The Holy Wild with Victoria Loorz

In this conversation, Victoria Loorz speaks with Dr. Martin Shaw, mythologist, storyteller, wilderness rites-of-passage guide, and author of seventeen books, including his latest New York Times bestseller, Liturgies of the Wild: Myths That Make Us. Dr. Shaw is the director of the Westcountry School of Myth and founder of the Oral Tradition and Mythic Life courses at Stanford University.Together, they explore the tension between wildness and discipline, myth and religion, exile and return. The conversation wanders through Dartmoor folklore, Orthodox liturgy, the role of beauty and ritual in a disenchanted age, and the deep hunger many people feel for forms of spirituality rooted in mystery, embodiment, and the living world. Martin reflects candidly on what has quietly shifted in him since reconnecting  with the Christian story the spiritual consequences of disconnection from land, and a story that didn’t make the final cut of his book — one that illuminates the challenge of this moment: how to ride the "age of the wolf" with courage and faith.Connect with Martin:Website: drmartinshaw.comWebsite: schoolofmythopoetics.comBook: Liturgies of the Wild: Myths That Make UsBook: ScatterlingsMentioned in the episode:Book: The Great Emergence by Phyllis TickleVideo: Ivan and the Grey WolfConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:00:00 — Introduction06:03 — Interview Begins10:56 — Re-exploring The Old Stories13:47 — Living Fidelity of Place18:24 — Discipline of the Wild20:42 — What’s Our Current Story?24:41 — The Age of the Wolf28:31 — The Religious Has a Place31:22 — Eastern Orthodox Expressions34:06 — How Jesus Changes Love39:05 — Martin’s Wild Threshold42:03 — Wild Invitation43:36 — Credits

In this conversation, Victoria Loorz speaks with Dr. Peter Kalmus, astrophysicist-turned-climate scientist, NASA researcher, author, and activist. Peter's radical integrity has taken him from searching for gravitational waves to growing his own food, refusing to fly for twelve years, and chaining himself to doors in acts of civil disobedience.Together, they explore the layers of grief that come with truly loving a planet in crisis and the spiritual disconnection underlying ecological destruction. What does it mean to love the planet not as a cause but as a being? What might it look like to move from the urgency of fixing into the slower, harder work of reconnection? The conversation also wanders into meditation, ego death, the empathy required to grieve a forest, and the strange fertility of not knowing — inviting us to consider that staying in the unknowing may itself be a spiritual practice. This conversation is for anyone sitting with the unknowing of this moment, and wondering if that might, somehow, be exactly where they need to be.Connect with Peter:Website: peterkalmus.netBook: Being the Change: Live Well and Spark a Climate Revolution by Peter KalmusSubstack: Climate HumanMentioned in the episode:Movie: Don't Look UpConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:00:00 — Introduction05:16 — Interview Begins09:07 — The Choice To Not Fly12:50 — Integrity Through Life Experiment15:54 — Layers of Integrity Under Systems17:11 — Civil Disobedience22:33 — Unmoored23:52 — The Discipline of Meditation26:09 — Disconnection Belongs In The Cycle28:12 — The Holy Local Tribe30:20 — Aging Into Eldership33:18 — Grounding Practices39:33 — Loving Kindness For Yourself42:57 — Trail Encounter with the Universe45:36 — Encounter with Ego Death48:51 — Expansive Meditation Encounter53:08 — Wild Invitation54:50 — Credits

In this conversation, Victoria Loorz speaks with Dr. Vanessa Wijngaarden, social anthropologist and founder of ANICOM, a European research project exploring intuitive interspecies communication across cultures and contexts. Vanessa reflects on her years living with Maasai communities in East Africa, where immersive fieldwork cracked open a radically relational way of seeing the world, rooted in the cosmology of Osotua, a word meaning "umbilical cord," in which who you are is defined entirely by your relationships. Together they explore what it might mean if animals, land, and the more than human world have something urgent and necessary to say to us right now, and whether we still have the capacity to hear them. Vanessa's research brings together indigenous knowledge holders, professional animal communicators, and hard scientists to ask whether other beings might be participants in knowledge making rather than objects of study. The answers emerging are surprising, humbling, and full of hope — and why recovering our ancient capacity to truly listen across species may be one of the most profound spiritual and scientific invitations of our time.Connect with Vanessa:Vanessa's Website: vanessawijngaarden.comANICOM's Website: anicom.uliege.beFilm: Maasai Speak Back (Trailer)Article (osotua): Wijngaarden, V. & Paul Nkoitoi Ole Murero. 2023. Osotua and decolonizing the academe: Implications of a Maasai concept. In: Curriculum Perspectives 43(Suppl 1): 33-46. Special Issue: Narrowing the Gap Beyond Tokenism: Transdisciplinary Search for Innovative Approaches in the Integration of Indigenous Knowledge Systems and Epistemologies in Higher Education. DOI : 10.1007/s41297-023-00190-2. Abstract and full textArticle: Wijngaarden, Vanessa In print. Secularization and decolonization of the academe: In conversation with African faiths and knowledges. In: The Palgrave Handbook of Decolonising Knowledge in Africa.Article (lion and cat): Wijngaarden, Vanessa 2023. Interviewing animals through animal communicators: Potentials of intuitive interspecies communication for multispecies methods. In: Society and Animals 32 (5/6): 519-539. DOI: 10.1163/15685306-bja10122. Full textMentioned in the episode:Wiki: Maasai MaraBook: The Little Soul and the Sun by Neale Donald WalschConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:00:00 — Introduction03:58 — Interview Begins05:39 — The Land Who Raised Vanessa08:30 — Osotua11:19 — Building Trust in Relationship16:56 — Humpback Whale Encounter17:52 — Wallaby Encounter18:26 — Fasting During Deer Encounter20:23 — Normalizing Relationship21:13 — Research in Animal Communication25:17 — Starting with the Experiential26:31 — Unseparating Professional and Personal31:05 — ANICOM34:44 — Lion Says36:09 — The Theme of the Alive World38:38 — Intuitive Interspecies Communication or IIC39:23 — Conversation with a House Cat43:08 — Restoration of Trust and Earth Power51:01 — Victoria Falls Tourists54:12 — Wonder in the Mountains55:24 — Elephant Encounter57:24 — Changing the Ethics of Relational Research61:39 — Reciprocity of Approach66:03 — Next Threshold68:51 — Real and True71:49 — Wild Invitation74:38 — Credits

