#2531 - Forrest Galante

The Joe Rogan experience Train by day Joe Rogan podcast by night all day My friend Joe let's get a second Let's get a second man Pro it's good to see you So I've been sending you stuff because like we've been I knew that you were coming on and I say that one that video of the guy who got a Trill cam photo of a black panther. Yeah, so that's just a Melanistic Mount line so is that it's a great question. There's never been a Melanistic Mount line Nobody's ever seen one ever never hit one with a car never born one captivity nothing Whoa, so mountain lions by definition pumas, you know, whatever you want to call them There's never been a black one ever but every year I mean I got a buddy in Florida swears blind that he's seen a black mountain line in his backyard and yet that photo that you sent me That photo circulates like once every three years bullshit. It's bullshit. It's a real photo, but it's a trail cam photo Oh, wasn't this one, but I think that's the first one and then there's another one with the cat gets like right up to the ones Yeah, that one so that photo is a real I want to say Jaguar It's hard to tell but either Jaguar or black leopard both of which arm do become Melanistic

But there's and you can tell it because you can see the spots barely like the rosettes So all these Melanistic cats like like jags and leopards and things that do get Melanistic They still have those resets under the black coat. Yeah, so not a mountain line. Right too bad And now it's such a bummer it one day if somebody finds one that'll be like a huge thing So funny that we want it to be different because just a mountain line itself is amazing I mean if they were all black and there was like a tan mountain line be like some sort of hundred percent It's like whatever is different and rare is what people just are like I want that one thing I've always said that about Bigfoot Yeah, the Bigfoot is kind of interesting but not as interesting as an orca 100% right we have gorillas that are cooler than bigfoots well orcas in particular because they have languages that we can't decipher Languages specialized diets some kind of you know, it's kind of even talk to each other right?

Yeah, it's unbelievable like it's the same as if you or I went to India or Africa We communicate we don't eat the same food. No different yet us and orcas and orca right? Yeah, and it's super smart and huge brains and don't kill people for some strange reason ever when they're in captivity That's right. Yeah, which is so crazy I did a thing in Baja, Mexico Maybe three years ago where we were just cruising on this little pongos little fishing boat And we saw these orcas go by and now people seem to be doing it a lot But at the time it was like nobody had really just tried this and this was a transient population Which means they primarily eat seals and sea lions not the sting rate eaters And so we're like fuck it Let's just go and we like ran the boat up ahead and jumped in and orcas came up and the bull never came up So, you know the bull has a huge thin like he's the biggest the dominant protector of the pod But the cows and their babies came up and the boat like drifted away And me and my buddy Mike and they just circled us like just looking at us with their big eyeballs Whoa and it was me to you from orcas and they did like two circles around us like what are these things?

They were just like meh boring and kept swimming like they cut they must know right if they're that intelligent and they have language and they Communicate they must know that what what a person is right? I think of this dude. I saw the guy that film this was co-craze Work ahead butts a Sunfish so hard it explodes boom turns into pieces So this is a newly documented behavior just in the last maybe six months They found that orcas will literally explode fish from impact whether it's a game or what but they're finding that This is not the first time this is not they're doing this they're starting to just explode these fish on impact just because how are they doing that? Like how fast are they going? I do not know the answer to that but it's impressive I would have never imagined that that would actually be possible right like how fast can you try like what does the starfish look like flat like a Thing right or a sunfish it's like a mala mala those oceans sunfish with the big big Pretty huge so huge 600 pounds I get huge I think literally turn the dust dude I think I think those are the orca equivalents of like a redneck that wants to hit a turtle on the road and they're just like We're bored Let's explode or those guys that do that have you seen that game?

Well, it's not game, but it's I guess whatever it is an activity where these guys just run at each other full blast dude RNC run nation I love that. It's my favorite thing. I'm such a huge fan. I love it. I love it So it's rugby boys that are doing it right it's like an Oklahoma drill except for rugby guys And that's a drill that when I was playing rugby we used to do all the time just run it just running it's my favorite run nation R&C it's my favorite thing I watch everybody go look at these guys I would have never get they both just want unconscious They both want it. Well that guys that guy's fine

I'm such a fan. I've seen it where they both get unconscious I want to bring these guys to the US and see how they stack up against like NFL line Oh Jesus Christ they both had butted each other dude. You love fights words. What are you talking about? This is not a fight sport. This is just retarded. I'm such a fan. Oh, it's so silly

Oh, I don't want to do it to be clear. It's easy that you like that I know too much about brain damage and you should too if you like rugby I've had too much brain damage to know too much about brain No, I'm just kidding, but how long did you play rugby for? Well, I grew up in Zimbabwe and so like Southern Africa rugby is life, right? So it's like probably deep South football kind of culture So I still play believe it or not except now I play very intermittently because one game puts me out for weeks You ever got your brain examined? No, I have not one concussion in my life. So I think I'm okay

Oh, that's silly because you guarantee you have sub-concussive trauma What is sub-concussive trauma? Well, you don't go unconscious, but you get rattled and then you have some brain damage You're probably right. Yeah, soccer players get it really. Yeah, yeah, yeah chronic traumatic and cephalopathy Yeah, that's the soccer players get it. I did not know that I'm heading the ball So is that and you know a lot about UFC is that brain trauma worse than UFC type trauma? Well, it's all brain trauma

And it's dependent upon many factors. It's dependent upon how many times you've been hit and also there's a gene variation It's a APOE4 is that what it is? If you have this one particular gene It makes you more susceptible to CT for some interesting yeah So like because a brain concussion is when your brain sort of impacts against your skull is that right? There's that and I mean I think it's also it's not just that it's like if you get hit in the neck You can get a concussion Also, yeah, also a lot of people don't realize you can get a concussion from getting hit in the body real how does that work? Because when you get rattled yeah, also another group of people that seem to get CTE are people who ride jet skis. That's wild

Oh, yeah, well my friend mark Gordon. He's a doctor who specializes in traumatic brain injuries and treating football players soldiers And he's treated some fighters as well. He said that any repeated stress any banging anything like that banging like if you're fucking headbanging Yeah, like you're probably gonna get brain damage. No way legitimate brain damage like I can't remember what I was doing five seconds ago Where's my keys? I forget what I'm talking about mid-sentence did you scare me here?

Running straight at people for last yeah I just look those guys are animals they're tough guys no doubt about it and those specific Islanders like cuz those the guys are doing it primarily Right like they play rugby league and stuff. They're built different. Oh, yeah, like they're so hard. It's insane Do you remember David toa? No, I'm not David toa was a heavyweight boxer Okay, back in the day who was like one of the most ferocious guys that ever fought in boxing and it just just built like like your Prototypical Island warrior guy. Yeah, yeah, that's David to a tank

You don't want to run it at that guy. I'm telling you what yeah, I mean just a monster not people out And so you knocked out John Ruiz like famously in the first round like something like 30 seconds or something like that was crazy different breed And crazy left look yeah that kind of guy. I mean we've got a bunch of the mark hunt who's a famous kickboxer There's another guy like that. Yeah, just just why does it fucking barn? There's like no waste It's just like a brick Yeah, yeah, I'm again playing rugby I played rugby against guys like that and it was the worst those dudes that have the balls to get a little tiny boat make it across the fucking Okay, you know kick your ass. That's what it is really I mean think about it like only the super robust

Survived right so it's like nature just weeding out any possible weakness only the strongest human beings made it this episode is brought to you by Squarespace if you're thinking about building a website you should try squarespace I know because I use it that's right Joe Rogan calm is powered by squarespace It has all the features that you need to create a stand-out website like an AI enhanced website builder SEO optimization tools and seamless checkouts with mobile Pay links head to squarespace calm slash Rogan for a free trial And when you are ready to launch use the offer code Rogan to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain This episode is brought to you by uber eats hockey seasons here and uber eats is delivering game day deals on favorites like wings Pizza fries and snacks and you can order more than food like gear to rep your team or fresh batteries for the remote When your watch party gets hungry or you just need anything Order in and keep everyone's attention on the ice core great deals on uber eats all season long because hockey is for the hungry

Terms apply product availability varies by region see app for details absolute natural selection Absolutely African Americans we have in North America like those are the strongest best guys that came over here Right, right? That's why they're all the most incredible athletes. I don't know about all But yeah, I know what you're saying. Yeah, this I mean it's and also like when you look at like guys from Iceland strongmen Yeah, so how many strong there from Iceland? Well, how many fucking Vikings are from Iceland?

I like it. Yeah, right. It's weird when you think about it that like nature finds its way. It's the same thing It's like we think we're so different and above like animals and stuff It's a natural selection We just bring the biggest the best and the strongest into some area whether that's Vikings colonizing Iceland or or the Samoans on their islands Or whatever it happens to be and you're just like well here's a superior population because we all the biggest best and strongest have made it And all the weakest have died off is that weird like you as a guy who studies wildlife biology? Isn't it weird that we want to think of ourselves as being a different thing? We are clearly not we're not we're not even at the top

That's the thing that people never understand intellectually we are obviously look what we've built but like we're not even We don't even sit at the top of the food chain But we kind of do because we kill everything else we want to because because we have yeah, well not even our brains really It's other people's brains that invented guns like you and me true. No, that's interesting. It's like our brains or our evolutionary advantage It transfers over to people that don't have good genetics Yeah, right because you could be built like a bag of shit like a literal bag of shit You can kill a grizzly bear with the rifle. That's right. Yeah, I'm not right He's just sitting there on a ridge Yep, like with a scope and boom and you kill a 1200 pound Kodiak round bear because all of our biological energy goes into this thing Instead of being physically big or intimidating or we can transfer what we figured out on the other people Yeah, no other animals ever figured out how to do that. No, it's not crazy wild. Yeah, it's really wild

Yeah, it's really wild. Yeah, it's when you think about it It's like what if you were studying us if you were coming from another planet and you were studying us to be like wow This one animal is fucking weird. Yeah, this one this one's doing something different Yeah, absolutely But they would still look at us and go oh well They're definitely animals like look at them Oh, yeah, if you look at the earth from an earth drop You look at what we've done and be like this is the top animal But they're parasitic and colonizing the whole planet and changing things and manipulating things whereas all the other animals are just getting by Yeah, if we found out that they're where we're actual visiting aliens that there was actual Intelligent life from somewhere else visiting us. I think there are a lot of us would probably be like why didn't you help?

Yeah, why didn't you come along and say hey cut the shit it reminds me of the I don't know Do you watch South Park ever? Yes, there was an old South Park episode where Earth was like a reality show And it's like let's see who's getting along this week the zebras are fighting with the giraffes and the people are doing this and it's like It's like we're just like a reality show for the universe where you just put a bunch of species We're like a big big brother situation. Well, we are kind of that for us. Oh, we are that's what a reality show is reality show for us Is the world yeah, you know Lindsey Graham did he died in a rocket accident or did he die was he poisoned by Russia? Let's tune in the Twitter find out. Yeah, exactly and it's hilarious. We are we are locked in on

Whatever the fuck is happening all over the world all at once and that's one of the weird things about social media now Is that we're constantly being inundated with new things to occupy our attention? Mm-hmm, you know, and we have no attention span to watch anything for more than five seconds But yeah at the same time. This is the rise of podcasts. Yeah, which are long form Right, so it's clear that that's not really the case with everybody There's enough people that are interested in actual fascinating things and have an attention span It's just like we're all susceptible to the brain rod that comes with just scrolling it's so hard not like I've tried to make conscious decisions Because you know you can imagine what my Instagram feed looks like right? It's animal after animal half of its AI now whatever and I still try and make a conscious decision to not look at it And I find myself just reaching for my phone and doing this It's just it's we're wired into it now. Yeah, dopamine hits crazy

And it's not even really rewarding which is really terrifying to me because it's not something that's like really feels great And you barely retain the information like even if you watch an educational one You're like wow that was amazing you barely retain that information because it's such a quick thing until you're on to the next one At least for me. Yeah, there's a little bit of that in there for sure But I think I've gotten a pretty good algorithm lately so lately for whatever reason my algorithm has been really excellent It's really dialed in where I'm only getting like really fascinating things. So that's a couple of weeks Yeah, awesome great. That's way better and then every now and then some retarded shit comes on I just get through it real quick and I'm like actually this algorithm going good or you text me a bigfoot AI thing So there's no there's no silly you actually texted me the bigfoot what was the same guy you said you said same guy texted you back I don't think so he's like this guy raised a baby bigfoot in secrecy It's so bad so bad so obvious is like a shitty AI photograph of like like a blurry Polaroid photograph And then you read the comments and there's like 400 people going like oh my god I can't believe this happened and you're like come on. I'll do Duncan and I back in the day like in 2012 or 11 Whatever it was when I did that sci-fi show Joe Rogan questions everything. Uh-huh. We went and hung out with Bigfoot people

We actually went bigfoot hunting. No way. Yeah, we were with them for a couple days. How was that? What's the Pacific Northwest? It's kind of sad. Yeah, the way I describe it

I was said here's what you don't find when you go looking for Bigfoot black people You're more likely to find Bigfoot than you are black people looking for bigfoot. It's just such a crazy white Unfuckable white guys out in the woods staring at shadows. It's like making something out of nothing Look at that leaf. It must have been here. It's just unfuckable guys. It's really what it is

It's it's unfortunately that's really what it is. It's not that there's not something to the story because I think there is something to the story Yeah, I think it's an old story. Okay, it's only back to Native Americans Well, not just that there's how many we look this up before how many different names there are and I think it's more than 50 different You imagine sitting that close to that thing how bad that would smell yeah, it's revolting I mean the thing's been dead for who knows how long this guy's just hanging out. Yeah, take your picture Fun fact this guy was on your mom's house like 12 years ago was he yeah What is he like a fun guy in Instagram as a dog trainer? That's hilarious. It's a way

It's a bit Tom found his videos a long time ago and they brought him into a podcast with them I just know what I know this guy is no way. I got a big foot. He has bigfoot body I mean he could be just the full-on Oh, he sawing into it. Look at this. It's a cake. It's a cake. Oh my god. He saw it into it open it up Tom

Oh, he found a foot. Oh, yeah, very real very real good foot Also if you contrast a guy in overalls with no shirt who can you trust my way guys on great shapers age is looks ripped It's out there lifting up fake bigfoots all day. Yeah, I think there was I mean obviously we know that Gigantopithecus was real But we were reading about this the other day that it seems like Gigantopithecus wasn't bipedal and that there was some Dispute as to whether or not it was bipedal but apparently there's some biologists that are saying no It was most likely walking around like a rank that interesting just just oh wow just a huge orangutan look at thing Huh, no, I've heard of it. I didn't know that it wasn't bipedal though. That's fascinating. I think it's under dispute. I think it's been disputed

That's interesting. It's hard to say they don't have a lot of bones right? They only have like a few jaw bones and some stuff of them Yeah, dude. I learned something pretty interesting this last week So I I just got back from India literally flew in here from India and we were doing some elephant rescues with Vintara that big Indian wildlife rescue place This elephant got hit by a car that we went and rescued so it's leg was all jacked up speaking of non bipedal things So you would think just the elephant would walk with a limp well having that trunk. It's incredible They use that trunk as a limb so I was watching this elephant walk I wish I had photos or video to show you but I was watching this elephant walk and it wouldn't put weight on its leg It was hit by the car so it would walk with three legs and it's trunk as its fourth appendage Oh, wow, which is an amazing thing So you think the size of an elephant's cranium and its head and the weight and in order to move that distribution off that broken leg It was using this trunk as a limb. It was just it was incredible

It was really sad was incredible thing to see the way they sort of figured out how to maneuver using that fifth appendage This episode is brought to you by zipper-cooter people who go that little extra step like your ride share pointing out the best Local places to eat goes a long way if you want people who are going to make a positive impression for your business use Zip recruiter in fact try it for free at zipper-cooter.com slash Rogan zipper-cooter's latest feature lets candidates go above and beyond to tell you why they want the role and it shows you the most Interested qualified candidates first try zipper-cooter and meet great candidates who go the extra step for your job four out of five employers Who post on zipper-cooter get a quality candidate within the first day try it for free today at zipper-cooter.com slash Rogan that's zipper-cooter.com slash Rogan zipper-cooter meet your match on zipper-cooter Does the elephant allow people to set its leg so in Elle in the is it broken?

