to Don't Say Content?
You can listen to Don't Say Content on PodParley by clicking any episode. We provide an embedded audio player for direct listening, and you can also subscribe via your preferred podcast app using the RSS feed.
Who hosts Don't Say Content?
Don't Say Content is created and hosted by Devin Bramhall & Margaret Kelsey.
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