In this one-year anniversary episode of The Holy Wild, Victoria Loorz is joined by producer Stephen Henning for a reflective conversation marking the close of Season One and the threshold of what’s next. Together, they revisit the heart of the podcast, sacred conversation as a living practice, and explore how a year of dialogue has deepened their understanding of relationship with the more-than-human world. Along the way, they reflect on the challenge of language itself, and how learning to speak, however imperfectly, about encounters with the holy and the wild is part of restoring those relationships.The conversation then explores the Seminary of the Wild Earth journey and the invitation it offers, not as a program to complete, but as a container for transformation through practice, community, and deepening relationship with place. Victoria and Stephen reflect on the process of discernment for those considering entering this immersive year of rewilding. They explore what it means to feel the pull toward this work, what it asks of those who say yes, and how to recognize whether this is the right season to step more fully into a life shaped by the holy wild.Connect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:0:00 Introduction2:34 Welcoming in Our Neighbors5:08 Reflecting on Season 111:27 Languaging About Language20:39 Seminary of the Wild25:24 Midroll25:57 Rhythms of the Seminary34:09 Discerning the Call of the Holy Wild40:23 Stephen’s Dream of White Crow53:07 Sacred Invitation54:32 Credits

In this conversation, Victoria Loorz speaks with Daniel Cooperrider, writer, ecotheologian, and pastor of Flicker Wild Church in Madison, Wisconsin, and author of Speak with the Earth and It Will Teach You and the forthcoming Live Each Season as It Passes. Daniel reflects on what he calls his lifelong “ecological conversion” and on the growing Wild Church movement, which is reimagining wild spiritual with community through outdoor gatherings rooted in the land, the seasons, and relationship with the more than human world.Together, they explore what it means to practice a “liturgy of the land” through outdoor spiritual community, seasonal ritual, and what Daniel calls “campsite thinking,” a way of gathering that embraces impermanence and presence rather than institutional permanence. The dialogue also reflects on earth empathy, mortality, and how sacred practices like communion and baptism might be reimagined through deeper relationship with water, landscape, and place, inviting us to rediscover our place within a living Earth.Connect with Daniel:Personal Website: danielcooperrider.comFlicker WC Website: flickerwildchurch.orgInstagram: @greatlakeswanderersFirst book: Speak with the Earth and It Will Teach You: A Field Guide to the BibleNext book (Pre-Order, 1 May 2026 Release): Live Each Season as It PassesMentioned in the episode:Holy Wisdom Monastery Website: holywisdommonastery.orgBook: The Hidden Life of Trees by Peter WohllebenBook: Finding the Mother Tree by Suzanne SimardBook: The Overstory by Richard PowersBook: Braiding Sweetgrass by Robin Wall KimmererConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:00:00 — Introduction05:09 — Interview Begins06:37 — Daniel’s Ecological Conversion08:58 — Inviting In Daniel’s Neighbors10:14 — Hearing the Call of Seasonality14:06 — Welcoming Victoria’s Neighbors14:46 — Flicker Wild Church15:51 — Cathedral and Campsite Thinking19:39 — Holding Space with Mortality23:32 — Availing and Allying27:10 — Kinship All the Way Up and All the Way Down27:47 — Midroll: Wild Church Network28:41 — The Waves of Possibility31:52 — Ancient Wisdoms Integrating with Technology35:14 — Finding and Becoming Indigenous38:28 — Re-Story-ing Our Place42:45 — Engaging the Rituals of Aliveness46:01 — A Sabbatical of Water Spirituality49:02 — Closing50:48 — Wild Invitation52:58 — Credits

In this conversation, Victoria Loorz speaks with legal scholar César Rodríguez-Garavito, founding director of MOTH (More Than Human Life) at NYU School of Law and a leading voice in multispecies justice. César has led landmark climate change, rights of nature, and Indigenous rights cases, including serving on the Science Panel for the Amazon and as an expert witness before the Inter-American Court of Human Rights.Together, they delve into César’s collaboration with Project CETI, which uses AI and non invasive technologies to study sperm whale communication. They explore the audacious possibility that whales might one day be heard in court not as property or evidence, but as subjects with legally recognized voices and interests. At its core, this dialogue is about dismantling human supremacy, crafting ethical guardrails for emerging technologies, and midwifing a shift from dominance to kinship.Connect with Cesar:Website: mothlife.orgPodcast: Crossing The RiverMentioned in the episode:Ecology Law Quarterly Journal (2025 Publication): What if We Understood What Animals Are Saying?: The Legal Impact of AI-Assisted Studies of Animal CommunicationOrganization: CETINYU Article: Marine Biologists Are Using AI to Decode Whale Speech. NYU Law Scholars Are Exploring What That Means for Animals’ Legal RightsThe New Yorker Article: Can We Talk To Whales?Plus: The New Yorker Companion VideoNYU Article: MOTH Unveils New Framework for Nonhuman Animal Communication TechnologiesPEPP (Prepare, Engage, Prevent, Protect) Framework: Nonhuman Animal Communication TechnologiesCity of Ojai Ordinance No. 940Book: An Immense World - How Animal Senses Reveal the Hidden Realms Around Us by Ed YongConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:00:00 – Introduction07:35 – Interview Begins08:16 – Formed By Columbia10:52 – Spiritual Formation11:50 – Learning the Language of Sperm Whales14:44 – Expanding The Understanding of More Than Human18:41 – Letting the Whales Testify For Themselves21:17 – The Birthing Rings of Sperm Whales26:28 – Gentle Technology and Ethical Guidelines32:19 – Imagining the Future of Multispecies Justice38:59 – How To Connect41:45 – Wild Invitation43:37 – Credits

In this conversation, Victoria Loorz connects with speaker, writer, and mentor Mac Macartney, founder of Embercombe, a UK educational charity and 50-acre retreat and rewilding site dedicated to the flourishing future of all species. In Victoria’s words, Mac is one of our generation’s true elders. He speaks from decades of lived apprenticeship, shaped by not fitting the dominant culture, by failure that became a gift, and by a lifelong search for home. His voice carries the embodied wisdom of someone who has moved through exile, betrayal, and the seduction of power, and chosen integrity.Mac reflects on decades of learning and on the unlearning required to remember the value of the miracle we were born into. He speaks of decency over brilliance, of integrity in the face of power, and of offering one’s gifts for the sake of future generations. At its heart, this is a conversation about integrity, about remaining in the field as long as one is able, and about creating places where there is no hiding truth.Connect with Mac:Website: macmacartney.comTalk Video: The Children's FireMentioned in the episode:Organization: The Earth Elders theearthelders.orgConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:00:00 – Introduction05:15 – Interview Begins12:09 – Embercombe18:57 – Finding the Teachings We Need24:30 – Letting the Gurus Go26:58 – The Cycles of Human Becoming29:53 – Born Into Cosmic Ceremony32:14 – The Grief of Worldview Shifts34:48 – Visited by Earth Elders40:22 – A Benediction for Being Human44:11 – Wild Invitation46:12 – Credits