I don't know it went so we went to basically so I work with place called ventara Which is the world's largest wildlife rescue and rehab center. It's unreal dude. It would blow your mind I mean like on a whole nother level all privately funded by a non-embony this Indian billionaire guy the guy I've had a huge wedding If you remember that He's a great dude him and I are buddies now, but um so he's funded this world's large wildlife rescue and rehab It like it makes a San Diego zoo look like a roadside attraction I mean it's like crazy big and so he does all these rescues right so reason I'm telling you all this is they go and respond to these rescues and then take it into this gigantic world's biggest animal hospital that they've built So we went and rescued the elephant and now it's probably by today back in ventara Yeah, here you go and and they'll be treating it so this is long to it. This is the other one We did two rescues this one was born with um Splay legs and then went into logging and so all the weight and stuff from logging see the see the display legs on the front there Ouch yeah, so anyway, I was just incredible But the short answer is they do let people treat them because these animals are raised by in captivity by what's called mahout Switcher elephant riders, and it's a really the whole dynamics really fascinating So you grow up with an elephant as a mahout in Indian culture and then there's usually one or two mahoutes that spend their life dedicated to the elephant

And all they do is ride them log them they use them as tools, but they still love them very much It's just they use them as a tool elephants obviously aren't made to do that so they break down over time So that's why it's like that it's from carrying the amount of weight that comes from logging So that one would have been born with a deformity Okay, but then yours of compounded weight and everything else makes its legs like that oh it's crazy And then yeah, so we go and we take the elephants in plus the mahoutes and take them all back to ventara give them a Full-time job you got to sleep on mattresses on the floor right and then take them back and it's a whole thing reform everybody It's amazing thing. Yeah. Oh wow so when they treat the elephants like what do they do for an elephant as a broken leg? So most of it's just pain management right because you can only get so far so the one that got them in a cast Not really no, you know it depends I guess it depends on the fracture I'm not at that but I guess it depends on the fracture But what they do is they have and Jamie you might be able to see it's incredible They have this giant jacuzzi like imagine a jacuzzi the size of your building here for elephants and it's their hydrotherapy pool So these animals that have terrible arthritis or fucked up feet or bad legs like that they just spend all day in the water because then there's no weight on Their limbs oh wow, which is really cool. Do they have medication like anti-inflammatories for elephants everything man? This place uses unbelievable

Eastern medicine Western medicine is crazy hospital. There's a lot of guys talking on their Instagram unfortunately, but yeah Look at that. Isn't that crazy. They do these amazing thing. Oh fuck man, but yeah, it's a really really cool place I'm gonna get to do some fun stuff. So I was really privileged to be part of those elf and rescues really emotional when you see an animal

Like an elephant that's so much like intelligence look you in the eye and be like I'm in so much pain and then you like start to relieve it It's cool. I am went to visit this place in Thailand a few years back that has wild elephants Mm-hmm, so they're wild elephants, but you can ride them and that you feed them So you make you have you'll make friends with them first Yeah, like a sugar cane hang out with them you pet them yep, and then they let you ride them Yeah, and they put their arm out like good. Yeah, they'll walk out to step on yeah So let you know like okay. Yeah, I didn't like the riding part I felt wrong to me just like it's a thing that like all the tourists did but my family wanted to do it So I said okay, yeah, but it's okay, but the animals themselves are so sweet Yeah, they're like when you're hanging around with them They're like they're so one of them. I got a video of it on my Instagram She's just like eating a log. Yeah, she kept chewing on this log and I'm just hanging out with her and I made this like video with me

I'm like she's eating a log I don't know why she's eating this log, but they're so sweet, but it wasn't it was it was a weird Relationship that they have and you wash them at the end of the trip Yeah, so you get them and they get in this pool this big pond yep, and you could just wash them and hang out with them It's like it that you do that so it feels good to them and I thank you. No, thank you for carrying me There's good and bad like I mean elephants have been used through history right in war and logging and circus everything else But now I would say in the last 20 years. We're finally sort of waking up to hey a lifetime of being on an elephant's back Like you can see the deformities you can see the bed swords you can see the hip displays or hip issues from caring people Yeah, they're just not designed for it You know they look you think they are when you look at them and you're like what could have you know We're like an aunt on that things back, but it it's pretty hard on them and the hardest part is actually not you or I or anybody riding them It's walking on concrete. Oh, it's have these soft padded feet. They're not designed for rock hard ground So the impact of walking on pavement is actually that compounding with weight added weight. That's what's actually so bad

I bet the heat of the Comp the asphalt to and their dogs like dogs hate the heat of asphalt It's horrible for them and the weirdest thing about an elephant foot if you look at its anatomy They're one of the few animals that walk on their toes So they don't have toes splitting out like we do they walk on top of their toes So that you know imagine that compounding on heat plus weight Isn't it cool that they thought that's what a cyclops was when they found the skull yeah Cyclops were real thing dude have you ever seen have you ever seen the explorers club in New York City? No, that's worth a visit you would love to have the champ what tiger there like the most famous man eating tigers I'm gonna kill like 476 people. Yeah, is that what the number?

I actually have it on my YouTube and I don't remember the name It's crazy and then Jim Corbett went and shot it. Yeah, and see you almost named my son Corbett because I love that story so much But but they have the only four-tust elephant at the explorers club in New York City. Wow. I'm sure Jamie You can find a picture of the skull nobody knows why total anomaly nobody's ever seen it nobody knows why I think it's the only one in existence And it literally has four tusks coming out of it. It's just a weird genetic thing I think so like that's play like it one we look at because sometimes with elk They'll get an injury when they're young and then they'll get weird deformities of their their antlers But is that different because they shed their antlers every year so they grow back in weird ways item?

That's a good question I think it's an injury to the skull. Yeah, so an injury to like the area where the antler is like sometimes I just have one sword Yeah, like there was a ranch that in California that had this one elk that was killing all the other elk because he didn't have antlers the same I oh they got a Yeti's go So this one elk had on one side he had like normal antlers But the other side he just had a spear. Oh wow And so he was stabbing all these other This guy doing wow it wasn't like they're used to their antlers interlocking of course Yeah, I think they get together in the clash of course they try to impress the ladies. Yep. There is look at that The tusks is so weird very weird or and they're like weird the way they're in or they're going towards each other's which makes you realize it's a genetic deformity Right, it's not like this perfect symmetrical like nature made it. It's just it's a mutation of some kind

Well, that's weird about jeans right like things go wonky all the time someone's born with an extra arm Yeah, yeah, exactly sometimes people are born with tails and like cool So weird dude you you and I talked about barber Russo one time the pigs that have those crazy Yeah, they go into their own skulls my buddy who's a vet he just got a horn out of a sable sable antelope Yeah, it was growing into its own skull. Oh, it's great I have a video on my Instagram If you want to see it, but it's um it so it got an injury so it killed part of the horn and you know they're antelope They're not deer so they don't shed their horns so they grow forever So this guy had this giant horn just circling back punching into its own skull It was gnarly the pigs are nuts though or whatever that animals call the bubble is a Pit it's technically a pit. Yeah, it's like a Indonesian warthog. Yeah, but the way it goes into its own skull no matter what like it Always happens. Yeah, because they have to fight and break them off and if they don't fight and break them off It's nature so weird man. Yeah, it's fucking crazy. They're so cool. I wonder what those things taste like. I bet they taste great

I think all the swine tastes great. Mmm. I had have a lean of you, which is not technically a swine. It's a peccary. Uh-huh Not good. No, huh? That's unfortunate. It's odd. Yeah. Yeah, it's like no. No, just not the best like you gotta think what they're eating

Well, you know what I know about how to eat garbage right now. Yeah, I think that's part of the problem Because like that's the case with bears. Mm-hmm, right like my friend Steve Rinella cooked a bear steak or a bear ham on his friends Smoker and he said to his friend he said hey, you should probably clean that smoker It smells like fish. Yeah, because I've never cooked fish and that smoker wants and it was just from the bear The bear had eaten so much fish that as he was smoking the bear all you could smell was fish. That's disgusting It's like eating a seagull. Whoa, that's going right into its head. That's the guy. Yeah, that's the guy. Oh, that's nuts

And it's yeah, he like cuts the horn off and you can see because the horns are living thing There's always that animal still alive fairly like they he had millimeters of growth to go before it punched right into his brain That's crazy. That's so gnarly. Yeah, digging in imagine that like every day just a tiny little amount more is growing into your brain It's got to be this constant pain where like it just it just gets tiny bit worse all the time I saw him through it. See how much into the skull it went like it was right there. That's crazy. So gross. I thought you'd like that

I don't know if that's about me. Yeah, you don't like that. I don't know. It is gnarly man. That poor dude now He doesn't have any antlers. Yep or horns, right is it technically horns horns. Yeah, but he's still got brain

So that helps carry on bro. Yeah Nature's a motherfucker dude. It's crazy. Um, where's the thio scene man? What's going on? It's gone pretty cold. Yeah, I mean

I'm hoping you come in with new evidence I wish I was there's a group that I've been working with called mammal watching like if you heard bird watching And they've been going into western pop when pop when you're getting which is as you know where I think there could still be a tiny population And so I'm working with them. They're giving trail cameras out to guys They're still hearing legends here and there but it's just I don't know It's it feels like the legends are getting fewer and further between like almost over generational time. It's disappearing if that makes sense Oh, that's a bad sign. Yeah, I mean, whatever's left is probably dying off, right? If at all yeah, I mean I still hold out hope it's something I've always wanted to be and I like I want it to be there But it just it feels like those bits of evidence that were compounding have all sort of started to fade Now a very interesting thing with the incredible variety of wildlife that we have that were so fascinated by the ones that might not be alive This like the things like the thio scene or the giant sloth. Yeah, I remember I watched this documentary on the giant sloth

There's this one scientist is biologist who had spent an inordinate amount of time like years in the Amazon Looking for a giant sloth. Yes realizing at some point time during the documentary that he might have ruined his career Overdoing it. Yeah, he might have been chasing something that doesn't exist and it's just wild gamble if he listens to these people And they're telling him the truth, right because all the natives like oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah We'll find tomorrow. Yeah, yeah, I've been there But you know if you don't follow those leads like do you know what the Salah is the Asian unicorn? I've heard that yeah same thing same story but real animal and you know there was there's basically one ever seen by Western science an animal named Martha and For years scientists Western scientists were going into Vietnam and Laos. They're going yeah

We have this thing called a Salah the Asian unicorn and they like shut up, you know and then all of a sudden turns out here's this giant Bovid that still exists what a cool little two yeah, and nobody knows whether they still exist now right there That's it. Yeah, so basically there's been three or four maybe more that have ever been seen Most of them caught in poachers snare's like this one But then really cool guy named Bill Robishod got a call once from a prince and he had caught one and it was in his village And he flew in there and overnight the fourth thing died and that was the only time a single Western in history has ever seen a live Salah And this guy had it and then and then he's like can we please preserve it and the king was like now We're gonna eat it and they ate it whoa got nothing out of it. Yeah, he's got pictures and stuff So, you know, it's all it's all real but they call it the unicorn because its horns are so symmetrical that when you look at it from a side Profile looks like one horn like that exactly. Yeah, that's weird. Yeah, they're very cool, but it's a bovid. It's a it's a cattle

That's that's not one. I don't know why they're using that photo. Oh, how odd yeah, but that's the same thing is these you know These things around giant slots and dialyce and big foot and everything else it's they are out there You know some of them not all of them But they are out there and if you don't follow the lead if you ignore it then you miss things like that Well, there's also like when you think about things like the Amazon like if you ever see footage of the Amazon from above you Oh, he doesn't know that's so big you let you look down and you go. Oh well There's no way you know this is this is way too big because no way there's a bunch of people scouring every inch of that place I mean given there are still groups of human beings uncontacted a lot like my friend Paul Rosalie Yeah, he's coming contact with them multiple times. Yeah, so you can get some aerial footage of flying over the Amazon I mean, it's it's in multiple countries. It's what is great Bolivia

Argentina It's huge. It's so fucking big and I had a similar experience in New Guinea talking about that I was saying where we got on a plane in a place called to fee and flew to another area Like look at this. It was just like us for four hours We didn't see one building Amazon in 4k so just a man like there is no fucking way You know what's in there? No way. There's probably a bunch of shit in there that no one has found and then there's oh undeniably There are and then there's stuff you know like you'll get a kick out of this lock-ass monster. Mm-hmm. What do you think it is?

Maybe a sturgeon or something like that Jamie. What do you think of a lock-ass monster is? I mean, I think they know but I don't know Whale dick what? Whale dick. Whale dick. Whale dick. Whale dick. I don't know what?

What? Whale dick. Whale dick. Whale dick. Whale dick. Whale dick. Whale. Whale.

A floc-nast monster versus whale dick. Look at this and tell me this isn't what they think is the lock-nastor. Do you mean like the photos that the hoax photo of the one that's poking out of the water? That one I mean you'll see it in a second here I think but there are these photos of a whale's penis compared to the lock-nast monster and I mean I that's certainly not proof But it kind of answers a lot of like that's a whale dick right there. That is a whale dick. Yeah, that photo

I'm pretty sure is a proven hoax. That one is. Yeah, right? I think that photo was like a guy like made something out of wood and like floated it in the water and took a picture. Is that what the story behind that? There's something along those lines. No, lock-nast monster isn't a whale penis. Professor says.

Oh, okay. Well, if the internet professor says it then. Oh, a professor. Oh, well, let's take him seriously. He's out there. If you're the type of professor that they call upon when they try to figure out if something's a whale dick.

Maybe, sir, would you please study these nine whale penis and tell us your thoughts on this? Maybe that's what happened to the... He was his claim and then he said he was just like kind of messing around with his throat. Well, I'm sticking with it. I like it. I like a whale. He's the guy that proposed it. Oh.

Darn it. I like it. He's just walked back his salacious claim. That's so funny. Maybe that's the guy that was looking for the giant sloth.

Yeah. Because I got a new angle. This giant sloth thing did not pan out. I like it. If you're a guy looking for a giant sloth in the Amazon, like, where do you look?

Like, how good look finding it? You have to find geographically isolated areas. You know, because they're little pockets, right? If the pockets of, okay, people aren't coming in here. Animals aren't going out. There's a big ring of mountains. There's whatever it happens to be.

I met a guy who said he guaranteed he knew all these people like this, but I always enjoyed the story of it. That there was this pocket in Peru that was completely geographically isolated by the mountains. And that's where they were. And the idea is that these areas remain unchanged, right? It's like an island, basically, in the Amazon. Like, things just don't change because it's so

isolated from everything else. Well, I think the idea also was that giant sloths where we know they existed in North America, that whenever whatever happened that ended the ice age, the younger driest impact, that it didn't affect things below the equator or the equator was more of a northern hemisphere thing. Yeah, because the climate shift was so much stronger. Exactly. So most of the animals that died off, I think it was 65% of North American megafauna died off during this very short window that didn't happen in South America. And that we're just guessing that

they're dead. Because if there was a healthy pup, like think how many tigers are there in the wild. I think there's 5,000. It's gone way up, by the way. It was down to 400.

Fun fact. More tigers in captivity in Texas than there are in all of the wild of the world. That's crazy, man. It's just in people's yards. In private collections in Texas, there's more tigers than all of the wild of the world. It's such an insane statement.

That should not exist. I love this day. It's just my favorite place ever. Get away with it. It's just a wild place for all intents and purposes. Yeah, it's hilarious. Wild for people.

Dude, I love Texas. Every time I come to Texas, I'm like, this place is great. It's always so fun. Everybody's so nice too. Exactly. That's the best part. Nobody scowls at you.

You get any elevator and they're like, hey, how's your day going? You're like, very friendly. I'll tell you how it's going. Very, a lot of people, especially coastal elites, I would like to say, like people, coastal snobs, they have this idea of it being like filled with rednecks and ignorant people and foolish people. It's not that way at all. Especially Austin.

Austin is one of the most liberal, easygoing, progressive cities. But even the progressives here, they're more reasonable. It's down to earth. It's not like extremism. They're definitely more crazy than they were 20 years ago when I first started coming here. But way less crazy

than liberals in LA or liberals in New York. It's just extreme. It's protest and all these. They're just saying about Austin, keep Austin weird and surrounded. And surrounded?

Yeah. What is the answer? Surrounded by red people. It's all red states around you and it's this pocket of blue that's in the center of this red state. I think that's good for everybody.

Yeah. I think that's good. It's a balance. And the liberals that want to turn Texas blue, like, don't. You're going to ruin it. You're going to ruin it for you too. You don't get it.

Balance is important. It's like, you can't kill all the predators. Because then the deer will get overrun and you're hitting them with cars and you can't kill all the deer because then there's no food. I mean, that's what they did when they were market hunting. Balance. And you need

balance with humans too. 100%. And the Austin balance is a great balance. It's a liberal city surrounded by like hardcore Republicans with guns and tigers. And it works. And it all works. It

works. It makes for nice people. It's like it's a good mix. And a misunderstood mix. It's interesting.

People on the outside, they have a very distorted perception of what Texas is, especially Austin. Yeah. Well, how do you feel as a California, I mean, you bounced around, but as a California transplant, did you bring your side balls and you're like, I need all that California stuff here. What stuff? I don't know. I mean, I don't know. That's like, that's the thing though, right?

It's like, all the Californians coming here and messing it up kind of thing. I was never one of those. So my what I got out of California was the comedy store and work. Yeah. And then Jujitsu. So like you get all that here. Austin is arguably the Jujitsu capital of the world right

now. Really? Oh, yeah. Oh, that's interesting. Is this where the new league is based out?

No, that's you mean the UFC league? Yeah. No, that's in Vegas. They do that in Vegas. Yeah. Because that's where the UFC is. But Austin has Kings World, which is Gordon Ryan's

place. It's got B team is out here. Sean J. Rehibero's out here. There's a bunch of Gracie Baja schools out here. There's multiple 10th planet schools out here. It's like,

there's an incredible amount of Jujitsu out here. So what I'm hearing is this is where to bring run nation. Bring it to Austin. No, get that. They'll never win. They don't

only be able to win. They're those wild New Zealand dudes and those Australian guys. Those guys will win every time. They're built for that shit. No, but it's just a great city period.

Artistically, it's always been like a great music city. Now it's arguably the comedy capital of the country. Yeah. I mean, there's so many comedians here now, right? It's because they got here and they went, oh, this is way better. There's no traffic. Yeah. That one's nice. Yeah. And then you can do

whatever you want. And also, there's a lot of places to do comedy. And just on my street where my club is, there's five or six other clubs that have opened up since we opened up. Oh, wow. So it's incredible. So if you're a young comic and you're an established comic that just wants a workout

material, you could go to my club, you hopped on the street to the sunset room, which is my friend Brian's club right down the street and you go down the street to the creek in the cave, an amazing club. It's just two seconds away. It's like one block over. It's got anything close to Vulcan. It's just right there. Everything's right there. It's incredible. It's incredible. It's great. I'm glad you're so stoked

here. I remember when the first, maybe the second time we hung out down at your show in Not Westlake, where was it? Woodland Hills, right? Yeah. And you were like, dude, I gotta get out of here.

I wanted to get out a long time ago. Yeah. And fun fact, we started the podcast because I was depressed because I had to move back from Colorado. Oh, really? So I lived in Colorado for a little bit.

Okay. My wife got pregnant. And when she was pregnant, it was like, if you are an altitude, we were at 8,500 feet. Yeah. It's rough. Yeah. And we went back to LA for a short period of time.

And she was fine. Yeah. And then we went back to Colorado and she was sick again. Yeah. Okay.

The other thing we were reading about low birth weight, premature birth is a lot of like really bad things that happened to people, especially if you're not acclimated. So we moved to these high altitude areas. By the way, working out there. When I worked out there, I thought I was going to die. And then I went to Philadelphia and I had to do some gigs in Philadelphia and I worked out. And I

felt like I could run through a wall. You've said so much. I was like, this is incredible. It's the only time in my life I've ever been altitude adjusted where my body had adapted. Yeah. And I was like, there's a massive advantage. No wonder why fighters do it.