In this conversation, Victoria Loorz is joined by Barnaby Steel, artist and co-founder of Marshmallow Laser Feast, an experiential art collective devoted to awakening the senses and expanding perception through multisensory exhibits. Together, they explore how art, science, and imagination engage the illusion of separation, and how even controversial technologies like AI might be held in ways that deepen relationship rather than fragment it. In a time when technology often distracts and numbs, the conversation asks a different question: what if our tools could help us remember how to sense, feel, and belong in relationship?Barnaby reflects on the roots of his creative life, shaped by deep observation, risk, and a willingness to let go. He shares stories about the collaborative experiences created when artists work with advanced technologies to translate scientific insight into lived experiences that extend our senses beyond their usual limits and inviting a felt experience of interconnection with breath, trees, sound, and the human body. Weaving themes of perception, ritual, grief, and awe, the episode considers immersive art as a modern rite of passage, not as an escape from the world, but as a return to it with softened defenses and renewed devotion to relationship.Connect with Barnaby:Website: marshmallowlaserfeast.comInstagram: @marshmallowlaserfeastLinkedIn: @marshmallowlaserfeastNewsletter Signup: mailchi.mp/marshmallowlaserfeast/newsletter-signupMentioned in the episode:Book: Existence, A Story by David HintonVideo: Richard Feynman's story of "What's the name of a bird?"White Mirror - The Sensory Wellness Agency Website: whitemirror.studioVideo: Samuel Barber - Adagio for StringsConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:00:00 — Introduction06:57 — Interview Begins08:24 — The Land That Raised Barnaby11:17 — Existence Tissue15:19 — Marshmallow Laser Feast23:01 — Physical Reality Is Spiritual Reality32:51 — How Experience Shifts Us37:34 — Caring for Self Is Caring for All41:40 — Virtual Reality & Expanding Empathy45:56 — Changing Perception49:26 — Patterns of Consciousness53:19 — Falling in Love57:11 — A Wild Invitation58:58 — Credits

In this conversation, Victoria Loorz is joined by Rachel Fleming, climate scientist, former Environment Agency policy advisor, writer, educator, and part of the Animate Earth founding circle. Together they explore modern animism, the remembering of the “common wild tongue,” and what it means to rebuild intimacy with a living, intelligent world. Rachel shares her journey bridging climate science, holistic ecology, and spiritual practice, reflecting on the limits of purely technical or policy-based responses to ecological collapse. Through stories of place, trees, and faithful return, the conversation traces the long human exile from belonging and the quiet emergence of a different way of being human rooted in listening, love, and relationship. Weaving themes of grief, beauty, ancestral memory, and hope, this episode invites listeners to remember that transformation rarely begins with grand solutions, but with simple, devoted acts of attention that restore our capacity to speak with and listen to the living world.Connect with Rachel:Website: animate-earth.orgSubstack: The Common Wild TongueMentioned in the episode:Stephan Harding pioneering Holistic ScienceColin Campbell: colincampbell.co.zaMonica Gagliano: monicagagliano.comAnna Breytenbach: animalspirit.orgOxford Real Farming Conference: orfc.org.ukNathanial Hughs & The School of Intuitive Herbalism: schoolofintuitiveherbalism.weedsintheheart.org.ukPatrick MacManaway-The Land Whisperer: patrickmacmanaway.comDr. Lyla June Johnson: lylajune.comConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:07:26 – Interview begins with invocation10:18 – The mountain that raised Rachel14:37 – How Rachel comes to this work through science19:57 – Holistic science21:33 – Animate Earth25:59 – The common wild tongue31:10 – Bridging “woo”35:09 – It is actually simple38:20 – Evolution is a spiral42:49 – The importance of subtle work44:48 – Needed medicine47:19 – Interconnection goes so deep48:42 – The heart field51:55 – Neighbor ash tree55:38 – Rachel’s work57:54 – Invitation to advocacy59:53 – Credits

In this conversation, Debra Rienstra, PhD, author of Refugia Faith and professor of English at Calvin University, joins Victoria Loorz to explore refugia, a biological term for small pockets of life that survive widespread environmental stress and become sources of regeneration after collapse. Debra invites us to imagine these protected pockets are also in our communities as forms of sanctuary amid increasingly uninhabitable social, spiritual, and ecological conditions. Together, they reflect on how small gatherings rooted in love for the land can counter paralysis in the face of global crisis and rewild our sense of vocation and voice. They explore the spiritual risk of loving places we may not own or keep, while naming how restoration begins through intimate, connected acts of care that allow life to persist and return.Connect with Debra:Website: debrarienstra.comBook: Refugia Faith: Seeking Hidden Shelters, Ordinary Wonders, and the Healing of the EarthNewsletter: refugianewsletter.substack.comUpcoming Book: Refugia Church (January 2027)Mentioned in the episode:Book: Great Tide Rising: Towards Clarity and Moral Courage in a time of Planetary Change by Kathleen Dean MooreOrganization: blackchurchfoodsecurity.netBook: Here Comes the Sun: A Last Chance for the Climate and a Fresh Chance for Civilization by Bill McKibbenEncyclical Letter Laudato Si' of the Holy Father Francis on Care For Our Common HomeEncyclical Letter Fratelli Tutti of the Holy Father Francis on Fraternity and Social FriendshipConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:00:00 — Introduction03:48 — Refugia08:58 — Finding My Small Work11:44 — Deciding the Work Based on Context14:33 — Examples of Human Refugia20:21 — From Passivity to Citizenship24:21 — Loving Places That Are Only Yours for a Time29:36 — Choosing to Belong31:59 — Grieving Reality Together34:18 — Mitigation and Adaptation40:02 — A Kalo Farmer in Relationship With the Land43:04 — The Book of Nature & Pantheism Paranoia46:30 — The Wild Edge50:03 — Wild Invitation53:24 — Credits

In this conversation, author of Earth and Soul: Reconnecting Amid Climate Chaos, speaker, retreat leader and longtime spiritual formation guide Leah Rampy joins Victoria Loorz to explore spirituality as a lived relationship to the natural world—where trees are kin, not symbols, and reciprocity replaces extraction. Leah reflects on her journey from corporate life into a decolonizing spirituality & leadership rooted in ecological belonging, sharing stories of black walnut trees, Wild Church as a practice of community and communion, and the slow unlayering of protective armor. Together, they reflect on how awe and grief must be held together, how the deepest forms of communion exceed language, and how remembering ourselves as part of a living, interwoven world can restore wholeness in a time of collective unraveling.Connect with Leah:Website: leahmoranrampy.comBook: Earth and SoulBook: Discovering the Spiritual Wisdom of TreesMentioned in the episode:Shalem InstituteConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:00:00 — Introduction02:57 — Interview begins04:36 — Leah’s background07:30 — A calling to educate11:38 — The power of storytelling13:20 — The black walnut tree17:05 — Decolonizing the soul20:33 — Communication in community23:26 — Seeking to know how we cause harm27:05 — Bearing witness28:39 — Church of the Wild: Two Rivers33:59 — Love beyond words35:08 — Communion37:26 — Trees as ancient teachers of life41:34 — Giving and receiving46:33 — A wandering invitation48:38 — Credits