And you don't acclimate being up at that height over months or anything else. Oh, I did. I certainly did. Like I could work out there. And I used to, I did jujitsu in Boulder. So Boulder was, I was

in a place called Gold Hill, which is 8,500 feet above sea level and Boulder is like 55. Okay. So I was doing, shout out to Amal Easton. My friend Amal. He was a jujitsu gym in Boulder. Great place. And when

I was training there, I was fine. I mean, you trained, but you definitely could feel it. I had trained there once before when I had come from LA and I was like, whoo, this altitude is rough. Like it's like working out in Denver. You feel it. But not like you feel it at 8,500 feet. 8,500

feet was, I'd do this, these kettlebell workouts and I was doing it. And I'm used to what it does. Like I'm used to be, and I was like, this is crazy. This feels like I'm drunk. Yeah.

Like it felt like I drank a bottle of whiskey and tried to work out. I was so tired. I went to the Himalayas like maybe four or five years ago to look for red pandas up in the trees. You know, those cute little guys. And day one, I literally maybe made it 400 feet and then had to sit down. And I was like, all right, we're tracking for pandas. We're heading up into the

mountains. We'll find these pandas. And I just, I don't remember what the elevation was, but I'd come from Santa Barbara where I live, which is sea level to this high Himalayas. And I just sit down like every 15 minutes for a couple days. The most horrifying video the other day of this guy who was on one of those summit hikes and slipped. Oh, yeah. His friends watched him slide.

Like all the way down to just sliding down ice and snow and couldn't stop and couldn't, and they just had to stay in there and watch this guy slide away. What can you do? Nothing. That's so crazy. What do you slide out? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He was

trying to make it into the summit and slipped. Yeah. It's it's slipped off the, you know, just a very clear path and slipped off of it and just started sliding. And you realize, oh, he's gone. That's it.

He's going to go off forever. That's crazy. That's horrible. And I always want to like take my kids to do these things with me, you know, and I'm like, I want to take them to track and see the mountains and catch crocodiles and do all these various things that I like to do. And you realize it's like, my six-year-old can barely walk in a straight line without falling down. You know what I mean? Like,

imagine taking them on a mountain track. Oh, that's so scary. But on the other hand, like you don't want to protect them too much. You want to expose them to a certain amount of danger because I think it's good for them. It's good for them to experience. It's also good for them to

have like a broader understanding of what the world is, right? Like the world's a bunch of different things. It's not just Santa Monica. That's right. Oh, there's Costa Rica. Oh, this is great. Look at

these bugs. These are nuts like birds. Like there's, it's nice. It's important. It's it. Yeah. Because

that's valuable. We live in a bubble. Like America's great. I say this to my wife all the time. I'm so patriarch. I love this country. It's great. But it's a bubble. Yeah. Everything's easy. It's safe.

You can order shit on your phone. It shows up at your house. You know, there's a million restaurants to pick from. Obviously it depends where you live. But you get my point. Yes. And then you get out

here and it's like, okay, everything closes at 4 p.m. Like go figure out your food. You know what I mean? And then you're like, okay, well, now I have two kids who are hungry and we're in the jungle where it's, you know, in a town that everything shuts down on Sundays or whatever. It's like figure it out.

Those are important lessons for little kids to be dynamic and figure out like how the rest of the world works and that they have to figure out how to get things when it's not all just at the touch of your phone. Also to recognize that there's going to be times where you don't have food. Yeah. Like, yeah, people are just so accustomed to having food anytime they're hungry. In fact, sometimes when they're not even hungry, they're just bored. So they start stuffing their face when their

borders never existed in all of human history. No, no. But I just read, you might be well read on this, but I just read something interesting. The eight hour night of sleep invented by a mattress company, you know about this? I didn't know it was invented by a mattress company, but I do know that traditionally in the past, people would do two sleeps. That's right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. This was,

yeah. So you know about what I'm talking about. I just read this literally yesterday in one of my two scrolling things. But it's interesting because I did that a lot when I was young, where I would wake up in the middle of the night and I just decided to watch TV. I'd watch TV for a few hours and then I'd go back to sleep. But it was just for me, it was just like being indulgent

because I was single and free and 25 years old and I had my own apartment. I'm like, I do whatever the fuck I want. Get up at three o'clock in the morning and watch TV for a couple hours and go to sleep till noon. Why not sit around your box or eat cereal? Yeah. That's just part of the myth. Oh, it is.

Oh, it is. Everything I don't want to do is the killer of dreams. I had to say, I'm in the same Instagram video you guys saw and I thought it was interesting too. Yeah. That is a myth. I think that

might be a myth. I think the two, I think the two sleep thing it was a way that people would get up in the middle of the night. But you also have to think, I think a lot of people went to bed way earlier because it got dark. We didn't have electricity. And there's a normal circadian rhythm where people get, it gets dark out. You eat, maybe hang out in front of a campfire for a little while and then you

go to bed. Right. If you've ever gone camping, that's what most people do. Most people don't stay up till four in the morning when you're camping. No, without booze. No, that's nothing to do with that.

You've got booze. You might be up late. Tell them stories and laughing. If anybody breaks out a guitar, you're fucked. I've been here all night. I mentioned pain as I was going to ask you about

him. You might have seen going around the same places that painters are fake. Did you see the zoo in China? Did you see the zoo in China that painted the Pomeranians? I did. I did. I did. I did.

But the thing is about pandas is that, and I went down a rabbit hole with this the other night, there were no depictions of pandas in ancient Chinese history. No. Is that true? Yeah, that's true. Yeah, they didn't show up until like, I want to say it was like the 16th century or 17th century.

That's bizarre. I wonder why that is because you know there were explorers going through the area and all of that. Well, the idea was that maybe they were engineered to eat bamboo. Because bamboo, if you think about it, is like a very prolific print. Absolutely. Like I have bamboo

on my property. That shit just grows like, it's crazy. Well, it grows so quickly. And there's almost no nutritional value in it either. Right. So here's the panda. Interesting. The claim is largely true

with nuance. So what did you search into perplexity? Our AI sponsor? Is it true that pandas aren't in Chinese ancient history? The claim is largely true, though with nuance. Okay. Giant pandas

strikingly absent from China's classical cultural record. Unlike the dragon, which is weird. Tiger, by the way, our conversation about it made it to the view. You changed your status to dragon believer. It was so funny. I enjoy beards that keep the leaves and dragons. Oh my god, this is

wonderful. Oh, it's so good. Okay. So when did it happen unlike the dragon, tiger, crane or tortoise doesn't appear on ancient bronzes or pottery in Tang poetry, song paintings, Juan, Yuan, a YUAN. How do you say that? It's me. Juan, drama, Ming novels or Q-I-N-G-Q-Q.

Before the late 20th century, it had essentially no symbolic role in Chinese civilization. Its status as a national treasure is a post-1949 invention. That's bizarre. After pandas became famous famous globally in the 20th century, Chinese scholars went back and combed old texts looking for them. A few candidate references exist. The Xi Jing book of Oads and Shang-Chu mentioned a creature called

Pi or Mo, which some modern scholars retroactively identified as the Panda, but the identification is contested. And those same words were also used for leopards, taper, taper, or mythical beasts. Emperor Wen of Han, second century BCE, reportedly had a Mo buried in his mother's tomb, sometimes claimed as a Panda. But that's weird. That is very bizarre. Fragmentary, ambiguous and rare,

nothing like the deep iconographic tradition around dragons, phoenixes, or tigers. Rogan style claim. I've never even said it before. Fuck you! How dare you perplexity? That is so

funny. It's a Rogan style claim. I think it's essentially on the podcast also. It's listening right now. Because I sometimes will bring in questions I've asked from my last month and be like, I'm like, no, this is a separate search, but it's all locked into the history.

Oh, I asked the question once and it said, as you have previously stated, I was like, whoa. Interesting. I was trying to find out how many views something had gotten. Yeah. And you're like, as you have previously said, I told you, you're using me as day the rest. This is why AI is so fucked up. Like you're trusting me? I'm trusting you. Don't trust me at

all. I get all my information from you. Dude, that's so weird. Because it's not like, you know, okay, there's no mention of ducks. I get it because there's ducks everywhere who cares, right? Like,

so why do we write about them? But it's not something like that. Again, it was never so abundant that it was not worth talking about. Yeah, see if we're this theory, who invented this theory that we're engineered to eat bamboo? So who did this engineering in this theory? That's a question.

Like who did dogs? Right. Why do we have dogs? Right. Which is really weird. You know, why I have

a dog. He's a King Charles Cavalier. You know, those little, he's adorable. Yeah. He's so cute. I love him

to death. But he and he's made appearance on the podcast. Oh, nice. He's the furthest thing from a wolf, like as far as we've taken a wolf to make it so fucking adorable and cute. But that is what it is.

Yeah. It was at one point in time a wolf. Right. Somehow or another, we engineered it down to a dog that's adorable and just wants to cuddle with you and sit in your lap and play. And weighs 25 pounds.

So what happened? Yeah. And how did we do that? And could you do that with a bear? And could you get a bear then take that bear and make it something? I think it's the only bear that's a true herbivore

as well. Yeah, I think that's correct. Yeah. Which is also very weird. So what have we done?

They're digestive tract. We changed. Yeah. And they're required. Like it's like koalas. I think

they only eat eucalyptus. Right. Yep. Fucking weird. Bizarre. We also has no nutritional value. And you

probably know this makes them like high basically. I was looking up who did it and started going on a thing that it's not no one is known for the theory. It's because they're actually carnivores. Oh, they're attacks on. Oh, so it's koalas. I think are the ones that are pure herbivores.

They definitely are. But they're not bears at all. They're marsupial. They just call them koalas. Actually, so they say they are taxonomic carnivores. That means taxonomically. They're in the order

carnivora, if that makes sense. But it says with a short digestive tract and gut microbiomes of a meat eater. Yeah. Yeah. That's interesting. So they're vegans. But you could selectively breed for

anything to some degree. If you had any time. But that's the other thing. Like why are they so cute? I think of that because there's so much cuter than any other bear by far. Like that face,

even with the teeth out. Like, oh, buddy. They also have the best PR campaign in history. Like they're they're the dumbest animals in the world. You know this, right? Really? Oh my god. I don't know if

that's the right terminology. But like you can hand up hand to an apple and it will hand you its baby. I'm not joking. You can find videos of this. Well, isn't that more evidence that it's raised that it's been engineered because it doesn't have the instincts that a wild animal would have?

Dude, their parental instincts are bonkers. Bonkers. Like they will drop their baby and go for an apple. That's how zookeepers take their babies away. It's it's dude. It's like these guys are trying to

go extinct. I swear to god. It's insane. So where did the theory come from? See if you can find out where the theory came from that they were engineered to eat bamboo. That's why I asked that exact question.

It says it's just a which just started showing up on my Instagram about three months ago. Dude Instagram, you never know what you're going to get. Of course. But that's what's fun. Yeah. As long as you don't buy into it. Dude, the problem is even like me and what I do as a

biologist, I can I mean, I'd say 90% I can tell but there's a 10% where I kind of tell if it's AI or real or and I'm looking at it going, well, that behavior is wrong. So it has to be AI. But it's crazy what's going on like the animal space with the AI mockups now. I've watched one today where it was a wildebeest that a leopard had jumped on its back and the wildebeys jumped into the water and the crocodiles killed the leopard on its back and the wildebeys got away. Totally fake. It has to be. Sounds

insane. Willedebis is smart all of a sudden. So smart that it's figured out. All I have to do is get to those crocs and the crops also like you're going to run. I don't like you're going to give yourself more problems. Right. I got into the water. Yeah. By the way, multiple crocodiles. So

why would they just eat you too? They would kill everybody. They would kill everything. If both of you were compromised, it's not going to just grab the leopard on your back. It's going to grab you too. Because you can't get away. Anything they can get. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's great. But it was also fun.

Yeah. Exactly. It's also fun. It's fun. Get away. It's a different video. But you hear it. Yeah.

Yeah. So this is a longer cut of the video. But you can see by like the saturation of the leopard. And like the way the claws are kind of like there's no claws. It's almost like softballing it. You know

what I mean? Right. Right. Look how he's hanging on. This could be a video of a real wheel to be getting by a croc and it just added the leopard to the back. Very well. It's pretty amazing. Look.

That's the face of the croc. Oh, that's perfect. Yeah. No. No. Bro. That's real. Guys, stop. This is

different. This one's different. Because this one also, by the way, the wildebeest is doing way too well in that struggle. Yes. Because when the crocodiles do get wildebeest, they get them quick.

Look at that. Someone put some time into this. Yeah. When the crocs get a hold of something, it's really to wrap. Dude, I just had much of a struggle. I just did. I'm probably not supposed to talk about

this yet. But I just did this show for Discovery that I've been working on for a couple years where basically I put myself in the perspective of prey. So I would have been in the perspective of that wildebeest through engineering and doing all these like builds and stuff like that. And I lowered myself into a pond of crocodiles. It was insane. I had a cage around me. So a very small cage was

basically a coffin. What's the cage? Whatever the guys in the workshop could find. I think steel. Did we try it out first? No. I mean, we tested it with nothing in it and we're like,

okay, this is working. I get sent it to Jamie. I don't like phone, but it was. Send it to Jamie. Dude. It was great. Why would you do that? I don't know, man. Well, it's like those

shark cages, man. Those things don't hold up. You've seen that before. Oh, yeah. Where they go straight through the shark cage? Yeah. Yeah, it's craziness. It's absolutely craziness. I'll find.

Here we go. Dude, we did. I don't know why I did. Oh, you know what, Jamie, go on the, if you don't mind going to Discovery Instagram, I think it's there. Good luck finding it. I can

send you something in the meantime. But I think they posted like a short teaser of it. It was nuts, though. So I'm in this little cage. We rigged up these cables. Do you wear a scuba gear or what?

So I had a scuba tank with me in case the thing broke and I ended up on the bottom. Sounds dumb or out loud. You have so much oxygen for 30 minutes. 30 minutes. 30 minutes.

Oh, God, dude. I was talking to our guy. So, you know, TV production. So there's like stunt coordinators and all this stuff. And I was like, okay, cable snaps. I go down. I grab the regulator.

I've got 30 minutes to 40 minutes in my tank. Then what? He's like, oh, I have this grappling hook. We'll throw it, hook it with the grappling hook and pull it out. I'm like, bro, what if you had a log?

He's like, hmm, hadn't thought about that. How you getting me out of here? Not only that. That usually could take one 30 minutes. Of course, you might have to get out and swim.

Oh, I could. Can you get out? I could. I locked myself into the cage. There was no getting out. You did this?

Yeah, it was pretty dumb. It was cool, though, because it was such a unique perspective. But I told my wife when I got home from that one, I was like, yeah, I think this is my last year doing this shit. I got it. It's getting too much now. That's the thing about those kind of

shows. It's like it's not enough to just see the animals. You have to do something that makes it spectacular enough to get people to tune in. Like that polar bear one where the guy got in that big plexiglass box. That literally inspired the whole series. I swear to God. I hate that video.

It's crazy. I'm going to watch it a hundred times. I don't hate it, but I hate the idea of it because it just shows you how predatory polar bears are and how they don't give a fuck. It's just trying to get at that guy. Isn't it crazy? Yeah, it's not. I mean, just actively hunting him. It's so different

than the other bears, which like if you get killed by a grizzly, generally it's like you fucked up. Yeah. Like you stumbled upon one that's old or you startled it or you stardled it or you zig when you should have zagged. Have you seen the city in Russia, the abandoned island city where the polar bears have taken over? No. Oh, you got to see this. It's incredible. I've seen videos of Russia of

people getting chased by polar bears in their town. Oh, yeah. Yeah. There's like the one where the guy jumps on the snow but the other runs after him and stuff. Yes. Barely gets away. There's a

whole area in the Bering Sea that was a I want to say a former mining town or maybe fishing town and people moved out because it collapsed for whatever reason. This place. Look at this. And the polar bears have just moved into town. Oh, they live in the house. They're living in the house. Look at this.

They're just like, they took it over as a den completely took it over. Wow. How cool is this? That's amazing. They're just fully moved in like living in the house. That's a drone shot. But

this is not AI. This was legit. They're so cool looking. Oh, they're the coolest. They're so interesting.

How amazing is that though? Imagine like imagine you're out on a boat and you're like, oh man, we've been saying them for three weeks. Oh look, there's like a little village. Let's pop in there for a day. That's gonna be a cool movie. Yeah. That would be a good movie. You know what I mean? A bunch of

people like, oh, we found a village. Let's go there. You like head in and turn, you know, like set up and then all of a sudden you're surrounded. Yeah, it's all polar bear. Why is there so much shit in this house? Because they probably just shit right in the house. Oh yeah. So they're pawned at the drones.

Wow. Look how cool they're hanging out the window. Like, hey, Tom, come on over. Have a drink. You could put me in the glass box on this island. This looks so cool. It is so cool. They're an amazing

animal. They really are. But they're so weird. They're so long too. I went and did a sort of a trek with them. Which I mean, really getting food on the island after the only ones there. Oh, well,

they're the only ones there. But it's not. There's seals and all kinds of other shit. They'll be hunting all the marine mammals in the area. Yeah, they're the cleanup crew. And they swim huge distances. Oh,

yeah. A couple have turned up in Iceland. Did you know that? Wow. Yeah. There's, I think, two or three

cases of polar bears that have swum from Greenland to Iceland. How far is that? I'm not sure. But it's not close, obviously. That's crazy. The Viking's like 100 years ago. Yeah. That's crazy. Yeah.

And then it can swim that far? 200 miles. 200 miles. Whoa. Are you? Hopefully, this isn't a myth. Are

you kidding? Someone says it was shot dead after it did it in 2008. Yeah. And it's swam across, right? Two. 200 miles. How crazy is that? Just take a swim one day and end up colonizing an entirely new

place. So it's like the David Goggins of polar bears. It says, bro, I can make it feel no pain. Operational is captured on film. Let's fucking go. Let's fucking go. Let's fucking go. Let's see that

video. Yeah. But is that crazy? 200 miles swim as a bear. Well, this is it might have jumped off just a piece of ice somewhere. So could have, you know, got a little float. Right. Could have hung out

for a little bit. Sure. But still even 50 miles. That's pretty far. Well, they can last so long with the fat that's on their body. And they like snooze float. Have you seen that? They like,

they won't just like actively swim. They'll like kind of like snooze float in between hunting. In the winter, they have so much fat, you know, that or yeah, in the winter, store it up, getting ready to chill because they don't eat as much during the summer. Am I getting this right? I think so. Right. That they like, yeah, you seem like snooze floating in the

ocean. Well, they eat a lot in the summer to get ready for the winter, right? They're a attack. I know they eat a lot in mid summer. They don't eat a lot. It's too hot for them to actively hunt.