In this conversation, Certified Soul Level Animal Communicators and grief-intuitive coaches from The Animal Communication Collective (ACC)—Julie Hirt, Karen Dendy Smith, and Meredith Tollison—offer a vivid picture of animal communication as a soul-to-soul exchange that restores trust, deepens wholeness, and opens doorways to healing and transformation. They demystify why losing an animal often breaks us open more than losing a human, explore how animals help surface grief we have long buried, and share stories from clients who continue receiving guidance through images, humor, sensations, and inner knowing even after their animals have crossed the veil. The trio also reflect on how each of them slowly found their way back to the sacred after religious trauma, supported by magnolia trees, ocean wind, and the quiet companionship of the animals who stayed close to them. You can hear more from Julie, Karen, and Meredith on their own podcast, The Animal Communication podcast. Connect with The Animal Communicators:Website: animalcommunicationcollective.comPodcast: theanimalcommunicationpodcast.comJulie: juliehirt-intuitive.comKaren: karendendysmith.comMeredith: meredithtollison.comMentioned in the episode:Book: All Creatures Great and Small by James HerriotBook: Opal- The Journal of an Understanding Heart by Opal WhiteleyFigure: Anna Breytenbach @ animalspirit.orgConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:00:00 — Introduction05:32 — Interview begins06:23 — Introducing Julie06:51 — Introducing Karen07:45 — Introducing Meredith08:28 — Unconditional love & authenticity13:33 — Julie’s grief origins16:02 — Karen’s grief origins17:41 — Meredith’s grief origins19:21 — Grief unlocked by companion animals22:34 — The felt sense of animals in spirit26:27 — The claires / intuitive senses30:48 — Accessing the sacred31:38 — Julie’s spiritual upbringing34:29 — Karen’s spiritual upbringing36:13 — Meredith’s spiritual upbringing38:21 — Reconnecting words41:34 — Why grief feels different with animals43:37 — Loss rituals44:44 — The “placeness” of animals54:38 — The animal communication collective56:43 — Wild invitation58:09 — Credits

In this conversation with Victoria Loorz, Randy Woodley shares stories from his Cherokee lineage, his mother’s deep communion with plants and animals, and his decades of land based ministry at Eloheh Farm. Together they explore why many today stand on the "inside and outside edges" of the Christian story, the collapse of institutional religion, and how Creator often works through seasons of chaos. Woodley describes this era as a time of composting, where old systems break down so more relational and grounded ways of being can emerge. He invites listeners to let go of rigid categories and doctrines and return to what he calls our original human vocation: co-sustaining the community of creation through simple acts of love, reciprocity, and right relationship, where meals become communion, tending becomes prayer, and all beings are kin.Rev. Dr. Randy Woodley, Ph.D., is a farmer, activist scholar, speaker, teacher, and Indigenous wisdom keeper whose work spans spirituality, justice, culture, racial diversity, regenerative farming, and our relationship with the Earth. Connect with Randy: Book: Becoming Rooted: One Hundred Days of Reconnecting with Sacred EarthBook: How Western Christian Got It Wrong (Forthcoming)Substack: @rwoodley7Personal Website: randywoodley.comEloheh Website: eloheh.orgMentioned in the episode:Documentary: The Year The Earth ChangedConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:00:00 – Introduction06:35 – Interview Starts08:14 – The Land Who Raised Randy10:08 – Academy Experience11:53 – Eloheh12:50 – Bridging Across the Edges15:09 – Widespread Abandonment of Institutionalized Western Religion19:05 – Replacing the Programs with Relationship23:56 – Co-Sustainers27:06 – Finding New Language31:15 – Becoming Rooted35:33 – Repairing the Separations37:57 – Seeds Are Our Treasure39:29 – The War on Indigenous Lands41:58 – Create Human Rights for the Earth43:40 – Sacred Clowns46:14 – Sacred Invitation

Biologist, biosemiotician, philosopher, and author of Matter and Desire: An Erotic Ecology, Andreas Weber, PhD, joins Victoria Loorz for a heartfelt conversation about reality as a sacred, living process of relationship - the continual desire to give life and what the heart knows as love. Together they explore how trauma causes us to forget our wholeness and how true healing is an act of remembering. Drawing on Sufi mysticism and the writings of Erich Fromm, Weber describes love as “the interest in the aliveness of the other” and names this time of global unraveling as a painful yet essential gift calling us to live in truth. Through stories of rivers, trees, & animals, he reveals how the more-than-human world restores trust, belonging, and courage. Blending science, mysticism, and deep ecology, you're invited you to sit with the living world, listen with an open heart, and remember that you are love, embodied and alive.Dr Andreas Weber is a biologist, philosopher, and poet and teaches ecophilosophy and ecological aesthetics at the Berlin University of the Arts. He holds degrees in marine biology and cultural studies, earned his PhD in philosophy in with a dissertation titled in English “Nature as Meaning: An Attempt at a Semiotic Theory of the Living” .Connect with Andreas: Book: Matter and Desire: An Erotic Ecology by Andreas WeberConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:0:00 — Introduction5:54 — Interview7:03 — Living Through Trauma and Pain10:38 — We Exist Only as Love13:32 — Dissolving at the Shore18:20 — Meeting Victoria’s More-Than-Human Neighbors19:58 — Defining the Sacred22:39 — Love Is the Interest in the Aliveness of the Other24:10 — Two Sides of Gifts27:37 — Our Era of Dying May Be a Gift31:37 — Religios Is Remembering It Has Always Been One35:43 — Resistance as Simply Truth39:27 — Truths About You and Your Heart47:56 — Wandering Invitation