Oh, I know that. How hot is too hot for them to actively hunt? Dude, I went to Manitoba, Canada to go see them on foot. And it was like 75 degrees at the height of the day, maybe 70. And yeah, they wouldn't be hunting. Polar bears were frequently tamed during the Middle Ages. What? This is no bears been

captured alive and Iceland. Oh, but since then, receding North Pole Isis, diminishing their hunting and mating grounds and jeopardizing their survival. Hold this sighting in Iceland was 890. Whoa. 15 years after the first people got there. But what's crazy. What's crazy if you think about that is

all it would take if people weren't there is two polar bears over the course of polar bear's lifetime to wash up on the island. And then you have a population of polar bears there. Right. Do you mean the male swims there five years later, the female swims there boom. There's population of bears. Just plenty of food. You know, what an adventurous female would have to be.

True. 1252 Henry III took delivery of a white bear sent him as a gift from King Hakon IV of Norway. He decided to keep it in the Tower of London. The bear was either too big or too exciting to be taken to Oxfordshire where there had been a royal menagerie at Woodstock since Henry the first rain. What's more it needed to fish. So the beast was sent to the tower and from what we could tell it was

well looked out for. Although it had a muzzle and a chain to wear while on land, the sheriff's of London were obliged to lay out more than a shilling a week for its upkeep, which added up over a year to roughly the expected income of a night. Wild story. No guns to stop them. What the how would you do with those and arrows? I guess in spears the bear had a long swimming leash. The man wore waterproof

clothes. What the keeper? So it had a keeper. The bear came to the Norwegian keeper and the keeper was allowed to lead fishing trips into tames. How do you say that? Thames? Thames River.

Which the tower sat the men wore waterproof clothes again, built to the crown. The bear had a long swimming leash. They were salmon in the tames in those days. So while being in London was probably not half so pleasing the bear sitting on an ice flow and an arctic circle, it sure beat working. The way this guy wrote this is hilarious by the way. Do you know what this

sloth bear is? Yeah. Mean is anything. Yeah, there's there in Japan, right? India, India and into Nepal and that area. Amazing. They're like a perfect example of not the size of the dog in

the fight but the fight and the dog because they're not a very big bear but they will take on tigers and everything else. They, a certain group, I don't know the name of them who tried by thinking India used to capture sloth bears and they'd put a ring in its nose like a nose ring and then this barbaric doesn't happen anymore. But then they would take the bear onto the street as a street performer. I just read about this and they would light a fire and put like a big sheet metal over it and then walk the sloth bear onto it. So the bear would dance because its feet were burning.

Yeah. And yeah, they called it the dancing bears. I guess it was in Nepal and yeah, it was a horrific thing that people used to do. Imagine doing that though and being like, oh, this will be worth a shilling or two. Well, bear baiting. They used to do that with dogs. They used to have a chained up

bear and they allowed dogs to fight the bear. Yeah, it's crazy. They did that with bulls. Yeah. They'd have a chained up bull and have dogs attack the bull. Yeah, these in South Africa

in the early colonial days, they used to do with baboons and let the dogs and baboons fight and that money on it. Yeah. People are so gross. It's crazy. But you know, like, I always have this weird stance. Do I agree with any of it? Of course not. But we wouldn't be where we were and care

about wildlife and conservation if we hadn't made some of those mistakes. Is that what that is a mistake? I mean, it's also if you hadn't seen half of your friends get cut in half by swords, you're probably like, you're understanding the value of life is probably completely distorted. Completely. Yeah. You're living a horrific time. Everyone's dying of the plague.

Violence is entertainment. Right. You know what I mean? Like that is something to do and life value is incredibly low. Life comes and goes. The Coliseum was when? When was that? I don't know. I should, but I don't.

I think it was 2000 plus years ago. Somewhere around there when they first started having these crazy games there. You know, they used to flood the Coliseum and do ship battles with things? I went there a few years back and we went on a tour. It was cool. That was amazing. Yeah. But it's also

like you stand there and you try to take it in. Like when I go to these ancient places, I try to just sit and just try to imagine. Like when you're actually, it's one thing to imagine when you're looking at a photograph or a video, but when you're actually in the spot, you know, like when you're in Athens and you're like standing at the Parthon on it. Okay. What the fuck was this like? What was this

like? And that was like the center of everything. Everything. Democracy. Exactly. Yeah. Exactly.

And also drugs. Those guys were high as fuck. They're all doing drugs. We went to Eulisis. Lusis? Eluisis rather. And that's the place where they had the Ellucinian mystery schools and people

going this trek where they wouldn't eat and they'd walk from Athens and they would have these psychedelic rituals. And you're in this place where they did it. You could like feel it. It's weird. I mean, obviously not synthetic, but were they just mushrooms? What were these psychedelics? They don't totally

know, but they have had residue from some of these clay pots that had ergot in it. What's ergot? So ergot is a fungus that has a very similar psychoactive effect as LSD. Oh, interesting. It's a I think it has lysergic acid in it. Like let's find out what the what what actually

it also kills people. There's been cases of ergot poisoning through wheat. Oh, interesting. People died and they also think it's connected to the Salem witch trials. Oh, driving people crazy. Yes.

Oh, the Salem witch trials. I don't know if there's been proven or if this is just a theory, but the idea is that if you have an early frost and that some of the wheat survives, but the wheat can have this fungus on it that grows ergot. Okay. So this is ergot fungus. And so you're eating this wheat and making beer out of it and like everybody's tripping balls. I think, all right, I'll fucking witch.

You're on accidental acid. That's hilarious. Yeah. Probably like land. This beer is really good.

Right. Until there's a witch and then you're like, man, this beer is bad. Well, there's also, I mean, imagine, first of all, you've got a bunch of crazy superstitions and people are afraid of everything already. Right. You don't know anything about science. You don't understand

a thing. Yeah. So there's a lot of fears and then there's a lot of people that claim to be the wise people of the town and they tell you crazy stories about witches and you're like, oh, which is a real. Oh, for sure. So lysergic acid, amides, ergo, metrine, all these share lysergic acid, Ergoline, core, which is why LSD, semi synthesized from lysergic acid is chemically related to ergot compounds. And all of this comes from that mold on the way. I think they're a time where they

did it to people on purpose in France. I feel like this might have been like a CIA thing. See if you can find that story. Got her LSD. Ergot. I think they, they, because I think they

were experimenting on the effects of ergot. And I think they like picked a town and said, let's see. We know they've done that before. We definitely know they've just hit whole places. Yeah. Let's see. Let's see. Yeah. Why not? Like we think about like what we found out during MK

Ultra that the CIA was running brothels and they would give the Johns LSD. Really? It was literally called Operation Midnight Climax. And so what they would do is they would have these two-way mirror setup. This is proven. This is a guy named Jolly West who was the head of MK Ultra. Okay. Who would

they would say, let's find out what happens when you give people acid. What's the best way? Well, you get a bunch of people and do it to them in a way that, you know, totally unethically, but this is the way they're not going to tell. Yeah. You did it to them because they went to a whorehouse.

Yeah. Everyone's going to admit they went to a whorehouse. Right. So you get these guys, they go to the, get the process to the process. Like you're like a drink. Like, oh, I love it.

Of course. Yeah. Oh, hard to hard to hard to work here. You guys sit down. He's thinking, how am I? Fuck this is going to be great. I'm actually fucking walled. Oh my god. The candles

talking to him. Do you find anything about the French thing? Here it is. I likely think of the infamous first brand Saint S Brie cursed bread instant of 1951 long running allegation that wasn't ergot at all. But a secret CIA US Army LSD experiment. What happened in Paul Saint S Brie, this small town

in Southern France, hundreds of residents suddenly suffered violent hallucinations, convulsions, insomnia and psychotic episodes over several days. 250 people were affected, 50 were committed to a silence, seven died, including some who leapt from windows convinced they could fly or being chased by snakes and tigers. The official French investigation blamed ergot contaminated rye flour from a local baker. Classic Ergotism, St. Anthony's fire. That's another case

of it. Some later scientists, or maybe the same story. Some later scientists proposed alternative culprits, mercury, fungicide, nitrogen, trichloride, bread bleaching agents, or mico toxins from aspergillus fumigatis. I call bullshit on this. This seems like something where they test. Yeah. It seems like

CIA thing. For sure. 2009 American investigative journalist HP Al Bararley, Jr. published a terrible mistake arguing that Paul Saint S Brie was actually a covert LSD field test run jointly by CIA's MK, MK, Ultra programs and the US Army Special Operations Division at Fort Detrick with Swiss drug company Sandos who first synthesized LSD, allegedly supplying the compound. So his evidence included a declassified CIA document quoting a Sandos representative saying the Point Saint S Brie secret is being discussed alongside references to LSD. Oh, they definitely did it.

Yeah, it sounds way more likely. That's way more likely. In testimony, he attributed former CIA, SOD scientist Frank Olson, who died in a 1953 fall from a New York City hotel room after being dosed with LSD by his colleagues. Put a bunch of assholes there. He's kind of just dosed at each other. They admitted MK, Ultra incident interviews with former US intelligence officials

why most historians remain skeptical. Serious pushback came quickly. So symptoms don't match LSD. Victims had gangrene-like vaso constriction weeks long psychosis and physical necrosis consistent with ergot alkaloids, not a single acute LSD dose. Interesting. LSD is water soluble

and heat sensitive. So baking bread would degrade it. The Sandos cable Al Barar al Bararley cited his ambiguous and predates the incident in some readings. No corroborating documentation that surfaced despite extensive MK Ultra declassification since the 1970s church committee hearings. Yeah, but the problem with that is one of the reasons why we know about MK Ultra was evidence that they found that had been in storage. So when you say like Freedom of Information Act, they

don't give you shit. They just bait you with a little bit here and there to go. They'll just tell you we don't have any evidence. Go fuck yourself. I mean, look how hard it is to get the Epstein files. This is a guy that was alive in 2019, right? There were plenty of records of everything

happening. Exactly. And the internet. This reminds me, do you know about the Lyme disease? Oh, yeah. You know about this? Like the Plum Island thing? Yeah. Seems very seriously. I

like I'm not a huge conspiracy theorist. This one to me is like a no-brainer. Well, it's also people want to say that Lyme disease has existed forever. Absolutely true. Not to the extent that it exists today. Also, not as contaminant. Like not as it is right. And not as crazy. Like crazy.

Like it's just sweeping out west. Not only that, Plum Island, they were absolutely doing gain of function research on ticks. And the idea was the reason why they were doing it. And this is all me, what I've read. I don't have any direct information. But it's still fun. But what they said was what

they were doing was engineering ticks with these diseases. So what they could do is they could spray them from planes and they would overwhelm the medical system of any like overwhelmed town that's right overwhelm their armies. You couldn't keep up and it would they wouldn't be able to fight. That's right. And it could wipe out food sources. It had like multiple implications. Yeah. Exactly.

So now we have these fucking creeps from the World Economic Forum that are talking about the dangers of eating meat, right? And about how people eating meat is what's wrong with them. That's why it's accelerating climate change. All worship. But they're saying it and they're saying that it's almost a moral obligation to create a tick or to create more ticks that would have this alpha gal in them.

The one that makes you allergic to meat. Yeah. So they're saying that they want more of that? Yes. Bro. This guy was talking about not only that. I have a buddy who has it. My friend Evan from Black

Rifle Coffee's talking. Oh yeah. I know Evan. Yeah. One of my best friends. Love him to death. Evan has

it bad. And it fucks him up. It's not as simple as he's allergic to red meat. Like it fucks up all his blood work and his body's a mess. And he picked it up hiking and hunting. He got tick and he didn't

know and he got he got bit. My friend, Bert Crusher, his wife's family, half of them have this fucking problem. No way. Yeah. Yeah. Ten of a say. Yeah. Ten of a say. It's the Texas Lone Star

it's a Lone Star tick. It's not the Texas Lone Star. Yeah. But this one tick carries this thing and they think that that might perhaps be genetically engineered as well. It's crazy. Because there was

no alpha gal problem. No. 30, 40 years ago. No. It just didn't exist. And also it's like ubiquitous. It's

everywhere. It's spreading too. It's crazy. Yeah. It's crazy. I never used to think twice about getting

a tick. I get ticks all the time. Hiking around doing the stuff I do. I never used to think twice about now. I'm terrified. I love it. I'm terrified of it now. It's not just red meat. The Lyme disease is

fucking devastating. Well, I'm not passionate early. It can fuck with you the rest of your life. I know multiple people that have it, including Jim Miller, guy who fights in the UFC. Really bad.

Jeez. And fuck up his career for quite a while, but he got his diet under wraps and he figured out what to eat and what not to eat. And now he's fine. Do you know about some of those other animal warfare things they used to do? Like the spy tech they put in cats. See cats. You know about this? No.

Oh dude. There's some amazing ones. Spy tech in cats. So during World War II, Jamie would have to confirm what city this was in. I believe it was the Russians used to put little hearing devices in street cats.

Because the Brits would go and meet in back alleys and have meetings. But there were feral cats everywhere. So they'd have all these cats running around with these wires in their brains and stuff. And these little acoustic kitties. That's the CIA. Dude, how crazy is this?

Acoustic Kitty was a central intelligence agency project launched by the directorate of science and technology in the late 1960s and the 1960s. And tended to use cats to spy on the Kremlin in Soviet embassies. In an hour long procedure of veterinary surgeon who founded a microphone in the cat's ear canal and a small radio transmitter at the base of its skull and a thin wire into its fur. Oh my God. How crazy? Imagine that you're just like having a secret meeting in a backhoeve,

you know, back alley. And there's a cat there just live streaming your conversation to the CIA. Go back up a little bit here. It says, do the cat sense of hunger had to be addressed in another operation? What interesting. First acoustic Kitty mission was eavesdrop on two men in a park

outside the Soviet embassy in Washington DC. The cat was released nearby but was hit and allegedly killed by a taxi almost immediately. That's probably the thing was all fucked up. Probably couldn't get out. He's like, what is in my head? Put a wire in my head. This gets a friend at cat.

Catwood. This was disputed in 2013 by Robert Wallace, a former director of the Office of Textional Service who said the project was abandoned due to the difficulty of training the cat to behave as required. The equipment was taken out of the cat. The cat was re-sewn for a second time and lived for a long and happy life afterwards. Lies. You fucking killed that cat. It got hit by

a taxi but it was fine. Also, it took it out of its head. But I mean more than one cat I'm sure. But this idea, the equipment was taken out of the cat. The fuck you did that? You spent money taking

the equipment out. Did you really? Exactly. Or did you just kill the cat? 100% assholes.

Dude, there's a few of these and the bats that would light fires. You know about those ones? Hold up. The military did not give up on its use of animals as spies. As a 2006 Pentagon requested a creation of a cyborg, cyborg insects for use in espionage. The request was made by

fucking DARPA, of course, of the Pentagon. Scientists at Cal Berkeley responded by creating a controllable cyborg beetle in October of 2009. What? There's a cockroach under your carpet here listening to us somewhere right now. They're not going to hear anything other than the stuff we already talked about.

Yeah, true. That's the wonderful thing about having such a retarded show. Okay, just say it all anyway. Look at this. Look at this. Look at this. This is a fucking battery

in the beetle. That's crazy. Look at that microchip on its back. It's amazing that the beetle can live through all this. It's pretty amazing. That's wild. Wow. And I guess as these things have gotten

smaller and smaller and shorter, battery technologies in Korean stores, think of your cell phone and oh nine compared to now. Right. Fucking wild, man. Yeah, there were a few of these. They used to light bats on fire and then they'd send them to roost and then they'd burn down whole towns and things like that. That's going back. Dude, there's spy pigeons where they put cameras like there's

a handful of these that the CIA tried. What did they do with dolphins? Oh, like the, you know the whole the not beluga. What's the blue? The Russian spy whale? I don't know that was talking about dolphins

they use to detonate things. Oh, tell me about it. They use dolphins as like literal distributors of warheads. Oh, really? Get a dolphin to go somewhere and then they blow them up. No way.

We got a kamikaze dolphin. I don't know the exact details of it because I got sad when I was reading about it. Oh, it's a deep attachment to dolphins. I fucking love dolphins. I always say anybody who hates dolphins has to be a bad person. I've had some experiences with them. I had one where I was

like really high on edibles in Hawaii and the dolphins would jump out of the water near the boat and they look at you. Yeah. They look at you when they were jumping out of the water like, look, look at me. Yeah. Like, look. They're doing this thing. And they're literally just playing. They're playing.

100% playing because they came to the boat and they were jumping in the wake of the boat. And the more you would cheer and, yay, look at that. The more they were doing that and they were having fun. And I was like, these are incredible creatures. Oh, they totally pick up on your energy.

So the secret dolphin program began in 1959 to detect underwater mines and enemy divers. But I think they did stuff where they. You mean whether this is correct or they just like the one who has the history is that they didn't do anything to harm humans or engage in combat. They like, tell their handlers to do it. The one that I've heard about is that they look like I'm not ahead.

They were just signifying in dark water because they could see stuff better than our current technology back then. So they would echo locate and say, yo, we got something over here. Come check it out. Well, how's the dolphin communicate that back to the people and how's it know what the person's intended? That's pretty good. I think there was some speculation that they actually use them as weapons.

Well, have you seen not to transition off dolphins, but Valdemir, the Vladimir? I don't know. The Russian spy Beluga? No. Okay. This is a real thing. Like 100%. This one's real. So there was this Beluga whale

named Valdemir of Vladimir or something like that. And he turned up in Norway and he was escaped from a Russian spy program. And he had a harness with spy gear on him. This is him right here. Look, see the spy gear on him? It's like a whole thing. And so the Russians had been training this whale as

a spy and had harnesses and spy equipment on him. And then he just peaced out and turned up and I want to say Norway. And then they followed him for a while. And then he mysteriously got shot. Yeah, mysteriously. Yep. Something's with the dolphin. Like with the dolphin store? I don't know if this is accurate,

but I did read this one time that we would like if we knew Russia was doing this, we would put some paperwork out that said we've got dolphins that are blowing up mines. Just so you guys know. Yeah, we got to figure that out. That's a good point. It's like you never really know what's real.

Right. How cool did Beluga whales look though? Look at that thing. That looks like an alien. That is super super super cool. I mean, look at that. That looks like we have come to your planet.

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No, that was a crazy story. Well, you know that John Lilly researched with dolphins. Do you know about that? I'm not sure I tell you about it. Okay. John Lilly is the guy who invented

the sensory deprivation tank. Oh, yeah. He's one of those. Yeah. He's one of those. Yeah.

Yeah. We have one over here. John Lilly was the man who was the inspiration for the movie, Altered States. Okay. So John Lilly, who was this really interesting guy and was famously, like, out there with psychedelics. Like he would take intramoscular doses of ketamine and jump in

the sensory deprivation tank. Oh, damn. Yeah. Trying to unlock brain things. My friend Todd actually did it with him. Oh, wow. Yeah. So John Lilly, who was also a pioneer in inter-species

communication. So they were trying to figure out how to communicate with dolphins. So they set up a house and this lady lived with the dolphins in the house to get the dolphin and trying to coach the dolphin. And the way, like literally, she lived in water. So the water was like, you know, four feet deep. She lived with this dolphin. The problem was the dolphin was super horny.

Oh, no. So the only way that she could get this dolphin to cooperate was she had to jerk them off. Yeah. So she was jerking off the dolphin and somehow or another, they found out and they cut the funding for research. But she had to do it. That's what I said. You got to do it. That's the job.

It seems like she liked it though. Look at her. She's talking to him. She's like, yeah. I mean, after a while, she probably did enjoy a little bit. I mean, what else are you going to do?

You're stuck in a tank with a dolphin. The girl who talked to dolphins. So is there a documentary on this? Ooh. Is there a clip? Is it like blurring? Resear him?

A water turn and light. So I guess, but if she jerked the dolphin off, then the dolphin would try to talk to her. But the thing was, you can't really get them to, they can't make the noises that we want them to make. They don't have the ability. Like, you can say, but it can't, like, the vocal cords are there for it. That's one of the things where AI may actually start to make

a huge difference. Yeah. Right. Because they are able to decipher a lot of like, citation, like, dolphin away a language now. And with enough of a database, they'll start to be able to say, like, this means this, this means this. How they actually decipher it? So it's coming up to,

so basically, you know, AI works. You have to train it on something. Is this the lady? I think so. She looks like a kind of lady would do that.

She's got a real dolphin jerk look to her. This is a crazy story. Listen to these orca whales imitate human speech. No. It's responding. Oh, there's your guy. Yeah.

It's getting there. It's trying. Yeah. Whoa. It's amazing. Whoa.

One, two, one. I bet what it wants to say is let me go. You fucking asshole. Put me back in the ocean. You crazy bitch.

Quit jerking me off. Maybe if they jerked off the killer whales, they wouldn't have killed them. Yeah. Yeah. It's like, you know, like, just like Sea World alone. It's just, it's so awful. And it wasn't

until those, those, that documentary, what's it called? Blackfish. Blackfish. Yeah. That was like the first one where people went like, Hey, it was really eye opening. We shouldn't support this at all. I

mean, I can't believe people still even go to fucking Sea World. It's pretty crazy. You know about those two in France that are trapped there? No. Oh, this is interesting. So there is basically a Sea World

equivalent in France and the government shut it down. I forget the, I'm sure we can figure it out, but it was shut down, but then the dolphins and the two orcas were not released and the guys like these are mine. I'm not releasing them and I kind of forward to release them, remove them. So they've just been sitting in these abandoned tanks for I want to say a year now. Maybe, maybe more. Yeah, this is

it here. The race to save these two. Jamie, I don't know if you can see if there's an aerial shot of it, but yeah. So they're just sitting in this thing, but it's closed. The guy can't afford to feed them because nobody's visiting. And then I believe the government just doesn't want to do anything about

it because they're like, we just wanted to shut you down. We don't want to actually like do anything about it. So there's just these two orcas sitting in these tanks. And how do they get food? I mean, he's feeding them. He's like doing it out of his pocket and it's like few and far between. Oh, man.

So yeah, it's a crazy there. Yeah, the abandoned whales and they're just sitting in these tanks. We've had, you know, Phil Demersis. He's a guy who helped shut down Marine land in Canada. Okay, yeah. Which was an

awful, awful place facility. Yeah. There's like, there's so many of these fucking places like that. We see what they're doing. And just like, oh, man, if we could understand them. Yeah. And we could, I think

someday in the future, we're going to look back at that the way people today look back at slavery. Oh, totally. We're going to say these are intelligent creatures that just they just don't have the ability to manipulate their environment. Like we do. Yeah. Like just dolphins. There's cerebral cortex

is 40% larger than a human being. So something's going on in there. And you think it's okay to put them in a swimming pool? That's crazy. Dude, it's the same thing. Like what I was talking about,

elephants, they're they're EQ. They're emotional intelligence. We can't even comprehend it. Right. The way those animals feel like the highs that an elephant experiences and the lows in experience are way bigger than the highs or lows that most humans, I think any human can experience like their EQ is way bigger than ours. The trauma that they feel from losing a loved one

or from being abused or whatever it happens to be is like 10x what humans can even emotionally comprehend. How do we know that? Based on their brain scans and whatnot, I don't know the specifics on it. But because that part of their brain is so much larger than ours. And so you have these, they might not have the same like, computer skills as we do mentally, but they have this emotional intelligence that's like so much deeper and broader than ours. At least that's my belief.

It is a weird thing with us where we only characterize intelligence as the ability to manipulate your environment. Yeah. Like we want you to write a book. Right. I don't trust you. You're real.

You're really smart. Make a house. Why don't you? Why don't you? Why don't you? How come you

not have a rocket ship? Right. You're so smart. Where's your phone? Right. Yeah. Yeah.

That's weird. It's weird. It's a weird way to look at things. Yeah. It's like, I think there's a part of people that recognize that this direction, the people like this classification of intelligence in that way is wrong. But I don't think we can really quantify it yet.

And if AI really can decipher a dolphin language, or a language whale language, they really can. And we realize that they're actually communicating. God, I would hope that would change our approach to how we deal with those things. I think of what? Because I think they are sea people. They're just they don't need to manipulate their environment. First of all,

they can travel 3D. They go up, they go down, they go across, they can hold their breath for an hour. They don't need to make a house. No. Their food is everywhere. Also, they're at the top of the

fucking food chain. Right. They're orcas. And they're nomadic. They don't. We are not nomadic by trade.

So we have to manipulate our environment to make it more comfortable. Where's it? They're not low. Yeah. We move so fast they can make a sunfish explode. Straight up. Yeah. Straight up. We're so slow.

Like the fastest people, like we just run into each other and knock each other unconscious. That's what we could do. Find a watch though. Dude, I want to go back to what you said about it. I agree, by the way, about orcas and captivity and whales and things like that. There's this

huge anti-zoom movement that I just don't agree with though. Like I believe, I agree with you that in the future we'll go, why do we keep animals the way we did? And when you look at old zoos and concrete boxes and stuff, but there's so much good that animals and captivity have done. Saving species, keeping things alive, connecting kids to nature. There's a lot of gray area. There's these things.

And there's fucking San Diego Zoo. You know what I mean? There's a lot of nuance to it. San Diego Zoo is an excellent example of a really great zoo. It's unbelievable. It's incredible. I've been to that

place before. Yeah. But I also went to that wolf place with you. Yeah. And that made me sad. I know. Yeah.

I know. I went there. I was bummed out man. But at least they're rescuing them. You know? Like,

I know what they also cut their balls off. Yeah. That bummed me out hardcore. Otherwise they all fight. I mean, but that's the gray area that you had. Like what's the alternative? You know, it's like

they die. Let them lose. But then only a few of them were pure wolves. You can't just let loose a wolf dog. True too. You know, because then you're muddying jeans. It's such a complicated thing.

Wasn't that the whole reason why black wolves exist in the first place? I think black wolves exist because it's a trait that they got from domesticated dogs. I read that and then I read it was false and then I read it again. I don't know what the truth behind that is. It's put it into propensity. We should say it's a rogue and ask claim.

As today's podcast. You got to wear that so it can't get a good. That's interesting. How do you wear that? Would you say? Is it true that black wolves inherited that trait from domesticated dogs?

Because that is one thing that absolutely has happened is it has been interbreeding between. And not just on purpose. No, no. Yeah. It happened. Yeah. I mean, you get to say it's a lot. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Is the genetic mutation of a black fur color brought about by domestication? Yes. Sorry.

Thrown a lot at you, Danny. Is it was a black, the trait of black wolves? Did they inherit that from domesticated dogs? I edit my thing. From domesticated dogs. I would. Yeah. See what it says. Let's say,

pointed enough. I love watching it work. Where it's like spinning. Yes. This is well supported by genetic research. Black coat color in North American wolves comes from mutation in the K locus,

especially specifically, excuse me, a three base pair deletion in the CBD 103. I don't know what that little thing is. I don't know. Defense and gene. Which.

Which is what it is. I think produces a dominantly inherited melanistic phenotype. The mutation originated in dogs and moved into wolves through hybridization, not the other way around. 2009 study by Anderson at all first identified the K.B. Black allele in wolves is derived from dog wolf interbreeding. Follow up work analyzing 331 wolves and 20 dogs found that North American wolf.

How do you say that word? Hapelo type. Hapelo type. Yeah. Are monofyletic, meaning a sink. I feel like

you're my teacher. A single good job. Introgression event from dogs most likely seeded the allale through the continent probably in the Yukon or Northwest territories. You know, I went to where Colossal made the direwolves. Ben texted me. You guys went. That was interesting experience. Was that

cool to see? Yes. I haven't even seen him. I know it's a whole hush hush. I brought my youngest daughter and she was cuddling with the four month old wolf. Well, there you go. You can cut it with them when

they're four months old. Yeah. But it was like puppy. And it was huge. No, no, no, no. It was pretty

small. Yeah. It's like 40 pounds. Okay. That was a fucking cute man. She was so sweet. She's so sweet.

She's so sweet. She'd cuddle with you and you pet her and she'd kiss you. That's cool. It was like a fucking dog man. That is a Romulus. There you go. That is a gosh. You're so sweet. But the males,

they had two males that had that's right. That's like Colese's the girl. So there's Romulus. Look how cute they are when they're they're babies. Remiss Romulus and then Colese the girl. That's pretty cool.

So Colese was the one that we got to the cuddle with and they're cute. Oh my gosh. He was so fucking adorable. But you can only hang out with her for a little while and then they got big. Yeah. And now they're big.

Yeah. He sends me pictures. So they were like that when we went there. Like that size. That size.

That's already the males. I don't know if I might get them with a wolf that size. Well, they kept away from you. Yeah. And we were in a large contained area. But we got to go out with

them. Yeah. And they're just kind of hang out and look at you. They keep away from you for the most part. But she didn't. She just came right up. But she can't be with them yet. She was too little.

Interesting. Like, you know, they didn't want her to get killed. Just just too sketch. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. And she was, you know, she was still a baby still. But they were older. I think they were a year or close to a year. But they could hang out with them for the first five or six months,

I think. Oh, wow. After a while, they just got different. There's also some stuff about them that they didn't even know direwolves had, like the main, which is interesting. They can aren't, they have a main. Oh, wow. Like almost like a lion's. Oh, wow. Which they didn't know. And

they didn't know they were going to be white either. No, is that a variant from their genetic mutation work? Or is that something that's just expressing itself? Very good question that you'd have to talk to a geneticist about because like, there's a lot of people that don't even agree they're actually direwolves. A lot. Yeah. A lot. Yeah. They're essentially saying that what you've done is

you've taken the traits of direwolves and you've made them be expressed in a gray wolf. But that's what Beth says they've done. You know what I mean? Like she's not, they're not hiding that. They're like, we're trying to fill in each. We're trying to make something. Yes. But she's also said that I

don't want to mischaracterize. But essentially what they're saying is, but that's what a direwolf was. Right. Like that they are a wolf that has all these traits. Right. Like the size is the same,

the look is the same. You can get technical and say, no, you've taken a gray wolf and made it express. But yes, but they got those genes specifically from dead direwolves. Right. Right. So it's like,

well, what is it? Is it our own classification of these things that we're disputing? Right. Because we can't just decide like this. I call this a direwolf and that's what it is. Like the genes don't

give a fuck what labels you put on them. Not at all. You know, and if you make a dinosaur, like that's not a real T-Rex. It ate everyone in the city. Right. It's a real T-Rex. It just took

over a fucking city. It just ate everyone in a VW bus. It's a 30 foot tall lizard. It's a dinosaur. Yeah. It doesn't matter how you shape it. Yeah. Oh, the world mouse is really cool too. Yeah,

they're really neat. Ben told me one day I could have a world mouse. So I'm holding him to that. Yeah. It's really interesting seeing the direwolves though. Just imagining, what was it like when

those things are just roaming the earth? I know. Is it's like a 200 pound wolf that's all white with like thick fur and a mane, like a lion. Dude, speaking of roaming the earth. Have you heard the theory about how sloth bears stopped? Sorry, not sloth bears. What were the becave bears in

short-faced? Short-faced bears stopped human immigration. Yes. Have you read about that? Yeah.

Yeah. That's really cool. Totally makes sense. Totally does. They just stood there waiting for people like salmon to cross the bear and land bridge and they're like, well, it's that time of year again. Also like who would do that knowing that those things are out there? That thing was so big.

Yeah. It's like double the size of a polar bear. It's crazy. Yeah. It's like a twice large polar bear that is can run 50 miles. Look at that thing. I don't care how smart we are. That is not

something you want to face. Right. Even if you have a gun, like good luck. Like if you have a 9mm handgun and you run across a grizzly bear, you're dead. Yeah. It's not going to be in a fire power.

No. So what are you going to hit that thing with? Well, they have rocks. So, you know, that's good. Rocks and spears. Rocks. Rocks. When they first started coming across, did they even

have fucking bows and arrows? Yeah. I don't know. Yeah. But I mean spears for sure. But like that.

But then there's the real question. Is that the only way people got here? Right. When you see the white sands footprints that are 22,000 years old and you're talking, well, this predates the ice age. Before any humans were known anywhere in the new world.

Yeah. So it's like, well, what's going on there? Right. Because there's actual human footprints that have been dated to 22,000 years ago. And that's just all we found. Yeah. Right.

That's just because they left footprints. Yeah. Like that doesn't mean there wasn't something there 50,000 years before. 100,000 years before. Exactly. Exactly. And then there's in Mexico,

this evidence that looks like predation on mammoth bones by humans. Oh, really? Like spearheads and things. Like carvings into the mammoth bones. Looks like they're broken open to get marrow.

Oh, interesting. Very disputed. Right. Because there's also some people that think it could have been like some rocks falling on the bones. Sure. Sure. I'm not sure how this is happening,

but it does think that. Oh, let me write this up for Joe. Fuck off. So what is it? We're going to get a separate computer that we use for perplexity. What is

the question? Oh, sorry. Well, how would humans have contested short face bears on the bearing street? Let me write this up for Joe. Fuck off, man. Like a baby. The actual evidence kept humans

out of North America doesn't hold up any longer, apparently. When I was following people, it was a myth that someone, a scientist, constantly commented on a paper that doesn't necessarily, he could have thought that, but they didn't really have evidence for it. Well, here's the thing. Like the idea of a bear line. No, because the problem is bears, they would have to eat so much.

To sustain that kind of mass. Yeah. But there couldn't really have been a lot of them. No, but it sure makes sense that they were predating upon people when they came across the whole hold up. Hold up. Hold up here. This guy's saying something kooky. He's saying that

hyper carnivore built for pacing long distance. He argued that it was primarily a scavenger using a size sense of smell and long legged gate to klepto paraceti paraceti. You got it. There it is. Kills from lions, dire wolves, and scimitar cats rather than the rundown prey itself.

That doesn't even make sense. Long legged gate would make it faster. I heard about this. So, yeah, the theory is that Shortface Bear would come in and rob a kill like basically what Ahayina does to lions. Or wolves do to mount lions. Yes, but I think it to me it doesn't add up.

Well, you know, grizzly bears chase down moose and kill them. Yes. Plenty of video. I watched a video yesterday of it. They've also shown now that hyenas are incredibly efficient predators.

And until like 10 years ago, we thought hyenas were only scavengers or I mean, it's longer than that. But you know what I mean? Now they show they have like a 30% success rate, which is very high. Yeah, there's no reason why they wouldn't be if they're carnivores. Like, why would they be completely reliant on other animals to do the work for them when they have that kind of biting power?

They're just opportunistic like old carnivores. And they move as packs. Yeah. They work as pack food. You know what I mean? If you can kill it, kill it. If you can fight something off

for it, fight something off for it. Like it doesn't really matter. That's how carnivores are. What is this chain? What is this chain? What is this chain? It says this is how they hunted

brown bears. They probably would have done it the same way. Oh, getting in the dens. And then burn the entrance with fire probably kill the babies. Right. But that's if you had access to fire.

They had an adult in a sphere at best and maybe some fire that they could maybe move, you know, you know, close. You have to be to get something with an adult. Yeah. Okay. There's there's some videos that are really interesting where they're showing people realistic scenarios where bears charging you and they pull the mates out. Yeah, showing bear spray and guns like showing

them like a map. Like imagine you have a 10 millimeter semi automatic pistol and you have to rack it. So you have to rack it. So the gun the bears coming. You have to draw the gun, rack it, take the safety off and then point it towards the animal and squeeze it to your dead. You're done. You're already dead. It's like that. It has to be like a hundred yards away from

you as it starts running for you to get a shot off. I think the like idea is the bear gives you some sign. Look at that bullshit ass thing. I tried one. It is impossible to throw accurately. Well,

that's true. But you're not practiced in it. No, of course not. Like, yeah, I mean, I've seen people that are super accurate with spears. Isn't anybody Adam Greentree doesn't he do the at-level?

I think I've seen him talk around. He probably knows how to do it. Yeah. That's pretty well. It's not a good weapon. No. I mean, it's definitely better than no weapon. I mean,

what's the advantage over throwing a spear? It just goes further. I mean, mechanical leverage. So, I have a thing like that for my dog. It's like a thing with the ball that has a ball in the bit. And you can, it's so easy to not blow your shoulder out. You throw it pretty fucking far.