In this episode of The Holy Wild, Scottish author and activist Alastair McIntosh explores the spiritual, historical, and ecological roots of our collective crisis of belonging. Grounded in the history of the Highland Clearances, he offers this chapter of Scotland’s past as a lens for understanding global patterns of displacement, from the enslavement of African peoples to the colonization of Indigenous lands and the refugees of our own time. He reveals how being unsettled from land fractures psyche and soul. Mcintosh invites a path toward compassion through the Scottish wisdom of Caledonian antisyzygy, the capacity to hold opposites. He weaves insights on complicity in capitalism, the moral paradoxes of renewable energy and wild land, and the call to reconcile inner and outer divisions. McIntosh calls for a re-membering of what has been dismembered- to rekindle community, restore reverence for the Earth, and awaken the soul of belonging in our time.Alastair McIntosh is a Scottish writer, academic, and activist raised on the Isle of Lewis whose work spans spirituality, community, land reform, and ecology. An honorary professor at the University of Glasgow and currently serving as director of the GalGael Trust, he has been instrumental in Scottish campaigns such as the Isle of Eigg community buy-out and the defense of the Isle of Harris against a proposed mega-quarry. His most recognized book, Soil and Soul: People versus Corporate Power, stands alongside his most beautiful work, Poacher’s Pilgrimage, a twelve-day walk through the wilds and villages of his home islands of Lewis and Harris.Connect with Alastair: Website: alastairmcintosh.comBook: Soil and SoulBook: Riders On The StormBook: Poacher's PilgrimageBook: Rekindling CommunityMentioned in the episode:Book: The Unsettling of America by Wendell BerryScripture: Numbers 21:4-9Academic Journal: Theology In ScotlandConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:00:00 Introduction07:59 Interview09:47 The Spirituality of Place10:26 The Land Who Raised Alastair12:59 Community Sense for Sharing14:31 Communitarian Identity17:38 The Unsettling22:27 Mary Anne MacLeod24:44 Antisyzygy29:15 Dissecting the Scottish Wind Farm Conversation33:52 Returning to Local Thinking35:20 The Promise of Being Placed37:47 Connection with Soul39:04 Practical Expression42:58 The Darkest Times Is When the Human Spirit Comes Alive44:59 A Privilege to Live in Difficult Times45:52 The Rubric of Regeneration47:25 Alastair’s Current Work50:35 The Bronze Snake53:02 Palestine and Scotland58:31 Wild Invitation60:42 Credits

In this conversation, Victoria Loorz and pastor-activist Michael Ellick explore the lifelong dance between wilderness, spirit, and faith. Michael shares stories of his mystical childhood in the forests of Washington—his first teacher in wonder and interconnection—and how that early “forest sense” eventually brought him through disillusionment with the church into a deeper, embodied Christianity. Together they reflect on grief, reciprocity, and the call to live as part of creation rather than separate from it. From the undulating forest floor to Holy Saturday’s sacred grief, from ancient language to feminine images of the divine, this dialogue traces a hopeful reformation of faith rooted in relationship, wildness, and love.Michael Ellick is the Lead Minister at University Congregational United Church of Christ in Seattle. A former community organizer and early leader in the Occupy movement, he works to help faith communities confront racism, colonialism, and disconnection from the natural world. Trained in comparative religion, philosophy, and depth psychology, he integrates insights from Christian, Buddhist, and Indigenous traditions in his ministry and teaching.Connect with Michael: Website: universityucc.orgPodcast: Gospel of Direct ExperienceMentioned in the episode:Gary Snyder essay on reinhabitationRomans 8Gospel of ThomasConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:0:00 Introduction7:28 The Land Who Raised Michael9:20 Big Rock10:56 Forest Sense14:25 Coming Out Into the Wild15:50 Language to Speak Of18:24 What It Means to Be of a Place20:25 Swapping Image for the Real Thing22:56 Trained in Reciprocity26:10 There Is an If in Romans 830:50 Separation Is Part of It34:17 Open to Grief40:19 Trickster Coyote44:45 Shifts from the Inside Edges50:08 The New Story55:53 Wild Invitation59:34 Credits

In this conversation, Victoria Loorz and Dr. Forrest Inslee explore how Christian faith is expanding beyond human-centered concerns into a vision of beloved community that embraces all of creation. Drawing from his work with Circlewood and the Earthkeepers podcast, Forrest shares stories of churches learning to “listen to the land,” embrace ecological discipleship, and practice what he calls co-powerment—partnership rooted in humility and reciprocity. Together, they reflect on how theology, community development, and lived experience can guide us toward a new story: one where spirituality is woven through relationship with soil, water, creatures, and the wider web of life.Dr. Forrest Inslee is a teacher, ethnographer, and spiritual guide whose work bridges culture, ecology, and faith. He is Associate Director of Circlewood, where he helps cultivate communities of ecological consciousness, and also serves as a Guide with Seminary of the Wild Earth. Forrest hosts the Earthkeepers podcast, drawing on decades of experience as a professor, social entrepreneur, and cross-cultural practitioner. His life and work reflect a deep commitment to reimagining Christian faith as a practice of belonging within the whole community of creation.Connect with Forrest:Circlewood Website: circlewood.onlineEarth Keepers Podcast: earthkeepers.onlineEcological Disciple Program: ecodisciple.comMentioned in the episode:A Rocha USA Website: arocha.usBook: Plundered: The Tangled Roots of Racial and Environmental Injustice by David W SwansonBook: Engaging the Powers by Walter WinkBook: The Great Emergence: How Christianity Is Changing and Why by Phyllis TickleBook: Belonging Without Othering: How We Save Ourselves and the World by John A PowellConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:00:00 – Introduction06:06 – Community Development Beyond Human-only Needs12:35 – Stories From The Inside Edges17:24 – Creation Care Is Part of Our Heritage19:28 – Redefining Cosmos22:48 – Listening To A Triangle of Land30:03 – Co-Powerment32:12 – The Transition is Holy and Messy36:26 – The Circlewood Vision42:04 – Collaborating Without Othering43:46 – Broadening The Vision45:10 – Integrating Vocation47:56 – Forrest’s “Landscaping” Experience51:43 – Coyote59:44 – Sacred Invitation61:34 – Harold and Honeybees64:29 – Credits