Right. And then I, whenever I tell I do it, I was like, wow, of course, this is way better. Yeah. You get this extra leverage with this thing. And then also you can kind of whip it with your wrist and you get all this action with the ball. You would do the same thing with the

spear with a metal. Makes sense. It seems hard to be accurate though. Super hard. It's hard to be accurate with a traditional bow. Right. You know, it's so hard. Like, you know, I shoot a compound

bow and a compound bow is, there's so much technology involved. Oh, yeah. First of all, I have a laser range finder and I arrange something that says 52 yards. Then I go to my site tape that's on my site on my bow and I dial it to 52 yards because I use archery software that measures the weight of my arrow. So I have this 500 grain arrow and then it has the speed per, so it's 390 feet per second from a 500 grain arrow. Yeah. And then I put it into this computer and it spits out a

site tape so that I can move my pins specifically. So I could put it in a quarter, 52 yards if I was accurate enough. I'm not. No one really is. Like, except like really excellent world class archers.

Sure. With a traditional bow, you're just guessing. Yeah. So you're just guessing the arc of the arrow. And then you have to think, okay, I'm buying arrows, right? They're made by a guy who's measuring

them. They're all down to like, they're within two grains of each other and they have inserts. So my front of center is very high. Perfect aerodynamics. Yeah. And they made it a carbon fiber.

These fucking arrows, they're making them by hand and then they're making the arrow heads by hand. Yeah. So they could be off. Yeah. Each one of them, like, so you're just guessing where that fucking arrow is going to go. And you have to shoot every day to get a real sense of like what the

drop is at a certain distance. And then you have to kind of judge how far is he? Is he 20 yards? 30 yards? 50 yards? So even with modern traditional bows. And that's like, and that sounds like a,

yeah, I know what you mean. Yeah. Recurve the long bows. Right. Right. I mean, that sounds like an oxymoron,

but they are still traditional in the sense of you're not using cams. Yeah. You don't have like a cam that rolls over and it's mechanical advantage. Yeah. Fibre glass limbs and all those jazz. You're

using like wood still, right? Even with those things, you're still buying arrows and the arrows weigh the same amount. Yeah, they're perfect. So if you did that over and over again in your yard, you did it every day for three hours a day, you would get a sense of how far and then if you did it a bunch, you'd get an idea of judging distances. And there's like little tricks.

There's certain archery tournaments where you're not allowed to use a rangefinder. Oh, really? Yeah. And so the idea is you have to develop a skill of being, and I think these tournaments probably started back when rangefinders didn't exist. Yeah. And then when rangefinders did exist, they're like,

that's cheating. So and then the targets are at various lessons. And so guys develop a very good way of measuring distance. Sure. And what essentially they do is they can pretty accurately judge five yards and then they double that and then they triple that and then they try to figure it.

And they get within like 10 or 15 yards. Sure. But you know, that's a lot, even with a compound bow, you know, that drop of 10 or 15 yards is pretty significant. Even something that's going 300 feet a second. But when you're doing with a fucking wooden arrow that you made yourself with a stone tip, like one of these bad boys, I have one here somewhere, somewhere on the desk. Yeah. Here it is.

So like that's something made that. So if you make that one and then somebody else makes one right next to it, it might be 15 grains different. It might be 50 grains different. And the aerodynamics are different. The flint nothing is completely different. Yeah. Yeah. This thing's not very

rare. That's not good. That's a thing with playing like a motherfucker. Shot it out of a really good bow. And not to mention the stress of if I don't kill this thing, I'm either going to die or I'm not going to eat or, you know, all the other things. And you have a 15 foot bear. Right. Right. Yeah. Probably bigger.

Yeah. Like was the height of a short face bear or the length? Like what is the what is a big short face bear? You've seen those caves. They haven't like Missouri where they're still claw marks from short face bears and things. Really? Oh yeah. You can go visit like mittens of them in Missouri where

they call it out a cave like a den. Yeah. Where they lived in dens and you can see their claw marks in the mud and everything else. It's amazing. 11 to 12 feet. I think they probably have to be bigger than

that because Kodiak bears get that big. Kodiak bears can get 12 feet. Do they get that big? Yeah. I mean maybe they're measuring them squarely because you know like a lot of times they measure stuff to try to make it seem bigger. So what is the largest Kodiak bear ever killed?

Let's look at that up. Largest Kodiak bear. Largest Kodiak bear ever killed. Ever recorded. There you go. Recorded the same thing. Okay. They have it by weight. It's

1,656 pounds which is by the way. Whole. That's the shit. And same. Yeah. Nearly a one ton bear.

Yeah. That's so crazy. Oh the hind foot measured 18 inches. Oh god. How tall was it? How long was

it? There was 500 pounds more than that. Yeah. Well it's over a time. In a zoo. Yeah. Yeah. Oh my god.

But he might have been fat. He was fat. He might have been a short fat. So. What is the so what is the longest the largest link? Pretty sure he's sitting. I think I've seen

this bear and he's sitting in the anchorage airport when you land there. Oh there's a big one. Is that that bear? I think that's the largest bear. I've seen that. Yeah. I've seen that in anchorage. That's

that thing's nuts. At the airport there. Yeah. Yeah. It's in like a glass case. Yeah. I'm pretty

sure that's the biggest bear ever ever shot. Look at that one. Ever recorded 2,130 pounds. No no length measurement. That's so big. That's so crazy. Bear. The short face bear. They don't even

really know how much it weighed. They're just basing it on the bones. Yeah. Right. They don't have a dead one. No. So that right that photo up there that's a Fred Bear with his 1962 world record

Alaskan Bear. Go back to that photo that you just were at before. Yeah. Look at that. That's his stuffed bear. Jeez. He shot that with an old bullshit bow. Yeah. Look at his bow. The reaker bow. That

bull sucks. Wouldn't narrow. That's so crazy. He was the first like modern bow hunter. Oh really?

Yeah. I mean he's a guy who popularized bow hunting. Fred Bear is a legend. Oh interesting. The bow hunting world. And I mean you got to think how good does life have to be?

Where you go? Let's try to do something that people use to do before guns. Yeah. Just because. Yeah. It wasn't really a thing that people practiced. Right. Like food had to be so readily

available. Yeah. We got to say let's make it harder. Yeah. Go backwards. Yeah. Let's have so much food.

Yeah. Let's make it more difficult. Yeah. And then there's guys today that they don't like compound bows because they're too hot to chew easy. Yeah. They're using reaker of all that. Yeah. Yeah.

That's crazy. My friend Aaron Snyder who's a like a world famous bow hunter went back to using a reaker bow. Really? It was killing too many things with compound bow. It felt it was too easy. But that's what

happens right? These guys master their craft. And when they spend all that time on it and then they're like how do I make the challenge harder on myself? It's also they're competing with other world class bow hunters. Like they're all like who's the man? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Even you go stroke. Yeah. This is a

little bit of that but it's also like that's how they get good in their first place. Like this is a weird thing about people in competition. You can say competition is bad. Like okay are you saying that on your phone? Because how do you think you got a phone? Yeah. You got a phone because somebody's

competing into the people who developed a phone. It's a different kind of competition. I think competition is essential to human culture. It's certainly essential to progress. Yeah. And this is why socialism's

never gonna work. Get a reward people. If they're not rewarded, they're not gonna work hard enough to do anything really spectacular. Why bother? So you're never gonna get a laptop. We've never happened.

You've never had high speed internet. Somebody has to profit wildly. Yes. For them to be enthusiastic about spending 17 hours a day making something like that. But that's the joy of competition paying off. Yeah. Right. It's like I know not so much bow hunting. But if you're a competitive as a person to

the point that you succeed the most at developing a phone or a cup or whatever it happens to be you win and you get paid the most. We just have to have regulations to make sure that those people don't run amok and then take over entire countries. Become a monopoly. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

What was going on with Microsoft in the 1990s? Remember all those? Remember that? No. What was how many taking over Bill Gates was a maniac? Like before people think of Bill Gates now. Well now I

think COVID kind of ruined his people's impressions of him can now they think of him as a vaccine pusher. But also as a philanthropist we're doing philanthropy that makes millions and millions of dollars for him. Didn't he also put out that anti-protein film? Wasn't that him? Do you know what I'm talking about? I think Bill Gates wife Bill Gates correct me for a moment. Bill Gates wife is vegan I believe

and he funded like some Netflix documentary all on how like bodybuilders get huge without thinking about James Cameron. Am I thinking about James Cameron? I know James Cameron's wife is vegan. I might be mixing him up. You're talking about game changers that the vegan document yes yeah with the huge Jack guy being like I never touched protein. Yeah it turns out that the

problem I think if you look at that from an ethical perspective and you're saying factory farming is bad I'm on your page. Totally. I'm with you. But that had a agenda. But yeah as a clear agenda also just not accurate. Anyway I pirated your thing on Bill Gates though sorry. So the point was during the

1990s he was there was all these trials where they had these monopolistic practices and they were buying up competition or destroying competition. Just anybody that developed any computer? Yeah anybody develop browsers that competed with you know microservices stuff. Yeah here's landmark 1990s trials referred to United States versus Microsoft Corporation massive antitrust lawsuit filed by US Department of Justice and 20 states. Key elements included browser war integration the antitrust ruling and the appellate settlement. And so everybody in the 90s thought of him as

this guy who is just like ruthless capitalist that was trying to destroy all the competition. Okay so he kind of reinvented himself. Gotcha. And the way he reinvented himself was first of all he donated an enormous amount of money to the media. So to NBC, CBS and all these different times they gave him hundreds of millions of dollars just to fluff. Just to kind of say guys I'm

your friend. I'm your buddy over here. And then he developed the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation and they were really concerned with global health. Oh my god. Dude do you know what they did fucking in the kaborba's of Delta with their mosquito nets? Why would you? But do you know what I'm talking

about it all? What did they do? Dude I'm gonna go on a fucking tirade here. Please do. Okay so the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation decided that there was too much malaria in Africa right which you and I probably agree with. Malaria is bad. So what did they do? They gave all of these people

living in tribal villages. I'm totally pirated your thing. I'm sorry but I'm gonna go on a fucking rant here. They gave all these people living in the kaborba's of Delta which is the bread basket of the Zambi'se Valley meaning like where more fish are born. It's a nursery for fish right?

Not just there but this is a good micro example. They gave millions of mosquito nets out to all these people to avoid malaria. Guess what the people who are starving to death did with their mosquito nets? They're fish with them. They fished with them. Mosquito net has a hole that is so small that

mosquito can't get through. So guess what? These mosquito nets now indiscriminately catch tiny baby fish in areas like kabora basa where the fish go to breed and reproduce and populate. So now all of a sudden you have thousands and thousands of people that have been handed nets that have been living one way for hundreds of thousands of years. Don't give a shit about malaria. They have their own

way of dealing with malaria. They sit in smoky huts at night. They sleep with a campfire. Everything else. Yes they still get malaria some of them but they deal with it their own way. Bill Melinda Gates

Foundation come in hand out millions of mosquito nets absolutely collapse the entire population of fish that feed millions of people because these people just take the nets and fish all the baby fish out so those fish don't grow up to make substantial protein sources. So now these wonderful philanthropists that have given out millions of nets have destroyed an ecosystem, crashed a fish population and created widespread hunger for people that otherwise had plenty of resources all because they were trying to help with their mosquito nets. Oh god. It's just like it's a fucking disaster dude. They've taken such a rich and important part of Africa. One of the most abundant freshwater fisheries in the world

and destroyed it because they're helping by handing out mosquito nets. Good god. Yeah I know sorry I told you I got a rant but it's like it's so bad what's happened over there and they're still giving out mosquito nets by the way and you literally watch these guys line up take a mosquito net and it never goes in their house. It goes straight to catching fish that are this big for them to eat. Oh god.

It says that's what I'm looking at the thing. Yeah but it's just totally ruined the ecosystem. It completely crashed and it created widespread hunger in a place that had no hunger. So now you have people with malaria and hunger. Oh god. And it's like done from a place of good intent or maybe

it isn't and I think that's where you were going but I don't think it is. I think it's a ruse and I think what a lot of it is is this thing like we are doing philanthropy but then you go but you're profiting you make hundreds of millions of dollars from this philanthropy right? You're buying goodwill. And you're also on television promoting vaccines like why are you your guy didn't even graduate college? Yeah like I mean I mean I mean I mean I even made it out of high school. Like he's a weird guy. He's

obviously very smart. Yeah of course. But why you're not a health expert. Why and you look like shit. Like why are you promoting health? Like this is great global health. Like just a fucking

weird guy man. Yeah. The weirdest thing if you ever seen that you know he was obviously friends with Jeff Riebstin or communicated with him and had some sort of relationship. Oh I didn't know that. Oh yeah popular. Gotcha. Well known. I feel like every one of you connected to Epstein now like I've lost

a lot of people. But the craziest conversation was there was a woman who was asking him. Did he regret his relationship with Jeff Riebstin and he's just trying to say that the only reason why I talked to Jeff Riebstin because Jeff Riebstin was going to he was going to donate money to his philanthropy and all the different things that he's involved in. But it didn't work out and I do regret it. And and she said did you I forget what her question was. But Gates says well he's dead now.

So there's that. There's something about it is you got to be careful. Like he's it's like a weird like veiled threat. It's very odd the way he answers the question. Yeah. Yeah. Essentially saying that

I'm reading it like like you got whacked. Yeah. Like that's what I'm reading. Interesting. Weird.

Could find that that I was sure. Well, you find out I was talking to some buddies about this, you know, just like standard bro chat. If Epstein happened today, right, and you had no knowledge of the weird stuff going on on the island like you would be invited. You know what I mean? They'd be like, Hey, Joe did they did invite me. Oh, really? Oh, yeah, 2017. I'm like not to

specifically. Yeah, but to meet Epstein. But that's what I'm saying. And I was like, what if that happened today? I came to me. Oh, sorry. Yeah. Yeah. Let's do it. Port at that time that you had a

number of meetings with Jeffrey Epstein who when you met him 10 years ago, he was convicted of soliciting prostitution from minors. What did you know about him when you were meeting with him as you've said yourself in the hopes of raising money? You know, I had dinners with him. I regret doing that. He had relationships with people he said, you know, would give to global health, which is a interest I have, you know, not nearly enough philanthropy goes in that direction. You know,

those meetings were a mistake. They didn't result in what he purported and I cut them off. You know, that goes back a long time ago now. There's, you know, so there's nothing new on that. It was reported that you continue to meet with him over several years. And that, in other words, a number of meetings.

What did you do when you found out about his background? Well, you know, I said I regretted having those dinners and there's nothing absolutely nothing new on that. Is there a lesson for you, for anyone else looking at this? Well, he's dead. So, you know, in general, you always have to be careful.

And, you know, I'm very proud of what we've done in philanthropy, very proud of the work of the foundation. Listen, first of all, the records, you have billions of dollars. And this guy didn't give you money for years. Right. And you still kept meeting us. You kept meeting us. What about

your money? Like, what is he going to give you? How much does he have? He's also compared to Bill Gates. But he also probably doesn't have a fraction of what you have. Right. So, like, if like Elon

started hitting me up to donate money to something, I'll be like, Hey, bitch, won't you? You got like, dude, do you have much money? You have so much money. Why don't you, why don't you ask me? If you kept meeting with me for years, for years, try to get me to donate. It's kind of

similar. Right. It's a little we're talking about. He's a billionaire, like hundreds of billions of dollars. So, none of it makes any sense. I was providing a party for rich people. That's what he was

doing. He was providing away with these rich people, can fucking let their hair down and have a good old time and do coke or whatever they did. It was really, right? It was just like come, but the party had no rules. And that's what makes it. I'm just guessing. I'm just guessing. But I had a guy who

tried to get me to meet him in 2017 in LA or where? Well, I was in LA when he reached out to me. Epstein appeared to have drafted himself, claiming Gates head can. Oh, yeah. He wrote it to himself.

Right. This is an email that Epstein appears to have drafted to himself claiming that Gates had contracted an STI from encounters with Russian girls and he had antibiotics from Melinda. Gates said the emails were never sent and are false. His spokesman called them absolutely absurd, so absurd that someone could get an STD from a Russian girl. Gates is separately admitted to affairs with two Russian women and with a Microsoft employee that says none of them are connected to Epstein or his victims. Let me go say those emails were like a journal he was keeping. Like, why

would you keep him himself? Well, he wrote on an iPad all the time apparently that's why the typos were so bad. And he just like email, you know, it's, you know, I mean, imagine that's your journal. But why would you do that? Why would you make up a story about a guy having STDs?

I think more likely because so there was a rumor and this is an unsubstantiated rumor when we were clear that that Epstein was trying to blackmail Gates with some story about a bridge player that he was having in a fair with. That's interesting. Russian bridge player. I also think they've intentionally flooded the internet with so much misinformation. Perhaps. But my point was,

if he could have drafted that email, which was never sent, and then sent the draft to Bill Gates or showed it to him. Yeah. And say, what do you think about this? Right. I could just. If you don't.

Yeah. Yeah. I bought you some money. How about you? You know, because there was a bunch of well, there was a bunch of people that gave him a lot of money. We gave him a lot of money. Yeah.

Yeah. In fact, the guy, the Victoria Secret guy gave him a house, gave him a house. Roll a roll of 100% of his finances. So he wasn't just, he gave it to him. Oh 100% taken it or you know, and he goes like, I didn't know what he was doing. So did he

fund that house right? Did he fund the Victoria Secret guy to start Victoria Secret? No, no, no, no, no. That's how he got involved after that guy's real deep. So Columbus is not got, he was gonna go to talk to the IRS about specifically what I don't know in 1984, but he was like the the tax guy for that company. He was murdered in a mob hit style.

Do this while I like this podcast. I'm just like an animal nerd. I like talking about snakes. And I'm like, find out about Victoria's Secret, Abstein and shit. Well, I mean, it's what the human animal does. Yeah. The human animal when it's in these very controlled

spaces where just, so let's look at it this way. So imagine you're a guy who's, especially if you're a nerd and you know, you were never really good with women when you're in high school and college. And then all of a sudden you have literally $100 billion. Yeah. And you can just get prostitutes anytime you want. And I guess if you get the really high end ones, they know

how to shut the fuck up. Sure. And if you have this friend of yours who was in the massage and that guy can get the best hookers. It's got a fucking island. You go to the island. It's

the best. Yeah. We fly. We talk about philanthropy. We fuck. Yeah. It makes sense. I mean, that's

what I was saying before. It's like, it's just a party for a bunch of dorks who can come here with a lot of money. But there's also some weird science connection with him. And that's where it gets really odd is that there's, he got that ranch in New Mexico. So he could be close to the guys that were working at Los Alamos who were famously not making much money. So he's around these guys and he's talking about going into business with them and giving

them this chance to make an insane amount of money. And this is what he did with Eric Weinstein. Eric Weinstein, he contacted him. They had a meeting and he was trying to get Eric Weinstein to do something with him. And if Eric did it, he had the potential to make an enormous amount of money. And Eric is very wise. And he just didn't buy him from the

start. He's like, yeah, as a construct. Everything about him. He's like, he doesn't know anything about finance. Like he was talking to him. He's like, this guy's a construct. It's not

there's not a real finance guy. Yeah. He's like, there's something going on. We learned dealer. So wait, what was the science they were working on? A bunch of different physicists

were connected to him. Einstein Epstein reportedly hoped to develop super race of humans with his D. Wow. Wow. Where's that from? What? That's a different one of the article. Oh my God.

That's crazy. That is crazy. But he had a bunch of relationships with some very impressive scientists and physicists. And also oddly connected to the whole UAP world, the whole Los Alamos things weird because the thing is that he by buying that ranch in New Mexico put him close to Los Alamos, which was in New Mexico. And he then he had access to all these scientists that were famously underpaid. So these guys were not making much money. And he was this

incredibly wealthy guy through no way that anybody could ever rationalize. It was all weird. And you know, and who knows what he was trying to get them to do. He was probably just one of those guys. I mean, you never ended up meeting him, but he was probably just incredibly likable as a con man. You know what I mean? You probably sat in a room with him and you're

like, wow, this guy's really great. Like maybe I should give him some money. Maybe I should like what a cool guy. And he's just a dirt bag under the, you know, under the veil. We're just speculating. But maybe, maybe also if you have a bunch of really hot Russian chicks

that are hanging out with you, you don't need to be that charming. That's so true. It's so true. You're a billionaire with a bunch of hot Russian chicks. Yeah. Yeah. And there's

a bunch of people that are willing to hang out with billionaires just because I've seen it where people just get enamored by the fact that someone's insanely wealthy and they want to go to the party at their house. But all those people didn't work like crazy. Do I mean, they're not fun. I mean, I don't know that many. Well, he was. That's true. That got

pretty hard. Good point. Good point. Yeah. To be a billionaire to, I mean, in most cases, what you have to do is be insanely driven. Yeah. You have to be that guy that works 18,

20 hours a day. Right. You know, and give up all the other things. Yeah, you have to give up all your time. And that becomes your whole life. Yeah. And I think that's also why

they wanted a guy like that that could provide them. This is why why Eric Weinstein described it. He said he provided them with experiences, I believe. Yeah. That was his, and I think he's right. I think that makes sense. So I mean, my one and only billionaire friend is that I'm

not a Bonnie, that Indian guy I was mentioning. I think it's so cool. He's built this gigantic wildlife rescue. That is pretty dope. Because he's a great thing to do with money. He's just

like, he's a nerd like me. And if he hurts, it's gonna be like, thanks a lot. But like, he's just an animal nerd. You know what I mean? He's gonna be like, he just loves animals and conservation. And he's like, I have generational wealth that might, you know, it came from his

family's family's like fifth or sixth generation of having huge industry. And he's like, okay, so with my excess money, I'm gonna rescue animals instead of do other, you know, it's very cool. That's very cool. I mean, for me, it's amazing. Yeah. I mean, there's nothing wrong with space

race stuff too. It's all fascinating. But it's just, it's, and I get it from a perspective of people who think there's not enough money in the world. And then why do these people have so much money and they should give all their money away and like, okay, but you could do that all the way down to like $100,000 a year if you really wanted to do it, especially when you compare yourself to everyone else in the world. That's right. That's right. You

know, we're in the, just living in this country alone, we're in the 1%. Yeah. Most people, I think 1% of the world, we will look this up. It's like $50,000, $60,000. If you make more than that, you're at 1% of Earth. Right. And that's the majority of people in the United

States. Yeah. So like, you're barely getting by in America and you're in the 1% of the world. Exactly. Yeah. Which is wild. It's wild. It really is. Yeah. We're, we're the weirdest

animal. It's just study us. I should. Well, I learned a lot today. I'll tell you why.

Yeah. But we're not fun. Like you study us and you go, Oh God, what are they fucking doing? Where's you study animals? You're like, Oh, fucking cool. They're way cooler. They're way

more interesting. More teeth, more claws, more slithering. Well, it's also just the fact that there's so much variety and that they are real and that they are, then some of them are so strange. How about that new monkey that they just found on the Congo with the lipstick? Crazy.

Orange, orange mouth. Yeah, it looks like you see one of them freeze pops. Yeah, exactly. Like your kid after. Yeah. 100 dude. It's so cool. And new primates,

species coming out still like no. I love that. I think it's so great. Do you believe in the Bondo ape? Do you think that thing is? Yes and no. Like there's probably likely a group of chimpanzees.

Do you know what I mean? That just are more aggressive. They're a social construct and are larger and are larger. But it doesn't mean that it's like this, you know, because they have the whole thing about them being lion killing apes and all this other stuff. There's probably a family troop, a group and you know, they're in war now. Have you read about this? Yeah. Yeah. So I think that's crazy. The Bondo ape is

real in the sense of there is probably an isolated larger group of chimps that just act like chimps. The thing about this chimp though is they said that their skulls are different. Yeah, the cranial ridge. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Makes sense. Things with stronger jaw muscles have a cranial ridge. You see

it in hyenas. You see it in things like that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. It's just more

surface air for the muscle to attach to basically. It's just like that would be so fascinating to find those things. And that's with, you know, that Carl Armand guy who spent his whole life hunting, reading rumors and at least he got some photos on like that poor fucker that was looking for the sloth. Yeah. Still trying. Like he got some camera trap photos of him. Yeah. Yeah. And they were

bipedal in the photos. Right. So yeah. Which chimps are? Yeah. They'll walk on hind legs and stuff. Yeah.

It's pretty cool. It is pretty cool. And then there's a photo of the one that they killed that was at the airport. Do you ever see that one? No, I think so. Oh, it's crazy. At the airport. Yeah. There's a

small airport and they killed this one enormous chimpanzee. So there's just two guys that are standing with it. It's hard to tell how big the guys are, but if they're normal sized human beings, that's the biggest fucking chimpanzee I've ever seen in my life. Look at that thing. Amazing. Look at that. I mean,

the guy is, you could tell by perspective that the guy's got his hand on it. So he's right behind it. Yeah. Yeah. It's not a force perspective. And his arm is not extended. So it's not fake. And that

chimpanzee looks way bigger than him. Way bigger. Yeah. It's amazing. So they think that is one of them.

Yeah. Yeah. Like I said, I think it's real in the sense, oh yeah, this famous photo. See, but that one just to me looks like a chimpanzee. That just looks like a big gem. Yeah. Where the one that's sitting

down, that looks way bigger than those guys. The size of its head is fucking enormous. You know that there's one river where, I'm trying to remember exactly how this works, but basically there's one area where the rivers collide, where the chimps and the gorillas go into conflict with each other over this one river spot. You know what I'm talking about? Have you ever heard about this? Yeah,

it's really interesting. So somewhere in the Congo, there's this particular river. I think it's called the Cross River. I can't remember now. And it's an area that the chimps will come on one side and the gorillas will come down on the other. And they will have their like throw stuff at each other

across the river. And like, it's like a whole thing that it's been documented. And these guys, well, there's sort of these like two clans of great apes that come and communicate across the river and throw rocks and like show off to each other. And then they kind of go back into the jungle. But it's been seen in this one particular river several times. Yeah. Like the real planet of the

day. What are the chimp wars? What are they fighting over food territory? Unless I'm mistaken, it's relatively unknown. But it's sort of a social construct. So if you think of humans, for example,

once our population gets too large and we have too many men and not enough women, we fight, right? We've seen that throughout history. Roman times, Mongolian times, you name it. So there was one troop of chimps that all lived together in relative harmony. And then two leaders basically sprung up and there was a lack of enough females. And so all of a sudden this clan divided into two

clans and now they're at constant war with each other. Like they live in the same relative territory, but they'll come in with come into contact with each other and go to war over who's going to be the leader of the alpha troop, the mega troop. And it's been going for maybe a year or two years now. Fuck. Yeah. But how human is that? So human. Like to be like, okay, we're all part of this

group. Like you and I don't like each other now. Like this is my side. That's your side. We're going to fuck each other up. Study highlights friends with benefits relationship between gorillas

and chimps. Wow. They're fucking each other. No, it's a younger ones hanging out. It says, it's probably in the same area. They're meeting pictures of them like in the same. Yeah. I think

this is that river for fake that one figs out of these trees. Yeah. But friends with benefits. Generally, benefits are, yeah, I was looking for wording that got to what you're getting at. But you don't really say that with like, you're like, why do you, why do you go to dinner with Bob?

Well, we're friends with Beth. Oh, you're fucking Bob. Yeah. Why'd you start fucking Bob, man? No, no, we just like figs, both of us. Yeah. The chimpanzees though, they cut them beating their

chest, which is only something grille is a very cool. Yeah. Oh, they're, they're imitating each other. Yeah. I'm sure you've seen that one documentary, I think it's called Relentless Enemies, where there's a particular pride of lions that grew enormous because they're only eating water buffalines. They got trapped on an island because the river changed paths. Yeah. Yeah. I remember

what you're talking about. I know the documentary, but yeah, they're eating Cape Buffalo exclusively. Lions are just getting bigger in beefier and they're all fat and like, yeah, it's pretty cool. Well, they have to get bigger. The females are doing all the killing. Yeah. So they're as big as

male lions in other places. Yeah. They're checked and they're not in their control. Yeah. Because otherwise, they're going to die. Exactly. Well, they're trying to hunt the Cape Buffalo. Yeah. But it's so,

we're watching natural selection in real time because they just keep getting bigger and stronger. Yeah. And you know, they're like these fucking buffalo are enormous, man. They're jumping on these things and hanging on them and trying to drag them down the ground. The Black Death, that's what they call the Cape Buffalo. Yeah. Those motherfuckers are so scary. So mean, so scary. Yeah. And they'll

charge so unprovoked. Like they'll just turn and come anytime. But it's crazy how you have that basically, insular dwarfism and insular gigantism throughout animals, no matter like, yeah, animals stuck on an island. They're either going to get bigger. They're going to get small.

Well, lizards usually get big on an island, right? We're tortoises, right? Like the Galapagos or the Seychelles. Yeah. Why? Why do they get bigger? No predators and limited resources. Yeah. So all

of a sudden, you know, you're a little tortoise that's this big and every time you get to this big, something spots you from the air and eats you or whatever it happens to be. But now you're stuck on an island with all the grass and fruit you could ever eat and nobody wants to eat you. So you just get bigger and bigger to out complete each other. Look at that face. Yeah, look at those guys.

I might just imagine that's the only thing you can eat is something three times bigger than you and I can fucking kill you. That kills a lot of lions by the way. Yeah. Well, you kick in the face, we're trying to take them out and then that's it. Your jaw is broken. You never eat again. And you

starve to death slowly. I love the little cub there covered in blood. Look at that. It's a really cool documentary. Yeah. It seems so weird when you're looking at the size of the females, they just look

exaggerated to the point where they look fake. They look like hulk lions. It's awesome. Very cool. Very, cool. Nature is such a wild thing, man. I mean, such an amazing, fascinating, endless resource

of just cool shit to see. And our understanding of it changes all the time. Every animal theory we've ever had evolves and changes as we learn more, which is what makes it so fun because it's so dynamic. It's not a static thing. What's just crazy that we keep finding new things like the new primate?

Well, we find that little new monkey that they found with the orange lips. He's really cool. He's in the Congo. Well, the Congo's another place. It's like, what? Yeah. I've seen you've seen that BBC

documentary in the Congo from kind of like the early 2000s. But look at him. What a weird looking guy. So cool. So strange. There's a few lost primates out there too, like species that we've seen once or

twice. They've never been seen since that like what Miss Waldron's red colobus is one that comes to mind. It's called Miss Waldron's red colobus. It's a colobus monkey that there's like three or four museum specimens and no live specimens. Yeah, really? There's a few of those. Yeah. Oh, Miss

Waldron's. Yeah, red colobus. Why is it called Miss Waldron? I don't know. Who's that lady? Good question.

What do you have to do with this monkey lady? In the West Africa, previously described as subspecies. Not been cited since. Oh, I saw it for a second. And what's crazy is a lot of these animals, especially like primates and essentially anything that lives in the Congo is in a place that's so scary and so dangerous to visit. Yeah. That's not a lot of research being done. Well,

that's always what I tell people when they're like, oh, well, you know, find these animals, find animals. Nobody's looking. It's too hard. The local people know they're there. Like these lost species are species that the people that hunt and eat them know they're there, but they have no communication to the outside or the scientific world. And you know, for you or I to go into that

part of the Congo is probably a death sentence. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But there's a lot of cool stuff out there.

Are there any other animals that might be real that people think they've seen? As far as like cryptids, they could still be real. Yeah. Weird ones. Like the giant sloth or something like that. I mean, there's that whole like the dinosaur in the Congo thing that people

always talk about. It's silly. It's not real. That one's silly. I mean, I kind of think of any. I

think, you know, like I didn't show went looking for that one. Yeah. Yeah. Actually, that's one of your pods that I watched the whole thing. He was talking about that. David's crazy. Yeah.

I can't think of any, but you know, it's those rumors like there's a sloth. We've seen it. There's an Asian unicorn. We've seen it that if people don't follow, you never know. It's like you can absolutely be the tin foil hat guy. Like I can be with the dial scene. But if you give up and don't look,

you know, we never really know. And if it's going to be, it'll probably be in a place like the Amazon or like the Congo. So enormous. But like the con isn't the Congo as wide as the contiguous North America, the country or the river? I think the country of the Congo, the Congo, the jungle, the Congo, I think is almost as big as America. Really? I did not know it was that large.

Africa's fucking huge. If you see the United States imposed on Africa, you're like, oh my god, I don't think Africa's enormous. That's what's squarely about maps, right? Especially like when you look at the globe, like everything's so distorted, which I don't understand why they do that. I've never had that explained to me in a way that like, oh, I'll get it. Or timelines. Have you ever looked at

how like time lines are drawn on the globe? Like, you know, like the time zones? Like jigsaw puzzles. Why is that island in this time zone that's three slots over? It makes no sense. It does make

any sense. But like, see if you can find the size of the Congo. Like if you see the size of the Congo versus, I think it's almost as big as the United States. That's the way I realized that. It's the same. Yeah. There are these. There's so many of these incredible remote areas. It's thousands

of miles wide. Okay. So if you took that and you shoved it, why doesn't put it over it? Right. The bottom one there is a better one. The bottom one. That one's better. So not quite.

Yeah, but it's still enormous. Yeah. It's like 35%. Yeah. And there's more political unrest there now, which means stuff shuts down. I mean, that's crazy. That's an enormous piece of what

look how big that is. You get all of India, all of Eastern Europe, the United States, China, fucking crazy, France, Spain, look at that. It's a big place. And the cradle of civilization. Yep. The cradle of humanity. And then also Egypt. That's also part of Africa.

You know about the eclipse coming up there? What biggest one in history? 2027. Yeah. So in 2027, I want to say April, there'll be a six minute total blackout in Egypt.

It'll be the longest one in 100 and something or maybe 80 something years over the Red Sea in Egypt. Oh, that's when you want to go see the pyramids. Can you imagine the aliens going to return? That's what I'm saying, dude. Can you imagine being at the pyramids and seeing a six minute long, six minute 22 second? That's what it's like. And it's in a place that never has fucking clouds.

So you're going to see it. I mean, they do, but not that time of year. So yeah, total solar eclipse for six and a half minutes. So we had one here. Yeah. Yeah. Two years ago. Yeah. Yeah. It was really cool.

It was how long did that last year? I wasn't. Not that long. But yeah, a couple of minutes. What was really cool about it though, was that all the animals got oddly silent before it happened.

Yeah. Yeah. It was really weird. So we're outside waiting for it. And as the eclipse starts taking place, everything went quiet. Yeah. It was really wild. So crazy. And then while it's happening,

like whoa, and you imagine, like imagine living like thousands of years ago, before anybody understood what the fuck was going on and thinking like some wild magical moment had happened and we entered into a new timeline or something. You know, all crazy theories. I was like, grab somebody. We got to sacrifice them right away. Something's going on here.

Get them to the pier and cut their heart out. Yeah. Straight away. It's also, it's like so weird that the sun and the moon are the exact right distance that when they cross, the moon just completely outlines where the, I mean, just fills in everything. Yeah. But the light

around the outside the edges. It's bizarre. How is it perfectly sized like that? Have you seen? Oh, sorry. Go ahead. No, it's just, it's an incredible coincidence that it's the right distance and the

right size because obviously the moon is so much smaller than the sun. Yeah. But perfectly distance the scale so that when the sun and the moon is there, it's like boom. It's like the right size, not like half of it. Yeah. You know, it's perfect. Yeah. Perfect. It just sits right in there.

Yeah. It's like an Oreo in the cream. It's amazing. The really screwball theories are that the moon is fake. I've never heard that one. Yeah. The Panda, the Panda fake has nothing on the moon

being fake. The moon is fake. Yeah. They think that the moon is artificial and then it was like put here by aliens and it's hollow. You're kidding. Oh, no, no. That's a good one. And that it was put here

in order to sustain life on earth to give us a stable orbit. I mean, it does do that. It does do that. Yeah. Yeah. Huh. Imagine like how fragile life is. Like we're really concerned about climate change.

Like, oh my God, the climate changes. Well, guess what? If the fucking moon wasn't there, you'd be doomed. Oh, there's nothing. There's no way. Yeah. You need a big moon too.

Controls all of our oceans and... It's a quarter of the size of the earth. Yeah. It's a weird moon. Yeah.