In this episode of The Holy Wild, Victoria Loorz and Dr. Sheri Kling explore how personal trauma, dreamwork, and encounters with the natural world can become gateways into deeper wholeness and divine relationship. Sheri weaves process theology and Jungian psychology into lived stories of synchronicity, butterflies, and sacred encounters that remind us we are co-creators in an unfolding cosmos of meaning. What emerges is an invitation to trust the flow of becoming, where even separation is part of the holy dance that leads us back into connection with Earth, Spirit, and one another.Dr. Sheri D. Kling, Ph.D., serves as the Director of Process & Faith (a multifaith network for relational spirituality under the Center for Process Studies) and is also the interim minister of Redeemer Lutheran Church in Bradenton, Florida. She earned her doctorate in Religion: Process Studies from Claremont School of Theology and brings together theology, depth psychology, mystical wisdom traditions, relational worldviews, and the intersections of spirituality and science to help individuals find meaning, belonging, and transformation. A theologian, teacher, songwriter, and spiritual mentor, Kling is a faculty member at the Haden Institute and Claremont School of Theology (adjunct), and authored A Process Spirituality: Christian and Transreligious Resources for Transformation; she also offers courses, concerts, retreats, and dynamic “Music & Message” presentations.Connect with Sheri:Organization Website: Process and FaithBook: A Process Spirituality: A Christian and Transreligious Resources for TransformationBook: Finding Home: Rural Reflections on the Journey to WholenessProcess Pop-Up Video with Victoria LoorzMentioned in the episode:Wiki: Alfred North WhiteheadBook: Black Beauty by Anna SewellBook: Women Who Run With The Wolves: Myths and Stories of the Wild Woman Archetype by Clarissa Pinkola EstésBook: Natural Spirituality: A Handbook for Jungian Inner Work in Spiritual Community by Joyce Rockwood HudsonBook: Radical Nature: The Soul of Matter by Christian de QuinceyBook: The Archetypal Process: Self and Divine and Whitehead, Jung, and HillmanDavid GriffinBook: Memories, Dreams, Reflections by Carl JungBook: Possessing The Secret Of Joy by Alice WalkerConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:00:00 Introduction07:04 Sheri's Background, Looking For Belonging09:11 A Love Of Horses09:53 Suburban Nature And The Golf Course11:41 The North Georgia Mountains12:55 Finding Comfort In Nature From Trauma13:55 Finding The Divine Feminine14:31 Finding Home15:46 Emerging From Emotional Numbness17:46 Connecting With Jungian Work18:53 Deep Relationship With Place21:27 Introduction To Process Theology28:13 Connecting Inner Wholeness With Universal Wholeness31:44 Whitehead + Jung33:55 Dream Work And Syncronicity42:12 Transformational Practices Of Wholeness47:00 Sin And Separation As Necessary51:49 The Butterfly Pushing Out55:47 Invitation And A Story With A Chimpanzee

In this episode of The Holy Wild, Victoria Loorz speaks with Dr. Craig Chalquist as they explore how to live through collapse with open hearts, grounding in love and relationship with Earth. They speak of healing false separations between spirit and matter, human and nature, psyche and place, and how imagination, story, and synchronicity can guide us into deeper belonging. Craig shares how dreams, fiction, and encounters with the more-than-human world invite us into sacred conversation rather than despair. Together they remind us that even in times of unraveling, new stories are already emerging and calling us to co-create them.Craig Chalquist, Ph.D., Ph.D. is program director of Consciousness, Psychology, and Transformation at National University and a former associate provost and several other administrative and leadership roles. His background includes public presentations, group counseling, depth psychology, mythology, ecopsychology, terrapsychology, and philosophy and wisdom studies. He presents, publishes, and teaches at the intersection of psyche, story, nature, reenchantment, and imagination. He has published more than twenty books, including the hopeful Lamplighter Trilogy. His motto is: “Converse with everything!”Connect with Craig:Website: Chalquist.comBooks: The Lamplighter TrilogySoulmapperHeartlanderLamplighterBook: Storied LivesMentioned in the episode:Article: Tolkien on the Secondary WorldVideo: Jungian Synchronicity: Meaningful Patterns In LifeRomans 8Albert Camus Quote: “It happens that the stage sets collapse. Rising, streetcar, four hours in the office or the factory, meal, streetcar, four hours of work, meal, sleep, and Monday Tuesday Wednesday Thursday Friday and Saturday according to the same rhythm – this path is easily followed most of the time. But one day the “why” arises and everything begins in that weariness tinged with amazement.” Book: The Myth of Sisyphus by Albert CamusCraig's Mentors:Joanna Macy: joannamacy.netLionel Corbett: psycheandthesacred.orgJames Stark: regenerativedesign.org/instructors/james-starkBook: The Fourth Turning Is Here by Neil HoweBook: Sapiens by Yuval Noah HarariBook: Belonging Without Othering by John A PowellFilm: The Wild RobotFilm: FlowFilm: The Truman ShowArticle: Val Plumwood Prey to a CrocodileBook: The Cloud of Unknowing by AnonymousNadia Bolz Weber nadiabolzweber.comConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:00:31 Intro05:31 Doing Spiritual Work In This Time09:07 Fiction's Place In The Wisdom Path12:11 A Sign Of Real Interconnection From A Teardrop Shaped Leaf14:50 Healing The False Separations18:10 Stage Settings Collapse20:53 The Place Of Resistance23:37 The Cycle Of The Human Story27:13 Relationshiping Is Aliveness29:37 Mythic Hero vs Savior31:18 The Storied Life Needs Hope34:56 New Stories Can't Be Stopped36:56 The Wild Balance Of Nature Goes Beyond Good And Evil43:02 Sacrifice Runs Deep45:10 Drawn Toward Reality Laboratories49:15 The Search For Certainty51:59 Religion As Reconnection Is Necessary

In memory of Joanna Macy, we offer this recording from a Seminary of the Wild gathering where she spoke with radiant clarity about living through collapse with courage and love. She outlines four ancient ways of seeing the world—battlefield, trap, lover, and self—and invites us into the radical intimacy of belonging to a living Earth as lover and self. With humor and grace, she tells a story from Cosmicomics by Italian author Italo Calvino, in which the universe begins not with a bang, but with a generous offer to make pasta.Discover Joanna's work at:joannamacy.netWork That Reconnects Network: workthatreconnects.orgCosmicomics by Italo Calvino Considering and discerning a call to be part of this new movement of ecospiritual direction? Apply today for the next cohort of the Seminary of the Wild Earth. The application deadline is August 15, 2025.Connect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:00:00 Introduction04:53 Joanna Macy begins—gratitude, interdependence, and uncertainty11:31 Choosing how to rebuild: worldview as a tool12:42 World as battlefield16:38 World as trap20:33 World as lover and world as self—belonging to a living world24:17 The Cosmicomics story: love, pasta, and the birth of the universe31:30 Transition from lover to self—nonduality and the ecological self33:00 Thich Nhat Hanh on evolutionary belonging35:00 Letting the Earth act through us—John Seed’s rainforest story38:30 Question session on deepening into intimacy45:41 Weekly wandering invitation: “What can I do for you?”47:38 Closing invitation and credits

What does it mean to listen with the Holy Wild? In this episode, Victoria Loorz is joined by Elizabeth Rechter and Deb Metzger—two seasoned spiritual companions and guides in the Eco-Spiritual Direction program from Seminary of the Wild Earth. Together they reflect on the sacred practice of holy listening in partnership with the more-than-human world, sharing stories of reciprocity, grief, and transformation that emerge from deep relationship with Earth. The conversation is both an invitation and a reminder: the wild trusts us, and in return, we are called to trust the holy within and all around us.Considering and discerning a call to be part of this new movement of ecospiritual direction? Apply today for the next cohort of the Seminary of the Wild Earth. The application deadline is August 15, 2025.Connect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:08:58 What Is Spiritual Direction, Elizabeth?12:40 What Is Spiritual Direction, Deb?13:55 Including the rest of the alive world18:23 The Wild Approach20:05 Holding Space21:58 Reciprocity23:48 Stories of the Spirit Directed Wild27:03 Memory meeting us in the Wild31:30 The Wild Share Her Pain Too34:36 A Deconstruction The Culture That Has Incarcerated Us37:30 The Non-Judging Wild40:56 The Wild Trusts You41:43 You May Feed The Birds By Hand43:13 The Wind Speaks Of Suffering47:03 Meaning In and From Relationship49:18 The Playful Wild51:59 Invitation53:23 Valarie and a circle of Blue Violets55:59 Outro