Like, I don't think there's another moon in our entire source system that's comparable in terms of the size and the relationship to the other planet. It's way bigger than every other moon. Let's find that out. Is that what it's pretty sure? Formulates the conspiracy theories that it was brought in.

Oh, yeah. Yeah. Interesting. There's also, we did something, some sort of experiment, we shot something at the moon and it rang like a bell for a long time, which is really weird. That's why. It echoed way longer than we thought. Of course, it could just be. They didn't know what

it would do because we'd never done it before. And now, the fifth largest moon in the solar system with the diameter of the width of the continuous United States, while it's dwarfed by Jupiter and Saturn's largest moons, it's uniquely massive compared to its parent planet. Yeah, that's what it is. Making the Earth moon system more like a double planet. Yeah. So in relationship to the planet,

it's so Jupiter and Saturn have huge moons, but Jupiter obviously is fucking way bigger than us. Yeah. Yeah. Well, you look at the size of Jupiter in comparison to the size of Earth. Yeah. So it's the scale of the moon to this two-day Earth. Yeah. Interesting. That is a wild conspiracy

theory. Imagine just being the guy who's like, you know what? Why don't we shoot at the moon? Give that a whirl. See what happens. Yeah, they did something. I don't know what they shot it with.

I think they sent a rocket to the moon just to measure the sound. They see what would happen. And it was odd. It was odd the way it rang. It rang like a bell. But you know, it's like they've

never done that before. Like, also, who knows what the fucking center of the moon's made out of? Who knows where you hit it? Yeah, totally. Maybe it's weird. You got some caves in there. It's hollow.

Apollo experiments in the ringing effect. The phrase moon rang like a bell comes from Apollo 12. In 1969, November, NASA deliberately crashed the lunar modules, a cent stage onto the moon. Size-mometers recorded a long-lasting vibrations for nearly an hour. This description is a metaphor for how dry, cold, lunar rock reverberates without water to dampen the shot. Interesting. Yeah. But retards and dorks. So it's hollow. It's

radellions. And there's also people that think that, you know, there's stuff there. Like there's a model there. Oh, the city's on the moon and all that. Yeah.

Yeah. Other side that we can't see. Yeah. Yeah. It bases. Reddit's a wild place.

This is not even Reddit. This is like, you gotta go to like weird message boards. Uh-huh. Crazy people go. It's deep crazy. Yeah. People go to...

What's that? Hollow moon. There. Yeah. The Hollow moon.

Crocely related to spaceship moon. Ah, that's the one. Our pseudoscientific hypothesis that proposed Earth's moon is either holy hollow or otherwise contains a substantial interior space. No scientific evidence exists to support the idea. Let's go to spaceship moon because that seems even more interesting. Yeah. Spaceship moon. Come on, baby. All these pseudoscientific.

The moon spaceship includes historical... Oh, no, no. Spaceship moon theory. Try that theory. Do-do-do. A pseudoscientific hypothesis proposing that Earth's moon is an artificial hollowed

out satellite constructed by an alien civilization. Oh, boy. See? It's like the Death Star. There you go, bro.

Yeah. Well, you need to get into like spaces fake. That's even better. Spaces fake. Is popularized in 1970 by two Soviet scientists.

Mikhail Vassin and Alexander Rur. How about that word? Sure. Sure. Sure. Sure.

Kebokov. Sure. Kebokov suggested the moon was reinforced by an armored titanium hull to survive impacts. Oh, man. People need more to do. No, they don't. You like that. I love the cookie or the

better. Like hashtag spaces fake is one of my favorite things to look up because there's a whole community of people out there that thinks spaces fake. But I also think that a lot of these people, what you're getting is there's been some people who develop fake theories in order to see if people bite and then they put them out there like on Reddit or somewhere on 4chan. 4chan is a great place. Yeah. Because you got to ask it's a friend, like they visit those places and then they'll put it out

there and see if people run with it and they'll do it to see if just for fun. And you give to your community, right? It's like, oh, yeah, I have this group of flat earthers that I hang out with on Saturdays and we talk about how their earth's not round. You know what I mean? It's like I've made my own lunatic community. Big foot hunters. Yeah. There you go. Unfuckable. Unfuckable. Yeah.

Unfuckable white guys. Looking for cryptids. Something to do. Are there any other cryptids that are even remotely interesting? To me, not really. I mean, I always enjoy the fun of it. Like,

when we chat about it, but as far as like the reality of it, I don't think so. You know, I know it's a boring answer, but I think that. Well, you would know. I mean, that's why I'm asking you. I mean, your guy actually goes to these places. I mean, goes looking for stuff. I love when you hear about

something like a borrowing snake and everybody's like, that's not real. It doesn't exist. And then turns out somebody finds this weird snake. It's not really a cryptid, but it's something that nobody's been looking for. Because why would you? Right? No, he's digging in the earth in the center of the

Congo to find a mud snake, you know, or whatever it happens to be. And I think those are the things that they end up being cryptids in small communities. You know, like you hear from the village about the snake. I'm making a snake up, but about the snake that lives under the mud and only bites when people dig their crops or whatever it happens to be. And it creates this generational legend that becomes a cryptid. But the truth is there is a snake that lives under the crops in the mud. It's just

nobody ever goes looking for it. Because why would you? Well, there is a weird arrogance that we have in 2026 because we have uncovered so much in comparison to people that lived two or three hundred years ago. Oh, for sure. That we have this maybe arrogant assumption that we have an accurate audit of all the animals on the planet. And it's such a human thing to do is to be like,

we've quantified it all. We have the answers. You know, it's like we put a finite on something. And then you have all these guys, like, especially in the scientific community, which is that's a whole story for itself. But they're now like, okay, I need funding. So I'm going to speciate a bunch of stuff.

So I'm going to go look at four things that are exactly the same except one lives on one side of the creek and one lives on the other. And now I'm going to make it its own species because that'll fund more work for me. So now you have a speciation race. Yeah, there's no gatekeeping on that where someone goes, Hey, I mean, there are certain criteria that you have to meet, but they're pretty easy to meet. Do you know what I mean? You have to say, looks different. It has some kind of genetic anomaly. It

has some kind of physical anomaly. There's a population of it. Okay, now now I've named my own species. And that makes noise and I can publish a paper. And now my research is funded. And it's just like, it's not,

you know, is it a species? Do we need this one frog to be split into four different groups because they live on, you know, four different patches of the mountain? Not really. You know, and it sort of lessens the conservation for that frog in general, because now all of a sudden it's like, well, there's four different kinds of them. So who cares if one of them gets extinct? You know, I mean,

so it's sort of like, it's a weird thing that's going on in the sciences where there's this race to do speciation and pull apart everything into more and more and more. And then it sort of lessens the value of them, in my opinion. That's interesting. So there's this reward thing that happens that encourages people to do these things. Dude, I'm writing a whole book on this right now next year, because it's just the scientific system in wildlife and conservation is so broken, because it's very, first of all, first of all, if you're an animal guy, you're probably not a great people person to begin with, myself included. You're not a bad people person. Thanks. But for the most part, the people that get

into the sciences probably don't have the best. Yeah, they're awkward. They don't have the best human social skills. Right. So then those people become professors and heads of parties and academics and all these things. And again, I'm generalizing there are great people that I work with too, but just a

picture of the system. So now you have all these socially awkward, somewhat introverted people studying animals. Now there's this tiny little resource pool of money, and everybody that's socially awkward, that's already somewhat arrogant because they've made it to the top of their field or close to the top of their field is competing for this tiny little pool of money. So now they're putting out anything that's headline worthy and a headline worthy could be as simple as speciating a frog on a mountain or it could be discovering something. But basically you have to just publish something to show that you are accomplishing something to then pull from that tiny little pool of money. So now a system,

like say, you mean, Jamie here should all be working towards saving this guy right here, this metal, metal chimpanzee. Well, we're not we're all fighting because there's this tiny little pool of money that we all want. And we're all saying that each other are wrong because we need to prove that we're right so that we're funded because you two because all three of us can't be funded to save that species. Does that make sense? So now we're all fighting each other to save the thing that we all care about because the resource pool is the solution to that. Well, it needs to become more

mainstream. And I think there's a lot of bullshit science, you know, to be honest with you, like there's a lot of this speciation and publishing and all this stuff that's just sort of making noise that isn't really helping. And I think the solution is, well, one once it becomes more mainstream, here's the short answer. Conservation is incredibly easy to measure. We try and make it very difficult and complicated. Are there animals now? After your work, are there more? Have you fixed

the problem? That's all conservation is, right? Are there are there more or less than when you started? If when you started there are less and now there are more and this is very black and white and every system's different. But if you had 1000 frogs and then you worked on the project now you have 2000 frogs, you're doing conservation right? As long as the ecosystem supports as long as the prey is

there, blah, blah, blah. That's all conservation is. We try and make it so complicated and so in-depth and require all these papers and this publishing and this information that is sort of an information overload that the common person doesn't care about it. I mean, when's the last time you read a paper on frogs? Probably never, right? I mean, either, because they're boring, because I don't want care about it.

But I would care if you just came out and said, look, these frogs need a home. We're going to fight Kitred fungus, which is this big widespread fungus that's killing all amphibians, by building frog hotels. And if we build which are these little brick hotel things that frogs go into incubate to kill fungus. And if we build enough frog hotels, then there's going to be more frogs. That's good conservation.

So instead of fighting over that, make that popular and mainstream, don't make it so complicated so that nobody understands it. I'm not saying don't publish papers and things. They'll still very much have their place and they're important. But focus on the messaging to the common person. So the common person now cares, then there becomes more funding and resources. Then we don't all have to fight over

this tiny little pool of resources to publish things that aren't actually accomplishing things. Well, this is actually the value of getting into a crocodile cage. That's right. Because you get people actually interested in animals. And that's why I do YouTube. That's why I do all these things.

Is it? I hope that it helps people care. I don't need to get funded by it. Like it's great when my YouTube does well and I make money. But I just want people to care about these things. Because if

you care about them, then that resource pool widens. Well, you got to make things interesting to people. This is where David Attenborough was so amazing. Absolutely. Because he developed these documentaries.

The voice that he had was explaining these things. Mine was. He was the first guy to document chimpanzees eating monkeys. Yeah. I remember that. Incredible. That was incredible. The goat.

Literally. But you kind of, that's another thing about being a wildlife biologist. You kind of have to get your hands dirty. You have to. You got to get in there. And the other part of the system that's

so broken is a lot of these world leading experts have never touched seen anything with a living one of these animals. I worked with a person and I don't want to say her name. She's a lovely person. It was a world leading expert on a certain type of shark. And we're like, great, you're the world's leading authority. You're perfect to come with us on the strip to study these sharks. We fly to

the opposite side of the planet. I only give too many details. It's not fair to her. She's a very nice person. We fly to the opposite side of the planet. She's published 50 papers on this species of

shark. And we get there. And I'm like, all right, day one, let's gear up. Let's hop in the water and look for this thing. She's like, I don't know how to swim. Like what do you mean? She's like, I've never

been in the ocean before. Like you're the world's leading authority on this type of shark. And she's like, yeah, I don't I don't dive. I don't snorkel. I don't have to swim. I'm like, well, how are you

the world's leading authority on the shark? She's like, well, I've never seen one alive. I've dissected in them. I published all these papers. I can tell you about the tooth count, but I've actually never seen one alive. Like you're the world's leading authority. And you've never seen one of these animals

alive to study it. The guy who fishes and eats it in the village next door is a more of an authority than this person. Do you know what I mean? But that's the scientific process. The world's leading authority because they publish the most papers on something that sits in a pickle jar. Do you think

that that is an absolute requirement, though? Like you have to have some sort of physical contact with the world that they live in? I think you have to have observational knowledge. You don't have to have physical contact. Like you shouldn't have physical contact with wild chimpanzees. They'll

rip your arm. Right. But I mean, the world they live in being on the ground. I think it should be a requirement. I think if you're going to be considered an authority on that thing, you have to have observational data as well as scientific data. You can't just live in a world where you're like,

I've studied them in pickle jars and I can tell you everything about them. Well, to me, that was like one of the most fascinating aspects of chimp nation, you know, that these scientists have been embedded with these particular chimpanzees for more than 20 years. That's science. Yeah. That's science. That means you are sitting there and that's why the best scientists are the guys that hunt

in fish and spend their lives surrounded by these animals that will never once be credited as a scientist because all they do is study the behavior of the animal. And I'm with you. Like, that is that's the real deal. 20 years watching a troop of chimps, learning their behavior, understanding their social dynamic. I'm not saying you shouldn't also cut one open and measure its canines. You should when you get a dead one. But that doesn't make you an authority on it. Right.

In my opinion. Well, that was the thing about that particular documentary and those particular scientists was it was so unusual that they had this long history where these chimpanzees had lived and died and raised new chips around these people. And as long as they followed this protocol, right, stay within, you know, 20 yards, at least 20 yards away from them, never have food around them. Don't look them in the eyes. You're good. Yep. And you got insane footage because of that.

Yeah, because there's a mutual respect. Right. Like they've learned to appreciate each other. And you can't do that with every animal. Like it doesn't matter how many years you spend sitting watching a crocodile, it'll still eat you with the first jacks. Yes. But you've earned a mutual

respect with a highly intelligent creature. That to me, as a field biologist, is science. That's incredible. Well, if not a respect, at the very least, you've become a part of their world at the point where they don't think of you as being an anomaly. That's right. So they're normal.

Yep. Where they're not, they're not weirded out. Like if you just show up out of nowhere and you weren't a spacesuit, yeah, the monkey's gonna go, Hey, exactly this thing. But if there's always people with spacesuits around, they never bother them. They go, Oh, it's just the spacesuit guy normal.

It's gonna go eat my bananas like normal. It's the same as seeing, you know, an impolent of wildebeys hanging out together at a watering hole. They're used to each other. They know they're not threats to each other. But you or I walk up and both of their ears perk up and they sprint in different directions. Yeah. You can have that time put in to make things calm. It's amazing. But I mean,

has there ever been anything other than chimp nation where they did that effectively? I mean, the grizzly manager tried. It didn't work out so well. Or did it. Yeah, it probably ended the way he wanted it to. Honestly, there's no way he could have wanted to go out any other way. I think,

I think that was suicide by bear. Yeah. You also think it was Werner Herzog's attempted comedy. You think? Yeah, there's something about the way he edited it where I'm like, this guy's fucking with us. Because there's one time where he talking about the sheriff and they asked the

sheriff like, what he thought of him. And the sheriff goes, Well, I thought he was retarded. And they smash cut to something else. I'm like, you're trying to make me laugh. We're in it. It's pretty

funny though. I've wanted to try to get him on the podcast. And that's going to be one of I'm he probably never answer honestly because they're probably disrespectful to Timothy Treadwell and just you got to get him. I would love to get him on. Just get these amazing. Yeah. And also his

documentary Happy People Life in the Tiger is one of my favorite documentaries of all time. Oh, really? I don't know. It's good. It's all about these people that live in Siberia. And they have

like no mental illness and all they do is they live as assistance lifestyle. They're just hunting and fishing and trapping and they ride around on snowmobiles and they make these huts and they live up there with their dogs and they have this extended periods of time where they're alone. Yeah. And all they're doing is like taking their snowmobiles to different traps and gathering wood for fire and fish to eat. It's and they're all happy and they're drinking and laughing and they're like it's weird because he he documents it and it's called Happy People. That's what the documentary

has called. And it's like with his like the way he describes these people living in Siberia. That's like very fucking amazing. Oh, that's really amazing. It's amazing documentary. I think he's

incredible. I have said forever you don't all look mentally and it's a real thing. I'm not gonna pretend it's not. But if you spend a lot of time outside and in nature and especially by yourself, the noise goes away. I don't care who you are. I don't care what your history is, drug

history, anything. When you you're much more present when you're alone in nature and mental illness, I have no experience in this is just opinion, but mental illness comes from when you're wrapped up in your own being, right? When you're thinking about all the problems and this that and the other thing. But when you're alone in nature, you have to think about your surroundings and what you're doing and you don't have time to sit and manifest on these things that create depression and anxiety and all of those types of things. There's also no comparison. You're not comparing yourself to anyone else

because you're living in a community that are assistance lifestyle people. All these people are doing the same thing you're doing. What are you gonna do? You have the biggest fish? No one gets a fun one. It's all hunting, fishing, living off the land. They all do it and they're all sharing

and drinking together and having fun. It's really wild. When you watch it, you get boiled down to the most simplistic community driven ways that people exist like this. Seems to be the best way for people to live. But like you said earlier, you have to have both sides of the coin. It's like the red and

blue in Texas because you have to have innovators and over thinkers and workers or it wouldn't be a society. And by the way, they wouldn't exist because they use normal bills and not one of those motherfuckers is gonna invent a snowmobile. Exactly. So you gotta have the red and the blue. You gotta have both sides.

Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. That's awesome. Well, hey, brother, it's always good to talk to you. It's really fun.

Really fun. What is this you and the crocodile? Oh my god, dude, you didn't tell me they put meat all around the outside of it. Told you I was an idiot. Look at this. We made that cage, by the way,

and I am no engineer. Oh my god. The caves look so flimsy. That thing looks so flimsy and you're just hanging by a thread. Literally like this cable that we sourced from a village and hoped it would hold up.

I mean, we tested it as far as put some rocks in it and tested it in empty cage. This is a terrible idea. It was dumb. It was dumb. Look at these things doing death rolls. But people are gonna watch

this, Joe, and they're gonna learn about crocodiles. It's the great thing you filmed it. Right? God, man. That's insane. That was fun. That cage looks way too flimsy. Don't do that again, I promise. Tell

people how they can see that where they can find all your stuff. Dude, it's Shark Week. We got an awesome show coming out this week, Alien Sharks Untamed America, looking at some incredible sharks celebrating America's birthday, our craziest, weirdest sharks. How long has Shark Week been going on since the 80s? 39 years old. Same age as me. Yeah. It's been around my whole life. That is so crazy.

Yeah. It's an institution. Plus we got the YouTube channel. That's where I'm doing most of my stuff. Now I hope people check that out. I know you watch some videos. I've heard you comment. I appreciate that.

Oh, I appreciate you. I appreciate you doing that stuff. Thanks for having me, dude. Always great to see you. Yeah. Bye everybody. Yeah.