In this episode of The Holy Wild, Victoria Loorz speaks with Sean Ó Gaoithín, the lead gardener at Glenveagh National Park, Irish forest-tender and a third-level Hedge Druid, about his journey of ecological restoration, ancestral reconnection, and spiritual practice. They share how sacred relationship with land is remembered through language, biodiversity, and embodied gestures like Gaia Touch. Together, they explore insights on rewilding efforts in Donegal, the ancient Celtic festivals, declaring peace with nature through prayerful movement, and how despair and hope can both be holy as we return to sacred kinship with Earth.Connect with Sean:Article: Native Woodlands of County Donegal Book LaunchInstagram: @ogaoithinMentioned in the episode:Book: Gathering Moss by Robin Wall KimmererOrganization: Botanic Garden Conservation InternationalVideo: What is GAIA TOUCH? Interview with Marko PogacnikVideo: Gaia Touch 1: Body Exercises by Marko PogacnikOrganization: Order of Bards, Ovates, and DruidsArticle: Rudolph Steiner's anthroposophyConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:00:00 Introduction08:38 The Seeded Wild Forest11:45 Donegal13:01 Indigenous Language As A Doorway16:12 "Ecology Is My Religion"17:46 Botanic Gardens Conservation International (BGCI)20:09 A Gardener Hopes For Eden25:01 Hope and Despair are both Holy26:06 Invasive Species28:45 Gaia Touch Earth Yoga31:34 Transmitters and Receivers34:43 The Fairies of Particular Places40:48 Declaring Peace43:51 Weeds Are Part of Biodiversity47:44 Generational Shift50:49 Sean's Druid Journey54:41 Order of Bards Ovates and Druids57:36 Celtic Annual Cycle60:54 The 7 Directions66:37 Being Drawn Home71:16 Sacred Invitation73:32 Ethan and Cherry Tree76:43 Outro

In this episode of The Holy Wild, Victoria Loorz speaks with her sister and co-author, Valerie Luna Serrels, about the transformative movement of Wild Church. Together they explore how sacred relationship with Earth is being rekindled through embodied spiritual practice, intentional community, and the reclamation of ancient ways of knowing. They reflect on the Field Guide to Church of the Wild, a book they co-wrote to support this growing network, and share insights into the shift from dominance to kinship as a core spiritual calling.Mentioned in the episode:Writing: USING EMERGENCE TO TAKE SOCIAL INNOVATIONS TO SCALE by Margaret J. WheatleyConnect with Valerie:Book: Field Guide to the Church of the WildWebsite: wildchurchnetwork.comEmail: [email protected] Community: The EcosystemConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:00:33 Introduction  05:00 Field Guide  09:45 Living Paradox  13:15 Wild Church Network  23:10 Feminine Emergence  26:53 Seeing Tree  28:51 WCL Offer *31:02 Grounding  34:15 Redefining Church  36:52 Reclaiming Vocabulary  39:27 Acknowledging Land and Ancestor  43:30 Re-Placing Rituals  47:20 Advocacy Through Relationship  48:06 Wandering Saunter  49:59 Threshold Crossing  51:33 Permission Asking  53:00 Connect with Valerie  54:17 Closing Benediction  57:27 Melissa and Grandmother Oak  58:56 Outro*When signing up for the Wild Church Leadership Course, mention PODCAST in your submitted form to get $50 off the cost of the course.

In this profound conversation, Victoria Loorz is joined by ethnobotanist, Franciscan brother, and spiritual ecologist Gary Paul Nabhan—also known as Brother Coyote—exploring themes of cultural and spiritual resistance, sacred relationship with the land, and the transformative power of remembering ancient ways. Gary shares stories of his time with Indigenous communities, his recent recovery from a traumatic head injury, and his hope for agrarian sanctuaries in a time of ecological and societal collapse. Inviting us into a re-enchanted worldview grounded in interconnection, reverence, and resilience and concluding with a poetic practice of naming the relationships in the natural world, reorienting us toward wonder and communion.Mentioned in the episode:Book: Against The American Grain: A Borderland's History of Resistance by Gary Paul NabhanArticle: On Doors and \cracks\ by Bayo AkomolafeBook: Refugia Faith: Seeking Hidden Shelters, Ordinary Wonders, and the Healing of the Earth by Debra ReinstraPodcast: Refugia Podcast with Debra ReinstraAgrarian Trust: agrariantrust.orgConnect with Gary:Website: garynabhan.comConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:00:00 Introduction05:53 The Land That Raised Brother Coyote07:22 Engaging All Senses09:52 Old Stories Collapsing11:32 Awkward Teen Phase12:28 Against The American Grain: A Borderland's History of Resistance15:24 Desert Spirituality17:29 Practical Sanctuaries of the Wild22:32 Listening Through Diversity24:29 Cultural Resistance28:13 Retreat to Assisi29:57 Take Little Steps31:34 Coming To Our Senses Through Body34:09 Active Incarnation36:29 Relationship > Thing-ness38:53 Ancient Expressions41:59 The World of Fragrance46:23 Wild Invitation49:26 Alex and the Ocean

In this episode of The Holy Wild, Victoria Loorz speaks with author and public theologian Brian McLaren about how to live with love, courage, and imagination in the midst of ecological and societal collapse. Rooted in McLaren’s latest book, Life After Doom, their conversation invites us into a deeper spirituality that faces reality without losing hope. Together, they explore how grief, beauty, and small communities of care can become seeds of transformation. It’s a moving, grounded dialogue for anyone longing to walk a path of love—no matter what unfolds.Mentioned in the episode:Book: Life After Doom by Brian McLarenGhost Ranch - www.ghostranch.orgBook: Everything Must Change: Jesus, Global Crises, and a Revolution of Hope by Brian McLarenEBook: Authoritarianism: Coming To A Society Near you by Brian McLarenArticle: On Doors and \cracks\ by Bayo AkomolafeBook: Refugia Faith: Seeking Hidden Shelters, Ordinary Wonders, and the Healing of the Earth by Debra ReinstraPodcast: Refugia Podcast with Debra ReinstraShort Story: The Ones Who Walk Away From Omelas (Kindle) by Ursula K. Le Guin Ursela LeguinBook: This Life by Martin HagglundBook: An Interrupted Life by Etty HillesumArticle: Etty Hillesum from The Jewish Women's ArchiveSong: Imagine by John LennonBook: Marx- Towards The Centre of Possibility by Kojin KarataniText: Revelation 21-22 A vision of Eco-civilizationBook: Mapping Ideology by Slavoj ZizekQuote: "It is easier to imagine the end of the world than it is to imagine the end of capitalism." (attributed to both Frederic Jameson and Slavoj Zizek)Book: Anam Cara by John O'DonohueConnect with Brian:Website: brianmclaren.netInstagram: @brian_mclarenConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:0:00 Intro5:34 Opening Poem7:12 Interview12:13 4 Problems13:12 Collapse and Authoritarianism18:40 Comfort in cycles and grief21:41 Practically being with neighbors27:12 Repentance29:08 The Bible as Indigenous literature30:30 Adam and the dust we return to32:20 This Life vs the afterlife37:00 What is our dream?41:31 Liberation to new thinking     

In this moving conversation, Victoria Loorz and Justine Afra Huxley explore kincentric leadership as both an unlearning and an emergence — a return to sacred relationship with Earth and a new way of living as spiritual leaders. Drawing from Sufi tradition, spiritual ecology, and deep listening to the more-than-human world, Justine invites us into a future shaped by kinship, reverence, and co-creation.Mentioned in the episode:Website: patmccabe.netConnect with Justine:Website: kincentricleadership.orgBook: Generation Y: Spirituality and Social ChangeMagazine: emergencemagazine.orgWebsite: goldensufi.orgWebsite: stethelburgas.orgConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:0:00 Introduction4:48 Justine's Beginnings in the Sufi Tradition7:35 Sacred Earth9:15 An Encounter In Devon10:56 Inner Life Becoming Outer Life12:05 Suffering Earth Severance12:39 The Work Is Spiritual15:29 Integration At Every Level17:29 Unlearning At Every Level22:41 Kincentric Leadership25:03 Many Knowledges Integrating26:34 Readiness For This Wild Shift27:49 The Need For New Words31:35 Avail Yourself33:13 Offerings To Water36:00 A Fire Ceremony Story38:17 The Pace Of Emergence40:02 Adapting Without Appropriating41:01 Inviting Earth In To The Ceremony Markers42:14 Farewells43:58 Wandering Invitation45:34 Corrine and Golden EagleClick here to view the episode transcript.

In this moving episode of The Holy Wild, Victoria Loorz is joined by Four Arrows (Don Trent Jacobs)—Cherokee author, scholar, and Lakota pipe carrier—for a profound conversation centered on reclaiming a kinship-based worldview. Drawing from Indigenous wisdom, never-before-told personal vision stories, and decades of advocacy, Four Arrows shares how restoring sacred relationship with the Earth begins with shifting our deepest ways of seeing and being. May this conversation serve as a powerful reminder that Indigenous worldviews hold essential guidance for healing our fractured relationship with the more-than-human world.Mentioned in the episode:Book: Restoring Kinship Worldview by Four Arrows and Darcia Narvaez, PhDVideo: Indigenous worldview can preserve our existenceMorobe Development Foundation: mdfpng.comBook: The Descent of Man - and Selection in Relation to Sex by Charles DarwinBook: Mutual Aid: A Factor In Evolution by Peter KropotkinArticle: "False Doctrine" and The Stifling Of Indigenous Political Will by Four ArrowsQuote: "“We must be compelled to hold this doctrine to be false, and the old and new law called the Old and New Testament, to be impositions, fables and forgeries.” by Thomas Paine in The Age of ReasonBook: Amerindian Rebirth by Antonia MillsBook: The Hidden Life Of Trees by Peter WohllebenPodcast: Radiolab on the secret life of treesConnect with Four Arrows:Website: fourarrowsbooks.comChart Download: worldviewliteracy.orgConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:0:00 Introduction5:30 Lakota Prayer6:31 Indigenous Worldview Video9:27 Statistics Challenge11:19 Anthropocentrism Harms Relationship11:56 Four Arrows Near Death Experience12:43 There's No Question The Animals Talk With Us13:51 How Do You Know It's The Animal Speaking?18:57 Sharing The Sacred20:05 Binaries23:18 How To De-Other24:30 Human Nature In Our Own Captivity30:00 Noun Verb33:18 Relationship Is Action36:21 Humans Are Not A Cancer37:26 Differing Worldviews40:29 Asking Permission Of Plants41:56 The Science Is Catching Up43:58 Closing Flute Song47:13 Wandering Invitation49:16 Michele with River and Wind51:16 CreditsClick here to view the episode transcript.

On our first episode of the Holy Wild, Victoria speaks with producer Stephen about the vision for the podcast. Victoria shares her answers to the questions we intend to ask every guest, including "tell me about the land that raised you?" and "what's a recent experience you've had with the holy and wild?" They also introduce elements of the podcast like the invitation to you at the end of each episode, as well as the Sacred Conversation segment to feature your stories and encounters.Mentioned in the episode:Book: Church of the Wild by Victoria LoorzBook: Field Guide to Church of the Wild by Victoria LoorzBook: Anam Cara by John O'DonohueNIH Paper: Depression and Vitamin D- A Peculiar Relationship Scripture: John 1 - On LOGOSScripture: Matthew 18:20 - Where Two Or More Are GatheredArticle: CAC Meditation: God in All Things (Richard Rohr on Panentheism)Video: "Wild Geese"- written and read Mary OliverConnect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spiritualityTimestamps:0:00  Intro                  3:43  The Land Who Raised You10:06 Being-In-The-Longing As Belonging11:06 The Unknown As Spiritual Practice Markers12:54 Our Tragic and Voluntary Severance14:56 We've Tamed Ourselves15:57 In Kinship With The Mosquito17:28 Hosting LOGOS Conversations20:36 Why Podcast Now?20:55 "God Is Not A Tree"?24:07 The Conversation Of Creation25:08 The Trap Of Duality25:53 Restoring Human Cooperation27:01 Conversation Beyond Words28:48 Victoria's Conversation With Sister Stream32:56 Obstacles Are The Music35:21 A Closing Thought On Practical Wandering38:05 Thresholds40:50 Introduction To Invitation44:40 Invitation46:44 Sacred Conversation: Stephen and Prairie Falcon49:30 Credits

From the Center For Wild Spirituality, The Holy Wild, hosted by Victoria Loorz.Connect with the Center:Website: wildspirituality.earthVictoria's Website: victorialoorz.comEmail: [email protected]: linktr.ee/ctrforwildspiritualityInstagram: @center_for_wild_spirituality